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Thread: Strong vs Moots

  1. #1
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    Strong vs Moots

    This might be a ridiculous question to ask on the Moots forum (b/c of Moots bias) but Iím in need of some opinions. Like many of you, Iíve wanted a Moots since I knew they existed but unlike all of you I have yet to actually buy one. My situation is changing (new baby) and Iíve thought long and hard about this and I buying a new frame that I want to last forever (obviously not forever, but as close as I can get). I have a couple bikes thatíll be liquidated to acquire my new frame. This is my question, what do I buy? I can afford a used Moots ($3000.00 is too rich for my blood) or a custom steel Strong frame? Do I buy a used Moots and hope everything fits (btw, Iím an average guy in every possible way; 5í 10Ē, 190 lbs, etc) and hope it lasts forever, or do I support one of the coolest small steel frame builders and get a the Strong warranty?
    "You can become a very fast donkey, but you'll never be a thoroughbred..."

  2. #2
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    I gotta vote for the new custom Strong. I have ridden some Moots and they are nice but a custom Strong would fit better and ride at least as well. In fact, if you want to slacken the HA a bit and have some other preferences, it would probably ride better than the Moots. The 26" Moots are a bit too race-oriented in geometry for me. If I went Moots, I'd probably want to go custom.

  3. #3
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    Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'll be interested in a 29er (who isn't these days?) and the Moots will be the YBB version. Thanks for the thoughts so far, Flyer. I went for a ride today on my friends Gary Fisher Cobia(?) and I forgot how harsh a hardtail is... I'm actually now thinking more about the YBB just to take the edge off of small seated bumps. A couple times today I swear my Flite was checking my colon, this hardtail really helped me focus on standing through the bumpys. I'm use to a Titus Switchblade and all its plushy glory, and I just hope I'm not making a bad choice selling it to buy a rigid 29er... Moots or Strong
    "You can become a very fast donkey, but you'll never be a thoroughbred..."

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    Was in the same boat as you. I have three month-old twins so when I started shopping for a mtn bike (haven't had one for almost 5 years), I knew it was gonna have to be a "lifetime" purchase. Wanted a 29er. Fascinated with Moots etc etc. For the type of riding I do, FS was not necessary but I wanted something to take the edge off since I'm not 20 anymore. That took me to the YBB design and there are only a couple of places doing anything like that.

    I bit the bullet and bought the Moots. I suspected I'd need custom geometry but didn't but I DID need lots of calls/conferring with the Moots people to decide on proper frame size b/c I was right in the the margin between 19 and 20 inch. That, I think, is where they excelled...helping me chose the right size for the purpose. Customer service was excellent. I'd buy another from them without question, though that's not likely to happen now that I'm buying formula!!!

    Never heard of Strong.

    Cheers

  5. #5
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    Bobonli, thanks, that's exactly what I'm looking for. I live in the Chicago area so I'm also not in need of a FS bike (even though it's been really nice having one) I'm glad to hear you like the YBB.

    Carl Strong is a small business frame builder and he does amazing stuff with steel and titanium, but he sticks with hardtails. http://www.strongframes.com ...he's worth a look. IMO His stuff is better looking then IF.
    "You can become a very fast donkey, but you'll never be a thoroughbred..."

  6. #6
    Ti is addictive
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    I've seen Carl Strongs work and Moots work in the same place, and Carl wins hands down. If you are buying any of the bikes at full retail, then I would say get the Strong frame hands down......Custom, work one on one with the maker, amazing craftmanship. Now if you are looking at new steel frame from Carl vs used moots, I would still say the Strong just because it is a custom for you vs guestimate on the used marked..
    "Can I put a Totem on a FTM?".....Originally Posted by All Mountain

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    Well I'm a Moots rider, so of course I'm partial to Moots. I also prefer ti to steel. The only thing here is you're talking used with no warranty vs. new with a full warranty. That does make a difference in my book. I have a new YBB and can't say enough about it, and I am very happy to have a lifetime warranty on it. My YBB is much smoother than my previous Moots (a Rigormootis--hardtail). I did take a chance and bought the Rigor used, but I recently read about a guy that bought used and had the frame crack. By the time he paid for the repair, he might as well have bought a new Moots in the first place. So I guess what I'd say is if you don't mind taking a chance on a used bike, go for the Moots. If not, save up for a new one, or go with the Strong.

