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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    right now - dope is illegal. it will never be made legal and free for all.
    Riding above 15mph in local parks is illegal. Yes, even on a wide open fireroad.

    There are hundreds of substances on the banned list for athletes that are perfectly legal, useful and not dangerous.

    Heck, what is illegal about filling yourself up with your own frigging blood?

    What Lance violated are the rules of the game. And they could not even catch him properly in all those years. Excuse me for not giving a damn about some silly games.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    they could not even catch him properly in all those years
    except for all the times during those years when they did catch him with dirty tests. you know, like the time he tested dirty and bribed the UCI to make it go away?
    "Knowledge is good." ~ Emil Faber

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Word.

    Spectator sports are no fun.
    Amen


    Quote Originally Posted by IndecentExposure View Post
    Lance, if you're out there, come to Colorado. Its legal here now, we don't care. You can sell off what you have left to pay for any of your legal crap. Hit me up, I'll buy you a beer. Dopers are all over the place around here... darn weed is everywhere!
    Word!

    Other than a little alky-hol I don't do any other drugs (legal or illegal).
    That being said, there are a lot of things that are illegal to do to your own body that should not be illegal. Many are less harmful than the alcohol I drink.

    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post

    There are hundreds of substances on the banned list for athletes that are perfectly legal, useful and not dangerous.

    Heck, what is illegal about filling yourself up with your own frigging blood?

    What Lance violated are the rules of the game. And they could not even catch him properly in all those years. Excuse me for not giving a damn about some silly games.
    Amen to that brotha!

    Seriously, way too many people seem to be taking this way to seriously even though it has absolutely no effect on their life other than the effect they are letting it have.

    If you were in the TDF and not doping then maybe you deserve an apology even though if Lance was not doping, you sill would not have beaten him.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    If you were in the TDF and not doping then maybe you deserve an apology even though if Lance was not doping, you sill would not have beaten him.
    remind us again how many tours LA won (or for that matter even finished) before he started doping?
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  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogod View Post
    remind us again how many tours LA won (or for that matter even finished) before he started doping?
    Remind us, who was on a major tour podium in the last fifteen years and definitely, absolutely did not dope and would stood up for targeted non-analytical scrutiny like USADA's?

    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Seriously, way too many people seem to be taking this way to seriously even though it has absolutely no effect on their life other than the effect they are letting it have.
    I listen to radio on my way to work - it is flooded with ads for testosterone prescriptions for "feeling tired" and "natural effects of male aging".

    I bet a whole lot of those commercial customers are seething with righteous rage against "dopers".

  6. #106
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    ^^^^ Amen on both

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued
    If you were in the TDF and not doping then maybe you deserve an apology even though if Lance was not doping, you sill would not have beaten him.
    Quote Originally Posted by monogod
    remind us again how many tours LA won (or for that matter even finished) before he started doping?
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe
    Remind us, who was on a major tour podium in the last fifteen years and definitely, absolutely did not dope and would stood up for targeted non-analytical scrutiny like USADA's?
    total red herring since my position is not that everyone on the podium in the last 15 years other than lance was clean.

    my request to Axe was made in response to his claim that lance was a podium level TDF racer before he started doping when in fact he was nothing but a pack filler who never even finished.
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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Remind us, who was on a major tour podium in the last fifteen years and definitely, absolutely did not dope and would stood up for targeted non-analytical scrutiny like USADA's?



    I listen to radio on my way to work - it is flooded with ads for testosterone prescriptions for "feeling tired" and "natural effects of male aging".

    I bet a whole lot of those commercial customers are seething with righteous rage against "dopers".
    How about Bradley Wiggins? Or Chris Froome?

    Axe - if someone is using testosterone supplement to feel less tired or just to provide his partner with some excitement - is a different ball game compared with someone who uses it to gain competitive advantage over his opponents - despite it is a banned performance drug.

    Really - what are you trying to do? Defend Lance because everyone else doped?

    C'mon man. Sure, if everyone else doped - get them all as well. And they did, for the most part. No one was exempt. How was this "targeted" witch hunt? Most everyone else was caught and stripped off their medals. Lance was one of the last...

    I can't believe anyone can defend Lance... for any reason...
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  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Riding above 15mph in local parks is illegal. Yes, even on a wide open fireroad.

    There are hundreds of substances on the banned list for athletes that are perfectly legal, useful and not dangerous.

    Heck, what is illegal about filling yourself up with your own frigging blood?

    What Lance violated are the rules of the game. And they could not even catch him properly in all those years. Excuse me for not giving a damn about some silly games.
    Sorry man, your statement is pretty oblivious in my opinion. "They could not even catch him properly"???? What the hell does that mean? They caught him improperly?

    What is illegal about filling yourself up with your own blood? Geez...

    It is illegal man, as defined by those that know what they are doing and accepted by Lance when he obtained his racing license through USA cycling. If he didn't like this rule - he should not have accepted it. But he accepted it and then violated it hoping that he would not get caught... Well, he got caught. Yep, he violated rules of the game. Penalty is pretty obvious.
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  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogod View Post
    total red herring since my position is not that everyone on the podium in the last 15 years other than lance was clean.

    my request to Axe was made in response to his claim that lance was a podium level TDF racer before he started doping when in fact he was nothing but a pack filler who never even finished.
    Total red herring since Axe's position was not........awe fvck it, we could go round and round with this one.

    Ok, assuming Lance was doping (which he most likely was yet we still have no real proof so we will assume he was)

    If you were clean but not even on the podium for several years because all the guys that were on the podium were on doped up and the only way you could beat them and make a name for yourself was to play the same game, would you

    a) Dope the fvck up and hope not to get caught
    b) Stay clean and just fade away like all the others that stayed clean.


