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  1. #1
    it means 'no problem'
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    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! COTA / USFS decide to block off the big feature on ODP

    The USFS and COTA have mutually agreed to temporarily block access to the large, elevated feature along the ODP trail, known as the Black Pearl, for public safety reasons. We are closing the feature because the risks are unknown and potentially very high. Please respect this temporary closure. We also ask that no new "mandatory air" features be constructed on public land at this time. COTA is working closely with the Forest Service to reach some common ground with the goals of ensuring public safety and fostering the development of world-class mountain bike opportunities in Central Oregon.Thanks for your understanding!
    "“May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view." - Edward Abbey

  2. #2
    Making fat cool since '71
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    That blows. It's built well and very rideable, but OK...thanks for the work and heads up.

    Brock...
    Are the wheels roundish? Ride it.

    Disciples Of Dirt, come ride with us.

  3. #3
    can't get here by wishin
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    "mandatory?"

    since when is doing any feature "mandatory air" sounds like newspeak for someone don't like it to me...people can't go around the black pearl? is it a black hole? does it have a force of gravity that sucks you onto the ramp and forces big table tops and drops? if so sign me up!

  4. #4
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    Yes, it SUCKS that we had to "TEMPORARILY" close the "Black Pearl".
    But we are trying to play by Forest Service rules. We are all hoping that this will be a quick process, but history shows that this could take some time. COTA greatly appreciates the patients of our community, and hopes that everyone understands that this is for the greater good of freeriding in our local, regional, and national forests.
    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

  5. #5
    it means 'no problem'
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredfight
    since when is doing any feature "mandatory air" sounds like newspeak for someone don't like it to me...people can't go around the black pearl? is it a black hole? does it have a force of gravity that sucks you onto the ramp and forces big table tops and drops? if so sign me up!
    "Mandatory air" is when you MUST become airborne in order to ride the feature. I thought that would be self-explanatory. The whole trail is open except for the big ramp feature, Black Pearl. It is important to note the FS could have said it needs to be torn down. They are being as accommodating as they are able to be - we should appreciate that.

    We are working towards a solution which will hopefully allow features like Black Pearl. Now is a good time to share your ideas on how that could happen.

    Thanks.
    "“May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view." - Edward Abbey

  6. #6
    Making fat cool since '71
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    Is the USFS against things with gaps (mandatory air) incorporated or just lines on trails which "mandate" a feature be ridden?

    I'm sure you folks are on the ball ('cuz you kick arse) I'm just thinking about the idea of (minimal) signing about "optional" lines/features which wouldn't make the rider get air or whatever.

    Like anyplace they see an orange (or whatever color...) diamond (or whatever shape...) they know to go right (or left...some predetermined direction) to avoid the feature or such. Just thinking out loud...I'll stop now.

    Keep kicking arse COTA and thanks again for the work.

    Brock...
    Are the wheels roundish? Ride it.

    Disciples Of Dirt, come ride with us.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaKlyde
    Is the USFS against things with gaps (mandatory air) incorporated or just lines on trails which "mandate" a feature be ridden?

    I'm sure you folks are on the ball ('cuz you kick arse) I'm just thinking about the idea of (minimal) signing about "optional" lines/features which wouldn't make the rider get air or whatever.

    Like anyplace they see an orange (or whatever color...) diamond (or whatever shape...) they know to go right (or left...some predetermined direction) to avoid the feature or such. Just thinking out loud...I'll stop now.

    Keep kicking arse COTA and thanks again for the work.

    Brock...

    The FS has a problem with any feature(weather its mandatory or optional) that you HAVE to get air off of in order to cleanly ride the feature.
    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

  8. #8
    industry employee
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    What if you built a little bridge from lip to lip, just wide enough to satisfy.....wouldn't that work?

    btw, thanks for your work, Nick.

