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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ledoman View Post
    By my test, thermal rump down should happen at about 50C. Of course it depends on the housing, heat dissipation and input power. Mine driver SKU: 231936 was lately tested in identical housing to SKU: 232195 at DX at room temperature, no additional cooling.
    Voltage rump down and its light signaling is depended by quality and voltage drop curve of battery pack. With almost empty or very low quality ones you might even get complete shut off (battery protection might cick in). This is because the driver is regulated and it tries to pull high current at low voltage while batteries can't stand it.
    Cat you might try different packs at their voltage end. At better ones, you might experience mid signaling stage at around 6.6V. Lower than that you could get flashing red. I'm writing from memory so this might not be exact numbers.
    Yes I agree but other lamps I own readily go into the "blue" mid-level warning with only a minor discharge on the battery. For the time being I'm not too worried about the lack of a mid-level warning. As long as the lamp doesn't shut off without some kind of warning I'm good with that but I will try with a better battery at some point to see if there is a difference.

    About the thermal shut down issue; Yes most lamps will shut down at around that 50C ( 122F ) level ( if indeed they have a shut down circuit ). When I test a lamp for thermal issues I always include a fan to simulate the moving of a bike because it is never a good idea to use a high powered LED lamp while not moving ( unless on a minimal power level ). When I do this I'm trying to find out if the lamp will over-heat WHILE using the fan. If it does that is not a good thing. With no fan moving the air almost every lamp will over-heat of that I have no doubt.

  2. #27
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    Yes I know it's not the best idea not to have fan to move air, but I've dare to do that as I've constantly monitored the temperature and I would stop the test if temepratur would go over 60C. I assume this is still safe enough. And the light was not mine ;-) I've just changed the driver because the stock one pulled only 1.2A from batteries.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ledoman View Post
    Yes I know it's not the best idea not to have fan to move air, but I've dare to do that as I've constantly monitored the temperature and I would stop the test if temepratur would go over 60C. I assume this is still safe enough. And the light was not mine ;-) I've just changed the driver because the stock one pulled only 1.2A from batteries.
    Since you mentioned "changing the driver" I have to ask, "How did you do that"? I guess it depends on the lamp but on the one I have the back of the lamp looks to be just one piece with the lamp body. I figured when they assembled the lamp that they did so working from the front. In order to get to the driver I would have to take off the front ( not so hard ) and then remove the LED board. That would certainly not be so easy as you would have to deal with the wiring. Even if I did that I have no idea what I'd find once I have access.

    My hope was that I would be able to access the driver through the rear so I could add a remote switch. If I have to work through the front of the lamp I'm not so sure I would be willing to try that. Working from the back ( where the driver is ) would be much more easier. Right now I consider this one of my better lamps so I'm not so sure I want to screw around with it by going through the front.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    I figured when they assembled the lamp that they did so working from the front. In order to get to the driver I would have to take off the front ( not so hard ) and then remove the LED board. That would certainly not be so easy as you would have to deal with the wiring.
    What namely light you're referring to? Most standard design is a "LED + driver assembly" (often with reflector attached to it), inserted into the case and fixed by front glass' bezel. It is quite easy to access the driver in such lights: no need to desolder anything.

    Design with removable rear cover exists as well, but is quite rare in my practice...

  5. #30
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    Cat, in mine example very similar to one from DX. Driver can be reached from back side. Original driver was like sku.236160. It has same dimensions as new one so the change was very easy. I've also changed the cable for thicker one.
    As Archie said, you can easily open from the front. Most of the time pills inside are quite loose with no thermal paste. No problem to geit it out. See discussion at DX from the post on Monday, February 17 onwards.

  6. #31
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    Inside the D003 the reflector comes out (holds the three led's in place) and underneath the led's is what looks like a large washer. That is press fit into the housing and rests on about a 1/8" shoulder milled into the body. It's in there pretty tight so I didn't try too hard to pull it out. There is a picture of the inside in the 3X clone thread, it think from steelhmr.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by robs31 View Post
    Inside the D003 the reflector comes out (holds the three led's in place) and underneath the led's is what looks like a large washer. That is press fit into the housing and rests on about a 1/8" shoulder milled into the body. It's in there pretty tight so I didn't try too hard to pull it out. There is a picture of the inside in the 3X clone thread, it think from steelhmr.
    Yeah, pretty much what I expected. The D003 outer shell is completely mono-piece. All I wanted to do was to solder the leads of a remote switch to the current switch and then have the wires exit the lamp through a hole ( I would drill ) in the back. Well, I guess that's not going to happen now. I'm not willing to tear apart the whole lamp ( at this time ) just to to get to the stuff in the back of the lamp so I can make such a minor change.

  8. #33
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    Cat, have you measured what the current draw is on high?

