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  1. #1
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    Kind of a serious question......but not really though.

    Does anyone actually yield to uphill traffic on Tiddlywinks or Funner?

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    I yell strava as I pass, so everything is ok

  3. #3
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    Funner is not so bad since there are separate uphill routes and fair lines of sight on the two-way portions. I won't ride up Tiddlywinks though -- too much risk of getting blasted around a blind corner. If ever there were a trail in the area that should be one-way, Tiddly would be it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by letsgo View Post
    I yell strava as I pass, so everything is ok
    😂 So I'm doing it right!

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    What is the hold up with making Tiddlywinks a one way trail?

  6. #6
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    I did yield to one couple on Tiddlywinks, just as I was starting the descent, on Memorial Day weekend. I wouldn't want to climb that trail in the big jump lines.

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    FS is not happy with the work that's been done on Tiddly (on the 2 way section) and they are not wanting to make it 1 way because they think an illegal up trail will be created.

    At this point keeping it 2 way is irresponsible.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    FS is not happy with the work that's been done on Tiddly (on the 2 way section) and they are not wanting to make it 1 way because they think an illegal up trail will be created.

    At this point keeping it 2 way is irresponsible.
    Which section are they not liking?

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    the 2 way section with all the big jumps and giant berms.

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    So making it "one way" would solve this, no?

  11. #11
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    Agree TidilyWinks should be one way from the intersection of Kiwa Butte down to Storm King. Rode up it once with buddy who was training for Pickets Charge and it felt strange.

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    I understand that we have to milk the trails to accommodate the lowest common denominator. Tiddlywinks doesn't have to be one way to "The Confluence". If should just be one way to the Larsons interchange.

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    Down to larsen would be best for sure.

    I am guessing the FS worries about setting a precedent for 1 way trails which were not slated to be 1 way trails.

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    Nah, I say leave TW 2-way. Have climbed it 5-10x over the last few years and never encountered a problem. Shutting down TW as a climb would leave Funner as the only option up to Wanoga from SK. I don't dig that, even if Funner has a number of 1-way sections. And the alternative of riding up FS roads to Wanoga just sucks, especially in the summer. But, the idea that TW should be 1-way beyond Larsen (perspective TW
    DH) is just ludicrous.

  15. #15
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    You don't like climbing up Funner? That's been my favorite ride in the area this season. I love hitting that set of five or six drops and jumps on the descent right at the end near the confluence.

    I've climbed up TW several times (not this year) and had to pull over a lot for people coming down. I think if I'd hadn't heard them coming and gotten out of the way they would have had to panic stop. It's a little too close for comfort.

    Earlier this season I climbed up Funner to the first dirt road then took a sequence of roads up to TW and hooked on just after the Kiwa intersection. It did kind of suck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    You don't like climbing up Funner? That's been my favorite ride in the area this season. I love hitting that set of five or six drops and jumps on the descent right at the end near the confluence.
    I do like climbing Funner. However, I don't think I would like the DH as much if everyone going to Wanoga from SK were forced to UH Funner. The solution is to create a separate climbing trail to Wanoga. There is plenty of dirt for that.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpryIP View Post
    I do like climbing Funner. However, I don't think I would like the DH as much if everyone going to Wanoga from SK were forced to UH Funner. The solution is to create a separate climbing trail to Wanoga. There is plenty of dirt for that.
    That's true, routing everyone up Funner wouldn't be desirable. There is enough two-way on it that increased uphill traffic would be unwanted.

    I would love a separate climbing route up. I often ride up the Tyler's uphill route and I don't find it unappealing since it's relatively tight two-track. The roads I took to Tiddly were a combo of the wide gravel road (blahhh) and a narrow Jeep road that wouldn't have been all that bad if not for the blowdown when I went. Like you said, there's room for one-track though.

  18. #18
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    No argument with adding an independent uphill to Wanoga. The few times I have ridden up TW I have had down hill riders skidding hard to avoid me (and looking pissed off). Funner now has enough up hill only sections to make it the preferred method of getting up to Wanoga from SK. TW reminds me of what lower whoops used to be like when people would ride up it.

