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  1. #1
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    Lets see those LT2s

    Frames, built bikes, weights, opinions, lets have it!
    You can't make a racehorse out of a donkey, but you can make a fast donkey.

  2. #2
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    Mine ain't due to arrive at the shop til mid May. Pictures will be coming for sure though.
    In an earlier thread, I did post an anodized skidmark from Sea Otter.

    Who has theirs and are riding it?

  3. #3
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    I'm in the same boat... Waiting on a white lg ordered all the way back in February. Maybe I should order a replacement now, cause when the first one finally arrives, I'll probably wear it out in a month I'm gonna ride so much!

  4. #4
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    Goog news!

    Ha, my distr was right that first order-first get!
    My XL skidmark will be here end of next week (laying in customs in the moment)

    My build will be as follows:
    08 Talas RC2
    RP 23 (nothing more mature offered)
    XT 11-34casette&cranks (22-32-44)
    XTR Shadow RD (med cage) &FD &shifters
    Rohloff chain
    Joplin R (finally arrived from warranty clamp exchange plus upgraded to Remote for free:P)
    WTB PureV
    Mango King HD +FunBolts + Mav819 +NobbyNic sankeskin2.25 (possibly 2.4 if fits) rear
    Mango King + Blunt650B+NeoMoto front
    Hope Mono M4 8"&7"
    Syntace Vector Carbon 31.8 27" bars (12deg rear sweep)
    Thomson X4 0deg 90mm
    Ergon GE1 grips
    Candy SL pedals

    Should be below 31lbs total

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    Joplin R (finally arrived from warranty clamp exchange plus upgraded to Remote for free:P)
    When you say finally, how long are you talking? I sent my peddles into Crank Bros for a warranty repair about 2 weeks ago, and I was told it would be a 2-3 day turn around on their end... I may have to find something else to use in the meantime.

  6. #6
    emtb.pl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogie Man
    When you say finally, how long are you talking? I sent my peddles into Crank Bros for a warranty repair about 2 weeks ago, and I was told it would be a 2-3 day turn around on their end... I may have to find something else to use in the meantime.
    Finally means it took 3.5 weeks Poland-USA-Poland, express shipping on both ends. Mind you we had a free long weekend here in Poland which delays the shipping 4days on my side.

  7. #7
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    My Lrg should be here by the end of the week

    Ano Skid mark Frame
    rp23 (soon to be Pushed)
    Pushed Float 32
    XTR cranks
    XTR shifters
    XTR re der
    Hayes Stroker Trails
    Stans Flow rims on Hugi 240's
    thompson Stem and post
    Truvativ Dh bar
    Michi Dry 2 in 2.3 front and rear.

    Wont know what it weighs until I weigh it.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    Finally means it took 3.5 weeks Poland-USA-Poland, express shipping on both ends. Mind you we had a free long weekend here in Poland which delays the shipping 4days on my side.
    Thanks that makes me feel a little better. Hopefully, my peddles won't be much longer.

  9. #9
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    Waiting for my medium (sand powdercoat) Blur LT2. should be here next week. CAN'T WAIT!!!


    FORK Pike 454 dual air
    SHOCK Float RP23
    REAR DER SRAM X9 long cage
    FRONT DER Shimano M770A (XT)
    SHIFTERS SRAM X9 triggers
    CRANKSET TruVativ Stylo Team w/ Giga X Drive 22/32/44
    CASSETTE SRAM PG 980, 11-34
    BRAKES Avid Juicy 7's w/ 185mm rotors
    BRAKE LEVERS Avid Juicy 7's
    BARS Race Face Atlas low riser
    STEM Race Face Atlas AM
    GRIPS Lizard Skin lock on
    HEADSET Cane Creek S3
    SEAT POST Thomson
    SADDLE WTB Pure V Stealth
    WHEELS DT 5.1 rims laced to DT 340 hubs w/DT 14/15 spokes, alloy nipples.
    TIRES Kenda Nevegal 2.35 folding
    TUBES Kenda Freeride

  10. #10
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    Ok....you guys that are riding next wk on the BLT2, you have to confess...WHEN did you place the order?

    I placed at the start of March, and was told ETA of last part of June. After some following up, they pushed it up to Mid May.

    You guys got to have ordered Feburary?

  11. #11
    emtb.pl
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    Late Feb

    I placed my order last week of February. Up to last week I was assured the frame will be here late June as L & XL are produced in a second run.
    And yesterday - BANG, the distr says guys at SC did a great job and my frame is already here in Poland just laing in customs and should be at his shop on monday. Still I need to wait for the DHL so probably wednesday.

    I need a headset though and just placed my order - mango bits with the skidmark should look nice, plus I have them left from my LT:P Another nice thing is that Joplin post has all these bits in mango. And I mean mango, not close to mango. The ano is IDENTICAL on King mango and CrankBros Joplin

  12. #12
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    Here you go. Just got it today. Medium black ano. Should be built by tomorrow night. I will post some pics when its finished. Frame looks amazing.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    KENDA

  13. #13
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    My local bike store had two frames on order already when I walked in four weeks ago. Got one of them :-)

    The black frame looks sweet!