  9. #9
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    We tried that idea with the FS, but they said we would also have to put a hand rail, in the areas that were above 4ft. YEAH!!! thats going to be REALLY!!! safe for people catching air. Plus, right now it is self limiting; if we make it rollable; riders of a lower skill level may find themselves somewhere they shouldn't be.
    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

  10. #10
    can't get here by wishin
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    black pearl

    i figured that was what the fs had in mind... they want it sanitized to avoid risk... no negative vibes were intended by my previous post... cota rules... carry on.

  11. #11
    it means 'no problem'
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    Quote Originally Posted by fredfight
    i figured that was what the fs had in mind... they want it sanitized to avoid risk... no negative vibes were intended by my previous post... cota rules... carry on.

    No negative vibes taken! No worries and thanks for the feedback.

    So far I'm liking the ideas coming up here. At this point my attitude is that "the only bad idea is the one you don't share". So bring it on.

    I also think the FS officials might read these forums, so they are aware what's being said and ideas coming forth. Nobody is excluded from this conversation.

    Brock, elaborate a little on your thoughts, there. I'm not in favor of more signage, but my experience with the FS is they do not shy away from it. ;-)

    Self-limiting is a good way to design stuff, and I think Nick & crew did an awesome job on the entire length of ODP accomplishing that.
    "“May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view." - Edward Abbey

  12. #12
    Making fat cool since '71
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    I'm not a huge fan of lots of signing or such, but signs v. handrails? I'll take the signs.

    I don't have any good ideas I think the FS would approve of. Even with the best of signing and clear direction(s)/legends for said signage...there's always going to be someone that genuinely (somehow) didn't see it/understand or is a full-blown douchebag/dipstick and just decided to send it on something he was woefully unprepared for.

    I originally thought of paint on things before a feature, but that sucks too, it's ugly and distracting...I'd hate for riders to take responsibility and educate themselves before riding off a ledge or bridge.

    Anyway, good luck. The FS tends to be pretty hardcore about the requirement for rails on "bridges" above 4' off the ground.

    Brock...
    Are the wheels roundish? Ride it.

    Disciples Of Dirt, come ride with us.

  13. #13
    newfydog
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    Good Grief! You should see the huge features on Crown land in British Columbia. Of course, there are a few people in wheelchairs, but no one made them try it.

  14. #14
    troubled economist
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    Quote Originally Posted by NastyNick
    We tried that idea with the FS, but they said we would also have to put a hand rail, in the areas that were above 4ft. YEAH!!!
    Sounds like an opportunity for step-up to rail-skinny to drop.

    Seriously, good luck in working towards a solution. I've been impressed by the work I've seen you post-- and optimistic that you will work something out.

  15. #15
    mtnjam
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    bummer about the step up on ODP...didn't end up riding it while we were there a few months ago.

    Sounds like the FS changed their mind about this feature. I thought this feature had the blessings of the land managers...

    Either way...definite kudos to having a good working relationship with the USFS about other projects on trails in the area and GREAT building of other features in the area.
    Just ride down there and jump off something for crying out loud...

  16. #16
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    Why not just make training wheels mandatory on all single-track. Does the FS know we're getting dirty out there too? Think of all the bacteria!

    Thank you, FS, for the care you've shown in deciding for us what's safe and what's not. Since we individuals don't have enough self-preservation instinct to decide for ourselves whether or not to ride something, your recent closure has surely saved us all from an injury plagued future.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by swift
    Why not just make training wheels mandatory on all single-track. Does the FS know we're getting dirty out there too? Think of all the bacteria!

    Thank you, FS, for the care you've shown in deciding for us what's safe and what's not. Since we individuals don't have enough self-preservation instinct to decide for ourselves whether or not to ride something, your recent closure has surely saved us all from an injury plagued future.


