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  1. #1
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    Mountain Cycle: Management Change

    Dear All,

    As of the 20th of January 2012, Mountain Cycle management and design shall be under new management.

    The new team (the current have been replaced) will be handling all matters MC from the 20th.

    Please note all sales and customer details are in place and any and all matters of warranty etc. will naturally be taken care of.

    The new MC HQ will be located in Orange County, and after the 20th Mountain Cycle shall continue 'business as usual'.


    We wish you all the best for the future and hopefully will see you on the trails.

    Happy trails.

    Sincerely Yours,

    Gerard, John, Dawn + Eric

    Mountain Cycle 2009-2012
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  2. #2
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    Is this new ownership again?

  3. #3
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    Are you looking fro someone to work the East Coast?

  4. #4
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    Just new management, same owners

  5. #5
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    yea, yea....building up a Stumptown and just got a sticker pack from them for the frame
    '14 Salsa Horsethief | '11 Salsa La Cruz Ti | '15 Advocate Watchman | '15 Advocate Hayduke

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTSHANK View Post
    yea, yea....building up a Stumptown and just got a sticker pack from them for the frame
    Be careful, you might get sued by the big S for having that bike!

  7. #7
    shut up legs
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    new bright blue powdercoat and on the fence whether or not to use the old style stickers(I have extra brown or green ones) or the new style black and red from the MC store when I do the build...
    building a gravel grinder...full Ultegra w/ drop bars and 700x40 Kenda Happy Mediums with other Thomson goodies foe the build...BB7 discs as well
    '14 Salsa Horsethief | '11 Salsa La Cruz Ti | '15 Advocate Watchman | '15 Advocate Hayduke

  8. #8
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    I would start a new thread here about your build.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTSHANK View Post
    yea, yea....building up a Stumptown and just got a sticker pack from them for the frame



    Pics? Would love to see them.

  10. #10
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    This sucks. I had a pretty good relationship with Eric and Jon at MC over the years. **** I think Eric still has the half naked picture of my girlfriend on her MC on his computer.
    Mike G.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by lv4sndz View Post
    This sucks. I had a pretty good relationship with Eric and Jon at MC over the years. **** I think Eric still has the half naked picture of my girlfriend on her MC on his computer.
    Mike G.
    You're gonna have to post that picture.

  12. #12
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    It's been almost a week?
    They haven't said a word...
    "I thought of that while riding my bike."
    Albert Einstein, on the theory of relativity.

    Peace and Long Rides...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ericmopar View Post
    It's been almost a week?
    They haven't said a word...
    I'm not expecting them to, to be honest.

    How the new owners let go the team they did is beyond me.

    Be interesting to see how it all pans out from here.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammydog View Post
    I'm not expecting them to, to be honest.

    How the new owners let go the team they did is beyond me.

    Be interesting to see how it all pans out from here.
    I'm not surprised. Because the right things were not getting done to bring MC back to what it once was. And what was getting done, was getting done at a snails pace.

  15. #15
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    Was that a function of the management in place or the resources the owners were giving management to make things happen?

  16. #16
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    They new to produce another cross bike...as big as the sport is in Portland, the twentynineandthirteen wasn't the right choice, but suggested to use as a cyclocross bike...it is what it is and you can't change the past....but I do plan to finish my Stumptown build soon...come back soon.

    My email from them stated the transition with be in effect starting February 1, 2012..

    Let's wait and see!!
    '14 Salsa Horsethief | '11 Salsa La Cruz Ti | '15 Advocate Watchman | '15 Advocate Hayduke

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammydog View Post
    Was that a function of the management in place or the resources the owners were giving management to make things happen?
    Well, the management has been changed, so I think that would be your answer. That's just a guess.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    Well, the management has been changed, so I think that would be your answer. That's just a guess.
    I'm sure I had read that ownership has also changed.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by sammydog View Post
    I'm sure I had read that ownership has also changed.
    No, John said "same owners" over at Facebook.
    "I thought of that while riding my bike."
    Albert Einstein, on the theory of relativity.

    Peace and Long Rides...

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    Well, the management has been changed, so I think that would be your answer. That's just a guess.
    And a very bad one as you have no idea of the back story, so should not make dispersions on what has, and has not, happened and why.

    Out of professionalism, beyond this I will not discuss this matter any further.

    I wish the new guys all the luck in the world and will leave it at that.
    Last edited by G..; 01-28-2012 at 04:04 PM.
    ---
    Design Guy [SanAndreas 2.0, Zen II]

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by G.. View Post
    And a very bad one as you have no idea of the back story, so should not make dispersions on what has, and has not, happened and why.

