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Thread: Vaya Problem

  1. #1
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    Vaya Problem

    I am having trouble with my 60cm Vaya complete, bought yesterday as an all around road bike.

    Twice now my tire has burst off the rim less than one mile into the ride, the tube exploding in the process, making a loud explosion sound. Both times I was going straight. Back wheel both times.

    • The rims are the stock rims that come with the complete build.
    • The tires are Specialized Nimbus Armadillo 700c x 38. They are rated 75 - 100 psi; in both explosions they've been inflated to 80 psi.
    • The first tube was the stock tube that comes with Vaya; the second tube was a specialized 700c x 28/38.


    I've searched on forums and found no similar problems. Has anyone else experienced this problem? Am I missing something obvious (which is entirely possible)?

    Any help would be appreciated.




  2. #2
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    Hard to say for sure. When mounting the tire check that the bead is seated properly on the rim and that the tube is not pinched between the tire and the rim. Inflate to 20PSI, check the bead seat, then to 40...etc. I know this is all basic stuff, but sometimes it is best to start with the basics. Maybe check that the rim strip has not slipped exposing a spoke hole.

    Out of curiosity, why the tire change? The stock Contis are great on dirt and pave; and long lasting too.

    Good luck, hope you get this sorted out so you can start enjoying the bike!

  3. #3
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    I kinda of laughed when I read this. I had a similar problem when I first bought my fargo. I commuted to work one day and after I arrived, I was walking away from my bike and all of a sudden the tire blew off of the rim. It happened three times all together. The problem was the result of a defective tire, or the actual bead of the tire, where it seated against the rim. Look closely at the edge of the tire where it meets the rim and look for any abnormalities. I would also take into consideration all of the things the previous post has said. Good Luck, the vaya is a great bike and once your tire issue is sorted out, you will love it!

  4. #4
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    Your picture gives it away.

    Near the valve the tube has a thick area, and when you mount the tire onto the rim in that spot you need to push the tube up into the tire to make sure the bead is set all the way down, otherwise this thick area will fill the space the tire needs to be. Next time once you get the tire mounted all the way around on both sides, push the valve into the rim as far as it will go, you should feel the tube push past the tire, then pull it back down and inflate.

    Not really a Vaya problem, just a common tire installation error for the mechanic.

    Have fun on your new ride, i am envious.

  5. #5
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    I also wait till I have the tire properly inflated to put the nut on the valve stem. This helps to make sure the tube is in the proper position that Midas describes.

  6. #6
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    go tubeless

    get a pair stan's rims strip and a set of continental tour rides(700 x 42) and about 6oz of slime in each wheel and your good to go. I've use this set up for about 3k miles since i got the 2011 vaya back in march.

  7. #7
    rth009
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    Quote Originally Posted by rothog View Post
    get a pair stan's rims strip and a set of continental tour rides(700 x 42) and about 6oz of slime in each wheel and your good to go. I've use this set up for about 3k miles since i got the 2011 vaya back in march.
    I was considering setting up my Tour Ride 42s tubeless on my X470's (from the complete Vaya), but i was wondering if it would be worth it since Ive heard you can only run 40 psi on tubeless systems and I liked having more pressure for road/bike path riding? Do the tour rides roll well at 40 psi? What psi are you running?

    Also, is there a particular size Stan's rim strip that you use for the dt swiss x 470, or are they all the same.

    Am I correct that I woudlnt need anything but the rim strip and the sealant to set up tubeless with x470 and Tour Ride 42s? Ive done it with Stan's rims, but have never "converted" to tubeless.

    Thanks for any advice.

  8. #8
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    ... and if we just ... Tubeless conti tour ride

    The conti tour rides are solid tire, they're a little slow on pavement given they're about 7mm thick on the tread but will not blow out like the 25mm road tires at stupid high pressure. On gravel they're smooth and some what supple. The slime alone seems to be suffice. I've got several holes but the slime sealed them up nicely. Be generous with the slime about 6oz will do, it won't dry up like stan's. I run them around 50psi.

  9. #9
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    Thanks everyone for your thoughts and suggestions.

    Following your advice, and filling the tire to 60 instead of 80 psi, I had a lovely 20 mile ride this evening without incident. A new hypothesis is that my floor pump is under-reading tire pressure thus causing over-inflation. I'm going to check on that.

    The bike rides beautifully. It's solid, stable, fast and comfortable--just what I was looking for in an all around road rig. The 60cm frame fits me perfectly, and the high head tube makes for a very comfortable riding position. I couldn't be happier.

