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  1. #1
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    Santa Cruz Hightower

    Anyone know anything about this or any new models coming out?

    EDIT:


    Santa Cruz Hightower - Mtbr.com
    Last edited by fc; 02-02-2016 at 07:36 AM.

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    Lots of riders and mag editors doing a four day rally in Patagonia hosted by SC. Someone mentioned Hightower on SC's Instagram and in was gone in minutes.

    Speculating release of something 29er or 27.5 plus this week. Who knows, maybe not.

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    Last edited by Salespunk; 01-21-2016 at 06:10 AM.

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    looks like a old version 5010 with a different paint job upon closer inspection. Theres another photo in that instagram link.
    This is getting fun....

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    Are we talking about the red one with the white letters? Looks like the current tallboy to me.

    Ah, I see the one CG is riding now. The one in the truck looks like the current TB, but the one CG is riding looks like a 29er nomad.

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    I read somewhere that the LT version has less travel than the previous Tallboy LTC - maybe 125mm, but is long and slack, with Boost hubs, so can run 29er or 27.5.

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    Quote Originally Posted by westeast View Post
    Are we talking about the red one with the white letters? Looks like the current tallboy to me.

    Ah, I see the one CG is riding now. The one in the truck looks like the current TB, but the one CG is riding looks like a 29er nomad.
    Got the same impression. Current tallboy and 5010 on the back of that truck. CG looks like he's on a 29er Nomad.

  10. #10
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    IF it really is going to be called Hightower, the guy who organises the SC demo rides in the states is going to be stoked as that's what he goes by too!

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    You guys are right, current version

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    looks like a 29er nomad!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by hot_beef_sundae View Post
    looks like a 29er nomad!
    YEAH, it does!
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    Took a screenshot of the Instagram photo, for when it inevitably gets taken down.


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    Looks like a 29r wheel but hard to tell, just a Red Nomad?

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    Quote Originally Posted by motoguru2007 View Post
    Looks like a 29r wheel but hard to tell, just a Red Nomad?
    Slimmer top tube (doesn't have that full length underside rib), fatter area in the ST/BB/DT area, longer DT/TT/HT connection, short HT. Not sure if I can make out a lower external headset cup.

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    Pretty sure the new LT will be called Hightower.

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    i hope that is not a (another) long travel 29er, because that would be very boring. a 27plus chameleon with a longer TT would rule. is anyone in santa cruz listening?

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    They are, and everyone is asking for a new long travel 29er.

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    It was labeled to me "a following killer " .... Guessing in the 130mm range ,short back , longer top tube , relaxed head angle

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by crashedupderby View Post
    i hope that is not a (another) long travel 29er, because that would be very boring. a 27plus chameleon with a longer TT would rule. is anyone in santa cruz listening?
    Can you name me some of these boring long travel 29ers beyond the old TB LT, CB Riot, and the Spec Enduro 29er? I'm looking for a 150mm one that's NOT the POS FSR design...DW/Maestro, VPP, etc would be good. TIA.
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  22. #22
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    Is a 27+ bike not a 29er with Boost spacing...?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    Can you name me some of these boring long travel 29ers beyond the old TB LT, CB Riot, and the Spec Enduro 29er? I'm looking for a 150mm one that's NOT the POS FSR design...DW/Maestro, VPP, etc would be good. TIA.
    Intense Carbine 29

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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtforester View Post
    Intense Carbine 29

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    Just did a dig. This bike seems a LOT like my long-shock'd TB LTc.

    I also looked at the Trek Remedy 9.9 29er...meh. Nice and light, but I'd go for the Riot in a choice between the three.
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  25. #25
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    I would imagine the Remedy rides really well and can't argue with it's weight. I had 2014 9.8 27.5" and rode really well once I swapped out the garbage CTD 34 that was on there. I got the weight down to 25.5lbs with dropper and stock cranks and to be honest it could go almost as well as an XC bike. Definitely a do it all bike.

    If I'm not so bothered by the up coming release then I may be tempted into a Remedy 29er. What I would say is that with Trek signing the Athertons I would expect the next Remedy update to be rather special with Dan Atherton surely having some input from his EWS racing.
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  26. #26
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    It is 130mm on the rear

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    seriously what is this like the 4th thread now about the same bike? argh

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    135mm travel?
    433mm chainstays?

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    Guessing the CS length down to the mm, more than just a guess?

    I note that the post I did a couple of days ago in this thread has been magically removed without a trace, likewise the offending link / picture name has been changed. Don’t worry Francis I can take the hint, mum’s the word until 2/2.

