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  1. #1
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    Biking with dogs

    I visited central Oregon afew years ago and couldn't help notice the volcanic charactor of the region. I'm thinking about going back this summer with my bike and bordercollie. What trails are dog freindly? I'm worried about avalability of water and will all that pumice and obsidian cut up her paws?

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    I don't think the rocks around here to as much damage as you think on paws, but it will depend on how far you ride. My dog has blown out his paws a few times but it's normally when i ride too far or end up riding on pavement some. Phil's will be smoothest, but it's also the most full of people and other dogs. Too many dogs I think. I ran one over and was launched from my bike a few weeks ago on phils. Maybe just go very early in the morning or something.

    I just rode Skyliner trail with the dog, and it's about 5 miles each way. Was great for the dog. Not as heavily traveled as other trails. Mrazek is less busy as well typically, but it's very tight...

    The trails east of town are less used at now that west side trails are open. But they are a little more rocky. Horse Butte, Horse ridge, swamp wells.

    good luck.

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    If riding out of Bend then probably the river trail is your best bet for legal and water. It's not terribly technical but fun and scenic, and it's along the river so plenty of water. Anything on the South Side of Cascade lakes Hwy. is legal for dogs, anything on the North side (Phil's complex) is not legal for dogs although you do see dogs in Phil's with runners and bikers on occasion.

    There is no real obsidian on the trails around Bend, and the pumice is really fine like flour, we call it moon dust when things dry out as it appears to defy gravity and just hangs in the air forever. Almost unbelievably it is already starting to dry out around here and if it keeps going like this it's going to be a dust bowl this summer, we should still have snow covering most of the Phil's complex and it's already getting dry. Bend is super dog friendly and nobodies paws are really getting cut up so I wouldn't worry about that to much.

    The McKenzie River trail is another option and is about an hour from Bend. The Umpqua river trail is South near Crater Lake and is a bit farther but if you are touring through the area that's another possible water handy super cool trail but you would have to check on the dog thing for those areas as I have no idea about dog access.

  4. #4
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    I'd suggest considering fall instead when it's a little bit cooler. Our dog loves to play in the water, so creek crossings were always an added bonus. Skyliner TH to Tumalo Creek, to North Fork, Flagline, and back on Tumalo creek has a lot of water opportunities for the distance. The Peterson Ridge system in Sisters is good for dogs too. Couple of creek crossings and not too rocky. Also, the Entrada lodge is dog friendly and has a trail out of the parking lot that connects to the river trail.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Phil's will be smoothest, but it's also the most full of people and other dogs. Too many dogs I think. I ran one over and was launched from my bike a few weeks ago on phils.
    Hate to be a pain, but I can't stand dogs on the trail. I have had multiple issues with folks who have ZERO control over their dog/s. Often, they also fail to warn me about the "Second" dog. Just went into the Manzanita yesterday because of this exact scenario.

    I also find that the amount of miles is just simply too much for most of the dogs. They look overworked and exhausted. My thoughts are if you ride with your dog do so when the trails are lightly used (daytime during the week or very early in the am). I would actually prefer that folks who ride with dogs use the Forest Service Roads and not the singletrack.

    Just my 2 cents....
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    I agree with willem. I know you all love your dogs, but many people don't. And having an unleashed dog on a trail -- especially singletrack -- is just dangerous. I've almost wiped out several times by mutts flying out of the brush right into my path. Letting your unleashed Fido run free on the trail is just an accident waiting to happen. I know it is fun and the dog has a great time, but when your friendly dog causes a small child to wipe out and get injured, it's not gonna be so much fun.

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    If I was going to ride with my dog, it would NOT be on a trail with lots of traffic(anywhere near Phils TH), or where high descent speed could hurt someone. Saw some people climbing with dogs on Funner last week. NOT smart IMO.

    Maston would be good this time of year for a dog ride, but little water.
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    Dogs in Bend

    The OP did not ask for anyone if they "liked" having dogs out on the trails. Most chose to answer the question, while some had to give their self righteous opinions and taint the thread. Maybe if your shit was under control in the first place you would have stayed out of the bushes.

    Just my two cents.


    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Hate to be a pain, but I can't stand dogs on the trail. I have had multiple issues with folks who have ZERO control over their dog/s. Often, they also fail to warn me about the "Second" dog. Just went into the Manzanita yesterday because of this exact scenario.

    I also find that the amount of miles is just simply too much for most of the dogs. They look overworked and exhausted. My thoughts are if you ride with your dog do so when the trails are lightly used (daytime during the week or very early in the am). I would actually prefer that folks who ride with dogs use the Forest Service Roads and not the singletrack.

    Just my 2 cents....

  9. #9
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    Biking with dogs

    Quote Originally Posted by bb12creek View Post
    The OP did not ask for anyone if they "liked" having dogs out on the trails. Most chose to answer the question, while some had to give their self righteous opinions and taint the thread. Maybe if your shit was under control in the first place you would have stayed out of the bushes.

    Just my two cents.
    Thanks. It seemed to me to be very relevant. Free Speech on these forums.....cheers
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  10. #10
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    Actually the Deschutes River Trail is leash restricted from May 15th to Sept. 15th. except for about a mile of it at Good Dog! - just downstream from Meadow Camp. The north/south rules only apply during the winter and are only at the higher elevations. The Phil's Trail complex is off-leash legal year round, but please use good judgement on busy trails as nobody wants an accident (with a biker or a dog).
    I think the McKenzie is off-leash legal except at developed areas, but it is a long ride for most dogs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by trailsharer View Post
    Actually the Deschutes River Trail is leash restricted from May 15th to Sept. 15th. except for about a mile of it at Good Dog! - just downstream from Meadow Camp. The north/south rules only apply during the winter and are only at the higher elevations. The Phil's Trail complex is off-leash legal year round, but please use good judgement on busy trails as nobody wants an accident (with a biker or a dog).
    I think the McKenzie is off-leash legal except at developed areas, but it is a long ride for most dogs.
    I can't recall actually seeing a dog out on the trails actually ON the leash. The leash, if there is one, is rolled up in the owner's hands, so the restriction seems to be meaningless.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by bb12creek View Post
    The OP did not ask for anyone if they "liked" having dogs out on the trails. Most chose to answer the question, while some had to give their self righteous opinions and taint the thread. Maybe if your shit was under control in the first place you would have stayed out of the bushes.