    Don't hate the player, hate the game.

    Don't be pissed at Lance, he obviously tried to do it clean but since the guys in charge couldn't catch the other dopers it forced his hand.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Total red herring since Axe's position was not........awe fvck it, we could go round and round with this one.

    Ok, assuming Lance was doping (which he most likely was yet we still have no real proof so we will assume he was)

    If you were clean but not even on the podium for several years because all the guys that were on the podium were on doped up and the only way you could beat them and make a name for yourself was to play the same game, would you

    a) Dope the fvck up and hope not to get caught
    b) Stay clean and just fade away like all the others that stayed clean.


    Don't hate the player, hate the game.

    Don't be pissed at Lance, he obviously tried to do it clean but since the guys in charge couldn't catch the other dopers it forced his hand.
    i am not pissed at Lance...
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  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    Sorry man, your statement is pretty oblivious in my opinion. "They could not even catch him properly"???? What the hell does that mean? They caught him improperly?
    I do not consider this targeted investigation an epitome of justice. There were no analytical positives (which I consider the proper way to catch, like with Contador or Landis), and this procedure is not up to the standards of what is accepted in a real court, which I would consider a proper way.

    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    It is illegal man, as defined by those that know what they are doing and accepted by Lance when he obtained his racing license through USA cycling. If he didn't like this rule - he should not have accepted it. But he accepted it and then violated it hoping that he would not get caught... Well, he got caught. Yep, he violated rules of the game. Penalty is pretty obvious.
    USADA is private organization enforcing private contracts. It has nothing to do with law as far as "legality" of those substances. Some rules prohibit caffeine or alcohol in competition. It is a private contract between private parties. I do not care about them.

    The point is, rules of a silly game do not elevate to wrist wringing about destroyed morals and hefty criminal offense terms used.

  13. #113
    Axe
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogod View Post
    my request to Axe was made in response to his claim that lance was a podium level TDF racer before he started doping when in fact he was nothing but a pack filler who never even finished.
    So who won before that? Riis? Ullrich? Pantani? LOL.

    Admitted and caught doping rules violators.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Some rules prohibit caffeine
    Good point, I forgot that caffeine could be considered a performance enhancing drug.

    I better stop drinking coffee if I don't want to be considered a cheat when I bike.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    So who won before that? Riis? Ullrich? Pantani? LOL.

    Admitted and caught doping rules violators.
    "Knowledge is good." ~ Emil Faber

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    I do not consider this targeted investigation an epitome of justice. There where no analytical positives (which I consider the proper way to catch, like with Contador or Landis), and this procedure is not up to the standards of what is accepted in a real court, which I would consider a proper way.
    you do know he tested positive twice , don't you. both times it was swept under the carpet and a "contribution" to the tune of $100,000 went to UCI. mafia and drug cartels are subject to targeted investigations. what's the difference... dude, he is so guilty - based on all the evidence and eye witnesses - your denial is weird, for the lack of better word...



    USADA is private organization enforcing private contracts. It has nothing to do with law as far as "legality" of those substances. Some rules prohibit caffeine or alcohol in competition. It is a private contract between private parties. I do not care about them.
    huh? seriously? USADA is enforcing the same rules as WADA who governs the Olympics and all other major competitions. what do you mean "private"? they are just enforcing rules that Lance and all other athletes ACCEPTED voluntarily when they got their licenses. whether you care or not doesn't matter. Lance ACCEPTED these rules and acknowledged their potential consequences. heck, some geriatrics were caught and banned after tested positive in a friggin' Grand Fondo type of race... it comes with the license (same as Lance) that they took. why is this so hard to accept?

    The point is, rules of a silly game do not elevate to wrist wringing about destroyed morals and hefty criminal offense terms used.
    really? if it was just for doping - i'd agree with you.
    but for all destroyed careers of those that stood up to him and all the millions of dollars that he won in lawsuits - he deserves everything he is called...
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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Good point, I forgot that caffeine could be considered a performance enhancing drug.

    I better stop drinking coffee if I don't want to be considered a cheat when I bike.
    you are hilarious... do you read your posts before you hit "submit"?

    if you don't have UCI license or any other racing license and don't race - why would you be considered as a cheat.

    if caffeine is banned - then it is banned. if Lance accepted these rules - and then broke them - he should be penalized, no?

    no one forced him to accept "silly" rules. he accepted them voluntarily.
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  18. #118
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    Honestly guys, can we move away from the totally ridiculous comparisons to coffee, weed, LSD etc to serious performance enhancing drugs like EPO, really its boarderlining on the totally ridiculous....
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    you are hilarious... do you read your posts before you hit "submit"?

    if you don't have UCI license or any other racing license and don't race - why would you be considered as a cheat.

    if caffeine is banned - then it is banned. if Lance accepted these rules - and then broke them - he should be penalized, no?

    no one forced him to accept "silly" rules. he accepted them voluntarily.
    Yes I do, but people thinking Lance owes everyone an apology isn't ridiculous, it is just plain stupid.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Yes I do, but people thinking Lance owes everyone an apology isn't ridiculous, it is just plain stupid.
    i personally do not care if he apologizes or not... he is beyond the point of no return with the damage that he's done to himself. no apology can change anything...

    but you are questioning his guilt - and that is what i am debating with you... forget the apology. it is irrelevant...
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  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Yes I do, but people thinking Lance owes everyone an apology isn't ridiculous, it is just plain stupid.
    Wrong again, people want him to confess, not apoligize, why the hell would we want an apology.
    The majority of us here don't give a hoot about him doping, there is a small percentage that do, but that's not what all the LA threads are about.
    Have you ever stopped to ask your self why there are no other threads about the other doped riders?
    It's because we don't give a shyte, but what we do give a shyte about is how he lied, decieved, bulled etc etc etc etc, thats why we want to see him taken down, no one will settle for anything less.