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  32. #32
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    Numbers look good. 135mm rear travel, 67* HTA, 433 CS, frame 5.9 lbs. No FD. Boost. 29/27.5+. Reach is 450mm on a large! STA 74.3*. WB on a large is 1187.

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    Take my money.

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    Gone already

  35. #35
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    Well I am guessing it was a 135mm Travel 17in rear 67 ha looks just like a nomad 29r but with 29r and 27.5 plus.

  36. #36
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    Hightower pic - hello!!


  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by expatrider View Post
    Numbers look good. 135mm rear travel, 67* HTA, 433 CS, frame 5.9 lbs. No FD. Boost. 29/27.5+. Reach is 450mm on a large! STA 74.3*. WB on a large is 1187.
    Didn't happen to get a shock i2i length did you?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    Didn't happen to get a shock i2i length did you?
    It wasn't on the post...id love to know that too...it would be awesome to repurpose my Monarch plus!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 52766 View Post
    It wasn't on the post...id love to know that too...it would be awesome to repurpose my Monarch plus!
    Someone please find out if/when the 11-6 will be available for this beast......

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  42. #42
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    flip chip for switching wheel size


  43. #43
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  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by expatrider View Post
    You know what this means don't you? Long shocking capable!
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    TLDR of the ride impression was basically: trails in Coyhaique, Chile, were lame so didn't really get to test the bike, and need to ride it somewhere else to do so; felt like a big solid bike even with "only" 135mm travel; "sporty" rear suspension not as supple as Remedy 29, but pedaled well; and Kazimer preferred it with 29er wheels, not 27.5.

  47. #47
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    It looks really good. I like the trend of lower stand over in the TT, due to the new top link.
    It is a lot longer in the FOC to, comparing reach numbers plus being 2.5deg slacker.

    I wonder, flip the chip, run standard 27.5 tyres with a 150 ish fork (to bring BB up again), might be a slack low flyer....

    Interesting bike.

  48. #48
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    Bummed it is not the LT version. Oh well, guess I will continue to wait.

  49. #49
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    Exactly what I was looking for! Can't wait to read some more reviews.

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    Somehow need to get some real world comparisons of this against an evil following as $ is burning a hole in my wallet and been waiting months.... Would love to know how nimble it is no mention of this in the short review.

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    Can't wait for proper reviews. How long before shipping to the 3rd bike world - eg Australia


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    Quote Originally Posted by m_t_b View Post
    Somehow need to get some real world comparisons of this against an evil following as $ is burning a hole in my wallet and been waiting months.... Would love to know how nimble it is no mention of this in the short review.
    My thoughts exactly ......would have bought a evil a month ago ,but my size xl was back ordered .. Now the have one , bot I want to see more reviews on the Hightower ...it looks clean .

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    Santa Cruz Hightower | Competitive Cyclist

    Someone let it slip early! Looks sweet!

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankmiester View Post
    Santa Cruz Hightower | Competitive Cyclist

    Someone let it slip early! Looks sweet!
    Definitely like the black/mint colour better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    They're heeeeerrrrre!

    Santa Cruz Hightower

    Both sides of the ocean now. Just got email from SC about it.

    Interesting, the spec's mention an "Easton Arc 40" rim that I've not heard of.

    Santa Cruz Hightower

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    Did anyone catch the shock stroke... 2", or 2.25"?
    I saw the 200mm i2i...
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    Ha ha, finally. We've been talking about this bike for 2 years now, and its pretty much exactly as expected!

    Good to see ETT has been lengthened but not made super long like the new wreckoning. And great to see a nice steep seat angle.

    Sold

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    Naysayers never apologize. Critics go to their grave thinking everyone else is wrong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by richt2000 View Post
    Ha ha, finally. We've been talking about this bike for 2 years now, and its pretty much exactly as expected!

    Good to see ETT has been lengthened but not made super long like the new wreckoning. And great to see a nice steep seat angle.

    Sold
    On the note of STA, do Santa Cruz measure differently to Evil as comparing the geometry charts they're very similar. However looking at the way they measure it looks a little different.

    In saying that, it "looks" steeper so it's a very appealing looking frame!

  62. #62
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    FC - what is the range of front rings that can be run on the Hightower? Was it shock rate & leverage designed for a specific chainring size (30?)?

    Does the Hightower ride more like a big wheeled Bronson or Nomad?

    Cheers,
    Mike

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    Looks awesome but I don't understand 28 hole rims on the non - Enve setup???

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    Quote Originally Posted by mbcracken View Post
    FC - what is the range of front rings that can be run on the Hightower? Was it shock rate & leverage designed for a specific chainring size (30?)?