    Just my two cents.
    Willem contributes more goodness to this forum than just about anybody so I'm okay with him giving his opinion.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Willem contributes more goodness to this forum than just about anybody so I'm okay with him giving his opinion.
    Thanks buddy!!
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  14. #14
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    I approach dogs on the trail the same way I approach ANY trail user. I assume they are completely unaware of my presence or will somehow act unpredictably, so I do what I need to do in order to avoid a collision. I have never hit a dog, but I have been hit by an idiot wearing headphones... I also caught my handlebar on a guy who was fixing a flat off trail when he looked up, made eye contact with me, and then inexplicably stepped back into the middle of the trail...(he was all upset about the little red mark on his arm while I was sprawled in the dirt trying to figure out why he knowingly walked in front of me...)

    There are only two types of dogs. Those that understand that they don't want to get hit by a bike again, and those that have yet to learn that lesson. Never assume a dog gets it. That's your fault.

    For those of you who have had bad experiences with dogs, I definitely blame the owner as well. I spent a lot of time conditioning mine to trails. He is very alert and avoids bikes. He often knows another rider is approaching before I do. He has more trouble with hikers because he is so friendly.

    To maybe help the OP, I have had good success with this stuff. It smells like cinnamon and WILL stain light colored carpet, but does dry in less than a minute. Upland bird hunters swear by this stuff as a cheat to toughen up a dogs footpads before the season starts. I have heard of marathoners and military types who use it as well.
    Tuf-Foot for Dogs (Bonaseptic): Tuff Foot for a Tough Dog's Pads/Feet
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    As for water, carry a bunch for your non-sweating trail buddy. I let mine drink from a portable bowl, then dump the rest on his neck and shoulders. There are collars that are supposed to help keep a dog cool, but I don't have any experience with one. I kind of like that idea for myself actually.

    Your best bet is to ride when it's cool out

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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    I also find that the amount of miles is just simply too much for most of the dogs. They look overworked and exhausted.
    Agreed. Don't turn the ride into a forced march for your dog. Keep the miles pretty close to what they are used to and increase gradually. I wouldn't go much over 5 miles with most dogs (if moving fast). I would work up to 10-15 miles MAX for most breeds, and NOT in the heat. Some dogs are motivated enough to kill themselves trying to keep up We have a huge advantage with our built in cooling systems and because we set the pace. Lack of a fur coat helps too.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Willem contributes more goodness to this forum than just about anybody so I'm okay with him giving his opinion.
    Willem also does more trail work than any regular contributor to this forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Thanks. It seemed to me to be very relevant. Free Speech on these forums.....cheers
    That was funny...America is great for those freedoms. And yes it was relevant Willem. Did the dog have ear buds in?

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    I didn't ask but it was my intention to feel out the local attitude on dogs,sounds mixed just like everywhere else. I wont take her where its not legal but if it is I will, and I'll expect you to ride in control. After all if you can't avoid hitting my dog how can you avoid hitting that small child(Dropper68)? That being said I'm not really looking for high speed down hills, she can run all day but she's not that fast. I'm also looking at woldo lake,whats that like? A freind says there is a great trail around Mt. bachlor but i cant find info on that.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by limplizard View Post
    Willem also does more trail work than any regular contributor to this forum.
    Yes, which is even more meaningful than posting on this forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kliemann53 View Post
    I didn't ask but it was my intention to feel out the local attitude on dogs,sounds mixed just like everywhere else. I wont take her where its not legal but if it is I will, and I'll expect you to ride in control. After all if you can't avoid hitting my dog how can you avoid hitting that small child(Dropper68)? That being said I'm not really looking for high speed down hills, she can run all day but she's not that fast. I'm also looking at woldo lake,whats that like? A freind says there is a great trail around Mt. bachlor but i cant find info on that.
    There are almost as many hikers and trail runners in the woods out here, so it's not just bikes you'll be mixing with. I think the local attitude is mixed, with opinions forming largely based on past interactions (both positive and negative). How about this: I'll agree to avoid interaction with your dog if your dog agrees to listen to your voice commands and avoid interaction with me? Sound fair?

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    Deal.

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    Dogs bring pet humans to the trails to pick up their poop. Dogs laugh at the pet humans whenever they condescendingly consider themselves master or trainer or handler or owner. Wild humans laugh at pet humans just like the dogs who own them. Perhaps someday man and dog will be true companions. On that day we will observe dogs placing human feces into plastic bags and carefully removing it from having to be picked up by humans trained to do trail work.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalitup View Post
    Dogs bring pet humans to the trails to pick up their poop. Dogs laugh at the pet humans whenever they condescendingly consider themselves master or trainer or handler or owner. Wild humans laugh at pet humans just like the dogs who own them. Perhaps someday man and dog will be true companions. On that day we will observe dogs placing human feces into plastic bags and carefully removing it from having to be picked up by humans trained to do trail work.
    I keep hoping that some day the horse people will start carrying bags around to pick up all the poop.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockin View Post
    I keep hoping that some day the horse people will start carrying bags around to pick up all the poop.
    I see less and less horses wearing those "diaper" things than in years past. Too bad. On the other hand, I have no problems riding through horse apples, compared to dog sh1t. Horse manure is just grass and oats, and is odorless, and does not stick to tires.

    Dog squeeze, on the other hand, can almost smell like human butt loaf.

    Oh, and please, putting your dog's steaming coil in a plastic baggie is only half the battle. Actually disposing of the baggie in a trash bin completes the process. I see so many full, tied up baggies sitting along the trail... WTF?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kliemann53 View Post
    I didn't ask but it was my intention to feel out the local attitude on dogs,sounds mixed just like everywhere else. I wont take her where its not legal but if it is I will, and I'll expect you to ride in control. After all if you can't avoid hitting my dog how can you avoid hitting that small child(Dropper68)? That being said I'm not really looking for high speed down hills, she can run all day but she's not that fast. I'm also looking at woldo lake,whats that like? A freind says there is a great trail around Mt. bachlor but i cant find info on that.
    The problems are not the controlled dogs.

    A lot of dogs like to run up front, and as we humans slow down going up hill, dogs don't. So the general fact that we are slow when travelling uphill and dogs are fast becomes one of the major sources or collisions. Uphill people can get out of the way if they hear someone bombing down a trail around a blind corner. Yes, I know, uphill has right of way, but are you going to sacrifice you body to hold your line around a blind corner? Dogs also are low and hard to see. You can be going around many corners thinking it's clear and wham!

    Other issues are when dogs like to run around off trail. That's great, but they will eventually come back on the trail. and they are so low to the ground they can't see a rider and they jet right into people. I have watched my dog do this half a dozen times. He's a liability.