  22. #122
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    No, I am questioning the so called proof of his guilt.

    I actually believe he is guilty but laugh at all the people that was on his junk (even though he was missing half of it) then act all shocked, surprised and betrayed as soon as accusations start flying. I also understand why he would do it considering all the top TDF riders probably were and the only chance a man would have to win would be to do it.

    If I was to direct my anger (if I had any), it would be at the governing boards of the TDF for allowing this to happen years before LA won and probably every year after his last win.

    I guarantee we can just go ahead and wipe every title off the books from 1999 to present and probably several years before that. However, we still ignore that fact.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post

    I guarantee we can just go ahead and wipe every title off the books from 1999 to present and probably several years before that. However, we still ignore that fact.
    Dude - that is exactly what happened. Are you really engaging in discussion without knowing even the basics of this case???

    Lance was one of the last cheats that finally got caught.

    You can run, but you can not hide forever.
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  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    you do know he tested positive twice , don't you.
    That is not proven. You can allege and believe anything, but under the system in place he was not caught with an analytical. It did not happen. You know that, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    huh? seriously? USADA is enforcing the same rules as WADA who governs the Olympics and all other major competitions. what do you mean "private"? they are just enforcing rules that Lance and all other athletes ACCEPTED voluntarily when they got their licenses. whether you care or not doesn't matter. Lance ACCEPTED these rules and acknowledged their potential consequences. heck, some geriatrics were caught and banned after tested positive in a friggin' Grand Fondo type of race... it comes with the license (same as Lance) that they took. why is this so hard to accept?
    Yes, he did. But that does not make those rules a matter of criminal law, and enforcement of those rule are not in the realm of judicial system.

    It is a private contract. Exactly that. USADA is a private organization with a contract. Subject to arbitration. Which is indeed a kangaroo court of sorts.

    Whatever. Unsubscribing. Arguing with you haters is pointless.

  25. #125
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    So, lets just wipe the TDF off the books from beginning to end because now we all agree the whole series is a farce where only the best cheater won. That being said, we also agree that from 1999-2005 LA was the best cheater.

    LIke I have said before, C'mon he still beat all the other cheaters.

    From now on, lets call it the TDC or the Tour de Cheaters.

  26. #126
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    sweet. ESPN is announcing The Confession on its ticker at the bottom of the screen...

  27. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    That is not proven. You can allege and believe anything, but under the system in place he was not caught with an analytical. It did not happen. You know that, right?
    Axe - he was caught. His urine samples showed usage of EPO without the doubt. They wee tested according to standards. Why are you denying it. What do you mean with "analytical"? This all was shown on TV many times. It is in USADA evidence.



    Yes, he did. But that does not make those rules a matter of criminal law, and enforcement of those rule are not in the realm of judicial system.
    Why is this relevant? Who is talking about criminal prosecution? How does that disprove his guilt?

    It is a private contract. Exactly that. USADA is a private organization with a contract. Subject to arbitration. Which is indeed a kangaroo court of sorts.

    Whatever. Unsubscribing. Arguing with you haters is pointless.
    But he accepted this court Axe. Voluntarily. He didn't have to. It was his choice.
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  28. #128
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    Louie Armstrong is INNOCENT!

    <iframe width="960" height="720" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/wyLjbMBpGDA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  29. #129
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    I think Phill Liggett is an accessory to doping. Not many people would know Lance if it weren't for paparazzi.. haaa haa
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  30. #130
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    OK, so now we know Lance is guilty, can we forgive and forget?

    I am a great believer in compassion, and I am sure there are people here who profess outrage, me included, at the bad things Lance has done in his career, and have also done some 'bad things' in their time. Perhaps and most likely not on the same scale as Lance, but bad nonetheless.
    I think everyone deserves forgiveness if they are truly remorseful, and not just because they did not get away with it and are trying to salvage something of their ill-gotten gains or tattered reputation. True and meaningful remorse comes when someone feels it no matter what the outcome, and we cannot know whether this is what Lance is feeling now. I suspect not, but that is just my gut feeling. Does this make him any less worthy of compassion? I think not, but many will disagree. I still think he is a dick for doing what he did, and if he is motivated now from something other than true remorse, then he is an even bigger dick than I give him credit for.
    This one will run and run folks!
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  31. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Lance owes nobody an apology.
    Even if he did do it, he still owes nobody an apology.

    When it comes right down to it, if you feel hurt or betrayed to the point where you think you deserve an apology from this man because he doped up, then you are an ignorant ass fool.

    Everyone with Livestrong still needs to be thanking him.
    If he wouldn't have won, they wouldn't be where they are today.
    If he would not have won. LS would not have been able to do the good it has done.
    If he would not have won, so many cancer patients would not have the hope they had.

    Funny how we can ignore all the good that has happened and turn our back so quickly on somebody just because he was accused of foul play.

    So what if he did it.
    Lets say he didn't do it, and lost.
    Would the winner behind him who also doped have started a foundation like Livestrong and given hope to so many other cancer patients?
    This is something you wrote. You must be proud!
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  32. #132
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    It's going to be really hard after he put so much effort into covering it up for so long, almost impossible really. Plus, he only seems to regret not being able to compete in triathlons now. We'll have to see what he said to Oprah when it airs on Thurs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    This is something you wrote. You must be proud!
    Wow you are brilliant, yes it is something I wrote.

