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  1. #1
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    Unhappy with my Vaya

    I'm just not feeling it. I've had it for 6 months or so now. I use it to ride to work and back (40 miles round trip) about 2 or 3 times a week plus around town on the easy singletrack trails.

    It just doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't feel right on the road and doesn't feel right on the dirt (though it feels much better on a dirt road, but that's not ridden too often). I was so stoked to get one but after putting it through a good amount of miles/saddle time, I'm not sure it's the bike for me. Thinking of switching to a Fargo (if I can sell my Vaya and not be out any money).

    Anyway, I have a Salsa El Mar that I'm in love with. I want to be in love with another bike, just not sure which. I need something to ride the road to work on, preferably with drop bars.

    Just thinking out loud here I guess.

  2. #2
    Kaishingo
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    It happens. There have been plenty of bikes that I purchased in the past that disappeared after a year. I just built up a Casseroll after half a year of planning, and the jury's still out on whether its the love of my life. Leaning towards it - but like women, the only way you know for certain is when you stop thinking about all the other possibilities. And believe me, I've had bikes which have done that for me, and which I still regret getting rid of.

    One question - if the Vaya doesn't feel right on the road, what makes you think the Fargo will be much better?

  3. #3
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    The El Mar and Fargo are *almost* the same bike with different bars and shifters. I have both... Not sure it would be money well spent.

    I'd spend more time with your Vaya, and maybe mod it a bit. You'll likely not get your investment back out of it.

    Have fun, regardless.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherpaxc View Post
    I'm just not feeling it. I've had it for 6 months or so now. I use it to ride to work and back (40 miles round trip) about 2 or 3 times a week plus around town on the easy singletrack trails.

    It just doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't feel right on the road and doesn't feel right on the dirt (though it feels much better on a dirt road, but that's not ridden too often). I was so stoked to get one but after putting it through a good amount of miles/saddle time, I'm not sure it's the bike for me. Thinking of switching to a Fargo (if I can sell my Vaya and not be out any money).

    Anyway, I have a Salsa El Mar that I'm in love with. I want to be in love with another bike, just not sure which. I need something to ride the road to work on, preferably with drop bars.

    Just thinking out loud here I guess.
    What doesn't feel right about it? Maybe there's some suggestions we can offer to give you and the Vaya a little relationship counseling?

  5. #5
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    I can't see a Fargo feeling better, especially with an El Mar in the stable. Unless you want a more road friendly mixed terrain bike, which the Fargo certainly is. And its capable in the woods too, once you dial it in.

    I have eyes on an El Mar, as I weighed that and the Fargo heavily when I bought. For gravel and dirt road and mild single track the Fargo is where its at for me. But man do I miss my Cross Check (fixed gear or SS, setup for gravel / dirt) which I sold to get a Soma Juice - I really do miss that bike too. That was setup FG / SS with a Salsa disc fork, but I sold that to get the Fargo. I really miss having a SS in the stable. And how quiet a SS is in the woods. But I'd miss the drops on the Fargo for my mixed terrain / gravel / dirt / pavement rides to and from trails and for exploring / bike packing.

    For me, the Vaya wasn't an option as it overlapped with my Indy Fab Club Racer too much. I can run 35s or 42s on there if I want. No discs, but still capable dirt / gravel bike.

    So many bikes, so little time.

  6. #6
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    Maybe your issue with the Vaya isn't the bike, but the destination. How excited could someone be riding to work?

    All kidding aside, maybe the bike needs a little more speed. Maybe a carbon fork and/or new wheels and tires. If you can get make it quicker and easier to ride you may like it a bit more.

  7. #7
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    Well how about a Ti El-Mar? Now that's money well spent! Maybe get a set of disc hub roadie or cyclocross wheels and some narrower smoother tyres for those occasions when you want to forsake the dirt, become a complete prostitute (dressed in brightly colored lycra) and ride on the road!

  8. #8
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    I sold mine and bought a ti Fargo. I am much happier with the fargo. Then again the fargo is also my first 29er. The ti fargo is also three pounds lighter which is a bonus.

