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  1. #1
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    New Tallboy LTc owner needs help

    OK guys, I need some help. I recently purchased a Tallboy LTc and I am having a very difficult time trying to get the suspension set up. When I am rolling over roots and rocks it almost feels as if I have a rear flat tire.
    The rear shock is a Fox CTD Kashima, can someone point me in the right direction on what I need to do, has anyone else had this issue?

    I also own a TallboyC and I have never had any such issues with it in the past 2 years I have owned it. Is this "flat tire" feel coming from the extra suspension? It makes for an awkward ride on the trail.

    My goal is to only keep one of these bikes and sell the other. Right now my 2 year old Tallboy has the nod for staying in the stable if this suspension feeling is what the LT is about.

    Any help would be appreciated.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  2. #2
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    Need more info.

    What's you're weight, geared up ready to ride?

    What pressure are you running in the shock and what is your rebound setting?

    What tire are you running on the rear? PSI... tubeless?
    2014 Tallboy 2

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by mlx john View Post
    Need more info.

    What's you're weight, geared up ready to ride?

    What pressure are you running in the shock and what is your rebound setting?

    What tire are you running on the rear? PSI... tubeless?
    I figured I would leave some valuable information out.

    Weight is 225, air pressure is also set at 225. Rebound is set in the middle. I have the stock Ardent on the rear and run it at 32 PSI.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  4. #4
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    Are you riding with the ProPedal in the Firm setting or is the lever flipped to the drive-side?

    Is this feeling happening while climbing or descending?

  5. #5
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    I had this feeling when I first got my bike, it was really strange and I kept looking at my back wheel to make sure it still had air. I had completely forgotten about it until you mentioned it because about a month after, I swapped out the wheels and tyres for Enve AM and Schwalbe Racing Ralphs. Maybe it's the Ardents? Because I know exactly that feel you're talking about but haven't experienced it since.
    Santa Cruz Tallboy LTc

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMFT View Post
    Are you riding with the ProPedal in the Firm setting or is the lever flipped to the drive-side?

    Is this feeling happening while climbing or descending?
    I have the shock in Trail mode, I mainly feel it when going a slower pace such as climbing or slower switchbacks.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by max_croft View Post
    I had this feeling when I first got my bike, it was really strange and I kept looking at my back wheel to make sure it still had air. I had completely forgotten about it until you mentioned it because about a month after, I swapped out the wheels and tyres for Enve AM and Schwalbe Racing Ralphs. Maybe it's the Ardents? Because I know exactly that feel you're talking about but haven't experienced it since.
    I have looked at my rear tire more times than I can count thinking I have a flat. I have never used Ardents before so maybe that can be the problem.

    I have owned roughly 10 Santa Cruz's and have never had this feeling on any of those bikes. I was concerned it may be the way the suspension is on the LT which was leaving me with a bad taste in my mouth. Hopefully a tire change will do the trick. I will try to pick up a new tire this week.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  8. #8
    rdb
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    I had the same feeling on my bike. When I added a little more rebound damping, the feeling went away. If you know of a spot on a trail where the feeling occurs, go over the spot a few times and add a little more rebound damping each time and see if that helps.

  9. #9
    Bodhisattva
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    This is a shock setup issue until proven otherwise.

    Start by rechecking your sag. Shoot for 20-25% shock travel and wear your regular riding pack. Ideally, get a friend to hold the bike. Mount the bike, bounce once or twice, then have your friend push the shaft o-ring down to the can while you sit in a riding position - brakes off. Gently dismount the bike and measure your sag. Adjust psi as needed Shock should be in descend mode for this. Then set rebound halfway for starters and see how the shock feels.
    Life....the original terminal illness

  10. #10
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    Sounds like you need more compression resis. I have played with mine for quite awhile before settling on the middle [0,1,2 ] on the newer shock its [1,2,3] I think. This will give the shock a slightly firmer feel under pedaling but not much diff. on descending. Also coming from the TBc to the TBLTc there is alot more mid travel to play with as the TBc used up its rear quickly, the LTc feels much plusher than the numbers suggest

  11. #11
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    Thanks for the input guys, I plan on riding tomorrow so I will play with the rebound then. I will also verify my sag and make changes if needed. I will report back what I find.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  12. #12
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    Update, I added 15 more lbs of air, set rebound in the middle setting and the bike was a completely different ride today. No flat tire feeling and the bike felt great. In fact, I cut 2 minutes off of my fastest lap at this trail. Much happier with the bike now.

    Now to decide about getting a Pike on the front and replacing the Fox.

    Thanks everyone for your help.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  13. #13
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    Yes get a Pike 150mm. And replace the RP23. Glad you're liking the bike with a different setup.

  14. #14
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    One thing to add for anyone who may experience this in the future, I am not getting anywhere near 20% sag on my shock, I may have 10%. I used the IRD app from Fox and the suggested air pressure was 240lbs, I put this in the shock and did the fitting with O ring, after the fitting the app showed I needed to drop the pressure down to 179 psi to get the appropriate sag. I did not do this, I left the pressure at 240 lbs which made for a great ride with no flat tire feel. I feel at 179 psi it would have made things worse.

    Strange but I will go with what works and that is a much stiffer rear end so I don't have that flat tire feeling.

