Need some Niner help!! Can't Decide!!
Guys, I'm being super indecisive here recently.
I currently have a 2010 Rip 9, in Milk Dud. I've loved this bike, and have thrown some upgrades on every year. Rides great, lots of fun. It's on the heavier side, but has been a great ride.
In general, my Rip 9 looks like this:
<a href="http://s56.beta.photobucket.com/user/morr5/media/a0ebe55c.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g192/morr5/a0ebe55c.jpg" border="0" alt="Uploaded from the Photobucket iPhone App"/></a>
<a href="http://s56.beta.photobucket.com/user/morr5/media/110e75ca.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g192/morr5/110e75ca.jpg" border="0" alt="Uploaded from the Photobucket iPhone App"/></a>
10 Rip 9
Fox Talas 95/120
No Tubes 355's
You get the picture.
I'm in Minnesota, I really highly doubt there is any true AM riding, mostly XC, and rough XC type riding I suppose. Some of the technical stuff is just that, slow rolling manufactured courses..
I'm considering a few options, and would like to hear opinions:
1. Replacing the Frame w/ A Jet 9 RDO. Lots of great deals on them, could stick with the same fork, maybe upgrade to some Carbon Wheels. Sounds like a good idea, but I'm not that sure about the compatibility of the components. I think I'd need an adapter for the cranks, new seat post.. honestly, some of the hub widths, etc are a little over my head at this point. Besides that, any issues I would need to worry about?
2. I'd absolutely love the Rip 9 RDO, though I'd need to get a new Fork, and New Wheels for sure. Expensive route, but I love that Rip 9 RDO.. just thinking it may be too much bike for my terrain in MN.
3. Buy the sweet deal at Competitive Cycle for the Jet 9 RDO complete. I'd then have a nice light Jet 9 RDO, and my Alloy RIP 9 (Maybe upgrade next year?)... only downside to this is... honestly, I think I need to replace the 355's on the RIP 9 anyway, and the Easton Wheelset that comes on the CC Jet 9 RDO scare me a little, so may have to upgrade them.
Anyone have an opinion, or suggestion?
Anyone have a set of All Around, and decent light Wheels to recommend?
Thanks for all, and any input!!
I'd consider the rip9 more of a trail bike...not a full blown all mountain...so in theory you already have a bike perfectly capable of XC riding, all mtn, and everything in between.
Do you know how much your bike weighs? I bet if you put the bike on a diet you'd be very happy keeping that rig..but it will get expensive! The upside is most of the parts can be used on your next bike. The jet 9 rdo is an awesome bike but it's a different animal. I actually just ordered one and will have it in the next week. They have some great deals right now. You might be able to sell your current frame and just swap parts. The jet 9 would run awesome with that 120mm talas.
A good wheelset is always my first major upgrade. So many good ones too choose from...comes down to budget. I've had good luck with my arch ex and only paid $425 new with the 3.30 Stan's hubs. My next ones will definitely be the crossmax st or slr.
Ok been there done that.
The way i see it is you either keep the Rip9 & put XX1 & carbon wheels on it to bring it alive & make it suit what you want better. ( & that is the sort of build you would need to stop you thinking about a new bike )
With that I would also fit a HV air can & maybe go to the needle roller bearings in the shock at the same time.
Option 2 would be to grab a V1 Jet9 RDO at the awesome price they are selling for at the moment & build it up with the gear you want.
If you are running a Rip9 with a 120 fork the Jet9 RDO will handle anything you are doing on your Rip9 but will be faster & more fun.
I loved my Rip9, I kept it linger than any other good bike I owned & was sad to see it go, I was planning on getting another 1 when the Jet9 RDO came out & got that instead.
It has done a great job for me.
I have a Rip9 RDO on order & will build that up with XX1 & carbon wheels & it will be a great bike, But if you are not going to build a Rip9 carbon & bling it out because of cost & your not ringging the neck of your Alloy Rip9, Then buying a V1 Jet9 RDO & throughing more dollars at it will really jive you an awesome bike for what you need.
