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  1. #1
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    Nicolai Helius AC - Fork type....

    Anybody know if you can run 160mm forks on the AC without voiding the warranty? Also, will the coil shock from a Helius FR fit? I realise the running of 160mm forks is more in the AMs domain, but just how much punishment could an AC take?

    Glad to be back on the forums......

  2. #2
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    Hi Alex, Long time mate.

    From what i understand the AC is a xc/trail and All mountain.
    They are only rated for a 150mm fork.I think you can fit a 200x57 even thought the Ac is designed to use a 200x50,i would have thought if you remove the spring and fit to the frame and make sure under full compression the tyre dosent hit it should be ok.You might need to put the shock in the second hole instead of the highest.
    Not sure on how tough the Ac frame is,its rated all mountain so it must be reasonably strong.

  3. #3
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    Warranty says maximum of 530mm, which is Revelation 150mm/Fox32 Vanilla/Float/Talas140/150 territory. Typical 160mm forks have at least 545mm. So a official no-go. The other thing is, that with a (much) longer fork, the BB comes up and may influence handling.

    If you run a 200x57mm coil shock, you could run that in an AC, but you have to mount it a hole lower than the standard shock, because of the increased stroke.

  4. #4
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    Thanks for the replies - how are you Sam? Nice new ride there....

    I have recently re-vamped my FR and it now looks good as new again, but have found that all my riding really doesn't warrant the totems, although they are such a great fork.
    I have thought about the AM for later in the year but more of a lightweight trail machine - thats when I thought of the AC.

    It will be interesting to see how much punishment the AC can take as I know how burly the AM can be, especially as it's been used to best effect on the Mega!

    I used to think that more was the way ahead, but now, it's certainly a case of less is more - (in my case).

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Testmaen
    Warranty says maximum of 530mm, which is Revelation 150mm/Fox32 Vanilla/Float/Talas140/150 territory. Typical 160mm forks have at least 545mm. So a official no-go. The other thing is, that with a (much) longer fork, the BB comes up and may influence handling.

    If you run a 200x57mm coil shock, you could run that in an AC, but you have to mount it a hole lower than the standard shock, because of the increased stroke.
    Fully agree what you said about longer forks and warranties. But longer fork does not mean automatically higher BB and slacker angles - actually most 160mm - 170mm forks, new Van`s and Lyrik coils, allows you to use much more sag compared to shorter ones. Un_sagged AC does not tell much how fork lenght effect to geos ...

    200 x 57mm coil shock works fine in M-sized AC-frame mounted in top hole. Have used such a mount with BIG rear tyres too, with CCDB and Elka-shocks. Of course it has to be tested without the spring in advance with every frame, every shock and with the biggest tyres in use.

  6. #6
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    Alex,

    I am good mate,The new bike is lovely but i am struggling to find riding time at the moment,its mentally busy at my work.Been sat in the shed for 3 weeks,Hope i can get out Wednesday evening depending on work,weather and light.

    What have you done to your FR,Photos would be good.

    What riding do you want to do on the AC?,It will handle rough trails,not sure it would like drops Dont think it was designed to get to much abuse,The front shock mount looks like the weak point to me.

  7. #7
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    Ac....

    [QUOTE=pergamonx]Fully agree what you said about longer forks and warranties. But longer fork does not mean automatically higher BB and slacker angles - actually most 160mm - 170mm forks, new Van`s and Lyrik coils, allows you to use much more sag compared to shorter ones. Un_sagged AC is useless.

    200 x 57mm coil shock works fine in M-sized AC-frame mounted in top hole. Have used such a mount with BIG rear tyres too, with CCDB and Elka-shocks. Of course it has to be tested without the spring in advance with every frame, every shock and with the biggest tyres in use.[/QUOTE

    I would be interested to hear more about your project AC as I know you are using the same shock as I plan to and I know that you have some interest in the 160mm fork option. If I used the Lyrik U turn coil, I could set it to 150mm and experiment with the remainder of the travel - I used to have a Lyrik U turn coil on a Yeti 575 without too many problems, so it's worth considering..... your thoughts?