    Anyway, just added this in case others may experience this feeling in the future as it appears from the other posts that others have had the same issues.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by jselwyn View Post
    Yes get a Pike 150mm. And replace the RP23. Glad you're liking the bike with a different setup.
    I am strongly considering this with all of the reviews I have been reading.

    I just have to figure out how to get another postal box past the wife without her noticing.
    2013 SC Tallboy LTc
    2011 SC Tallboy C
    2010 Jackal
    2012 Heckler

  16. #16
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    even though you got it figured out, maybe make sure that none of your axles are loose. I had a couple loose axles once on my Blur and had this same feeling. Kind of a flattire/squirrelly feeling in the back. they dont need to be very tight at all, just tight enough to remove the play, but mine were really loose and it led to this feeling.

  17. #17
    Bodhisattva
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtbiker View Post
    One thing to add for anyone who may experience this in the future, I am not getting anywhere near 20% sag on my shock, I may have 10%. I used the IRD app from Fox and the suggested air pressure was 240lbs, I put this in the shock and did the fitting with O ring, after the fitting the app showed I needed to drop the pressure down to 179 psi to get the appropriate sag. I did not do this, I left the pressure at 240 lbs which made for a great ride with no flat tire feel. I feel at 179 psi it would have made things worse.

    Strange but I will go with what works and that is a much stiffer rear end so I don't have that flat tire feeling.

    Anyway, just added this in case others may experience this feeling in the future as it appears from the other posts that others have had the same issues.
    I think you strongly need to consider having Push tune your shock.
    Also, their new 34 Float tune it superb as well.
    Life....the original terminal illness

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirtbiker View Post
    Update, I added 15 more lbs of air, set rebound in the middle setting and the bike was a completely different ride today. No flat tire feeling and the bike felt great. In fact, I cut 2 minutes off of my fastest lap at this trail. Much happier with the bike now.

    Now to decide about getting a Pike on the front and replacing the Fox.

    Thanks everyone for your help.
    I weigh 225 lb geared to ride and had similar experiences. I sent my shock to Push and have been very happy with the result. I went from running ~240 psi to running ~225 psi with drastically improved performance. I still may go with a CCDBA, but Push can, at a minimum, get the RP23/Float working to the top of its capabilities, and the result is a massive improvement from the stock tune.

  19. #19
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    I too am debating whether I should send my 2013 CTD 29" fork to Push for their elite service tune for $325 or bite the bullet and get a Pike. The Push alternative is 1/3 the cost so I will probably go that route. Would it be worth having the CTD shock Pushed as well if I go that route.

    Thx

  20. #20
    Bodhisattva
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter19ue View Post
    I too am debating whether I should send my 2013 CTD 29" fork to Push for their elite service tune for $325 or bite the bullet and get a Pike. The Push alternative is 1/3 the cost so I will probably go that route. Would it be worth having the CTD shock Pushed as well if I go that route.

    Thx
    I haven't tried the Pike, so can't comment.
    I was one of the beta riders for the 34 Push tune and I 've been riding it for about 6 weeks. Mine is a 2014 fork. The upgrade from stock is significant. Gone is the mid-stroke wallow of the stock tune. I now have separate control of both high & low speed damping which gives a feeling of superb plushness but without brake dive or wallow in g-outs.

    I also have my rear Float tuned, which is also a big improvement over stock.

    (yes, I'm a long time Push fanboy)
    Life....the original terminal illness

  21. #21
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    Thanks for the reply. I will most likely send them both to Push. My biggest complaint with the CTD fork is that it is extremely rough when I go over sections of small rocks. I can barely hold on to the handlebars. It gets better going over bigger rocks but is awfully bumpy on the small stuff. My son has a RockShox Lyrix and it is so much smoother that my CTD fork it is unbelievable.

  22. #22
    Bodhisattva
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter19ue View Post
    Thanks for the reply. I will most likely send them both to Push. My biggest complaint with the CTD fork is that it is extremely rough when I go over sections of small rocks. I can barely hold on to the handlebars. It gets better going over bigger rocks but is awfully bumpy on the small stuff. My son has a RockShox Lyrix and it is so much smoother that my CTD fork it is unbelievable.
    On stock, my biggest complaint was the complete lack of midstroke support on the 34 fork. I can theorize that the harsh sensation you feel on the small stuff may be because you upped the air preload in order to compensate for the lack of midstroke? I know that I can get anyway with less air pressure now than before
    Life....the original terminal illness

  23. #23
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    That's pretty much right on target. Now my fork is so stiff I can barely compress it. My sons lyrix on the other hand is smooth as butter no matter what the psi is sent to. Hopefully the Push tune will help. Otherwise I'll have to get a 150mm Pike

  24. #24
    Bodhisattva
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter19ue View Post
    That's pretty much right on target. Now my fork is so stiff I can barely compress it. My sons lyrix on the other hand is smooth as butter no matter what the psi is sent to. Hopefully the Push tune will help. Otherwise I'll have to get a 150mm Pike
    I don't want to oversell the Push tune, but it's super smooth. I've owned a number of RS & Fox products - I can't really say I prefer one over the other. It depends on the model year, tune, etc....
    Life....the original terminal illness

  25. #25
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    Well it's either a $325 Push elite tune or a new $995 Pike because the 2013 CTD isn't cutting it

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