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  1. #1
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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    K/D MS 880 clone. Not as fancy as the Solarstorm ( which they sell as well ) but likely do the same job as the other cheap two XM-L emitter lamps. At least these will likely handle heat better and have a decent mode set-up ( press to hold strobe ) Kaidomain looks to have a few two Xm-l lamps that ( while not fancy ) have a decent mode arrangement. Not that I'm stumping for K/D but I just had to tell folks about the MS clone.

  2. #2
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    Looks pretty good. Thanks for the link. Are you buying this Cat-man-do? They only thing it doesn't seem to have is any indicator of the battery life remaining.

  3. #3
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    @Cat, are you going to buy this product?

    It is a better sollution than SolarStorm X2?

  4. #4
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    No, I won't be buying one of these but if I was a newbe looking for a good bar light I would definitely consider it. Too bad these weren't around two years ago. Not sure if they have battery indicators on these but I will attempt to find out when I get the chance...off to work for now...

  5. #5
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    To be honest, i really don't know what to choose...

    This light (copy of the MJ-880) or the SolarStorm X2?

    Which is more suitable for modding? Maybe swaping the optics with some aspherics? And improving the thermal dissipation?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Khrystyan27 View Post
    To be honest, i really don't know what to choose...

    This light (copy of the MJ-880) or the SolarStorm X2?

    Which is more suitable for modding? Maybe swaping the optics with some aspherics? And improving the thermal dissipation?
    I can't answer those questions but I like the look of the Solarstorm X2. Myself, I'm curious as to how easy one of these lamps might be to mod when it comes to LED replacement. With XM-L2's coming out if you can switch out the emitters without any problems that would be a big plus.

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  8. #8
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    Wow!...those look nice. I like these better than the K/D version. The black is much better looking than the pale gray on the K/D.

    One thing that did jump out at me on the D/X ad....580lm? ( )
    That's got to be an error in the ad.

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  10. #10
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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    I'm introducing a friend to night riding and he insists to buy a clone one. This "ultrafire" 8080 clone might be a good place to start. Do you think I can install a wide angle lens on it? I can get one from action led http://www.action-led-lights.com/col...for-the-mj-880 although it was designed for the original MJ 880.

    The battery holder looks cool too. Much better than the simple Velcro one.

    I've been trying to avoid purchasing on dx because they just take so much time..... I'll see if he likes the grey one. If he does buy it, I will review it here.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by varider View Post
    Yeah, these colors are interesting but I'd like to see a "Gun metal Blue" or "dark metallic gray" like the Quad XM-L model. The black does look nice though.

    I sent the D/X guy a PM telling him about the "580 lumen" on the ad. He usually answers in a couple days.

  12. #12
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    Still no news about this one? From all these D99, SolarStorm X2 and now this D50, the last one seems to be the best one for the bars as it comes with an OP reflector AND we might actually be able to swap the lenses for the original MJ880 ones. A combination of one wide angle lense with the original one might be a good combination.
    I guess I will have to convince me friend to buy this one

  13. #13
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    I think the two button arrangement on these might be less than ideal. From the manafont link on the other thread.

    4 Modes: Hi > Mi > Lo > Strobe (press right swich for 2 secs to enter Strobe)
    Switch Location: Left on/off & Right modes adjustment
    What we really need is comparison shots of all three dual-led lights, in the same manner as Francois in his yearly shoot-out. Obviously. Maybe we can convince dx to send them all to Cat and he can do all the work.

    I bought a magicshine 868 clone for around $32 that I'm real happy with. It's brighter than the 808 and a major flooder. That and the triple and quatro xml led all deserve to part of the best-bang-for-your-buck conversation.
    Last edited by varider; 05-02-2013 at 09:54 PM.

  14. #14
    Kir
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    Since nobody posted any reviews yet...
    Clicky - here are some detailed pics of the light. Imo this light is awesome and one of the best choices atm.

    Some technical details:
    2 leds in series, current on leds in 3 modes - 0.58A-1.53A-2.36A
    2 buttons to control the light, one turns it on and off, another changes modes. These is a mode memory, if you turn it off - it will turn on in the same mode as it was before turning off (unless you disconnect the battery, this resets memory).
    Simple 2 stage voltage indicator, green switched to red at 6.41v on input.
    LEDs are mounted on thick aluminium...erm, inserts? Don't know the correct english term for that. These inserts are 21x7mm with 2mm recess in the front for mounting leds on 16mm stars. Then they're inserted into case with very small gap on the sides (about 0.1-0.2mm or so). Fill this gap with thermal paste and you'll have perfect thermal transfer to the outer case, which is massive enough to handle 2 leds on full power.
    Reflectors are orange-peel and made from aluminium, 21x14mm.
    Driver looks very nice, good soldering everywhere. Thick silicone wires to leds too, overall quality of light is very, very good.