Ok it easy. Keep the Rip9 you have and get something else totally different like a Air9 Carbon run it as a SS or a One9 SS. Thatway you have a different bike.
This is a great problem to have because you will like any of your solutions. The previous jet9 rdo is the best frame deal available and will give you an extra grand towards the build. Its a well rounded capable bike that felt even plusher to me that the rip. Unless the terrain you ride is of the harsh/technical/rocky variety that punishes the rdo is awesome.
I do like the air 9c (another great deal) and keep the rip idea if you're a hardtail fan.
This is what I would do. I was pleasantly surprised by how much I enjoyed riding the JET9 RDO, and if I were in a position to buy a bike straddling the XC-trail category I would snap up one of these frames at the current price.
Originally Posted by muzzanic
"Back off, man. I'm a scientist." - Dr. Peter Venkman
Riding in Helena? Everything you need to know, right here
Thanks a lot for the input guys!
Great point, I really can't go wrong, that's what makes it so hard!
Yes, no AM, definitely between XC-Trail here in MN. I mostly want to go faster! Haha! I don't like people catching me, and I'm pretty quick on the RIP9, but definitely want to go faster.
As far as Hardtail goes, I'd like to find the perfect cush bike for me first. My back hurts pretty bad after a while on my old Hardtail.
So, some thoughts after everyone's feedback.
1. Putting the 10 RIP9 on a diet. Love the idea, but Niner has made changes in geometry on the RIP for a reason, I'd like to do something to upgrade. If I upgraded all the parts, I'd still have the same frame. Also, with all the carbon coming into the line-up, I'd like to give it a whirl... Especially, if it's gonna cost me a couple G's to get there.
2. Fully Blinged RIP9 RDO. I really don't think it's necessary. Brakes/Drivetrain/Cockpit are all perfectly fine on my RIP9, so it would be an easy swap.. my problem, and where I agree is... Frame/Fork, and Wheels are gonna cost me $5000 anyway, so might as well buy a whole complete that would cost $4000, and suit me fine. Plus, I could maybe upgrade my 10 RIP 9 next year, as more than likely the RIP RDO will be discounted as much of last years stuff is. Muzz, you've always said the the JET was fully capable for XC/Trail w/ 120mm, so I'm very much starting to lean that way. But damn.. that RIP RDO is frickin beautiful!
3. V.1 JET RDO. $4000 seems to be the way to go. Then I can have 2 bikes, if my Jet RDO is as capable, or more capable, I can move the RIP 9 out, or go the RIP RDO route.
As far as wheels go.. I could get the Crossmax SLR's for a $400 upgrade on the Jet RDO.
Anyone have any other wheels they might suggest?
I like the Stans Arch EX idea. Solid wheels, at an amazing price.
What about Roval Control SL's?
Chinese Carbon Wheels?
Thanks again for all the feedback!
Good choice, you will love the j9 rdo- absolutely a great bike.
I use an Arch rim / King hub combo due to the 190 lb wt limitation on the Crest. I have ridden on the Roval's and they had impressive stiffness for their light weight. The same mfg that make the Roval's make the Light Bicycle and Tru Composite rims but that doesn't mean the wheels are equivalent.
Light Bicycle rims are around 200 with shipping, they seem to be responsive to warranty issues but some users have posted about failures. Carbon is the only way to go if you want light but need stiff/strong for a heavier rider. Enve's are steep but they would be my first choice if I could afford them.
No experience with Mavic so someone else will have to jump in about the Crossmax SLR.
IMO, the RIP 9 - especially the version you have with it's geometry and amount of travel - is an XC bike/Trail bike. It is and remains such a versatile "do all" bike hitting the sweet spot of travel for FS 29"ers.