    Yes, I still stand behind it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kjlued View Post
    Wow you are brilliant, yes it is something I wrote.

    Yes, I still stand behind it.
    I agree. Armstrong doesn't need to apologize to anyone. He still won 7 straight TDFs against other doped up competitors. Sounds like a level playing field and he dominated.

    It wasn't like he went from couch potato to superhuman with drugs (which is what the main stream media seems to be intimating with their bogus interviews with that azzhole Tygart). He still trained like nobody else, he still rode like nobody else. I've never understood the persecution of Armstrong and it's still playing out.
    So it seems to me to be, this thing that I think I see.

  35. #135
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    I already forgot....not because I do or don't believe that Lance is truly sorry but because I honestly believe the entire peloton of 'Tour de France' level professional road racers(minus maybe 5% tops) is guilty of doping or cheating in some way, manner or form. If they never caught Lance in 500+ tries, what does that say for the competency level of those conducting the testing? It means they suck and are essentially worthless.

  36. #136
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    I look forward to seeing his head in a bowl next to Nixon's on Futurama.

  37. #137
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    I have been reading all the other threads on the subject and the answer is 'NO'. LA is the devil incarnate, the mother of all evil, and the worst of the worst in the Doping Rat Squad.

  38. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    I already forgot....not because I do or don't believe that Lance is truly sorry but because I honestly believe the entire peloton of 'Tour de France' level professional road racers(minus maybe 5% tops) is guilty of doping or cheating in some way, manner or form. If they never caught Lance in 500+ tries, what does that say for the competency level of those conducting the testing? It means they suck and are essentially worthless.
    It means they're guilty of collusion* and, if Lance wants to do some good, maybe he could take the whole rotten lot down.

    *At best.

  39. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    If they never caught Lance in 500+ tries, what does that say for the competency level of those conducting the testing?
    "tested 500+ times with no dirty results" is true only in the same realm as cotton candy rainbows and unicorn farts.

    in reality he was tested fewer than 130 times and failed 8 of them. one of which mysteriously "went away" after a large 6 figure "donation" to the UCI for equipment to test for PEDs, of all things.

    what does that say about the competency and integrity of those who head the UCI and other governing bodies?

    oh, he also tried to make a $250,000 "donation" to the USADA when they started investigating him as well. they turned it down citing "conflict of interest".
    "Knowledge is good." ~ Emil Faber

  40. #140
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    Well I don't think LA has done anything that I personally need to forgive him for.

    I hope that those who he negatively affected can forgive no matter if he is truly remorseful or not because holding on to that anger can be more damaging then the deeds that somebody has done against you.

    That being said, forgiving and forgetting is two different things.
    For instance if somebody stole something from me, I would forgive them, but I would never forget and give them the opportunity to do it again.

  41. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogod View Post
    one of which mysteriously "went away" after a large 6 figure "donation" to the UCI for equipment to test for PEDs, of all things.
    Convincingly showing just how independent the independent testing labs were.

    edit: Let's be charitable and assume the sample was blinded.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nuffink View Post
    I look forward to seeing his head in a bowl next to Nixon's on Futurama.
    Id vote for him as the next prez of Earth, at least he admits he is a cheater. I wonder if he will inherit the headless body of Agnu?

  43. #143
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    There will be no yellow wash at the Lance House.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nuffink View Post
    Convincingly showing just how independent the independent testing labs were.



    The Dr. Ferrari trial is exposing the level of corruption and collusion in the "independent" testing and I am certain that it plays into Lances decision to confess, confess before the real facts are once again brought forth. This whole thing is going to blow up to levels that are almost incomprehensible, and more than a few people are going to be looking at prison terms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    I agree. Armstrong doesn't need to apologize to anyone. He still won 7 straight TDFs against other doped up competitors. Sounds like a level playing field and he dominated.
    wrong. he doped and won against other dopers AND CLEAN RIDERS.

    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy
    It wasn't like he went from couch potato to superhuman with drugs (which is what the main stream media seems to be intimating with their bogus interviews with that azzhole Tygart). He still trained like nobody else, he still rode like nobody else.
    wrong again. he went from a mediocre (at best) pack filler who NEVER FINISHED A TOUR prior to doping to being able to actually finish and win after doping.

    so yeah, before doping he rode like a nobody all right...

    oh, and after doping he "trained" like nobody else too by having access to better PED's and an elaborate system of enablers and confederates than anyone else.

    so no one could match his level of cheating, dishonesty, and corruptness.... wow... something to really be proud of.

    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy
    I've never understood the persecution of Armstrong and it's still playing out.
    you don't understand the persecution of LA for lying, cheating, intimidating, blackmailing, extortion, perjury, retaliation, etc.?

    you do realize those things are wrong and morally reprehensible, don't you?
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  46. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    I agree. Armstrong doesn't need to apologize to anyone. He still won 7 straight TDFs against other doped up competitors. Sounds like a level playing field and he dominated.
    1. LA winning 7 TDF's is not true, prove it!
    2. It still was not a level playing field among doped riders, why is that so hard for you to comprehend? LA still had a huge advantage over the other doped riders, if this is news to you then I suggest doing some research next time before making ridiculous statements.

    The only other riders that could be considered to have been on a similar level as LA would be his own team mates, and even then LA still had an advantage.
    Last edited by SV11; 01-15-2013 at 07:02 PM.