    BTW - kids are a little like dogs as well. I ride with my 4 year old and if I wasn't telling him to get out of the way he'd either be run over or he would piss a lot of people off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dirt farmer View Post
    I see less and less horses wearing those "diaper" things than in years past. Too bad. On the other hand, I have no problems riding through horse apples, compared to dog sh1t. Horse manure is just grass and oats, and is odorless, and does not stick to tires.

    Dog squeeze, on the other hand, can almost smell like human butt loaf.

    Oh, and please, putting your dog's steaming coil in a plastic baggie is only half the battle. Actually disposing of the baggie in a trash bin completes the process. I see so many full, tied up baggies sitting along the trail... WTF?
    Thanks DF. I needed that laugh. Nice commentary.

  27. #27
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    I agree that folks overwork their dogs and let them run wild at times. It can be unsafe for the dog and bikers in some places. That said, I find other bikers far more annoying on the Bend trails than dogs...

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    You and I have differed about riding when muddy. I do agree with you here. I like dogs, but I nearly hit a dog yesterday on the way back down Farewell. That could be a real recipe for disaster on a trail like that for both the dog and rider on many sections of that trail.

    I wish I could come up with a good piece of advice here, but considerate people will ride with their dog where and when conditions allow for the safety of the dog and rider. Inconsiderate people, too many dog owners fall into this category and penalize the considerate ones, will do what they want when they want.

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    Man, I love dogs, really, really do.... Better than a lot of people I know if I'm honest.

    But any dog not on a leash is not right in the woods. For a number of reasons, but for cyclists, the only thing I have to add is that you may know your dog and vice versa, but I don't know your dog and they don't know me....

    I hear people say oh she's a good dog, etc, but I don't know - what if I smell weird to it and it decides I am to be dealt with? Everyone wants freedom, but.... hell - this is just one of those topics that is just a tough one....

    An old buddy of mine who hunts said that if he ever saw a loose dog ithe woods he'd shoot it. I thought he was nuts, but he began to defend his stance, and when he was done, while I still thought he was extreme, I saw his side.

    And what about people with phobias... If they are on the trail and meet with a loose dog....

    I say let your conscience be your guide....

  30. #30
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    How could anyone be afraid of Murphy? My biggest problem has been people stopping me so hey can pet him and feed him chunks of clif bars.
    Biking with dogs-image.jpg

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    Thrasher - that IS one lovable lookin' pooch!what breed? Looks like something that is a cross of two common, popular breeds....

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    Yep, he's a planned mutt. Father is a standard poodle, mother is an English style golden retriever. He's a big clown.

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    "my dog" is a good dog. He's just being friendly

    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    How could anyone be afraid of Murphy? My biggest problem has been people stopping me so hey can pet him and feed him chunks of clif bars.
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    You are right. However, when a person who has a poorly trained dog, they see many people with dogs, like yours, and say to themselves, "the're all out there
    with their dogs, so why shouldn't I be out there with mine?"

    The other issues are too many dogs terrorize wildlife, and spoil the trails with waste. he

    In the four years I've been riding in the Bend area trails, I can honestly say, the vast number of dogs I have encountered have been as well behaved positive instances. However, it's too often than not, that the few spoil it for all,

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    Poodles seem to make great mix breed dogs. Friend of mine has a 'Labradoodle' - looks a lot like yours - And is also a big cuddly mutt! ( and I use the term endearingly)

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    I train dogs for a living and unless you have a hunting shock collar on your dog to keep him or her in line you should have them leashed.... Just yesterday I had a pit run upto me and want to get pet..... Had I not stopped in time i would have flipped over the bars .... 95 percent of dogs when they see a Bike they go into hunt mode and want to chase it.... It's there natural reaction as canines.

    Keep in mind I love dogs and own them but certain breeds shouldn't be off leash and no dog should be off leash around strangers.... Remember dogs ar considered personal property and whatever they do or cause is your responsibility.... Be responsible and understand not everyone wants to have a dog lunging at them to get pet and listen to the owners screaming " come back".... It's kind of annoying.... With that being said if you don't own a yard where you can run your dog... You shouldn't own a dog period

  36. #36
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    Biking with dogs

    Quote Originally Posted by Njhardrock View Post
    I train dogs for a living and unless you have a hunting shock collar on your dog to keep him or her in line you should have them leashed.... Just yesterday I had a pit run upto me and want to get pet..... Had I not stopped in time i would have flipped over the bars .... 95 percent of dogs when they see a Bike they go into hunt mode and want to chase it.... It's there natural reaction as canines.

    Keep in mind I love dogs and own them but certain breeds shouldn't be off leash and no dog should be off leash around strangers.... Remember dogs ar considered personal property and whatever they do or cause is your responsibility.... Be responsible and understand not everyone wants to have a dog lunging at them to get pet and listen to the owners screaming " come back".... It's kind of annoying.... With that being said if you don't own a yard where you can run your dog... You shouldn't own a dog period
    I live in a townhouse community and have a dog (German Shorthair Pointer) along with many others in the neighborhood. None of us own a yard and do just fine. To say that we shouldn't own dogs because we can't throw them outside and shut the door is pretty stupid. The quality and quantity of exercise and attention my dog receives is far better than a lot of people I know that have dogs and a yard. Would a yard make exercising my high energy breed easier? Absolutely. To say that my neighbors and I shouldn't own dogs "period" due to the lack of owning a yard is ridiculous. There are many on and off leash options for exercise and play.

    Now that I'm done with my rant... I leave my GSP at home when I ride. I love saying hello to other dogs on the trail (and watching the YouTube videos of dogs tearing it up with their owners) but I believe they're more of a liability on the trail than not. I would love to bring my dog on the trail but if he was hit by myself or someone it could get really messy. For his own safety and the safety of others he gets his exercise away from the bikes. I've almost nailed a few dogs in Hood River and I don't want to put anyone else in that position. My dog sticks to my side but I figure better safe than sorry.

    To the original poster. If you're worried about your pups pads check out the little shoes that look like Keens for dogs. I've seen a few people use then on their trail dogs. Keeps their feet safe from cuts on the trail. My dog would spend the whole time trying to remove them instead of running but it might be worth a shot if you're going to take them on trails you're unfamiliar with.
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    I'm not one who thinks shock collars are cruel, but is not a necessity. Dogs have both their instincts and their training. Getting a German shorthair that is trained to hunt pheasant to follow you down a trail in pheasant country probably isn't a good idea. Getting Murphy, who is trained to follow me and sit at my side when I stop, to follow me is a different story. He is still a work in progress and has puppy moments, so I try to be aware of other trail users for the both of us. He often spots others before I do, especially hikers. However, if he is close to me and you run him over then you must be out of control and risk running over me, which will go badly for you, especially if you damage my bike.

