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  1. #1
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    Shock choise for Helius AM

    I am looking for a rear shock for a Helius AM, but not sure which is a good choice.
    On my Helius CC I have a RP 23 HV with medium compression and low rebound tune which works great for me, would a similair shock work good in an AM frame? for the AM I was thinking of buying a Float R HV without propedal adjustment because I do not use it. Or should I better go for a coil shock? I am pretty lightweight, around 65 kg.

    Thanks for any tips!

  2. #2
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    The Helius AM does tend to have a little bit of pedal induced bob; it's suspension is smoother and more refined in use than the CC, but the net result is that it does bob a little. If you're really not worried about that bobbing, then you've no reason to only spec a Float R as opposed to a Float with pro-pedal, but personally I would prefer to have the option of turning on the pro-pedal if I wanted it.

    I run mine with both a Cane Creek Double Barrel and a Fox Float RP23. I like both but I particularly like the Cane Creek. Having not used it for a few months I've recently put it back on while the Float went in to have a higher compression tune (I am 105kg and was finding there wasn't enough high or low speed compression damping) and reminded myself that it was just so good.

    I don't think it's a simple case of coil versus air anymore because by all accounts the Rockshox Vivid Air is supposed to be amazing. That would be the best of all worlds I guess, at least until BOS and/or Cane Creek come up with an air damper that's comparable to their coil units.

  3. #3
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    What sort of riding are you mainly doing on your AM?

    Having a RS Vivid Air on my AM (wagon wheel AM ), I would look seriously at one for an AM... It is the closest shock I have ridden to a coil...

    In saying that the CCDB is awesome, hear great things about Bos shocks too. Also my riding buddy loves his Elka shock, of which is on a Knolly DT

    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  4. #4
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    I've been running two shocks over the last year on my 2010 AM (215 x 63 levers). A Float R and a DHX 4.0 - both standard shocks and bought very cheap.
    The standard Float R was a high volume shock and blew through it's travel unless I ran a high pressure in it (10% sag), so I modified it by partly filling the second chamber with plastic to reduce the volume which improved the blow through at lower pressures... this in combination with running the shock in the reduced travel setting made for pretty good performance for 90% of the time. Really rough stuff would still pack the shock down and i was still having to run less sag than I would like (20%). Standard Float R is high pro pedal tune so pedalling performance was never an issue, but it does give the shock a very on/off feeling hence the blow through, mid stroke wallow and pack down.
    Last week I had the shock serviced and tuned with the PUSH upgrade at TFT. I've only had one ride on the bike since but it was a good one. I had the pro-pedal reduced to minimum and asked for the shock to be set up with a fast rebound. So far so good, I'm running lower pressure than before the tune with about 30% sag and not getting anything like as much of the poor performance I had before (running in nthe 6.3" travel not the 6.7" so far... more experimentation to follow but I found I like the 6.3" setting). It's still a 90% shock I would say but definetly an improvement over before I had it tuned.
    At 250g it's very light, and for 90% of the time it's a good enough shock... but if you want the best feeling shock go coil... even a boggo DHX is better by miles.

    PS. I spoke to TFT before I bought either shocks and getting one/both tuned was always my plan. I didn't expect to like the air at all and figured doing it this way would let me experiment with the concept at very low cost.... it's worked out okay but I do wish I had better shocks for the whole of last year rather than faffing with these ones I bought cheap. On the DHX I started on a 500# spring but am now running 400#... but at this rate I need the shock tune improved... which is the next step... or a new shock now my finances are a little better. Experimenting has been fun... but if I had the cash I would have got better shocks from the start - worth speaking to TFT/Mojo etc as they do suggest good improvements..
    Last edited by thepimpmessiah; 03-26-2011 at 02:45 AM.

  5. #5
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    Thanks for the answers. I realize everyone advices a coil shock, but I tend to go for the much lighter air shock. Think I will go for a Fox RP23 rather then a DHX air which is from what I heard to soft in the middlle range. Then the next question, which tune is advisable for rebound and compression? On my Helius I run with medium compression and low rebound.

