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  1. #1
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    Lupine Wilma 7r vs GW XS - Help

    Looking for light setup to last me several years.

    It's come come down to

    Lupine Wilma 7R paired with a Piko R
    Or
    Glowworm XS with X2 for helmet (I want a BT remote so this would require waiting until 2017 - they said early but I have learned not to hold my breath with new product releases)

    I am coming from an exposure maxxd mk4 1285 claimed lumens and a diablo MK2 claimed 950 lum. A bit more light from the helmet would have been nice. I really liked the convenience factor of all in one but felt that this led to some of the heat Managment issues in the summer.

    I could be wrong but XS 2500 lumens seems plenty so higher lumens of Wilma not so important to me

    Questions I still have.

    1. Beam pattern - lots of options with GW optics. Seen one review of Wilma that stated it was a little narrow for the amount of light it threw. If there is a difference - is it big?

    2. Piko vs X2 - they seem to be about as similar as you get so that's not in my equation (unless beam or heat managment is radically different)

    3. Heat managment - I live in the desert - Phoenix Arizona - while most of my night riding is in the winter months when the weather is cooler I do ride in the summer. Ambient temps can be 100F. This was a huge issue for my exposure lights. This issue is the reason I ruled out Gemini lights. Is one better than the other with regards to this?. Dispersing heat and heat managment. The XS seems to have better surface area than the Wilma - but assuming I will not be running either at full, will running Wilma at 60% be better then running xs at a higher % for same lumen output.

    4. Recommended settings btw headlamp and bar for high medium low? Obviously low will be easy to match them probably both 750-1000?. Medium where I would be using during most of my non climbing - Helmet on full and bar at approx 1800? High would be max? But with such a gap on the Wilma and Piko would this be an issue? Is it still better on the downs to just throw on max or do I want the lights better matched?

    5. Is there a light with a wireless remote that is in this class that I am missing (ruled out Gemini because of heat managment and would have to move my bike computer). I really like the idea of synced lights that can change with a thumb press so I can conserve power, keep cool, and easily turn down when I stop

    I am leaning to just getting the Lupine now. I don't have to wait, it's more lumens, they sell upgrades, and the app looks like the ideal way to program. But it is close to double the cost and the heat managment and beam patterns are unknown to me.

    Thank you!
    Brian

  2. #2
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    Myself running two Lupines off one remote is pretty sweet, so if the decision needs to be made right away i think you have your answer. If the GW's had the wireless remotes i would lean in that direction as you have optional optics to customize beam shape.

    Also both brands do have optional neutral tint led boards around 4900K vs the 6000K cooler tint leds that are stock. I highly recommend the warmer tint as trail detail is much better and overall light is easier on the eyes.

    Been in such a warm riding area if you do go the Lupine's make sure you get the optional heat sinc for the Piko.

    As for the Wilmas beam pattern,, it does come with a 26degree optic. A few years back Lupine was using a 22 degree so some improvement on spread. Are there wider bar lamps out there,,, yes but the Wilma on the bars and Piko up top is a pretty sick set up.

    Also a two to one ratio is pretty common on output the brighter been on the bars for most people so the Piko will be plenty bright.

  3. #3
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    Gloworm XS
    Lupine Wilma 7r vs GW XS - Help-gloworm-xs-beam-900x600.jpg

    Lupine Wilma
    Lupine Wilma 7r vs GW XS - Help-lupine-wilma-71-900x600.jpg

    Gloworm X2
    Lupine Wilma 7r vs GW XS - Help-gloworm-x2-beam-900x600.jpg

    Lupine Piko
    Lupine Wilma 7r vs GW XS - Help-lupine-piko-4-900x600.jpg

    Stole these beam-shots off the 2016 MTBR light shoot-out in case you hadn't seen them. I live in the Phoenix area so I understand your concern with heat issues. I own a Gloworm XS, X2 and similar Ituo XP3, and XP2 so if you have any specific questions about these lights I should be able to help. I've never even seen anyone run a Lupine here which may be because of the cost or poor performance in hot weather (if you buy the Wilma/Piko combo please let us know how they work for you). All the local shops I deal with have loaner lights so locating a Lupine dealer may get you a test run before spending all that money.
    Mole

  4. #4
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    Just fyi except for lupine, most wireless systems are NOT Bluetooth.

    Bluetooth is specifically for mobile devices/smart electronic devices and far more advanced than what is used in 99.9% of wireless anything.

    Lupine has an app and is actually Bluetooth. Everything else I've seen is nothing more than the same stuff you see in toys basically.

    Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk

  5. #5
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    Thank you.
    When looking at there site I only see the 6000k option. Will call them tomorrow to see if 4900k is still available. That may be the deal breaker. Also the beam pattern looks a little better to me on the GW. Will defiantly order the heat sink if I get the lupine- also headband and red filter. I've always wanted a bright red head lamp for camping

  6. #6
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    The lupines have to be specially ordered with the 4900K leds, or at least used to be. Talk to Dan or Bill as they may have inventory on sight. Also IMO take light photos with a grain of salt. With lights been of such high output these days, often the camera doesn't depict the real life beam pattern. Even if you look at the photo's Mole posted, to me the X-2 looks just about as bright as the XS and there is about 800/900 lumen difference between the two. The Wilma has such intensity the photo looses some of the spill. So in some cases photos have their place but often dont depict real word beam patterns.

