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  1. #1
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    Is "rotor rub" under turning or hard pedaling common (Salsa Fargo)?

    So the bike:

    2012 Salsa Fargo (with road BB7s, 180/160mm F/R)

    me:
    *picture of 255# chubby former powerlifter*

    I hear a heavy rotor rub under the following circumstances:

    1. when I start to ride, I put my left foot on the left pedal and pedal once to get going, then swing my right foot over the bike. I hear heavy rotor rub until I'm centered on the bike, then it goes away.

    2. When I turn corners and lean into the corner, I'll hear some obvious rotor rub.

    3. when I stand and hammer. this agitates me because I go through a lot of heavy gravel on the way to work during my commute (well, I purposely go through the gravel, but dammit it's fun!) and it frequently requires some hammering to power through

    4. When I have done many miles or finished a climb, I will stand with pedals at 6 and 12 o'clock, alternating with my left foot at 6 o'clock, then my right foot at 6 o'clock, to stretch out all my stuff. Definite rotor rub

    I've tightened the QR as best as I can, taken many steps to ensure that the wheel is centered. I don't think anything is out of true because it doesn't make that noise when I'm NOT in those situations (i.e. just pedaling along in a straight line)

    now it seems that I'm causing an inordinate amount of wheel flex, or is it possibly something else causing this deliciously agitating noise?
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  2. #2
    since 4/10/2009
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    Not wheel flex.

    Frame/fork flex (and more specifically, the interface between the frame and hub), depending on whether you're hearing it in the front or back.

    The Fargo is steel, which is known to be flexier than aluminum. That's why steel is more comfortable in a touring bike. You are a bigger guy, so you put more stress on the bike than a 140lb racer boy.

    This is also why thru axles are becoming more and more common. They stiffen the interface between the frame/fork and the hub.

    With a frame that's limited to QR type axles, there's really only one way you can stiffen those interfaces. Use hubs that allow for 9mm front and 10mm rear skewers like the DT RWS system, or convert them to bolt-on axles. If your hubs have swappable end caps to convert to thru-axle, there's a good chance that end caps are available that would allow you to use the beefier RWS skewers (standard skewers are 5mm in diameter, so much more flexy - and be aware, you can get RWS skewers in the 5mm flavor, too).

  3. #3
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    well buggers.

    Why would a frame be limited to QR axles? Why isn't it possibly to use a thru-axle? Is it the shape of the dropouts or whatever? I only hear it from the front, BTW.

    I'm willing to get a new set of hubs if it means getting rid of this. I was prepared to buy a whole new wheelset to be honest.


    so I just found the DT RWS on the DT Swiss website. How can I tell if my hubs are compatible with this skewer type? Is it safe to assume that all DT Swiss hubs are compatible with this (i.e. the DT 350 or 240?) Is it a proprietary thing, or are other hubs compatible (XT hubs? Chris King? Hope? etc)
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  4. #4
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    I don't think that DT Swiss RWS is going to fix your issues. It's still just a QR. A though-axle is different in that it inserts through a circular hole on one side and then threads into the other side of the fork/frame. It's also a larger diameter.

  5. #5
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    so a thru-axle is something that is frame-specific, not just hub-specific?
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  6. #6
    The Original Suspect
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    I think this is a fork flex issue. Like I said in the other thread. You being a big guy is flexing the fork and making the rotor rub in certain instances. Like you said when you mount your bike from one pedal you hear the rub, you are flexing the fork on the side you are mounting from. Not a big deal IMO.

  7. #7
    since 4/10/2009
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    You'll have to look up the specifics for whatever hubs you have, to see if they have the option to use those skewers. Hubs other than DT are compatible (I have a Specialized hub that has an RWS front on it), but probably a little less common than DT's own stuff. My wife's mtb has DT Swiss Tricon wheels, and the hubs have end caps for the RWS skewers. they're beefy and pretty stiff. Not quite to the level of my new bike which has actual thru axles front and rear, but definitely better than 5mm skewers.

    For example:
    Pro 2 EVO Front Hub | Hope Tech | Made in Barnoldswick, England

    Under specs, it lists axle compatibility, so every axle spec they mention will have a different set of end caps available. Since this one is a front hub, we'd be looking for a 9mm axle. Like I said, any hub with swappable end caps for wide range of axle choices SHOULD have 9/10mm compatibility.

    As for why a frame would be limited to QR axles, the dropouts are shaped totally differently. QR axles have been around for a really long time and started their life on road bikes. Thru axles are a bit newer and actually thread directly into the frame/fork, and were designed for mtb's first (and now they're being adopted on cross and some road bikes, even). They also have to be removed completely to pull the wheel out, whereas a QR is just loosened and left in the hub.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by TBarnaby View Post
    I don't think that DT Swiss RWS is going to fix your issues. It's still just a QR. A though-axle is different in that it inserts through a circular hole on one side and then threads into the other side of the fork/frame. It's also a larger diameter.
    It's true we can't know for sure if they will fix his issues. But it's the stiffest interface he can use on the bike he has.

