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  1. #26
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    It's an interesting take on the Mountain Cycle San Andreas.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by posey24 View Post
    lol rants aren'talways right just looking for input if I'm wrong just explain so i can learn a thing or two...
    hopefully my previous post explained why your theory's are incorrect and I also hope I didn't hurt your feelings. It is the internet after all
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    It's an interesting take on the Mountain Cycle San Andreas.
    Similar main tube but the goose has the rear coil pretty exposed on the underside of the bike.

  4. #29
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    why is the front derailleur post so excessively long?
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  5. #30
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    ^^^^^ LOL What in the hell is that
    Dont ever let the truth get in the way of a funny story....

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    ^^^^^ LOL What in the hell is that
    isn't the the Kmart bike this thread is about?
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  7. #32
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    The San Andreas was the full suspension DH MTB that influenced full suspension MTB design for the past 20 years.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  8. #33
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    maybe for single pivot
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  9. #34
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    after some google searches i might be able to buy into it
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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tone's View Post
    ^^^^^ LOL What in the hell is that
    Normal mountain bicycle.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinning Lizard View Post
    2 things are going on here.

    1. You are a shill for Mongoose

    or

    2. You drink too much

    Either way you need to put in your sig your affiliation to Mongoose.
    Do you have nothing better to do than stalk me on here? Creepy. Just look at my signature line, there's a link to my YouTube channel. Might want to check it out before accusing me.
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad mechanic View Post
    There isn't value in upgrading a Blackcomb frame. Put that money aside and buy a better full suspension bike to begin with.
    A person has the right to do whatever they want to their bike... I wouldn't tell you not to upgrade a bike with SLX to and XTR rear derailleur if that's what you wanted to do.
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by irishmongooserider View Post
    A person has the right to do whatever they want to their bike... I wouldn't tell you not to upgrade a bike with SLX to and XTR rear derailleur if that's what you wanted to do.
    I didn't say you can't. I just said there isn't value in it, and there isn't.

    Do the math. At the end of the day you'll spend more money than on an equivalently speced bike and you'll still be stuck with a heavy, low performance frame. Your money buys a lot more when you buy a good bike to begin with.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad mechanic View Post
    I didn't say you can't. I just said there isn't value in it, and there isn't.

    Do the math. At the end of the day you'll spend more money than on an equivalently speced bike and you'll still be stuck with a heavy, low performance frame. Your money buys a lot more when you buy a good bike to begin with.
    My point is that value is in the eye of the beholder so to speak. I may rather have a Teocali frame to build, but if someone wants to upgrade a less expensive bike, more power to them. Value is a relative/objective figure. One person's value of something is different than another individual's perception of the same object's value.

    As someone who's had a Blackcomb in the past, and built it up into a better bike, I can say the frame (while it is a heavy frame) is durable, and with the proper length fork (frame's geometry is far better suited to a 100mm-120mm fork, and the headtube is more than reinforced enough-just look at the monocoque front end, very beefy) is a fun handling little bike that can handle smaller stunts while not costing a ton. My previous build totaled around $600-$700 and resulted in a decent budget lighter-duty freeride bike for urban riding.

    A year ago, Airborne had a $700 freeride bike (a 6" travel single pivot model), but not much else exists for a rider looking for a heavy duty bike on a budget, and thats what the Blackcomb can be when built properly.

    I'd not recommend a used freeride bike ever (a higher end freeride bike would be heavily used and beat up to cost only $700) because of the abusive nature of the type of riding. Parts used to build a Blackcomb into a better bike could at least in part end up transfered to a better frame when a riders budget allowed.

    So, value can be very relative, and to me there can be value in the Blackcomb. I've decided to build another, which my progress can be tracked firsthand on my YouTube channel here: Mongoose Blackcomb : Building a budget freeride bike, a video documentary - YouTube
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

  15. #40
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    By the way, the San Andreas is a legendary bike that's one of my all-time favorites! Love that bike.
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

  16. #41
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    Yeah, the San Andreas is bad ass. I've ridden one and it's not like anything else I've ever ridden. Seeing a properly built one in person is a sight to behold! Although I understand why the design isn't still being used, I certainly have mad respect for the bike. I suspect the Blackcomb design was a way to copy it while getting around the MC design patent.

    The San Andreas 2.0 is a neat design, but it is WAY too much bike for around here.

    I'll say this about the Blackcomb: it's probably a sufficient bike for what many people are looking to do with a bike. I'm not a fan of people bashing on big box bikes and haven't been since my good friend Ronald showed up to a road ride on one 25 years ago and embarrassed me and my friends with our very expensive bikes.

    If you've got a Blackcomb and ride it, congratulations - you are doing more than most of the US population. Ride whatcha got and when it breaks, make a decision: fix it or move on. I understand why some people get attached to frames, for better or worse. Just wish others could understand it too.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by irishmongooserider View Post
    My point is that value is in the eye of the beholder so to speak. I may rather have a Teocali frame to build, but if someone wants to upgrade a less expensive bike, more power to them. Value is a relative/objective figure.
    Value is objective. If you end up with a setup that costs $$$, after spending $$$$, you lost.