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    yes, everybody wants an official climbing route. But that's what the FS does not want. What we will get is another road climb.

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    If it's a Jeep road climb like Tyler's uphill route I'd be okay with it. Wide gravel road, not so much.

  21. #21
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    This probably wouldn't work, but would Tiddlywinks or Funner need to be one way if there was a one way climbing trail nearby. Put it just on the other side of the highway and paralleling it for the least impact.
    I only ride bikes to fill the time when I'm not skiing.

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    There are plenty of ways to get to the top of Twinks. Funner basically has its own up route. Larson's to Tyler's up route is probably the most interesting way.

    Twinks may not be official one way, but it is de facto one way.

    Yielding in Bend is a frustrating prospect, as in it doesn't often happen. I'm happy to step off whenever I can, even if I'm climbing, but after a day of dutifully pulling over for folks with little reciprocation its all to easy to say "screw it". Its easier for me to forgive a blissed out occasional rider that is probably ignorant of the rules than it is to forgive a kitted out bro that makes eye contact and says sorry as they roll you.

    I've started riding strong when I climb and not backing down unless it looks like a crash is imminent. Its led to some surprised looks from people and a few confrontations.

    I ride to have fun. Its easy to take this stuff too seriously, but its a pretty simple standard for yielding. Common sense route planning helps a lot too.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan View Post
    This probably wouldn't work, but would Tiddlywinks or Funner need to be one way if there was a one way climbing trail nearby. Put it just on the other side of the highway and paralleling it for the least impact.
    It would still be safer to be one-way on TW since the speeds are generally higher and the lines of sight are obscured in a lot of places. Even if there were only one other person out there that day, if he happened to come barreling around a corner right as you're ascending at the same place things could get ugly if you two aren't prepared to encounter each other.

    There is a lot of land in between TW and Funner that could accommodate an uphill trail. I don't think it would have to be across the highway. Actually minimizing the need to cross the highway would be better since there can be a lot of fast car traffic.

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    The NF4613 which is between Funner and Tiddlywinks could be an uphill option. I am guilty of being the guy who is coming down TW between KBT and LT and having to pull completely off the trail to avoid hitting someone coming up. In other words I was not able to stop in time. The line of sight just isn't enough. Just look at Strava to see how fast some are going down TW..

    https://www.strava.com/segments/1486080

  25. #25
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    4613 is a wide gravel road and it's not great to bike on. It has that really loose, deep surface that gets chewed up by auto traffic. If you look at the map, I rode 4613 up to the first left Jeep road (I don't see any number attached to it) after Kiwa Spring Road and it took me to the power line. It's fairly primitive and I could tell that no one has driven that way in a long time. That section wouldn't be bad to turn into an uphill route, but it doesn't extend all the way to the bottom near where Larsen connects.

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    yeah 4613 is not fun. No shade, and cars.

    Rode that during the wanoga enduro race and it was by far the worse section of the entire race.

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    I almost got into a head on going up Kiwa two days ago. Guy flew around a berm and almost took me out. Tough to get out of the way when your grinding up a hill. Unfortunately all you can do is be aware, listen etc. Other than that there is no solution.

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    Berms and whoops give the impression of a one way downhill trail. Riding up them seems awkward at best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dry Side View Post
    Berms and whoops give the impression of a one way downhill trail. Riding up them seems awkward at best.
    The vast majority of trails in the Wanoga area are two way regardless of any jump or berm features they may have. I know that Tyler's has a one way stretch.

  30. #30
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    Funner has several one way sections.