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    the whole affair is a bummer, plain and simple.

    i admired lance for his "accomplishments" and was in the "believer" camp until fairly recently, when all of the facts began to be made clear. i'm embarrassed for having once been such an ardent supporter of lance--and floyd as well. (i remember floyd tearing it up on the MTB scene in the early nineties)

    "This whole thing is going to blow up to levels that are almost incomprehensible, and more than a few people are going to be looking at prison terms."

    indeed. here's what i posted on my facebook page. bad words have been deleted:

    everybody involved in this sordid situation ought to be sent straight to secret underground kentucky salt mine federal prisons for the rest of their short assed natural born lives on GENERAL PRINCIPLES...and i mean EVERYBODY...lance, floyd, WADA, the USADA, the UCI, the USOC, the IOC, NORBA, USA cycling, the USPS, nike, the screaming fans on the side of the road in france...yes, even the management of trek bicycles...EVERY-XXXXXXX-BODY...

    (let's shove oprah into her own filthy jail cell, for adding an additional layer of slime to the whole wretched affair)

    competitive professional road cycling ought to be shut down for twenty-six years before grown men are allowed to sanction or participate in any way, shape or form of bicycle racing. god damn you, lance armstrong and every money grubbing rat xxxxxxx xxxxxxx that has let the sport sink to such a shameful level...

  48. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn-Rider View Post
    It's going to be really hard after he put so much effort into covering it up for so long, almost impossible really. Plus, he only seems to regret not being able to compete in triathlons now. We'll have to see what he said to Oprah when it airs on Thurs.
    I think we know the Oprah thing will be more obfuscation. I kind of like Shekky's observation of her bringing a whole new level of slime. The slime strata go back millennia!
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    I'm waiting to see how many of the people he trampled, sue his lying ass.
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    How's about we just forget and lock this thread down.

  51. #151
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    I wonder if LA also paid Oprah...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mtn-Rider View Post
    I wonder if LA also paid Oprah...
    they paid each other...it's complicated...

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    This is the first thread about Lance that I've seen in a while

  54. #154
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    No! He needs to be tortured, humiliated in front of a large crowd of journalists, exorcised in a sacred bike shop, de-headed, his corpse needs to be chopped and fed to the hounds so his spirit won't be able to find its way out of this world. He is the worst possible evil that has happened in this milenium and the day when will USADA revoked his TDF titles will be celebrated in every major religion as the "Day when all the corruption was purged." Afterwards all the evil will fade and a new age of prosperity will come to Road cycling all over the world. PROSPERITY FOR ALL!

  55. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by shekky View Post
    the whole affair is a bummer, plain and simple.

    i admired lance for his "accomplishments" and was in the "believer" camp until fairly recently, when all of the facts began to be made clear. i'm embarrassed for having once been such an ardent supporter of lance--and floyd as well. (i remember floyd tearing it up on the MTB scene in the early nineties)
    I agree with this statement wholeheartedly. During Lance's reign I was in middle school and high school. As a young, impressionable cyclist I really looked up to him. I am very disappointed to say the least.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Millfox View Post
    No! He needs to be tortured, humiliated in front of a large crowd of journalists, exorcised in a sacred bike shop, de-headed, his corpse needs to be chopped and fed to the hounds so his spirit won't be able to find its way out of this world. He is the worst possible evil that has happened in this milenium and the day when will USADA revoked his TDF titles will be celebrated in every major religion as the "Day when all the corruption was purged." Afterwards all the evil will fade and a new age of prosperity will come to Road cycling all over the world. PROSPERITY FOR ALL!
    Don't hold back man, tell us how you really feel.

  57. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy View Post
    I agree. Armstrong doesn't need to apologize to anyone. He still won 7 straight TDFs against other doped up competitors. Sounds like a level playing field and he dominated.

    It wasn't like he went from couch potato to superhuman with drugs (which is what the main stream media seems to be intimating with their bogus interviews with that azzhole Tygart). He still trained like nobody else, he still rode like nobody else. I've never understood the persecution of Armstrong and it's still playing out.

    agreed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    This is something you wrote. You must be proud!
    I thought it was pretty nice and accurate, myself.
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  59. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    I thought it was pretty nice and accurate, myself.
    that's too bad dell...

    i guess if drug cartels build a few hospitals from the fraction of their drug money - they would have your support too? It's ok to sell drugs, because they build hospitals, eh?

    Livestrong is a brilliant refuge for Lance... whenever someone mentions doping - Lance would hide behind Livestrong...

    Now it is ok that he doped because he earned money to start Livestrong...

    Geez.... you guys could be Lance's spin doctors....
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  60. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    that's too bad dell...

    i guess if drug cartels build a few hospitals from the fraction of their drug money - they would have your support too? It's ok to sell drugs, because they build hospitals, eh?

    Livestrong is a brilliant refuge for Lance... whenever someone mentions doping - Lance would hide behind Livestrong...

    Now it is ok that he doped because he earned money to start Livestrong...

    Geez.... you guys could be Lance's spin doctors....
    I have no opinion currently on LiveStrong (As I am not fully-read on that side of things); I was commenting on this bit:

    Lance owes nobody an apology.
    Even if he did do it, he still owes nobody an apology.

    When it comes right down to it, if you feel hurt or betrayed to the point where you think you deserve an apology from this man because he doped up, then you are an ignorant ass fool.
    Sorry, for the doping/racing bit, that is completely true IMO


    </so-not-trying-to-flame-war>
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  61. #161
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    Lance Armstrong is a lying doper sociopath who will only continue to try and manipulate this confession into his advantage. I wager there will be no remorse. His apology will have rationales attached thereby negating the apology.
    He was the best he trained so hard rode his bike 6 hours every day. Thats because he was on the juice getting recovery through testosterone etc. Would not suprise me if he had a weekly volume of 42 hours with 1/4 of that at zone 6.
    I look forward to him kicking my ass in the 35open.
    BTW I really don't care that much about the actual doping aspect of his transgressions.