    And then you have the battery pack...which is awesome! Its made from aluminium extrusion profile with 2 screwed-on covers (with rubber seals) on both sides. This makes it waterproof and the best thing about it - you can easily insert any non-protected 18650 cells into it.
    Just unscrew one cover, insert 4 panasonic 3400 cells and you have a 6800mAh battery, no need to solder anything.
    These are 4 cells included, made by ASO (some chinese company). They have about about 2100mAh capacity per cell, overall battery capacity (measured on Imax B6 at 0.7A discharge current) - 4246mAh.
    The only downside is that it comes without any pouches, just one velcro strap - but it fits into standart chinese pouches for these batteries.

    Overall this light (unlike D-99) is very well constructed and I was very impressed with it. Haven't tried it on road yet, so I can't give any comments about beam profile or brightness - but in the room testing it gives very wide beam with enough brightness to light up a whole wall.

  15. #15
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    That looks great, kir! Love the battery case design. Really really great. I have a 8 18650 cells taken from an old laptop and I've always wanted to test them for a bike light...this could work well as a cheap backup battery (considering that a good Xeccon one is on my way).

    Did you get it from DX? Thanks for the photos! Looking forward for beamshots

  16. #16
    Kir
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    This one is from kaidomain, silver version is sold only there afaik.
    Keep in mind that this battery pack is not designed for constant opening/closing, you'll wear out the screw holes very fast. But you can get it and replace cells inside to get a high-capacity battery.
    I won't be able to make any beamshoots atm - my mate stole this light from me to use on his bike And I don't really know to do them properly anyway.

  17. #17
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    Great info Kir. Looks like better thermal management than the d99, although I'm no expert.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kir View Post
    And then you have the battery pack...which is awesome! Its made from aluminium extrusion profile with 2 screwed-on covers (with rubber seals) on both sides. This makes it waterproof and the best thing about it - you can easily insert any non-protected 18650 cells into it.
    Just unscrew one cover, insert 4 panasonic 3400 cells and you have a 6800mAh battery, no need to solder anything.
    Thank you for the Review and the photos Kir

    KD sells the battery separately 17,40 USD
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S021564

  19. #19
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    Thank you HakanC and Kir!
    That battery pack from Kaidomain comes with a PCB, is there any reason I should not use protected Panasonic cells in there?
    Want to charge it with my Magicshine charger, hope the plugs will be compatible.
    Goatman
    - It's not the destination that counts but how you get there -

  20. #20
    Kir
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    It's simply not needed, you'll just make double protection. And I really doubt that you'll fit protected cells in this battery pack, there is barely enough length for normal batteries.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HakanC View Post
    Thank you for the Review and the photos Kir

    KD sells the battery separately 17,40 USD
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S021564
    Sweet looking battery case! I've ordered two and will put the through a little abuse. I love the idea of being able to easily upgrade the pack with the latest cells. It is too bad they are slightly more robust in design and quicker to open/close. For a 24 hour solo, swapping precharged cells would be a cool way to go.
    baker

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    Quote Originally Posted by HakanC View Post
    Thank you for the Review and the photos Kir

    KD sells the battery separately 17,40 USD
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S021564
    Thanks for the Link! Has anybody tested this battery already? Is it available in other colours too (black maybeeeeeee)?
    ..just ride...

  23. #23
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    I'm interested in this light/battery/charger package. 2 hours minimum on high would be very nice (as they advertise). Where can one get a nylon pouch for the battery? I looked over the site and could not find one, sigh.

  24. #24
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    I went ahead and pulled the trigger on this. I liked Kir's review of the light (in terms of the build) and that the battery pack is strong and can easily be upgraded if desired. If I don't get the 2+ hours on 'high' I will complain. It's on back-order, but I'll update when it arrives and provide beam shots. Beam shots will include comparison to the Lumina 650 (which has tested out well to it's claimed 650 lumens in the mtbr shootout).
    Last edited by steelhmr; 07-04-2013 at 07:55 PM.