Originally Posted by five5
You want to go faster? Dump those Hans Dampf tires and get some XC tires. Dump those platform pedals and get some lightweight clipless pedals so you can spin a really great circle and pull up hard on the upstroke to lessen the dead spot. If that picture is your normal set up with the saddle below the bars, I'd drop that spacer out of there, trim the steerer tube - maybe even flip the stem negative and get your bars at a more aggressive level (at least even with the saddle if not a bit below for starters). In other words, set it up and ride it like an XC bike!!! That suspension and the big wheels loves to grip and rip the corners. So much so, that those aggressive tires aren't really needed at all in Minnesota. Rolling Resistance tests by German Bike Magazine rates the Schwalbe tires in this order of speed (fastest listed first due to rolling resistance):
Another good tire review (inlcuding 29"ers) here.
Here's my RIP with Maxxis Ikon XC race tires and my Roval wheels (bike is 26 and change with these wheels/tires) and super fast:
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/6613323637/" title="RovaledRIP by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7158/6613323637_1ab9ced1ec_z.jpg" width="640" height="395" alt="RovaledRIP"></a>
Nobby Nic 2.35 front, Ralph 2.4 rear is a nice aggressive, big meat tire combo that is also fast...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/6973028163/" title="RIP with meat by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7192/6973028163_7a314ce19d_z.jpg" width="640" height="398" alt="RIP with meat"></a>
Understood. No matter what the bike, keep working on your core, stretching and do all the usual things off the bike to increase your stamina. I'm tolerating my HT and Softail a lot more these days with core work, stretching, weights, and running a 2.4 Racing Ralph on one in the rear and a 2.25 on the other with nice supple air pressure.
Originally Posted by five5
I would go with the slight diet, but I don't think it is going to take much for you to jump start the RIP you do have. I pointed out the two items that you will benefit from immensely which won't cost you a lot of $$$ - new XC tires and clipless pedals. Even the Nobby Nics are much quicker and lighter than the Hans Dampfs if you want to stay more Trail oriented. That being said, I raced all season on Nobby Nics and had my best season to date. A Nic up front with a Ralph in the rear is a great combo as well (pictured above), but in my experience, I've had great success with Ralphs, Ikons, Raven 2.2's (all my standard XC race tires) on the RIP when I want it to really fly and for me not lose the cushion. The suspension really does a great job of keeping the tires glued to the trail - especially with correct counter steering and lean on the corners such as this example illustrates...
Originally Posted by five5
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/8271431753/" title="732959d1351104652-cornering-technique-need-advice-jeff_crop by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8359/8271431753_d3e6f32c9e_z.jpg" width="499" height="640" alt="732959d1351104652-cornering-technique-need-advice-jeff_crop"></a>
Are you absolutely utilizing the fork's two travel settings? I know that fork weighs more than single travel setting forks - and the new 2013 forks have a nice weight drop. Again, that's a costly upgrade for the weight, but I just wondered if you really use the 95mm setting? The HT angle on your version of the RIP is XC oriented as it is, and if you get those bars down a bit, you won't need to drop it into a 95mm setting for climbs.
I like the looks of the bike a lot as well, but do you need more travel? The new RIP RDO will bump you up to 130mm of rear travel (your current fork won't couple with that very well) and the 130mm blue OEM fork would be a very nice match to keep it XC/Trail oriented. If you go to the 130 or get a 140mm fork, if you think your bars are high now and you are sitting in an upright Mary Poppins position as it is - wait until your front end is even higher by going to the new RIP RDO. If you can't get faster on the RIP you currently have, I'm not sure I would advise you going to a bike with even more travel based on the comments you stated in what you are looking for in a bike for Minnesota. In other words, be careful of the advice you are getting and letting it create new bike drool for you.
Originally Posted by five5
Now it's sounding like you've just got the itch to get some new bikes. Only you can answer that. I've got four 29"ers I am riding (JET 9, RIP 9, Karate Monkey SS, Dos Niner), so I can't fault the desire to have choices.
Originally Posted by five5
I love my Rovals (on my JET 9) and I love the Light - Bicycle carbon AM rims on my RIP 9. Totally livened up the RIP (wheels are 1540g). Uprade costs? Just get a pair of the rims and have your LBS take apart your 355 wheels and relace them with the carbon rims. Cheapest way to do it for you. Probably about $400 for the rims shipped, plus whatever your LBS charges for a wheelbuild ($100 - $130 for spokes and labor).