  14. #14
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    doesn't look like they are made in the USA like the nomads

  15. #15
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    nope-

    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Earn your turns. )'(

  16. #16
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    looks better than any made in the usa frame i've ever seen. whats wrong with spending the extra money on making things nicer rather than making them cheaper? Besides, your dollar from a few years ago is worth quite a bit less now, so if you consider value and not the "number" you have a different comparison. This is an interesting website to check out if you are so inclined: http://www.measuringworth.com

    Use the "relative values" of US$ from 2005 (the last US Blurs produced) and compare to 2007 (the latest data available), and you see the difference in prices. Since 1/1/08 until today its been a steady decline also, so that would even be a conservative value.

    Thanks to our friends in Washington and corporate whores everywhere!

  17. #17
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    yeah, SPC / ISO mfg methods with a reduced number of operators tending precision numeric controlled robots will make a nicer bead every time. I'm skeptical it costs more to make the frames in that manner even adjusting for "values". Off shore mfg's surely DO NOT have the ENVIRONMENTAL / Hazardous materials Considerations we have here in the US either. So they look prettier, cost more and are more detrimental to the planet..... nice trade off....

    I'm kind of partial to feeding an American family. But that's just me.

    Have you scrutinized a Moots, or Merlin, or Yeti or Ventana frame.... all hand welded and mighty fine work. Paul Sadoff, Rick Hunter, John Caletti these guys are artists with a Tig torch. If a machine welded frame looks better than any Made in USA frame you've ever seen, I think you may need to look more closely at more US made frames.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  18. #18
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    it sucks big time that so many frames are made out of states or N America. hope that one day we will have back in here all the production. corp sucks. let the wheels rollin'.
    cheers sc owners.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Have you scrutinized a Moots, or Merlin, or Yeti or Ventana frame.... all hand welded and mighty fine work. Paul Sadoff, Rick Hunter, John Caletti these guys are artists with a Tig torch. If a machine welded frame looks better than any Made in USA frame you've ever seen, I think you may need to look more closely at more US made frames.
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.

    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.

    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.

    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.

    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.
    Last edited by syadasti; 05-08-2008 at 04:56 AM.

  20. #20
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    hey those are new frame graphics - where is the 'swoosh' over the lettering and on the seat stay - does this mean all frames are getting the new look?

  21. #21
    emtb.pl
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    Quote Originally Posted by munkyboy
    hey those are new frame graphics - where is the 'swoosh' over the lettering and on the seat stay - does this mean all frames are getting the new look?
    yep I've noticed that too.
    shame as I liked it - it looked somewhat retro.

  22. #22
    HIKE!
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    Taiwan

    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Yeah, you'd think with attention to detail, better accuracy and precision, superior fabrication all around, better finish and assembly, the superior Taiwanese frames would cost alot more than the USA made.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Or maybe the $1750 price of a powdercoated frame would be over 2k like an Intense 5.5.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.

    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.

    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.

    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.

    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.


    Amen to that! The latest Taiwan frames have become increasingly higher in quality, and not just from Santa Cruz.
    "To crush your enemies, see them driven before, and to hear the lamentation of the women."

  25. #25
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    What about the Environmental issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.
    Their high volume models are Taiwan made. - AS-X , DJ, and 575 and their prices reflect that fact, being $100's cheaper than they would be if US made.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.
    I don't care, I have my preference for US made frames for personal reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.
    Never said they didn't, on the contrary, SPC derived mass production mfg that has been adopted by Asian markets was the brain child of an American who was snubbed by US big business. BUT 1 operator tending 4-10 robots isn't a craftsman, he's an operator/engineer.

    OTOH - Taiwan doesn't have the environmental standards in place, I wouldn't be surprised that they dump toxic mfg by products directly into the environment. And expose their operators to all the toxic fumes from tig welding to boot.

    What can you say about the continual damage being done by them to our already injured planet?

    What kind of carbon footprint does a Taiwan made frame have compared to a US made one? Factory, Truck, Ship, Truck, Truck,shop? compared to factory, truck, truck,shop.
    and that's not considering the Carbon footprint of getting the production materials to the factories, and unregulated environmental concerns.

    so maybe that's why they cost more; in order to get my made in Taiwan bike, I gotta pay compensation to put more hurt on the environment.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.
    What story is that? I want to buy local American to feed a local American family?

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.
    That "bright" side might be a Nuclear flash

    I'm learning Mandarin and Cantonese in preparation, and digging a bomb shelter.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    OTOH - Taiwan doesn't have the environmental standards in place, I wouldn't be surprised that they dump toxic mfg by products directly into the environment. And expose their operators to all the toxic fumes from tig welding to boot.

    What can you say about the continual damage being done by them to our already injured planet?

    What kind of carbon footprint does a Taiwan made frame have compared to a US made one? Factory, Truck, Ship, Truck, Truck,shop? compared to factory, truck, truck,shop.
    and that's not considering the Carbon footprint of getting the production materials to the factories, and unregulated environmental concerns.

    so maybe that's why they cost more; in order to get my made in Taiwan bike, I gotta pay compensation to put more hurt on the environment.
    The bike manufacturers have a small footprint overall compared to the mining and processing companies that make the materials that go in to the bike. That is were made in the US won't really mean much as most of the materials are from overseas - that is were it matters but good luck finding that out from any bike maker. Mining and processing operations are horrible for the environment even in the US. Overall making a bike or bike parts is bad for the environment regardless of what country you are in.

    China is making progress on the environmental front but are obviously way behind, I don't deny that.

  27. #27
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    uh, robots are used to weld bikes. Not in the US, not in Taiwan, not in China. When "operators" can be used to replace "skilled labor" its called "increasing productivity". Increasing productivity is typically what high labor cost economies do (think United States and Europe). Do you think there are "operators" controlling robots that sand your carbon frames smooth in China? Why do you think they are made in China? Because they have lots robots that work for $2 an hour? (in a robot voice now) - "I am a robot, I welded your bike, you should go ride it and stop spewing your nationalistic nonsense".

