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  1. #1
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    Upset E-bikes on Mtn Bike Trails

    Yesterday I went riding at the White Tanks Competitive Track In Phoenix, Az. I was in the parking lot getting ready to ride. Before I got to the parking lot I noticed a truck parked where the pavement ends and an individual was getting ready to ride, bike in truck. Didn't think anything about it. Then I noticed the rider going through the parking lot heading for trail. Something looked different about his bike. Then I saw the large rear hub. This was an E-Bike. I thought how lazy. Then I saw the trail he was leaving. The bike with power to the rear wheel was digging in the the trail, especially on the climbs & was sliding on the corners. It is like a Motor Cycle. The trail sign says no motorized vehicles. When I finished my lap went to see if he was still parked there. He was gone. That is why he didn't park in the regular parking lot
    My point is not being lazy but Mountain Bikers a losing trails. A contraption like this will not help the issue.
    So be on the look out for e-bikes on trails. Let them know about it.
    Conserned Mtn Biker

  2. #2
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    Let the battle begin!

  3. #3
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    Was there a handicapped tag hanging from his rearview mirror? If not, you should have punched him in the face.

  4. #4
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    ^^^ lol...

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhartman18 View Post
    This was an E-Bike. I thought how lazy. Then I saw the trail he was leaving. The bike with power to the rear wheel was digging in the the trail, especially on the climbs & was sliding on the corners. It is like a Motor Cycle.
    Please take the time to re-post what you witnessed in the 'Fifty+' forum (see thread link below). You'll see there's a pretty heated e-bike debate going on & those few who are defending e-bikes claim they have no more impact on trails than the average MTB.

    http://forums.mtbr.com/fifty-years-o...ol-992022.html

  6. #6
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    Now go back and have another look but this time unbiased and also look at the trail damage done by a regular bike. I think you'll find they are the same.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by GRPABT1 View Post
    Now go back and have another look but this time unbiased and also look at the trail damage done by a regular bike. I think you'll find they are the same.
    I think you're being a bit biased. If it had a throttle, it very easily could do much more extensive damage than a real mountain bike. It's darn near impossible to tell the difference without getting up close and personal. Hence the heated debates on this topic.

  8. #8
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    I can't wait for the "ebikes destroyed my KOM" threads.

  9. #9
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    Regardless of what sort of ebike it was, if it's posted non motorized, it shouldn't have been there.

    Letting the ranger know is more effective than posting on a forum btw.

  10. #10
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    Does an E-bike have that kind of power to make a rut from hitting the gas? I was under the impression that they don't possess that amount of umph. I have yet to encounter any on the trails, but at this point I acquiesce. i could care less so long as they don't damage trails at any rate more than us nor pose any danger to anyone due to potential throttle power or what not.
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  11. #11
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    Ebikes do not have a throttle like a motorcycle correct? It's only assist based on rider pedaling.... I looked at one in the trek store and that's how it was explained to me. So I guess If you were to have explosive speed you may or may not damage the trail.... But if you have explosive speed why are you on an ebike?

  12. #12
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    Does an E-bike have that kind of power to make a rut from hitting the gas?
    The short answer is stock ebikes from your LBS no, kit ebikes, yes.

    Class 1 bikes are pedal assist with no throttle.
    Class 2 may or may not be pedal assist with a throttle on demand, same power/speed limits as class 1
    Class 3 may have a throttle and higher power/speed limits.

    The problem is that how the power is measured can vary, so it's easy to have a "legal" motor that is more powerful than intended. Aside from stickers designating the class, all three bikes are virtually identical. They are easy to mod to bypass speed/power limiters.

    The Myth of Ebike Wattage - EbikeSchool.com

    The CA regulations are solely to make people feel better since there are now regulations in place. They effectively will do little in actually regulating the bikes since it's so easy to bypass them and there will be little enforcement on the ground. The industry having pushed to have regulations defined are now free to sell, sell, sell.

  13. #13
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    I saw three e-bikes on the trail today. They blew past us so fast there was a sonic boom and a flurry of dust. I felt the tingle of electricity and the smell of singed flesh. The ruts they left behind could now serve as ditches!

    Actually they rode by us at a normal speed both uphill and downhill sections. You could hear a faint weird electrical motor sound as they rode by but nothing else out of the ordinary.

