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  1. #1
    whoa!
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    So, , , you don't like nuclear power ???

    Join the party. . .

    Having worked mainly around industries that use cogeneration as a standard practice, the following article describes a company that is pursuing a course of related energy production that I have been thinking about for years. . .

    'Waste' heat recovery is what it is all about. The numbers are truly staggering. . . I heard one of the guys,Thomas Castin, on a radio program a few days back and wrote down some of the numbers he was quoting I didn't see in the article :

    total recoverable US industrial waste heat (est) = 65 large nuclear reactors (1000MW)
    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . or = 120 coal fired power plants

    $350 billion upfront capital expenditure for retrofit = $70 billion/year payback in energy savings.

    Projected construction costs of these refits will come in around $0.05/kwh. . .

    orion magazine
    Does that sound suspiciously pie-in-the-sky? Casten can drive a few miles from his Chicago office to an East Chicago plant run by Mittal Steel. A few years ago, a predecessor energy-recycling company installed this kind of equipment on the smokestacks of the plant’s coke ovens. In 2004, this single steel plant generated roughly the same amount of clean energy as was produced by all of the grid-connected solar collectors throughout the world.

  2. #2
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    It should be a two pronged attack.

    Efficiency, waste heat is there ... extreme efficiency ....

    and new energy sources, wind, solar, bio, PV, and nuke

  3. #3
    Who are the brain police?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystery Shopper
    It should be a two pronged attack.

    Efficiency, waste heat is there ... extreme efficiency ....

    and new energy sources, wind, solar, bio, PV, and nuke
    Damn. I've been b|tching about efficiency forever. Heating, AC, and transportation. We could crush energy demand, but the sectors that benefit in its loss pull the strings.

    We need leadership that backhands the corporate vampires.

    New corporate vampires will be created, but more sustainable ones.
    The Who - Glittering Girl
    Ween - The Grobe
    Yellowman - Strong Me Strong
    all your base are belong to us

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Locoman
    Damn. I've been b|tching about efficiency forever. Heating, AC, and transportation. We could crush energy demand, but the sectors that benefit in its loss pull the strings.

    We need leadership that backhands the corporate vampires.

    New corporate vampires will be created, but more sustainable ones.
    Exactly.

  5. #5
    here today
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystery Shopper
    Exactly.
    Vampires?



    A Word about Battery People: Battery people are those humans who were birthed and raised in the Matrix. Both the Animatrix and the first Matrix movie makes clear that the former battery-people (those people stuck in the Matrix Pods from birth but who now live in Zion) are REPLEAT with electronic parts. Their entire nervous system is wired from head to foot. They have massive amounts of electronics in their brain that allow a virtual reality simulation to completely take over all sensory and perceptual elements. But the purpose of the cybernetic implants is two-fold it is used to allow perceptual control of the battery people (cyborgs) and its designed to harvest and transfer human-generated energy into electricity.


  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Locoman
    Damn. I've been b|tching about efficiency forever. Heating, AC, and transportation. We could crush energy demand, but the sectors that benefit in its loss pull the strings.

    We need leadership that backhands the corporate vampires.

    New corporate vampires will be created, but more sustainable ones.
    Garlic is the answer !!!

    Given our whole infrastructure is built on the idea of an endless and cheap supply of energy, its going
    to be really interesting to watch it adapt to a much different reality.

    You actually can see some of this taking place now from 'green' building conferences to compact
    fluorescent bulbs to electric cars. Collectively we are pretty phocking clever if and when we have to be, its
    just too bad we have to wait until the eleventh hour to do something we shoulda been doing from
    the start.

    Years back when I was an electrician at a large mill complex I did an energy survey in my spare time
    and came up with a plan to save $10 or $20 thousand/year by just shutting down stuff like excess lighting
    and a pair of 1200 HP chippers in the middle of the night when they weren't being used.

    The responses I got back from the powers to be went something like :
    "What, , , are you crazy? Get the hell outta here !!!"

    From my perspective trying to supply side our way out by building a bunch of new generating capacity
    before seriously reconsidering low, medium, and high tech conservation is classic old school think that will
    get us nothing more than the same BS problems we are dealing with now.

    Air quality, NIMBY, shortages, , , Enronism. . .

  7. #7
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    I bought Faulkner's short stories, on your advice, and if you keep posting this type of crap, I am going to toss it in the garbage. Unread.





    Quote Originally Posted by zenmonkey
    Vampires?



    A Word about Battery People: Battery people are those humans who were birthed and raised in the Matrix. Both the Animatrix and the first Matrix movie makes clear that the former battery-people (those people stuck in the Matrix Pods from birth but who now live in Zion) are REPLEAT with electronic parts. Their entire nervous system is wired from head to foot. They have massive amounts of electronics in their brain that allow a virtual reality simulation to completely take over all sensory and perceptual elements. But the purpose of the cybernetic implants is two-fold it is used to allow perceptual control of the battery people (cyborgs) and its designed to harvest and transfer human-generated energy into electricity.


  8. #8
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    So we are finally getting there.

    We installed a 5MW compressor, thermal eff about 35% total cost $12MM.

    The cogen would have paid out in less than a year, and cost $1MM more, it got canceled to save a nickel???

    Cogen would have a thermal eff of 85%.

    District heating even better.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffscott
    So we are finally getting there.

    We installed a 5MW compressor, thermal eff about 35% total cost $12MM.

    The cogen would have paid out in less than a year, and cost $1MM more, it got canceled to save a nickel???

    Cogen would have a thermal eff of 85%.

    District heating even better.
    Thats depressing, , , where's the thumbs down emoticon when you need it. . .

    And when you look at balance sheet out over 20 years :
    $1 Million initial capital expenditure vs $x,xxx,xxx reduced energy costs (life cycle).

    Classic !!!

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