    Here's a good one: If an Asian robot welds your frame in California, operated by an undocumented Mexican, is it US made?
    Oh, and when Rick, Paul or Moots makes a competitive aluminum full suspension frame for $1800 retail, I'll buy one. You don't gotsta be white or in 'murica to be an "artist with a tig torch".

  28. #28
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    Also the carbon footprint of an average American family is exponentially bigger than that of a average Chinese family. Even taking into account the population differential it would still be in their favor as far as smaller footprint. The US has 5% of the world's population but uses almost 30% of the world's energy - we are the dirty pigs.

    Talking about pigs...some of the worst polluters in the US:

    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...orst_polluters

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    Here you go. Just got it today. Medium black ano. Should be built by tomorrow night. I will post some pics when its finished. Frame looks amazing.
    Back to the topic at hand, as I'm sick of every thread about a new frame turning into an argument about where it's made... The BLT2 frame does look amazing. Thanks for the pics.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogie Man
    Back to the topic at hand, as I'm sick of every thread about a new frame turning into an argument about where it's made... The BLT2 frame does look amazing. Thanks for the pics.
    Totaly agreed here!
    I'd much prefer a little chat about the frame and its behaviour over the never ending argument about manufacturing.

  31. #31
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    On a happy note, I just left my LBS and dropped off my bike to swap over all my parts(plus some new ones) to my new BLT2. Looks wicked nice in person. I will post some pics when she is done.

  32. #32
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    Krolik- I Think The Swoosh Is For The Powdercoat Frames. My Ano Frame, And All The Other Ano's I Have Seen Have Not Had The Swoosh. However, I Could Be Wrong.
    KENDA

  33. #33
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    Also, This Tread Is Supposed To Be About People Excited Over Their New Blt2. Not *****ing About Manufacturing Processes And Factory Locations. Some Of You Are Ridiculous.
    KENDA

  34. #34
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    I might understand swoosh wrong

    This is what I thought about - the line going across the letters - this is my ano orange - she's gone next week:P

    blt_left.JPG

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    Also, This Tread Is Supposed To Be About People Excited Over Their New Blt2. Not *****ing About Manufacturing Processes And Factory Locations. Some Of You Are Ridiculous.
    I was just thinking the same thing. Very nice frame you got there regardless of where it was made.

  36. #36
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    Yeah, nice frames. Very Pretty, Great handling and let's ride now.... forget what happens to future generations.

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...asianhaze.html

    done pissing..... going riding.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by eleven-yo
    looks better than any made in the usa frame i've ever seen. whats wrong with spending the extra money on making things nicer rather than making them cheaper? Besides, your dollar from a few years ago is worth quite a bit less now, so if you consider value and not the "number" you have a different comparison. This is an interesting website to check out if you are so inclined: http://www.measuringworth.com

    Use the "relative values" of US$ from 2005 (the last US Blurs produced) and compare to 2007 (the latest data available), and you see the difference in prices. Since 1/1/08 until today its been a steady decline also, so that would even be a conservative value.

    Thanks to our friends in Washington and corporate whores everywhere!

    I've got a 07 blur that says mde in the USA

  38. #38
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    taiwan not china

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    The bike manufacturers have a small footprint overall compared to the mining and processing companies that make the materials that go in to the bike. That is were made in the US won't really mean much as most of the materials are from overseas - that is were it matters but good luck finding that out from any bike maker. Mining and processing operations are horrible for the environment even in the US. Overall making a bike or bike parts is bad for the environment regardless of what country you are in.

    China is making progress on the environmental front but are obviously way behind, I don't deny that.
    Be carefull Taiwan is not exactly China in termes of social and environmental standards the difference is important

  39. #39
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    According to China,and its billion man army...it is....

    Quote Originally Posted by raki
    Be carefull Taiwan is not exactly China in termes of social and environmental standards the difference is important
    I think China has something to say contrary to that..... and if they wanted to push it, the world essentially would be powerless to stop it. unless we want to use Nukes...

    Economic sanctions wouldn't quite work since they MAKE OUR goods. We are at their mercy.

    If they decided to withhold trade, our nation would be in DEEP DOO DOO.

    but screw it all - let's just consume and ride our bikes. Pie in the sky and rosy colored glasses. It's all good.

    God Loves me at least.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  40. #40
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    We haven't built ours completely up yet, but I've sat on it and to me it felt pretty good. Obviously feels a little more like the Nomad, and i would be more inclined to take it off some small drops than the LT1. In my opinion, its kinda of a hybrid between the Nomad and the LT1, but not an equal distribution. Its more like 70% LT1 and 30% Nomad if you get my drift. It should make a great all around bike and should be pretty comparable to a Mojo. If I had to pick though, I would pick the Mojo because its comparable in price and I really like what Ibis is trying to do right now.

  41. #41
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    Man - you guys are crazy. I've been to Hodaka, Giant, most of the Kinesis factories, Fairly, Strong (vietnam) a BUNCH of small builders... heck I've been to most of the factories over there. It's always a PERSON welding and building the bike. Yes, I've even met the people doing it and they are incredible people. I haven't ever seen a robot welder although maybe they are there now because it's been a while. What is the problem? If we can't do it in the USA for a reasonable price, we lose the business to others that can. And we lose it to people that appreciate the business. Would I prefer a USA frame - yes. Are the people that make it over there bad - no. JEEZE.

