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Thread: BOS suspension

  1. #501
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp


    Nothing and I mean nothing beats a coil...
    Dont under estimate the RS Vivid Air, closest I have ever felt to coil.......
    The_Lecht_Rocks: whafe - cheeers - may i offer an official apology for the wagon wheeler "dis-belief"

  2. #502
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whafe
    Dont under estimate the RS Vivid Air, closest I have ever felt to coil.......
    Would love to try one...
    Check my Site

  3. #503
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whafe
    Dont under estimate the RS Vivid Air, closest I have ever felt to coil.......
    Whafe I agree it is the best air shock we have ever rode have 2 on AFR and people are raving about them

  4. #504
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    I have only one word for the BOS Deville and Stoy combo on my AM, coupled I guess with the new Head angle of 66.5Deg, AWESOME.

    Blasted it at the weekend. Was worried the front was too firm and the rear too soft before setting off but what an absolute display of control in the gnarr, they just ate the terrain, massess of braking potholes (they no longer qualify as bumps) into fast berms (yes) roots everything, I get the feedback from the front, it soaked it all up but didn't dive like the proverbial under braking. Amazing

    The rear, well, it just did the job brilliantly , despite feeling soft statically, I didn't suffer unpleasant pedal bob and it just GRIPPED. I did up the preload a little on feel, I suspect it might be a smidge under 30% sag now static, I need to check.

    Is the best method to measure the sag with a cable tie or similar on the shaft or eye to eye with a ruler?

    The head angle change has made a massive difference to feel, it just rails corners in the gnarr now but I don't think the steering feels any slower really but I have also put 780mm bars and a 50mm stem on.

    Overall, I bloody love it!!!

    I'll post some pics soon, off to Italy at the weekend to do Sestri Levante SuperEnduro so it should get a good test :-)

  5. #505
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    Im liking the fact your on 780 bars, really loving my 750's wished id changed up earlier.

    Same goes for the forks and its making my next upgrade decision really hard, brakes or a new rear can, did you get the 2010 or 2011 Stoy (im assuming its not the air?)


    edit:
    When your on about no pedal bob, is that sat or out the seat mashing?

  6. #506
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    I got the 2010 S'toy. Didn't want to wait for a couple of months and the 2010 std S'toy is unchanged.
    The 2011 S'toy Rare has the same damping just an alloy shaft and hydraulic bottom out (I see no advantage for me)
    I liked the idea of the air for weight but I am a bit of a coil convert and again didn't want to wait a min couple of months.

    Pedal bob, just didn't notice any stood or sat. I'm sure there was some but it wasn't intrusive to me in the way it always was with air, this was also the case with my CCDB on the back. The big difference is he Stoy feels waaay softer statically and indeed mine has a 325 spring as opposed to 450 on the CCDB, but it doesn't seem to translate to a soggy pedal feel on the trail.

  7. #507
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    Bit personal, but whats your weight please?

    Edit: whens the new stuff out?

  8. #508
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    oooer

    71KG, built for 78KG riding weight (2kg water, trail tools, backpack, clothes, FF lid, armour etc)

  9. #509
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    Which levers and shock lengths? Was the ccdb 200mm old levers vs 215mm on new levers for the Stoy?

  10. #510
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    Whats the price of new levers for 2010 AM?

  11. #511
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    pilot:

    Did you get the new -7 shock mounts to get the 66,5 degree head angle or how did you accomplish that?

  12. #512
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    No, 'old' levers. 200mm, 57mm stroke. I took Dippers feedback and experiences and have stuck with old levers but I have added Saars Head Angle Adjusting headset to get 66.5deg static HA with my 1 1/8" tube

    you can see it is markedly slacker<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pilot/5616947784/" title="IMG_0288 by philip.pryor, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5269/5616947784_0f7d3f027d.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="IMG_0288"></a>

  13. #513
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    Its been posted before but here is the link http://www.ofanaim.net/hasale.html

    Great service and a really nicely made piece of kit. Not the cheapest but the quality is superb and it is a one off cup set.

