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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by calboy View Post
    I'd love to................and throw a tire pump in his spokes!
    Well would be quite a catty behaviour. . He's also jerk but doesn't permission you to attack a person. And potentially damage a pretty bike!

    I was expecting responses like Yes I'd go for a ride with him/No, he has sunk in my eyes too low./ Maybe... ect. But not an act as a friend and attack when not looking. That's just childish.

    I apologise if you've met your post as a satire.

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter View Post
    Question for those who follow road racing Closely. Please, in your honest opinion, name the last rider to win the TDF Clean, no PEDs.

    I would like to think Cadel won clean, but he met with Lance's doping doctor Ferrari in 2000, he does seem to suffer much more than the rest of the GC leaders, still doubtful.

    I have to go back to 1990, Greg Lemond.
    Why do you think Lemond is cleaner than Wiggins? Neither have tested positive for band substances and testing now is much much stricter.

    I thought this was an interesting article about how riders power to weight ratio in the TdF is going down as bike technology and sports medicine is improving which implies it's cleaner than it once was (it's pretty subjective though).

    BBC News - Tour de France: Are drug-free cyclists slower?

  3. #303
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    Upset Forgive or forget

    In the past when celebrities, sports people or politicians transgress and then come out and apologise it is our nature to say "Oh well he seems to want to make amends and we should give them the benefit of our forgiveness."

    Let's not forget. He will, as another suggested, probably go back to work in the foundation and regardless of all that he looses as a result of all this still live a very good life and begin to put back the pieces.

    In the end it is his journey and 'this scandal' is just a small blip in what has been a very good life, just not a life well lived. He probably will be a better person for having to suffer this humiliation, and there are many out there that won't judge him harshly, sycophants are like that, he will bounce back.

    More is the pity. What about all those along the way that were trodden on, bullied and whose lives were scarred by his unrelenting ego? That damage has been done and his apology won't make them feel any better. What about the thousands of athletes who devoted their lives to honest competition? Do they get any compensation for having been robbed of their efforts?

    He can piss off.

  4. #304
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    This has gone beyond being about Lance, it's now become about creating a clean path for future athletes. There's no place for Lance in it, he veered off long ago.

  5. #305
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    just my take. i didn't watch it so...

    everyone involved from the beginning were and are adults. they ALL didn't give a sh*t til someone turned up the heat and the moneygrab was becoming more and more in jeopardy. Lance turned on those people. Is that really a big surprise? really? I've been helping you win by cheating myself and I'm not gonna expect you to go into self-preservation mode when i do when we all get busted, knowing full well from the very beginning along the way every aspect and outcome? that's classic shyte when we would get into trouble as kids. he did it..no, he did it, he made me do it, nah unh, liar, you're a liar..

    i'm not a fanboi, never been but expecting him to show any different character as the one that's been on the podium defying and denying for 7 consecutive yrs is completely unrealistic. expecting any kind or hint of atonement on oprah is laughable.

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbco1975 View Post
    Why do you think Lemond is cleaner than Wiggins? Neither have tested positive for band substances and testing now is much much stricter.

    I thought this was an interesting article about how riders power to weight ratio in the TdF is going down as bike technology and sports medicine is improving which implies it's cleaner than it once was (it's pretty subjective though).

    BBC News - Tour de France: Are drug-free cyclists slower?

    1. I've watched old footage of the TDFs back to mid 80s, during Lemonds wins, the pace was much slower, much more suffering, bonking, riders on their faces. It seemed legit, in my opinion.

    2. Team Sky's Performance was classic USPS, Wiggins, Froome, Roche, Rogers all tearing a$$ ! team doctor Geert Leinders was implicated as running Rabobank's program, lot's of sketchy...