  31. #31
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    Tyler's is entirely one-way, isn't it? I can't think of a two-way portion of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    The vast majority of trails in the Wanoga area are two way regardless of any jump or berm features they may have. I know that Tyler's has a one way stretch.
    Words like "vast" imply a seemingly endless or immense amount of something. We're talking about, what, three trails (Kiwa and Larson's do not count. They are connectors and should be treated as such)? Tyler's is one way from the tippy top all the way down to the 41 road.....that's one hell of a stretch. This leaves us with two berm and jump laden trails. A rider familiar with the complex can make it up Funner with little to no downhill conflict. I might be coming on a little strong here, but you have to be a special kind of (fill in the blank) to willfully ride up Tiddlywinks beyond the Larson's junction. Given the prevalence of longer travel bikes, and Bend's skyrocketing bike population, it is only a matter of time before someone gets plowed through. That forest service road just below the Funner log drop is my preferred Tiddlywinks climb. It doesn't have much traffic and it only takes 15 minutes. The surface is reasonably firm too.........just say in'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post
    Words like "vast" imply a seemingly endless or immense amount of something. We're talking about, what, three trails (Kiwa and Larson's do not count. They are connectors and should be treated as such)? Tyler's is one way from the tippy top all the way down to the 41 road.....that's one hell of a stretch. This leaves us with two berm and jump laden trails. A rider familiar with the complex can make it up Funner with little to no downhill conflict. I might be coming on a little strong here, but you have to be a special kind of (fill in the blank) to willfully ride up Tiddlywinks beyond the Larson's junction. Given the prevalence of longer travel bikes, and Bend's skyrocketing bike population, it is only a matter of time before someone gets plowed through. That forest service road just below the Funner log drop is my preferred Tiddlywinks climb. It doesn't have much traffic and it only takes 15 minutes. The surface is reasonably firm too.........just say in'.
    No... we're talking about:
    Catch and release=4.5 miles
    Deschutes River=11 miles
    Dinah Moe=6+ miles
    Duodenum=4 miles
    Storm King=4 miles

    as well as Tylers, Funner, Larsen and TW. So yeah, pretty vast. Not to mention all the other areas which connect to Wanoga are also, wait for it.......vast.

    You're also assuming everyone knows the trails. Perhaps you should say, or meant to say that someone is a special kind of *whatever* if they ride up TW....more than once? I saw a couple doing just that when I got to the end of Kiwa.

    Perhaps the best way to ride the trails is to check your ego at the trailhead:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Kind of a serious question......but not really though.-traillove-3_666.jpg  


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    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    No... we're talking about:
    Catch and release=4.5 miles
    Deschutes River=11 miles
    Dinah Moe=6+ miles
    Duodenum=4 miles
    Storm King=4 miles

    as well as Tylers, Funner, Larsen and TW. So yeah, pretty vast. Not to mention all the other areas which connect to Wanoga are also, wait for it.......vast.

    You're also assuming everyone knows the trails. Perhaps you should say, or meant to say that someone is a special kind of *whatever* if they ride up TW....more than once? I saw a couple doing just that when I got to the end of Kiwa.

    Perhaps the best way to ride the trails is to check your ego at the trailhead:
    Catch and Release, Deschutes River Trail, Dina-mo-him, Storm King, etc,. are cross country trails. There is a distinct difference between the character of those meandering trails and the downhill trending berm and jump riot on Tiddlywinks. My grevience with up hill traffic on the true Wanoga trails (River trail....really?) has nothing to do with ego. It has everything to do with progressing safely. When I'm out of the complex in the vastness of our vast trail network I am the pillar of that COTA sign. The Wanoga complex is growing through an identity crisis.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post
    Catch and Release, Deschutes River Trail, Dina-mo-him, Storm King, etc,. are cross country trails. There is a distinct difference between the character of those meandering trails and the downhill trending berm and jump riot on Tiddlywinks. My grevience with up hill traffic on the true Wanoga trails (River trail....really?) has nothing to do with ego. It has everything to do with progressing safely. When I'm out of the complex in the vastness of our vast trail network I am the pillar of that COTA sign. The Wanoga complex is growing through an identity crisis.....
    All of those trails are part of Wanoga. There is no 'true Wanoga trails' over any of the others. There may be ones you personally like better, but they're all part of the complex....really. Perhaps you should slow your roll before you hurt someone? I've seen 8 year olds up there riding with dad. That sign is posted everywhere in Wanoga as well.