  9. #9
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    I have a custom King/Stans Crest wheelset on there. The weight is a non-issue to me really. I actually threw that wheelset on my El Mar to do my small one hour road loop (have the 2.4 Ardents on my El Mar and didn't want to run those!) and it felt great. I use a riser bar/Cane Creek bar end combo and really like the wide leverage for climbing in Austin's hills.

    Things I'm not to keen on with the Vaya...
    I've pinched a nerve in my hands on several different occassions on this bike. I'm using a Salsa Bell lap bar with a Thompson 100x10 rise stem on a medium frame. I do not like this combo at all. I actually feel too stretched out on the road and the hoods don't feel right in my hands at all.

    I don't really ride the road very much at all anymore except to work. I love my El Mar a ton. Enough that I sold one custom frame to get it, and I'm going to sell my second custom frame to either get another one (set up SS) or get a Fargo. I've owned a road bike since I started riding in 98. I'm not sure what life is like if I didn't own one!!!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmike View Post
    I can't see a Fargo feeling better, especially with an El Mar in the stable. Unless you want a more road friendly mixed terrain bike, which the Fargo certainly is. And its capable in the woods too, once you dial it in.

    .
    Yes, that's what I want. That's what I thought the Vaya was going to be. Maybe I misunderstood the marketing.

  11. #11
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    It happens, I built my vaya after it came out and never really got happy with it. It's definitely an in-between bike. Something about the geometry feels a bit cramped to me. Combine that with pretty high trail, it just feels wrong to me after about ten miles or so. Dozens of adjustments and it never worked so it found a new home. I've got a rawland that's felt great and every adjustment makes it better. I just like bikes with w longer tt because I've got a pretty long torso and longish arms for my height.

    I spend all day riding my kid around on a big dummy. When I'm on my own I want something zippier and the vaya is definitely a touring bike. I'm building up a cross check with a custom fork and disc tabs, which seems promising from my test rides.

  12. #12
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    The Vaya comes to life when it's got a load to carry. If you aren't riding road very much and you love your El Mar that much, I would just sell the Vaya and keep the cash! Maybe keep the wheelset as a spare for the El Mar. No reason to have 2 bikes if you don't have the use for the second one. For unloaded riding, you'd probably want more aggressive geometry from a 'cross or road bike (Casseroll, Surly Crosscheck / Pacer, etc).

    Mind you, disliking the handlebars and shifters isn't a reason to write off the whole bike, but if it feels too sluggish / uninspiring, that probably is.

  13. #13
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    Sounds like you have the WRONG SIZE. Or at the very least, a bad fit.

    The Vaya is not much of a "woods" bike IMO. It's a gravel grinder.

    I have Bell Laps on my Chili, and I'm not fond of them. As soon as I get some other expenses out of the way, I'm switching them out for Cowbells.

    Sounds like you just are looking for a different machine. Do it. Life is too short.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherpaxc View Post
    Yes, that's what I want. That's what I thought the Vaya was going to be. Maybe I misunderstood the marketing.
    vaya is a tweener. a 'rough stuff' touring bike, when rough is mainly gravel / dirt roads and tame single track. sort of wants to be a cross bike, but with the geo of a touring rig.

    fargo is more of a mountain bike. certainly has the room for big tires if you want to take on rougher trail.

    i've done back to back pave / dirt / trail centuries loaded on my fargo.
    while i certainly wasn't as fast as my road machine on the paved sections, or even the smooth dirt road sections, the bike held its own over the entire trip. i would have been faster overall on my IF, just would have struggled on the trail portions and the rougher dirt road segments. and probably been more beat up.


    IMAG3788 by mbeganyi, on Flickr

    what i wished for was that the bike felt more 'alive'... something a ti fargo might be able to do... but doubtful that i'll ever get my road rig feeling on an adventure bike. especially with gear on board.


    tricky rocky bits by mbeganyi, on Flickr

    and its a capable mountain bike. the engine and pilot certainly holding it back far more than the bike.

