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  1. #1
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    Hammer Perpetuem killing throat

    I used perpetuem at 8 hr race last year and couldn't drink my beer at the finish line because my throat was swollen and really sore. I chalked it up to the continuous breathing through mouth in dusty air.

    Just last weekend, did a 16mi XC race (1.5 hr + 30 min warmup) and used perpetuem again. At the end, my throat was sore in the same way though less severe with shorter race.

    Looks like I'll need to find another drink. I do like a drink with protein. I've added endurolytes since perpetuem doesn't include full electrolytes. (wonder if that has impact on throat??)
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  2. #2
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    are you allergic to soy?

  3. #3
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    I'm not alergic to soy that I know of. I'm lactose intolerant so I do pick soy over whey.
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  4. #4
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    Hmmmm weird. I would recommend contacting hammer or searching their website. They have excellent customer service.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by gte534j
    Hmmmm weird. I would recommend contacting hammer or searching their website. They have excellent customer service.
    That is a really good idea to contact. I've felt like the fuel was good, just the delivery was a little off.
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  6. #6
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    I'm allergic to soy, but only the protein. Soybean oil and soy lecithin are OK, as is small amounts of hydrolyzed soy protein (whatever that is). But any significant amount of soy in protein form will affect my throat, but also usually gives me stomach pain for a few hours. Sometimes eating soy makes me itchy all over, but I don't break out in hives.

    Most of the time nothing I eat has soy protein. I have to be careful with things like cheap processed meats, Chinese and Thai food, and "healthy" bars. Cliff bars, for example, have soy beans in them, but the Z bars for kids don't (they just have soy butter, which is mainly oil as far as I can tell. It sounds much healthier than listing soybean oil on the ingredients).

    It doesn't sound like a soy allergy, at least not like I have, but don't rule it out unless you are sure (like if you eat things containing soy protein all the time with no problems).
    Matt

  7. #7
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    Carbo Rocket CR333, I did the Cohutta 100, Pisgah Adventure race ans Slyamos Revenge on this stuff and maybe 300 calories of solid food all day....ZERO GI Issues and it tastes good even when it starts to get warm.....LOVE this stuff.......anyway, my 2 cents...

  8. #8
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    Not sure what your current nutritional consideration are so I won't hazard a guess, but I mix Perpetum and HEED together to get a better overall mix of carbs and electrolytes for my longer races. I don't concentrate too much on protein until after the race when I'm in recovery mode. It is a good idea, though, to contact Hammer Nutrition. They are several people there that can help you. They're a good bunch of people, in my experience.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlliKat
    I'm not alergic to soy that I know of. I'm lactose intolerant so I do pick soy over whey.
    I would suggest the following:

    1) just 'cause you got a sore throat twice and were drinking perp during a race doesn't mean that the perp caused it. More likely race intensity/heavy breathing...

    2) while you may like protein in your drink, you don't really need it... so consider this, if you can't take whey protein, do without protein. Soy is the devil (well, right behind HFCS).

    The more you read about soy, the more you'll want to make sure you you never consume it (in an unfermented form).

  10. #10
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    My current race schedule, I have an upcoming 8 hour race. For that, I think protein makes sense. Everything I've read says you need protein at the 2 hour mark.

    I particularly like a one bottle setup. My entire nutrition (water, carbs, electrolytes etc from my water bottle) because in a race I don't have enough perception of time to remember when to take gel and water and electrolytes.

    For short races, I may go back to water and diluted gel (thick gel slows me down until I wash it down) I'll take endurolytes before race and call it good.
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  11. #11
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    I use infinit and after a 24 hour race I got the soar throught you are talking about. I didn't get it in 12 hour. But after talking to other racers at the 24 hour race...this seems to be common with being on a liquid diet drinking as much as we do in a short period of time.