    @tws21975: I went with slicks because this bike won't see dirt. It's for long days and evenings in the saddle. The conti tread and thickness looked as if it'd be a bit slow for those purposes. The 38 slicks are still sluggish compared to 25s, but they roll fast and smooth things out nicely, which is ideal for my casual purposes.

    Thanks again, everyone. I appreciate it.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by tws21975 View Post

    Out of curiosity, why the tire change? The stock Contis are great on dirt and pave; and long lasting too.
    because the stock Conti's weight almost 2 pounds EACH... I'm sure they are durable, but I put a set of Ritchey SpeedMax on my Vaya that are almost half the weight and WOW... bike accelerates and climbs MUCH easier...
    Like is too short to grow up, go ride a bicycle!

  11. #11
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    DT Swiss lists a max pressure rating of 58psi, (4 bar,) on those rims. (Right on the rim label sticker.)

    I would stay at that or less. If you are looking to run tires in the 80-100psi range a different rim would be safer and more ideal.
    I sell bikes here. Check out the Blog here. Facebook.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by fourflys View Post
    because the stock Conti's weight almost 2 pounds EACH... I'm sure they are durable, but I put a set of Ritchey SpeedMax on my Vaya that are almost half the weight and WOW... bike accelerates and climbs MUCH easier...
    To each their own, I honestly don't find the Contis to hold me back on climbs or acceleration and I love the stability the extra width provides on gravel descents and turns. The OP says he rides pavement only, so I understand his reasoning behind the change.

  13. #13
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    I see that 4 bar max now. Wow. Before knowing that I was running the tour ride 42s at 65 psi and some wtb all terrain 32s at 80 psi in the x470s. I'll cut it off at 60 from now on.

    I too think I felt a noticeable difference in acceleration with the 32s but the 42s are way better on gravel or sandy trails.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rth009 View Post
    I too think I felt a noticeable difference in acceleration with the 32s but the 42s are way better on gravel or sandy trails.

    that's why I went with the SpeedMax... they seem to do reasonably well on pavement and great on the trail... as far as pressure, I've run 70# in my rear on the same rims you have (I have a stock '11 Vaya as well) and never had a problem with the Conti's or the Ritchey's... I do want to try the Specialized Borough tires or the new Schwalbe as both sound nice and are pretty light for a big tire...
    Like is too short to grow up, go ride a bicycle!

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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre meux View Post
    Thanks.... A new hypothesis is that my floor pump is under-reading tire pressure thus causing over-inflation. I'm going to check on that..
    I had a similar experience. A riding buddy complained of bulging/wobbly tires. Also had some flats. He replaced the tubes/tires with some fancy rubber, had same problem. He complained to me about it on this second set, and I simply pinched the tire and said "wow that's awful hard for 80 lbs". I grabbed my gauge and read 120. Turns out his cheap floor pump had a gauge that indicated 80 at an actual 120-130. He had been greatly over-inflating the tires for several weeks since he got the floor pump.

    I recommend buying a few pressure gauges to supplement the one built into your pump. None of them are super accurate, but with 2-3 you can get a better idea.

  16. #16
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    "DT Swiss lists a max pressure rating of 58psi, (4 bar,) on those rims. (Right on the rim label sticker.)"

    Whoa. Wait a second. Does this mean that one is not to run tire pressures above 58 psi on the stock rims that come on Vaya???

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre meux View Post
    "DT Swiss lists a max pressure rating of 58psi, (4 bar,) on those rims. (Right on the rim label sticker.)"

    Whoa. Wait a second. Does this mean that one is not to run tire pressures above 58 psi on the stock rims that come on Vaya???
    That's what it sounds like, keep in mind that they are 29r disc brake MTB rims. FWIW, I run 70, sometimes 75 in the stock contis without issue. I think the stock tires are only supposed to have 60 max. I put a little extra air in the when I know I'll be on pavement only, which is very rare; too many good, almost car-free dirt roads around here to waste a ride on pavement alone! Keep in mind that the Vaya is designed to be ridden on "any surface that is considered a road." I think the stock component spec and the low(er) PSI ratings on the tires and rims fit well within that ideal. Out of curiosity, what tires were stock on your bike, the Tour Rides or the Cyclocross tires? The website specs for 2011 call for cyclocross tires but all the bikes that I've seen have had the Tour Rides.

    You said a few posts back that 60psi is working out well; is that still the case? Maybe try Schwalbe tires next time, I hear they offer lower PSI low-rolling resistance tires, or maybe a different set of contis. I've been super happy with conti tires on our cars and bikes!