    The quickest/simplest/cheapest thing to fix the problem would be to dial the brake pads out a little bit so the rotor has a little more room to move when the bike flexes. Or ignore it.

  9. #9
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    I weigh just a bit less than the OP, about the same loaded for backpacking. the DT Swiss RWS made a difference for me... its small, but it helps. Having someone check the tension in the wheel, and proper brake setup will help too.

    With BB7s there is just some noise that comes and goes that you can't get rid of, especially if you are running the BB7 road, and road levers. Just have to have things setup tight in order to get good feel on the lever. When I switched to a Jones bar and MTB lever and BB7 MT things improved quite a bit.

  10. #10
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    so is the RWS just something I switch out with my QR skewers?
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  11. #11
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    Superstar Components in England sell rebranded Novatec 9mm front and 10mm rear quick release through axles. These are commonly known as QR THRU. You need to be able to properly convert your hubs, but some people have successfully drilled out their existing end caps. A friend of mine has converted Hope hubs and used these and likes them a lot.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgtrobo View Post
    so is the RWS just something I switch out with my QR skewers?
    yes

    DT Swiss - RWS MTB steel

  13. #13
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    I believe Nate was referring to the 9/10mm QRs. They're quite uncommon now, Hope is the only company that I can think of that makes a hub that is easily convertible anymore.

  14. #14
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    Is "rotor rub" under turning or hard pedaling common (Salsa Fargo)?

    Quote Originally Posted by wschruba View Post
    I believe Nate was referring to the 9/10mm QRs. They're quite uncommon now, Hope is the only company that I can think of that makes a hub that is easily convertible anymore.
    That may be with thru axles becoming more common

  15. #15
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    Is "rotor rub" under turning or hard pedaling common (Salsa Fargo)?

    If you don't already have a good QR skewer, that's the easiest and cheapest. Sheldon Brown was fond of internal cam skewers, like Shimano's. They have much higher mechanical advantage than a lot of the competition's, so "as best as I can" is pretty good, even for someone who never got into power lifting.

    On an aluminum frame, if your QR skewer's not leaving marks on the dropouts, it's not tight enough.

    BB7s don't open that wide. So you also may need to adjust your segmentations. Bikes ridden off-road trend to make noise. Can you actually feel it dragging, or is it just a sound?
    "Don't buy upgrades; ride up grades." -Eddy Merckx

  16. #16
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    nah, i think it's just sound. Just a hideous, nails-across-the-chalkboard sound that makes it sound like I'm breaking $hit... (I am a bull-in-a-china-shop type, I break things all the time accidentally)

    bmike, you had the DWS on your Fargo? I'll drop the $$$ on them now if I can figure out that they definitely fit the Fargo.
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  17. #17
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  19. #19
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    I had this issue when running 203mm rotors on my Big Dummy. I switched to 180s and it went away.

    I dunno if you could/should try a 160 in front, but it's an option.
    You change your own flats? Support your LBS and pay them to instead.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Volsung View Post
    I had this issue when running 203mm rotors on my Big Dummy. I switched to 180s and it went away.

    I dunno if you could/should try a 160 in front, but it's an option.
    I'm not sure if I'd want to do that if I was the OP. I'm about 175 and I really prefer a 180mm rotor on the front of most mtb's.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by wschruba View Post
    I believe Nate was referring to the 9/10mm QRs. They're quite uncommon now, Hope is the only company that I can think of that makes a hub that is easily convertible anymore.
    American Classic also has a conversion kit.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmike View Post

    so i just got mine from JensonUSA.

    what's the deal with these, replace my skewers with them and just crank these suckers on tight, once you get the wheel nice and centered in the dropouts?
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

  23. #23
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    I don't know if I buy that the RWS skewer is any better than a good cam-locking skewer if it's just a skewer and not an axle.

    Worth a try, I s'pose. OP, what kind of skewers do you have now? And I'm not sure how to ask, but do you know how to use them?
    "Don't buy upgrades; ride up grades." -Eddy Merckx

  24. #24
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    Yes, just crank the RWS ones down tight and then reposition the lever so it won't snag on anything.

    Did you just buy the 5mm ones? I don't think those are nearly as much of an improvement as the fat 9/10mm ones.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrwSwitch View Post
    OP, what kind of skewers do you have now?
    dunno. they're not labeled at all

    Quote Originally Posted by AndrwSwitch View Post
    And I'm not sure how to ask, but do you know how to use them?
    uh....*laughs* I didn't realize there was a 'way' to use them? Stick them in, screw them on? No?


    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    Did you just buy the 5mm ones? I don't think those are nearly as much of an improvement as the fat 9/10mm ones.
    well crap. I got these ones: DT Swiss RWS MTB Steel/Aluminum QR > Components > Wheels > Quick Releases | Jenson USA

    one for the front, one for the rear. i don't see any that specify 9/10mm
    a day on a bike is a good day

    - 2012 Salsa Fargo 3
    - 2014 Spec Stumpjumper FSR Comp

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