  15. #15
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    I may be just looking for a different bike. I've certainly owned my fair share of them. But put it this way, I've been only riding custom frames for around 7 years now and was always pretty happy with them, but in the back of my mind I always wanted to buy into the Salsa "brand" by getting an El Mar. When Salsa started moving more towards their "Adventure by Bike" slogan I was already fully ingrained in it. Funny thing...and I've told this story to all my riding buddies, but never have I felt so "at home" on my very first ride than I had with my El Mar. I'm talking being able to take it on the gnarliest and most technical trails we have and fully committing to them right off the bat. That's how well the El Mar and I got along. That's what I was hoping for with the Vaya. It didn't happen. So I want to at least see if the Fargo can do that for me.

    I do a lot of bikepacking (BMike, I've seen you plenty on bikepacking.net) and the El Mar is a great machine for that. But I also do plenty of "other" type of riding like short road tours, hauling the kid around, grocery getting on bike, and urban adventures. I could go with another El Mariachi, but it's fun to have more than want type of tool in the toolbox you know? I'm either going to rent one (Fargo) at a local shop and hopefully find someone in Austin that will let me spend a little bit of time on one. That way I know up front if it's the right bike for me. Otherwise, well...I'm not sure.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherpaxc View Post
    I have a custom King/Stans Crest wheelset on there.

    My love for my Vaya would get ridiculous if it had a King/Crest wheelset

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherpaxc View Post

    Things I'm not to keen on with the Vaya...
    I've pinched a nerve in my hands on several different occassions on this bike. I'm using a Salsa Bell lap bar with a Thompson 100x10 rise stem on a medium frame. I do not like this combo at all. I actually feel too stretched out on the road and the hoods don't feel right in my hands at all.
    I HAD a bell lap and thought it was an OK bar. I liked the flare. Then I upgraded to a Cowbell, and WOW.......fantastic bar. I recently bought another salsa and it came with a Bell Lap, and again it's just "meh." I'm going to keep using it because I think I may have finally gotten the bike dialed in and I don't want to spend any more $$.....but the second I get some extra cash I'm converting that bike to Cowbells as well. Great bars.

    The bike might not be the one for you, BUT if you are going to give it some extra time, I would start with bars and stem. Maybe have a local shop let you try some stems out to get a feel for different angles/lengths. I happen to have a few extra stems on the shelf so I try to give each set-up a few rides before I decide yay or nay.

  18. #18
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    Interesting that someone mentioned Rawland above. I recently picked up an rSogn, and it's slowly replacing my Fargo as my around town/kid puller/comfy road bike. Probably it will be my overnighter bike as well, although I haven't tested that yet. I really like the front loading capability, it's so much more convenient than a rear load, and I don't have to switch my load around when I'm pulling the trail-a-bike. Also, the smaller gauge/thinner wall tubing just rides so much better. And if I ever want an alternate mountain bike, it can still take fat tires.

    Something to think about.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by 88 rex View Post
    I HAD a bell lap and thought it was an OK bar. I liked the flare. Then I upgraded to a Cowbell, and WOW.......fantastic bar. I recently bought another salsa and it came with a Bell Lap, and again it's just "meh." I'm going to keep using it because I think I may have finally gotten the bike dialed in and I don't want to spend any more $$.....but the second I get some extra cash I'm converting that bike to Cowbells as well. Great bars.

    The bike might not be the one for you, BUT if you are going to give it some extra time, I would start with bars and stem. Maybe have a local shop let you try some stems out to get a feel for different angles/lengths. I happen to have a few extra stems on the shelf so I try to give each set-up a few rides before I decide yay or nay.
    That's some good advice. I've given it a lot of thought and Im thinking of just selling the vaya and getting another el mar frame. Hopefully a ti one this time though.