  62. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    I have no opinion currently on LiveStrong (As I am not fully-read on that side of things); I was commenting on this bit:



    Sorry
    i don't care if he apologizes or not...
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    That was me bringing that post to kjuled's attention to help him recognize that what he wrote is justifying and rationalizing criminal behavior, which he stated, in another thread, that he never did.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    That was me bringing that post to kjuled's attention to help him recognize that what he wrote is justifying and rationalizing criminal behavior, which he stated, in another thread, that he never did.
    Barring talk of LiveStrong (again, I have no horse in this.) and focusing on the racing, are you saying that is criminal?

    [not trying to put words in your mouth, just clarifying]
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  65. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    Barring talk of LiveStrong (again, I have no horse in this.) and focusing on the racing, are you saying that is criminal?

    [not trying to put words in your mouth, just clarifying]
    you have to clarify your question.

    i don't care as much about the fact that he doped - it ain't criminal if you ask me.

    what is criminal is his perjury in the court of justice, his persecution of those that stood up to him and his organized cheating network that was sucking in those that did not necessarily want to go his route...
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    I had read that there is a possible charge of drug trafficking that could be charged. Had read this on another site where the forum users have been pretty accurate about what has happened over the past few months. Otherwise just hearsay.

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    No, tell all the guys who refused to dope and gave up their cycling careers to forgive and forget. Or tell the 25% of American PRISONERS who are doing time for non-violent drug offenses that taking illegal PEDs are okay and getting high for recreational purposes warrants time behind bars.

    Put Lance Armstrong behind bars or in a mental institution.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  68. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    you have to clarify your question.

    i don't care as much about the fact that he doped - it ain't criminal if you ask me.

    what is criminal is his perjury in the court of justice, his persecution of those that stood up to him and his organized cheating network that was sucking in those that did not necessarily want to go his route...
    It should have never come to a trial to be perjured in - I think that's where you and disagree
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  69. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    It should have never come to a trial to be perjured in - I think that's where you and disagree
    he committed perjury without a trial. he was not on trial.

    many athletes and politicians were in the same position.

    why do you think he should not have testified under oath? what is wrong with that?
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    Barring talk of LiveStrong (again, I have no horse in this.) and focusing on the racing, are you saying that is criminal?

    [not trying to put words in your mouth, just clarifying]
    He signed contracts stating he would not use EPO. The races he participated in had rules against the use of EPO.

    My personal stance on drugs is that drug laws are stupid. I personally believe the fact that 25% of incarcerated Americans are in for non-violent drug offense is appalling. They should be let go immediately and either put in mental health facilities or let go completely.

    I personally think athletes should be able to take whatever types of drugs they want. But that's not the world we live in.

    The world we live in is one of laws, contracts and rules. If you break the laws, contracts or rules, you have to pay the penalty. Yes, what Lance Armstrong did was criminal. What makes it worse is how he sued other people and won when they were telling the truth!

    The whole thing is a scam. I've said it before and I'll say it again, we, as a society, place too much importance on professional sports. This leads to huge incentives for the competitors and huge incentive to cheat.

    There always has been and always will be drug use in cycling and other sports. Make it legal so we can see it for what it is. But until then, anyone cheating or being dishonest should be held criminally and civilly responsible for the damages they caused.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  71. #171
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    ^^^ RULES - about "Professional Sports", which we all get in a tussy over.
    All-while the Govt/elite is keeping you distracted by MSM, REAL crimes are going down - Crimes against humanity.

    Sit Back, take a toke or breath, and think about "IT"

    In everyday thinking, it seems most want to shoot the puppet, and could give a crap where the strings go - talk about suspension of reality
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  72. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    ^^^ RULES - about "Professional Sports", which we all get in a tussy over.
    All-while the Govt/elite is keeping you distracted by MSM, REAL crimes are going down - Crimes against humanity.

    Sit Back, take a toke or breath, and think about "IT"

    In everyday thinking, it seems most want to shoot the puppet, and could give a crap where the strings go - talk about suspension of reality
    I'm all too familiar. Did you check out the Dan Airely video I referenced in the other Lance thread? RSA Animate- The Truth About Dishonesty (A verdade sobre a desonestidade) - YouTube

    The problem I have is that this is all connected. Not in an Illuminati sense, but the incentive structures we have in place invite the rationalization of dishonest behavior to the point that dishonest behavior is acceptable, justified and/or defended.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  73. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    ^^^ RULES - about "Professional Sports", which we all get in a tussy over.
    All-while the Govt/elite is keeping you distracted by MSM, REAL crimes are going down - Crimes against humanity.

    Sit Back, take a toke or breath, and think about "IT"

    In everyday thinking, it seems most want to shoot the puppet, and could give a crap where the strings go - talk about suspension of reality
    Ah yes. That is a completely another stinky can of worms. So stinky that LA story sounds like a lullaby. No argument there.

    But Lance is at hand here. Stay focused.
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  74. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    I'm all too familiar. Did you check out the Dan Airely video I referenced in the other Lance thread? RSA Animate- The Truth About Dishonesty (A verdade sobre a desonestidade) - YouTube

    The problem I have is that this is all connected. Not in an Illuminati sense, but the incentive structures we have in place invite the rationalization of dishonest behavior to the point that dishonest behavior is acceptable, justified and/or defended.
    That video is a great illustration
    I have a connected feeling too, but 'stars' are falsely held to a level of 'morality' than the machine driving it.