  7. #7
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    I purchased the Wilma R 7 and Piko R 4, both with Smartcore batteries. This is a very nice setup, plenty of light output. The Piko is mounted to my helmet using a GoPro mount, and the Wilma on the bars. Not a cheap setup, but worth it. And a big thanks to Bill for answering all my questions with the order.

  8. #8
    Old Fat Guy
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    I recently ordered a Piko RX4 SC with the special-ordered 4900K emitters. Love this little light!! Bill and Dan are terrific! Get everything sorted via Email, and then make a note referring to the Email when you order online.

    I ordered the heatsink for my Piko, but also live in Alberta and am enjoying the beginning of winter - a little different than Phoenix.

    As mentioned earlier, the 4900K is a little warmer, and renders trail details in a much more natural light. I'm a big fan!


    BenTYYC
    2015 RMB Thunderbolt 790 MSL BC Edition
    2017 RMB Blizzard -50º
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    "Love the ride"

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones2 View Post
    Looking for light setup to last me several years.

    It's come come down to

    Lupine Wilma 7R paired with a Piko R
    Or
    Glowworm XS with X2 for helmet (I want a BT remote so this would require waiting until 2017 - they said early but I have learned not to hold my breath with new product releases)

    I am coming from an exposure maxxd mk4 1285 claimed lumens and a diablo MK2 claimed 950 lum. A bit more light from the helmet would have been nice. I really liked the convenience factor of all in one but felt that this led to some of the heat Managment issues in the summer.

    I could be wrong but XS 2500 lumens seems plenty so higher lumens of Wilma not so important to me...
    Well, if you can wait till next year I would certainly consider the Gloworm XS with "wireless remote" ( if or when it is released ). Money seems not to be a limiting factor here so I'll add my thoughts based on what you said above: Consider using the brighter lamp on the helmet, whatever you chose. An upgraded XS (wireless remote ) would have to be sweet on the helmet. I would of course insist on "neutral white" emitters across the board. Output will be a little less ( vs. CW ) but if the newer lamps are using upgraded emitters output will not be an issue.

    Beam pattern of the Wilma 7R looks to me to be almost perfect for helmet use as long as you use the tightest available optic they offer. Once again, NW a "must have" in my opinion. Downside of running the Wilma on the helmet is that Lupine uses a proprietary battery set-up and ( the battery ) is probably a bit heavier than normal batteries. That would mean more weigh in your backpack/hydration pack. Not a big negative considering the output and throw you will get but still needs to be considered.

    For the bars I'd think any two or three emitter ( in row style ) lamp using either a wireless or wired remote will work fine. That said a set-up using a 2 emitter lamp on the bars and a three emitter lamp on the helmet would be almost just as nice and cost a lot less.

    Personally I'm waiting for the wireless remote version of the XS. Would be nice if I might be able to get NW XP-L2's but XM-L2 U3 NW is the current emitter that rocks When available I'll run one of those on the helmet and move my ITUO XP3 to the bars. Combined output should be way more light than I would normally need.

  10. #10
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    Do note that with beamshots, the fall off of the beam from center to fringe is faster than it really occurs in actual practice. This is due to the nature of digital photography vs the human eye as well as photography on the web. I ride with a Wilma and that beam shot is not what I would describe as characteristic. The beam of a Wilma will pretty much cover two lanes on a two lane highway at about the range you would want when riding a road bike on level ground. I base this on several years of riding many hours at night with a Wilma on the bars.

    If I recall, I believe that the thermal protection of the electronics is one of the core competencies of Lupine. So I don't think I'd worry about that. Too, Lupine seems to use very high quality cells in their batteries which will also do much better in temperature extremes (less internal resistance thereby with lower heating on charge and discharge).

    The Wilma/Piko combination is kind of a killer combination. It's hard to do much better than that and you get your BT remote as well right now.

    J.

  11. #11
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    Thank you everyone. I broke down and ordered the lupines in NW. Wilma had to be ordered from Germany in NW. I can't imagine not being happy with it. I will experiment with Wilma on the helmet and Piko on the bars and vice versa. Should be a huge improvement from where I am.

    Any recommendations on the ratio of head to bar lumens?

  12. #12
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    As i mentioned up top two to one on ratio,,,,, but the more i think about it,, i'm resorting to mentality from a few years ago when you had to specifically choose your bar/helmet light. There is so much output now and optic options that you can decide for yourself and place the outputs to your preference with most set ups. The Lupines are very good and in the real world are incredible performers. So in your final decision you will be happy when you see them on the trails.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bones2 View Post
    Thank you everyone. I broke down and ordered the lupines in NW. Wilma had to be ordered from Germany in NW. I can't imagine not being happy with it. I will experiment with Wilma on the helmet and Piko on the bars and vice versa. Should be a huge improvement from where I am.

    Any recommendations on the ratio of head to bar lumens?
    My Piko is the 1200 lumen version and my Wilma is the 2800 version and I run it around 2000 lumens. That seems about right ~2:1 or so. With the new R versions you can fiddle to your hearts content using the smartphone app.

    I have the Betty R that I use on my road bike. Given that the eye perceives added light in a logarithmic fashion, I have that set up with three steps with the light doubling every step. So that on is set as 1000, 2500, 5000. I'd suggest the same with the Wilma although you may want to do that in two steps. Same with the Piko.

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