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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmirBernard View Post
    only when strapped to explosives.
    Amir;

    Do you think it would be possible to create a different mindset by bringing mountain biking to the West Bank? Rather than strapping on explosives the teenager could look forward to a fun mountain bike ride which would be a deterrent to the explosive route.

    TD

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Amir;

    Do you think it would be possible to create a different mindset by bringing mountain biking to the West Bank? Rather than strapping on explosives the teenager could look forward to a fun mountain bike ride which would be a deterrent to the explosive route.

    TD
    no, they need to be re educated so they wont be as violent to people from israel/the US

  3. #28
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    different mindset?

    now instead of running with belt bombs they would cycle at you in full speed.

    also imagine what rob warner would say about arab downhill rider..

    LOOK AT THE T.......BOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!
    14' Canfield Jedi - The fast just got faster!
    15' Canfield Balance - The go to guy of the bike world!

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Amir;

    Do you think it would be possible to create a different mindset by bringing mountain biking to the West Bank? Rather than strapping on explosives the teenager could look forward to a fun mountain bike ride which would be a deterrent to the explosive route.

    TD
    It would be nice, but not too likely. This seems to be the more common after school activity in my neighborhood.


  5. #30
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    But seriously...

    Whatever the politics of the Palestinian areas (not good, whichever way you look at it), the economics is not such that much of the local population could afford a bike that is suitable for riding trails. For outsiders, there's too many risks caused by the politics.

    ... And I refuse to blame the politics on just one side. In the last 100 years, there have been too many bad moves by too many sides, not all of them exactly local. I also refuse to believe there's any easy solutions just around the corner.

    I have not been to Gaza but did a little excursion to West Bank many many years ago, in a UN marked bus. I recall that the terrain could be quite suitable for MTB.

    "it IS possible that you are faster or slower than anybody else who is having at least as much if not more or less fun"

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by perttime View Post
    But seriously...

    Whatever the politics of the Palestinian areas (not good, whichever way you look at it), the economics is not such that much of the local population could afford a bike that is suitable for riding trails. For outsiders, there's too many risks caused by the politics.

    ... And I refuse to blame the politics on just one side. In the last 100 years, there have been too many bad moves by too many sides, not all of them exactly local. I also refuse to believe there's any easy solutions just around the corner.

    I have not been to Gaza but did a little excursion to West Bank many many years ago, in a UN marked bus. I recall that the terrain could be quite suitable for MTB.
    perttime:

    I had thought there might be an economic issue that is why I was hoping to get several mountain bike companies to donate some bike for the project. I was also thinking that there are many riders who have older technology bikes that they might be willing to donate to a worthy cause. A five to ten year old bike might create a mindset change to the right teenager.

    Are there any citizens from different countries who are neutral politically who might travel to Gaza and the West Bank as part of a vacation, that also might also be into mountain biking? Maybe those individuals would want to help out. How about the Arabs who live in Israel, do they ever hook-up the the locals to do a mountain bike ride? Those Arabs who live in Israel might be neutral politically since they see the benefits of a more economically viable place to live. Maybe they would want to help out.

    TD

  7. #32
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    Beside the other points...

    Before you do anything, you should look for some local backing or at least approval.

    If you have the approval of some local Palestinian authorities, be it a Minister, Mayor, or Imam, you have some chance of accomplishing ... something. If you just barge in pushing something to the people, I doubt you'll like the results.

    Don't try to do it everywhere. Pick a location: a town or village. Or better, ask someone who really knows the area for a location.

    Your chances could also increase if you go with an organisation that already works there. Médecins Sans Frontières or the Red Cross (or Crescent) might not quite fit...

    Also, find out the Israeli view on bringing in a bunch of bikes (and people?). It is surprising what kind of things can become complicated.

    "it IS possible that you are faster or slower than anybody else who is having at least as much if not more or less fun"

  8. #33
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    If the UN recognizes Palestine as being a State will that help with the chances of building a mountain biking trail system in Gaza or the West Bank? What other kinds of positive change will possibly take place if the UN votes in Palestine's favor?

  9. #34
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    After listening to the talking heads of both Palestine and Israel it doesn't seem like a peace agreement is going to take place no matter what the UN decides to do. Apparently Israel wants peace more than Palestine, but the Palestine leadership is not willing to guarantee Israel's security if there is a border change.

    I wonder if there ever could be some type of security guarantee that both Palestine and Israel could be held to, that both groups could live with? Maybe some type of total destruction by a third party if one country attacked the other after a peace resolution was signed.

    Looks like the bike trail idea may be set back a while.

  10. #35
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    sure there can be, move all arabs to Jordan.
    14' Canfield Jedi - The fast just got faster!
    15' Canfield Balance - The go to guy of the bike world!

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    I wonder if there ever could be some type of security guarantee that both Palestine and Israel could be held to, that both groups could live with?
    Ever? It is possible. Soon? Grudgingly, which means "not really".

    As I said: "In the last 100 years, there have been too many bad moves by too many sides"

    The mutual ... call it "distrust", to be gentle, does not disappear quickly. I don't know if anyone in USA still feels strongly about the Civil War. We had ours, in Finland, in 1918. People no longer hate each other over it, maybe because we had common enemies in the mean time. But people can get passionate over whose attrocities were the worse back then.

    "it IS possible that you are faster or slower than anybody else who is having at least as much if not more or less fun"

  12. #37
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    disposable income what!!! f that my bikes are the best use of my income that i can think of, house place i can sleep in to rest up for next ride, car takes me to park, Food nourishes my body so i can ride,wife....cant think of a reason to spend money there, oh yea she cooks the food, dude this is the dumbest use of my otherwise useless input, put your own ass in peril but don't kill any of my riding buddies. lets get drunk and stay home, that sounds better, send us pics of your ride there with kevlar helmet and body armor.
    FIVE MORE MIUNTIES,JUST HOLD STILL !!!!

  13. #38
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    Hi L.K. Foster
    Are you still living in Ashkelon? If so, maybe you can hook up with my nephew,Mike, and show him so good rides in the area. He and his wife just made Aliyah from southern California last October and are living in the Ashkelon Marina. The problem is he doesn't have a mountain bike. If you want to meet a new aliyah contact me at
    mbiker10(at)sbcglobal.net and I'll give you his phone # and e-mail.
    Thanks
    Neal

  14. #39
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    Neal,
    I've been gone for a year now so can't help there.

    If he's at the Marina he picked a good spot. My apartment overlooked it, nice view and the rockets couldn't reach it. It's a bit far on the decent grocery stores but close to the only good restaurants open on sabbot.

    There's an excellent series of trails and bike shop that rents MTBs at Kibbutz Be'eri a bit south of Ashkelon. Take hwy 4 south to 34 to 232. Take a left at 25, right takes you to Gaza, and back on 232 to get there. The owner and his staff all speak English if that's an issue and are very helpful. I posted a video of part of the trail on YouTube, look for "Be'eri".

    Once he gets sorted with a bike the trail closer to Ashkelon is G'varam, just a bit south of Ashkelon on 4. Look for the mtb sign. It's a more interesting XC trail. It's well marked, as are most trails in Israel.

    The country is pretty good for MTBs with trails all over.

    Let me know if there's anything else that I can help with.

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