Originally Posted by five5
Light-Bicycle rims built up by my LBS to my old American Classic hubs using off the shelf standard double butted Wheelsmith spokes (equivalent to DT Comps).
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/7082751231/" title="1540g by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7239/7082751231_555cb80f27_b.jpg" width="804" height="1024" alt="1540g"></a>
Add about 44g per wheel for the Bontrager Rhythm rim strip and valve to make them super secure UST (don't have to, but I like security and ease of use).
How I ran the RIP (set up as an XC/Trail bike) for 2012 (raced it 4 times, including once in Minnesota at Duluth)...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/7288163982/" title="P1010011 by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7079/7288163982_565d9bdf36_b.jpg" width="1024" height="651" alt="P1010011"></a>
It's my main off road training bike during the season as it keeps me fresher as I recover during the week from the weekend's intensity of racing.
Size XL RIP 9 (same generation as yours) weighs 27 and change with the big Nobby Nics on there and my Shimano XT triple old version with the old Hollowtech cartridge BB.
Me racing the RIP 9...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/7770273948/" title="Rockin'TheRip9 by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8428/7770273948_4ef5b7e79c_b.jpg" width="473" height="649" alt="Rockin'TheRip9"></a>
My usual race bike for Minnesota (here I am at Buck Hill) is a JET 9 which I ran with Nobby Nic 2.25's front and rear this season and the Roval AM wheels (with the beefier front hub)...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/7647209034/" title="BuckHill2 by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8425/7647209034_e1d0449cb9_b.jpg" width="795" height="524" alt="BuckHill2"></a>
I've raced it before at Mt. Kato in MN...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/4744397579/" title="Muddy RIP by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4138/4744397579_502688706a_z.jpg" width="640" height="480" alt="Muddy RIP"></a>
That was with the Ardent 2.25 LUST up front and Crossmark 2.1 LUST in the rear.
NoTubes Raven 2.2 front and rear (was set up for the Bone Bender Endurance Race in the spring of 2010). Note the very high stem stack as I was still too chicken with the new bike to decide on and settle in on the lower bar height for my fit since I had just purchased the bike that winter and had little ride time on it...
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7166535@N05/4471345376/" title="Is it spring yet? by BBcamerata, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4004/4471345376_ba2fa337dc_z.jpg" width="640" height="406" alt="Is it spring yet?"></a>
Bars were too high and over time, I slowly trimmed the steerer tube down until my current setting which uses 0 spacers and the stem flipped negative.
You didn't say you were a racer, but just wanted to go fast. I was just trying to point out that the RIP 9 can go very fast. You just have to outfit it right for the Minnesota trails to increase your speed on it. Cut the rolling resistance of the tires and the weight would be where I would start. That will give you the most bang for the buck in increasing your speed. Lap times show that I am just as fast on the RIP as I am on the JET or my HT around all my usual training grounds and race courses that I have done year after year. So - it's not the bike. Whether my RIP weighs 26, 27, or 28 pounds - my lap times are the same. But the tires, tire pressure, and good wheels to take advantage of the RIP's frame/suspension are key elements.
I can attest to setting it up in a more XC oriented way (which the bike is designed to do as part of its "do all" sweet spot) for your Minnesota trails. If you head out to the Black Hills, Colorado, etc... - then you can throw on the more aggressive tires if need be. But why handicap yourself in Minnesota? The same would be true for any bike frame you owned. In terms of the RIP, if I had to sell all of my bikes except one to keep and use for everything - I would keep the RIP and sell everything else. It's that good of a bike and the "do it all" aspect covers all the bases.
Outfit it best for your local/usual trails and ride like the wind...
The other issue is the "I wanna new bike syndrome" and asking a bunch of us who own multiple bikes, or change bikes more often than we buy a new suit (or underwear) is not going to yield any answer for you that doesn't involve $$$$.
Last edited by BruceBrown; 12-25-2012 at 09:18 AM.
I'm not afraid to spend money, and yes, I do have a touch of "I wanna new bike syndrome". I just don't believe that I need to put XX1 on everything, and "bling" it out.
