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  1. #101
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    Is the yellow logo frame gloss finish, and the red matte?

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockland View Post
    Is the yellow logo frame gloss finish, and the red matte?
    This was from an early EnduroMag review:

    The new Mach 4 Carbon will be available in 3 different colourways: Anthracite Grey/Neon Green in a gloss finish, Stealth Black/Red in a matte finish with gloss black accents, and in a Matte Black/Blue with blue in metallic gloss.

  3. #103
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    Yeah, the green is the only gloss color. Red & Blue are matte finishes
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  4. #104
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    Yeah, the green is the only gloss color. Red & Blue are matte finishes
    Can you say when you expect the small and extra smalls, Ken?

  5. #105
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    I don't have access to delivery schedules but you can always call and ask one of the sales guys. Daniel is on vacation otherwise I'd have him respond (he's the sales manager)....
    Quote Originally Posted by toddchism View Post
    Can you say when you expect the small and extra smalls, Ken?
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by toddchism View Post
    Can you say when you expect the small and extra smalls, Ken?
    My LBS told me that Pivot has had production problems with the Mach 4 in Asia and for that reason no updated ETA.

  7. #107
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    I preorder in July I hope I get it by spring My mach 6 took a few months but the wait was worth it.

  8. #108
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    Re: Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Quote Originally Posted by zootsuitbass View Post
    Attachment 928461I rode one today for 3 minutes.... I want it! Mainly because of fit. It was a Med and it has a amazing amount of stand over clearance.
    Thtats JRA cycles in Mass
    Do they have it in stock?

  9. #109
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    It is/was? Give them a call!

    XO build with the renolds.
    Last edited by zootsuitbass; 10-06-2014 at 09:18 AM.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by tobyrider View Post
    Attachment 927675

    I'll get a ride in as soon as I can get away from work tomorrow.
    Toby,
    One thing I notice about this photo and the one from the trail is that the seatpost looks really long. I also noticed when I went to the Pivot website and looked at the video of the mach 4 the guy riding the bike had his seatpost extended a lot as well. Is this the design of the bike to have so much of the seatpost exposed? My 3 bikes have between 6-7 inches of the seatpost showing. Granted I have 2 29ers and a Fat Bike. It just looks like a lot of seatpost is exposed. I am very interested in this bike and the color combo you got would be the one I would get as well.

    Thanks,

    Chuck

  11. #111
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    It's actually only a few cm more extended than on my medium Les29 (I'm 5'10). See the pics below; I'm using the seat post off the Les right now because I'm waiting on my Loaded post to come in for the M4c that matches the stem and bars. It's the low stand over that makes the seat post look so extended. I raced it yesterday with just a water bottle for hydration and had no problem accessing the cage during the race.

    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...-img_0091.jpgEarly Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...-img_0458.jpgEarly Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...-img_0533.jpg


    Quote Originally Posted by procos View Post
    Toby,
    One thing I notice about this photo and the one from the trail is that the seatpost looks really long. I also noticed when I went to the Pivot website and looked at the video of the mach 4 the guy riding the bike had his seatpost extended a lot as well. Is this the design of the bike to have so much of the seatpost exposed? My 3 bikes have between 6-7 inches of the seatpost showing. Granted I have 2 29ers and a Fat Bike. It just looks like a lot of seatpost is exposed. I am very interested in this bike and the color combo you got would be the one I would get as well.

    Thanks,

    Chuck

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by tobyrider View Post
    It's actually only a few cm more extended than on my medium Les29 (I'm 5'10). See the pics below; I'm using the seat post off the Les right now because I'm waiting on my Loaded post to come in for the M4c that matches the stem and bars. It's the low stand over that makes the seat post look so extended. I raced it yesterday with just a water bottle for hydration and had no problem accessing the cage during the race.

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    That Les 29er is beautiful. I am looking at an Ibis Tranny right now. Need to sell my El Padrino first. But that Les is sweet.

  13. #113
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    Looks to be a fantastic bike but here in the UK they're talking about delivery dates of January2015.....maybe. Is the bike so good that it's worth waiting that long?

  14. #114
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    Hey Toby, was that you out at Erwin today around noon? Saw the Mach 4 Carbon go by as I was putting my Mach 4 Alloy in my car. I've got a Mach 6 carbon also but may need to upgrade the 4 to carbon after I saw yours. The 26'er is still fun to me though at those tight little trails like Erwin...

  15. #115
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    Someone else has a M4c in DFW? What the hell?! Ha! Not me man, I'm in Moab. We've done Slickrock and Whole Enchilada so far, this bike is so freakn badass!

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    Hey Toby, was that you out at Erwin today around noon? Saw the Mach 4 Carbon go by as I was putting my Mach 4 Alloy in my car. I've got a Mach 6 carbon also but may need to upgrade the 4 to carbon after I saw yours. The 26'er is still fun to me though at those tight little trails like Erwin...

  16. #116
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Tried a large M4 today. Amazing bike but felt a bit too dainty to me being used to my M429 C. The bike felt really great though and is exactly what Pivot says it is. A very nimble light feeling bike with a bit of extra travel that makes up for the smaller wheels.


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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by tobyrider View Post
    Someone else has a M4c in DFW? What the hell?! Ha! Not me man, I'm in Moab. We've done Slickrock and Whole Enchilada so far, this bike is so freakn badass!
    Tobyrider - any new feedback on the bike since you rode in Moab? I've been demo-ing bikes and fell *almost* in love with the 429C this weekend. Loved how quick it felt, but I kept wishing it had just a touch more travel in the back. Would love to hear how you think the two compare now that you've ridden the M4c in some more techy stuff!

    Think I'll be waiting a while until my bike shop has a small to demo, and might just get one on order if I hear some more favorable reviews...

  18. #118
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    I've been riding a 429c with 120mm fork for a year now; I've taken it to Bend, OR, Breckenridge and all over Texas racing TMBRA so I've experienced a lot of different terrain. The 429c is a great bike, but for me the M4c seems more plush, climbs easier, descends with more confidence and is just more fun; I love the spin up of the small wheels. I went to Moab with a bunch of guys on 29ers and I was out climbing them all week and I didn't notice any disadvantages on rollover. With the exception of Enchilada I think the M4c is a perfect Moab bike (should have put a dropper post on b4 the trip though). There were a few fast approaching rock gardens on Enchilada that I wanted more travel.

    I'm selling my 429c; my stable will be the M4c and Les29. I just don't see a reason to keep the 429c with those two bikes.