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    I'm going to have to agree to disagree with you about trail designation. Don't worry about how I roll. I'm in control and respectful. This is merely an excercise in Devils advocacy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post
    I'm going to have to agree to disagree with you about trail designation. Don't worry about how I roll. I'm in control and respectful. This is merely an excercise in Devils advocacy.
    Costigan's Wanoga Trail Complex=Tyler's and TW. For the rest of the world, it's this:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Kind of a serious question......but not really though.-screen-shot-2016-07-07-4.56.54-pm.jpg  


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    Tyler's is basically 1 way in it's entirety.

    DRT is NOT a Wanoga trail. It's also not part of Cota's portfolio.

    Wanoga was started using funds from an RTP grant. Party as a race venue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Tyler's is basically 1 way in it's entirety.

    DRT is NOT a Wanoga trail. It's also not part of Cota's portfolio.

    Wanoga was started using funds from an RTP grant. Party as a race venue.
    You might want to take a look at the site you list in your sig.

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    Ha. The site groups trails by region. DRT is not technically a wanoga trail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Ha. The site groups trails by region. DRT is not technically a wanoga trail.
    Oh we're speaking technically now? If so, Tyler's is not technically a one way trail then?

    A 'complex' is typically grouped together by proximity, region, locale etc. Cota doesn't maintain nor mark DRT, doesn't mean it's not part of the Wanoga complex. Cota has a portfolio of trails they maintain, but they don't own anything out there. Therefore, because of the proximity of DRT, it is part of the complex. Don't worry Tyler's and TW will be just as balls out hardcore as you want it to be, even with DRT within the complex lol.

  42. #42
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    DRT and Storm King were there way before Wanoga came into being so I don't consider them part of Wanoga.

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    [QUOTE=Rated R;12720848]Costigan's Wanoga Trail Complex=Tyler's and TW. For the rest of the world, it's this:[/QUOTEI

    Tonight I was out on a drinking social with a handful of riding buddies. Apropos to nothing and at various points of the night I asked each of them to name the trails in the "Wanoga Complex". Their answers were unanimous: Funner, Tiddlywinks, Tyler's Traverse. Rated R, real riders don't give a damn about your little print list. And you've drifted the thread. I'll yield to up hill traffic on any of that other BS, but I have a hard time doing it on Tiddlywinks.

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    And for the record, despite what you may drum up, DRT is not part of Wanoga. How long have you lived here anyway?

  45. #45
    Nat
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    I consider to be a part of Wanoga:
    - Funner
    - Tiddly
    - Tyler's
    - Kiwa
    - Larsen
    - Duodenum (actually I don't even consider this trail at all)

  46. #46
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    [QUOTE=Costigan;12721271]
    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    Costigan's Wanoga Trail Complex=Tyler's and TW. For the rest of the world, it's this:[/QUOTEI

    Tonight I was out on a drinking social with a handful of riding buddies. Apropos to nothing and at various points of the night I asked each of them to name the trails in the "Wanoga Complex". Their answers were unanimous: Funner, Tiddlywinks, Tyler's Traverse. Rated R, real riders don't give a damn about your little print list. And you've drifted the thread. I'll yield to up hill traffic on any of that other BS, but I have a hard time doing it on Tiddlywinks.
    Hmm, sounds like you have a little elitist MTB syndicate there. And for the record, it's not my little printed list, just the list on Bendtrails.org lol.

    If the inclusion of DRT in the Wanoga complex bothers your ego so much, may I suggest you petition the site to take it off? Post the petition on the cork board at 10 Barrel. Create a gofundme lol. Have all your friends grow beards in protest (mmm never mind lol) Have bendtrails create another less serious MTB list. Actually, they could change the name of Wanoga to 'the Gnarliest Gnar Gnar' so after the ride you could tell everyone where you went, and you can watch their eyes get real big when you tell them lol. That should make you feel better when you're waxing rental skis up at the mountain haha...