    Does the Hightower ride more like a big wheeled Bronson or Nomad?

    Cheers,
    Mike
    I'll ask SC on the ideal chainring. They come stock with a 30 tooth.

    The Hightower rides just like a Bronson. Same plushness, descending abilities. Both are playful. Classic 27.5 vs 29er traits follow where the Bronson is easier to throw around in mid-air, Hightower holds a line better in ruts.

    The Plus size versatility on the Hightower is a cool bonus as it is well-sorted!
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Here's some photos. Ask me anything.
    Which "version" did you like better and why? 29, or 27.5+?
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  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandyeggo View Post
    Which "version" did you like better and why? 29, or 27.5+?
    29er in Patagonia and 29er in Santa Cruz.

    The reason is we did a lot of fireroad traversing in Patagonia and the 29er can cover ground like that very easily.

    I live in Santa Cruz too where we have a lot of berms, loam and traction.

    I love Plus bikes but they really excel on all hardtails (for cushioning) and in cases where traction is at a premium. So sand, snow, loose rocks is where they stretch their legs.

    When it's really loose and rocky that's where the Plus bike can really show an advantage. Tahoe, Downieville and anywhere in the Sierras is where they go up and down better than the 29er. Traction, comfort, control are the advantages. Sometimes it's faster. I've also experienced better vision and les arm and shoulder fatigue.

    One thing really cool is the Hightower rode and felt almost the same in either configuration on most trails. There isn't a huge jump in ride characteristic since it's well sorted.

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    First question: how do you think the climbing ability stacks up compared to the Bronson and 5010? I was close to pulling the trigger on a 5010 but had second thoughts as I think I'd rather go with a 29er than 27.5.

    Second question: how is pedal clearance compared to the 5010?

    Last question: Any scuttlebut on a lower-travel 29er coming soon?

    Thanks!

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    Interesting to read the review from a UK mag who's write currently owns a Tallboy LTC he bought himself.

    Singletrack Magazine | First Ride: The SantaCruz Hightower - Patagonian adventure

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    Quote Originally Posted by dunleavy View Post
    First question: how do you think the climbing ability stacks up compared to the Bronson and 5010? I was close to pulling the trigger on a 5010 but had second thoughts as I think I'd rather go with a 29er than 27.5.

    Second question: how is pedal clearance compared to the 5010?

    Last question: Any scuttlebut on a lower-travel 29er coming soon?

    Thanks!
    I think this is equal in climbing ability to the 5010. Both have a great climbing position and not as much travel/sag as the Bronson. This one has better traction and it has better rocky/rooty climb ability.

    Pedal clearance: This Hightower is 13.27 inch bb height while the 5010 is 13.1. Geometry on this Hightower can be changed with the Flip Chip and fork air spring change. So it can be raised according to needs and preferences.

    Normally, two different forks are ideal, a 140mm and 150mm. If a rider wants to swap between the two and only have one fork, the easiest option is to use a 150mm fork all the time.

    Low Travel Tallboy? No news but that is long in the tooth and folks are not buying that and racing it xc so much. So it should get updated this year!!

    fc
    Last edited by fc; 02-02-2016 at 03:26 PM.
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    some video


    We plummeted down cliffs in remote areas with one thought in mind.... "DON'T GET HURT. YOU'RE FAR FROM HOME."

    It was cool, specially on the last 10 minute singletrack downhill.

    The race format was a 4 day Rally. Unlike Enduro, some uphills are timed. And not all downhill ones are. So there is a Downhill winner, uphill and Overall.

    Last edited by fc; 02-02-2016 at 12:31 PM.
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    Agh! I see it comes with Schwalbe Nobby Nics. Terrible tires.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheNormsk View Post
    Agh! I see it comes with Schwalbe Nobby Nics. Terrible tires.
    Those are on the custom build that I posted but are not on bike as sold from Santa Cruz. It comes with Maxxis tires.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Here's some photos. Ask me anything.
    FC, can I trouble you for 2 shots...the space between the link or shock eyelet with the flip chip in both position and the dist relative to the seat tube? Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    FC, can I trouble you for 2 shots...the space between the link or shock eyelet with the flip chip in both position and the dist relative to the seat tube? Thanks.
    There are pics of the chip in the vitalmtb article.

    2016 Santa Cruz Hightower CC X01 29 - Reviews, Comparisons, Specs - Mountain Bikes - Vital MTB

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    FC, can I trouble you for 2 shots...the space between the link or shock eyelet with the flip chip in both position and the dist relative to the seat tube? Thanks.
    This is the low BB position where it's pretty tight indeed.

