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  1. #1
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    CCDB or Elka or Vivid Shocks???

    What's the thoughts on which coil shock for the Helius AM 29er?

    Have 2 CCDB shocks, rate them hugely, I have had more time on a CCDB coil shock than any other type / make etc.... It would be the most logical choice for me...

    I really liked the RS Vivid coil on my ION ST, of which norcosam is enjoying as well.

    My main riding buddy Momentus has an Elka Stage 5 shock on his Knolly DT. He rates it, it is really nice, great feel....

    What should I do, go with what I know, or step out and try something new?

    Elka Stage 5 Coil Shock

    CCDB Beast Shock

    RS Vivid Coil
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  2. #2
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    or, has anyone tried the Monarch Plus RC3?


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  3. #3
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    I think everything else than a CCDB will make you dissapointed.

  4. #4
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    Bos Stoy?

    Vivid Air?

  5. #5
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    Whafe, according to a freind of mine which is a specialist in suspension, you should go for a BOS or an ELKA. They are a bit better than the CCDB, and way better than a vivid. The most imporant is that the internal setting is prepared for your bike, that's what makes the difference between a bos or an elka against a CCDB or a Vivid.
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    Quote Originally Posted by samwell
    Whafe, according to a freind of mine which is a specialist in suspension, you should go for a BOS or an ELKA. They are a bit better than the CCDB, and way better than a vivid. The most imporant is that the internal setting is prepared for your bike, that's what makes the difference between a bos or an elka against a CCDB or a Vivid.
    I agree what said about importance of internal settings, if shock is some other than CCDB.
    If you`re lucky enough, or suspension curves of your frame, linkage rates, your weight, spring you`ll use ... allow you to find golden spot of suspension behaviour somewhere middle of CCDB adjusting ranges, then it`s hard to beat CCDB.
    You can get nearly_similar behaviour with Elka, or Bos, but not without someone changing internal shimmings, normally you can not do that by yourself. I got Elka, with recommended shimming for my frame, it was not bad, but far below CCDB. After re-shimming both directions and after finding optimal nitrogen pressure, it`s in same level than CCDB.
    Don`t have experiences about BOS.

  7. #7
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    Go custom... Avalanche, BOS, Elka, etc.
    Check my Site

  8. #8
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    Thanks as always for the feedback and thoughts....

    As I said, am not at all unhappy with the CCDB, just thought I should try something else, I am usually the type "if it aint broke, dont fix it"

    But have read great things about Elka etc etc, and having ridden Momentus's Knolly with the Elka, it is a great shock....

    Have not heard enough about the Vivid Air, the weight sounds really appealing, it is somewhat odd that in reality very few DH WC peeps have been using them.. A few have, but not many at all.....

    Shock required is 216mm (8,5") x 63mm (2,5")

    It is not at all to say that I will not go CCDB again, they have served me very well

    Too many Homers love Avalanche shocks Warp

    Decisions decisions... Well I do know am not going with Magura brakes on this build. Every bike I have had runs Magura.... Am going with the Codes, the 2011 are awesome...
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  9. #9
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    It would be a tough decision for me on the rear shock, The CCDB is a very good shock but Is quite expensive,The Vivid coil is a very good coil shock and i love the one on my Ion,It works very well and seems to absorb everything i can throw at it,Works well on small and large hits.
    I am not sure on the Bos or Elka,Not seen or used any of them.But i could be tempted by a set of there forks
    The one i would look at if i was going down the full custom shock would be an Avalanche.
    You know you cant go wrong with the CCDB as an off the shelf unit,Or the Vivid as a cheaper alternative.

  10. #10
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    There is not much price difference between CCDB and Elke. I would go with what you know and buy the CCDB. Elke or CCDB on the Knolly are going to be equally impressive.

  11. #11
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    ryates - going with the CCDB would be easy, am going to go with the Elka... Be like a new woman, have 2 CCDB's already, need a change..... Getting old and set in my ways

    For sure nothing at all wrong with the CCDB though.....
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  12. #12
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    @Whafe - why not Hopes? Or Formulas?
    Last edited by a1helius; 11-06-2010 at 07:23 PM.

  13. #13
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    Whafe, can you get the Elka with a tune for the AM?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by a1helius
    @Whafe - why not Hopes? Or Formulas?
    Formulas get good reviews, however my first hand experience is ***** with them, my main riding buddy Momentus has 2 sets sitting in his cupboard now, they never worked well at all and absolutely mow through pads..... So sell the idea to me, they look great..

    Hopes, they look awesome and industrial, my fav's in looks... But again, don't hear loads of great stuff. People have ridden my bikes and the first comments are always how great the Magura brakes are, and they ride Hopes... Again, sell the hopes to me....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryates
    Whafe, can you get the Elka with a tune for the AM?

