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  1. #1
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    Lets see those LT2s

    Frames, built bikes, weights, opinions, lets have it!
    You can't make a racehorse out of a donkey, but you can make a fast donkey.

  2. #2
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    Mine ain't due to arrive at the shop til mid May. Pictures will be coming for sure though.
    In an earlier thread, I did post an anodized skidmark from Sea Otter.

    Who has theirs and are riding it?

  3. #3
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    I'm in the same boat... Waiting on a white lg ordered all the way back in February. Maybe I should order a replacement now, cause when the first one finally arrives, I'll probably wear it out in a month I'm gonna ride so much!

  4. #4
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    Goog news!

    Ha, my distr was right that first order-first get!
    My XL skidmark will be here end of next week (laying in customs in the moment)

    My build will be as follows:
    08 Talas RC2
    RP 23 (nothing more mature offered)
    XT 11-34casette&cranks (22-32-44)
    XTR Shadow RD (med cage) &FD &shifters
    Rohloff chain
    Joplin R (finally arrived from warranty clamp exchange plus upgraded to Remote for free:P)
    WTB PureV
    Mango King HD +FunBolts + Mav819 +NobbyNic sankeskin2.25 (possibly 2.4 if fits) rear
    Mango King + Blunt650B+NeoMoto front
    Hope Mono M4 8"&7"
    Syntace Vector Carbon 31.8 27" bars (12deg rear sweep)
    Thomson X4 0deg 90mm
    Ergon GE1 grips
    Candy SL pedals

    Should be below 31lbs total

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    Joplin R (finally arrived from warranty clamp exchange plus upgraded to Remote for free:P)
    When you say finally, how long are you talking? I sent my peddles into Crank Bros for a warranty repair about 2 weeks ago, and I was told it would be a 2-3 day turn around on their end... I may have to find something else to use in the meantime.

  6. #6
    emtb.pl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogie Man
    When you say finally, how long are you talking? I sent my peddles into Crank Bros for a warranty repair about 2 weeks ago, and I was told it would be a 2-3 day turn around on their end... I may have to find something else to use in the meantime.
    Finally means it took 3.5 weeks Poland-USA-Poland, express shipping on both ends. Mind you we had a free long weekend here in Poland which delays the shipping 4days on my side.

  7. #7
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    My Lrg should be here by the end of the week

    Ano Skid mark Frame
    rp23 (soon to be Pushed)
    Pushed Float 32
    XTR cranks
    XTR shifters
    XTR re der
    Hayes Stroker Trails
    Stans Flow rims on Hugi 240's
    thompson Stem and post
    Truvativ Dh bar
    Michi Dry 2 in 2.3 front and rear.

    Wont know what it weighs until I weigh it.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by krolik
    Finally means it took 3.5 weeks Poland-USA-Poland, express shipping on both ends. Mind you we had a free long weekend here in Poland which delays the shipping 4days on my side.
    Thanks that makes me feel a little better. Hopefully, my peddles won't be much longer.

  9. #9
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    Waiting for my medium (sand powdercoat) Blur LT2. should be here next week. CAN'T WAIT!!!


    FORK Pike 454 dual air
    SHOCK Float RP23
    REAR DER SRAM X9 long cage
    FRONT DER Shimano M770A (XT)
    SHIFTERS SRAM X9 triggers
    CRANKSET TruVativ Stylo Team w/ Giga X Drive 22/32/44
    CASSETTE SRAM PG 980, 11-34
    BRAKES Avid Juicy 7's w/ 185mm rotors
    BRAKE LEVERS Avid Juicy 7's
    BARS Race Face Atlas low riser
    STEM Race Face Atlas AM
    GRIPS Lizard Skin lock on
    HEADSET Cane Creek S3
    SEAT POST Thomson
    SADDLE WTB Pure V Stealth
    WHEELS DT 5.1 rims laced to DT 340 hubs w/DT 14/15 spokes, alloy nipples.
    TIRES Kenda Nevegal 2.35 folding
    TUBES Kenda Freeride

  10. #10
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    Ok....you guys that are riding next wk on the BLT2, you have to confess...WHEN did you place the order?