  20. #20
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    Would love to get a cowbell for my road rig. They look like a great bar! Currently rising Nitto noodles, but after spending so much time on the Fargo I routinely smacks wrists on the bars when in the drops.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherpaxc View Post
    That's some good advice. I've given it a lot of thought and Im thinking of just selling the vaya and getting another el mar frame. Hopefully a ti one this time though.
    Certainly can't go wrong with a Ti El Mar...... Local shop sells Salsa and I like to stop in an drool.

    I even rode a Ti Mukluk once and ........... Ridiculous amount of fun on the singletrack!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 88 rex View Post

    I even rode a Ti Mukluk once and ........... Ridiculous amount of fun on the singletrack!

    Although it has absolutely nothing to do with this thread, I have to say this comment resonates with me for sure.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by 88 rex View Post
    I HAD a bell lap and thought it was an OK bar. I liked the flare. Then I upgraded to a Cowbell, and WOW.......fantastic bar. I recently bought another salsa and it came with a Bell Lap, and again it's just "meh." I'm going to keep using it because I think I may have finally gotten the bike dialed in and I don't want to spend any more $$.....but the second I get some extra cash I'm converting that bike to Cowbells as well. Great bars.

    The bike might not be the one for you, BUT if you are going to give it some extra time, I would start with bars and stem. Maybe have a local shop let you try some stems out to get a feel for different angles/lengths. I happen to have a few extra stems on the shelf so I try to give each set-up a few rides before I decide yay or nay.
    This mirrors my own experience with my Vaya. I also wasn't feeling it anymore with the Vaya, so I went to the LBS to test some roadbikes (surly pacer, all city mr. pink). I also tried a Chili ConX, which I like the best. Thinking about it, I decided the biggest difference in feel between all the bikes was from the bars. I decided to swap the bell lap for a cowbell 2. It made a huge difference in the feel on the bike and I'm digging the Vaya again.

  24. #24
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    Nice thing about going Fargo is you could buy the frameset and swap everything over - crankset and tires (and bar) are the only changes needed

  25. #25
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    Good to see the universal Cowbell love - I was hoping it wasn't just me... I have to agree with another poster as well - I may very well get a set for my road rig. They're that good.

  26. #26
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    ditto...have some Bell Laps on my Handsome Devil and can't wait to switch them out for cowbells.
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guitar Ted View Post
    Although it has absolutely nothing to do with this thread, I have to say this comment resonates with me for sure.
    I didn't want to say it, BUT if I already had an El Mar in steel, a Ti Mukluk would make a great pairing. Snowy commutes would be a blast!

  28. #28
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    I had an orange Vaya that I bought stock with the Cowbell bars and agree the bars are awesome! I did end up selling the Vaya because I just didn't feel it for the bike... I had also built up a Casseroll a few months after buying the Vaya and like it a TON better! If you already have a Mariachi then you may be looking for a Casseroll... with the canti studs on the Cass now you can run bigger, knobbier tires if you want to hit a trail and it the bike is awesome on the road... and after upgrading to BB7's on the Vaya and still like liking then I can tell you putting a set of mini-v's on the Cass is just as good as BB7's if you don't dig cantis... although I have Paul Touring on my Cass and they are great...

    one other suggestion is to look at Black Mountain Cycle's framesets... Mike, the owner, has a ton of experience in the industry and designs one heck of a bike...
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  29. #29
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    Before making my choice on the Casseroll, I spent some time playing with a friend's Vaya. It's a cool bike - it just felt a little "sluggish" to me. I wanted something that leaned a little more towards a road bike, and fixated on the Casseroll. It's a great do anything bike - just not really given much attention since the stock build makes the bike look like that it's hiding in the back of math class playing d&d.

    It's my gravel bike, and my pavement commuter. If I changed the 42c Conti Speeds on there right now (with plenty of room to spare, btw), I'm sure it'd hold it's own on a road ride. And it has more eyelets then I know what to do with (like these funny ones that sit mid-seatstay???) I don't mind the cantis - probably because I grew up in an era of mountain bikes where John Tomac raced downhill with a 60tooth ring and OMG - canti brakes.

