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  1. #1
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    At last! Nicolai website updated with new frames!

    Was just thinking about when they were going to update with the AM etc. Now they have with the '09 range! Not sure about the AM in 'seasick green' though...

  2. #2
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    ...and with 400 g difference between the FR and AM, still not sure what to go for...??

    Still seems to be some good info on the AM pdf factsheet about heatube options, travel (stroke, i2i) etc...

  3. #3
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    Nice, thanks!

    Finally someone who (seems to) check the N-homepage more often, then I do. *phew*

  4. #4
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    That's right, and for a change I was reading it at home not work!

  5. #5
    "Its All Good"
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    Its all good, great to see the updates there been made....

    That weight difference is not alot really.....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  6. #6
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    Good to see.... any idea how they have managed to add 20mm of travel to the helius ST.

    Seriously considering one now for next year with big forks! might be time for a new thread about that actually lol!

  7. #7
    lazy piston
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    I'm reading a tech sheet PDF file for the AM and I'm liking it. I can't remember if there were those PDF files on the website before but this document is really handy and answers a lot of questions. Good job Nicolai!

  8. #8
    wyrd bi ful rd
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    yeah Whafe ... 400g difference for the AM and FR is peanuts really ... if i carry 0.4 of a litre of water less, i have already made up the difference on an AM, just gotta re-fill at the Peaslake shop with the killer samosas ... you do wonder then if the AM can be used for small FR ... small ones ... ... not that i am planning to, of course...

    it all depends on your intended use. if you use weight winnie FR stuff on an FR, you can get the weight down quite a bit ... choices choices!

    Karve ... just had a look around and noticed that on an 'older' ST the rear shock mounts had 3 positions and the latest ST had 4 ... 20mm extra? i could be wrong ...

    the ion g box 2 looks the dogs bollocks

  9. #9
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    Hi Smith, is it possible for you to post the PDF on the AM or let us know where it is?

    Cheers.

  10. #10
    lazy piston
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryates
    Hi Smith, is it possible for you to post the PDF on the AM or let us know where it is?
    No problem.
    Go to the Nicolai site and view the AM frame: http://www.nicolai.net/products/e-fr...helius-am.html

    And find the small picture of the frame marked with "tech sheet PDF".

    Here's the direct link: http://www.nicolai.net/pdf/helius-am.pdf

  11. #11
    wyrd bi ful rd
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    from the AM tech pdf sheet ...

    min insertion depth for headset is 22mm ... hmm

    and the maximum fork length is 550mm ... even though the maximum travel is 160mm ... 550mm actually equates to a 180mm travel fork is it not? i am only calculating this from the fact that my old standard 100mm travel fork was 470mm from axel to crown.
    Last edited by chinaman; 10-02-2008 at 10:27 AM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by chinaman
    from the AM tech pdf sheet ...

    min insertion depth for headset is 22mm ... hmm

    and the maximum fork length is 550mm ... even though the maximum travel is 160mm ... 550mm actually equates to a 180mm travel fork is it not? i am only calculating this from the fact that my old standard 100mm travel fork was 470mm from axel to crown.
    No - we quote axle to crown measurements because it is the measurement that actually dictates the forces on the headtube. Axle to crown can differ significantly for forks of the same travel - Bombers have alwasy come up relatively long for example.
    Simon Still
    Momentum Distribution
    www.nicolai-uk.com

  13. #13
    steep fast and loose :)
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    simon - does that mean that a Fox 36 is ideally suited then ?

  14. #14
    steep fast and loose :)
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    @ nicolai-uk [simon] :

    as the a2c is ~545mm. therfore, to keep the recommended geom, i'm asuming a 5mm stem shim stack will be necessary ?
    fwiw, any idea when my AM is due , ordered via richard @ gravity sports. large ano black with shiny black decals, crud mounts and 9mm QR rear end ?

  15. #15
    steep fast and loose :)
    Reputation: The_Lecht_Rocks's Avatar
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    oh - 22mm insertion headset - what options other than the chris king steelset are there then ?
    cane creek 110 perhaps ?

