Waiting on Magicshine Replacement Battery...what to buy to get riding now?
So, I know someone has probably went through this tradeoff already...maybe even posted it although I've read so many threads, my head is spinning. Here are the options I see along with advantages and disadvantages...by the way, DIY is out of scope...
Oh, and I have a magicshine light with a battery that has pretty much died (30 min run time) and need capability of a helmet light and a bar mounted light...so, I need to buy another light...the question is what kind ?
1. Buy another magicshine from Nova bike lights and spare battery. Advantages: batteries and lights all interchangeable. eventually, after geoman replaces my battery, I'll have a spare.. cost ~$150 . Disadvantage: although "improved" batteries from Nova, they still may have problem.
2. Buy 2 light sets like the Gemini set, or Light and Go. Advantages: brand new everything Disadvantages: maybe $50 more, a magicshine light that someday has a replacement battery from Geoman.
Is there an obvious choice ?
I had the same dilemma, though I have a DiNotte 200L and Fenix to get me by. I'm down to ~45 mins run time on my MS900, and I'm sure it's rapidly getting worse.
That being said, I had an old, not working Nite Rider Digital Evolution. Yesterday, 12-06-10, I sent it in to Baja Designs for the $100 trade-in credit toward the purchase of a BD Strykr. It's more expensive than the MS900, but puts out an honest 700 lumens, lifetime warranty on the light head, is dive rated to 33 feet so I know it's waterproof, and it's virtually indestructible. Another thing I really like about it is that it digitally controls the light output depending on how hot it gets. In other words, run it on high when you're moving and it'll stay on high. Run it on high when you're not moving and before it overheats, it'll ramp down the light output to reduce the heat to protect it from any heat related damage. Total cost for the light ($298 - $100 trade-in = $198), shipping (~$13), and optional quick release/o-ring mount (~$13), plus the ~$5 to send the NR to BD is about ~$230. Not bad for a top quality, guaranteed to not let you down light.
On a side note, I've never done any night snorkeling, but this light may inspire me to try it next summer.
The best part - I get rid of an old, broken light and actually get something for it.
I can't see buying a new light just because the battery bellied-up. I've own lots of lights in my time and had to buy batteries lots of times. Assuming you've not had problems with the light head just buy a new battery pack from a place like All-battery, wire on the old connector and off you go. Another option would be to buy a 4-cell holder from LuminousDIY, buy some Tenergy 18650 2600mAh cells from All Battery and then buy a couple cheap twin bay 18650 Chargers from D/X or Kaidomain. Likely the holder will fit in your old MS battery pouch.
Originally Posted by Raybum
Personally I like my second option because once you get that set-up it will only cost you $20 to replace the cells. Still, just buying a new ( packaged ) battery pack is likely the easier way to go. Once again, it should fit no problem into the MS battery pouch. Oh, I almost forgot to mention: If you get a new battery don't be surprised if your MS suddenly looks SO MUCH BETTER than it did before. If you were only getting 30 minutes runtime ( unless you live in Alaska..) something was definitely wrong with that battery.
Option 3...I like the Owlet offered by Light and Go ( D-bin P-7 ) but the Gemini is there as well ( and the dealer seems friendly enough FWIW...)
Is this the seller on Ebay? I'm starting from scratch regarding light kits and may go this route.
Originally Posted by Raybum
CRAP... I'm in the wrong gear
I did the diy battery bit myself. Ordered two Y cables from Geoman (for the plugs), and the 4400mah battery from All-Battery. Got some liquid electrical tape and shrink wrap tubing at Home Depot, and grabbed the soldering iron. Soldered it up, then a layer of liquid tape, then a shrink wrap on each wire, then another liquid layer, then a bigger shrink wrap around the whole thing. Then another liquid tape layer over the finished cable. Maybe a bit much, but I wanted it as water proof as possible. I did not have time to plastic dip the battery as I needed to get it charged for my commute, but plan to do that this weekend. The magicshine charger worked fine with it.