    I placed at the start of March, and was told ETA of last part of June. After some following up, they pushed it up to Mid May.

    You guys got to have ordered Feburary?

  11. #11
    emtb.pl
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    Late Feb

    I placed my order last week of February. Up to last week I was assured the frame will be here late June as L & XL are produced in a second run.
    And yesterday - BANG, the distr says guys at SC did a great job and my frame is already here in Poland just laing in customs and should be at his shop on monday. Still I need to wait for the DHL so probably wednesday.

    I need a headset though and just placed my order - mango bits with the skidmark should look nice, plus I have them left from my LT:P Another nice thing is that Joplin post has all these bits in mango. And I mean mango, not close to mango. The ano is IDENTICAL on King mango and CrankBros Joplin

  12. #12
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    Here you go. Just got it today. Medium black ano. Should be built by tomorrow night. I will post some pics when its finished. Frame looks amazing.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    KENDA

  13. #13
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    My local bike store had two frames on order already when I walked in four weeks ago. Got one of them :-)

    The black frame looks sweet!

  14. #14
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    doesn't look like they are made in the USA like the nomads

  15. #15
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    nope-

    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Earn your turns. )'(

  16. #16
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    looks better than any made in the usa frame i've ever seen. whats wrong with spending the extra money on making things nicer rather than making them cheaper? Besides, your dollar from a few years ago is worth quite a bit less now, so if you consider value and not the "number" you have a different comparison. This is an interesting website to check out if you are so inclined: http://www.measuringworth.com

    Use the "relative values" of US$ from 2005 (the last US Blurs produced) and compare to 2007 (the latest data available), and you see the difference in prices. Since 1/1/08 until today its been a steady decline also, so that would even be a conservative value.

    Thanks to our friends in Washington and corporate whores everywhere!

  17. #17
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    yeah, SPC / ISO mfg methods with a reduced number of operators tending precision numeric controlled robots will make a nicer bead every time. I'm skeptical it costs more to make the frames in that manner even adjusting for "values". Off shore mfg's surely DO NOT have the ENVIRONMENTAL / Hazardous materials Considerations we have here in the US either. So they look prettier, cost more and are more detrimental to the planet..... nice trade off....

    I'm kind of partial to feeding an American family. But that's just me.

    Have you scrutinized a Moots, or Merlin, or Yeti or Ventana frame.... all hand welded and mighty fine work. Paul Sadoff, Rick Hunter, John Caletti these guys are artists with a Tig torch. If a machine welded frame looks better than any Made in USA frame you've ever seen, I think you may need to look more closely at more US made frames.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  18. #18
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    it sucks big time that so many frames are made out of states or N America. hope that one day we will have back in here all the production. corp sucks. let the wheels rollin'.
    cheers sc owners.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Have you scrutinized a Moots, or Merlin, or Yeti or Ventana frame.... all hand welded and mighty fine work. Paul Sadoff, Rick Hunter, John Caletti these guys are artists with a Tig torch. If a machine welded frame looks better than any Made in USA frame you've ever seen, I think you may need to look more closely at more US made frames.
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.

    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.

    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.

    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.

    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.
    Last edited by syadasti; 05-08-2008 at 04:56 AM.

  20. #20
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    hey those are new frame graphics - where is the 'swoosh' over the lettering and on the seat stay - does this mean all frames are getting the new look?

  21. #21
    emtb.pl
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    Quote Originally Posted by munkyboy
    hey those are new frame graphics - where is the 'swoosh' over the lettering and on the seat stay - does this mean all frames are getting the new look?
    yep I've noticed that too.
    shame as I liked it - it looked somewhat retro.

  22. #22
    HIKE!
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    Taiwan

    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Yeah, you'd think with attention to detail, better accuracy and precision, superior fabrication all around, better finish and assembly, the superior Taiwanese frames would cost alot more than the USA made.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    Made in Taiwan for a Made in USA price.
    Or maybe the $1750 price of a powdercoated frame would be over 2k like an Intense 5.5.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.

    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.

    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.

    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.

    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.