    Upgrading complete bikes is not cost effective, unless you sell off or reuse parts. Shop interwebz for parts you want and build from scratch, or buy a complete you want, if value is a concern.

  18. #43
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    My point is that value is in the eye of the beholder so to speak. I may rather have a Teocali frame to build, but if someone wants to upgrade a less expensive bike, more power to them. Value is a relative/objective figure. One person's value of something is different than another individual's perception of the same object's value.
    you can only polish a turd so much, but it's still a turd

    As someone who's had a Blackcomb in the past, and built it up into a better bike, I can say the frame (while it is a heavy frame) is durable, and with the proper length fork (frame's geometry is far better suited to a 100mm-120mm fork, and the headtube is more than reinforced enough-just look at the monocoque front end, very beefy) is a fun handling little bike that can handle smaller stunts while not costing a ton. My previous build totaled around $600-$700 and resulted in a decent budget lighter-duty freeride bike for urban riding.
    Must have been one heck of a build for $700. You say had in the past implying you upgraded to a better frame which indicates either a fault in the frame or skill increased. The Mountain Cycle clearly has much better and stronger welds then the mongoose. and a "light-duty(?)" freeride is an All mountain bike.


    A year ago, Airborne had a $700 freeride bike (a 6" travel single pivot model), but not much else exists for a rider looking for a heavy duty bike on a budget, and thats what the Blackcomb can be when built properly.
    Again, most higher quality modern day frames alone are $2k. Plenty of "heavy duty" Freeride / DH bikes exist for under $2000 complete. Regardless of how the blackcomb is built, the quality of the frame stays the same and more prone to damage when the geometry of the head tube pushed beyond it's welded limits. which is why most bikes now a days have beefed up welded gusts to support the head tube and seat tubes.


    I'd not recommend a used freeride bike ever (a higher end freeride bike would be heavily used and beat up to cost only $700) because of the abusive nature of the type of riding. Parts used to build a Blackcomb into a better bike could at least in part end up transfered to a better frame when a riders budget allowed.
    Not true at all, some just want to upgrade to a more modern day freeride/dh platform. My $1100 now 13 year old Schwinn Straight 8 which was heavily used for racing prior to me buying it hasn't fallen apart, no cracked welds or any other fame anomalies causing catastrophic failure. Much like any bicycle or mechanical machine, due to normal wear and tear items need to be fixed such as tuning the derailleur, adjusting the breaks truing the wheels... Your philosophy on parts used to build one bike then transfer to a better frame makes me laugh and follows ( which I agree with) Bad Mechanics comment about it's worth more to just put money aside to buy a better bike. Now I'm not saying upgrading is bad! like tires... a seat.. maybe some handle grips but I would never suggest to anyone to fully upgrade a department store bike. To me, $700's in upgrades makes me wonder what kind of upgrades one is making? It costs about $700 alone for a rear shock and over $500 for a decent fork, not to mention the drive train... Now I know times are hard and money is tight and not everyone can afford a $2k+ bike but I would want to get the most for my $$. With that, as far as dh/freeride frames go, I can go to craigslist, pinkbike and ebay and find older 2000-2006 frames for under $1k and complete rigs for under $1500. All of which are still built stronger and better equipped then a department store bike. I'm not trying to bash the walmart/kmart stuff. Everyone has to start somewhere and others just want something to ride and I'm not one to take that freedom away from anyone! BUT Typically that's where most of us start and as skill increases the need for lighter stronger bikes increase. By the nature of the beast regardless to what some might say but for the most part it's true... Quality reflect price....


    By the way, the San Andreas is a legendary bike that's one of my all-time favorites! Love that bike
    The Merit Lawwill 4bar suspension is one of the best suspension designs to date and I too love my bike just as much as you and I'm glad you enjoy yours!
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  19. #44
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    Schwinn8,

    You've missed my point on most of my points...

    The time when I had the Blackcomb, I had bought it as an extra bike for others to ride, and ended up liking it enough to see what I could make of it. I ended up really liking the thing in the end.

    At that time, I was already a top ten placing XC and DH rider at the state level, so it wasn't a matter of skill level, just a neat little project for me. I only sold it during a financial crisis related to my younger daughter spending three months in the hospital due to a heart condition, when I ended up selling 4 bikes, 2 computers and my Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited. Don't automatically assume the rider of a low cost bike isn't experienced...

    What you belittle as a turd (that's a you problem btw) may be someone else's only bike, and one they like, so think before you make that statement as you seem far too elitist when you look down on a bike so much. After all, it's not what you ride, but that you ride.

    I referred to it as a lighter duty Freeride bike rather than an all-mountain bike due to the fact that it's not well suited to trail riding (all mountain bikes tend to be beefier trail bikes, pedaling well enough, and light enough to climb still) but rather suits drops off of loading docks and stair gaps well, as long as you don't get too wild.