    You're right testing is better, and it's becoming cleaner, but not clean IMO. Testing is always behind. The Bio Passport is helping, but not fullproof, it actually allows for micro blood boosting with the range a riders hematocrit level can be.
    Last edited by snowdrifter; 01-18-2013 at 10:27 AM.
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  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    How do we know he was a terrific athlete because he was doping...
    lets see... because he was training while undergoing cancer treatment and because even doping (many pros do, he is just on the spotlight) most Tour de France cyclists wouldn't make it 1 time, let alone 7.
    I really don't understand why people is so surprised. Maybe they are too naive and live in a bubble.
    These are PRO. That means that if you win you get money, send your kid to college and be able to continue eating when you are old. They don't have a carreer or trade. They have a very limited sport "span". They don't ride for "fun" and they don't do it for health, they do it to win and that is called being a PRO.
    It would be nice if everyone would play nice and the field would be leveled but is not.
    That is it
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  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by calboy View Post
    I truly believe that because of Lance's story of achievement - near defeat - comeback; it generated soooo much media attention and MONEY through the years that the cycling community turned a blind eye. He was too big to fail. They could've took him down anytime they wanted to. Just think of all the people who got caught cheating while Lance just kept on riding.
    It was the same with Tiger Woods and all his indiscrections. Too many people making too much money. Nobody wants to cook the goose that laid the golden egg. But Tigers indiscrections were in his private life and he didn't cheat at his sport in anyway or hurt other competitors. So Armstrong's offending is on a totally different level altogether.

  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    You know perjury and fraud are felony offenses with minimum jail or prison sentences, right?
    It's a sport/hobby, if you wanted to chuck someone in jail for something which is totally insignificant in the grand scheme of things then half the world would be behind bars.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavyRay View Post
    You have no idea. Really. Not all teams were injecting junk. Not all teams were pressuring their riders to inject. Do you know any athletes who are 15 years old? Do you want them to start injecting roids so they can win whatever game they are playing?
    Ok I retract my statement. Just seems to me the whole tour was dirty. I always assumed LA was juicing to win it seven times. How could he not be? It's the dirty stuff over and above the straight out juicing that makes this case so reprehensible IMO.

  11. #311
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    He reminds me of OJ... something's not right with him.

    From "If the glove don't fit you must acquit" to "If the syringe ain't in 'im, you must acquit him".
    I read that on the internet.

  12. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevieGriff View Post
    It's a sport/hobby, if you wanted to chuck someone in jail for something which is totally insignificant in the grand scheme of things then half the world would be behind bars.
    You need to do your required reading before you can participate in class discussions.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  13. #313
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    Looks like the common theme is not so much about the doping, but more about how Lance conducted himself with regards to his interactions with others along the way to victory.

    Looks like most of us had come to grips with his doping (or simply doping in cycling) long ago...

  14. #314
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    Yeah, its on like Donkey Kong. Wait til the Feds resume their hostilities.

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS View Post
    Yeah, its on like Donkey Kong. Wait til the Feds resume their hostilities.
    Is this what our Tax dollars need to be spent on? We have Presidents lieing under oath, or deliberatly mis-leading Congress like in Benghazi, there's so much corruption that has far serious problems than BIKE RACING !!

    If they want to recoup any gov money lost in all this, go for it.. But come on, USPS and Discovery Channel lost nothing in this, not a fricken penny, at the time of their sponsorship LA was the Man, bringing them loads of attention, well worth their investments.
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  16. #316
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    ^^^this^^^

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter View Post
    Is this what our Tax dollars need to be spent on? We have Presidents lieing under oath, or deliberatly mis-leading Congress like in Benghazi, there's so much corruption that has far serious problems than BIKE RACING !!

    If they want to recoup any gov money lost in all this, go for it.. But come on, USPS and Discovery Channel lost nothing in this, not a fricken penny, at the time of their sponsorship LA was the Man, bringing them loads of attention, well worth their investments.



    They still had a business agreement which he did not honor, he defrauded the government. Its rather simple, when you break a contract you should expect some repercussions. Time to pay the Piper.

  18. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by Millfox View Post
    Well would be quite a catty behaviour. . He's also jerk but doesn't permission you to attack a person. And potentially damage a pretty bike!

    I was expecting responses like Yes I'd go for a ride with him/No, he has sunk in my eyes too low./ Maybe... ect. But not an act as a friend and attack when not looking. That's just childish.

    I apologise if you've met your post as a satire.
    REALLY!?!
    I WAS JOKING!!!!!!!
    You should be happy that someone even responded to your question.

  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter View Post
    Is this what our Tax dollars need to be spent on? We have Presidents lieing under oath, or deliberatly mis-leading Congress like in Benghazi, there's so much corruption that has far serious problems than BIKE RACING !!

    If they want to recoup any gov money lost in all this, go for it.. But come on, USPS and Discovery Channel lost nothing in this, not a fricken penny, at the time of their sponsorship LA was the Man, bringing them loads of attention, well worth their investments.
    In one instance, a career diplomat made an informed decision and lost his life. I do not see a comparison with any lying or cheating in sport. I could wonder why a quasi-government entity like USPS was spending money to make itself look good as well.