    Elitism in any sport or walk of life is foul. Nobody has earned looking down their nose at anyone else out there. You're going to lose your mind when they build that feeder trail straight from SR.

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    I don't even know what we are talking about anymore.

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    [QUOTE=Rated R;12721522][QUOTE=Costigan;12721271]

    Hmm, sounds like you have a little elitist MTB syndicate there. And for the record, it's not my little printed list, just the list on Bendtrails.org lol.

    If the inclusion of DRT in the Wanoga complex bothers your ego so much, may I suggest you petition the site to take it off? Post the petition on the cork board at 10 Barrel. Create a gofundme lol. Have all your friends grow beards in protest (mmm never mind lol) Have bendtrails create another less serious MTB list. Actually, they could change the name of Wanoga to 'the Gnarliest Gnar Gnar' so after the ride you could tell everyone where you went, and you can watch their eyes get real big when you tell them lol. That should make you feel better when you're waxing rental skis up at the mountain haha...

    Elitism in any sport or walk of life is foul. Nobody has earned looking down their nose at anyone else out there. You're going to lose your mind when they build that feeder trail straight from SR.[/QUOTE

    Taking shots at people's occupation is low and about as elitist as it gets. Yeah, I wax skis for a living. What of it?

    Anyhow, Tiddlywinks needs a climbers trail. It definetly deserves to be one way. Many people feel this way. The trail isn't "gnar, gnar". It's down hill trending in nature and it's riddled with terrain features that roll through sections with less than ideal lines of site. This isn't an elitist stance. It's just common sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    I consider to be a part of Wanoga:
    - Funner
    - Tiddly
    - Tyler's
    - Kiwa
    - Larsen
    - Duodenum (actually I don't even consider this trail at all)
    Duodenum.....I've actually never peddled that thing. Nat, it must suck pretty hard if you question it's designation as a trail.

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    Duodenum is a tough one. Used to be only accessible by riding down a road and riding the loop, but now there is singletrack down to the loop, and the up route on the loop was completely re-done as a road to trail conversion.

    I have not been on any of it since a couple years ago, so don't know how it is to ride these days.

    A new trail may go in from the top of the loop up to tyler's which will help.

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post

    Taking shots at people's occupation is low and about as elitist as it gets. Yeah, I wax skis for a living. What of it?

    Anyhow, Tiddlywinks needs a climbers trail. It definetly deserves to be one way. Many people feel this way. The trail isn't "gnar, gnar". It's down hill trending in nature and it's riddled with terrain features that roll through sections with less than ideal lines of site. This isn't an elitist stance. It's just common sense.
    Didn't taste good did it? It was low for me to post I'll admit. I figured I'd help you get down off your throne. I loathe those who feel they're above others. I'm sure you do too, so don't do it.

    May I suggest that you check your attitude when you're out on these trails as well. If it's anything like you've presented here, you're going to get yourself in trouble and/or hurt someone. Perhaps a few incidents up there is what you need in order to acquire some wisdom. They may help you get over yourself....

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post
    Duodenum.....I've actually never peddled that thing. Nat, it must suck pretty hard if you question it's designation as a trail.
    I tried riding it earlier this year then said "the heck with this" and turned around. I forgot who on this site wrote about it (Woodman?) but the creation of that trail had something to do with diligence in converting old Moro trails to mtb trails or something like that. It wasn't ever intended to be a big attraction.

    *moto, not Moro. I'm on my iPhone and can't edit easily.

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    Holy Hell. Rated R..does the "R" in your name stand for Ridiculous? It sure should.

    Also, since I'm throwing a comment into this insanity, Larson's to Tyler's uphill route IS a Twinks climbing route and so is Funner's climbing route. Someone unfamiliar with the area could mess up the "safe" way to climb Funner, but better signage could fix that.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by sickdog View Post
    Holy Hell. Rated R..does the "R" in your name stand for Ridiculous? It sure should.
    It stands for Royalty. As I'm the gnar gnar king of Wanoga. I look down my nose at the plebeians who ride DRT...

