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  1. #1
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    2013 Forks Mazocchi, Rock Shox or X Fusion

    I know there are a couple of similar threads out there but I wanted some fresh advice. I need a fork for my ibis HD (just put a CCDB Air in the rear). I've got a Marz 55 RC3 V2 Evo Ti ordered but I'm beginning to have doubts about the future of the company and have decided to rethink my decision. I just removed and sold a 2013 Fox 36 160 RC2 Kashima because I was underwhelmed by the performance. I weight just under 200 with gear.

    My main focus is having a bike that will perform well in Moab and Southern Utah but I also want it to climb fairly well. Will occasionally ride smooth alpine trail and bike park stuff as well. I'm looking at the forks in the 170 travel range. Considering air or coil.

    Marzocchi 55 Evo Ti
    X Fusion Vengeance HLR
    Rock Shox Lyric RC2 DH

    What do you guys think?

  2. #2
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    Nothing that I have tried feels better than the current Marz 55 Ti IMHO. I bought one on the cheap to replace my Pushed 36 Talas and the ride is markedly smoother. My first ride down The Whole Enchilada was an eye opener with the Marz. It was the first time I finished that trail without significant arm pump and sore hands.

    I have spent some time on a Rock Shox Lyrik RC2 DH but not enough time setup properly to give an educated opinion.

    In short, I would buy for feel and not try to prognosticate on what company will or will not be in business for a purchase of this size.

  3. #3
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    I've had lyrics, loads of 36s, deville 170 on my HD, now running 55 rc3 evo ti.
    If you need light weight then Deville. If you want the best performing fork then 55 wins.
    400gs heavier than the deville but they're just awesome.

  4. #4
    moaaar shimz
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    Try to ride a Vengeance and you'll see why everyone that buys one never go back to Fox/RS/Marzocchi.

  5. #5
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    X Fusion would be my choice...however understand that they do have a slightly taller a2c which may affect your climbing. For the price, stiffness, and damper on the X-Fusion, it is hard to beat.

    I have a Lyrik with an Avy cartridge, which I think is the best fork I have even been on, if you can find a Lyrik cheap, get an Avy cartridge and you have another winner.

    Not sure when the 2013 X Fusion products will be available. Can't wait to see them.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    X Fusion would be my choice...however understand that they do have a slightly taller a2c which may affect your climbing. For the price, stiffness, and damper on the X-Fusion, it is hard to beat.
    The difference in A2C is next to nothing. If you change the size of your tires you can make a larger difference. Heck it seems like the only complaint that people can ever come up with for this fork is that they think it *might* be taller than some other forks. I bought one a while back and I can tell you I won't be going back!

  7. #7
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    I agree that your micro-economic decision should not be made on macro-economic factors, you just won't be affected by them.

    I am now giving X-Fusion a chance because of their superior damping and overall stiffness. Also, I have heard nothing but good words about the air system they have (and I'm getting), and the coil was even called "too good". Read here about the air and here about the coil.

    Also, please note that 2012 and 2013 models are no different in a2c than RS or Fox. Here is a proof, posts #19 and #20.

    Tell us what you decided finally!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    X Fusion would be my choice...however understand that they do have a slightly taller a2c which may affect your climbing. For the price, stiffness, and damper on the X-Fusion, it is hard to beat.

    I have a Lyrik with an Avy cartridge, which I think is the best fork I have even been on, if you can find a Lyrik cheap, get an Avy cartridge and you have another winner.

    Not sure when the 2013 X Fusion products will be available. Can't wait to see them.
    2013 Vengeances should be in stock late January.
    If you are at all concerned about climbing, you can always buy the DLA version where the travel (and ultimately the axle-to-crown height) can be dropped by 30mm from 170mm to 140mm with a flick of a switch.
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  9. #9
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    waitejasoe - if you pay the highest possible price, expecting highest possible ride quality is somehow natural... Glad that you got it!

  10. #10
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    I just purchased a 2012 X-fusion Vengeance HLR 170mm to replace my 2007 Marzocchi 66 SL1 ATA's 180mm.
    The only reason for new forks was that the par chamber valve snapped off the bottom.
    I can confirm that the axle to crown height is the same between the 2, even though the vengeance has 10mm less travel.
    I love the X-20 axle.
    Im 105kg without gear and only need 70psi in the vengeance, compared to 150-170psi in the 66.