    I couldn't agree with you more on the fit and ride of the bike; the 60 fits me like a glove and is super comfy on long rides. I liked it so much, I replaced my MTB with a Fargo!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre meux View Post
    "DT Swiss lists a max pressure rating of 58psi, (4 bar,) on those rims. (Right on the rim label sticker.)"

    Whoa. Wait a second. Does this mean that one is not to run tire pressures above 58 psi on the stock rims that come on Vaya???
    I've had no issues running as much as 75 in my SpeedMax tires... I think the OP has a bad bead on his tire...
    Like is too short to grow up, go ride a bicycle!

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by fourflys View Post
    I've had no issues running as much as 75 in my SpeedMax tires... I think the OP has a bad bead on his tire...
    I am sure his tire is fine, it was setup error as explained above, easy to tell by the location. You notice these little details after changing 20 flats everyday for a decade.

    Most rim companies list a max rating, on Mavic's road rims they list PSI for each tire size, as the size of the tire affects how the pressure is exerted upon the rim, either into the bead or casing and how much the tire rolls. For instance....
    19mm 146psi
    23mm 138psi
    25mm 131psi
    28mm 117psi
    32mm 103psi

    So we would have to assume for a 29er rim they were going with the max PSI for a 2.4 tire or something along those lines since there was only one listed. Something smaller like a tour ride would seat up and hold at higher then stated psi.
    Also, manufacturers play well on the safe side of limits, parts can usually go quite a bit beyond stated limits under most conditions, but manufacturers have to account for the entire scope of use and users.

    All this to say, take note of the max psi, but don't lose sleep over it.

    Love, Chad.

  20. #20
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    I've been running Conti 32's @85psi with no issues on the stock rims. I would use the max rating on the tire as a guide.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hand/of/Midas View Post
    I am sure his tire is fine, it was setup error as explained above, easy to tell by the location. You notice these little details after changing 20 flats everyday for a decade.

    Love, Chad.
    So you've been changing tires since you were like, what? 2 years old?

  22. #22
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    User error. There was tube sticking out under the tire bead. Have to push up on the vavle to get that thick spot up into the tire. You can inflate any tire/rim combo a ways past max pressure and it won't burst. Manufacturers aren't going to have you riding around on a tire on the verge of exploding. You can pump those babies up way higher than what the label says. Not that I would ride around past max. But I've seated dozens of tires that had to go past max to get the bead to pop.

  23. #23
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    No, Atom, you are wrong: The tube was not sticking out from under the tire bead in either of the two explosions. The tire beads are fine as is the pump gauge--neither are defective. The rim pops the bead at around 80 psi with those particular tires.

    I have to say that I'm surprised that Salsa would couple this frame with these rims, rated to 58 psi, and then also couple it with a stock tire rated to 65 psi. In my opinion, stock wheels on an "all road" bike should be equipped to handle higher tire pressures, at least 80.

    I love the Vaya; but I think Salsa made a bad choice in their rim selection for the complete build on this frame. Given the Fargo is their mountain tourer, they should have stocked Vaya with a more road-friendly wheel set. I know others will surely disagree, especially those who seek more versatility from the Vaya than I, but that's my opinion.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre meux View Post
    I am having trouble with my 60cm Vaya complete, bought yesterday as an all around road bike.

    Twice now my tire has burst off the rim less than one mile into the ride, the tube exploding in the process, making a loud explosion sound. Both times I was going straight. Back wheel both times.

    • The rims are the stock rims that come with the complete build.
    • The tires are Specialized Nimbus Armadillo 700c x 38. They are rated 75 - 100 psi; in both explosions they've been inflated to 80 psi.
    • The first tube was the stock tube that comes with Vaya; the second tube was a specialized 700c x 28/38.


    I've searched on forums and found no similar problems. Has anyone else experienced this problem? Am I missing something obvious (which is entirely possible)?

    Any help would be appreciated.





    Ditto... My 2013 with DT Swiss X470 rims and Clement MSO tires. I switched to Continental Touring Plus Reflex 32mm, I have not had a problem since, even with 80 psi.

    I heard that the Rim was the issue, it has a Max Pressure of 4 bar(58 psi). My opinion is that its a combination of high volume tires and low pressure rims. I will keep running the Conti's, but will limit the pressure to 70 psi, I think I'll be OK.

  25. #25
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    Holy necrothread...

    My Vaya has the X470 rims. Says max pressure 4 bar right on the rim. If I put more than 65psi in, the bead slips and the tube explodes. Same happened to a friend with the same rims. 40mm Clements for both of us.

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