  25. #25
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    2 tests on high w/ a fan running @ 80 degrees f.
    1st test, 1hr. 51mins.
    2nd test. 2hrs. 4mins.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitedog1 View Post
    Thanks for the Link! Has anybody tested this battery already? Is it available in other colours too (black maybeeeeeee)?
    Will answer my own question now
    Did a short review on the battery pack (better tell it a battery hoder cause the deliverd cells inside are crap)
    You can find it here (post #133)
    Last edited by Whitedog1; 07-08-2013 at 10:17 PM.
    ..just ride...

  27. #27
    Kir
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    2500mAh - not bad
    UltraFire D-50 2 x Cree XM-L T6 580lm 4-Mode White Bicycle Light Headlamp - Black (4 x 18650) - Worldwide Free Shipping - DX - this one has 2000mAh battery pack, cells are usual blue chinese crap.

  28. #28
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    Finally got my light. Please track your package more closely than I did. From China to Pennsylvania:

    Ordered = July 4th
    Delivery attempt with notice supposedly left and never seen = July 19th
    Checked the tracking online = August 1st
    Re-delivered = August 5th

    If I had not noticed it for 5 more business days it would have been sent back to China. Anyway, I checked the light down in my basement. Super bright compared to my Lumina 650. Best comparison I can make is that with the KD unit set on Low, it was brighter than the Lumina on Medium (400 lumens according to manufacturer). If I had to eyeball estimate the differences on High, I would say that the KD is close to 2x the brightness of the Lumina (for whatever that is worth).

    Weight:

    Unit = 135 grams (as advertised)
    Battery = 250 grams
    2 battery straps + large O-ring = 8 grams

    Was leaning towards not riding today, but I guess that's out of the question. Gotta see how this looks on the trail. Eventually I will do run-time tests and beam shots (on the trail).

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Finally got my light. Please track your package more closely than I did. From China to Pennsylvania:

    Ordered = July 4th
    Delivery attempt with notice supposedly left and never seen = July 19th
    Checked the tracking online = August 1st
    Re-delivered = August 5th

    If I had not noticed it for 5 more business days it would have been sent back to China. Anyway, I checked the light down in my basement. Super bright compared to my Lumina 650. Best comparison I can make is that with the KD unit set on Low, it was brighter than the Lumina on Medium (400 lumens according to manufacturer). If I had to eyeball estimate the differences on High, I would say that the KD is close to 2x the brightness of the Lumina (for whatever that is worth).

    Weight:

    Unit = 135 grams (as advertised)
    Battery = 250 grams
    2 battery straps + large O-ring = 8 grams

    Was leaning towards not riding today, but I guess that's out of the question. Gotta see how this looks on the trail. Eventually I will do run-time tests and beam shots (on the trail).
    So did you order from KD or DX? You seemed to get it pretty quick.

    Could you tell us your impressions of the beam shape of this light. Someone else described this a being more floody than the Solarstorm X2, which has been described as somewhat spotty. Of course there was disagreement on that point, but without beam shots it's difficult to compare the two.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by varider View Post
    So did you order from KD or DX? You seemed to get it pretty quick.

    Could you tell us your impressions of the beam shape of this light. Someone else described this a being more floody than the Solarstorm X2, which has been described as somewhat spotty. Of course there was disagreement on that point, but without beam shots it's difficult to compare the two.
    Varider,

    This was from KD. The pattern is definitely more of a flood, at least compared to my Lumina. Of course, that has to be expected to some degree since this is a 2x LED setup. I took it out on the trails last night. My time was limited so I only rode one trail. Also, I left right at sunset and got on that trail about 10 minutes later. Even though the sky was cloudy, there was still a lot of light hanging in the sky. I ride in the forest though under foliage so it still was too dark to ride without a light in there.

    Setup was the KD on the bars and a Lumina on my helmet. Very soon in I could tell that I was going to have to order another light for my helmet. The KD unit is so bright and full that it completely dwarfs any light being output from the Lumina. As stated earlier, it was far from 100% dark so I didn't get the maximum contrast needed to see the full effect of the light. What I did see was very impressive though. I am very very pleased with the light output. I will try to get beam shots sometime this month. Hopefully sooner than later, but gf is leaving for out of town today for a week and I'll need her to help me with this project.

    Just to be clear, this is the exact one that I ordered: http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S021521

  31. #31
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    Runtime Test #1

    Setup:

    1. KD light facing the air AC/heater in my office.
    2. Fan (only) running parallel to the front profile of the unit.
    3. 75-80 degrees F in the room.
    4. 'High' setting used throughout entirety of test.