    Airborne did have a decent Freeride bike for around $700 last year, not $2000. Not all Freeride bikes are $2k for a frame, even Specialized has a complete bike for $2500 (the Status 1).

    Again, I'm not touching a used Freeride bike, and on this the experts tend to agree with me (MBA had an article detailing this, why not to buy a used dh or fr bike, and to be careful of buying any used mountain bike). I know there are deals out on C list, but also bikes with hidden cracks and stressed frames. You can always inspect frames (feeling under the downtube for ridges or bulges for example) but you have to be careful.

    Your comment about a $700 rear shock is wayyyyy off. A quick looksie online shows Marzocchi Roco, Fox DHX's and Rockshox models for DH from $299-$425... Snag a clearance fork at 70% off (I did just that with a Marzocchi All Mountain 3) paired up with a even better priced sale shock (Rockshox Deluxe for $80) and you're nowhere near what you quoted as prices. Just a little savy and patience pays off in big savings. Then snag a big Azonic sale at Wheel World and get a double wall bar, shorty stem, post and A frame pedals at 60% off and the cost is near off brand prices. I can go on and on about how to do a custom build on the cheap. I've done more than my share of frame up builds on low and higher cost bikes, but I always try to save on good gear when possible.

    Now, while I'm certainly not against big box bikes (ie department or mass market bikes) I've always tended to ride a bit higher end (mid line mostly-say $750-$1500 bikes) but sometimes I've gotten the urge to build up a less expensive bike just to do it and have fun while keeping the build cheaper. Ive had nearly 20 bikes in 15 years, so I've had a bit of everything. Again, it's not about what you ride, but that you ride!

    I'm glad you love your old Schwinn (the Lawwill design was cool in its day, and remains so in my opinion) but there's many people out there that'd say it's probably time to hang it on a museum's wall, but I wouldn't tell you to because you enjoy riding it! That's what is awesome, you get to ride what you want! I don't currently ride a cheaper bike, but I would without question, as I simply love riding. I am doing another Blackcomb build this spring though!
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

  20. #45
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    times, technology and courses have changed alot in the past 10 years... i highly doubt any department store bike would last a modern day dh course sorry to hear about your little one, hope things are better and it was probably a good thing selling the jeep, they seem to end up more on jack stands then the trail
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  21. #46
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    no point in hanging it up yet in my eyes. it's still made of aluminum, has 8.5in. rw travel, 100% compatible with modern day components and still weighs about the same as todays dh rigs... all for under $2500, used, and zero frame issues ...
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  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by irishmongooserider View Post
    My point is...
    Axe and shwinn8 summed it up quite nicely for me. You get more for your money buying a nicer bike as opposed to upgrading a low end bike. It's just math. At the end of the day you end up with an expensive bike with a heavy, low quality frame.

    If you want to upgrade one, go ahead, just don't be under the mistaken idea that you'll save money in the long run, or you'll get it to the level of nicer bike for the same price.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    The San Andreas was the full suspension DH MTB that influenced full suspension MTB design for the past 20 years.
    I don't think I'd say that. It was a good bike for it's time, and quite stout, but it wasn't ever really revolutionary. I think if you want to point to one DH bike and say "that changed the game" it would be the Intense M1.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad mechanic View Post
    I don't think I'd say that. It was a good bike for it's time, and quite stout, but it wasn't ever really revolutionary. I think if you want to point to one DH bike and say "that changed the game" it would be the Intense M1.
    aww yes! the M1! how i missed thee i dont know!... the straight 6 also introduced the floating disc brake mount that prevented the notorious suspension lock out that still haunts bikes today
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  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by shwinn8 View Post
    times, technology and courses have changed alot in the past 10 years... i highly doubt any department store bike would last a modern day dh course sorry to hear about your little one, hope things are better and it was probably a good thing selling the jeep, they seem to end up more on jack stands then the trail
    Schwinn8, you're assuming I only riding cheap bikes (my bikes are on youtube, I'm not hiding anything)... Not true. I was using a 8" travel full-blown DH rig when I did downhilling. I even said that I wouldn't use the Blackcomb for downhill riding. Please be sure to thoroughly read my posts, as I never endorsed a bigboxbike for DH runs (quite the opposite, I stated more than once that the Blackcomb was not for DH).

    My Jeep was a newer model Grand Cherokee Limited with all options other than navigation that wasnt going to ever be messed up trail riding (got a fantastic deal on the thing, well under book value, and ended up making out on the sale after having it for awhile) and I really liked it, so no I wasnt happy about selling it, but it was something that had to be done. Again, there you go putting down something that someone else likes... I'm seeing a pattern on this forum. Not that I'm bothered by it that much, but others could be if the same treatment was always used with everyone.
    Riding the Geese since '98! Check out my youtube videos at www.youtube.com/mongoosejake

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