  14. #514
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    I heard the new air stoy and devilles will be available in a couple of weeks on the production line currently.
    I was going to pick up a stoy coil to compare with the air stoy too. My instinct is if the deville is anything to go by I won't feel the need the need to use a coil.

  15. #515
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    Pilot, are they deep cups? Also was is tricky to put them in? I understand the orientation is crucial and they can be an absolute swine to get right.
    Interested to see some close up pics and please keep us updated with the durability.

  16. #516
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_pilot
    I have only one word for the BOS Deville and Stoy combo on my AM, coupled I guess with the new Head angle of 66.5Deg, AWESOME.

    Blasted it at the weekend. Was worried the front was too firm and the rear too soft before setting off but what an absolute display of control in the gnarr, they just ate the terrain, massess of braking potholes (they no longer qualify as bumps) into fast berms (yes) roots everything, I get the feedback from the front, it soaked it all up but didn't dive like the proverbial under braking. Amazing

    The rear, well, it just did the job brilliantly , despite feeling soft statically, I didn't suffer unpleasant pedal bob and it just GRIPPED. I did up the preload a little on feel, I suspect it might be a smidge under 30% sag now static, I need to check.

    Is the best method to measure the sag with a cable tie or similar on the shaft or eye to eye with a ruler?

    The head angle change has made a massive difference to feel, it just rails corners in the gnarr now but I don't think the steering feels any slower really but I have also put 780mm bars and a 50mm stem on.

    Overall, I bloody love it!!!

    I'll post some pics soon, off to Italy at the weekend to do Sestri Levante SuperEnduro so it should get a good test :-)
    Not bad for "French Tat", then?

    I have been running this combo (on another bike) for over a month now and endorse everything you say. I haven't felt the need to fiddle much, just knocked back the Stoy's rebound one notch. I think I'm running around 40% sag which is fine.

  17. #517
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingboy
    I heard the new air stoy and devilles will be available in a couple of weeks on the production line currently.
    I was going to pick up a stoy coil to compare with the air stoy too. My instinct is if the deville is anything to go by I won't feel the need the need to use a coil.
    I want a Bos VIP'r,but dont want to spend that amount of money on an air can,and find its not as good as the CCDB or even remotely close performance wise.
    I am hoping it feels like the Deville,that would be nice,it would drop the weight of my bike by about 400g

  18. #518
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    Stupid question but how do I find out what levers are on my bike

  19. #519
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    Dipper said Roger didn't know when the new gear would arrive, I said if I knew it would be April then I might wait, but in the end I decided that I'd go with the coil.
    If the air gets loved up by everyone and proves itself reliable then maybe I'll think about it but with a Ti spring I think I'd be 2-300g better off, I could save that on tyres and carry a couple of ml less water, or not worry about it, she just doesn't ride heavy at 33.5lbs

  20. #520
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpm100
    Pilot, are they deep cups? Also was is tricky to put them in? I understand the orientation is crucial and they can be an absolute swine to get right.
    Interested to see some close up pics and please keep us updated with the durability.
    Yes deep cups, orientation is important, I was just careful, patient and ensured everything was clean and greased, kept checking the alignment marks with a plumb bob and straight edge. I did get paranoid at one point but unnecessarily so.

    The cups are machined to be a good fit so once in a couple of mm and lined up, even greased they did not twist.

    I'll get some closeup pics but not much to see really now they're in! I do have one pic before fitting.

    Using Tange Japanese bearings, standard stuff, rubber o ring seal onto the crown race.

    I'll keep everyone updated.

    Off to enjoy my 'oh so last week' S'toy coil now the air is imminent and the next big thing 

  21. #521
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    @the_pilot - you mentioned somewhere earlier that you used 450lbs spring with CCDB and told too that your riding weight is ~78kg ?? Did you ever try 400lbs or even 350lbs springs with CCDB?