  12. #12
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    I also ran into this problem last year at an 8 hour race, but I was drinking gatoraid and water, I was also eating solid food. I figured that most of it was due to the eating and drinking as well as breathing heavy since I would breath really heavy though my mouth after eating while on the bike. I also thought about it being due to the acid content in the drink. I am doing another 8 hour next weekend and I will see what is going to happen, I hope some better conditioning will help a little.
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  13. #13
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    I know there isn't whey protein in it, but have you considered the First Endurance line of products? I've ridden on EFS for long rides and gone far longer than I thought possible without solid food or much protein on it. Good stuff, and the Cappuccino Ultragen is amazing

  14. #14
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    Keep in mind that a sore/tired throat and/or slight loss of voice is not a terribly uncommon result of pushing your body to the limit, no matter what the nutrition. Even more common among flatlanders like me that occasionally insist on racing at elevations over 8,000 feet!
    Last edited by kosmo; 05-24-2011 at 06:59 AM.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by kosmo
    Keep in mind that a sore/tired throat and/or slight loss of voice is not a terribly uncommon result of pushing your body to the limit, no matter what the nutrition. Even more common among flatlanders like me that occasionally insist on racing at elevations over 8, feet!


    Excellent points...

    I've had simialr issues after events, but yet when I train with Perp** I'm OK...

    Heck, through the course of my work I have to inflect my voice for extended periods and it gives me the same hoarseness, etc.




    ** Perp, to me works great, but tastes of nausea...I vae to put a packet of splena (or similar) product in it to make it palletable...just MO.



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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by RSW42


    ** Perp, to me works great, but tastes of nausea...I vae to put a packet of splena (or similar) product in it to make it palletable...just MO.



    .
    I use the orange-vanilla Perp, mix in 1/2 scoop of orange Cytomax, tastes like an Orange Julius.

  17. #17
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    I tried some of the orange-vanilla and it is almost undrinkable to me so I went with the strawberry-vanilla instead which is a little better but not something I look forward to drinking either.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mudge
    I use the orange-vanilla Perp, mix in 1/2 scoop of orange Cytomax, tastes like an Orange Julius.

    Thats what I use too...still tastes like azz without some sweetner.

    I'll have to try the orange cytomax trick...good idea! thanks



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  19. #19
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    To me, it's just fuel, not a gourmet drinking experience, so I don't worry too much about the flavor (not a big chocolate fan).

    If I'm training I sometimes notice a less than desirable flavor from any of the energy drinks, but at the end of a race, I'd be hard pressed to tell you what flavor I used that day.
    The drive towards achievement and success is the motive power of civilization.

  20. #20
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    Keep in mind that a sore/tired throat and/or slight loss of voice is not a terribly uncommon result of pushing your body to the limit, no matter what the nutrition. Even more common among flatlanders like me that occasionally insist on racing at elevations over 8, feet!

  21. #21
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    I mix Perpetuem in a concentrated form. I mix it so I get about an hour's worth in 4 ounces in a gel flask. I use a Sharpee to highlight the ounce markings on the flasks. I shoot for an ounce every 15 minutes = 1 flask/hr. This allows me to drink and "rinse" my mouth with plain water as I want. It allows me to control fuel/nutrition and hydration independently. You do need to be sure and chase the Perp. with water.
    I also like this method because I can use a blender bottle to mix the Perp. and serve as a reservoir in the cooler. Keeping my water bottles clean (or at least not sticky). If you do a 24 solo with no support little easy organizational things help. Hmmm blender, flask=food! ......uhhhh .. water bottle=water...

  22. #22
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    My guess is this has nothing to do with one particular product. What may be making your throat sore could be bacteria, fed in part by the carbs in your drink mix, and enabled to flourish because your immune system isn't operating at its full potential. Add dust and/or bacteria-laden mud splashed on your bottle top and your immune system is stretched pretty thin. Eight hours into a race once your body starts scavenging for protein your immune system is really on the ropes.

    I've had similar issues at many long races. For 12/24 hour lap races I'll stop and brush my teeth and maybe use mouth wash. For most of us the extra 2 minutes will not make or break a podium spot. And, it feels really good to brush your teeth and get those nasty sports drink/gel sweaters of the teeth.
    Abba Zaba, you my only friend....

  23. #23
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    I have chugged a bunch of Perpetuum last week during a 12h ride, and my throat was just fine. Good stuff.

  24. #24
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    I called hammer. They suggested I was consuming a little too much. We talked about doing the endurolytes swallowed instead of mixed. The other thing was to go to a concentrated flask and rinse with fresh water.

    I was thinking about trying infinite to see if it sits better for me.
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  25. #25
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    I have the same problem. Add more water to dilute it, and supplement with a spoon of Carbo Pro and a dash of salt. Sounds weird but this works perfectly for me on 50+ mile races. Try in practice before a race though.

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