    Out of professionalism, beyond this I will not discuss this matter any further.

    I wish the new guys all the luck in the world and will leave it at that.
    Hey, I'm just going by what the OP said. Which was new management and design. They didn't saw anything about ownership. If there is a back story, how about enlightening us. Dang, if I wanted to be treated like that, I can go buy a bike from one of the big three. Because with that attitude, I'm sure not going to buy a MC.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    Hey, I'm just going by what the OP said. Which was new management and design. They didn't saw anything about ownership. If there is a back story, how about enlightening us. Dang, if I wanted to be treated like that, I can go buy a bike from one of the big three. Because with that attitude, I'm sure not going to buy a MC.
    But, I guess your not with MC any more. So, I guess I can buy one of their bikes.

  23. #23
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    Except for John,

    I can't say I'm sad to hear they're gone.

    I've been following MC for a while and was hoping that this was the year they would finally pull off something cool. Alas, it was not to be.

    For the new management, please take this advice going forward:

    1) Team up with people who know all about modern riding requirements and geometry. If you have to hire/sponsor multiple people to do this, do it. The last two MC designers clearly didn't know it all and didn't talk to anyone who could round out their knowledge. Both of them brought bikes that showcased that lack of knowledge. The Battery was 9# 15oz, 5" travel frame that came only in a small size with no front derailleur compatibility and no ISCG mount... I went over to MC a few weeks ago to try out the new bikes. The San An 2.0 has 34" standover height in a medium sized frame! I can't even straddle the top tube without discomfort. On what planet does that make sense? That's an immediate no-go for me and probably anyone that would otherwise fit a medium frame. This is your flagship bike and it's got a glaring problem! (For comparison my medium Highline is 31.5" in the same place on the top tube and it has more travel. My medium Fury was 31.5" as well.) Why does the 5.5" travel Zen 2 have a 69.5 degree head angle? What's up with the geometry numbers on the supposed DH-capable Shockwave? Anyone who would post such incredibly weird numbers is either doing so by mistake (i.e. those aren't the real numbers) or is intent on screwing up a bike.

    2) Listen to all of your staff when coming up with the designs. Should the guy who interfaces with customers on a daily basis have a big say in how the bikes are built? Absolutely. This was not done during the last 5 years of management and it shows.

    3) Listen to customers and address their concerns appropriately. Gerard had a tendency to flip out when anyone seriously questioned anything in his design. (New stuff.) What could have been a valuable opportunity to educate consumers just devolved into a diva storming off. Elbry's attempts to answer questions fell aggravatingly short. Eric, the manager, could have and should have stepped in to mitigate these problems but instead did nothing. Several people, myself included, pointed out concerns with the SanAn standover height in that thread but were ignored by MC, misunderstood by many other forum members and basically told "it's not a problem." Well, it's here and it is a problem. What now?

    4) Don't force silly new standards that are not clearly better than benchmark parts. That BB35 thing is a joke because the cranks that are attached to the standard are cheap junk compared to Hollowtech cranks. Aside from being a really thin hollow back forging, these cranks attach via a press fit spline taper similar to the old ISIS standard. The one on the Zen was clearly press fit crooked out of the box such that front shifting was compromised. If I wanted to, swapping to a Shimano crank would likely be no small task as I'd have to find/make an adapter to size down to a regular BB shell diameter. Oh, and there's no provision for a granny gear on these cranks. Not that it could fit without major modification because the huge BB shell would interfere with a small ring.

    5) Sweat the details on the bikes and when in doubt, ask others. Aside from the issues I listed above, both of them were too wide at the main pivot causing swingarm contact with my calf on every pedal stroke. The cable and hose routing is a mess and requires disconnecting the brake lines to route them properly through the frame. The Roco TST air shock on the San An hits the turntable link (that fugly yellow thing) at full extension... how did that make it through to production? There's two holes on the Zen frame's down tube that look like water bottle mounts but there's no way you could mount a cage in the provided space let alone a bottle. I was told they were additional cable mount points but there were no additional clamps provided so all you get are two gaping holes in the down tube.

    6) Don't bring stuff out to market that has never been tested by real riders. As far as I know, the Zen 2 and SA20 platforms have not been through real world riding. Had they been through even moderate testing, or even built up by a professional mechanic, those problems listed above would have been caught. I am not paying for the "privilege" of being a guinea pig.

    7) Squash production delays. The current owners took over in late 2006. It took 3 years for the Battery to be released and by then it was irrelevant. These new bikes were what, 8 months late after debuting at Sea Otter? How long will customers have to wait for truly functional bikes?