    Amen to that! The latest Taiwan frames have become increasingly higher in quality, and not just from Santa Cruz.
    "To crush your enemies, see them driven before, and to hear the lamentation of the women."

  25. #25
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    What about the Environmental issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Yeti makes frames in Taiwan too.
    Their high volume models are Taiwan made. - AS-X , DJ, and 575 and their prices reflect that fact, being $100's cheaper than they would be if US made.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Numerous US frame builders use materials and parts from overseas in their US made framesets.
    I don't care, I have my preference for US made frames for personal reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Taiwan has world class bike manufacturers, so that argument isn't solid. They build it to the spec requested by the brand and can do anything they want in terms of quality and features.
    Never said they didn't, on the contrary, SPC derived mass production mfg that has been adopted by Asian markets was the brain child of an American who was snubbed by US big business. BUT 1 operator tending 4-10 robots isn't a craftsman, he's an operator/engineer.

    OTOH - Taiwan doesn't have the environmental standards in place, I wouldn't be surprised that they dump toxic mfg by products directly into the environment. And expose their operators to all the toxic fumes from tig welding to boot.

    What can you say about the continual damage being done by them to our already injured planet?

    What kind of carbon footprint does a Taiwan made frame have compared to a US made one? Factory, Truck, Ship, Truck, Truck,shop? compared to factory, truck, truck,shop.
    and that's not considering the Carbon footprint of getting the production materials to the factories, and unregulated environmental concerns.

    so maybe that's why they cost more; in order to get my made in Taiwan bike, I gotta pay compensation to put more hurt on the environment.

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    You have a very poor understanding of modern economics if you are spouting that typical made in the USA story.
    What story is that? I want to buy local American to feed a local American family?

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    Look on the "bright" side though. Since this country has been run horribly over the last 8 years our dollar is weak enough for both domestic and foreign companies to bring more production back our way.
    That "bright" side might be a Nuclear flash

    I'm learning Mandarin and Cantonese in preparation, and digging a bomb shelter.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikerDan
    OTOH - Taiwan doesn't have the environmental standards in place, I wouldn't be surprised that they dump toxic mfg by products directly into the environment. And expose their operators to all the toxic fumes from tig welding to boot.

    What can you say about the continual damage being done by them to our already injured planet?

    What kind of carbon footprint does a Taiwan made frame have compared to a US made one? Factory, Truck, Ship, Truck, Truck,shop? compared to factory, truck, truck,shop.
    and that's not considering the Carbon footprint of getting the production materials to the factories, and unregulated environmental concerns.

    so maybe that's why they cost more; in order to get my made in Taiwan bike, I gotta pay compensation to put more hurt on the environment.
    The bike manufacturers have a small footprint overall compared to the mining and processing companies that make the materials that go in to the bike. That is were made in the US won't really mean much as most of the materials are from overseas - that is were it matters but good luck finding that out from any bike maker. Mining and processing operations are horrible for the environment even in the US. Overall making a bike or bike parts is bad for the environment regardless of what country you are in.

    China is making progress on the environmental front but are obviously way behind, I don't deny that.

  27. #27
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    uh, robots are used to weld bikes. Not in the US, not in Taiwan, not in China. When "operators" can be used to replace "skilled labor" its called "increasing productivity". Increasing productivity is typically what high labor cost economies do (think United States and Europe). Do you think there are "operators" controlling robots that sand your carbon frames smooth in China? Why do you think they are made in China? Because they have lots robots that work for $2 an hour? (in a robot voice now) - "I am a robot, I welded your bike, you should go ride it and stop spewing your nationalistic nonsense".

    Here's a good one: If an Asian robot welds your frame in California, operated by an undocumented Mexican, is it US made?
    Oh, and when Rick, Paul or Moots makes a competitive aluminum full suspension frame for $1800 retail, I'll buy one. You don't gotsta be white or in 'murica to be an "artist with a tig torch".

  28. #28
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    Also the carbon footprint of an average American family is exponentially bigger than that of a average Chinese family. Even taking into account the population differential it would still be in their favor as far as smaller footprint. The US has 5% of the world's population but uses almost 30% of the world's energy - we are the dirty pigs.