    When speaking to the australian distributor i learned that the 2012 and 2013 models had barely any differences, despite the price hike of about $100-$150. but still cheaper than Fox or Marzocchi.

    I feel that they are much better value.

    Roy.

  11. #11
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    for the price my x-fusion velvet 140mm is the best fork I've owned. Being able to drop it down to 110mm on the climbs is awesome. Not to mention I can lock it out also which makes it very versatile and fun. best $400 I've spent on suspension. The shock is as good if not better than by fox rp23 (different bikes so its hard to compare).

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenocatalyst View Post
    Im 105kg without gear and only need 70psi in the vengeance, compared to 150-170psi in the 66.
    Ha ha, yea that can go both ways. I weigh 125 lbs after eating a whole pizza so I have to run around 30 psi to get the correct sag on my Vengeance. Still works and gets full travel even though its 15 psi under the minimum!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by myarmisonfire View Post
    The difference in A2C is next to nothing. If you change the size of your tires you can make a larger difference. Heck it seems like the only complaint that people can ever come up with for this fork is that they think it *might* be taller than some other forks. I bought one a while back and I can tell you I won't be going back!
    According to their website it's over an inch of difference. That's a big deal and much more than changing tires.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by pieroglif View Post
    I agree that your micro-economic decision should not be made on macro-economic factors, you just won't be affected by them.


    spoken like someone who's never faced parts unavailability due to supplier out of the market. It happens, and if your otherwise-functional fork is made useless by impossible to get seals or bushings or something, it will affect you. It's happened to me a couple times (though not recently).

    That's not to say I think it's likely to happen with Marz, but if the OP knows something I don't, I'd understand his desire to go elsewhere.

  15. #15
    moaaar shimz
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellurfingers View Post
    According to their website it's over an inch of difference. That's a big deal and much more than changing tires.
    No its not an inch.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya View Post
    No its not an inch.
    You're right, set at 160 it's not even half an inch.

  17. #17
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    How easy is it to shim down a vengeance to 150mm? Going to be in the market for a new fork but want the a2c around the same as a revelation.

  18. #18
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    Super easy

    They are internally adjustable from 170 to 150 to 130mm.
    Anywhere in between and you'll have to make spacers.


    Roy

  19. #19
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    As stated above, it is very easy. Took me all of 30 min to do. The most difficult part is finding a roll pin to fit.

  20. #20
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    Oh man, I'm saving up for a fork upgrade for my Rumblefish. It currently has a Fox F29-32 open bath 120mm DRCV and I'm obsessing over either the Fox F29-34 140mm ctd or X-Fusion's equivalent. I've had nd loved a lot of Fox forks but the 32mm stanctions don't seem stiff enough for the Rumblefish. It's 4 months old and at Fox for warranty service.

    I suspect binding between the tubes is eating the seals prematurely.

    I'm having a hard time confirming the X-Fusion offset. I emailed X-Fusion a few days ago.
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  21. #21
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    I have not ridden an X Fusion.

    I rode all last year on the 55RC3 EVO ti on my HD. It is by far the smoothest fork I have ever ridden and nice and lively with the ti spring - and stable and can be hammered hard bike park style with no ill effects in the stability. Also easy to self service and reliable. I have ridden and owned the Lyrik and many 36's since the 36 first came out.

    The 55 has earned my allegiance. I sold the HD and fork. I went through a bit of panic last month when I went to order a new one and was told they were changing manufacturers(to Hodaka? who has built their shocks for years) and that they would not be available until Jan/Feb.

    I considered the X Fusion. Read some good reviews and fan mail about it. Having spent a season on the 55 and knowing it handled better than anything I've been on I pulled the trigger on a new 2012 on ebay last week - I need a fork now and can't wait until jan/feb.

    I highly doubt Marzocchi is going anywhere. Their forks the last couple years are putting anything put out by the big OEM guys(RS/FOX) to shame.

    Call Marzocchi directly if you want some assurance. You will not be disappointed if you end up on one.