    Pivot nailed this bike!


    Quote Originally Posted by stacers View Post
    Tobyrider - any new feedback on the bike since you rode in Moab? I've been demo-ing bikes and fell *almost* in love with the 429C this weekend. Loved how quick it felt, but I kept wishing it had just a touch more travel in the back. Would love to hear how you think the two compare now that you've ridden the M4c in some more techy stuff!

    Think I'll be waiting a while until my bike shop has a small to demo, and might just get one on order if I hear some more favorable reviews...

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by tobyrider View Post
    I've been riding a 429c with 120mm fork for a year now; I've taken it to Bend, OR, Breckenridge and all over Texas racing TMBRA so I've experienced a lot of different terrain. The 429c is a great bike, but for me the M4c seems more plush, climbs easier, descends with more confidence and is just more fun; I love the spin up of the small wheels. I went to Moab with a bunch of guys on 29ers and I was out climbing them all week and I didn't notice any disadvantages on rollover. With the exception of Enchilada I think the M4c is a perfect Moab bike (should have put a dropper post on b4 the trip though). There were a few fast approaching rock gardens on Enchilada that I wanted more travel.

    I'm selling my 429c; my stable will be the M4c and Les29. I just don't see a reason to keep the 429c with those two bikes.

    Pivot nailed this bike!
    Sweet - thanks! I think I might have to pull the trigger and order one...

  20. #120
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Quote Originally Posted by tobyrider View Post
    I've been riding a 429c with 120mm fork for a year now; I've taken it to Bend, OR, Breckenridge and all over Texas racing TMBRA so I've experienced a lot of different terrain. The 429c is a great bike, but for me the M4c seems more plush, climbs easier, descends with more confidence and is just more fun; I love the spin up of the small wheels. I went to Moab with a bunch of guys on 29ers and I was out climbing them all week and I didn't notice any disadvantages on rollover. With the exception of Enchilada I think the M4c is a perfect Moab bike (should have put a dropper post on b4 the trip though). There were a few fast approaching rock gardens on Enchilada that I wanted more travel.

    I'm selling my 429c; my stable will be the M4c and Les29. I just don't see a reason to keep the 429c with those two bikes.

    Pivot nailed this bike!
    Always felt the Mach 429 C may need a bit more travel - until recently. I think I recall fox recommended settings are almost 200 psi for my weight which is 225 kitted. I lowered rear shock to 160 and I still get recommended sag and have a very plush ride further emphasized by running 20 psi front and 25 psi back. Have yet to bottom out rear shock.

    I tried the M4 albeit in the parking lot and as a Clyde just felt the bike a bit "slight" if that makes sense. The combination of the steeper downtube, the thinner handlebars, the smaller wheels, just felt less substantive than the Mach 429 - haven't tried one on the trails though but I can comment that I did immediately note the rear suspension feel. Very nice!

  21. #121
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    KRob just posted day two of his annual Outerbike demo reviews (thanks as always Krob!) focused on shorter travel options. Sounds like he wasn't too pumped on how the Mach 4c was setup (90mm stem, narrow bars, no dropper, XC tires). I imagine Pivot needed to settle on an XC race or trail setup and went for the XC race option. He did mention that the 115mm of travel felt like "at least 125mm" (he'd just ridden the 125mm Transition Scout and owns a 125mm 5010/Solo) which is really what I'd be hoping to hear.

    Just pulled the trigger on a large Mach 4 and will likely Pike and DB Inline the thing for my all day trail steed.

  22. #122
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    One thing I don't quite understand is, how come many of the pictures I've seen of M4C's show the RD cable coming out from the upper port on the downtube, if it's supposed to come out from the lower port? Are the people assembling these bikes not aware of this? I mean, it's no big deal but I just don't like cables hanging around...

    (Photo taken from "Stuck in the Spokes - 2014 Outerbike Day 2" )

    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...-15431270956_320e48e3b2_c.jpg
    "I will not relent"

  23. #123
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    Yeah, that's one thing we're adding to the FAQ section of the website, plus we need to make sure all of our dealers know the recommended routing as well....I'm pretty sure that's one of our demo bikes so I'm not sure how the cable got routed that way, but it is a brand new frame so getting everybody up to speed takes a bit (and these were built in a big rush for Interbike...)
    Quote Originally Posted by blatido View Post
    One thing I don't quite understand is, how come many of the pictures I've seen of M4C's show the RD cable coming out from the upper port on the downtube, if it's supposed to come out from the lower port? Are the people assembling these bikes not aware of this? I mean, it's no big deal but I just don't like cables hanging around...

    (Photo taken from "Stuck in the Spokes - 2014 Outerbike Day 2" )

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    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by OriginalDonk View Post

    Just pulled the trigger on a large Mach 4 and will likely Pike and DB Inline the thing for my all day trail steed.
    Perfect! I'd add a short stem <60mm, bars in the 750-760mm range to that and I think this bike would rock. What was amazing to me is that despite the XC build on the demo I rode, I could still see its potential. Keep us updated when you get it.
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  25. #125
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    I am definitely pumped KRob. Scouring the intertubes for a few more reviews and talked to a buddy who had a go with one. Gonna set the Mach 4 up with the same reach as my Mach 6. 50mm stem, 760mm bars, 130mm Pike, Thomson Covert dropper, and some trail rubber (Ardents or Nics).

    I've got the Mach 6 built up on the burlier side of the things. Should be an awesome pair of complimentary bikes. I've been a Pivot guy since my 2009 Pivot Mach 5 aluminum redefined what was possible with a trail bike.

    Thanks again to KRob for taking time to write up the solid reviews. I'll see if I can get my tightwad buddy on a Scout.

  26. #126
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    I pretty have the same exact plan for mine... : )

  27. #127
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    Finally got to throw a leg over one of these after waiting almost 6 months. Was it worth the wait? Well, I'm not canceling my deposit!

    I was only able to ride for about an hour on the Mach 4 due to the rules of the demo (that was a major bumer) but thats all it took to realize this is the bike I have been waiting for. I picked up a Medium blue/black rig with a 60mm stem, 740mm bars, and 2.25 Maxxis tires on alu rims. The geo was spot on for me and I instantly felt comfortable. For record I'm 5'7" with a 29" inseam. I didnt even need to try a small, medium felt perfect.