    Oh - I have Cowbells, and agree, they are the nicest road bars I've ever ridden.

    Regarding Black Mountain - nice, affordable stuff. However, don't understand why you would put a rack mount on the drop out, but rely on wrap clamps for the seat stay??

  30. #30
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    I wonder if they will make the casseroll in a disc version this year (2013)

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by designmaki View Post
    I wonder if they will make the casseroll in a disc version this year (2013)
    Not really a need for it, IMO.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by axebiker View Post
    Not really a need for it, IMO.
    Except for discs being better

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by designmaki View Post
    I wonder if they will make the casseroll in a disc version this year (2013)
    I really hope not... not every bike has to have disc brakes!
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ser jameson View Post
    Except for discs being better
    You might find some differing opinions among the quasi-roadie crowd. Personally, I'd find those two bikes to be too much alike, and you'd have to beef up the fork of the Cass to use discs, which would probably change that bike a bit too much. I liked the Cass for the lively, springy ride. A burly fork would not be my choice for an "upgrade".

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by axebiker View Post
    you might find some differing opinions among the quasi-roadie crowd. Personally, i'd find those two bikes to be too much alike, and you'd have to beef up the fork of the cass to use discs, which would probably change that bike a bit too much. I liked the cass for the lively, springy ride. A burly fork would not be my choice for an "upgrade".
    +1...
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  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmike View Post
    what i wished for was that the bike felt more 'alive'...
    +42 on lost love for the Vaya.

    I had it. It's not that it wasn't the lightest thing out there, it just always felt lazy, slow, and unstable. It was twitchy/squirrly on the road and just felt plain wrong off the roads. I went the serious upgrade route and got a Mosaic custom Ti frame that is freakin awesome! (It's similar geo to a Lynskey Pro Cross though.) It's fast on the roads, stable and nimble on mellow singletrack, and felt fine on DK200 this year. I've have a small bikepacking seat bag made and that works great too.



    Since I got the Mosaic I hated riding the Vaya even more - I even dreaded the 0.7 miles to the grocery store. Since we weren't meant for each other I sold it. A lot of folks DO like the Vaya so it only took an hour for someone to ring me after listing online. Later that day I took home an El Mariachi Ti Dubbed Elmer, this thing is a blast! The frame just fits, and it rides like it's on rails. There are some tweaks I'll make (bars and grips) but I can tell the frame and geo are spot on.

    El Mariachi felt amazing right away. The Vaya never felt right. You gotta know when to hold em, know when to fold em...
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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdemars View Post
    it just always felt lazy, slow, and unstable. It was twitchy/squirrly on the road and just felt plain wrong off the roads.
    Wow...lots wrong with the Vaya for you!! Interesting, cuz I have the exact opposite feel. I'm curious about the "lazy, slow" followed up by "twitchy/squirrely" though...

    Quote Originally Posted by sdemars View Post
    I went the serious upgrade route and got a Mosaic custom Ti frame that is freakin awesome!
    You spent more on a frame than the entire Vaya! It better be THAT FREAKIN' AWESOME!!

    Quote Originally Posted by sdemars View Post
    Since we weren't meant for each other I sold it.
    I had a similar experience with a "dream bike" that I parted with this year - my '08 Cervelo Soloist Carbon. Sad, but some times it's easy to fall in love with the idea of the bike, and there are things that a quick demo ride won't flush out.

    Quote Originally Posted by sdemars View Post
    El Mariachi felt amazing right away. The Vaya never felt right. You gotta know when to hold em, know when to fold em...
    Yep - the El Mar is one of my most favorite rides - once I got the size right.

  38. #38
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    The Vaya felt sluggish more than slow. It was more like a truck. It would get up to speed and roll at a decent clip but it didn't get going fast and it took more diesel power to keep it at speed.

    Twitchy - well I never could take my hands off the bars for more than 2 seconds. This is the ONLY bike I've ever felt this way about and that includes a Ridley, Litespeed, G Fisher, Surly, Rocky Mtn, Giant, blah blah blah. I don't understand it, and can't explain why it did it, but I can say I didn't like it. What's the antonym for inspiring confidence?