    Marz USA - 661 257 6630
    Marz Canada - 604 986 3675
    Last edited by JimEG; 12-25-2012 at 06:52 PM.

  22. #22
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    @JimEG - did you get your new fork yet? I am curious your impressions of X-Fusion, as I will be soon deciding between these two brands as well.

  23. #23
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    To my knowledge X-Fusion has Vengeances in stock right now. 2012's, but as someone mentioned pretty much the same as the 13's.

  24. #24
    moaaar shimz
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    X-Fusion USA has no forks in stock right now. They will become available at the end of this month.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by pieroglif View Post
    @JimEG - did you get your new fork yet? I am curious your impressions of X-Fusion, as I will be soon deciding between these two brands as well.
    I picked up a new 2012 55 RC3 ti on ebay a couple weeks ago. The 2013 are supposed to be out later in the month - same fork though, unchanged. I'm sticking with Marzocchi. I see no good reason to try the X Fusion. I'm sure they are good - based on reviews, but I spent a season on the 55 and I know that it is a great fork that served me very well from local trail rides to the Whistler Bike Park.

    Not to sound like too much of a fanboy of Marzocchi, but the 55 really is an exceptional fork. I've been riding 36's and the Lyrik since 2006, and the 55 is in a whole other league.

  26. #26
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    I've had a Marz 55 evo ti on order for some time now. It was my original intention to sell the Fox 36 (2013 160 talus RC2 w/ Kashima) for the Marz. I should see it in a couple of weeks (was originally told end of November). I guess it taking a bit longer to get things ramped up at the new factory).

    I considered the X Fusion but the axle-crown height in 10 mm taller on an already tall fork (same travel). I plan on climbing a lot on this bike (quite a bit of steep terrain in my area) so I'm sticking with the Marz. I've owned Marzocchi's before it's just been a while.

    There is one change to the 2013 model. The 13' model includes the RC3 piston/cartridge. Taken from the 888, this supposedly allows you the ability to play with the shim stack more easily. May be considered a minor feature by many though.

    I'll post some info when a get the new fork.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SweatyBiscuit View Post

    There is one change to the 2013 model. The 13' model includes the RC3 piston/cartridge. Taken from the 888, this supposedly allows you the ability to play with the shim stack more easily. May be considered a minor feature by many though.

    I'll post some info when a get the new fork.
    Interesting. I was under the impression the 55RC3 has been using the same 888 RC3 cartridge for a couple of years - hence the 55RC3 ti description. Is there a new RC3 cartridge for 2013?

  28. #28
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    Your right about the RC3 designation. The guy I spoke with a Marzocchi USA said there was a change to the new piston assembly to allow for easier tuning. Haven't spoke with him for a while and the details are a little fuzzy but I'm fairly certain he referenced the 888 for comparison. Can't remember any of the specifics as I doubt I'll have to mess with it anyway. Sorry if I misled anyone. Maybe someone else can clarify for us.

    I would snag a 2012 model if I didn't get deals on the new stuff. Hopefully the 13' models are as nice as the 12's were.

  29. #29
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    There are three iterations of RC3 damping. RC3, RC3 Evo and RC3 Evo V.2.

    RC3 is just like a RC2 cartridge, sealed open bath with a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo has a removable compression assembly from the bottom and retains a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo V.2 has removable compression assembly and a shimmed rebound piston (allegedly).

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by SweatyBiscuit View Post
    Your'e right about the RC3 designation. The guy I spoke with a Marzocchi USA said there was a change to the new piston assembly to allow for easier tuning.
    That makes sense. Thanks for clarifying.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya View Post
    There are three iterations of RC3 damping. RC3, RC3 Evo and RC3 Evo V.2.

    RC3 is just like a RC2 cartridge, sealed open bath with a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo has a removable compression assembly from the bottom and retains a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo V.2 has removable compression assembly and a shimmed rebound piston (allegedly).
    What is the benefit of a shimmed vs plunger piston?

  32. #32
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    How do you delete posts?
    Last edited by seanpatrickb; 01-09-2013 at 01:11 AM.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanpatrickb View Post
    To my knowledge X-Fusion has Vengeances in stock right now. 2012's, but as someone mentioned pretty much the same as the 13's.
    Is it really? I thought 2013 get's a coating similar to Kashima on fox forks?