    Santa Cruz Hightower-p1310018.jpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    I think this is equal in climbing ability to the 5010. Both have a great climbing position and not as much travel/sag as the Bronson. This one has better traction and it has better rocky/rooty climb ability.

    Pedal clearance: This Hightower is 12.7 inch bb height while the 5010 is 13.1. So this is lower. But the geometry on this Hightower can be changed with the Flip Chip and fork spacer change. So it can be raised according to needs and preferences.
    Thanks, fc. I guess if it doesn't sacrifice on the climbs compared to the 5010, there is no reason to forgo the extra travel. 140 on a 29er seems like a lot for my riding, but that'll just mean I need to ride harder. On that BB height, is the 12.7 on the low position for 29" wheels or 27.5+ wheels? I thought I saw a bb height figure about the same as the 5010, but that is before sag of course. I'm hoping my local guys get a demo!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    FC, can I trouble you for 2 shots...the space between the link or shock eyelet with the flip chip in both position and the dist relative to the seat tube? Thanks.
    I like where you're going with this.

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    Ok, I know some "smarter than me" people already did the math. What's the geometry look like with a 160mm front fork in the low position with 29" wheels?

    That's what's interesting to me. Otherwise, with the high chip this looks pretty much like an "ever so slightly" update of the Carbine 29. A touuuuch shorter chainstays, but that's about it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dunleavy View Post
    Thanks, fc. I guess if it doesn't sacrifice on the climbs compared to the 5010, there is no reason to forgo the extra travel. 140 on a 29er seems like a lot for my riding, but that'll just mean I need to ride harder. On that BB height, is the 12.7 on the low position for 29" wheels or 27.5+ wheels? I thought I saw a bb height figure about the same as the 5010, but that is before sag of course. I'm hoping my local guys get a demo!
    13.27 inches is the low position Flip Chip setting on a 29er. When one puts those 27.5 Plus 2.8 tires, the BB height drops to around ~12.9 inches so the Flip Chip along with fork travel increase will prop it back up to 13.27 inch bb height.
    Last edited by fc; 02-02-2016 at 01:55 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    Ok, I know some "smarter than me" people already did the math. What's the geometry look like with a 160mm front fork in the low position with 29" wheels?

    That's what's interesting to me. Otherwise, with the high chip this looks pretty much like an "ever so slightly" update of the Carbine 29. A touuuuch shorter chainstays, but that's about it.
    It's gonna look slaaaack!

    The baller setup right now among the employees seems to be put that stock fork in 150mm mode (chip at Low setting). So it slackens it may 66 degrees? Seat angle is slackened too but at least it starts out at 74.

    This makes the bike rally ready and I think we're gonna see some of their racers use it like this in EWS this year.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip D View Post
    I like where you're going with this.
    are you going like this?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Santa Cruz Hightower-12522915_10153767931983213_7419430045187429179_n.jpg  

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    2.8 plus tires. Like with Scott, it is not a bug, it is a feature.

    Even if Scott and now SC say that 2.8 is superior to 3.0 (the reason, according to Scott, being that 2.8 "rides more like a normal tire") I think the most likely explanation is that the frame development was well underway when Plus emerged on the horizon.

    But the bike looks nice, yes.

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    FC, can you run that 150 fork on the 29 setting?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    are you going like this?
    I think he's thinking 57mm stroke shock. I could be wrong, but that's where my mind went.

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    Thanks. 12.7 is crazy low, IMO, for areas with lots of roots and rocks. I'm sure folks do it, but they have better technique/run bigger gears than me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rev. 14 View Post
    FC, can you run that 150 fork on the 29 setting?
    Absolutely. One thing cool with this bike is there's no restrictions really. The Flip Chip and 140-150mm travel fork were designed for the Plus tires but they can really be used for just 29er tires.

    It can give the bike adjustable bb height for that West Coast, East Coast polarity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard View Post
    2.8 plus tires. Like with Scott, it is not a bug, it is a feature.

    Even if Scott and now SC say that 2.8 is superior to 3.0 (the reason, according to Scott, being that 2.8 "rides more like a normal tire") I think the most likely explanation is that the frame development was well underway when Plus emerged on the horizon.

    But the bike looks nice, yes.
    For a bike that's gonna thunder down the mountain at 40+mph and do air ballet, I think this is a good choice. The bike feels more nimble and the tire inertia is more manageable. Also, as tires add sidewall weight and get big knobs, it's got room for growth.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    are you going like this?
    Where I was going was with this train of thought:

    OE shock spec is 200x51. I have a 203x56 Monarch. The flip chip looks like a 4mm diff between the up and down positions. So the space needed to absorbed is 2mm, something an offset bushing can deal with.
    So, the travel gain would be:
    135/51 x 56 = 148mm
    With a 160mm fork and the pushed down rear axle, hopefully elevating the BB to 13.5 in. That 13.2 is INSANE low!