  8. #8
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    Hi ya Alex. For sure a long time no hear, do hope all is rocking good in your world...

    How strong is an AC frame... Mmmm, a very good question, one that I think about often...

    I feel I have given my Orange Crusher AC 29er has taken a bit of a beat down.... I kind of dont want to take it to the next level to what my FR can handle with ease. I would hate to break the AC...

    The bigger jumps I have done are all to transition, so it is all good.....

    Lorni, having ridden with you, if you were to look at a AC, I would for sure look seriously at an AC 29er like mine. Your height etc, you would feel awesome on the AC 29er.....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by lornibear
    I would be interested to hear more about your project AC as I know you are using the same shock as I plan to and I know that you have some interest in the 160mm fork option. If I used the Lyrik U turn coil, I could set it to 150mm and experiment with the remainder of the travel - I used to have a Lyrik U turn coil on a Yeti 575 without too many problems, so it's worth considering..... your thoughts?
    @lornibear,

    AC and shocks - yeah, have at least tried some and during last months mainly tested 2nd generation CCDB (200*57mm with several ti-springs from RCS and Diverse) against Elka Stage 5 (same 200*57mm) with 30/30 shimming mainly using same springs. IŽve 200*55mm DTSwiss EX200, but after "finding" coils, it has had not very much of use. Like both coils, getting Elka to almost same level than CCDB needs still some changes to shim-stacks (already coming from CAN) - further reports available after few weeks. But if you`re going to CCDB, you cannot get wrong. It takes hell lot of hours to get used with adjustments CCDB offers, but when you`ll know it - it works exactly like you wish. With AC there`s huge difference between those two upper holes, top hole is really challenging for shocks because of nearly 1:3 linkage (or leverage) rate compared to lower ones - CCDB can handle that if you know how to adjust it but for example Elka needs changes for shimming to get optimal performance when upper hole is in use.... of if it works fine when mounted top hole, then lowers ones sucks... Have not tested yet BOS Stoy, but when IŽll do that IŽll expect results similar than with Elka.
    But shortly - if you`ll want best coil shock, it`s CCDB gen 3 (mine is not yet upgraded) but if you`re fine with ~90% of CCDB performance, then Elka is better value for money.

    AC and forks - all we know those specs and recommendations and clauses in warranty terms. AC lenght max 530mm with standard frame is fine and enough for purposes AC is planned. I started with DTSwiss EXC150 with 15mm TA and measured AC 528 mm - was ok. Next more seriously used fork was DT`s EXM150, again with 15mm TA and measured AC 535mm. Ouch... am I using my frame against warranty
    To be honest, cannot care less... Actually when using some of those coils in rear mounted in top hole and with a sag IŽll prefer (~25% with CCDB and nearly 35% with Elka) fork feels nearly too short... (my fork sag is ~ 25% with EXM)
    There`s new fork ordered, but not yet get it, 2011 VAN RC2 160mm with AC-lenght of 545mm and IŽll suppose IŽll get nice balance with that combo. Tried 170 mm DH-Lyrik too, AC 560mm, but that was too high when I got sag of 30%. Not too high for AC, but front end sat too high compared to my rear - there no option anymore to decrease sag on rear and no more upper holes in use. Maybe bit softer spring in Lyrik has changed that too.

    So, AC limits what IŽve found are those, there are questions about the strenght of AC-frame - I don`t know - in my use with all those combinations no problems so far.

  10. #10
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    If one want's to use 160mm forks, go for the AM. It was silly by Nicolai to make it heavier this year though, so I can see the dilemma.

  11. #11
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    indeed less is definitely more.......

    how long before the rest of the trail 'fashionista's' perservere i wonder.....lol.....

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikael_nr1
    If one want's to use 160mm forks, go for the AM. It was silly by Nicolai to make it heavier this year though, so I can see the dilemma.
    Agree with mikael_nr1 - I would even say that if you want to use forks shorter than 540mm and get a slightly lighter frame, get AC. If you`ll want to use longer forks, then definately AM is better. IMHO Nicolai made good decision when made those changes to new AM, new levers and longer shock creates different animal ...

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