    Talking about pigs...some of the worst polluters in the US:

    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...orst_polluters

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    Here you go. Just got it today. Medium black ano. Should be built by tomorrow night. I will post some pics when its finished. Frame looks amazing.
    Back to the topic at hand, as I'm sick of every thread about a new frame turning into an argument about where it's made... The BLT2 frame does look amazing. Thanks for the pics.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boogie Man
    Back to the topic at hand, as I'm sick of every thread about a new frame turning into an argument about where it's made... The BLT2 frame does look amazing. Thanks for the pics.
    Totaly agreed here!
    I'd much prefer a little chat about the frame and its behaviour over the never ending argument about manufacturing.

  31. #31
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    On a happy note, I just left my LBS and dropped off my bike to swap over all my parts(plus some new ones) to my new BLT2. Looks wicked nice in person. I will post some pics when she is done.

  32. #32
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    Krolik- I Think The Swoosh Is For The Powdercoat Frames. My Ano Frame, And All The Other Ano's I Have Seen Have Not Had The Swoosh. However, I Could Be Wrong.
    KENDA

  33. #33
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    Also, This Tread Is Supposed To Be About People Excited Over Their New Blt2. Not *****ing About Manufacturing Processes And Factory Locations. Some Of You Are Ridiculous.
    KENDA

  34. #34
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    I might understand swoosh wrong

    This is what I thought about - the line going across the letters - this is my ano orange - she's gone next week:P

    blt_left.JPG

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by PALMEJ1
    Also, This Tread Is Supposed To Be About People Excited Over Their New Blt2. Not *****ing About Manufacturing Processes And Factory Locations. Some Of You Are Ridiculous.
    I was just thinking the same thing. Very nice frame you got there regardless of where it was made.

  36. #36
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    Yeah, nice frames. Very Pretty, Great handling and let's ride now.... forget what happens to future generations.

    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...asianhaze.html

    done pissing..... going riding.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by eleven-yo
    looks better than any made in the usa frame i've ever seen. whats wrong with spending the extra money on making things nicer rather than making them cheaper? Besides, your dollar from a few years ago is worth quite a bit less now, so if you consider value and not the "number" you have a different comparison. This is an interesting website to check out if you are so inclined: http://www.measuringworth.com

    Use the "relative values" of US$ from 2005 (the last US Blurs produced) and compare to 2007 (the latest data available), and you see the difference in prices. Since 1/1/08 until today its been a steady decline also, so that would even be a conservative value.

    Thanks to our friends in Washington and corporate whores everywhere!

    I've got a 07 blur that says mde in the USA

  38. #38
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    taiwan not china

    Quote Originally Posted by syadasti
    The bike manufacturers have a small footprint overall compared to the mining and processing companies that make the materials that go in to the bike. That is were made in the US won't really mean much as most of the materials are from overseas - that is were it matters but good luck finding that out from any bike maker. Mining and processing operations are horrible for the environment even in the US. Overall making a bike or bike parts is bad for the environment regardless of what country you are in.

    China is making progress on the environmental front but are obviously way behind, I don't deny that.
    Be carefull Taiwan is not exactly China in termes of social and environmental standards the difference is important

  39. #39
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    According to China,and its billion man army...it is....

    Quote Originally Posted by raki
    Be carefull Taiwan is not exactly China in termes of social and environmental standards the difference is important
    I think China has something to say contrary to that..... and if they wanted to push it, the world essentially would be powerless to stop it. unless we want to use Nukes...

    Economic sanctions wouldn't quite work since they MAKE OUR goods. We are at their mercy.

    If they decided to withhold trade, our nation would be in DEEP DOO DOO.

    but screw it all - let's just consume and ride our bikes. Pie in the sky and rosy colored glasses. It's all good.

    God Loves me at least.
    Earn your turns. )'(

  40. #40
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    We haven't built ours completely up yet, but I've sat on it and to me it felt pretty good. Obviously feels a little more like the Nomad, and i would be more inclined to take it off some small drops than the LT1. In my opinion, its kinda of a hybrid between the Nomad and the LT1, but not an equal distribution. Its more like 70% LT1 and 30% Nomad if you get my drift. It should make a great all around bike and should be pretty comparable to a Mojo. If I had to pick though, I would pick the Mojo because its comparable in price and I really like what Ibis is trying to do right now.