    I will echo everyones statements when I say this bike is light. It just wants to keep going. Towards the end of my climb I was getting gassed but I just kept pedaling because the bike climbed so damn well. I was able to punch up technical climbs because the bike is so easy to get up to speed. Im comming off a 29er hardtail and this is one of the things I dont like about it. If I get in trouble on a climb I stall and have to dismount. I would honestly say that because of the rear suspension this bike climbs better than my hardtail.

    This bike shines as much descending as it does ascending. I found it took very little body english to get the bike where I wanted it. I let off the brakes and took every bad line I could find. I never felt in trouble nor did I ever overshoot a turn. The Fox 32 fork did feel better in descend on the way down, however. After I figured that out it was nothing but smiles. Another rider commented that the steering felt twitchy but I never felt that way. I was surprised by how exact the steering was for me.

    I'm a little disappointed that Pivot didn't have their bikes set up like this one at Outerbike. I was really looking forward to Krob's review, which wasn't stellar. I didn't feel this bike was overly XC at all. In fact it felt more rugged than the Flux and 5010 I demo'ed.


    My build plans:
    Pike @130
    65mm stem
    740 bars
    Nox Teo's on I-9 hubs

  28. #128
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    One thing to always remember; a demo bike isn't necessarily going to be setup with stock stem because riders request different lengths all the time. I also took the 90mm stem off and ran a 70mm which suited my riding style better. You can always request a different stem length at our demos! Bar width and tire selection is less flexible though, we started putting 740mm bars on the bikes last year but we still get the "too narrow" comments as well as "too wide" so....
    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Finally got to throw a leg over one of these after waiting almost 6 months. Was it worth the wait? Well, I'm not canceling my deposit!

    I was only able to ride for about an hour on the Mach 4 due to the rules of the demo (that was a major bumer) but thats all it took to realize this is the bike I have been waiting for. I picked up a Medium blue/black rig with a 60mm stem, 740mm bars, and 2.25 Maxxis tires on alu rims. The geo was spot on for me and I instantly felt comfortable. For record I'm 5'7" with a 29" inseam. I didnt even need to try a small, medium felt perfect.

    I will echo everyones statements when I say this bike is light. It just wants to keep going. Towards the end of my climb I was getting gassed but I just kept pedaling because the bike climbed so damn well. I was able to punch up technical climbs because the bike is so easy to get up to speed. Im comming off a 29er hardtail and this is one of the things I dont like about it. If I get in trouble on a climb I stall and have to dismount. I would honestly say that because of the rear suspension this bike climbs better than my hardtail.

    This bike shines as much descending as it does ascending. I found it took very little body english to get the bike where I wanted it. I let off the brakes and took every bad line I could find. I never felt in trouble nor did I ever overshoot a turn. The Fox 32 fork did feel better in descend on the way down, however. After I figured that out it was nothing but smiles. Another rider commented that the steering felt twitchy but I never felt that way. I was surprised by how exact the steering was for me.

    I'm a little disappointed that Pivot didn't have their bikes set up like this one at Outerbike. I was really looking forward to Krob's review, which wasn't stellar. I didn't feel this bike was overly XC at all. In fact it felt more rugged than the Flux and 5010 I demo'ed.


    My build plans:
    Pike @130
    65mm stem
    740 bars
    Nox Teo's on I-9 hubs
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  29. #129
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    I would agree Ken, you cant please everyone. I just felt that the set up on this particular bike really accentuated the trail strengths of the bike. It was better than I could have hoped for. I also realize that this is Pivot's XC bike so they need to create a gap between it and the M6 at bigger demo's and shows.

    I just really think that this can be a great trail bike for someone who doesn't want to carry around all that suspension all the time (ie: M6) The 115 in the back felt endless to me. Granted I wasn't doing enduro stuff bro.

  30. #130
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    You can only endure on a blue bike
    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    I would agree Ken, you cant please everyone. I just felt that the set up on this particular bike really accentuated the trail strengths of the bike. It was better than I could have hoped for. I also realize that this is Pivot's XC bike so they need to create a gap between it and the M6 at bigger demo's and shows.

    I just really think that this can be a great trail bike for someone who doesn't want to carry around all that suspension all the time (ie: M6) The 115 in the back felt endless to me. Granted I wasn't doing enduro stuff bro.
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

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    I finally pulled the trigger and ordered a small. Now I just have to survive the wait!

    Thanks everyone who posted reviews here and elsewhere. I knew I wasn't going to get to demo one in my size for a few months, and wanted to get it ordered sooner than later. I do a few XC races a year, and do a LOT of climbing, so I want something light and fast but also want something that will eat up the rocks where I live in the CO mountains a bit better than the 100 mm XC bike I've been riding. From the reviews, it sounds like this could be the PERFECT bike for me. I'm excited.

    Also, thanks to Pivot for offering a girly color choice without making me buy a lame women's specific bike with lesser components. I like pink, I'm not gonna lie

  32. #132
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    Looking forward to demoing this bike this weekend at a fairly rocky trail in town. Unfortunately, they don't have a small on the demo fleet, so I'll probably have to try the XS (I'm 5'5.5ish). I'll post up a review after I ride it.

  33. #133
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    So I'm hearing all these great things about this bike. Is it/how much better is it than the '12 alloy Mach 4? How much lighter? I have an alloy M4 and carbon M6 and was thinkin' I may have to have all carbon bikes (carbon Colnago also). Love the M4 but need someone to tell me they've ridden both M4's and that the carbon, 27.5"-legged one is that much better. Someone please tell me!

  34. #134
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    Didn't get a chance to try this bike at the demo, unfortunately. XS was too small, and the medium was pretty much consistently out. I did try and like the Mach 6, but it's alot of bike.

  35. #135
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    Hello everybody.

    I am an alien here since I am a diehard Santa Cruz fun. I own a carbon Blur and a carbon Highball. Honestly the 29" wheel does not rock my boat as much as I though it would and I find it more fun riding the 26er Blur. Recently I rode a rental 27.5 SC 5010. I really liked the 27.5 wheels. However here in Michigan all one needs is 100mm of suspension. So it looks like the only two 27.5 rigs that I know of that fit my bill are Giant Anthem 27.5 and the Mach 4C. Most of the people here are leaning more towards the trail setup of this bike. I was wondering if anybody rode it with 100mm suspension and 90-100 mm stem and narrower handle bars. I am looking for a XC setup experience.

  36. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by kk2 View Post
    Hello everybody.