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    I tried riding it earlier this year then said "the heck with this" and turned around.
    I did the Duodenum loop for the first time on Memorial Day weekend. A group of local riders didn't even know how to find it when I came across them at the Tyler's landing where you break right to ride it. I didn't quit while I was riding it, but probably won't bother to ride it again.

    The "climb" is better than the descent, which has these very tight corners with uphill exits that don't flow into each other. The only thing I could figure for why it was built that way is that it was heavily anchored by an old fall-line on the descent and so they kept the corners very close together.

    At one point on the climb the freshest tracks on the trail were mountain lion prints.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    It stands for Royalty. As I'm the gnar gnar king of Wanoga. I look down my nose at the plebeians who ride DRT...
    Are you Streamrider with a new name?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    Didn't taste good did it? It was low for me to post I'll admit. I figured I'd help you get down off your throne. I loathe those who feel they're above others. I'm sure you do too, so don't do it.

    May I suggest that you check your attitude when you're out on these trails as well. If it's anything like you've presented here, you're going to get yourself in trouble and/or hurt someone. Perhaps a few incidents up there is what you need in order to acquire some wisdom. They may help you get over yourself....
    Re-read our collective participation in this thread...or at least re-read your blurbs. You're rich in arrogance. We might have found a new poster boy for the phrase "holier than thou". Christ, man, one of us is certainly looking down from some sort of throne.... Like I said a page ago, do not concern yourself with how I roll. I've been at this game a long time and I play quite well with others. Keep climbing Tiddlywinks if you want. It's all good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sickdog View Post
    Holy Hell. Rated R..does the "R" in your name stand for Ridiculous? It sure should.

    Also, since I'm throwing a comment into this insanity, Larson's to Tyler's uphill route IS a Twinks climbing route and so is Funner's climbing route. Someone unfamiliar with the area could mess up the "safe" way to climb Funner, but better signage could fix that.
    Bingo!

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Are you Streamrider with a new name?
    No I'm not. I'm ignorant of the reference.

    Anyway, apparently we have a few members who wrap their identity into this stuff. I'm a recreational user of these trails and I enjoy them. I wish you all the same experience out there.

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    Enjoying the trails is not a one way street. If you're only thinking of your own experience, someone else's will probably suck because of you. Lift your chin, eyes up, remember how to show mutual respect with a brake lever or two, smile, say "hi" and wish everyone well.

    And yeah, TW prolly oughta end up as a one way down but there's lotsa time for that. It took thirty odd years to get a full sheet of ice in the winter, eh?

    Cheers!

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Are you Streamrider with a new name?
    LOL, hey yeah whatever became of streamrider? Did he get run out of town?

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    Yeah Steamrider was on a number of Bend forums always complaining. I never understood why he/she remained in Bend.

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    All Good Natured

    I just wanna ride my bike and have fun. Sorry if anything I said here was inflammatory.

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    I don't really see anything wrong with wrapping up a little bit of yourself in a pastime. I believe we call this "passion". I mean, what do you really expect out of a loathsome, bearded, wax monkey?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Costigan View Post
    I don't really see anything wrong with wrapping up a little bit of yourself in a pastime. I believe we call this "passion". I mean, what do you really expect out of a loathsome, bearded, wax monkey?
    No worries, it's all good...

    You deliver the snark with just the right amount of sting. Enough where you get the attention, but not too much that you put yourself in a precarious position. It's a delicate balance...

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbmaddux View Post
    At one point on the climb the freshest tracks on the trail were mountain lion prints.
    Cool (but yikes)!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rated R View Post
    No worries, it's all good...

    You deliver the snark with just the right amount of sting. Enough where you get the attention, but not too much that you put yourself in a precarious position. It's a delicate balance...
    Lol, I suppose it is. It's evident that you've become apt at the waltz as well.... although you did turn your nose down at my chosen profession, which was interesting. Getting personal is never clever. It's all good though. Over and out.
    Last edited by Costigan; 07-08-2016 at 09:36 PM.

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