    Just trying to understand- my riding weight is few kg`s less, but setup anyhow comparable - frame is different but geo is ~same, using 200mm*57mm shock mostly in top hole with first one AC- links (which are same than older AM-links) and when trying to use 450lbs spring, got hardly 15 % sag and were out from CCDB`s adjustment range ... 400lbs made bit more sense, 350lbs was ok but ended using 300lbs spring (in fact 295lbs measured) - got ~33% sag using 1,5 turns preload and ended approx middle of shocks adjustment range (at least now after Stendecs finetuning) ...

  22. #522
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    Pretty sure ive read somewhere BoS recommend not using a Ti spring, its a least a month away for me but even with the possiblity of the Stoy air im still being drawn to the coil version

  23. #523
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    Now we could be getting into territory unknown to me but I understood, feel free to correct me anyone who knows more, that the spring rate is also influenced by the leverage ratio of the suspension design not just rider weight.

    I was skeptical regarding my CCDB spring weight as the calculators suggested I needed 400lb, but when fitted with less than half a turn of preload the sag was spot on, once I put it in the correct lever hole But that's another story. I was getting 28% sag even in the bottom hole short travel setting.

    So my S'toy feels very similar to my CCDB in pedalling and first impressions very similar overall active, but it does feel softer and more compliant static. Bear in mind I've only had one ride on the S'toy and my reasons for changing were mainly to match the front in terms of damping characteristics without me messing up the CCDB rather than any performance issues with CCDB, cos I didn't have any, I fitted it and the STD settings (albeit set up by Dipper for the bike/my weight) were great, I was running it with Fox 36's at the front.

  24. #524
    steep fast and loose :)
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_pilot
    . Bear in mind I've only had one ride on the S'toy and my reasons for changing were mainly to match the front in terms of damping characteristics
    how on earth does an air fork match a coil shock in damping terms ?


  25. #525
    steep fast and loose :)
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    air fork mated to a vivid air is a closer match IMHO.

  26. #526
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    Characteristics I said. Air fork is air sprung, not air damped iirc It was not a stupid statement, I was careful how I worded it and I don't want to get into an argument on this thread!

    Manufacturers products tend to have certain characteristics, Magura forks were very linear etc etc.. I wanted damping at both ends designed by the same company..I also wanted something I didnt have to mess about with too much and if I did I couldnt really screw it up. Of course it's not necessary, it was my choice and I'm glad I made it

    Everything I have read about the Stoy confirmed the fact that whilst the adjustments were effective even at the extremes they were constrained within the overall tune of the shock for the bike/rider, the CCDB is much more flexible in that regard.

  27. #527
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    Right I'm off to Italy now to ride my bike down some steep, long, technical single track

    Reports when I get back ...

    http://www.superenduromtb.com/category/video/.

  28. #528
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_pilot
    Right I'm off to Italy now to ride my bike down some steep, long, technical single track

    Reports when I get back ...

    http://www.superenduromtb.com/category/video/.
    Have a good trip and keep us posted.

  29. #529
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    Bos 2012


  30. #530
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    Well, I'm back, wow, that is one tough race!

    Arrived on the Friday and rode the course with my Italian friend; 1800m of climbing, 45km, 5 hrs.
    Only a couple of runs on the Saturday as the old legs were burning just 500m or so of climbing and Special Stage 1 and 2 checked out again.
    Race on the Sunday, just over 1500m climbing and another 1600m climbing again 5 hrs but under race conditions for the Special Stage descents.