    I am an alien here since I am a diehard Santa Cruz fun. I own a carbon Blur and a carbon Highball. Honestly the 29" wheel does not rock my boat as much as I though it would and I find it more fun riding the 26er Blur. Recently I rode a rental 27.5 SC 5010. I really liked the 27.5 wheels. However here in Michigan all one needs is 100mm of suspension. So it looks like the only two 27.5 rigs that I know of that fit my bill are Giant Anthem 27.5 and the Mach 4C. Most of the people here are leaning more towards the trail setup of this bike. I was wondering if anybody rode it with 100mm suspension and 90-100 mm stem and narrower handle bars. I am looking for a XC setup experience.
    Hey I live in Michigan as well. And though we only need 100mm of suspension going up to 125-130mm of travel is not a big issue these days. I guess unless you race and are trying to get your bike under 22lbs. I own an Ibis Ripley which has 120mm of travel and love it. Where do you ride? My favorite trail is Pontiac Lake. I live in the suburbs of Detroit. If I didn't own the Ripley I'd be grabbing a Pivot Mach 4C. However I might be able to pick up an Ibis HDR650b with the XT kit for $4000 and if I can I am going to grab it. It is a 130mm travel bike, which might be overkill and overlap with my Ripley, but I don't care. Have always wanted that bike.

    I also have heard tremendous praise from a few guys I know who ride the Giant Advanced Anthem 1. That bike rocks. Fast, light and great suspension. Good luck on your search.

  37. #137
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    You picked a medium with a height of 5'7". The Pivot recommended range for medium is 5'8" to 6' Curious because I am 5'6" and was going to just order a small, but now I am not sure if I should go for a medium.

  38. #138
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    pivot makes nice looking bikes but the mach 4 looks ugly. too much swoopy swoop in the frame imho. mach 6 on the other hand is sexy. my personal opinion only.

  39. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by nexttozen View Post
    pivot makes nice looking bikes but the mach 4 looks ugly. too much swoopy swoop in the frame imho. mach 6 on the other hand is sexy. my personal opinion only.
    Never thought of it but after you mentioned it went and looked at one online and you have a point.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by beagle249 View Post
    You picked a medium with a height of 5'7". The Pivot recommended range for medium is 5'8" to 6' Curious because I am 5'6" and was going to just order a small, but now I am not sure if I should go for a medium.
    I had already demo'ed a small and medium 429c and felt "in between" both sizes. When the numbers for the M4C came out I compared the 2 and the M4C seemed like it would fit a smaller rider. Then the suggested size specs came out and the medium was recommended for a bit smaller rider. I think most of their mediums are for 5'9". Once I got on the medium I felt right at home. Didn't even have to try the small. The stand over clearance goes a long way for making this bike feel smaller.

    If you can, demo one or even try one in a parking lot. I know it's hard with a bike that's this rare. Even trying a mach 6 in the parking lot and comparing numbers will give you something to go by.

  41. #141
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    Well, I get to ride just about everything we make and the new Mach 4C is definitely more of a "do everything" bike than the original version. I absolutely loved that bike as well but it was a handful when things got steep and techy. The new version is much more relaxed in those situations while still retaining the snappy feel that makes the M4 so fast. Weight is going to depend on how crazy you want to go with the build kit as well as frame size but getting a Med bike to come in at 23 lbs isn't all that hard to do. One of the show bikes we built up was the same weight as my large Les 27.5 with XO1 build....
    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    So I'm hearing all these great things about this bike. Is it/how much better is it than the '12 alloy Mach 4? How much lighter? I have an alloy M4 and carbon M6 and was thinkin' I may have to have all carbon bikes (carbon Colnago also). Love the M4 but need someone to tell me they've ridden both M4's and that the carbon, 27.5"-legged one is that much better. Someone please tell me!
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  42. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    Well, I get to ride just about everything we make and the new Mach 4C is definitely more of a "do everything" bike than the original version. I absolutely loved that bike as well but it was a handful when things got steep and techy. The new version is much more relaxed in those situations while still retaining the snappy feel that makes the M4 so fast. Weight is going to depend on how crazy you want to go with the build kit as well as frame size but getting a Med bike to come in at 23 lbs isn't all that hard to do. One of the show bikes we built up was the same weight as my large Les 27.5 with XO1 build....
    Ken...any idea what the XT and XTR/XT Pro models are weighing in at? Thanks.

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    I've been thinking that too, actually. I've a Mach 6 and it looks mean/badass and an alloy Mach 4 that looks sleek and fast, but the Mach 4c looks kinda, well, bloaty and swoopy, for lack of better words. Or maybe pregnant. Doesn't help that all the pic's on Pivot have the grips way above the saddle, like a comfort bike. But looks don't matter, right?

  44. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    One thing to always remember; a demo bike isn't necessarily going to be setup with stock stem because riders request different lengths all the time. I also took the 90mm stem off and ran a 70mm which suited my riding style better. You can always request a different stem length at our demos!.
    That's good to know. I should've asked for a 60 or 70. I agree with Dickbrown's review and while I liked the M4 even with the "too XC" set up I could certainly see past that to appreciate what a fun trail ripper this could be with a few tire and cockpit tweaks.
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  45. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by procos View Post
    Hey I live in Michigan as well. And though we only need 100mm of suspension going up to 125-130mm of travel is not a big issue these days. I guess unless you race and are trying to get your bike under 22lbs. I own an Ibis Ripley which has 120mm of travel and love it. Where do you ride? My favorite trail is Pontiac Lake. I live in the suburbs of Detroit. If I didn't own the Ripley I'd be grabbing a Pivot Mach 4C. However I might be able to pick up an Ibis HDR650b with the XT kit for $4000 and if I can I am going to grab it. It is a 130mm travel bike, which might be overkill and overlap with my Ripley, but I don't care. Have always wanted that bike.
    Hi procos. Yes I ride pontiac quite a bit. Probably seen you there once or twice. Actually you said the key words here "unless you want a 22lb bike". That is one of the reasons I want 100mm suspension. Another is pedaling efficiency when one stands up on the climbs. If you are on this forum than you probably read the MMBA forum. And if so then you might have seen my recent rather long comparison of 29 vs 26. Hence my interest in 27.5

  46. #146
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    I'll have to see about weighing one of the demo bikes when I can get my hands on one (yeah, they're in short supply at Pivot HQ as well...)
    Quote Originally Posted by ltspd1 View Post
    Ken...any idea what the XT and XTR/XT Pro models are weighing in at? Thanks.
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  47. #147
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    I do agree that it looks crazy swoopy but that's due to the dramatically dropped top tube which gives the bike an immense amount of stand over. Looking at pics of the Med proto I was riding is crazy, it looks like I have 2 feet of seat post sticking out! You won't notice it when you're riding though
    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    I've been thinking that too, actually. I've a Mach 6 and it looks mean/badass and an alloy Mach 4 that looks sleek and fast, but the Mach 4c looks kinda, well, bloaty and swoopy, for lack of better words. Or maybe pregnant. Doesn't help that all the pic's on Pivot have the grips way above the saddle, like a comfort bike. But looks don't matter, right?
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  48. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenbentit View Post
    I'll have to see about weighing one of the demo bikes when I can get my hands on one (yeah, they're in short supply at Pivot HQ as well...)
    Thanks much.