  9. #34
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    Just ordered this K/D light only to find out it is on backorder.

    I really like the way they tell you before you place your order with them

  10. #35
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    All orders show as back ordered when placed. It basically just means your order is queuing for processing, not really that the item is out of stock. Mine was "back-ordered" for about 3 days before the order status changed.

  11. #36
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    Ahh, ok thanks!

    First time i have ordered from them.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by G_Mozz View Post
    Cat, have you measured what the current draw is on high?
    Sorry, no I haven't. I'll try to get that for you over the weekend. I can only measure the current leaving the battery, no way to measure the current to the emitters without tearing the lamp apart.

    If you ordered this lamp and get the same type ( D003 ) that I did I don't think you will be disappointed ( in the lamp ). It is by far the brightest cheap Chinese lamp I own. The stepless user interface is just icing on the cake.

    I hope to get my first real road ride of the season in tomorrow if the weather cooperates. Been a long dreary winter.

  13. #38
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    Cat, that's alright, I've ordered the light now so I can measure it when they arrive next year sometime.

  14. #39
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    Finally got this in the mail a month and a half after I ordered it, and it doesn't disappoint! Very bright light, came in an unmarked box with no directions but the ui was pretty easy to figure out with the aid of your earlier post. Just curious why you suspect that yours was a manta ray? Was yours marked in some way?

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crescentius View Post
    Finally got this in the mail a month and a half after I ordered it, and it doesn't disappoint! Very bright light, came in an unmarked box with no directions but the ui was pretty easy to figure out with the aid of your earlier post. Just curious why you suspect that yours was a manta ray? Was yours marked in some way?
    Yes, mine had the words, "Manta Ray" and D003 written on the back of the lamp. Hopefully the one you received is the originally listed lamp with XM-L2 U2 emitters.

    I'm real anxious to get out to do some more testing with the one I have but somehow threw my knee out a couple weeks ago. Right now I'm trying to rehab it myself but might have to get it checked out by the Doc's before I start putting the kind of stress on it that MTB riding can do. I should probably get an X-ray just to be on the safe side. PITA to have this happen right as the weather is starting to get nice.

  16. #41
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    ...Some more feedback from last weekend's night ride: I used my D003 on the bars again to see how it would work while out on the trails. I have one of those plastic bar extensions sold on the ActionLED website and the Manta Ray was mounted on that. The light itself works great but unfortunately I was having a problem with the lamp vibrating and sliding downward. The plastic extension simply has too much flex. If it was all aluminum it would likely work better but it is entirely made out of plastic. Works fine with a smaller lamp but the D003 is a bit heavy for the plastic extension. I'll have to try it again but this time mounted directly to the bars.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    ...Some more feedback from last weekend's night ride: I used my D003 on the bars again to see how it would work while out on the trails. I have one of those plastic bar extensions sold on the ActionLED website and the Manta Ray was mounted on that. The light itself works great but unfortunately I was having a problem with the lamp vibrating and sliding downward. The plastic extension simply has too much flex. If it was all aluminum it would likely work better but it is entirely made out of plastic. Works fine with a smaller lamp but the D003 is a bit heavy for the plastic extension. I'll have to try it again but this time mounted directly to the bars.
    I had the same problem. You will need to put some grip tape or adhere some rubber to the bars before mounting.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    I had the same problem. You will need to put some grip tape or adhere some rubber to the bars before mounting.
    Yes, I've been trying that. The problem is with the upper part of the extension mount which is actually a plastic tube. It has such a small diameter that it really doesn't work well when built up with silicon tape. I've got it the point where it will stay in place but there is still some minor flex which will translate over to vibration once I start going over some rough stuff. . . now if I could get a stronger mount for the lamp ( one that clamps ) I might be able to eliminate most of the vibration.

    I might have to buy some of the friction tape used for baseball bats. I'm told that works well but I've never tried it. If that doesn't work I'll try a piece of rubber tube for a shim but at this point I have no idea if anything used ( for shimming ) is really going to give it an iron tight fit. I might have to order one of these.

  19. #44
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    Continued from my last posts:

    Been a good number of weeks since I last went out to test the D003. Well last night I finally got dry enough weather to give it a go again.

    The set-up: Manta Ray D003 mounted on my handlebars ( extension not used due to vibration issues ). The battery used is a 6000mAh Xeccon Li-Po ( which I don't think they sell anymore )

    Basic observations: The lamp functioned as expected and had no mounting issues while on my handlebars. The only problem I had all night was getting used to NOT having a remote which I am totally use to when using my Gloworm's but I digress.

    Compared with the Gloworm X2 if definitely has a more narrow beam pattern. ( more about that later ). Since the three steady mode levels are all programmable I had it set up and ready to go with the option to change if I felt I needed to change any of the modes.