    Perspective!
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  20. #320
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    I'm not cool with our gov spending a bunch of tax dollars investigating baseball players and cyclistist, seems ridiculous. The money could be spent on education, creating jobs..... not tearing down some Aholes in sport.
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  21. #321
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    While I dont think he cheated, only leveling the playing field, I believe he did actually win lawsuits against people, or companies that accused him of doping. It is definited wrong to use any peformance enhancing drugs or take shortcuts, but actually getting lawsuits against people who where accusing him of cheating, who where actually telling the truth is really really wrong. Thats sort of thing shows how much arogance he had, and thats pretty bad.

    As far as livestrong, i'm wearing my bracelot right now. I know Lance was one of the founders of the company, but that doesnt change its cause. The cause is much bigger then this. It doesnt change my opion of Livestrong what so ever. After loosing my father this year from cancer, this sort of thing is very close to my heart

  22. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by bucksaw87 View Post
    that ain't right. The dude had cancer for cripes sake.

  23. #323
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    I hate burst anyone's bubble but..... Lance just inflicked the largest wound on the bike racing world and he's made everyone in it look guilty. It might have been different if he cheated one time but for years and years!?!?!?! COME ON! REALLY!?! Has anyone noticed that none of the second place racers have been crowned with the Tour title yet? Wonder why??

    Yes its a dark day for cycling. Ive been sick to stomach all day.

  24. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter View Post
    But come on, USPS and Discovery Channel lost nothing in this, not a fricken penny, at the time of their sponsorship LA was the Man, bringing them loads of attention, well worth their investments.
    Armstrong's financial ties were/are well woven:

    http://dimspace.co.uk/la/ArmstrongBu...ctions1707.png

  25. #325
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    Sports holds an unjustified top rung, we celebrate the winners then monetize them beyond belief. This outing won't change the win at any cost mentality that runs through sports and boardrooms - the cheating will continue to evolve in attempt to avoid detection and the money will continue to flow. That a top sports star is also a solipsistic ass, willing to use their money and power to destroy any threat seems incidental until they are caught. Still pessimistic about pro cycling but I like to see mythology bubbles popped.

  26. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by etanc View Post
    Sports holds an unjustified top rung, we celebrate the winners then monetize them beyond belief. This outing won't change the win at any cost mentality that runs through sports and boardrooms - the cheating will continue to evolve in attempt to avoid detection and the money will continue to flow. That a top sports star is also a solipsistic ass, willing to use their money and power to destroy any threat seems incidental until they are caught. Still pessimistic about pro cycling but I like to see mythology bubbles popped.
    Well said.

  27. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by calboy View Post
    Has anyone noticed that none of the second place racers have been crowned with the Tour title yet? Wonder why??
    Wiggins has been given 3rd place in 2009 TdF.

  28. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by das028 View Post
    While I dont think he cheated, only leveling the playing field, I believe he did actually win lawsuits against people, or companies that accused him of doping. It is definited wrong to use any peformance enhancing drugs or take shortcuts, but actually getting lawsuits against people who where accusing him of cheating, who where actually telling the truth is really really wrong. Thats sort of thing shows how much arogance he had, and thats pretty bad.

    As far as livestrong, i'm wearing my bracelot right now. I know Lance was one of the founders of the company, but that doesnt change its cause. The cause is much bigger then this. It doesnt change my opion of Livestrong what so ever. After loosing my father this year from cancer, this sort of thing is very close to my heart
    Seems to me that the attorneys going after innocent people should be held accountable too. Talk about fraud! LA's money hungry attorneys need to pay up too imo...not cool!

  29. #329
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    I'll play the cynic-card here....I dont' care. I also have to get back to work, which happens to be something that matters in my life, unlike some D-bag who has (shockingly) pulled the wool over a majority of the public's eye to make a buck. It's all very American, really. Almost as American as apple pie, school shootings, the idea that you can have something for nothing, and an over-inflated sense of moral superiority.
    Moving to Montana soon, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  30. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydbyk View Post
    Seems to me that the attorneys going after innocent people should be held accountable too. Talk about fraud! LA's money hungry attorneys need to pay up too imo...not cool!
    If you hire an attorney to sue somebody and you lie to them, and they win a lawsuit based on your lies, they are not in violation of any laws.