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    Fork Questions

    Alright guys and gals, and Ken especially,

    Help me out here. I'm trying to get the build to my bike shop as my M4C should be shipping in a month. ugh. Anyway, I want to get some opinions on Forks.

    Does anyone know the A2C measurement of the 2015 Fox 32 120mm forks? I cant find it. Seems the damping has been upgraded but I still think I want to go Pike to make this more of a trail bike.

    My question is how will the difference in the A2C plus the difference in offset (42mm pike vs 44mm OEM Fox 32 and recommended offset) affect the steering?

    From everything I have read less offset equals slower steering. But will I even be able to tell 2mm difference in offset?

  50. #150
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    Dang, I'm on vacation for a few days so I won't be able to get that measurement until next week. The A2C variance will make the head angle slacker (for a taller A2C) or steeper (shorter A2C). How much it changes is dependent on that variance. As for being noticeable, just changing a fork's travel by 10mm is immediately apparent to most riders. Small changes in the overall cockpit geometry can drastically effect how a bike feels. As for the 2mm offset change, I'm not really sure about that one as I don't usually get to spend much time on anything other than Fox forks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Alright guys and gals, and Ken especially,

    Help me out here. I'm trying to get the build to my bike shop as my M4C should be shipping in a month. ugh. Anyway, I want to get some opinions on Forks.

    Does anyone know the A2C measurement of the 2015 Fox 32 120mm forks? I cant find it. Seems the damping has been upgraded but I still think I want to go Pike to make this more of a trail bike.

    My question is how will the difference in the A2C plus the difference in offset (42mm pike vs 44mm OEM Fox 32 and recommended offset) affect the steering?

    From everything I have read less offset equals slower steering. But will I even be able to tell 2mm difference in offset?
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  51. #151
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    Thanks Ken. Enjoy your vacation! Im sure someone here will now the A2C height.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Alright guys and gals, and Ken especially,

    Help me out here. I'm trying to get the build to my bike shop as my M4C should be shipping in a month. ugh. Anyway, I want to get some opinions on Forks.

    Does anyone know the A2C measurement of the 2015 Fox 32 120mm forks? I cant find it. Seems the damping has been upgraded but I still think I want to go Pike to make this more of a trail bike.

    My question is how will the difference in the A2C plus the difference in offset (42mm pike vs 44mm OEM Fox 32 and recommended offset) affect the steering?

    From everything I have read less offset equals slower steering. But will I even be able to tell 2mm difference in offset?
    All Specification Sheets | Bike Help Center | FOX

  53. #153
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    Thanks Maindog.

    Now here is a clearer picture. Can someone tell me how a Pike will change the ride characteristics please...

    Fox 32 120mm - A2C=507.7mm 44mm offset (OEM from Pivot, which I have ridden)
    VS.
    Pike 130mm - A2C=552mm 42mm offset

    Seems to me that the loss in offset would slow down the steering. The added A2C would further slacken the bike. How much? I just dont know how this would translate to real world ridding experience.

  54. #154
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    I think you may want to double check your Pike A2C. A 150mm Pike has an A2C of 542. Bump that down to 130mm you're looking at 522.

    A 130mm Fox 32 has an A2C of 517 so you'er looking at 5mm of difference when comparing both at 130.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Thanks Maindog.

    Now here is a clearer picture. Can someone tell me how a Pike will change the ride characteristics please...

    Fox 32 120mm - A2C=507.7mm 44mm offset (OEM from Pivot, which I have ridden)
    VS.
    Pike 130mm - A2C=552mm 42mm offset

    Seems to me that the loss in offset would slow down the steering. The added A2C would further slacken the bike. How much? I just dont know how this would translate to real world ridding experience.
    Thank you!!!

  56. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by OriginalDonk View Post
    I think you may want to double check your Pike A2C. A 150mm Pike has an A2C of 542. Bump that down to 130mm you're looking at 522.

    A 130mm Fox 32 has an A2C of 517 so you'er looking at 5mm of difference when comparing both at 130.

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    Thanks for that! So that 5mm of height should cancel out 2mm of offset loss. Or, I won't even notice.

  57. #157
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    It'll actually go the same way. You lose 2mm of offset and have a 5mm of increase in A2C, both of which will "slow" down the steering.

    In my humble opinion I feel that these differences are in the noise of the numbers. People don't lose their mind swapping out a Fox fork for a Rock Shox after they lose those 2mm of offset. I'd suggest taking A2C numbers with a huge truckload of salt and use them for general high level comparison. Actual A2C is a function of many things (e.g. fork sag, tire height, etc.).

    On paper running the Pike will change your steering a bit. Some may say it'll "turn slower" while others may say it'll be "more stable." Shrewd riders may be able to pick up on the subtle difference but it's by no means a game changer.

    I'm also in your position and my plan is to grab a fork (probably a 130mm Pike) and go ride.
    Last edited by OriginalDonk; 10-30-2014 at 09:41 PM.

  58. #158
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    FWIW my Pike set at 130mm due to go on a Mach 4C has an A2C of 515mm

  59. #159
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    Going off of Tahic's measurement you're looking at about 7mm increase in A2C and 2mm loss in offset.

    I think that bar width and stem length will have a much greater impact on how your ride feels than these subtle changes.

    See if your shop can throw on a few different stem lengths for you before you settle on one you pay for. It's amazing what losing 10mm in stem length will do to the handling.

  60. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by OriginalDonk View Post
    I'm also in your position and my plan is to grab a fork (probably a 130mm Pike) and go ride.
    Point taken.

    Now, about that 130mm Pike. Ive seen a few online places claiming to sell a 130mm version. I know 5010's now come with them OEM. However, on the Sram website there is no mention of a 130mm 27.5 fork. Are the online shops legit? Or did/are you guys just lower a 150mm.