    I would agree that many (most?) owners don't have as much on control over their dog as they think they do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    However, if he is close to me and you run him over then you must be out of control and risk running over me, which will go badly for you, especially if you damage my bike.
    What exactly are you saying here?

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    Doesn't matter how in control a dog is or isn't.

    Mountain biking trails are built with human height sight-lines. Many, many corners on our trails are covered in Snow brush and manzanita, so you can't see a dog at all.

    When dogs are running full speed, they apparently can't hear another bike approaching either. I witness this all the time. If they can't see a bike, and can't hear it, they will keep barreling forward full speed.

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    There have been, repeatedly, people mentioning problems with dogs on bike trails such as safety for the dog and the rider. I also mentioned dog-waste on the trail and how dogs can terrorize wildlife.

    The question I have for the dog owners who are taking your dogs out on mtb trails is: do these comments about problems of dogs on trails have any influence on you?

    Were you taking your dog out, but now either A) are considering not doing it, or B) ignoring legitimate issues raised by responders to this thread.

    Have you changed your mind, or at least considering it?

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    I'm saying that its pretty hard to run over a dog that trots along 2 feet behind my back tire without hitting me as well, which would make me very unhappy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    I'm saying that its pretty hard to run over a dog that trots along 2 feet behind my back tire without hitting me as well, which would make me very unhappy.
    Makes sense! If your dog runs behind and stays on the trail, I don't see a problem.

    Majority of dogs I see either run in front, or blast crazy off the trail and back on erratically all over the place. Gotta love playing chicken with a dog while their owner is nowhere to be seen, as the dog is leading and way ahead, then turns around to run back to the owner, now you are chasing the dog.

    I tried trail riding the phils area with my Boxer when I moved here, as I didn't know anywhere else, and after training him to ride behind me for the most part, it just was not worth it. It was still too much disrespect to other riders. Looked like a 85lb muscle with teeth running at you, and I didn't feel right stressing people out. I only take him out on the flat rarely ridden trails now.
    Bend, Oregon

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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalitup View Post
    Dogs bring pet humans to the trails to pick up their poop. Dogs laugh at the pet humans whenever they condescendingly consider themselves master or trainer or handler or owner. Wild humans laugh at pet humans just like the dogs who own them. Perhaps someday man and dog will be true companions. On that day we will observe dogs placing human feces into plastic bags and carefully removing it from having to be picked up by humans trained to do trail work.
    NOW if only the "Pet Humans" would pick after their horses like I have to do with my dog, I would be happy!!!!

  44. #44
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    If a dog runs 2 feet behind your bike, doesn't that spray all kinds of dirt and rocks in his eyes?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    If a dog runs 2 feet behind your bike, doesn't that spray all kinds of dirt and rocks in his eyes?
    Totally and my dog seemed to like to run that close for some stupid reason haha.
    Bend, Oregon

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    Quote Originally Posted by thuren View Post
    Totally and my dog seemed to like to run that close for some stupid reason haha.
    How odd. Someone should invent Doggy Goggles.

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    My black lad does the same. RIGHT behind me. When we're done he has dirt and pine needles all over his face...


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    I am a little confused with the direction of this conversation. Are you all talking about dogs with bikers on our trails? Or, all dogs on trails? Although I am an addicted MTBer I realize that the trails around Bend are NOT the exclusive domain for bikes. There are trail runners, walkers, horses (where permitted), wildlife, XC skiers, etc. Although COTA does the majority of the work on the trails that does not give ownership of the trails to mountain bikers.

    Many on this forum have a very entitled tone, instead I think we should be thankful for the awesome trail system we have and respect all trail users (SHARE THE LOVE).

    If Im hauling ass on my MTB and come upon a runner with a dog off leash, I dont have the right to be pissed at the runner and dog who were going much slower and under control. The forest service website explicitly says dogs are allowed off-leash with a few exceptions, such as the DRT and Green Lakes trails (leashes required during the summer season). So who am I to be pissed at people with their dogs off leash? Assuming the dog isn't violent/ aggressive...

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    I personally am not pissed at Dogs or Dog owners. I have even run over a dog on occasion sending me in the bushes.

    That said, I have decided not to ride with my dog anymore. He's not "in control". He runs as fast as he can all over the place and will chase other riders (he races other riders actually). So because of that I keep him at home sadly.

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    drunberg while I agree with you, I just feel it's just a courtesy thing. If your dog runs around like crazy(like mine), and I decide to let him run free right off the busiest bike trails, I feel I'm being a jerk.


    Some people walk down the sidewalk, and make everyone else move out of their way. Not illegal, but their being a d!%K!
    Bend, Oregon

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    Quote Originally Posted by thuren View Post
    drunberg while I agree with you, I just feel it's just a courtesy thing. If your dog runs around like crazy(like mine), and I decide to let him run free right off the busiest bike trails, I feel I'm being a jerk.


    Some people walk down the sidewalk, and make everyone else move out of their way. Not illegal, but their being a d!%K!
    You're very thoughtful. Thanks for that, seriously.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sketchbook View Post
    Mountain biking trails are built with human height sight-lines. Many, many corners on our trails are covered in Snow brush and manzanita, so you can't see a dog at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by thuren View Post
    Majority of dogs I see either run in front, or blast crazy off the trail and back on erratically all over the place.
    Great points!

    Not uncommon to have a dog appear "out of the blue" because it was hidden by the brush and trees.

    Quote Originally Posted by thuren View Post
    I tried trail riding the phils area with my Boxer when I moved here, as I didn't know anywhere else, and after training him to ride behind me for the most part, it just was not worth it. It was still too much disrespect to other riders. Looked like a 85lb muscle with teeth running at you, and I didn't feel right stressing people out. I only take him out on the flat rarely ridden trails now.
    A truly considerate dog owner!

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by StreamRider View Post
    Not uncommon to have a dog appear "out of the blue" because it was hidden by the brush and trees.
    That happened to me on Swede Ridge a few years ago. I saw the owner a hundred feet back and was ready for that encounter but then his 20" tall dog came full-boogie around the corner hidden by the manzanita and ran right into my front tire.