    Whoa!!! Just a tad bit of sarcasm there eh... Yes, it sucks that the BlackPearl has temporarily been shut down; but on the possitive side of things, the Forest Service could have gone out and cut up the entire structure with chain saws; but instead, they contacted COTA to work out a better way of closing the feature. We should all be very thankful that our local FS officers are so understanding and patient... Things could be way, WAY, WAY, worse. Just hang on for the ride, and it will eventually get better!
    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by NastyNick
    We tried that idea with the FS, but they said we would also have to put a hand rail, in the areas that were above 4ft. YEAH!!! thats going to be REALLY!!! safe for people catching air. Plus, right now it is self limiting; if we make it rollable; riders of a lower skill level may find themselves somewhere they shouldn't be.
    I am sorry this happened Nick! I agree with you about building a bridge across the gaps that it would make the feature just accessable enough to people without the neccessary skill to really hurt themselves. I also agree with you on the idea that we need to play nice with the forest service in order to grow the sport. If you need help showing a "respectable face" to your cause let me know; I can look and sound like a real respectable adult when I need to. Unfortuantely we ultimately have "third party liability" and insurance companies to blame for all this crap. This is what the USFS is worried about when they see stunts the the "Main Event/Black Pearl". We defintely don't want to burn any bridges here...unless it leaves nothing behind but a sweet gap!

  19. #19
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    i live down in Medford soo i'm not super familiar with your trails but i just recently rode the Lair and how is it that the huge ass drop to left hand berm that is getting built is ok but this obstacle is not? i've never seen what your talking about here but if the Lair is legit and this isn't how big is this thing?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratfab0120
    i live down in Medford soo i'm not super familiar with your trails but i just recently rode the Lair and how is it that the huge ass drop to left hand berm that is getting built is ok but this obstacle is not? i've never seen what your talking about here but if the Lair is legit and this isn't how big is this thing?

    First of all, the large drop you speak of at the lair, was built for a jump jam that happened a couple summers ago. We have been asked to remove that feature, as no one rides it.
    The forest service believes that jumps made from dirt and rock, can be argued that they're natural terrain; as where big features made from big logs and decking, can't really be argued that its natural. They originaly wanted us to take down the boner log jump at the lair, but we argued that it would disrupt the flow of the expert jump line. So they let that be.
    If you can't play by the rules (no matter how rediculous), then maybe buying some land, and building anything your hearts desire is the way to go.
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  21. #21
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    Here are some pics of the feature.





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  22. #22
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    Pile up dirt all the way around it so that the tallest any part is 6 inches?

    Surround the take-off in a staircase or banked ramp?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  23. #23
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    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

  24. #24
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    Can I help?

    Can I help in some way?

    I am a professional trail contractor (and President of the Professional TrailBuilders Association) based in NC and am here in Bend for the next 5 weeks. I have worked with the FS all over (we have worked in 20 states and 3 foreign counties) and understand the FS as well as anyone. It should be noted that the local FS here is way more progressive than anywhere else that I know of, hats off to COTA for all the years of hard work and grooming the local FS.

    I rode DOP this AM and looked at the structure, not at all surprised that they red flagged this structure. It certainly is well designed and built, and the step up is a great filter. But this is way out of the range of comfort level for the FS and they have to play by their rules. COTA also needs to be smart and concerned about liability and risk management, not only so you can keep a good relationship with the FS and doing cool things, but also to protect COTA and it's board members. I have served as an expert consultant in a number of trail related lawsuits and am under retainer for 2 in Canada now.

    I plan to attend the COTA meeting this week and look forward to talking on this subject and what can be done to re-design and re-open this kick arse feature. I look at other wood structures on DOP and had a few minor risk management concerns that I will share at the meeting.

    Also checked out the Lair this AM and was most impressed. I looked at the site 2 years ago with Sam and Kent and made some suggestions. COTA did a great job on developing the area and it exceeded my expectations, nice job to all who were involved in the design and development.

    I am here to help in any way I can. Also plan to do some digging as often as I can at the upcoming work parties.

    Woody Keen
    President- Trail Dynamics LLC
    President- Professional Trailbuilders Association
    Certified NC Clear Water Contractor

  25. #25
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    Your concerns of loose boards on features, is being dealt with. I will try to get out tomorrow and tighten up the boards that have issues.
    Braun Enterprises LLC, Building Cool Stuff

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