    Now if they know you are lying and they let you lie in court, then the can be disbarred.

    I seriously doubt that when LA sued people that he told his attorneys the truth.

  31. #331
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    I rode past a school on my ride today and some kid yells "lance armstrong".. I thought to myself , hey I didn't sue so many people that I cannot be sure if I sued so and so. Plus I don't do EPO. A few years ago they used to write "hey slow down you're not lance armstrong" on signs in peoples yards on certain downhill rides in and around Colorado.

  32. #332
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    ^You should have yelled back, "Shut up kid, or I'll sue your ass."
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  33. #333
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    I've listened to people on the talk radio circuit, and what others have posted here and elsewhere. I have to at least give my .02 on this as I find this very irritating. First IMO I hear more people than not say things like "well that's how it goes" or some fancy I don't care attitude like; it just how things are. Maybe not directly at the Lance/Oprah interview but across the board with drug use in sports. In life.. sports.. work, whatever. It's your freedom to do as you wish so long as it's not hurting others. That's how I look at life for the most part. It's when people have this forgive and forget attitude. I get it people are repentant of sins; however when your a leading sports figure, hero or any number of high profile type of people/person you have to be held to account when children are involved. The more we just let things go our children see this. Makes them want to cheat. They see it as, well maybe not the "right" thing to do, but what the heck.. everyone else is doing it. This is the problem with this country and many others frankly. We don't stand for principals anymore. There is no standard anymore. Morals, greed etc; it all stems from one thing. A lack of respect for yourself. Thus making the collective suffer.

    A quick example. Jimmy Rollins from the Philadelphia Phillies. Once in a while he doesn't hussle it down the line to first base, or second w/e. I get the argument that well "I popped the ball up there's no reason to hussle" isnt even close to being good enough. As a matter of fact im offended at this type of thing. Same attitude professional drug users have. (Im not saying Rollins does drugs). So your telling me that I have to teach my son not to hustle each and every time. Just.. sometimes.. So I have to buy my Phillies tickets months in advance. Tell my employer at least two weeks in advance. Plan to get this kids together, the wife, driving in traffic, the mess, sloppy ice cream bars, yelling...all of that great stuff just to go see a game of so-called professionals tell me they don't feel like hustling.

    The great thing about this country is competition. The ability for there to be winners and losers. From the stock markets to sports. Its the greed in society that ruins everything. The lazy effort made for people to be held accountable is pathetic. Nothing will change in society, sports, drugs etc: until we all make the changes within. Teaching proper life skills to the next generation is our great task. We are failing miserably. Sorry for the rant guys/gals but I had to get that off my chest.

  34. #334
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    My LIVEWRONG bracelet had not been worn since 2004. Thanks Big Johnny! Anyone still have theirs? I am glad that no other human is dishonest, ha.
    Master of Laundry...Lord of Cleaning!

  35. #335
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  36. #336
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    Couldn't agree more P. Stefanelli--I have plenty of friends that say "everybody was doing it." As a teacher I can't help but use the example that if their kid came home and explained to them that they cheated on a test, only because they saw a bunch of others cheating....

  37. #337
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    Well said poppa#1. Football at any level is the worst at teaching kids the at all and any cost WIN!!! I understand we as parents should teach and push our children to do thier best to succeed, but at what level do you stop? All the major sports leagues are doing nothing to really stop any of it because the greed factor $$$,$$$,$$$. That just encourages the behavior. So we must start there because we all know sh** rolls down hill.

  38. #338
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    i will not post it here, but search you tube for george carlin "f*ck lance"...

  39. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by calboy View Post
    I hate burst anyone's bubble but..... Lance just inflicked the largest wound on the bike racing world and he's made everyone in it look guilty. It might have been different if he cheated one time but for years and years!?!?!?! COME ON! REALLY!?! Has anyone noticed that none of the second place racers have been crowned with the Tour title yet? Wonder why??

    Yes its a dark day for cycling. Ive been sick to stomach all day.
    Probably the most truthful statement within any LA thread

    Wait till they make us turn in our ... Anything over 7 gears, assault bikes, and force us to register what we are allowed to possess.

    NAW !!!
    Ban them all

  40. #340
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    He lied to Oprah?!!!

    To paraphrase, is there no honor among gasbags?