    The cost of my Mosaic: Is it worth it? My wallet may be empty but it does look like this


    So yeah, absolutely. And the wheels are worth it too More pix here if ya want a look.
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  39. #39
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    Yeah - my Chili Con Crosso is a much better/faster/livelier ride too by comparison, but people gotta understand that the Vaya is not a CX bike.

    Your explanation above makes more sense though.

    Were you using the stock wheel set and tires on the Vaya? Which particular one did you have? I have the Vaya 2, all stock except for the saddle, and seat post, which is a Thudbuster ST. I even thought the stock tires were great off-pavement.

    I see you're running Small Block 8's - awesome tires for almost everything. I had them on my La Cruz - I just wish they came bigger than a 35c. That said, I'll be putting a set on my Chili soon.

  40. #40
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    I had the brown (I think 2011) when there was only 1 version. Loved the looks of that year. The ride was the worst with the stock wheels but still not awesome with the DT240/crest wheelset I picked up.

    You are right though, it's not a CX bike. I'd say the ride is closer to touring bike feel than CX bike. I suppose I decided I wanted more of a CX bike but one that I may never take to a CX race. Mine was purpose built for long stuff like DK200. Although you the discs aren't needed there they're handy in other events with different (bigger) hills and terrain - I'm thinking South Park Dirty Fondo and R2G2.

    The stock tires on mine were damn heavy but fine other than that. I've run SB8 and Ritchey Speedmax. I prefer the Kendas and agree on the size. I'd like to find something with a similar tread at 40-42c for R2G2. I'm anti-Specialized so their stuff is out (no need to rant here). Vaya did have awesome clearance though...and the breakaway hangers do work (a friend's Vaya there with the stick):

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  41. #41
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    How slow and sluggish does the vaya feel on the road? I mean can anyone quantify it somewhat.
    What actually makes a bike feel slow and sluggish? I have a bike with Head angle 72.5 and mechanical trail of 57mm and supposedly 57-58 is the exact spot of what is regarded as neutral. The vaya in my size would have a Headangle of 71.5 and a mech trail of 61mm so a little more sluggish in both accounts. I think my current bike is stable at all speeds even with no hands. But its not very comfortable as a long range bike so I'm looking to buy a new one.

    It will have a rack in the back but thats it pretty much. I have been looking at the vaya/vaya ti and Shand stooshie and also the Cotic x. The shands and cotic will definitely have shorter stays, the shand also has the same angle and the cotic is slacker, the shand has a45mm rake fork so the trail is longer. Anyone care to guess if any of those would feel less sluggish than the vaya?

    the Product of COTIC cycles : X steel cyclocross
    Stooshie frame geometry: Reynolds 853 steel cyclocross frame

    I'm kinda torn between these 3 frames, and I get a bit worried about the vayas reputation.
    I will use the bike as a commuter and it will be running road tires (and studded winter tires).
    all 3 frames are a gamble for me since they only stock taiwan mass produced brands here so a test ride is out of the question unfortunately. I have to go by other peoples impressions/guesses.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.

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    Specialized sucks ass.

  42. #42
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    The vaya definitely feels like a touring bike, a bit peppier than the LHT, but definitely on the touring spectrum. A nice touring bike but long chainstays and highish trail. I can't really quantify it but it definitely lacked the 'zoom' for me. Which isn't really a function of weight, partially tubing, partially geometry. I'm a biggish guy so take that into account too. For comparison, the two bikes I have now are a Rawland dSogn with a 73 head angle and mechanical trail of around 45, and a CrossCheck with a custom fork (and disc brakes) 72 head angle & mechanical trail around 56 or so.