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    Thank you for asking the question. I have lived in Bend a few years and do my best to be as respectful to all whether on or off trail. I've wondered the general opinion for a while on this topic but never came across a thread like this. My black lab is so obedient, but when I take the leash off, she definitely becomes a wild animal. Despite staying reasonably close, she still will run ahead. With that said I have learned very few people are tolerant of an off leash dog running up on them in anywhere in Bend. I too want to take my pooch riding. I also know she would never hurt a soul. But ultimately I would be really bummed if my dog caused an accident which resulted in a rider or dog getting injured. I appreciate everything that was said in this thread pros and cons. Based on reading this I will refrain from taking my dog off-leash on the bike trails. No judgement passed on anybody either way. Cheers.Biking with dogs-img_1011.jpg

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    Thank you to all you courteous pet owners out there!

    And remember, just because you can have your dog off leash, does not always mean you should. I recently saw a loose dog on the DRT attack, catch, and maul a chipmunk. It offended my sensibilities, but the owner just shrugged it off like "$hit happens". No, that does not need to happen

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    Once Bitten, Twice Shy: More off-leash dogs means more dog encounters on the trails | Features | The Source Weekly - Bend, Oregon

    It's a beautiful, unseasonably warm Saturday in Bend. I have a paid baby sitter entertaining my two minis so I can ride as long as I want. Although it's gusty, I've opted for a trail ride, and feel smart as I imagine my husband and his pals riding their road bikes on the open, windswept roads east of Bend.

    I ride C.O.D., which is reportedly in good shape compared to some of the other trails in Phil's, and as I ride under the rock outcroppings I think of mountain lions. For some reason that trail, more than others, makes me aware of my appeal as a tasty snack for a big kitty.

    I push the thought from my mind, as I always do, and had a great ride up to Storm King. Coming back down, I clear some tricky sections and, feeling pretty darn sassy, decide to add a loop and extend my saddle time. I'm cruising on fast, tacky single track when a couple of animals jump from the brush onto the trail in front of me.
    I'm relieved to hear tags jingling, and realize they're just dogs - not mountain lions. As a frequent trail user, I'm fairly desensitized to off-leash dogs, and most of the time ignore them. The majority of them seem to be friendly and curious, if not particularly well trained, as I often have to brake and dismount to avoid running over a happy, panting dog running right into my front wheel.

    I don't see a person, but figure the dogs will run back to their owner, and notice a third dog running up to join the others. I can tell they've turned around to run next to me when I feel a piercing pain in my left leg. I look down at the dog that's just bitten me with disbelief.

    I yell for the owner, and see her running toward us from a distance. When she comes up, she knows which dog of the three bit me without me saying so, and is clearly distressed. I'm dropping F-bombs and unzip my leg warmer to see a puncture in my leg. Great. I know enough to assume I'll need a tetanus shot, and say so. Meanwhile, I don't ask for her information. I think she'll volunteer it. But she doesn't. She only offers that the dog has had its shots. I'm confused, and leave.

    My response isn't unusual, based on both expert and anecdotal verification. "You were just bitten," says the deputy who ultimately takes my report, when I admit my gaffe. His tone suggests I'd expected too much of myself, and I can't wait to tell my husband, who is furious with me for not getting the owner's information. A friend who's an orthopedic surgeon - and a practical, cool customer - was bitten last year while riding in Phil's. She assures me she did the same and bolted without exchanging information after she was bitten.

    Ironically, I remember having checked my Pearl Izumi leg warmers for damage, thinking I'd need to ask to have them replaced. But I didn't think to ask for the same consideration for my physical self. (Typical biker: the first thing we check after a crash is our gear.)

    After being bitten, I head home and use the rest of my babysitter time to hit the urgent care for a tetanus shot. The doctor, who tells me she was bitten by a dog in her neighborhood while running, checks the wound and tells me it's a crush injury and will be sore. She encourages me to report the incident.

    I feel silly calling the Deschutes County Sheriff's non-emergency line to report a dog bite, and say so to the deputy who takes my report. "Oh no," he says. "You have to report these things. What if it was a child?" This hits home.

    In dog-centric Bend, I expect my experience to be minimized as random, and worse, somehow my fault for not managing someone else's dog during my ride. However, the most dogged, canine-adoring members of my posse respond with more than sympathy. They are concerned that experiences like mine give Dog Love a bad name, and could potentially threaten off-leash access for responsible dog owners.

    "We don't want to put restrictions on people, but we do want everybody to have a good experience in the forest," says Jean Nelson-Dean, the Public Affairs Officer for the Deschutes National Forest. "It's more than just our management. It's people taking personal responsibility and respecting the needs of others."

    Two of my friends share heartbreaking, personal stories of having to put aggressive dogs down. They felt it wasn't worth the risk of having a hostile dog, one that was increasingly showing signs of being a four-legged time bomb, and made an incredibly difficult decision.

    "People have to be accountable for their pets," says Lieutenant Shane Nelson of the Deschutes County Sheriff. "Your dog has to be under your control - and that can be by voice command - but only if the dog listens to you."

    Nelson leashes the dog he's owned for ten years when he's around other people because he says he's just not 100 percent sure how the dog will react. Nelson-Dean, who is also a dog owner, agrees. "You can't totally predict what a dog is going to do," she says.

    So what should you do if you're bitten?

    "The first thing is to make the situation safe," says Nelson. "You need to be prepared to defend yourself against the animal, and have the owner get control of the animal." Depending on the severity of the bite, you may need to get immediate medical attention. Otherwise, get the owner's name and contact information and report the incident to the authority with jurisdiction.

    Unlike an attack in your neighborhood, where it's reasonably easy to identify the owner of the dog, one in the woods puts the victim at an unfair disadvantage. Although you can request the owner's information, they do not have to give it. In this case, Nelson suggests gathering as many details as possible, including a license plate, and calling authorities immediately.

    "We really want those dog bite reports," says Nelson.

    Ultimately, I'm able to connect with the dog owner - Bend is small town - and she is sincerely contrite and offers to pay for my tetanus shot. More importantly, she assures me she'll keep the dog that bit me on a leash from now on.

    "County code dictates that the owner of the animal has to have complete control of that animal at all times," explains Nelson. "People will tell you their animal is friendly, or doesn't bite. But if you don't feel comfortable around the animal, ask them to get control of it."

    So how will this experience change the way I respond to off-leash dogs on the trail? Please don't be upset if I yell authoritatively at your dog, to establish myself as the "alpha," as I was advised to do by some of my dog-loving friends. I might not say, "It's OK," when your dog forces me to yield the trail. And I might ask you to restrain your dog, especially if my minis are with me.

  57. #57
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    ^ related thread: Dog bite incident on C.O.D. (Bend)

    Last weekend down near Paulina Lakes an off-leash Pit rushed over to bark at me and my family. The owner yelled over from his campsite, "Oh he doesn't bite; he's only 7 months old!" So does that mean when he's a little older he will bite? Great!