    Yeah, you could say, HE could have chose to not 'Do It'; how many have chose not to?


    My 'beef' is the witchhunt over something so petty - where was the witch-hunt when (HSA and NDAA went down? - Suspending Habeas corpus - That's real-humanity shlt - THAT should be on Oprah - instead, its reserved for the 'tin-foil' channels
    Honestly... ahh I give up

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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    That video is a great illustration
    I have a connected feeling too, but 'stars' are falsely held to a level of 'morality' than the machine driving it.

    Yeah, you could say, HE could have chose to not 'Do It'; how many have chose not to?


    My 'beef' is the witchhunt over something so petty - where was the witch-hunt when (HSA and NDAA went down? - Suspending Habeas corpus - That's real-humanity shlt - THAT should be on Oprah - instead, its reserved for the 'tin-foil' channels
    I mentioned in another thread that this is a little personal to me because my world was shattered as a teenager when a personal friend and hero, who is a Tour veteran, gave up his professional cycling career because he refused to dope. He told me that it had been going on since the beginning and all the top guys were all doing it and it was impossible to be a contender without it. I was 15 at the time and shortly after that I stopped road riding and gave up any dreams I had of being a professional cyclist.

    That's when I gave up on all professional sports because as I looked into it, it wasn't just cycling.

    Then I looked into the world on a broader scale and became even more disillusioned. And don't get me started about what I learned while being stationed at Fort Bragg and during my deployments.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  76. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    ^^^ RULES - about "Professional Sports", which we all get in a tussy over.
    All-while the Govt/elite is keeping you distracted by MSM, REAL crimes are going down - Crimes against humanity.

    Sit Back, take a toke or breath, and think about "IT"

    In everyday thinking, it seems most want to shoot the puppet, and could give a crap where the strings go - talk about suspension of reality
    there are many more things far more grievous and heinous than what LA did or even the extent to which he was enabled and protected at the very top echelons of the UCI.

    start a thread on it and i'm sure you'll get great agreement, me included.

    in the space of time that it will take to read just one page on this thread several people will die in this world from genocide. several from starvation. many rapes will occur, some violating children. according to the NHTSA 27 people in the u.s. are killed by drinking and driving DAILY, and in 2010 alcohol related crashes claimed the lives of 211 children. our government is grabbing more and more power and stripping us of the last vestiges of our Constitutional freedoms. not satisfied with that they're daily running up millions upon millions more dollars of debt to encumber our children with.

    discussing this issue does not mean that one is not aware of other problems in this society, this country, or globally (i.e. "IT"). it does not mean that one is not involved with doing something about "IT".

    if you're that concerned about it how about signing off MTBR and stop wasting time here and doing something about "IT"? how can you chastise others for not thinking about "IT" when you waste time here and in the OC squabbling over trivial things, posting clever one liners, and arguing over other trivialities? should we take that to mean you don't care about "IT" because you've posted in this thread as well?

    there's a rather dusky kettle awaiting your introduction...
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  77. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by monogod View Post
    there are many more things far more grievous and heinous than what LA did or even the extent to which he was enabled and protected at the very top echelons of the UCI.

    start a thread on it and i'm sure you'll get great agreement, me included.

    in the space of time that it will take to read just one page on this thread several people will die in this world from genocide. several from starvation. many rapes will occur, some violating children. according to the NHTSA 27 people in the u.s. are killed by drinking and driving DAILY, and in 2010 alcohol related crashes claimed the lives of 211 children. our government is grabbing more and more power and stripping us of the last vestiges of our Constitutional freedoms. not satisfied with that they're daily running up millions upon millions more dollars of debt to encumber our children with.

    discussing this issue does not mean that one is not aware of other problems in this society, this country, or globally (i.e. "IT"). it does not mean that one is not involved with doing something about "IT".

    if you're that concerned about it how about signing off MTBR and stop wasting time here and doing something about "IT"? how can you chastise others for not thinking about "IT" when you waste time here and in the OC squabbling over trivial things, posting clever one liners, and arguing over other trivialities? should we take that to mean you don't care about "IT" because you've posted in this thread as well?

    there's a rather dusky kettle awaiting your introduction...
    From how you got that out of my poasts, I see not
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  78. #178
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    Oh and this reminded me about skydiving's Roger Nelson and Water skiing's Herb O'Brien. My whole life, it seemed that whatever sport I got into was built on drug use. That when I realized Mr. Hand was right - everyone IS on dope
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  79. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    I mentioned in another thread that this is a little personal to me because my world was shattered as a teenager when a personal friend and hero, who is a Tour veteran, gave up his professional cycling career because he refused to dope. He told me that it had been going on since the beginning and all the top guys were all doing it and it was impossible to be a contender without it. I was 15 at the time and shortly after that I stopped road riding and gave up any dreams I had of being a professional cyclist.

    That's when I gave up on all professional sports because as I looked into it, it wasn't just cycling.

    Then I looked into the world on a broader scale and became even more disillusioned. And don't get me started about what I learned while being stationed at Fort Bragg and during my deployments.
    Fantastic comment.

    It's infuriating that he's sitting on 100 million dollars while others never made enough to eat. I hope people will focus on the forgotten ones.

    Here is Nicole Cooke's retirement speech. It is astounding. She managed to not dope and be a winner.

    Nicole Cooke's retirement statement in full

  80. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll View Post
    From how you got that out of my poasts, I see not
    you stated it point blank. how one could not get that out of your posts, i see not.
    "Knowledge is good." ~ Emil Faber

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    Quote Originally Posted by girlonbike View Post
    Fantastic comment.