  42. #42
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    Ironically, in the U.S. we think of reducing costs and making things more efficient as good business practices. If we can't step up to the plate and compete with they way the Taiwanese and Chinese are building frames, then we need to change our process of building bikes. One thing I can't understand though: why someone thinks "U.S. Made" is better in every facet. Obviously the Japanese are typically better at making cars (Toyota/Honda) and computers than the U.S. is. Would you buy a computer just because it was made in the U.S.? No. In fact, I wouldn't even say that Taiwanese welders make frames equivalent of that of U.S. welders, I would say they are better. The Taiwanese welder probably has more experience and takes more pride in his work than the American. (This is not a generalization of all welders; I am positive there are some very amazing welders in the U.S. I am just stating my overall opinion.)

  43. #43
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    2 pages and only a couple of pics of actual BLT2's.

    If you want to argue about the economics of frame building, I think there's a forum for that here: http://forums.mtbr.com/forum.php#political-socio-economic-religion

  44. #44
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:H...07_report_.gif

    x-axis: degree of advancement in material life.
    y-axis: amount of pollution produced to achieve the material life.

    There are 4 pink triangles representing East Asian countries in this graph. I believe they are Japan, South Korea, China, & North Korea.

    I've been to Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan, both their urban & rural parts I'm fairly certain wealth & the industry of Taiwan are more or less comparable to South Korea in this graph.

    Link to the original article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecological_footprint)

    A lot has to do with how people in East Asia just don't own and drive cars & SUVs as much as Americans. Much of environmental damages (famous violations kids would learn in schools) & the installment of regulations & the enforcement are old news: Japan in 70s, So. Korea & Taiwan in 80s.
    Last edited by Astroboy; 05-08-2008 at 10:42 PM.

  45. #45
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    Can a moderator split this thread into two - blur lt2 stuff and tiawan vs USA production?

    Thanks.

  46. #46
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    + 1 to this idea.

  47. #47
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    sounds like a great idea, stop whining!

    Get some pictures up and how is the BLT2?? Anyone been out in the dirt yet? It will probably be another week until I see mine :-(

  48. #48
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    I think that when there are more of them out, we'll start getting more pics. Until then - we gotta talk about something.

  49. #49
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    I'd much prefer little argument about future builds
    or how is it possible that SC doesn't offer any more aggressive shocks to this frame
    or why they just made one step forward and offered one piece outer cable in the rear but not the next step and the front cabling part still has to suffer mud
    or how the new two piece rear dropout is better then the previous replacable one
    or heck, even what colour combos are you going to run
    dammit, even another argument about non-existent bottle mounts would be better than this never-ever-ending argument about manufacturing.
    it's all been said already everywhere and if someone doesn't understand why protecting environment is important, than there is no way you're going to make him understand it here. and if someone doesn't get it why frames are being build on taiwan and not in us, there is nothing anyone can do to help him.

    please, guys that already have their LT2's - post some more pics! I know you're prolly not going to go home for another month cause you're licking your frame somewhere alone but please, share some more!

    Mine is confirmed to be here on wednesday:]

  50. #50
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    How about some feedback on how they ride? That'd be interesting.
    Faster is not always better, but it's always more fun

  51. #51
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    wouldn't even dare to ask

  52. #52
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    Here is my baby Nomad

    Yes they do exist. Just took it out for a spin. My Nomad, BLT1 and Superlight are going up for for sale this weekend...need I say more?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzboy
    Yes they do exist. Just took it out for a spin. My Nomad, BLT1 and Superlight are going up for for sale this weekend...need I say more?
    A bit more feedback would be nice, but we don't want to be asking for too much either.
    Faster is not always better, but it's always more fun

  54. #54
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    new bike envy, looking for a replacement? one of the sc guys said it's all good. i'd love to demo one, but I'd prolly want one after that.

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by nativeson
    new bike envy, looking for a replacement? one of the sc guys said it's all good. i'd love to demo one, but I'd prolly want one after that.
    Bike ADD... So far, I've demoed 575, Durance and Spot. The Maverick and Turner felt really good. Gotta ride the Blur LT2 to check it out too (probably at Dville).
    Faster is not always better, but it's always more fun

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzboy
    Yes they do exist. Just took it out for a spin. My Nomad, BLT1 and Superlight are going up for for sale this weekend...need I say more?
    This is an L size??

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Their high volume models are Taiwan made. - AS-X , DJ, and 575 and their prices reflect that fact, being $100's cheaper than they would be if US made.



    I don't care, I have my preference for US made frames for personal reasons.



    Never said they didn't, on the contrary, SPC derived mass production mfg that has been adopted by Asian markets was the brain child of an American who was snubbed by US big business. BUT 1 operator tending 4-10 robots isn't a craftsman, he's an operator/engineer.

    OTOH - Taiwan doesn't have the environmental standards in place, I wouldn't be surprised that they dump toxic mfg by products directly into the environment. And expose their operators to all the toxic fumes from tig welding to boot.

    What can you say about the continual damage being done by them to our already injured planet?

    What kind of carbon footprint does a Taiwan made frame have compared to a US made one? Factory, Truck, Ship, Truck, Truck,shop? compared to factory, truck, truck,shop.
    and that's not considering the Carbon footprint of getting the production materials to the factories, and unregulated environmental concerns.

    so maybe that's why they cost more; in order to get my made in Taiwan bike, I gotta pay compensation to put more hurt on the environment.