    Lance Armstrong May Have Lied to Oprah to Cover Crimes: Investigators - Page 1
    Lance Armstrong May Have Lied to Oprah to Cover Crimes: Investigators
    Last edited by edley; 01-18-2013 at 05:24 PM. Reason: Spelin
    Will trade for some chicken.

  41. #341
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    Everyone needs to remember that ANY business/corporation out there will cheat to ANY extent to make a profit. The neglected joke here is that most folks believe that Phil Knight did not know about this. HA, Uncle Phil is aware of anything that involves that much money. This is not as simple as one lying Texan fooling everyone. All of my riding friends have always believed that most of the pro circuit doped. Not all were caught, but that means very little. How many carbon road bikes did Trek sell before Lance? If money is involved PEOPLE will do anything! I am not defending anyone, but those who pontificate from that steed will fall and fall... splat
    Master of Laundry...Lord of Cleaning!

  42. #342
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    This is such ground breaking news that I see why you didn't just tag this to one of the many other Lance Armstrong threads.

    I mean seriously why do we act surprised, and better yet why do we care?


    Edit:

    This comment was in reference to two posts up which was originally a whole new thread and then later moved and tagged to this one.
    Last edited by kjlued; 01-19-2013 at 04:24 AM.

  43. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by StevieGriff View Post
    It's a sport/hobby, if you wanted to chuck someone in jail for something which is totally insignificant in the grand scheme of things then half the world would be behind bars.
    When you mix many millions of dollars with that level of subterfuge and skullduggery it will get real ugly for him soon. He seems to be limiting his confessions to stuff more than 5 or 6 years ago...statue of limitations is coming into play here?

    Blueliner

  44. #344
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    forget it lets move on
    XMAN

  45. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBW View Post
    lets see... because he was training while undergoing cancer treatment and because even doping (many pros do, he is just on the spotlight) most Tour de France cyclists wouldn't make it 1 time, let alone 7.
    I really don't understand why people is so surprised. Maybe they are too naive and live in a bubble.
    These are PRO. That means that if you win you get money, send your kid to college and be able to continue eating when you are old. They don't have a carreer or trade. They have a very limited sport "span". They don't ride for "fun" and they don't do it for health, they do it to win and that is called being a PRO.
    It would be nice if everyone would play nice and the field would be leveled but is not.
    That is it
    Not naive, but believing his public denials. Now that it's over and information on his scheme is coming to light it seems Lance is just another PRO that suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder. So you're saying once a professional athlete's days are over they can't have another career? Maybe they will not be able to live the same lifestyle but I don't believe for one minute that they are used up and useless not being able to provide for their families.

  46. #346
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    Lance is pretty slick. Don't buy anything he says happened after 2005. I believed he doped then too. It was pretty sad when he said he was offended that they thought his blood samples seemed doped during the 2009 + 2010 TDF. He is a crafty SOB. Wish he would have come clean but what was I thinking? Sure there will be some ripples for the next year or two until this is all sorted out. DOping is wrong but I understand why some do it but all the other BS ; come on?

  47. #347
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  48. #348
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    Thoughts on the interview:

    Never watched oprah before, thought she was pretty good actually.

    It was good being able to watch it on teh internet at the same time as everyone else in the world.

    The sound was terrible. One of the biggest tv interviews in history and they use a $20 scratchy lapel mic on Lance. It scratched every time he moved.. They even had it attached wrong. Aaaargh, drove me insane. Use a fecking proper mic next time!

    And Lance? He is dead to me.

    Although I think he should go on the pro poker tour. He would be an awesome poker player.

  49. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwiplague View Post
    Not all of them were doping, what about Christophe Bassons? One of the (admittedly few) riders who refused drugs and was absolutely pilloried for it by a lot of other riders, including Lance. If you don't believe me, read this - Christophe Bassons - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    What chance did he ever have of winning? Why not give him the win?

    I have always hated the "they were all on the juice, so it still counts for something" argument, it does nothing for the credibilty of cycling.
    This is what he said
    I'm not the only clean rider but there aren't many who can say 'I don't take drugs'.
    That certainly implies almost all were cheating. I wasn't though so they can give me money as well. I wasn't racing though.

  50. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by markymark View Post

    Although I think he should go on the pro poker tour. He would be an awesome poker player.



    His body language gives him away, he would be a crappy poker player imo.

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