  6. #6
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    I don't like Pro-Pedal, it does nothing for me as I spin low gears and hence pedal very smoothly so I get no bob anyway. Whenever I have used it in the past I get to the bottom of the descent after cursing my stupid bike before realising I forgot to turn it off... since I don't "need" it anyway I am better off without.

    I can't help you on what tune to go for... I like no pro-pedal and fast rebound so thats how I had mine set up. I've three weeks to figure out if I'm happy with the results or if I would like something changed... from garage tests I was thinking the rebound needed to be faster but on the trails it feels better than I expected. The PUSH high flow system should help with the big hits I tend to give the bike... but if I'm planning to huck and ride really hard I'll be bunging the coil DHX on as it does make for a better ride... I can't say I can feel the extra lbs when riding... and the bike does ride better with the coil... but for big days out in the hills on not stupid tough trails the Float R is more than good enough.

  7. #7
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    I just bought Elka Stage 5 and im really pleased. After using this there is no coming back to air suspension.

  8. #8
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    don't like Pro-Pedal, it does nothing for me as I spin low gears and hence pedal very smoothly so I get no bob anyway. Whenever I have used it in the past I get to the bottom of the descent after cursing my stupid bike before realising I forgot to turn it off... since I don't "need" it anyway I am better off without.

    Absolutely. I was running an older, Pushed, RP23 on my AC at the weekend and inevitably did exactly that on a couple of descents.

    What's really needed is a boost valved Float R - on the current RP23 I run it with PP on the whole time (as that's the way the boost valve is in circuit) but that means the switchgear on the shock are superfluous. Give me something to set up and leave anyday (on which note the Bomber 44 RC3 Ti felt wonderful).
    Simon Still
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    www.nicolai-uk.com

  9. #9
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    Thanks for all the tips, I learned that an RP23 is perfectly suited for CC, but may be too soft for an AM. Since I also have to keep an eye on budget, I bought a used DHX air wit Propedal. Let's see how this works out.

  10. #10
    steep fast and loose :)
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    CCDB + custom tune here.

    Loads of LS pop and incredible depth to HS impacts....

    Took me 2 years to find the optimum set up however !

    I still need to dial in the HS circuits perfectly though, as at warp speed, it's feeling a litle benign / wooden.....

  11. #11
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    Pimpmessiah you have experimented with a few air shocks for your AM - do you think a non-HV, push tuned, fox float R would work - as you had the HV and lowered the volume by filling the can

    The frame I have in mind is the 2011 longer eye to eye version

    Thanks

    Max

  12. #12
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    Hi Max,
    I'm not sure that size of Fox Float R is available without the high volume can?
    The volume reduction is an easy modification to do and I'm sure whoever fits the Push system will be happy to do it.
    I've not tried the 2012 Fox shocks and I believe they are different - I'm still running my bargain basement Push Float R and am happy with it most of the time, although the CCDB is much better and what I prefer for gnar.

    If I had the cash I would be gettting a Bos VIPr as I wrote here.

    BOS suspension

    I've now got my CCDB sorted and I think it feels better than the VIPr did, although I would have to do another back-to-back test to be sure

    If your looking bargain basement as I did it's wfun experimenting with whatever you can get your hands on cheap. Although the cost of professional tuning such as TFT/Push/Loco/etc means it may not end up that cheap ...and hence possibly better to just get the best from the start...

  13. #13
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    Thanks

    TF seem to have MY10 in low volume - according to their website, anyway. I guess if it's the Fox then as you say high volume, modified, is a good option as you can't add more to a lower volume can

    I saw your BOS mini review - sounds good and it'd match my forks but Cane Creek are turning up the hype on the DB air, which makes me want to wait and see for a posh nuts option

    Thanks

    Max

  14. #14
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    MY11 I mean. I can't keep up

  15. #15
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    whafe ive only just noticed your front shock mount is off the FR, now if that shock shuttle is shorter than the 2.2 one on my FR i could be a very happy bunny!

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