    What story is that? I want to buy local American to feed a local American family?



    That "bright" side might be a Nuclear flash

    I'm learning Mandarin and Cantonese in preparation, and digging a bomb shelter.

    As an American living and working in Taiwan for the past 4 years, I have to say you should educate yourself to the reality of Taiwanese labor and environmental policy before you start giving it a negative description. I think you have China and Taiwan confused.

    These new LT2's are awesome by the way. Make my Reign a little jealous.
    OVER THE LINE SMOKEY!

  58. #58
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    Yep. Large, black ano.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzboy
    Yep. Large, black ano.
    That's what I thought looking at the space between top tube and rear shock mount.
    Just as with LT1, the larger the frame, the better it looks imo. With LT1 the XL looked far better than S&M imo, with that curved top tube. I hope my XL LT2 will be that way.
    Tell us some more how it rides!
    Bike looks incredible btw

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by moshelove
    As an American living and working in Taiwan for the past 4 years, I have to say you should educate yourself to the reality of Taiwanese labor and environmental policy before you start giving it a negative description. I think you have China and Taiwan confused.

    These new LT2's are awesome by the way. Make my Reign a little jealous.
    Free Tibet. 'nuff said.
    Earn your turns. )'(

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    *wrong tree*
    Last edited by syadasti; 05-11-2008 at 09:45 AM.

  62. #62
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    This thread has gone to a very silly place. I will post my thoughts on the new BLT in a new thread when I get a chance.

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    Seems like you are a typical blind bandwagon cause supporter. First you said robots and environment and that was BS so now its Free Tibet?

    A large percentage of your bike supports Taiwan and China. How many of these idiots on the wagon buy a whole bunch of crap that goes totally counter to their so called cause when they could easily do otherwise if they really cared.

    Its like buying a Prius (consume to save the planet?) which supports a company that lobbies against tougher fuel economy standards in CA and the US. Toyota just came out with a whole new line of upsized vehicles compared to the prior generation like the rest of the industry instead of building smaller more efficient cars. In fact they now they have all new full sized (oversized) POS like the Land Cruiser, Sequoia, and Tundra. They are in it to make money and they don't give a crap about the environment, only their marketing image and the bottom line.

    Instead of truly changing their ways everyone wants to project an image of trying but they really aren't looking at the issue that closely and really trying to change to make a difference. Bandwagon posers suck.

    Free Tibet...when are you getting your BLT2

  64. #64
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    So Off Topic....

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Seems like you are a typical blind bandwagon cause supporter. First you said robots and environment and that was BS so now its Free Tibet?
    Out of context - Taiwan is governed by China FACT; FIRST and FOREMOST- Taiwan tenuously operates outside of the hardline communists because it's a goose that lays golden eggs, and China has for 10,000 yrs been a trade nation: and business is business.

    numerous replies to my posts have tried to paint a picture that Taiwan is independent of China, which is patently NOT TRUE..... Let Taiwan TRY to claim independence from china and see what happens.... my free Tibet comment was a glib declaration on what china can and will do if it so chooses, humanity be damned.

    The FACT still stands, Robots are putting those precise pretty welds on the new LT's, Automated Hydroforming machines are forming the highly manipulated tubesets, and the wastewater/coolant/forming fluid is more readily improperly disposed of in an industrial nation whose primary motivating factor is supplying the market, human costs be damned. I'm not too keen on that fact, and in my original post on my preliminary parking lot ride of the LT2, stated that; Coming to grips on purchasing a taiwan made frame.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    A large percentage of your bike supports Taiwan and China. How many of these idiots on the wagon buy a whole bunch of crap that goes totally counter to their so called cause when they could easily do otherwise if they really cared.
    I ride a bike with 5 yr old XT 755 Disc brakes, 4 yr old cranks, 4yr old wheels, re tuned, repaired rather than replaced, etc...- I'm not in the habit of gross consumerism.... I replace parts as they no longer become serviceable, I don't buy cheap crap, I make thoughtful purchases for semi durable goods, my most recent being a RS Pike fork, an item using a standard 20mm TA, easy conversion of my Hope Hub, and of a vintage that I feel has been offset my personal reduction of my own carbon footprint, i.e., 2 mile solution, recycling, re-using, reducing for the last 1.5yrs since my last worthwhile component purchase; a maverick speedball R.

    Consumables, Tires, cables, chains, cogs, grips, chainrings..... a necessary evil, since I ride so much. But living in Santa Cruz, I ride to the dirt, I ride to grocery shop, I ride to the pub, I ride to the gym, I ride to the cinema, my 2 mile solution is more like 7 miles.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Its like buying a Prius (consume to save the planet?) which supports a company that lobbies against tougher fuel economy standards in CA and the US. Toyota just came out with a whole new line of upsized vehicles compared to the prior generation like the rest of the industry instead of building smaller more efficient cars. In fact they now they have all new full sized (oversized) POS like the Land Cruiser, Sequoia, and Tundra. They are in it to make money and they don't give a crap about the environment, only their marketing image and the bottom line.
    My last Toyota was a 1980 Hi-lux 4wd and it had 300,000 miles on it. NEVER PASSED SMOG without extensive tweaking. I dumped it in 97...