    I don't mean to sound like an angry, venom-spreading troll, but this current line is a big fail IMO. Look, I know that working in the industry is hard and you guys had to make some tough calls. But most of these screw ups are just plain boneheaded and there are tons of companies out there that had made similar mistakes which MC could have learned from. So I'm sorry if I hurt anyone's feelings, but if I can save someone from paying ~$1800+ just to smash his nuts getting on his new bike, I think I'll sleep better at night. I sincerely hope the new management does better. The Mountain Cycle brand deserves better. For the time being, this whole sorry saga has soured me enough that I've unloaded my much loved MC's and moved on to another brand. I hope that one day I'll once again be able to fly the MC flag proudly.
    Last edited by HHMTB; 01-31-2012 at 09:36 PM.
    "Adventure begins where good judgment ends."

  24. #24
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    The new MC: Please read what HHMTB and I have to say!


    I can't understand why it takes MC so long to do anything. I mean, car companies come out with new cars from start to finish in half the time it takes MC to come out with a new frame.

    If the owners want to save MC, they need to come full circle and get back Robert Reisinger as a designer. It would be a great move design wise and it would be a great marketing move.

    MC needs to do something similar to what SC did. They took the Heckler and Bullit And modernized it into the Nickel and Butcher. MC could take the original San Andreas frame, change the monocoque front end to a twin tube front end, have a one piece CNC BB and pivot location (I read some where that G took credit for this. But MC was doing that a long time ago with the 9.5) Add a link to control wheel movement. The swing arm could be something similar to the new SA. Redesign the seat assembly and add modern geometry. The final redesigned SA would look very similar to the old design, with the same low standover height. It just wouldn't be a monocoque design anymore, which is ok, because it would be easier to build them in different sizes. And, it would look nothing like the new SA, which in my opinion isn't a SA.

    And here's the kicker. When the frames are done, actually take some to the magazines so they can test and do a write up on it. Get MC back in the public eye. This is something, to my knowledge, that the previous management of MC did not do. It they did, the product must have been so bad that they wouldn't even put it in their mags, because I have seen nothing MC in the mags for a long, long time.

    The SA should, in my opinion be like a Porsche 911, a car that came out with a great basic design and small changes were made every year to make it better. It's a classic design. The original SA is also a classic design. But because of the monocoque construction (which was a great idea at the time, because the only thing available was round tubes) it was much to difficult to make the small changes needed to keep it modern. Robert told me that himself. At some point, much sooner then the new SA, the monocoque design should have been changed over to a tube design. Especially when technology allowed people to make tubes in any shape needed. Again, back then you just had round tubes. So, in conlusion, the original SA could be modernized into a new frame, that would look very much the same as the classic, almost exactly the same in profile, with modern geo and a single pivot with a link. It doesn't need to look like the nut crunching monstrosity of the new SA, which I have a feeling will never really make it to market, past february of this year.
    Last edited by Mountain Cycle Shawn; 02-17-2012 at 09:03 PM.

  25. #25
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    I agree totally with what everyone has to say. I gave up on MC a while ago when they told us years ago that "there is something coming that's worth waiting for" i believe that was 09. I was looking for a bike that i could ride XC with and ride the local DH park with. I personally wasn't to worried about weight but wanted a dual purpose rig. And i found that rig but it didn't have a MC name plate on it. I still have my Rumble built up that i ride from time to time, and i love that bike. But its not the dual purpose rig. I also have a Sin and Fury in the stable but no plan on purchasing a new MC any time soon. So its sad to see them still not have a plan after all these years. Hopefully they get another chance.

    And on a side note did anyone see on there facebook page that Elbry who rides for then doesn't even know whats going on.......WTF. Oh and there web page says under construction. Mountian Cycle Shawn this is for you.....she would kill me if she new this was up.

    Mike G.

  26. #26
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    Right on! Your secret is safe with me.

    It's going to be interesting to see what happens with MC.

  27. #27
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    I've been keeping my mouth shut until now, but I have to say I agree with the above.

    The new Zen II looks good, but is not in the light weight XC bike category as the original. That would be like the Big S turning the Stumpjumper into a All Mountain ride.

    I guess the San An two had a taller top tube than I was thinking from the photos.

    All the extra pivots in the new suspension design, take out the simplicity of single pivot in the first place. They may as well have gone four bar, or DW.

    John listened, I know this from talking to him. He was a great customer service rep.

    I could tell by Gerard's comments, that he didn't ride the terrain that the San An II and Zen II are built for. Therefor he couldn't design in ideal geometry from experience.
    That in of itself isn't a problem if you listen to those that do have the riding experience.