Yep ordered another couple of batteries today http://www.all-battery.com/li-ion186...bareleads.aspx
the ones i got last week are working out great I still don't trust those new and improved batteries that Nova is pushing I would rather have them made in the good old USA buy a company here that only makes batteries and can not hide 2000 miles away when there is a problem
. I have faith that the batteries that Geoman is getting us will be good he,s got a lot riding on them being good and I think the MTBR DIY crew will go threw them with a fine tooth comb,
I'm into him for 6 batteries so the sooner the better. but for the mean time I'm just going to keep soldering on some connectors to these all-battery packs and getting out on the trails
I always type in bold cuz I'm blind as a bat
For the Rich there is therapy!!!! for the rest of us we have Mountain Biking
May the Force be with you
I rode with my normal group tonight and we were talking lights and found that the Gemini Battery will work on Magicshine, same hookup
Yep, I may need to get one of those Gemini batteries. My year-old MS battery doesn't quite hold the charge it used to.
"Got everything you need?"
May the Force be with you
Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
Good ride tonight , It was good to see you and I really like the new bike.
Guys, not sure how cold it gets out there in Ca. at night but once temps start to drop into the 40's(F) , don't be surprised if your batteries seem to not run as long as usual. This is typical for Li-ion cells. If you can still get two hours run time into the 40's that's not so bad.
Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
As for the Gemini batteries...well...I don't want to bash a new product but lets just say that it is coming out of China just like the MS. That doesn't mean the batteries are going to have problems but who's to say. I'm sure if the dealer reads this he will chime in and say that his batteries are different. Sure, what would you expect him to say, that his batteries come from the same factory as the MS batteries? Heck, no one right now would do that and expect to sell their product. Right now it might be better to error by being a bit cautious. After a year or so if no one complains about their Chinese made battery pack then changes were likely made in the quality controls at the factories. That would be a good thing. If it were me, I'd go the All-battery route for the time being...just saying.
For the record, I would have no problem buying a Gemini or Light and Go system. However if I did I would not be holding my breath to see how long the battery would last. If I got two years use out of the battery I would consider it as having received more than my money's worth.
I think I'd just forgot to top the charge off before the ride, so it lasted about an hour. That was also a battery which was over a year old, so I expect some decrease in the run time. In this part of northern california, it can get down into the 20s overnight but it rarely gets below 40 in my garage. I think last night it was a balmy 45F or so. I'm going to fully charge the battery today and see how long it lasts. If run-time is not much longer than an hour, I'll pick up another battery from Gemini. Most of my night rides are in the 2 hour range, so a one-hour battery won't work.
"Got everything you need?"
Know about this well living and riding in Anchorage AK. I routinely ride in temps down to about zero degrees F.
I have two Geoman sourced MS lights (and of course 2 battery packs) that were purchased this last summer. Using both lights at the same time in the same conditions I don't get the same performance out of the packs. At this point, I can only assume one of my battery packs is not good. One will last 2+ hrs (at low temp) while the other will only last 45-min.
The battery that seems to "discharge" quickly also seems to "charge" quickly. Hmmm? Would you interpret this battery is not good?
Also, would you recommend that I "wear" the batteries below 40 degrees F inorder to keep them warm? I've never had to do this before.
My advice and $3 will buy you nothing more than a tunafish sandwich.
Wearing the batteries is always good in the cold, just be careful you don't get burned skin syndrome.
Originally Posted by EndUser
On a side note, i'm wondering if the MS light responds well to the cold.. i don't have the ability to check the output but when wearing the battery i have also received the low-voltage signal - well actually the signal led rotates in a kaleidoscope fashion between green, red, orange very quickly... If i turn it to a lower setting the green led comes back on i think the cold is somehow affecting the circuit perhaps? We are talking -15C to -20C.
Sounds like it is really far out of balance.
Originally Posted by EndUser
This seems to be the trend that causes the short life of most MS packs.
How long does it take to charge?
Like a third of the time as the good pack?
Look, whatever happens, don't fight the mountain.
Yep, the one with the 45 min run time sounds like it's done.
Originally Posted by savagemann
This idea about wearing the battery sounds like it might work, at least as far as helmet lights go. No so sure for bar lamps. All of my bar lamps have short cords. If you have a long cord though it could work.
During the years I've tried isolated the battery using a couple layers of insulating foam and then in a nice pouch. The problem is the battery still gets cold pretty fast. This is because the power cord draws the heat from the pack. I rarely ride in the cold anymore anyhow. Still, an interesting stategy might be to use torches and rotate batteries every half hour or so. Keep the spares close to your body to keep them warm.