    So FC, think there is 3mm from link to seat tube to shoehorn a 203mm i2i, 56mm stroke Monarch Plus into the frame with out having to use Burgtec offsets, and get some BB height increase benefits?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    It's gonna look slaaaack!

    The baller setup right now among the employees seems to be put that stock fork in 150mm mode (chip at Low setting). So it slackens it may 66 degrees? Seat angle is slackened too but at least it starts out at 74.

    This makes the bike rally ready and I think we're gonna see some of their racers use it like this in EWS this year.
    Yea, thinking about it, I might like that. I wish it had 145mm rear travel though vs 135. My current Carbine is pretty amazing, but I wish I had a touch more travel and a touch shorter CS. This kinda gives me that, but dunno about the travel.

    The Wreckoning is looking amazing, but that thing is a BRUISER and super long. I think it might be a bit too much bike for what I want. Even for EWS stuff. We'll see what the new Enduro 29 brings after Jared Graves gets to play with it, but it will still have FSR

    Either way, it's a great time to love long travel plastic 29ers with real suspensions! Love having more choice than "Intense Carbine and uhhhh that's it"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pau11y View Post
    Where I was going was with this train of thought:

    OE shock spec is 200x51. I have a 203x56 Monarch. The flip chip looks like a 4mm diff between the up and down positions. So the space needed to absorbed is 2mm, something an offset bushing can deal with.
    So, the travel gain would be:
    135/51 x 56 = 148mm
    With a 160mm fork and the pushed down rear axle, hopefully elevating the BB to 13.5 in. That 13.2 is INSANE low!

    So FC, think there is 3mm from link to seat tube to shoehorn a 203mm i2i, 56mm stroke Monarch Plus into the frame with out having to use Burgtec offsets, and get some BB height increase benefits?
    Anything special about that 203x56 vs. 200x57? Does the extra 3mm of i2i help with seat tube contact on full compression?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin+M View Post
    Anything special about that 203x56 vs. 200x57? Does the extra 3mm of i2i help with seat tube contact on full compression?
    Just want a bit more BB height. Can be done with Burgtecs, but since I already have a shock, with customized shim stack...

    Unsure about seat tube contact at fully squished tho.

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    FC check your math on the bb height. 13.27 on 29 low

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    It's gonna look slaaaack!
    Ok, back of the napkin math with 160mm fork and the low setting for 29" wheels would be:

    HA: 65.9
    SA: 73.2
    Wheelbase: 1173mm ~ 46.2"
    ETT: 605mm ~ 23.8"
    BB Height: 344mm ~ 13.54"
    Reach: 420mm ~ 16.54"
    Stack: 616mm ~ 24.25"

    Damn, that seems pretty solid. If it was 145mm travel, my credit card would be out already. At 135mm travel, going to have to think some more.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    For a bike that's gonna thunder down the mountain at 40+mph and do air ballet, I think this is a good choice. The bike feels more nimble and the tire inertia is more manageable. Also, as tires add sidewall weight and get big knobs, it's got room for growth.
    For a bike that thunders down at 40+ mph, give me a 29er on beefy 2.5 / 2.4 tires any day.

    I think the Hightower is a very promising bike, but Plus in its current form is immature.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by motoguru2007 View Post
    FC check your math on the bb height. 13.27 on 29 low
    You are correct!! I will edit my stuff now so as not to mislead.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard View Post
    For a bike that thunders down at 40+ mph, give me a 29er on beefy 2.5 / 2.4 tires any day.

    I think the Hightower is a very promising bike, but Plus in its current form is immature.
    Agreed. That really is the issue here. If one's gonna go that fast and needs absolute precision, then the 29er is good.

    But if one is gonna do chunky, rooty, sandy trails where traction is at a premium and lower bump-eating tire pressures are desired, the Plus may do well.

    Plus tires are in their infancy for sure. But things are moving very fast.
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    Why didn't they call it the Tallboy LT? Because they said this bike is such a departure from that bike. The said every attribute of the geometry changed so it's not even the same bike anymore.

    I put together a little sheet to analyze. That bike has changed. Styles have changed.Santa Cruz Hightower-screen-shot-2016-02-02-1.10.16-pm.jpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin+M View Post
    Anything special about that 203x56 vs. 200x57? Does the extra 3mm of i2i help with seat tube contact on full compression?
    I had a feeling I'd meet you again here!

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