    They shouldn't have waited so long for all the bikes to come out. They should have worked on one and got it out there sooner, then the next model etc.
    "I thought of that while riding my bike."
    Albert Einstein, on the theory of relativity.

    Peace and Long Rides...

  28. #28
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    ^ yep, they should have pushed to get the new SA out, that has always been the bread and butter for them, And as an AM bike, it should continue to be bread and butter.

    But, just like SC with the Butcher and Nickel, I think they were right by adding the link to the single pivot. It's really difficult to get a shock to work good with the old style single pivot. And there is nothing you can do to get it to work as good as the new single pivots with a link, so it's just needed to keep up with advancements in performance. I like the new SA suspension design from a standpoint of, it should be very strong, flex free, centrally located, low CQ, less pivots. It's really everything that a 4 bar isn't. The big question is: is it properly tuned to work well like a Butcher and Nickel. The standover height and the odd geometry can be fixed, But the rear end is going to have to work good, or it's just all a waste.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ericmopar View Post
    I could tell by Gerard's comments, that he didn't ride the terrain that the San An II and Zen II are built for. Therefor he couldn't design in ideal geometry from experience.
    That in of itself isn't a problem if you listen to those that do have the riding experience.
    I can tell you first hand you are wrong there.

  30. #30
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    Agreed with the HHMTB's assessment - when I first heard that the SA 2.0 was coming out I was really excited and it didn't look too bad. However, looking over the numbers they were not on par with what I was expecting....not even close.

    MC had a chance to really make a big statement and it fizzled. Too bad. But like all things that change i will be interested to see how they change and what results come about.

  31. #31
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    I'm with Shawn's last post. I'm fine with the new suspension design as long as it works.

    I would definitely buy a new Zen if
    (A) So many of the part's weren't proprietary. I already have almost enough spare parts to build 2 bikes,but most of the "expensive" parts (Wheels,Cranks,etc) won't work.
    (B) It came in one color (All Black,Red,etc)
    C) Most importantly,I could afford it. See (A)

    That said, Had they made a lighter AM/Trail Battery frame available in sizes similar to an SC Heckler, I would have bought it on release day. I'm Still a sucker for the simplicity of a Single pivot.

  32. #32
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    Hey Folks,
    Just wanted to chime in and also address any questions about HHMTB's #4

    - M35 is not a new standard, but rather just a new BB design that fits in 2 current standards out there...BB30 and PF30. That's all.

    - The MC Frames are PF30 and can easily handle any PF30 crank in the market, or our Conversion BB for Shimano cranks.

    - If you'd like to run a Shimano crank that's no problem at all. The Praxis Conversion BB's are available now....Just go to our Praxis Works site, and under products you'll see the Conversion Kit. Have a look at it and there is an instal vid as reference too.

    We stand behind all our products and if any MC customers have any questions about their crank/BB/rings during the MC transition, we'll be glad to help you out no problem. Just give us a call or email.

    Hope that helps!
    Adam @ Praxis

  33. #33
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    How many companies are adopting this new BB design, for FS all mountain and DH bikes?

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Cycle Shawn View Post
    How many companies are adopting this new BB design, for FS all mountain and DH bikes?
    X2. I was told it was to be a new standard months ago, probably over a year now, but I haven't seen one single bike at the local shops equipped with it.

    When Shimano went from square taper to outside bearing with a 25mm spindle that was a huge improvement, but I don't see how a 30mm spindle with a larger heavier bottom bracket shell is better. Someone had pointed out that small rings don't work well or at all with the new standard of PF 30.
    If you like two rings that's fine, but I prefer the full range of gearing offered by 22X32X44.
    "I thought of that while riding my bike."
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ericmopar View Post
    X2. I was told it was to be a new standard months ago, probably over a year now, but I haven't seen one single bike at the local shops equipped with it.

    When Shimano went from square taper to outside bearing with a 25mm spindle that was a huge improvement, but I don't see how a 30mm spindle with a larger heavier bottom bracket shell is better. Someone had pointed out that small rings don't work well or at all with the new standard of PF 30.
    If you like two rings that's fine, but I prefer the full range of gearing offered by 22X32X44.
    Exactly! And, I don't see the point if you have to run a conversion BB. It's just more weight and complexity, with less options.

  36. #36
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    I had "heard" that the BB shell is too wide on PF/BB 30 for a small ring, but I must admit I don't know if that is true.
    It seems to make sense. If the spindle is 30 - 35mm, then the bearing and cup would have to be bigger in diameter as well. '
    It would also depend on the width of the BB shell.
    "I thought of that while riding my bike."
    Albert Einstein, on the theory of relativity.