    Yep, on there website they state all the bikes that they tune shocks for. The AM is on there, however the shock eye to eye is different to the AM. It is the shock for the AFR. I need to keep reminding myself it has an AFR rear, built wi AM rear tubing....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  16. #16
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    Whafe, I think you just hit the nail on the head about brakes.... stick with the Maggies or you will probably be disappointed. I love Hope, my mate loves Hayes... we dislike each others... best to go with what you know and like as its all about feel and what your used too.

  17. #17
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    agree with tpm(again!)

    Each to their own. I've had issues with magura, avid, hayes and shimano. Much of it simple stuff but in the UK the back up for some of them leaves a lot to be desired. I've ended up ebaying loads of the above as 'spares or repair' as fixing them is too much hassle.

    I've also had issues with Hope in the past but the back up here is first class. Also, the last few years the brakes have been near faultless and pads last ages. Only issues/complaints I've had with Hopes recently have been down to customers cleaning regime. You wouldnt believe how much oil and crap folk manage to get on the discs/pads while cleaning!
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryates
    Whafe, can you get the Elka with a tune for the AM?
    Sure you can get. There are some generic tunes (shimmings) available for horst-linkage frames with Nicolai-type suspension curves. You can live with those, at least. But to get best out of Elka, you`ve to inform them the leverage rate you`ll mostly use (= what hole you`ll use when mounting your shock), your weight, your preferred spring (lbs) and your preferred sag and how you`ll wish your shock behave...

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by pergamonx
    Sure you can get. There are some generic tunes (shimmings) available for horst-linkage frames with Nicolai-type suspension curves. You can live with those, at least. But to get best out of Elka, you`ve to inform them the leverage rate you`ll mostly use (= what hole you`ll use when mounting your shock), your weight, your preferred spring (lbs) and your preferred sag and how you`ll wish your shock behave...
    Hi ya pergamonx... I will for sure be giving Elka as much info as I can. At present in my communication with them I am working through the shock length. I have told them it is an AM 29er and gave the shock length of which is different to their records. So have explained to them that this frame will have an AFR rear. So waiting to hear back... Will then progress with giving them loads of info... Thanks for the help though, it is appreciated..
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by thepimpmessiah
    Whafe, I think you just hit the nail on the head about brakes.... stick with the Maggies or you will probably be disappointed. I love Hope, my mate loves Hayes... we dislike each others... best to go with what you know and like as its all about feel and what your used too.
    Again, as I was saying, just love the look of Hopes, they are raw, industrial and engineered in looks, awesome in fact...

    What Hopes would you run with?

    In dippers post, maintenance is no issue for me, keeping brakes clean etc is part of having an mtb.....

    I thought that the new Magura Marta FR's were a new model so to speak, however they are the same as Marta SL's more or less...
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  21. #21
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    Never had issues with Formula.

  22. #22
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    Will never run anything else than Formula The ones are superior

  23. #23
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    ryates & mikael_nr1 = Do your Formula's go through brake pads like loaves of bread?
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  24. #24
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    Yes they do, worth it every day though.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikael_nr1
    Yes they do, worth it every day though.
    MMMMMMmmmmmm tell me more.....
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  26. #26
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    Whafe, I don't have a wide range of experience with other makes but since first going over to Formula Bianco's some years ago and then later fitting One's on another bike, I have had no issues. They feel good and are very powerfull and are light in weight. Definately worth considering I think.

  27. #27
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    Whafe,

    I have an older set of The One's.
    They went through the stock pads like crazy then I took a chance on pads from Superstar Components. I think the first set from SuperStar lasted more than half a season.
    I have had zero issues with them and they have only been bled once (in desperate need at this moment).
    On the other hand, a riding buddy bought a set of The One's used and they have caused him nothing but headaches. He is waiting on some part from the Canadian distributer to hopefully remedy the situation.
    I weigh 220lbs on a good day and have used them in Verbier (lots of stock pads), Whistler and North Shore (Superstar) and Bromont (home). No problems stopping, plnety of power when needed and never lock up unless I want them to.
    On Elka's, well worth it. Almost everyone I ride with has made the switch.
    The friend with the troublesome One's has an AM. Loves the Elk to bits. I think the reason why the AM on Elka's site might have some different shock lengths is that the AM used (friends) was a one off that was used for a bike show in MOntreal. I think it is a mix of an AM and FR, or so he was told when he purchased it.
    Eric

  28. #28
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    brakes, i like hopes and have them again on my am, but have used saints for over a year and they are awesome stoppers, reliable, long lasting pads and never more than one finger braking required even on a 14km descent in the alps, zero fade, have them on my Jones :-)

  29. #29
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    Magura is great, thought I would never switch from them, and the one time I had Hopes (M4) it was quite awful setting them up (and keeping the pistons aligned). But as is I have Hope again. This time I got V2's which actually end up lighter then M4's (if you put braided hoses on both) and feel very nice. Only real critique is that they are a bit noisy when wet, and you are limited to 183/203 rotors.