  41. #41
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    Man - you guys are crazy. I've been to Hodaka, Giant, most of the Kinesis factories, Fairly, Strong (vietnam) a BUNCH of small builders... heck I've been to most of the factories over there. It's always a PERSON welding and building the bike. Yes, I've even met the people doing it and they are incredible people. I haven't ever seen a robot welder although maybe they are there now because it's been a while. What is the problem? If we can't do it in the USA for a reasonable price, we lose the business to others that can. And we lose it to people that appreciate the business. Would I prefer a USA frame - yes. Are the people that make it over there bad - no. JEEZE.

  42. #42
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    Ironically, in the U.S. we think of reducing costs and making things more efficient as good business practices. If we can't step up to the plate and compete with they way the Taiwanese and Chinese are building frames, then we need to change our process of building bikes. One thing I can't understand though: why someone thinks "U.S. Made" is better in every facet. Obviously the Japanese are typically better at making cars (Toyota/Honda) and computers than the U.S. is. Would you buy a computer just because it was made in the U.S.? No. In fact, I wouldn't even say that Taiwanese welders make frames equivalent of that of U.S. welders, I would say they are better. The Taiwanese welder probably has more experience and takes more pride in his work than the American. (This is not a generalization of all welders; I am positive there are some very amazing welders in the U.S. I am just stating my overall opinion.)

  43. #43
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    2 pages and only a couple of pics of actual BLT2's.

    If you want to argue about the economics of frame building, I think there's a forum for that here: http://forums.mtbr.com/forum.php#political-socio-economic-religion

  44. #44
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:H...07_report_.gif

    x-axis: degree of advancement in material life.
    y-axis: amount of pollution produced to achieve the material life.

    There are 4 pink triangles representing East Asian countries in this graph. I believe they are Japan, South Korea, China, & North Korea.

    I've been to Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan, both their urban & rural parts I'm fairly certain wealth & the industry of Taiwan are more or less comparable to South Korea in this graph.

    Link to the original article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecological_footprint)

    A lot has to do with how people in East Asia just don't own and drive cars & SUVs as much as Americans. Much of environmental damages (famous violations kids would learn in schools) & the installment of regulations & the enforcement are old news: Japan in 70s, So. Korea & Taiwan in 80s.
    Last edited by Astroboy; 05-08-2008 at 10:42 PM.

  45. #45
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    Can a moderator split this thread into two - blur lt2 stuff and tiawan vs USA production?

    Thanks.

  46. #46
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    + 1 to this idea.

  47. #47
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    sounds like a great idea, stop whining!

    Get some pictures up and how is the BLT2?? Anyone been out in the dirt yet? It will probably be another week until I see mine :-(

  48. #48
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    I think that when there are more of them out, we'll start getting more pics. Until then - we gotta talk about something.

  49. #49
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    I'd much prefer little argument about future builds
    or how is it possible that SC doesn't offer any more aggressive shocks to this frame
    or why they just made one step forward and offered one piece outer cable in the rear but not the next step and the front cabling part still has to suffer mud
    or how the new two piece rear dropout is better then the previous replacable one
    or heck, even what colour combos are you going to run
    dammit, even another argument about non-existent bottle mounts would be better than this never-ever-ending argument about manufacturing.
    it's all been said already everywhere and if someone doesn't understand why protecting environment is important, than there is no way you're going to make him understand it here. and if someone doesn't get it why frames are being build on taiwan and not in us, there is nothing anyone can do to help him.

    please, guys that already have their LT2's - post some more pics! I know you're prolly not going to go home for another month cause you're licking your frame somewhere alone but please, share some more!

    Mine is confirmed to be here on wednesday:]

  50. #50
    Paper or plastic?
    Reputation: zorg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    8,715
    How about some feedback on how they ride? That'd be interesting.
    Faster is not always better, but it's always more fun

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