    Peace and Long Rides...

  37. #37
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    Hey guys im new to the site. I recently bough a second hand MC Fury from 06-07 from a friend. I broke my derailleur hanger riding the other day, and have been trying to contact MC to no avail.

    Their phone number doesn't work and I have send numerous email to them with no reply.

    Does anyone know if they are still in business or how to contact them?

    They have the part listed on their site but their checkout system doesn't work.

    SOMEONE PLEASE HELP!!!! im very sketched out by their lack of correspondence and i have the feeling that I might be up the creek without a paddle.

    I have looked on eBay and done a bunch of searching for a suitable replacement hanger, but no luck. Does anyone know a replacement that would work in place of the one from MC.

    If you have any info that could help please let me know!!

    Thank, Chris

  38. #38
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    DerailleurHanger

    Click on all hangers and match it up.

  39. #39
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    Thanks for the help Shawn!

  40. #40
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    I'm pretty sure I've got one or two new ones on hand. If you fall flat locating others, I sell you one for $15 + shipping. I've divested myself of most MC stuff by now due to their continuous screw ups, so it'll be no big deal to send you one. PM me if interested.

    On the other hand, if your buddy used the Fury a lot, you might want to check the underside of the swingarm for cracks before you spend any more money on it. I've cracked a couple on the drive side near the bend. I always caught it before anything bad happened, but one of them had a 2-3" long crack in it (prob cracked for months) and it never felt/rode different. It was disappointing though.

    Any else notice the new frames on ebay starting at $900? Not looking good for the brand.
    "Adventure begins where good judgment ends."

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by HHMTB View Post
    I'm pretty sure I've got one or two new ones on hand. If you fall flat locating others, I sell you one for $15 + shipping. I've divested myself of most MC stuff by now due to their continuous screw ups, so it'll be no big deal to send you one. PM me if interested.

    On the other hand, if your buddy used the Fury a lot, you might want to check the underside of the swingarm for cracks before you spend any more money on it. I've cracked a couple on the drive side near the bend. I always caught it before anything bad happened, but one of them had a 2-3" long crack in it (prob cracked for months) and it never felt/rode different. It was disappointing though.

    Any else notice the new frames on ebay starting at $900? Not looking good for the brand.
    Yeah, and no ones buying them!

    What else MC do you have to get rid of?

  42. #42
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    This news has really sagged my MC Fury smile earned from my experience with John at Mountain Cycle, from a couple of years ago, when I purchased my Fury. MC was so unique even though they swam in the limited manufacturing pool of Taiwan.

    Must put a magic charm on my rear der hanger to ward off rocks, stumps and wild wood.

    urmb
    “Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of riding a \mountain or fat/ bike.” ~ John F. Kennedy

  43. #43
    mtbr member
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    Yeah, the whole thing sucks! I talked to John a couple times. I was very impressed and he is one of the coolest guys Iv'e talked to in or out of the bike industry.

  44. #44
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    Hi urmb,

    If this is any help. When I was let go there were quite a few hangers left in house (along with other spares).

    maybe they will pop up

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRA009 View Post
    Hi urmb,

    If this is any help. When I was let go there were quite a few hangers left in house (along with other spares).

    maybe they will pop up
    Thanks for the info. I will start knocking on the door.

    urmb
    “Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of riding a \mountain or fat/ bike.” ~ John F. Kennedy

  46. #46
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    Thanks Shawn

  47. #47
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    Your very welcome. What are you doing these days?

  48. #48
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    hello I live in France and owns an MC shockwave bos team and a Zen but I have broken my hanger and I can not find a piece in France is that someone can help me and tell me if this pilo piece if s' adapts please help me to continue to roll in MC

  49. #49
    mtbr member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ether09 View Post
    hello I live in France and owns an MC shockwave bos team and a Zen but I have broken my hanger and I can not find a piece in France is that someone can help me and tell me if this pilo piece if s' adapts please help me to continue to roll in MC
    Try asking here:

    http://www.facebook.com/groups/ClubMountainCycle/

    You'll have to ask to join, I'll join you as soon as I can. Please continue to use MTBR for all your other mountain bike needs. Please tell your MC friends about Club Mountain Cycle.

  50. #50
    Just the tip!
    Reputation: HHMTB's Avatar
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    Do you have the Rumble with the replaceable dropouts or just the replaceable hanger? If the former, I've got a set of both dropouts. Cheap + shipping if that's what you need.
    "Adventure begins where good judgment ends."

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