Lots of good info here, so I appreciate it. I suppose that is why I threw this up. I'm not looking for someone to make the decision for me, but a lot of great info to discover Pro's/Con's of my options.
I don't want to be an XC racer, I'm mostly just stating the type of terrain in MN. I'd love to be in more of a Trail/AM world, but I'm just not. I like to take bad lines, jump stuff not meant to be jumped, and yeah... go faster!
Tires were a big mistake, I know.. They are for sure being replaced. I got them right when they came out, and clearly they are the wrong tire. Will be moving into a NN front, RoRo, or RaRa rear.
Clipless... will never happen. I have the clips, and the shoes. I clip in on my road bike, I'll keep the flats on my MTB, at least whatever one I'm having fun on. If I ever decide to really race... I might clip again.
As far as the seat position.. honestly, I just need a dropper. Before this pic, I was doing some riding in some XX loops, and needed the clearance. I actually like it like this, because of that. Not getting much air with my ass way up in the air. I have taken all spacers out now, just need to trim down the fork tube. No angle on the stem, so that will have to stay the same until I buy a new stem I suppose.
Which leads to my back issues... core isn't the problem, I have very tight hamstrings. I'm a certified PT, so I'm comfortable with my issues here. Too many college sports issues. I stretch every day, but my back stays reactionary. My college wrestling coach said I was by far, the most inflexible wrestler he's seen in his life. Haha!
I bought the bike with the Talas on it, I've never used the 95 setting, nor would I ever.
I love your wheel suggestions.. I didn't really consider relacing my current hubs with the Chinese Rims.. that's a great idea!
I think I'm really liking the idea of going carbon, I like the idea now of getting the JET RDO, and keeping the Rip9, seeing where that takes me. As Muzz has mentioned a million times, maybe the JET RDO will be the best of all worlds, and I can replace the RIP someday if needed.
Who knows.. I love the info. Lots of great stuff! Thanks again Bruce!
Well, looks like I'm picking up some Rovals from a friend of mine for an awesome price, so I have wheels covered.
I think I will for sure get a new carbon frame. Now the choice is between the RIP, and JET.
Wish there were some ride impressions of the RIP out there. I'm sort of wondering if the longer travel RIP would be overkill in MN. I'd probably put a 140 on there, as putting 120 up front would sort of be a waste if my other choice is a JET with a 120.
I'm really looking forward to building up my Rip9 RDO, But the thought of replacing the Jet9 RDO with it hasn't been the plan.
Being a little under biked can often be alot of run & being over biked can make you push harder to try to find the fun.
Ok I don't know you but the 120mm fork & no dropper seat post say alot to me.
If you are not pushing the Rip9 close to it;s limit then the Jet9 RDO is the bike I would be talking you into.
The Jet9 RDO really feels alive & playfull. & I'm sure the New Rip9 will feel much more that way than the current Alloy one.
The thing is i do still really like the Alloy Rip9, It lifted my riding more than any other bike I have owned, The reason for that IMO is because you don't feel like you are living on the edge on that bike.
Now depending who you are, that IMO can mean 1 of 3 things.
1/ It can make you push your self harder & let you try stuff you wouldn't maybe on another bike & make you a better rider. ( because you feel safe & not at the limit )
2/ It can be so good that it feels like you just can't push it hard enough & feels like it's not as much fun. ( because you feel safe & not at the limit )
3/ It can make you feel like it is a good bike but it is missing something. ( because you feel safe & not at the limit )
I think that I lost sight of just how good the Rip9 really was when I had mine & was looking at the weights people were getting there Tallboys down to at the time.
When I sold my Rip9 & brought a Tallboy I soon found out what I had lost, Right for the 1st night I rode it my ridding friends knew that I wasn't happy with it.
I sold the Tallboy after 3 months of trying to like it & was going to go back to a Rip9 right around the time the Jet9 RDO came out.
I was gutted that the Rip9 carbon hadn't come out at the same time because that is what I wanted.
So I brought the Jet9 RDO to hold me over untill a Rip9 carbon came out.