Right now it is colder than a witches upper mid-section where I live. I'm not going outside for nothing. I used to ride into the 20's(F). I don't do that anymore.
Has anyone discected the new MS Battery with the LED power/v indicator, is it the same balancing circuit and cells with just a spangly new case.
I have all three types of battery now, my original (from geoman) is so tiny and light i really dont want to give it up, for walking duties the battery and case with clip work perfectly.
For those who want a battery for their MS and arent too fussed about money check out
Not sure if the MS charger is to blame or the board that is directly connected to the batteries but they aren't working perfectly together.
Originally Posted by Tzvia
My advice to anyone else doing this; ^look where i wrote stop here, STOP THERE! Check the individual voltages of each cell(if you have a individual cell charger, charge them all to full or the same voltage) write them down and make sure the cells are marked so you know which is which. Now discharge the battery with your light, i'd say to when the light noticeably starts to fade. If you normally run your battery completely dead( well i'd try to stop doing that, the more deep discharge cycles the more the pack will come out of balance) but if you aren't going to stop then run yours completely dead. repeat 2 or 3 times. Check the voltages on each individual cell, if they are not aligned with the original numbers you'll eventually have the same issues as the MS battery.
The way to fix this is buy an individual charger and pull the pack apart after every 10 or so cycles and charge each cell back to the same voltage.
Yup, I am getting about 45 minuts on a 2200mah battery (14.8v) on my triple soul lights running a 1000ma buckpuck. I could get closer to 1-1.5 hours when the temps were in the 60-70 degree marks. Wed night is was low 30's. I think I may have had it on for all of 30 minutes. I was cutting it one and off and running with my helmet light on to conserve.
Originally Posted by Cat-man-do
NINER MCR 9 (Moondust)
2009 Gary Fisher Rig
1997 Kona Ku
2009 Titus FTM (RIP old Friend)
I don't want to thread jack, and but at the same time I don't think another thread is needed.
I have a 24hr race coming up in February, and had plans to buy extra batteries for my 2 magicshines. Anyone willing to speculate that geoman will have new batteries by presidents day weekend, or am I going to be in the build my own light group?
ajmelin: geoman is not the only seller of magicshine. theres another seller in the states you can find the seller online with the "updated" battery packs since Nov'10 that do not have the same faulty batteries sold by geoman
I'd say yes
Originally Posted by ajmelin
Updated...I bet they have a slight change but will still go out of balance if you kill the pack continuously between charges.
Originally Posted by illnacord
Geoman is going to be the first with 100% fixed batteries.
Diagnosed with MTB.
The batteries used for Gemini Lights can be also used with Magicshine Lights. The connectors are the same.
We are confident that we offer the best quality, 100% safe, Battery Cells. For more information you can check our news section: http://gemini-lights.com/news
On Behalf of the Gemini Team
Sorry if this has been asked before-- What does Gemini offer in terms of warranty for the batteries? For example, If I purchase a battery pack and after 9 months I'm getting 60% run time, what does Gemini offer?
The great use of life is to spend it for something that will outlast it.
Originally Posted by insighter
You know, I've been night riding for a long time...had Marwi, Light and Motion, Niterider, Schwinn-branded lights before the MagicShine. No batteries lasted over 2 years except the Schwinn, which was a huge 12 volt lead acid battery (best light I've owned, btw- who cares about weight sometimes?) and lasted about 4 years. No company ever warrantied a battery and the direct replacement cost was over 100 dollars from some.
What I'm saying is that based on my experience, expecting any company to warranty batteries is expecting the exception, not the rule. Power tool companies usually won't warranty their batteries, either; basically, they have no idea how you treated the battery when it was in your possession and don't (and, in my opinion, shouldn't)feel responsible for replacement.
A manufacturing defect (a la MS) is a different story...that should be a warranty.
Oh, and manufacturer's looking at this stuff- I think a lot of consumer's would not care if a manufacturer gave up on the lightweight war for lights and tried to win the brightness/durabilty war. I'd love to see how long a LED hooked up to 12 volt LA batterty would last...