    Low worked very well ( stepless level 4 I think ) for slow climbing or slow riding. Since the lamp is "reflector based" I found that in practical use it was necessary to make minor adjustments in the angle of the lamp to make the beam pattern more useful. This is where lamps that use optics ( like the Gloworms ) have a big advantage.

    Mid-mode ( set at about level 7 ) was good enough for just about anything ( again, once you re-aim the lamp ). Still, the beam width ( while adequate ) was not quite what I was used to. Still, this is expected when using any reflector based lamp. Throw however excels with the D003, depending though on how you aim the lamp.

    Lastly, the high mode ( 100% output ). Stellar performance! In this mode you aim the lamp straight out ( for maximum throw ) Since it's the highest level of output the spill is quite significant. At this level I had no problems seeing anything on the trail. Very impressive for a lamp at this price. I'm considering buying a "flood lens" to see how that might work. Personally I find making adjustments to the lamp angle bothersome. ( Then again I'm spoiled by the Gloworms which require little or no adjustments once you have them dialed in. ) I figure with a flood lens you will lose a bit of throw but with the D003 you have more than enough throw. I'd like to see a little more spill when using the lower modes.

    Summing up I think this lamp is a winner. Output on high will really impress. If this lamp came with an optical array ( similar to the Gemini Olympia ) I think it would be a fantastic bar light. I only say this of course because I have the Gloworm X2 (v3) to compare it to which means of course that I'm biased. Still, during the night I stopped at one point just to compare the D003 ( on lower levels ) to the Gloworm X2. As soon as I turn the GW on my jaw just drops. The Gloworm X2 (v3) must supply a beam pattern that is at least *twice as wide (* on any mode and with as much or more throw ....freaking have to love the GW lights! ). Only on high did the D003 come close to parity with the Gloworm as far as trail visibility. I guess that means that a lamp with the right optics sitting on the bars ( with decent output ) has a big advantage. Still, all things considered the D003 makes a good bar lamp as is and and as far as reflector based lamps go it is definitely one of the better values for the money.

  20. #45
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    Thank you for the review cat!
    I just received mine and agree it would really be nice with a flood lens.
    Please let us know if you find one (the lens measures 44.7mm od)
    Thanks again for all that you do!

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by motomech View Post
    Thank you for the review cat!
    I just received mine and agree it would really be nice with a flood lens.
    Please let us know if you find one (the lens measures 44.7mm od)
    Thanks again for all that you do!
    You're welcome. I might try one of the flood lenses from Action LED. ActionLED has a couple small items I want so I'll probably order one and see if I can make it work. Likely it will be a bit smaller than I need ...BUT...I might be able to glue it to the the lens already in place IF the back side is flat.

  22. #47
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    I ordered one of Action LED flood lenses and the back is indeed flat.
    The lens on the K/D tri clone is glass while the action led flood is plastic.
    Will need to think about the best epoxy for this union.
    the flood lens does a nice job of widening the beam while sacrificing a bit of throw.
    I may tweak this a bit by cutting the flood lens in half horizontally and cover the lower led only.
    This should widen the beam pattern just in front of the bike yet still give good throw.
    Wont be the first or last time I take a perfectly good design and improve it to a point that it is no longer useful!

  23. #48
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    Nice to hear that indeed the back is flat. I hope to find the time to order the flood lens in the next couple days. My plan is to experiment with the lens to see how it works before I decided to mount it permanently. I'm willing to sacrifice a bit of throw if the overall spread of the beam improves, particularly when on lower output levels.

    In my case I really don't plan to use the lamp that much anyway. I do this for curiosities sake and because I've always wanted to see just how well one of these "flood lenses" actually work. Too bad they don't make more than one type of flood lens. Hmmm...makes me wonder if there's a Tri-Optic out there ( similar to what the Gemini Olympia uses ) that might be adapted to the K/D lamp. If there was that would certainly be the better solution.

  24. #49
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    @Cat. Don't know what are exactly measures of this 3 led, but if they are near 35mm diameter then Ledil has TIR optics that might suits - Led lighting - Products | Ledil
    There are also medium and wide angle options - search for CUTE lens. Farnell had them in stock quite some time ago.

  25. #50
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    Oh crap!!

    I got messing with the KD 3-up tonight and took off the front. Good news and bad news; the good news first. The LED's are easy to get to. The bad news; the LED's were just being held down by the reflector assembly. Actually, not as bad as it might sound. Apparently they were initially held in place with some thermal paste but the paste had turned to powder and all three LED's were just setting there loose when I removed the reflector assembly.

    On a side note I'm not sure the LED's are XM-L2 U2. They might be but I can't confirm that yet.

    Anyway, I need to clean the emitter heat sink ( which is wide and looks good ) and then put some thermal paste in that won't turn to dust. Otherwise nothing else looks to be bad....at the moment.

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