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Thread: Edward Snowden

  1. #1
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    Edward Snowden

    I'm not sure why the NSA thread got recycled - after all, it affects all of us, globally.
    Is MTBR trying to sweep it under the rug too? NAH!

    Anyways, here's the latest from the NSA Whistle-blower (or 'leaker' if you are MSM), Edward Snowden:
    Statement from Edward Snowden in Moscow

    "One week ago I left Hong Kong after it became clear that my freedom and safety were under threat for revealing the truth. My continued liberty has been owed to the efforts of friends new and old, family, and others who I have never met and probably never will. I trusted them with my life and they returned that trust with a faith in me for which I will always be thankful.

    On Thursday, President Obama declared before the world that he would not permit any diplomatic "wheeling and dealing" over my case. Yet now it is being reported that after promising not to do so, the President ordered his Vice President to pressure the leaders of nations from which I have requested protection to deny my asylum petitions.

    This kind of deception from a world leader is not justice, and neither is the extralegal penalty of exile. These are the old, bad tools of political aggression. Their purpose is to frighten, not me, but those who would come after me.

    For decades the United States of America has been one of the strongest defenders of the human right to seek asylum. Sadly, this right, laid out and voted for by the U.S. in Article 14 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, is now being rejected by the current government of my country. The Obama administration has now adopted the strategy of using citizenship as a weapon. Although I am convicted of nothing, it has unilaterally revoked my passport, leaving me a stateless person. Without any judicial order, the administration now seeks to stop me exercising a basic right. A right that belongs to everybody. The right to seek asylum.

    In the end the Obama administration is not afraid of whistleblowers like me, Bradley Manning or Thomas Drake. We are stateless, imprisoned, or powerless. No, the Obama administration is afraid of you. It is afraid of an informed, angry public demanding the constitutional government it was promised and it should be.

    I am unbowed in my convictions and impressed at the efforts taken by so many.

    Edward Joseph Snowden

    Monday 1st July 2013"
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  2. #2
    gobsmacked Moderator
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    Political. Just like this one.

  3. #3
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    it's not politics GOB - this is about people, human rights and entities that want to curb them.
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  4. #4
    Bro
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    But in the end, it turns to politics. It's just too closely tied to politics for us to talk at any length about Snowden without turning it into a political discussion. I think the OC (at least the regulars here) would be able to keep it tame and insightful, but unfortunately, rules for the entire site is rules for the entire site.

    Now, without expressing my personal opinion of Snowden, I believe that, if he'd done things differently, he could have achieved the same goal without getting himself in so much trouble so quickly. But it's a bit late for that now.
    I've made some bad decisions like taking the gears off my bike. So here's the warning: Do not as I say, nor as I do.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bro View Post
    But in the end, it turns to politics. It's just too closely tied to politics for us to talk at any length about Snowden without turning it into a political discussion. I think the OC (at least the regulars here) would be able to keep it tame and insightful, but unfortunately, rules for the entire site is rules for the entire site.

    Now, without expressing my personal opinion of Snowden, I believe that, if he'd done things differently, he could have achieved the same goal without getting himself in so much trouble so quickly. But it's a bit late for that now.
    Even when it's inter-country? Does that make it super-political or something?
    New NSA leaks show how US is bugging its European allies | World news | The Guardian
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    Even when it's inter-country? Does that make it super-political or something?
    New NSA leaks show how US is bugging its European allies | World news | The Guardian
    Yup. Probably at least mostly because it's the governments that are involved. If it were a private company that was doing this, I would expect the discussion to be very different. Also, let's not forget that this is an international forum.
    I've made some bad decisions like taking the gears off my bike. So here's the warning: Do not as I say, nor as I do.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bro View Post
    Yup. Probably at least mostly because it's the governments that are involved. If it were a private company that was doing this, I would expect the discussion to be very different. Also, let's not forget that this is an international forum.
    private companies/banks-governments ,,, hard to tell the difference IMO
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    private companies/banks-governments ,,, hard to tell the difference IMO
    There we go with the politics part.

    (And though I agree with you ) The difference is in the public perception. Snowden's case was first widely reported as data collection by the government, so that's what people will believe. First impressions do wonders.
    I've made some bad decisions like taking the gears off my bike. So here's the warning: Do not as I say, nor as I do.

  9. #9
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    If he didn't do anything wrong.... why is he running?
    Hey Miraculous... Go Raiders ! .
    -Dad

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fishbucket View Post
    If he didn't do anything wrong.... why is he running?


    To Russia of all places. Bring him back to the U.S., have a trial.

  11. #11
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    After the articles I read it didn't seem as though Russia was intended to be his final destination. People who ask why he ran to Honk Kong, and then Russia (with the intentions to go to Cuba) and then Ecuador are forgetting the modern nature of seeking asylum. Where was he to go, Britain, Australia, Canada? But then again we are speaking about individualistic action here so know one knows his intentions except him. That's why I am less concerning myself with Snowden and have more concerned myself with the actual content of his leaks and what will be done about it.

  12. #12
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    I really do not know enough about what actually happened with these 'leaks', or what circumstances led to Snowden's flight, and unfortunately, now that obfuscation and bending of the truth have no doubt happened, mixed in with a healthy dose of 'opinion' giving, I probably never will.
    Send RandomGuyOnABike to fetch him back... actually, just the thought that RGOAB might come after him will get him on the first plane back...
    It's all Here. Now.