    The best description of the difference I've heard between low and mid trail is that with low trail, you steer with your hands, with mid-trail you steer with your hips. The steering on the Vaya didn't feel precise. On the rawland you pick right where you want to go and it goes exactly there, on the NotACheck, you cruise it to the right spot. The Vaya felt cramped (I probably had too small of a frame) and the steering felt flat, it didn't miss where you were going but it didn't exactly move you there. The chainstays are shorter on the CC and it definitely feels more zippy because of it. If I were touring, it would have been ok, on gravel, probably ok as well, but roads & trails & some dirt & gravel, it just didn't work for me.

  43. #43
    djw
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    I think the sluggishness with the vaya comes from the wheelbase rather than trail or steering angle. I just converted my Casseroll to a mullet with a vaya fork and bb7 road front disc. The heavy fork adds a bit of harshness to the ride (especially with <28c tires) but the bike still carves a decent line. The head angle has slackened to 71.5 (same as the vaya) but the cass still has 25mm shorter chainstays and the wheelbase is not surprisingly also 25mm shorter. Since I have no heel clearance issues with the bags I think the Cassevaya mullet is a great solution for me.
    Last edited by djw; 08-25-2012 at 07:37 PM.

  44. #44
    ejj
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    The Vaya IS a touring bike. Almost same body position as a Long Haul Trucker. SLIGHTLY lighter/peppier tubeset. If you want something faster/quicker, there are many options...

  45. #45
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    Good info here guys! Thanks for responding. I really like the Vayas features and so many people seems to be so happy with them, I'm just a bit uncertain since its quite a lot of dough. And I want to be happy with it if I eventually get it.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.

    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles View Post
    Specialized sucks ass.

  46. #46
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    I just got the Ti Vaya myself. Its a great bike. The local bike shop sized me on it (56). I changed out a lot of the parts but the most important changes have been the handlebar (Cowbell 2) and the stem (100mm Thomson). I ride this bike as my gravel/road/cx bike. The thing to remember is this bike is a touring bike! It will do other things well, but not perfectly.

    I think the bike feels great on gravel. Very stable, fast, great for long rides and can be light!

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twebb View Post
    The thing to remember is this bike is a touring bike! It will do other things well, but not perfectly.

    ... Very stable, fast, great for long rides and can be light!
    Key point there ^^^ the better you do one thing the less well you do other things. It's just a fact of specialization. Also, there ARE many folks who love their Vayas - I'm just not one of em. For me personally the touring geometry feels horrible. If I were to get a stock frame I'd personally go with the Warbird, but then again it's rather different from the Vaya - and I don't care about racks n fenders.

    ...light, however, is a relative term. A specific weight is absolute. I got my Vaya to 24# with a change in wheels and tires. This did seem light compared to the stock build. With the new Whisky carbon straight disc fork and a bit more cash I could go as low as 22# but I doubt I could really shave more off that. My Ti mosaic is 18.5. My old CX bike was a Ridley X-Fire, which I've seen built up at 15#! Hardly makes the Vaya seem light.
    Overland : Hayduke : Hightower : Delirium : Piolet

  48. #48
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    Hey car bone,

    feel free to email or PM me with any questions you have on the Shand stuff and I'll see if I can help you out.

    Cheers

    Steven

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    So a bit of an update. I sold the Vaya and am building up a Cross Check. I borrowed one for two weeks and put a good 10 hours on it and was much happier overall. It felt quicker and lighter while still being adequate on dirt.

    Hopefully this will be my last bike build for a while.

  50. #50
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    When I first got the Vaya I had the exact same feelings...so instead of selling it right away, since it is my commuter/road/gravel/travel bike, I invested in some nice wheels built my Mike Curiak. I wouldn't have believed it, but the bike came alive after I put those on. It feels much more vibrant and it hums the road. I've put a lot into the bike and am over all happy with it. It isn't as fast as I would like, but it sure is very comfortable.

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    I would definitely try a shorter stem length and different bars. Also wondering if bar height might be contributing to the hand numbness. I am running a 90mm stem and woodchippers and they feel perfect. Also put the bars up higher than my roadbike. Don't know what else to say except no bike is perfect for everyone.

  52. #52
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    Anyone know where I can find a Vaya Ti 57cm to buy?

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