    I currently drive a US made 10yr old compact truck with 209,000 miles on it, and it passes California smog tests (some of the most stringent) everytime, without repairs. Pretty sure I've offset the carbon used to produce it. end of subject.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Instead of truly changing their ways everyone wants to project an image of trying but they really aren't looking at the issue that closely and really trying to change to make a difference. Bandwagon posers suck.
    I Talk the talk and WALK the WALK. Or actually Ride the WALK.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Free Tibet...when are you getting your BLT2
    I'm not sure if I'm even going to bother anytime soon, and if I do it'll be in at least a year of the 3 R's and unless they reintroduce Trans Blue before that, then I'll go into carbon debt.

    And when someone asks "how do you like it, I'll say it's great except........made in ....."
    Earn your turns. )'(

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorg
    A bit more feedback would be nice, but we don't want to be asking for too much either.
    I agree that the people who are lucky enough to have theirs already need to tell the rest of us on the waiting list how the bike rides. On the other hand though, I know that ounce mine finally gets here I'll be too busy riding to do a review !

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Out of context - Taiwan is governed by China FACT; FIRST and FOREMOST- Taiwan tenuously operates outside of the hardline communists because it's a goose that lays golden eggs, and China has for 10,000 yrs been a trade nation: and business is business."
    Dan, you seem like a cool dude with excellent environmental values. I just want to clear up some of the misinformation about Taiwan though because it is a huge producer of MTB frames and a beautiful country, but is often mislabeled and misrepresented. While Taiwan is formally a part of the ROC, it functions 100% independently from China in all areas of government and economic trade. China has no power to directly tax or profit from Taiwan's economy, only the economic power to shut Taiwan out of the international community. Taiwan is an independent democracy with a stable 2 party system. The fact that Taiwan operates in this manner is to no benefit to China whatsoever and is made possible by our (US military) pledge to protect Taiwan defensively against China's military threat. Taiwan has unsuccessfully attempted to gain independence due to China's economic power internationally, particularly over the US. Taiwan is currently seeking to join the United Nations which would offer it more protection from China and more opportunities for formal acknowledgement of it's independence. Basically a classic political dead-lock.

    Sorry for stinking up your LT2 topic guys, I want to check out these bikes too but I feel the need to clarify some of the misinformation about Taiwan. It is relevant in the context of this thread when we are discussing the quality and "cost" of producing these frames that people understand that their is a substantial difference between Taiwanese and Chinese manufacturing and environmental policy.

    and yes, "free Tibet" by all means.
    OVER THE LINE SMOKEY!

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by moshelove
    It is relevant in the context of this thread
    I don't see a picture of a BLT2 in your post, so I don't see how it's relevant.

  68. #68
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    and again...

    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    The FACT still stands, Robots are putting those precise pretty welds on the new LT's
    sorry for the further derailment, but dude, you really need to let go of this. robots aren't welding bikes. at least not this bike. i will go on record here, there are no robots - american, taiwanese, mexican, chinese, portugese, or even those dreaded german ones - involved in the welding of santa cruz bicycles.

    everyone else, sorry. as you were...
    hold my beer...

  69. #69
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    BlurLT2

    Is it true SDF is closed?? I heard there was no way to access the trails.

  70. #70
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    regarding where the frames are made...it doesnt matter. Reciprocity is our friend
    We can bomb the world to pieces, but we can't bomb it into peace -Michael Franti

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzboy
    Yes they do exist. Just took it out for a spin. My Nomad, BLT1 and Superlight are going up for for sale this weekend...need I say more?

    I think what he's really trying to say here is that 1) he's broke from buying the new bike; and 2) selling all of his other bikes to make up for it is certainly better than trying to sell his body on the street corner. It's OK. I get it

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by cnichollsca
    Is it true SDF is closed?? I heard there was no way to access the trails.
    lol, well, the bridge is closed, but you ride into the trails from highland. kinda random posting in the lt2 forum...

  73. #73
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    Here's a shot of Mark Weir's new orange LT2 taken down at Gooseberry Mesa a couple of months ago. This was at the Yeti/Fox camp testing out the '09 suspension

    (Let me try and fix these broken image links....)



    Mark and my friend Kevin. He rides Yeti but can kill it none-the-less.



    I have a better close up of Mark's bike. I'll see if I can find it and post it later.
    Last edited by slcrockymountainrider; 05-13-2008 at 02:21 PM.

  74. #74
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    Here we go....some angle shots and the paparazzi. Sorry these are a bit smaller as they're from my flickr page.
    That's a new Fox 36 with XTR and an MRP guide. Gravity Dropper, Hayes, and Easton Monkey Lite DH bar....
    and everything else is WTB...obviously.
    Weighs a svelte 14lbs on Mars
    .




  75. #75
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    So I guess they really exist? I was starting to lose hope for this thread.

    Speaking of which, I got to test ride the new one today. It was the sickness. Pretty much the same build as the orange one above. 36 Talas and all. Unfortunately I was limited to side walks and streets close to the LBS. I need to get that thing on a trail, however I have not yet pulled the trigger...

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpy_Steve
    lol, well, the bridge is closed, but you ride into the trails from highland. kinda random posting in the lt2 forum...
    'Random posting' is an extremely polite way to put it:/

  77. #77
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    How do these new LT2's compare to a giant Reign? I imagine they are probably a pound lighter at the frame. Same travel, probably pedaling feels a bit stiffer with the VPP versus maestro. They look like a very dialed frame.
    OVER THE LINE SMOKEY!

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by A MAN CALLED HORSE
    Frames, built bikes, weights, opinions, lets have it!
    I'm told my BLT2 is at customs waiting clearance, which means that it's touch and go if I'll get it to build up this weekend.