  13. #13
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    I forgot to add... . Come back and fight like a man. don't throw out a ***** slap then run.
    He's no better than a terrorist... hit and run

    .like a poosy
    Hey Miraculous... Go Raiders ! .
    -Dad

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fishbucket View Post
    I forgot to add... . Come back and fight like a man. don't throw out a ***** slap then run.
    He's no better than a terrorist... hit and run

    .like a poosy
    I respectfully disagree. Yeah, he ran, but he knows that the deck is stacked against him. If you don't mind being watched constantly, that's fine. He just wants to make sure you're aware that you are being watched and listened to all the time. I appreciate him making it known. He knew his actions would require him to run, and gave up his "life" to do it. He'll never be able to just chill out on a beach again without a gnawing feeling that he could be snatched up or just out right killed.

  15. #15
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    The backpedaling by Ecuador is funny.
    "Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights make a left."
    Ty Webb

  16. #16
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    And most, if not all of the countries allegedly bugged by the U.S. would be hypocritical in their complaints. Not unjustified, but hypocritical.
    "Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights make a left."
    Ty Webb

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by girlonbike View Post
    Political. Just like this one.
    Pedal faster

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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bro View Post
    But in the end, it turns to politics. It's just too closely tied to politics for us to talk at any length about Snowden without turning it into a political discussion. I think the OC (at least the regulars here) would be able to keep it tame and insightful, but unfortunately, rules for the entire site is rules for the entire site.

    Now, without expressing my personal opinion of Snowden, I believe that, if he'd done things differently, he could have achieved the same goal without getting himself in so much trouble so quickly. But it's a bit late for that now.
    Even when it's inter-country? Does that make it super-political or something?
    New NSA leaks show how US is bugging its European allies | World news | The Guardian
    Absolutely it's political.

    Besides,
    A MOD has already stated it is political.

    But, being as it's still around ... I guess it's time to voice an opinion on the subject.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottap2003 View Post
    I respectfully disagree. Yeah, he ran, but he knows that the deck is stacked against him. If you don't mind being watched constantly, that's fine. He just wants to make sure you're aware that you are being watched and listened to all the time. I appreciate him making it known. He knew his actions would require him to run, and gave up his "life" to do it. He'll never be able to just chill out on a beach again without a gnawing feeling that he could be snatched up or just out right killed.
    If you don't realize that you're constantly being watched, you're not paying attention.

    Enemy Of The State
    That is his unofficial title, and IMO, the political factions that control from within government, will either get him, or make him disappear.

    He embarrassed our government, by reminding the public of what they knew about, but chose to forget.

    This same government has admitted to committing acts of espionage, and called other nations hypocrites, if they do not look behind their own curtains, first.

    The sad thing is ... Some people want blood, because what should be known by all, required a reminder.

  20. #20
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    You cant take a job at the NSA, make a living from them and the country, then turn around and feed information to who ever he pleases, the guy is no different to a terrorist and should be treated as such.
    Now he is running to other countries and they will provide him with asylum to hand over more information, in the old days guys like this would have been shot.

    Of course every country is running survailence, and they absolutly need to be doing that, the worlds a dangerous place, its not a kids playground.

    I recon the guy should be locked up for a very long time.

    He was in a trusted position and he broke the trust, i say charge him as a terrorist and lock him up.
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  21. #21
    AZ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    You cant take a job at the NSA, make a living from them and the country, then turn around and feed information to who ever he pleases, the guy is no different to a terrorist and should be treated as such.
    Now he is running to other countries and they will provide him with asylum to hand over more information, in the old days guys like this would have been shot.

    Of course every country is running survailence, and they absolutly need to be doing that, the worlds a dangerous place, its not a kids playground.


    I recon the guy should be locked up for a very long time.

    He was in a trusted position and he broke the trust, i say charge him as a terrorist and lock him up.




    Hey! Did ya hear about the Aussie wearing the yellow jersey in Le Tour?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty $anchez View Post
    Hey! Did ya hear about the Aussie wearing the yellow jersey in Le Tour?
    GO SIMON GERRINS WWWOOOOOOOO WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
    only the 6th aussie to ever pull on the yellow.

    Won the stage yesterday and our aussie team won the time trial today, one very proud aussie here AZ
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  23. #23
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    My 2 cents?
    Dude doesn't even exist.
    This is just a distraction to keep you refocused away from what is important. Nothing he "leaked" was new information, hell I have known about this for at least 20 years, and ANYTHING reported by the MSM is not to be trusted.

  24. #24
    gobsmacked Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    our aussie team won the time trial today, one very proud aussie here AZ
    Way to go, spoiler. Sucked the fun right out of watching it for me tonight.







    you still suck though.

  25. #25
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    Agreed,

    With the current administration, and crew, you must watch the sleight of hand, constantly... diversion is a useful tactic in the accomplishment of their hidden agenda. Transparent my ass.
    "i'll brazilian when YOU do boy, right around the ol' rusty star. Actually, whole fruit bowl. Get on it!" NicoleB

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