  14. #14
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    The throttle vs. pedal assist is dependent on the different type of hub and control circuit. A friend has an e-bike with both (and I did give him grief about using an ebike, but it's only for commuting). Depending on the motor size used and battery, they can easily spin out with enough torque to damage a trail.

    Only reason for an e-bike is if you're physically handicapped (like missing a leg handicapped) or for commuting a long distance. Even using one for commuting is lame, but at least it has the purpose of going from A to B without drive a car.
    "a hundred travel books isn't worth one real trip"

  15. #15
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    It's hard for me to disparage e-bikes without thinking I'm just another crank complaining about some new feature the industry comes up with. Sure, it makes riding easier. Just like gears, suspension, aluminum/carbon frames, big wheels, fat tires, etc, etc. All of these were new at some point, and we buy them because they make riding EASIER. My only concern is if the motors get so powerful that riders rip up the trail or become a danger to others. Then it's an electric motorcycle and should be verboten.
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  16. #16
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    The real problem isn't the trail damage or lack thereof today,the problem is that its another reason for mtb access to be banned or not allowed in a future area. Ebikes and regular MTB's would be lumped together by the bike haters. Who expects any mountain bike trail organization to lobby for allowing motorized bikes on non motorized trails and how could they do it with a straight face when we've been arguing the opposite since day one?

    Where's the benefit to the exisiting mtb community and what we've built?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhartman18 View Post
    i am a sock puppet. This is a sock puppet rant.
    ftfy

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryman View Post
    The real problem isn't the trail damage or lack thereof today,the problem is that its another reason for mtb access to be banned or not allowed in a future area. Ebikes and regular MTB's would be lumped together by the bike haters. Who expects any mountain bike trail organization to lobby for allowing motorized bikes on non motorized trails and how could they do it with a straight face when we've been arguing the opposite since day one?


    Where's the benefit to the exisiting mtb community and what we've built?
    yep

  19. #19
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    Its sad, every hobby I have someone is out to shut it down: bike haters, anti guners, anti fishing, anti hunters, etc. I just got back into mountain biking and people want it shut down.
    sorry got off topic there.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigt338 View Post
    Its sad, every hobby I have someone is out to shut it down: bike haters, anti guners, anti fishing, anti hunters, etc. I just got back into mountain biking and people want it shut down.
    sorry got off topic there.
    I know! These e-bike backers are working on getting mountain bikes banned from singletrack in many places by lumping e-bikes and mountain bikes together. It's extremely sad, but not as sad as when trail access is lost.

  21. #21
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    Weak troll. not buying it.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by watts888 View Post
    The throttle vs. pedal assist is dependent on the different type of hub and control circuit. A friend has an e-bike with both (and I did give him grief about using an ebike, but it's only for commuting). Depending on the motor size used and battery, they can easily spin out with enough torque to damage a trail.

    Only reason for an e-bike is if you're physically handicapped (like missing a leg handicapped) or for commuting a long distance. Even using one for commuting is lame, but at least it has the purpose of going from A to B without drive a car.
    Why is commuting on an e-bike lame?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by derekbob View Post
    Why is commuting on an e-bike lame?
    answer a): A lot of people on this website have been working on strengthening themselves and building up their endurance for many years. Would you think that it was lame for me to use an electric grocery cart because I wasn't in the mood to walk across the grocery store?

    answer b): This is a website discussion forum and people are entitled to their opinion-hence the term 'discussion'.

    answer c): Because commuting on an Ebike is lame.
    I'd rather push my 29er than ride a road bike.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by misterbill View Post
    answer a): A lot of people on this website have been working on strengthening themselves and building up their endurance for many years. Would you think that it was lame for me to use an electric grocery cart because I wasn't in the mood to walk across the grocery store?

    answer b): This is a website discussion forum and people are entitled to their opinion-hence the term 'discussion'.

    answer c): Because commuting on an Ebike is lame.
    I'm no fan of e-bike being considered as identical to real bikes as far as trail access goes, but on the street, who gives a damn? Most people that ride bikes also drive cars or motorcycles. How exactly does that affect someone else's fitness, or anything else for that matter? Don't see why any would give a shit about this at all.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by slapheadmofo View Post
    Don't see why any would give a shit about this at all.
    Some, and some more than others, including your humble poster in weaker moments, think that their opinions are very important and that others should accept them as such.

    My better self thinks that before I should tell others what they should/shouldn't do, I need to be able to demonstrate the harm that results from their current behavior.
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

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