    I was able to shoo it away but my daughters were freaked out. I was a bit concerned because he was a Pit that was definitely not under voice control.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    ^ related thread: Dog bite incident on C.O.D. (Bend)

    Last weekend down near Paulina Lakes an off-leash Pit rushed over to bark at me and my family. The owner yelled over from his campsite, "Oh he doesn't bite; he's only 7 months old!" So does that mean when he's a little older he will bite? Great!

    I was able to shoo it away but my daughters were freaked out. I was a bit concerned because he was a Pit that was definitely not under voice control.
    I find it hard to trust young dog's, and the owner was pretty lame to assume he,"knew his dog", well enough at that age. If a 7 month old puppy is already running over to bark at you, man.......
    Bend, Oregon

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    Items to get before bringing Murph to Bend:
    -muzzle
    -orange safety vest
    -dune flag (like quads and dune buggies use to improve visibility behind dunes)
    -bear bell (maybe a tambourine?)
    -hazard lights
    -deer whistle (to warn native wildlife)
    -"how's my trail etiquette?, call 1-800-123-4567" bumper sticker
    -sign that says "I like clif bars (no chocolate please)!"

    Am I missing anything?

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    Items to get before bringing Murph to Bend:
    -muzzle
    -orange safety vest
    -dune flag (like quads and dune buggies use to improve visibility behind dunes)
    -bear bell (maybe a tambourine?)
    -hazard lights
    -deer whistle (to warn native wildlife)
    -"how's my trail etiquette?, call 1-800-123-4567" bumper sticker
    -sign that says "I like clif bars (no chocolate please)!"

    Am I missing anything?
    Obedience training will suffice.

  61. #61
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    Some dogs are trail dogs, and some have no business running free around bikes. My seven year old Weim goes on hikes, but no trail riding for him. There never has. He has poor listening skills and does whatever he wants.

    My one year old Weim was born to trail ride. It's his passion (as seen in his line selection). All he cares about is running the trail and nothing will distract him. He has blinders on really. I make it a point to pull off the trail for every other user if he's with me off leash, and it's to the point now where I don't even say anything to him anymore. He knows the drill.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

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    That's funny Thrasher_s!

    me-im all for dogs on trails as long as there nice! if your dog shows or has showed any aggression to bikes or people then please keep it on a leash....that what i do for my dog.

    cb

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    Am I missing anything?
    Cone of shame.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    Items to get before bringing Murph to Bend:
    -muzzle
    -orange safety vest
    -dune flag (like quads and dune buggies use to improve visibility behind dunes)
    -bear bell (maybe a tambourine?)
    -hazard lights
    -deer whistle (to warn native wildlife)
    -"how's my trail etiquette?, call 1-800-123-4567" bumper sticker
    -sign that says "I like clif bars (no chocolate please)!"

    Am I missing anything?
    Is the muzzle for the whiny MTBR people?
    I only ride bikes to fill the time when I'm not skiing.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan View Post
    Is the muzzle for the whiny MTBR people?
    Is it whining to discuss a valid topic? Water issues, trailhead parking lot development, and sharing the trail with other users all seem like legitimate issues to discuss to me.

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Water issues, trailhead parking lot development, and sharing the trail with other users all seem like legitimate issues to discuss to me.
    Very well said!

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldHouseMan View Post
    Is the muzzle for the whiny MTBR people?
    Funny Guys get their pink panties in a bunch very easily.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    ^ related thread: Dog bite incident on C.O.D. (Bend)

    Last weekend down near Paulina Lakes an off-leash Pit rushed over to bark at me and my family. The owner yelled over from his campsite, "Oh he doesn't bite; he's only 7 months old!" So does that mean when he's a little older he will bite? Great!

    I was able to shoo it away but my daughters were freaked out. I was a bit concerned because he was a Pit that was definitely not under voice control.
    Nat,
    In that situation at a camp ground or in the open I find when I pull out my .45 XD and tell the owner I will shoot their dog if they don't get it under control works quite well. Extreme maybe, children's welfare way more important. And yes sometimes I do carry when I ride depending what trail I'm on. Better to have a gun and not need it then to need one and not have one.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by CmbtDvr185 View Post
    Nat,
    In that situation at a camp ground or in the open I find when I pull out my .45 XD and tell the owner I will shoot their dog if they don't get it under control works quite well. Extreme maybe, children's welfare way more important. And yes sometimes I do carry when I ride depending what trail I'm on. Better to have a gun and not need it then to need one and not have one.
    I can see how that method would be effective. I did not have a pistol on me so my plan, if sh*t went down, was to feed the dog my left hand while I called my lawyer with my other hand. Or something like that. Har.

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    Pink panties remind me of something obvious that I missed.
    -diaper

  71. #71
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    Heck just carry a shot gun wherever you go with a speed dial to a lawyer. Gotta love America! Beauty.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by CmbtDvr185 View Post
    And yes sometimes I do carry when I ride depending what trail I'm on. Better to have a gun and not need it then to need one and not have one.
    Where are you carrying? I've riden with IWB G26, but man - I'd hate to land on it.
    In the pack seems too slow if a big cat/dog pops out...

    I'm thinking 1911A1 detective-style shoulder holster with integrated H20 bladder
    Time wounds all heels...

  73. #73
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    This is only tangentially connected to this thread so I'm not suggesting it's the same thing, but I clicked on CNN this morning and the following article made me think of this conversation. Have you guys read this messed up story? Cripes. Totally sickening.

    Little boy survives monster tornado, only to be mauled to death - CNN.com

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirt farmer View Post
    Oh, and please, putting your dog's steaming coil in a plastic baggie is only half the battle. Actually disposing of the baggie in a trash bin completes the process. I see so many full, tied up baggies sitting along the trail... WTF?
    You may enjoy my thread on pooh baggers. One of my pet peeves....no pun intended.
    Stop The Pooh-Baggin' Now!

    Sorry OP, didn't mean to thread-jack, but thought this was pertinent to the conversation.

    STOP THE POOH-BAGGIN' NOW!

    *2016 Transition Patrol Carbon (aka: Sweet Pea)

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    Clearly this is an important subject or this thread would no longer exist at the top of the board. Time for another in the field, real world example of dog owner stupidity. For every awesome dog owner, there are three idiot dog owners in my opinion. That is too bad. I had a couple of interactions with dogs and their owners yesterday. One was horrible and the other two were just typical. Yesterday was my birthday and I decided to take the day off and go for an epic Singlespeed ride here in Bend. Ended up doing 65.5 miles with almost 6K in climbing. It was fun.