    It's infuriating that he's sitting on 100 million dollars while others never made enough to eat. I hope people will focus on the forgotten ones.

    Here is Nicole Cooke's retirement speech. It is astounding. She managed to not dope and be a winner.

    Nicole Cooke's retirement statement in full
    She managed not to get caught and complain about cheaters anyway. Can't say anything beyond that. What he actually said in his comment was
    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    He told me that it had been going on since the beginning and all the top guys were all doing it and it was impossible to be a contender without it.
    I am not sure what "beginning" he is referring to, but if the beginning of the tour then it sort of supports the notion that it is just a cess pool better ignored. Others have said and I agree that if you want a clean sport get the money out. Most especially if you want clean cycling.

  82. #182
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    I see no reason to forgive ... But given enough time, I hope everyone forgets his name as anything more than a bad joke played upon the sporting World.

    And FWIW,
    Keep the slamming of each other out of this thread.
    The MOD's just closed the other thread, for what I suspect is such actions ... Personally, I'd have deleted some comments and given a few people time-out's ... But I'm not a MOD.

    We don't need another thread, but the topic isn't going away, either !!!

    Heard the cats, leave the thread

  83. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    No, tell all the guys who refused to dope and gave up their cycling careers to forgive and forget. Or tell the 25% of American PRISONERS who are doing time for non-violent drug offenses that taking illegal PEDs are okay and getting high for recreational purposes warrants time behind bars.

    Put Lance Armstrong behind bars or in a mental institution.

    Last time i checked everyone is a grown up and can make their own choices wisely . Hey if you give up on something then thats your fault .

  84. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeabuser View Post
    I see no reason to forgive ... But given enough time, I hope everyone forgets his name as anything more than a bad joke played upon the sporting World.

    And FWIW,
    Keep the slamming of each other out of this thread.
    The MOD's just closed the other thread, for what I suspect is such actions ... Personally, I'd have deleted some comments and given a few people time-out's ... But I'm not a MOD.

    We don't need another thread, but the topic isn't going away, either !!!

    Heard the cats, leave the thread



  85. #185
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    I don't need to forgive Lance. What did he do to me? He got caught up in cheating in bicycling. And then lied about it. Most people would if they made the same mistake. So many worse things out there than cheating at cycling and lying about it. (Rape, murder, incest, kidnapping, etc)

    Personally I feel bad for him and his family. Yes he caused it but the last few years of his life have been miserable and Im sure the next few will be as well...

    I for one have made mistakes in my life. Not at the same level to be sure, but I am no ones judge.

    Hang in there everyone...

    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

  86. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tackhammer View Post
    I don't need to forgive Lance. What did he do to me? He got caught up in cheating in bicycling. And then lied about it. Most people would if they made the same mistake. So many worse things out there than cheating at cycling and lying about it. (Rape, murder, incest, kidnapping, etc)
    According to some people he is as low if not lower than all the rapists, murderers, child molesters, etc.

  87. #187
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    This really sums it all up nicely...

    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/vOxQ6aEWNJU?list=UU4G3lPPWm6qtoWtRk4vyGwg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

  88. #188
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    Well im going to point out a fact here, NOBODY here was in his shoes or ever was in his shoes. Nobody really knows the truth about what goes on behind closed doors , and if you believe any of the " media " then shame on you . There is always 2 sides of the story , he will suffer mentally and emotionally and thats VERY draining . We are human people , everyone needs to sit back and take a hit from the pipe

    "Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again"

  89. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlienRFX View Post
    How's about we just forget and lock this thread down.
    Agreed... Lance and all threads related to him should be buried in the deepest possible hole and never come out

  90. #190
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  91. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lovedirt View Post
    , and if you believe any of the " media " then shame on you
    Yes, the big evil empire agenda.
    I had visions, i was in them i was looking into the mirror to see a little bit clearer rottenness and evil in me
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  92. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by shekky View Post
    people are denying knowledge about what went on behind closed doors:

    Thom Weisel speaks, denies doping connection | Bottom Line | an SFGate.com blog



    Yeah, people are funny like that. Deny everything when facing prison time.

  93. #193
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    Axe, like I said in my post, LA did not win 7 TDF's. Giving me a neg rep without proof is a copout, I thought you were bigger than that, my mistake!

  94. #194
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    I am done hearing about LA. I am gonna go out and ride my new skateboard and try to forget about all of this crap.


  95. #195
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    This will settle all of your fears.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lance

    Well, it took a long time, but it looks like my plan worked.
    I apologize for leading everyone on, but it was the only way I could single-handedly clean up the sport of doped cycling. Playing the part to the hilt was the only way I could be sure to rout out all of the guilty parties. I hope you can all understand and find it in your hearts to forgive me.
    Thank you, and good night.
    -F
    It's never easier - you just go faster.

  96. #196
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    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9bZkp7q19f0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

  97. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lovedirt View Post
    Well im going to point out a fact here, NOBODY here was in his shoes or ever was in his shoes. Nobody really knows the truth about what goes on behind closed doors , and if you believe any of the " media " then shame on you . There is always 2 sides of the story , he will suffer mentally and emotionally and thats VERY draining . We are human people , everyone needs to sit back and take a hit from the pipe

    "Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again"
    You know puppet accounts are grounds for perma-ban, right?
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  98. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    You know puppet accounts are grounds for perma-ban, right?



    He does now.

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  100. #200
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    I am sure many other lawsuits will follow.

    The sharks smell blood and they will attack.
    The first sharks to the meal are the only ones that will be able to get a piece.

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