    Terrain was very steep and loose on SS1 with a lot of roots, steps and tight switchbacks through the trees, very tight with a few narrow rock chutes thrown in for good measure.
    Special 2 was fast and flowy at the start but then became steep and rocky with big steps and drop offs and some near vertical 7-8ft drops at speed, the descent lasting about 6 minutes, the surface was much sandier and stony making the flowing corners great fun but also quite treacherous at times.
    SS3 was the shortest, classic woodland singletrack with a few sharp climbs thrown in and lots of rooty drop offs.
    SS4, after 4.5hrs of riding was a beast of a long, rocky, steep flowing trail, very technical, very loose, lasting nearly 10 minutes flat out it had everything, jumps, natural bermed corners, rock shutes, slatey sections it was amazing!

    What about the BOS well fantastic I have to say, everything I wanted from shocks.

    Definitely not plush at the front tho! Described by my Italian friend and a few who tried the front in the paddock as 'like a rock'! I preferred firm Running the front at 4bar, 1 bar lower than recommended for my weight I was getting full travel, I would maybe now back off the LSC a smidge as I had almost zero bob even standing climbing with TRC off so perhaps it is too firm at low speed, I washed out the front on one corner which was loose but it surprised me, perhaps another indication that LSC is a little too strong right now. HSC is spot on as is rebound on std settings.

    The fork just ate the terrain, always riding high, feeling very firm but soaking everything up, it reacts so fast, big step downs that could not be jumped, even one near vertical 7ft rock face drop to a switch back didn't result in the front tucking, with similar reactions under braking, this for me was the most outstanding attribute, the ability to provide such feedback and grip yet sit high under braking and soak up all the hits.

    The rear was un-noticable apart from the frequent chirping of the rebound and an irritating squeak that developed under pedalling, I think the dust had got into the spring! I ran it at 30% sag, grip was never an issue at the back and the std settings seemed to do the job admirably. I have to confess surprise at how well it pedalled, just not a problem, I think I could increase the sag to 35% without compromising that or making it feel soggy, there was very little pedal bob even under standing climbing, some obviously, but nothing like I experienced with previous air shocks even with ProPedal.

    I am sure in all this the stiff Nicolai chassis and the very noticeable stability improvement provided by the 66.5deg HA courtesy of the new 1 1/8' Head Angle Set played their part.

    Front and rear attacted various glances and discussions amongst my Italian competitors and it was certainly the only set up with BOS there, shame the rider was never going to do it true justice

    If you haven't worked it out I am absolutely stoked by this purchase, I think the characteristics suit the Nicolai amazingly well.

    I am no great rider but I managed to finish 183/400 in the last Special Stage, most of the riders in this pro event ride the terrain a lot and very good riders were in the majority, not least the winner Karim Amour who is up there with the likes of Fabien Barel in these. I can now speak from experience that the Pro events are not for the feint hearted and that a 10 minute downhill at the end of 1500m + of climbing in 28 egree heat is quite a challenge to do flat out without crashing or making too many mistakes.

    So, if any of you get the chance to do one, you wont regret it, Finale at the end of the year in October is meant to be spectacular, I will be there for sure.

    As for the BOS, brilliant, no regrets. The fork is NOT coil plush but it does grip like the proverbial, soak up all the hits, react to successive hits very very fast without packing, yet resist dive and thus maintain stability like nothing else I've ever ridden, without having to compromise steering by making the bike too slack and thus less good in the tight stuff. Stiffness was never an issue and I had no issues with the axle tightness with my CK bolt through (Well I did pick up some play after day one and thought the headset or axle was loose but that turned out to be the hub that needed adjusting!)

    The rear is sublime, only word for it.

    I can't wait to nail it in some other events in France and Italy this year and rip it on some UK trails too

  31. #531
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    pilot, interesting write up, thanks. Are you running stock settings on the shock? Running mine with 40% sag at the moment.

  32. #532
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    Smashing write up, sounds like you had great time

  33. #533
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    Thanks wpuk, it was awesome, this BOS stuff rocks (forgive the pun) but I can see it not being for everyone. It was initially wierd for the front to 'feel' firm and yet soak everything up both large and small bumps, I know this as I had no arm or hand pump, just great feedback. gratuitous pic..