    I've collected several PINK highlights which will go on this build....for better or for worse....

    Frame: BLT2 Medium White
    Shock: Fox RP23
    Fork: 09 Fox 32 Float RLC (qr dropouts)
    Headset: Pink Chris King
    Stem: Thomson X4 50mm Silver
    Bars: Reverse OS, 40mm rise PC White
    Grips: Brown ODI Crosstrainers w/Pink Lock Rings
    Brakes: Hope Mono Mini's in the LE Pink.
    Cables/Hoses: White Goodridge & White Jagwire Outers
    Saddle: Charge Spoon in Tan (may change it to same but White)
    Seatpost:Silver Thomson Masterpiece
    Seatpost Clamp: Pink Danger Boy
    Bottom Bracket: Pink Cupped SKF's
    Cranks: 770 XT's @ 170mm
    Pedals: White Wellgo Mag MG-1's
    Wheels: 08 Macic Crossrides in Silver
    Tyres: F-Maxxis 2.1 ADvantage Xcept R-Maxxis 2.0 Ranchero Xcept

    All built it should be around 28.5 to 29Lbs......I hope it's as good as my V5 Heckler and my 4X.................

  79. #79
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    Where find a blur LT2 size L

    Hi,
    Do you know where it is possible to find the New blur LT2 frame in size L ?
    Thanks

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gripo
    I'm told my BLT2 is at customs waiting clearance, which means that it's touch and go if I'll get it to build up this weekend.

    I've collected several PINK highlights which will go on this build....for better or for worse....

    Frame: BLT2 Medium White
    Shock: Fox RP23
    Fork: 09 Fox 32 Float RLC (qr dropouts)
    Headset: Pink Chris King
    Stem: Thomson X4 50mm Silver
    Bars: Reverse OS, 40mm rise PC White
    Grips: Brown ODI Crosstrainers w/Pink Lock Rings
    Brakes: Hope Mono Mini's in the LE Pink.
    Cables/Hoses: White Goodridge & White Jagwire Outers
    Saddle: Charge Spoon in Tan (may change it to same but White)
    Seatpost:Silver Thomson Masterpiece
    Seatpost Clamp: Pink Danger Boy
    Bottom Bracket: Pink Cupped SKF's
    Cranks: 770 XT's @ 170mm
    Pedals: White Wellgo Mag MG-1's
    Wheels: 08 Macic Crossrides in Silver
    Tyres: F-Maxxis 2.1 ADvantage Xcept R-Maxxis 2.0 Ranchero Xcept

    All built it should be around 28.5 to 29Lbs......I hope it's as good as my V5 Heckler and my 4X.................
    Where do you live?
    And how are you going to have the 09 talas by this weekend...prototype???

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    And how are you going to have the 09 talas by this weekend...prototype???
    Some 09 Fox was available straight after it's Sea Otter debut...............

  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gripo
    Some 09 Fox was available straight after it's Sea Otter debut...............
    Dammit. And I thought it won't be before july/august... Are the 15mmTA in too?

  83. #83
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    Show us some pics and weights! I might have missed that but I don't recall any propper info about it yet anywhere. I must've overslept.
    Where're you, mine LT2 is in Polish customs in the moment too, that's why I asked.

  84. #84
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    So, I've got two good rides on the bike and I am blown away. Feels bottomless. The rear feels so good, I almost feel like the Pike is the weak link. (Although I never felt this way on my other frame) I'm running the RP23 with NO propedal and it climbs great in and out of the saddle. It feels like the rear tracks so well it provides more traction than any frame I've ridden. Like the rear tire spend more time on the trail than bouncing off rocks and roots>insane traction and an ability to hold a line like no other. Also, with no propedal the small bump sensitivity is great and I feel like it aids when climbing rough sections. All in all, I was afraid I would not like this bike as much as my last bike (Ventana El Ciclon) but after only 2 rides the Ventana will not be missed. If I had to find a flaw, not the stiffest rear but plenty stiff, and I'm used to a Ventana. (Stiffest frame on the market). The BLT2 is way stiffer than my old 6.6. I'm looking forward to riding this bike for a long time. Santa Cruz has really got something with this bike. Weights 27.7 pounds as pictured. Still have a Masterpiece seatpost to add!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    KENDA

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    So, I've got two good rides on the bike and I am blown away. Feels bottomless. The rear feels so good, I almost feel like the Pike is the weak link. (Although I never felt this way on my other frame) I'm running the RP23 with NO propedal and it climbs great in and out of the saddle. It feels like the rear tracks so well it provides more traction than any frame I've ridden. Like the rear tire spend more time on the trail than bouncing off rocks and roots>insane traction and an ability to hold a line like no other. Also, with no propedal the small bump sensitivity is great and I feel like it aids when climbing rough sections. All in all, I was afraid I would not like this bike as much as my last bike (Ventana El Ciclon) but after only 2 rides the Ventana will not be missed. If I had to find a flaw, not the stiffest rear but plenty stiff, and I'm used to a Ventana. (Stiffest frame on the market). The BLT2 is way stiffer than my old 6.6. I'm looking forward to riding this bike for a long time. Santa Cruz has really got something with this bike. Weights 27.7 pounds as pictured. Still have a Masterpiece seatpost to add!
    Nice info - thanks!
    That's very light indeed. I presume mine will land just above 30lbs. What's that chainrings/bash you're running?
    Also, there's no way I would get away with that tire in the back - by far not enough grip for the conditions here.
    how much do you weigh? the rotor in the front lookes like not more than 160-170lbs
    The bike looks amazing! Mine will be here tomorrow but the headset will be on...monday