  16. #16
    lazy piston
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Lecht_Rocks
    oh - 22mm insertion headset - what options other than the chris king steelset are there then ?
    cane creek 110 perhaps ?
    Check this thread

  17. #17
    local trails rider
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    Quote Originally Posted by chinaman
    400g difference for the AM and FR is peanuts really
    That is without shock. Depending on your choice of shock, you have a bit more difference.

    Rock Shox Monarch 3.3 - 247 g
    Fox DHX air - 461 g
    DHX 5 -quite a bit more-
    ....

  18. #18
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    Simon
    unless you're putting the 5mm stem stack at the crown end of the steerer it isn't going to make any difference to the geo. Just to the height of the bars. 5mm here or there isn't going to make much difference anyway.

    the fork is constantly moving up and down on the trail and therefore changing the A>C and geo all the time. geo is just as(if not more so) effected by suspension set up. A 5mm lower front end will marginally steepen the static front end geo but could be made up by using more preload at the front, less at the rear or on a fork with LS comp control you can dial it in to prevent diving under braking and weight transfer.

    eg. I'm running my CCDB with well over 30% sag. On paper thats going to lower the BB and slacken the fork angle. It's how the changes translate to the trail thats important.

    My advice would be to build it. Ride it, and adjust to suit yourself. The figures only tell half the story. Same goes for the discussions on the weight difference between the AM and FR. I've ridden both and they feel totally different regardless of how close they may or may not be in weight.

  19. #19
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    Dipper,

    In your view, what are the main differences to the ride between the FR and AM out on the trail?

    Nick

  20. #20
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    It's one of a number of forks that will work very well. These are not absolutes - as someone else points out small changes in fork length don't make a whole lot of difference BUT we state a MAXIMUM fork length for warranty purposes. Running an overlong fork with a lot of sag is very unlikely to damage the frame but you would not be covered by the warranty if it did
    Simon Still
    Momentum Distribution
    www.nicolai-uk.com

  21. #21
    steep fast and loose :)
    Reputation: The_Lecht_Rocks's Avatar
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    nick - the MAIN difference is the AM has a much keener sense of direction change. the head angle helps this.
    it also climbs better.
    basically , nicolai have simply tweaked geometry to steepen up angles a wee bit over the FR, allowing a better suited pedalling trail bike.
    they have trimmed the gussets here and there, but if you're less than 85kg, then i'd very much doubt, for trail riding, the need for the FR over the AM.
    The FR is a great trail bike if you have lift assist(s) and the terrain is severely steep (think Alps, Sierra's, etc).
    Also, beaar in mind that Yetiman runs his FR with a 180mm RS fork up front. The AM is critically designed to suit a Fox @ 160mm MAX.

  22. #22
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    Nick-o-lai
    Making a direct comparison wouldn't be fair as there was some important variables. The main one being frame size. The FR was a large and the AM a medium. But as TLR said above the main difference was the speed of turn. The FR is a rock solid bike. Very stable. But as a result it takes a bit of muscle to turn. hammering down twisty single track your upper body gets as much of a workout as your legs! In comparison, a large Turner 6-Pack with the same spec has a much lighter feeling front end and turns very quickly but lacks the stabilty of the FR. The AM falls between the 2. Best of both worlds if you like. It turns reasonably quick and is pretty stable.

    Despite what the figures suggest there was a good 2lb difference in the build as well using pretty much identical spec.

    I'd suggest if you don't require a bigger fork than a 160mm 36 for example then go with the AM. Even built pretty beefy with coils either end and Schwalbe BB's it still comes in at 34lb. It's as much an FR bike as the Turner 6-Pack was in it's day and they've seen some abuse with no complaint. However if you need a bigger fork and your riding justifies the extra heft(36lb+) then go with the FR. No point in my opinion in getting the FR and speccing it light. If you plan on doing that you'd be better with an AM.

  23. #23
    steep fast and loose :)
    Reputation: The_Lecht_Rocks's Avatar
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    what Dipper says.

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