    While climbing up North Fork, I encountered a dog running full speed at my bike down the trail. It was some kind of mix that did not look threatening in terms of the breed type (i.e. not a Pitbull or Rott). It was barking and growling and ran past me on the trail. I thought, "Okay, he must be chasing something further down the trail...". Nope! He did a U-Turn after passing me and proceeded to chase me and nip at my Achilles and Calf Muscle. Luckily for me he was not successful. I un-clipped my foot from the pedal and proceeded to kick the dog in face with my cleat, then re-clipped and continued pedaling. Didn't want to mess up my Strava time because of a damn dog!! I then encountered the owners of the dog. They were not upset with their dog, but with me!! WOW, what a surprise..... Not. While pedaling, I let them know what happened and they said that their dog just barks and growls and does not bite. I proceeded to say, "How in the hell am I supposed to know that?". The man yelled at me up the trail in a pissed off tone that implied that he wanted to "discuss" the matter with me. I told him that I wanted to continue my ride and that they should get a handle on their dog or someone will proceed to kick the crap out of it. He did not like this based on his response and of course his wife or gal pal proceeded to grab him and stop him from running after me. Good thing I am somewhat speedy on my bicycle.... Yet another example of on the trail dog/owner mis-behavior. I have no doubt these types of scenarios will continue... The other interactions throughout my ride with dogs and owners were typical. No aggression, just dogs that were out of control running into bushes, out of bushes, all over the trail, at my bike, etc... My feelings toward dogs and their owners continues to be reinforced in the negative.

    My 2 cents... If you do not know how your dog might behave on a trail, don't take it on the trail. If you are hiking, use a leash. Do not take your dog on busy trails or narrow trails were conflicts will occur. Also, be nice to other trail users when you are out there with your dog. Don't blame the messenger.... Look in the damn mirror. Dogs that are not well behaved are a reflection of the owner.
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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Ended up doing 65.5 miles with almost 6K in climbing. It was fun.
    The dog encounter sucks. What really stuck-out is the 65.5 miles and 6K of climbing on a SS. Nice.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpryIP View Post
    The dog encounter sucks. What really stuck-out is the 65.5 miles and 6K of climbing on a SS. Nice.
    It was fun. The dog encounter did not put a damper on the day. I quickly got focused on the ride again. Man & Machine versus the trail! Good stuff. What life is all about.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostRing View Post
    Where are you carrying? I've riden with IWB G26, but man - I'd hate to land on it.
    In the pack seems too slow if a big cat/dog pops out...

    I'm thinking 1911A1 detective-style shoulder holster with integrated H20 bladder
    If I carry when I ride it's in the pack. I have an old camelback Hawg from my military days. Has some good outside pockets. I'm not going to have a hip or shoulder holster, God only knows what would happen when I took a header, not to mention the freak out factor for others on the trail. I also don't have a round chambered when I ride either for the above header reason. I would use my bike as a shield. And go for my pack. I can get it out in about 7-8 seconds with no adrenalin rush. I like the shotgun idea, carry it like the guy did in the movie Aliens. Happy Birthday Willem!! I would have like to seen that encounter on N. Fork, "hold me back, hold me back". Cardio always wins!

  80. #80
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    Willem, that sucks about the dog encounter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Willem, that sucks about the dog encounter.
    It does! Total pain in the ass. Hate to see my negative opinion of dogs on the trail validated. However, the facts are the facts. One thing I learned yesterday, is that you will not change the dog owner or the dog, just protect yourself and your gear. Nothing else matters!
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    Quote Originally Posted by CmbtDvr185 View Post
    If I carry when I ride it's in the pack. I have an old camelback Hawg from my military days. Has some good outside pockets. I'm not going to have a hip or shoulder holster, God only knows what would happen when I took a header, not to mention the freak out factor for others on the trail. I also don't have a round chambered when I ride either for the above header reason. I would use my bike as a shield. And go for my pack. I can get it out in about 7-8 seconds with no adrenalin rush. I like the shotgun idea, carry it like the guy did in the movie Aliens. Happy Birthday Willem!! I would have like to seen that encounter on N. Fork, "hold me back, hold me back". Cardio always wins!
    Tough to carry concealed while riding. Easy in daily life. Always have the challenge of "printing". As a Lycra guy with no Camelback, it is even more of a challenge. I have looked into a smaller frame, like the PM9 (http://www.kahr.com/pistols/kahr-pm9.asp). My G26 and G30SF are too big and show up too much. Although, the best solution is just to be FAST! Cardio and leg strength do win in the end!
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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Tough to carry concealed while riding. Easy in daily life. Always have the challenge of "printing". As a Lycra guy with no Camelback, it is even more of a challenge. I have looked into a smaller frame, like the PM9 (Kahr PM9 - Style # PM9093, Kahr Arms Pistols). My G26 and G30SF are too big and show up too much. Although, the best solution is just to be FAST! Cardio and leg strength do win in the end!
    That's true. Not matter what if you are in Lycra it will show, And I don't carry all the time. If I'm on a quick ride through Phils or coming down from Wanoga I won't. Also if I'm with grp I won't depending on where we are planning on going. Mostly if I'm solo and I planned to go past Happy Valley and around. Although the other day I was coming down South Fork and wiped out right before the bridge, I was brushing my self off and my spider sense started tingling, hair raised up. Felt watched. I rode on at a higher rate of speed. Willem you are probably in the top 1% when it comes to cardio, most dogs couldn't keep up with you LOL

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    Here is your answer then guys.........



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    *2016 Transition Patrol Carbon (aka: Sweet Pea)

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    Mace Muzzle Dog Pepper Spray?

    Pepper Spray, Mace, Stun Gun, TASER, Self Defense Products

    Did you know that there are nearly 5 million reported dog attacks in the United States every year? Thatís one attack every 75 seconds! And more than 1,000 emergency room visits per day are the result of aggressive dog attacks. Donít be a statistic! Keep that aggressive dog away with Mace Muzzle Dog Repellent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CmbtDvr185 View Post
    That's true. Not matter what if you are in Lycra it will show
    I don't wear Lycra specifically because my "weapon" prints.

    (For non-gun people, "printing" is when you can see the outline of a concealed firearm under your clothing, and yes, the above is a penis joke)

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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Didn't want to mess up my Strava time because of a damn dog!!
    I empathized with you until you said this... I'm not sure if you are kidding or not, but this is exactly the kind of rider I worry about. More concerned with your time than the well being of others. The same types that run me off the trail when I am on a steep climb...