  86. #86
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    krolig- Thats a Gamut P30 chain guide that I had to modify to fit the BLT2. I had to remove the bottom part of the boomerang with the roller. The boomerang interfered with the lower link. However, I have not dropped a chain since the mod and it greatly reduced drag on the drivetrain and some weight!! The tires are a compromise between rolling resistance and traction. I always have the 2.35 Nevegals when things get wet. As long as it's dry, I feel the only thing I lose with the SB8 on the rear is some braking traction and it rolls for ever, so I feel it's worth it. Coming from a freeride background, I too feel weird running dual 160mm rotors. However, to be honest, my local trails are so flat even a 180mm up front is an overkill. By the way, I'm 185-190 all geared with pack. Let me know if you have any other questions.
    KENDA

  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    krolig- Thats a Gamut P30 chain guide that I had to modify to fit the BLT2. I had to remove the bottom part of the boomerang with the roller. The boomerang interfered with the lower link. However, I have not dropped a chain since the mod and it greatly reduced drag on the drivetrain and some weight!! The tires are a compromise between rolling resistance and traction. I always have the 2.35 Nevegals when things get wet. As long as it's dry, I feel the only thing I lose with the SB8 on the rear is some braking traction and it rolls for ever, so I feel it's worth it. Coming from a freeride background, I too feel weird running dual 160mm rotors. However, to be honest, my local trails are so flat even a 180mm up front is an overkill. By the way, I'm 185-190 all geared with pack. Let me know if you have any other questions.
    How would you compare the plushness of the LT2 to your Ciclon?
    Faster is not always better, but it's always more fun

  88. #88
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    ZORG- The LT2 wins hands down. It might have something to do with not needing the prepedal on the LT2 as opposed to the El Ciclon which required prepedal #1 for decent pedaling. I remember reading an early review claiming the LT2 had lost small bump sensitivity. I don't agree with that at all.
    KENDA

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    Great stuff, keep the pics and info coming.

    Looks like ano black is in front at the moment!
    You can't make a racehorse out of a donkey, but you can make a fast donkey.

  90. #90
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    Black in front

    But only till tomorrow when mine arrives:P

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    But only till tomorrow when mine arrives:P
    Can you get a frame and shock weight when you get yours tomorrow? Im waiting to see your XL in pics before I go to order one myself. Some of the XL frames look horrible, and im in a tussle about replacing my XL nomad with a 6.6 or BLT2.

  92. #92
    mtbr member
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    I like your cable routing.
    2018 Transition Patrol

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    That's a new Fox 36 with XTR and an MRP guide. Gravity Dropper, Hayes, and Easton Monkey Lite DH bar....
    and everything else is WTB...obviously.
    Any idea what headset/stem he was using? Hard to see in the pictures. I'm asking because I thought I read on a different thread that the SC test crew was running no-rise stem and headsets with low stack height with their 160mm forks, otherwise it was a bit too tall and slack?

    If anyone else is using (or planning to use) a 160 fork, comments appreciated.

  94. #94
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    I plan on running a 160 if I go to a LT. I drew up the geometry in CAD and found that a change of 1.4* was what I got out of a 515mm to 545mm A to C change. That put a LT at 67.6* compared to a Nomad with 67*, as well as the same WheelBase and a BB height of 13.9" vs the Nomads 14.2". This all calced on a XL frame for each model.

    So geometrically speaking I would have a Nomad with a slightly steeper headtube and a little bit lower bottom bracket. then you throw in the revised VPP and only 5" rear travel, as well as a little bit more stretched out cockpit, this is exactly what I am looking for. Hopefully I can see Kroliks pics soon, but moretha nlikely I am going to go order a Skidmark Anno XL Blur LT very soon.

  95. #95
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    PALME...is the shock a float R on your Frame?

    Looks like the shock is a Float R?? not a rp23? In the one LT2 R AM build kit it had rp23...curious if you chose Float R instead.

    Great looking frame btw.

  96. #96
    Bring on the Funk!
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    Back to bikes

    Since we are back to bikes....the new Blur LT is like a Nomad, a Giant Reign and a Blur tossed in a blender. sifted and only the best bits left. I simply have never ridden a bike that climbs this well (period) and descends as well as a Nomad and still feels as all mountain as a Reign. Santa Cruz knocked one out of the park with this one. It feels plush but does not need to sag as deep as a Nomad with a DHX air. It rides in between a Nomad and a Reign. The pic (sorry, only had my camera phone with me) is of my first ride up at Burnaby mountain. Will post again after a few rides. If you are thinkin' about it, just do it!!!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  97. #97
    Surly OG
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    that hose routing really knocks the cred down.... sorry dude. Shimano hose is cut-able and the bits to resize them are available from Shimano or a web dealer, very rube, rookie and hokey. A dis-service to the breed, just couldn't wait eh?

    http://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...?category=1606

    http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...And+Parts.aspx
    Earn your turns. )'(

  98. #98
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    My bike has Avids and are the right length??? What's wrong now Dan?

  99. #99
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    my bad, they are avids, that routing looks poorly done, $4000 bike and a wal mart hose routing.... but it's your bike... go for what you know.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  100. #100
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    clone bike of PamleJ1.....deja vu....
    Earn your turns. )'(

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