  8. #8
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    jckid- what do you find is preferable in Ti over steel? Is it the feel/ride or a preference for Ti as a last-forever material? I'm simply curious.

    Also, has anyone had any toe-overlap issues with the front wheel on Moots 29ers? I'm talking about overlap with size 12/13 shoes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueMountain
    jckid- what do you find is preferable in Ti over steel? Is it the feel/ride or a preference for Ti as a last-forever material? I'm simply curious.

    Also, has anyone had any toe-overlap issues with the front wheel on Moots 29ers? I'm talking about overlap with size 12/13 shoes.
    Actually I ride a steel bike (Bike Friday) and a ti bike (YBB). I've also owned many other steel bikes and 3 other ti bikes over the years. Actually, I think both steel and ti have a nice ride quality. I like the lighter weight of the ti, the fact that it should last forever and doesn't rust, and the overall look of ti. I prefer an unpainted frame as well--seems to hold up better over time.

  10. #10
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    Not to diss Moots, but the YBB is the only reason to choose a Moots. If you don't want or need the YBB, think about Eriksen, Strong, IF, Seven, Quiring, etc. You can go custom for less than the price of a stock Moots. FYI - many Moots 29ers still have trouble with the fork crown of suspension forks not clearing the down tube . . . just lazy design for so much $$$.

  11. #11
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    Moots

    I totally disagree with you. I'm riding a Cinco and I would never go back to another "cookie cutter" brand again. No way in hell. Call me a snob, thats like going from driving a Kia to going out and driving a Lexus. I rode a Blur for God knows how many years, piece of crap. All the damn pivot creaking and cracking and I really dont care about the "new" Blur and all the new pivots.

    There is nothing like the feel of Ti and also knowing that your buying the product from an American company who makes the bikes in America rather than some cookie cutter bike co. who manufactures the bike in Taiwan. Please. If you cant afford to buy a Moots then fine, just say it and dont buy one. But dont sit here and tell us that the only reason to buy a Moots is the YBB. Thats annoying and stupid.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by skibum1
    I totally disagree with you. I'm riding a Cinco and I would never go back to another "cookie cutter" brand again. But dont sit here and tell us that the only reason to buy a Moots is the YBB. Thats annoying and stupid.
    I guess you overlooked that the Cinco is using a rear end built by Ventana. If I want a 5 inch travel FS, I can go many places and still stay away from mass produced bikes (Ventana, Turner, Lenz, etc.) No one makes a Ti softail quite like Moots, but lots of companies make great hardtails and FS bikes. What I'm getting at is that the YBB is the only truly unique product in the Moots line. For every other style there are other options, like the Cinco for example. I owned a 26" YBB in the past and will most likely have a 29er YBB in the future. To insinuate that Moots it the only non "cookie cutter" manufacturer out there when they are less flexible than most small builders is . . . well . . . quite "annoying and stupid".

  13. #13
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    Moots

    Keep your panties on.

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    Hairllama,

    Quote Originally Posted by Hairllama
    I guess you overlooked that the Cinco is using a rear end built by Ventana. If I want a 5 inch travel FS, I can go many places and still stay away from mass produced bikes (Ventana, Turner, Lenz, etc.) No one makes a Ti softail quite like Moots, but lots of companies make great hardtails and FS bikes. What I'm getting at is that the YBB is the only truly unique product in the Moots line. For every other style there are other options, like the Cinco for example. I owned a 26" YBB in the past and will most likely have a 29er YBB in the future. To insinuate that Moots it the only non "cookie cutter" manufacturer out there when they are less flexible than most small builders is . . . well . . . quite "annoying and stupid".
    "No one makes a Ti softail quite like Moots"? I take it you never heard of or have ever seen a BLACKSHEEP? I'd do some research on this before you start using the words "NO ONE".BTW I"m a HUGE Moots fan,HUGE. CF..

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    I've heard of Blacksheep, James uses an air shock on his soft tail and is spotty at returning phone calls and emails. I said no one because most of the others use air shocks which don't handle the odd load angles as well as the YBB slider. I figure if out are going to mess with air & oil, go ahead and get the FS. Salsa, Black Sheep, Siren, Funk, Castellano, Dean, etc. all use an air shock of some kind or are just plain ugly. I've done my research. Show me a slider style Ti soft tail that has the clean lines and low maintenance of the Moots.