    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    then encountered the owners of the dog. They were not upset with their dog, but with me!! WOW, what a surprise.....Not
    I'm back on your side again. I am a teacher and I deal with the parents of kids who are slacker pains in my ass, and who detract from the learning of all of the other students, yet it is MY fault... My current theory is that their admission that the student is/has a problem is an admission of their failure as parents, which they can't/won't accept.


    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    I told him that I wanted to continue my ride and that they should get a handle on their dog or someone will proceed to kick the crap out of it. He did not like this based on his response
    What did you expect his response to be? Thanks! Please do harm my beloved pet!

    That said, when training my trail dog I made sure he had a few, careful, negative experiences with other bikers. They didn't run his butt over or Unclip and kick him, but I had a couple friends scare him on their bikes by riding by and acting scary and yelling at him when he approached. Works for a pup.
    Last edited by thrasher_s; 06-17-2013 at 09:07 AM.

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    Is this a suggestion for a Murphy accessory? I guess he could mace hikers and steal their Clif bars.

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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    He did a U-Turn after passing me and proceeded to chase me and nip at my Achilles and Calf Muscle.
    Types of Aggressive Dog Behavior

    Predatory Aggression

    People, animals and things in motion trigger this behavior. It is associated with the hunting and stalking prey drive. They tend to attack with the victim or object moves away. This dog will chase joggers, children, cats, bikes, cars -- anything that moves, including someone just strolling by. It's a mistake to think that the chasing dog will not deliver on his threat.
    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    While pedaling, I let them know what happened and they said that their dog just barks and growls and does not bite.
    That is what many owners of aggressive dogs say right up until the dog bites. Unfortunately making excuses for aggressive behavior is all too common.

    Dog Tip: Aggression, Growling, Lunging at Dogs and People Outdoors

    When a dog starts to show aggressive behavior in public, most people make excuses for their dog. "He's just scared." "That person stared at her!" "Those kids were making entirely too much noise!"

    Don't make excuses. Don't deny what is right before your eyes. Your dog needs your help, and there's no time to waste.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StreamRider View Post
    That is what many owners of aggressive dogs say right up until the dog bites. Unfortunately making excuses for aggressive behavior is all too common.
    Agreed. Most growling is a sign of dominant/territorial behavior or fear, either could lead to a bite. There is such a thing as playful growling, but there is a HUGE difference, and I discourage it anyway because strangers might not know the difference.

    If my dog was growling and showing teeth I would be mortified. Fortunately he has never met somebody he didn't immediately love, which is actually a problem because he will walk up to ANYBODY.

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    Couple things. I think you mean empathized not emphasized. Mr. teacher.
    I don't always agree with Willem but in this case I agree with pretty much everything Willem did. Actually the dog and owner got off easy but that is my opinion. Just because a person uses strava doesn't mean they are some complete out of control *******. I use it to see how I'm improving or not. I'm competitive, I'm not out there to hear bees buzzing or birds chipping. I use my bike to work out and try and go has hard as I can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cmbtdvr185 View Post
    i'm not out there to hear bees buzzing or birds chipping. I use my bike to work out and try and go has hard as i can.
    awesome!
    Bend, Oregon

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    Quote Originally Posted by CmbtDvr185 View Post
    Just because a person uses strava doesn't mean they are some complete out of control *******.
    Oh then you don't know Willem like I know Willem...

    Kidding!

    I want to grab Murphy and squeeze him and roll around on the grass with him. He looks really fluffy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Oh then you don't know Willem like I know Willem...

    Kidding!

    I want to grab Murphy and squeeze him and roll around on the grass with him. He looks really fluffy.
    Hilarious!!!! You follow me on Strava.... You do know. ;-)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Oh then you don't know Willem like I know Willem...

    Kidding!

    I want to grab Murphy and squeeze him and roll around on the grass with him. He looks really fluffy.
    Hilarious!!!!
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    Though I did get "auto-corrected" trying to write empathized, technically I should have written sympathized.
    I didn't intend to generalize about all strava users, but there is a growing number of riders who are ignoring trail etiquette, sometimes putting others at risk, to save a few seconds on an afternoon ride... It's worse, but not as annoying, as the riders who speed up when I come up behind them and then block when I want to pass...
    While I understand that experiencing nature is not your main goal, I hope the background of the woods adds in some way to your ride. At least it decreases your odds of being run over by a speeding minivan.

    Also, there aren't any birds and bees left because they were all mauled by trail dogs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thrasher_s View Post
    but there is a growing number of riders who are ignoring trail etiquette, sometimes putting others at risk, to save a few seconds on an afternoon ride...
    Very true! What in the heck happened to "uphill rider has the right of way"? On Saturday's ride not one downhill rider yielded. And I passed at least 10 rides on my way up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StreamRider View Post
    Very true! What in the heck happened to "uphill rider has the right of way"? On Saturday's ride not one downhill rider yielded. And I passed at least 10 rides on my way up.
    I believe Strava gets scapegoated for this all the time. In my belief, Mountain Biking downhill has always been about speed and flow. With Strava that is the same. This is tough to measure, because pre-Strava data does not really exist other than subjective assessments. Trail etiquette has always been an issue. Honestly, I have more issues with "Slow Old Farts" going downhill slowly not moving out of the way, than folks bombing the downhill. I have had a few run ins with slow "recreational" riders who do not respect or know about the right of way. Experienced riders overall tend to be more respectful. There will always be exceptions, but this tends to be my experience. I ride a lot on our trails here in Bend and this is my 2 cents worth. Also, I tend to have less issues outside of the Phil's area.

    Therefore, blaming Strava is the easy way out. I tend to think that this will always be an issue for Mountain Bikers to deal with.

    I must agree, that getting behind someone who blocks or chooses not to hear you is really frustrating. Especially true if they have earbuds in...
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    Quote Originally Posted by willem3 View Post
    Also, I tend to have less issues outside of the Phil's area.
    Me too, but I think the observation makes sense since Phil's is the well-known attraction that draws in visitors from all over the place. Casual riders along with never-evers who decide to give mountain biking a whirl while they're in town (i.e., when in Rome) gravitate towards Phil's. I therefore give extra room (both physically and philosophically) to people on Phil's because I don't want people to go home with a negative experience making a black cloud over their vacation. We're less likely to run into those casual riders and tourists out in the boonies so people you see way out in the boonies probably have a better grasp on trail etiquette.

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    Strava is becoming more common and lack of yielding is getting worse. Are they correlated? Who knows.

    A big sign at the Phils TH that spells out the right of way rules for visitors and new riders might help some but the downhill riders I am talking about are clearly experienced.

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