  30. #30
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    Am still not 100% decided on brakes, almost pulled the trigger on Hopes, but they are pretty heavy, really want to watch weight on this build, not all weight weener like, but dont want this bike coming in at 36 lbs etc..

    Decisions, decisions
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  31. #31
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    A touch of the Tomac?


  32. #32
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    For sure some Tomac in there...
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  33. #33
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    i use Hope Tech M4's on all my mountain bikes.
    simple, easily bled, nice modulation and enough power for the AM for sure.
    pads last an age [unless you're a ***** braker] and the levers look stunning.....

    regarding shock, the CCDB is still king of the hill, but you've previously admitted to not fiddling once you have your preferred setting.......

    i prefer the Monarch on my AM for general trail duties......

  34. #34
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    Pads for any kind of brake are all a bit hit or miss - they just aren't consistent in terms of performance, even when you buy them from the same 'manufacturer', which I think is the problem, because no way does Superstar make their own pads. They're a tiny, design here make there' company. They contract everything out.

    I'm not sure how many brake manufacturers make their own pads but I can't imagine that many do. It's quite a specialist process I would think and it's the sort of thing that some one is going to manage and execute far more effectively than Hope could ever, ahem, hope to do.

    So on that basis, buying pads is something of a lottery. With my Forumla The Ones, in the early days when I bought Formula pads, I've found that I chewed through one set in a day (it was a very wet day in the Alps mind) and then other times, I've had a set that lasted several months of winter use.

    There's just no consistency. I would't let the issue of pads rule your choice of brake.

  35. #35
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    hear you on pads... I just dont know if it is worth carrying and extra 350 grams of weight to run Hopes.... Sorry if that sounds really w a n k, but it is the truth, need to really watch weight on this bike....

    I am still waiting for Elka to get back to me. When I first made contact with them, they were really quick to respond. They then said I had the wrong shock length, explained that this frame will have an AFR rear end made of AM tubing and an AM front tri, and have not heard back...

    Am still wondering about the Monach RC3... The Dirt top 101, gave it a good review, well good words. Again, anyone ridden one?
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  36. #36
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    Magura seem to be up to something... all a bit secret squirrel at the moment though...

    http://www.mission-performance.com/e...ts/brakes.html

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikael_nr1
    Yes they do, worth it every day though.

    Thats as often as i changed the pads in mine.

  38. #38
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    Sure seems like they are.... Still have not seen the new Marta FR out there for sale yet, but as I said above, it is really no different I hear to the Marta SL's....

    Due for something really new for sure....

    Bring it on


    Quote Originally Posted by thepimpmessiah
    Magura seem to be up to something... all a bit secret squirrel at the moment though...

    http://www.mission-performance.com/e...ts/brakes.html
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  39. #39
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    I had a set of 2009 Marta's. Very close to the louise, just losing the BAT and hinge from the lever.

  40. #40
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    Fox RC4

    Quote Originally Posted by Whafe
    What's the thoughts on which coil shock for the Helius AM 29er?

    Have 2 CCDB shocks, rate them hugely, I have had more time on a CCDB coil shock than any other type / make etc.... It would be the most logical choice for me...

    I really liked the RS Vivid coil on my ION ST, of which norcosam is enjoying as well.

    My main riding buddy Momentus has an Elka Stage 5 shock on his Knolly DT. He rates it, it is really nice, great feel....

    What should I do, go with what I know, or step out and try something new?

    Elka Stage 5 Coil Shock

    CCDB Beast Shock

    RS Vivid Coil

    Interesting to note that you haven't given thought to the FOx RC4 - any reasons for not considering it? If so, please share your thoughts......

  41. #41
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    What about the vivid air - good performance by the sounds of it and save a pound in weight.
    www.essexhertsmtb.co.uk - Mountain Biking near London in the UK

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karve
    What about the vivid air - good performance by the sounds of it and save a pound in weight.

    Have you seen the price of an Air Vivid

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by lornibear
    Interesting to note that you haven't given thought to the FOx RC4 - any reasons for not considering it? If so, please share your thoughts......
    Because it is a Fox... No real reason, just know CCDB is better.... Dont mean that in a disrespectful way to Fox....

    May even look at the Monarch RC3, as the Vivid Air is so so expensive....
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

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