  61. #161
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    I think they originally started as OEM options for Santa Cruz and Rock Shox has realized there's wider demand. You're looking for part number FK7743. Your shop should be able to call SRAM and order it directly.

    SRAM receives all their forks at 150mm I believe (maybe 160mm) and they swap in the required air shaft to bump down travel.

    I think at this point they may only be doing that on request. Should be an awesome setup.

  62. #162
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    Thanks Donk. I am meeting up with my shop on monday to finalize the build so I will have them call SRAM for sure.

    Now to figure out my drivetrain. Im a 2X guy and there is no chance I am waiting on the new XTR. I dont think we will see any of those until 2015.

  63. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Thanks Donk. I am meeting up with my shop on monday to finalize the build so I will have them call SRAM for sure.

    Now to figure out my drivetrain. Im a 2X guy and there is no chance I am waiting on the new XTR. I dont think we will see any of those until 2015.
    I am willing to wait for the XTR Di2 build. One of the best features of this bike IMO is the full Di2 integration. I live in the SF Bay Area where my rides can be long stretches of coastal flat then head up into the mountains for some steep climbs. For that reason I'm gonna go for the 2x to give me the range I need and probably just use one shifter with the "Synchro" feature.

    Anybody thinking of putting a dropper on one of these? How about tire size? I am thinking of going 2.4 Maxxis Ardent for the front. I know the rear tire size is limited due to tight chainstay...just not sure what the max size is. I am less concerned with speed and more on comfort & control at my age of soon to be 58 years old!

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    I like the concept of the Di2, but I just can't see spending 400-600 bucks (or however much it will cost) to replace when something in the trail like a stick or rock takes out my rear derailleur. Maybe on smoother areas, but I ride too many rock gardens/not incredibly well groomed trails around here.

  65. #165
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    If I were in your position Beagle I'd wait for that XTR Di2 as well and go with the syncro feature. I've heard great things about Shimano Di2 products but have carefully maintained my ignorance and therefore my state of bliss.

    I think an Ardent up front and something like an Ikon or Ardent Race rear would do really well in the Bay Area (also what Yeti is specing for the SB5C). One thing I like about Maxxis is I can swap out tires with different compounds for different seasons or uses. You can run the stickier 3C Ikon or Ardent Race out back and then try a a 2.25 dual compound Ardent for a more durable setup if you have pavement between you and a trailhead (e.g. Tamarancho).

    My Mach 4 frame is about two weeks out. I'll be running a Thomson Covert dropper on it. Looking for a super snappy trail bike to make less nasty trails more interesting.

  66. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by beagle249 View Post
    I am willing to wait for the XTR Di2 build. One of the best features of this bike IMO is the full Di2 integration. I live in the SF Bay Area where my rides can be long stretches of coastal flat then head up into the mountains for some steep climbs. For that reason I'm gonna go for the 2x to give me the range I need and probably just use one shifter with the "Synchro" feature.

    Anybody thinking of putting a dropper on one of these? How about tire size? I am thinking of going 2.4 Maxxis Ardent for the front. I know the rear tire size is limited due to tight chainstay...just not sure what the max size is. I am less concerned with speed and more on comfort & control at my age of soon to be 58 years old!

    If you can wait, all the better. Everything I have heard has been spring of 2015 for those builds. I feel like I have been trying to figure this out for so long, I'd rather not wait for components that might be finicky in the first batch. Plus I am pretty hard on my equipment as it is.

    I am going to go XT package with Next SL 2X cranks and upgrade to the new shite when the time is right.

  67. #167
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    Oh ya, the largest rear tire the Mach 4 can run is a 2.3. I'm sure we will all try to cram more rubber in there. But that is for a later thread.

  68. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by OriginalDonk View Post
    If I were in your position Beagle I'd wait for that XTR Di2 as well and go with the syncro feature. I've heard great things about Shimano Di2 products but have carefully maintained my ignorance and therefore my state of bliss.

    I think an Ardent up front and something like an Ikon or Ardent Race rear would do really well in the Bay Area (also what Yeti is specing for the SB5C). One thing I like about Maxxis is I can swap out tires with different compounds for different seasons or uses. You can run the stickier 3C Ikon or Ardent Race out back and then try a a 2.25 dual compound Ardent for a more durable setup if you have pavement between you and a trailhead (e.g. Tamarancho).

    My Mach 4 frame is about two weeks out. I'll be running a Thomson Covert dropper on it. Looking for a super snappy trail bike to make less nasty trails more interesting.
    I'll be interested to get your feedback on the bike after you have done some rides. I've got to be patient since I won't be seeing mine for many months.

  69. #169
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    Got some bad news today...

    LBS called to tell me my delivery date was moved back to January. He also said that Chris (owner) has flown to Asia to check on production.

    I should have seen it comming. At the demo I asked about availability and the guy said he couldn't say. What he did say was that they had been having some QC issues with the Mach 4. I think we saw a first batch get out and now we are backed up. Anyone else hearing this?

    I feel like if it gets pushed back once, it will get pushed again...

    Might be time to jump ship. For me at least. I have already been looking for a long time with one of these on order for 2 months now.

  70. #170
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    Here in the UK I've been given a POSSIBLE delivery date of January 2015. When I contacted Pivot they reckoned that January 2015 was a reasonable guesstimate !
    While I'd really like a Mach4 Carbon a possible date some time in the distant future isn't quite what I'd be looking for.

  71. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    Got some bad news today...

    Might be time to jump ship. For me at least. I have already been looking for a long time with one of these on order for 2 months now.
    Personally, I'm hoping it will start snowing here soon, so that I'll be too busy riding my fatbike to notice that I'm waiting forever for my Mach 4!!

    I just want it in time for next race season. I was really hoping it would show up and be an awesome Christmas present, but I've also been preparing myself to not get the thing until Feb/Mar.

  72. #172
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    I'm sure the wait will be worth it. Personally everytime I sit on my beat up hardtail I cry a little. I have been waiting a year. I'm done with waiting.

    More from the rumor mill - I had an online retailer speculate that they could have as many as 1200 backorders already. Yikes.

  73. #173
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    My buddy just got his xo1 with the carbon wheels etc... pretty much top of the line. I wonder if pivot is shipping the high dollar builds out first? I do the same. I have a x1 med black/red build on order since July I hope I see it in 2015. I really wanted a frame set but I would have to wait til 2019.

    There's always a nice wait on the good bikes!! keeps the resale value up.