    <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/aadm/5636614963/" title="Sestri PS4, Phil jumping by aadm, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5310/5636614963_4bb4114eee.jpg" width="500" height="375" alt="Sestri PS4, Phil jumping"></a>

  34. #534
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    guys

    the webstore on BOS online is not working... anyone knows where i can grab the Deville ? someone that ships internationally?
    hmm... i need a 140 and a 160mm version

  35. #535
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    Quote Originally Posted by AttitudeBikes
    guys

    the webstore on BOS online is not working... anyone knows where i can grab the Deville ? someone that ships internationally?
    hmm... i need a 140 and a 160mm version
    Try Roger at R53?

  36. #536
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    Hi guys,
    i am about to buy a new fork and since January i am i doubting between Bos Deville 160 and Fox Float 160 FIT RLC with kashima (i was thinking about Talas but i read that Float works better, is that true). Can you help me, i really can't decide. I haven't ride non of them and all the information i am collecting by Internet and forums. You all seems with quite lot of experience and i will really take into account your opinion

    Cheers

  37. #537
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    Bos > fox
    /thread

  38. #538
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    Quote Originally Posted by AttitudeBikes
    guys

    the webstore on BOS online is not working... anyone knows where i can grab the Deville ? someone that ships internationally?
    hmm... i need a 140 and a 160mm version
    Attitude
    You have PM
    www.gravity-sports.co.uk

    flash bikes for flash gits

  39. #539
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    Last edited by loamranger; 04-25-2011 at 03:28 PM.

  40. #540
    Nicolai
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whafe
    Dont under estimate the RS Vivid Air, closest I have ever felt to coil.......
    Best match with the deville for me...

    now one question is.... who have tried a vivid air and a stoy coil? any comparison report possible ? hmm... because... i just broke my vivid air valve stupidly while doing "some" adjustments, well anyway bottom line shock is down and i wana try a Coil shock now... thats gonna put a +/- 150 grams on my already getting heavier am...

  41. #541
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    Stoy coil rocks i tried to give it a bit if a review. Very plush and grippy, yet pedals well, very like the CCDB but I find it more plush and s bit 'faster' but I'm sure I could have made the CCDB feel like that if I had tried.

  42. #542
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_pilot
    Stoy coil rocks i tried to give it a bit if a review. Very plush and grippy, yet pedals well, very like the CCDB but I find it more plush and s bit 'faster' but I'm sure I could have made the CCDB feel like that if I had tried.


    The Stoy is tuned to the bike, so very little fiddling is necessary to set it up, which I like. Just fit and leave it alone. At the moment I have left my compression settings on stock and backed off the rebound just a little. Compared to the CCDB I find it gives more "pop" off lips, is as plush and has loads of traction. Nice match with the Deville's upfront. Very predictable set-up. I'm staying with BOS on any future builds....looking at Deville 170 or Idylle SC and Air. Only slight downside so far is the axle (keep bending allen keys) which I assume has now been sorted on the 2012 models.

  43. #543
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    Stoy / Deville combo working in perfect harmony here also.


  44. #544
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    Nice.. i want my stoy... now... so i can write a review against both and do some juctice.. then again it will be at least 2 weeks, thats where an enduro race is coming up! DAMN

  45. #545
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    I thought the Mojo was the 'team' bike when I went to the Italian SuperEnduro, never seen so many in one place, obviously popular for a reason. Mostly 140's and 1x10 tho from what I could see.

  46. #546
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    Last edited by loamranger; 05-01-2011 at 03:40 PM.

  47. #547
    Nicolai
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    is it me or the link isnt working?

  48. #548
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    Yeah it doesn't work, just go here and find the link in the news section http://www.shinnyracing.com

  49. #549
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    Bos 2012

    Link now fixed.

  50. #550
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    BOS Air Shock

    I see that this is also custom tuned to the bike.

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