  16. #16
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    Fair enough,,

    Quote Originally Posted by Hairllama
    I've heard of Blacksheep, James uses an air shock on his soft tail and is spotty at returning phone calls and emails. I said no one because most of the others use air shocks which don't handle the odd load angles as well as the YBB slider. I figure if out are going to mess with air & oil, go ahead and get the FS. Salsa, Black Sheep, Siren, Funk, Castellano, Dean, etc. all use an air shock of some kind or are just plain ugly. I've done my research. Show me a slider style Ti soft tail that has the clean lines and low maintenance of the Moots.
    Although I think the "Clean Lines" of the Blacksheep are some of the sweetest I've seen on Ti. But to be honest none of these bikes really interest me anyway,I was honestly trying to make you aware of something(Blacksheep) that could be a good choice for you. Good luck with what ever you do and make sure to keep us posted..CF..

  17. #17
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    no comparison

    ^^^SS Silk Ti RR^^^

    Quote Originally Posted by Hairllama
    I've heard of Blacksheep, James uses an air shock on his soft tail and is spotty at returning phone calls and emails. I said no one because most of the others use air shocks which don't handle the odd load angles as well as the YBB slider. I figure if out are going to mess with air & oil, go ahead and get the FS. Salsa, Black Sheep, Siren, Funk, Castellano, Dean, etc. all use an air shock of some kind or are just plain ugly. I've done my research. Show me a slider style Ti soft tail that has the clean lines and low maintenance of the Moots.

  18. #18
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    Whoa! That Silk Ti 29er is amazing. I like the 100mm fork and it's built by Potts!

  19. #19
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    I was "THIS" close to ordering up a Mooto-X YBB as I have wanted one ever since I could remember. When pictures of the Silk Ti were posted, I said what the hell and threw in another $800 or so bucks. Hopefully my Castellano gets here in late October. Either way the Silk and the Mooto are both sweet framses.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hairllama
    Whoa! That Silk Ti 29er is amazing. I like the 100mm fork and it's built by Potts!

  20. #20
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    I assume you ordered the Silk Ti from Steve Potts? What is the intent of the curved seattube? Is it to make the chainstays shorter and still have tire clearance? Great looking bike!

    Regarding the Moots, I'm pretty sure the Fox crown clears the downtube (since some use the Fox F29) but I wonder if the new 20mm Reba will give the frame some problems.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hairllama
    Not to diss Moots, but the YBB is the only reason to choose a Moots. If you don't want or need the YBB, think about Eriksen, Strong, IF, Seven, Quiring, etc. You can go custom for less than the price of a stock Moots. FYI - many Moots 29ers still have trouble with the fork crown of suspension forks not clearing the down tube . . . just lazy design for so much $$$.
    The tall crown race that Chris King makes takes care of the issue with the clearance. I happen to fit the stock Moots frame just fine. My Mooto-XZ 4 inch 29er is a sweet silky ride since I like a bit more suspension then the YBB offers.

    To each their own on bikes, it's all very personal. I happen to like to test bikes before a purchase and I had the opportunity to test my bike, but that is not always possible.

    Peace.

  22. #22
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    Good point pastajet, anybody have a mooto-x ybb they will let me borrow? I live in the southern part of chicagoland area. I would really like to ride before i buy but i figure b/c of where i live nobody has a moots let alone a 29er ybb in my size (im 5'10" btw)... the silence is deafening...
    "You can become a very fast donkey, but you'll never be a thoroughbred..."

  23. #23
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    Here's another option: custom Curtlo softail. His lead times are waay out there (not like Vanilla or Jones out there though...) but if you're not in a huge hurry you could get a nice custom steel softtail frame from him for less than a standard steel hardtail from Strong.

    Don't think I'm putting down the other two options though; I currently ride a custom steel hardtail from Strong and the construction is absolutely flawless. I've wanted a Mooto XBB for a long time too so all are good options.
    "I'll disintegrate over time if I expect my body to try to keep up with my mind" -BM

    Race, Rocks or Road...Just Ride

  24. #24
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    I own a Strong custome steel road bike and a MootooX. I really enjoyed working with Carl. Nothing bad to say about either. IF I was going for a softail then it's hands down Moots, anything else I would look very hard at either Carl or Kent Eriksen.

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