  74. #174
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    any one ride this bike and the CZAR from Turner? I know the two are different wheel sizes but they seem similar in weight and travel. Both look pretty nice

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    Yes, I've ridden both recently. I decided on the Czar - for me, if I'm trying to fill the XC/trail niche, a 29er seems appropriate. That, and Dave Turner is the real deal. CC...I don't know????

  76. #176
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    I had a chance to ride med. for about 10 min. it had new Shimano 11 speed. The bike was light, about 25lbs with flat pedals has fox 32mm fork. Front end compared to my med. 429c with pike 120mm fork, Sram XX1 felt very light. I like the feel of my Pike better but 10 min. on bike tells you nothing. If I were to get one it would be large, I'm 5'10 with long upper body. The med. felt small to me, I would built it more burly with Pike fork, wider carbon rims and tires.
    The Shimano 11 speed was nice but I think it should have 42 tooth instead of 40, but XX1 is the one thing I like from Sram, besides the Pike. Pike transformed my 429c.

  77. #177
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Looks like mine will be here next week!!!🙉 I have a fox 34 from my m6 was told that since it's a 2014 model I can't lower it more than 10mm can anyone confirm this? Would love to run the m4 at 130.

    Also I plan to run a rock razor 2.35 rear and hd up front would this setup fit?






    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    I'm sure the wait will be worth it. Personally everytime I sit on my beat up hardtail I cry a little. I have been waiting a year. I'm done with waiting.

    More from the rumor mill - I had an online retailer speculate that they could have as many as 1200 backorders already. Yikes.
    I was in a local shop which I hadn't visited before and looked at the LES and they had a Large Mach 4C on the floor. I asked about a Mach 4C in Med and he said he thought he could get one. Later that day, he called and said that a Med stealth/red with XX-1 build was on it's way to him if I wanted it. Will pick it up Tues or Wed after he swaps out the wheels for some Enve 50-50's. Should be fun, I'll post back after a few rides. Hopefully it'll be better for the local trails than my Mach 6.

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    That should be killer!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by nmadse1 View Post
    Yes, I've ridden both recently. I decided on the Czar - for me, if I'm trying to fill the XC/trail niche, a 29er seems appropriate. That, and Dave Turner is the real deal. CC...I don't know????
    CC is what, then, in your opinion?
    Supply Side Jesusnomisist

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    I'm not insinuating anything. I don't know cc. I've never met him.

    I have, however, met David Turner and spoken with him on numerous occasions. He's down to earth, extremely knowledgeable, and doesn't come across as a salesman. He's the kind of guy you want to support and buy a bike from, rather than find a good deal on ebay.

  82. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by nmadse1 View Post
    I'm not insinuating anything. I don't know cc. I've never met him.

    I have, however, met David Turner and spoken with him on numerous occasions. He's down to earth, extremely knowledgeable, and doesn't come across as a salesman. He's the kind of guy you want to support and buy a bike from, rather than find a good deal on ebay.
    I've never met either, and I've never ridden a Turner. I'm sure they're great bikes and Dave is a great guy. I will say that based on my experience riding bikes that Chris Cocalis has designed, the man is a suspension mastermind. My Racer-X is phenomenal, and nothing out there has convinced me to upgrade until Chris came out with the Mach 4 Carbon. The proof is in the pudding, as they say, and Chris is known for designing bikes with incredibly efficient rear suspension without relying on the crutch of shock platforms. The only reason I'd buy one of his bikes on eBay is because they don't make the Racer-X anymore

  83. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    I was in a local shop which I hadn't visited before and looked at the LES and they had a Large Mach 4C on the floor. I asked about a Mach 4C in Med and he said he thought he could get one. Later that day, he called and said that a Med stealth/red with XX-1 build was on it's way to him if I wanted it. Will pick it up Tues or Wed after he swaps out the wheels for some Enve 50-50's. Should be fun, I'll post back after a few rides. Hopefully it'll be better for the local trails than my Mach 6.
    Sweet-looking foward to pics and ride report!
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  84. #184
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    Bump

  85. #185
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    Ride report to come:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...-img_1128.jpg  


  86. #186
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    Nice build Bman! Red and white accents against the black looks sharp. Next cranks. Enve wheels. Should be killer.
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  87. #187
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    Mach 4 Carbon

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    Ride report to come:
    BEAUTIFUL, pls do let us know how it rides, asap!

  88. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by BmanInTheD View Post
    Ride report to come:
    Sooooooo.... Report???

  89. #189
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...



    It's sexy!! Can't believe I got one before Christmas I preorder in July. Still need to lower the 34 and do a few things. Plan is 24lbs with a dropper trail build to race xc and do a few 100 mile beat downs.

    I love my mach6 and all the new sweet enduro bikes but this is were it's at. This is the flow bike👊.


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  90. #190
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...



    My buddies bike so it looks like pivots got them Rollin in he also has a mach 429 and prefers the m4!


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  91. #191
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    Pivot Mach 4 Carbon vs Santa Cruz 5010 Carbon for XC/Trail... Thoughts?

    I live in San Diego. My current MTB is a Trek/Fisher Superfly 100 29er. I don't love it. I don't like it for steep climbs -- front end feels tall and wheel wanders off line. For steep uphill trails I actually prefer my 650b road bike (Rawland Stag with Compass 42mm slick tires) vs the Superfly. I have several 650b road & monstercross bikes and have an itch to get a 650b MTB.

    I demoed a Santa Cruz 5010c and liked it. Climbed better than my Superfly and was fun in twisty singletrack. The wide bars felt odd to me since I am used to old school XC setup.

    Anyways, interested in hearing opinions on 5010c vs this bike, pros and cons, from folks who have ridden both. "XC+" application, SoCal trails. Thanks!
    Last edited by dyg2001; 12-14-2014 at 12:51 PM.

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    The biggest factor is dw link absolutely destroys vpp.

  93. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by dyg2001 View Post
    Pivot Mach 4 Carbon vs Santa Cruz 5010 Carbon for XC/Trail... Thoughts?

    I live in San Diego. My current MTB is a Trek/Fisher Superfly 100 29er. I don't love it. I don't like it for steep climbs -- front end feels tall and wheel wanders off line. For steep uphill trails I actually prefer my 650b road bike (Rawland Stag with Compass Babyshoe Pass 42mm slick tires) vs the Superfly. I have 3 650b road & monstercross bikes and have an itch to get a 650b MTB.

    I demoed a Santa Cruz 5010c and liked it. Climbed better than my Superfly. The wide bars felt odd to me since I am used to old school XC setup.