    X Fusion Shox - HLR Coil

    Seems like a pretty big deal to me

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by dropadrop View Post
    Is it really? I thought 2013 get's a coating similar to Kashima on fox forks?

    X Fusion Shox - HLR Coil

    Seems like a pretty big deal to me
    That is what I heard as well.
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  35. #35
    moaaar shimz
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    No Gold Slick Ano for 2013.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya View Post
    No Gold Slick Ano for 2013.
    You sure about that? The trade show talk, said all the forks were going to have the Gold Slick.

  37. #37
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    So does their site, all interviews and marketing material.

  38. #38
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    I've been talking to John at X-Fusion and he confirmed they were having manufacturing difficulties with it and will not be doing it for the 2013's.

  39. #39
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    Ah bugger, as always tacubaya knows more than me.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanpatrickb View Post
    I've been talking to John at X-Fusion and he confirmed they were having manufacturing difficulties with it and will not be doing it for the 2013's.
    Well that might not be the best marketing strategy, there might be a lot of interested people like me holding out for the new models to be released, and expecting they will be like described on their site and all the release news published around the internet. Some shops are even taking pre-orders based on this info...

    I've been thinking the increase in price would not be so bad due to so big improvements, how will that make people feel after months of wait? Better to inform customers asap.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by dropadrop View Post
    Well that might not be the best marketing strategy, there might be a lot of interested people like me holding out for the new models to be released, and expecting they will be like described on their site and all the release news published around the internet.
    Hmmm... I agree. I would hope they update their site or confirm this. It's always cool to see stuff ahead of time... but this is one of those reasons I wish manufacturers would make sure the product they start advertising is going to be the product they sell.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya View Post
    There are three iterations of RC3 damping. RC3, RC3 Evo and RC3 Evo V.2.

    RC3 is just like a RC2 cartridge, sealed open bath with a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo has a removable compression assembly from the bottom and retains a plunger piston.
    RC3 Evo V.2 has removable compression assembly and a shimmed rebound piston (allegedly).
    Bingo.

    2010/2011 55's were RC3
    2012's were RC3 Evo
    2013's are supposed to have the Evo v.2 if they ever show up.
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  43. #43
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    I just ordered a 2012 Vengeance, so they definitely still have some. This is from X-Fusion USA. To be fair about the anodizing, it didn't seem to me like X-Fusion was highlighting or pushing it as a new feature for 2013 from everything I've seen. Just mostly said it was a future update they were looking into. I certainly agree they should take it off their site, though.

  44. #44
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    Well on some 2013 presentation I read through they did seem to be making a pretty big deal out of it, and I'll admit I got a bit pumped up.

    I give them a lot of respect for not pushing out a product who's quality they are not happy with even when it risks dissapointing potential customers, shows they have guts and will pick quality over deadlines.

  45. #45
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    What is the website address you are ordering from? I can only find their regular site with info only.

  46. #46
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    Email or call:

    X Fusion Shox - Contact

  47. #47
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    You could also order from one of their dealers. I had a great experience with dropnzone when I ordered my frame.

  48. #48
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    I don't like to hijack the thread but since it is the most recent in this fork category I would like to ask a question: Where are the 160mm coil forks????? Fox dropped the 36vanRC2, Rockshox is selling the LyrikRC2DH in Solo Air only, at least here in Europe, Marzocchi 55 is only in 170mm mode, Bos Deville is Air only, X-fusion is a 160 coil fork but with an A2C height of a 180... Is it really so hard to find a 160mm coil fork???

  49. #49
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    10mm won't make much difference. My 170mm coil lyrik a2c is closer to 545mm without spacers.

    But I imagine the fork offerings reflect what people are buying, and few companies want to make low volume products.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanpatrickb View Post
    I've been talking to John at X-Fusion and he confirmed they were having manufacturing difficulties with it and will not be doing it for the 2013's.
    Their site still reads the following:
    http://www.xfusionshox.com/product/f...-hlr-coil.html
    For 2013 the Vengeance receives our brand new Gold Slick Ano stanchion treatment to ensure riders the smoothest, supplest ride on the market.
    Weird...

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