I thought it would be light, But lacking what I liked about the Rip9.
But it is a bike I have loved from day 1 & even stopped my every day thoughts that I must have a Rip9 carbon ( until I saw one )
So here is the thing you really need to get down & be honest with yourself, what is it you want from a new bike.
If you like your Rip9 & just want it lighter,easyer to pedal & a bit more alive then IMO buy the Jet9 RDO.
If you are lusting for a longer fork & dropper post on a light weapon then buy the Rip9 RDO,
Originally Posted by five5
Definitely rethink the way you have your rip setup now. Like the others said...tires alone will make the bike feel much quicker. You've got the right idea. I've got the NN up front and RARA in the rear. It's plenty of grip and rolls fast. Both are 2.25, i originally bought the nn 2.35 and it was a massive tire with huge volume. A little overkill for my riding style. It seriously looks like a 2.5 when mounted.
Originally Posted by five5
Lowering your bar position will make it feel more like a XC bike as well. Right now it looks like its setup for all mtn or chair lifts, aside from the fork. If you do go with a jet9 rdo...that will be an awesome fork to swap over. If you end up buying complete and selling that fork, let me know! Haha.
All your options should do the trick but if it were me, I'd first start playing around with the rip to see If you can improve the feel. You might like it and save some cash on a second bike. I think the rip and jet will handle the same terrain and no point of having 2 similar bikes. If you were gonna have 2 bikes you might as well have complete opposites..one for XC/training. And another to huck and dh.
I have a friend that has only been on a MTB for 8 months so has alot of learning to do & will have a few spills & isn't that great at looking after gear.
He has a good budget but not huge.
He has got a Rip9 Alloy frame coming,
The build that we are looking to build.
We are looking at putting carbon handle bars & niner stem.
Cheap shimano brakes with 180mm rotors front & rear.
Industy 9 wheels with light bike carbon rims, Or Hope Pro 2 EVO hubs with Light Bike carbon rims.
Nobby Nic tyres, 2.25 rear & 2.35 front.
XX1 group set with 28 front ring.
Shimano SPD pedals.
We will take the Reverb off his Giant that he has now.
This will be a very capable & easy bike to ride & should give him a big leap forward in riding.
Originally Posted by muzzanic
Honestly, I wouldn't read much into the 120, and lack of dropper. This was my first full sus bike, and I bought it as is (More or less), and have just ridden like it was.
Seat is low, because I really get into the downs.. Dropper post was going to be my next piece.
I really don't know if I'm being pushed or not. The terrain isn't amazing around here, so that is why I have a tough time deciding whether 140 is needed, or if it would hold me back on the XC/Trail type trails around here.
At this point, I'm definitely looking for Carbon. I've got some carbon wheels on the way.
I love the idea of having a 140, and get a little more aggressive, but I'm not entirely sure I'd use it to its max.
I like the Jet idea, because I might do a 24 hour race this year, and maybe a couple other events.. Not going hardcore XC race style.. just something to train for. Most of the time, I'm just having fun.
Honestly, it seems like the Jet would suit me, and I'd love it.... but there's something super exciting about the Rip, Dropper, 140...
More excellent points! Thanks for the opinions, and yes, I'll let you know if the fork goes!
Originally Posted by drz400sm
Get the competitive cyclist deal. That thing is a steal. Youll love it and never look back. The Jet rdo is a very capable bike. I think sometimes labels of xc vs am vs trail are just to get people (me) to buy more bikes. If you arent scaring yourself on your current bike, I think a jet rdo will handle whatever you throw at it.
I know, it is a killer deal! Wheels on the way as well!
What wheels did you go for ?
Originally Posted by five5
I ended up with some Rovals from a local guy, have me a real nice deal on them!
I was hoping you give a nice update after you get your new Roval wheels and see how she ride with them.
What tires are you gonna run with the new wheels?
Thanks for the extra time to give all this great info.
I can't wait to give a review, hopefully I get to ride them sometime in the next couple months, it's freezing here! Haha!
Probably wont get to ride them until March unfortunately.