    Anyways, interested in hearing opinions on 5010c vs this bike, pros and cons, from folks who have ridden both. "XC+" application, SoCal trails. Thanks!
    I've demo'ed both bikes and found the 5010 to be a plusher suspension than the M4C. The Pivot just begged me to keep clicking down to go faster. Plus, Pivot handled really well downhill as compared to my Anthem and Burner. It could easily replace both for the trails (OH, AZ, PA, NC) that I ride.

  94. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by dyg2001 View Post
    Pivot Mach 4 Carbon vs Santa Cruz 5010 Carbon for XC/Trail... Thoughts?

    I live in San Diego. My current MTB is a Trek/Fisher Superfly 100 29er. I don't love it. I don't like it for steep climbs -- front end feels tall and wheel wanders off line. For steep uphill trails I actually prefer my 650b road bike (Rawland Stag with Compass Babyshoe Pass 42mm slick tires) vs the Superfly. I have 3 650b road & monstercross bikes and have an itch to get a 650b MTB.

    I demoed a Santa Cruz 5010c and liked it. Climbed better than my Superfly. The wide bars felt odd to me since I am used to old school XC setup.

    Anyways, interested in hearing opinions on 5010c vs this bike, pros and cons, from folks who have ridden both. "XC+" application, SoCal trails. Thanks!

    I have demoed both. The 5010 I have about 60 miles on and the Mach 4c I have only 1 ride on, so take it for what its worth.

    The M4c is a fast bike, It floats uphill, really. With some meatier tires and a bigger fork you would have no problem with a capable trail bike. I will say it might take a bit more finesse on the downhills though. I felt a bit bounced around in moderate chunk due to the bike being built primarily for XC duties.

    The 5010 (to me) felt heavy going up. Not unbearable but your not winning any race to the top. However, going down the 5010 feels much more monster truck ish. The bike just feels bigger.

    The 2 main differences in these bikes is suspension and geo. Personally I could never get the 5010 to feel good as I have a long torso.

  95. #195
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    Like to get some feedback on how plush you can make the M4C and how the ride compares between the "Trail" & "XC" shock settings.

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    I got to spend a couple of months testing shocks on the M4 and the differences between Trail & XC are pretty significant. I tried running in "pure" setup on Trail & Race sag setting as well as in between the 2. Trail definitely has a more plush feel, not DH bike soft but it didn't hold me back on the rough stuff. Race was noticeably firmer, much more snap coming out of corners and pushing hard uphill but you feel more trail feedback as well. I preferred the Trail sag for my everyday riding but could see using the Race for smoother rides or XC racing. The bike is surprisingly plush, I was even able to ride some sections just as fast as I normally do on my Firebird while still retaining the fast acceleration that the 4 is known for. I did try setting the bike up in a super plush setup (smaller air volume reducer, shock in Descend mode) and while it was VERY plush it seemed to take away the fun factor quite a lot. The stock settings we settled on for the suspension are the result of lots of test riding and we feel it gives riders the best of both worlds, plush feel while still being a true XC race bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by beagle249 View Post
    Like to get some feedback on how plush you can make the M4C and how the ride compares between the "Trail" & "XC" shock settings.
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    So given you build (Im similar) You going for a Mach 4? Or...???
    Quote Originally Posted by Dickbrown View Post
    I have demoed both. The 5010 I have about 60 miles on and the Mach 4c I have only 1 ride on, so take it for what its worth.

    The M4c is a fast bike, It floats uphill, really. With some meatier tires and a bigger fork you would have no problem with a capable trail bike. I will say it might take a bit more finesse on the downhills though. I felt a bit bounced around in moderate chunk due to the bike being built primarily for XC duties.

    The 5010 (to me) felt heavy going up. Not unbearable but your not winning any race to the top. However, going down the 5010 feels much more monster truck ish. The bike just feels bigger.

    The 2 main differences in these bikes is suspension and geo. Personally I could never get the 5010 to feel good as I have a long torso.

  98. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by dyg2001 View Post
    Pivot Mach 4 Carbon vs Santa Cruz 5010 Carbon for XC/Trail... Thoughts?

    Anyways, interested in hearing opinions on 5010c vs this bike, pros and cons, from folks who have ridden both. "XC+" application, SoCal trails. Thanks!
    Like Ken said, the M4 is surprisingly plush given its travel. With the right fork, tires, bar/stem etc it should feel quite capable on the XC+ to full on Trail/light AM type conditions.

    I own a 5010c and have ridden the M4c and I think they are quite comparable. Like someone else said, the M4 may have the advantage on pure XC and being fast on smoother climbs and flatter rolling sections, but the 5010c may be a bit more plush/capable on the steeper, rougher descents.

    What wheels were on the 5010 you tested Dickbrown? The stock i23 wheels with HRII tires are fairly heavy. I haven't ridden the 5010 with lighter/stiffer carbon wheels and lighter tires, but I bet that would help the climbing and acceleration quite a bit.

    I may com to fit dyg2001. The 5010 is a little short given today's preferred geometry of longer front center. I think the tt and reach are a little longer on the M4c (I haven't checked the numbers).

    Someone else was asking about the Czar vs M4: I've also ridden the Czar and with a more XC+ set up on the M4 I would also group these as having similar ride characteristics. Light, fast, efficient but with some decent crossover into more technical terrain especially with a 120 fork on the Czar.
    Last edited by KRob; 12-15-2014 at 12:39 PM.
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  99. #199
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    Early Mach 4 Carbon Reviews...

    Thanks for the info.

    I test rode a size L M4C in a parking lot and I think it fits me better than the size L 5010 as I am 6' with relatively short legs.

    I'm pretty much set on buying a M4C now; just trying to decide on parts. Unfortunately it seems that M4Cs with the new XTR mechanical and di2 kits won't be shipping for a while.

    Is there anything special about the Fox 32 Kashima fork that comes with the Pivot build kits? I asked a dealer about upgrading to a Pike 130 and he replied he couldn't do a fork swap because the Fox 32 was "Pivot-tuned". Is that true?


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  100. #200
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    I'm sure that it true, put the Pike at 130mm would be the perfect fork. It sucks they don't allow you to swap forks out, Ibis you can !! Pivot has a very close relationship with Fox so the Loyalty thing prevents them from using the Pike. They also want keep the weight down thus the 32mm fork compared to 35mm from Pike. I would go with Sram XO1 the prices have come down considerably, rear derail. only 189.00 now. 42 tooth cassette, no 40 like Shimano why would you only design a 40 tooth Shimano!!

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