    Results

    Before I go into the results, some notes about the test. As seen from the setup, the light was going into the fan so I could not see if the light pattern was changing. That being said, everything was running smooth. At the 2:07 mark, I went up to see if the unit was getting hot. I swear right when I was putting my fingers toward it, something happened. The light on the UI changed color or shape (bear in mind that I am colorblind so these changes are not as obvious to me). It continued to run and I didn't notice if the light output changed or not.

    It kept running and I cycled the UI to confirm that I was indeed still on the High setting. As it was approaching the 3-hour mark I again cycled through the UI, but it was again still on high. After the 3-hour mark I feel that I definitely noticed that it was not as bright (this was the first time in the test that I specifically noted a change in brightness). The unit continued to run until at the 4:15 mark when I had to leave for the day (obviously I wasn't expecting it to run this long). The light output was very weak by the end, but again, it was still running. I even cycled the UI one more time and it was still on High, as the other two setting were significantly weaker.

    In summary, I will have to test again and set it up so I can distinctly notice if the brightness changes. So far though, I am very very very pleased with the runtime. I need to quantify though when exactly it deviated from the max brightness (I was unaware that it was built in to run on lower power when the battery was low).

  32. #32
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    Great info. Thank you.

    Since this runs almost four hours, which is about the same as a Magicshine 808, I don't see how this could be any brighter.
    Last edited by varider; 08-07-2013 at 05:54 PM.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by varider View Post
    Great info. Thank you.

    Since this runs almost four hours, which is about the same as a Magicshine 808, I don't see how this could be any brighter.
    It ran for 4+ hours, but the light output at the end and sometime before the end was significantly lower than the maximum brightness. Again, I will have to quantify that with future tests. Also, this is a clone of the 880 with U2, not the 808.

  34. #34
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    What I was trying to say is that they use the same amount of energy in the same amount of time. The two xml led light can't be putting out that much more light than a single xml led light if it drains the battery in the same amount of time. That's if the leds are the same between these lights and driver efficiencies are the same. Of course this light uses the newer U2 light, so that already makes it different.

    To make the light brighter it needs to drain the battery faster. The 880 comes with a 6 cell battery and it only runs 2.5 hours on high.

    Anyway, I think this light probably has a better beam than a single xml (808 or clone) light. That makes it useful in my opinion. It probably not as bright as bright as the 880 though. I do like the two button user interface.

  35. #35
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    The description of these lights have always been works of fantasy that merely hint at the truth . I quite like the lights, but you would do well not accept any of the words and numbers in the description as being true. Just to give a few back of the envelope examples

    • The specs published by the manufacturer, Cree, on an XM-L U2 is that the maximum lumens produced at 2.8A is 936 x 2 = 1872
    • The only Cree LED that produces 1100 lumens at 2.8A is the XM-L2 and that's in the U3 bin.
    • The power consumed by an XM-L at 2.8A is 3.33V x 2 = ~18.6 W per hour. The available power in a li-ion cell rated at 2500 mAh is ~9.2W x 4 = ~37W. Even if you could achieve 100% efficiency, 4 x 18650 2500mAh cells could only run at 2.8A for less than 2 hours.
    • to run 2 XM-Ls at 2.8A for 4 hours would require in excess of ~75W or more than 8 x 2500 mAh cells.
    • working the other way, if 4 x 2500 mAh cells last 4 hours 37W / 4 hours = 9.25W per hour / 2 XM-Ls = 4.625W = ~1.45A each XM-L = less than 570 lumens each XM-L.

    Given these "exaggerations" in the description, I would be utterly astounded if they were using XM-Ls from the highest (& most expensive) U2 bin.

    One of the things I like about using 2 LEDs is that they produce more light per watt than a single LED driven at twice the current. Ignoring questions of driver efficiency,

    • 1 XM-L U2 at 2.8A = a maximum of 1067 lumens
    • 2 x XM-L U2 at 1.4A = a maximum of 623 x 2 = 1246 lumens

    Like I said I quite like the lights, just don't believe the words & numbers quoted for them.
    Last edited by find_bruce; 08-08-2013 at 03:04 AM. Reason: fix maths errors

  36. #36
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    I don't feel that I am explaining myself well enough. This unit DID NOT produce the maximum brightness for the entire 4:15. For all I know, and I am hypothesizing here, it ran with max brightness for 2-3 hours and then switched to some emergency power-saving mode for the rest of the test. I am not equipped to perform the test well at work since the setup I used directs the light into a fan instead of a wall. That is to say I can't see the beam well enough. I will re-test this with pictures at home to show what I mean when I say the the light output appears to change.

    Additionally, Kir measured the current of this unit on high at 2.36A, and not the 2.8A listed on the site.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by find_bruce View Post
    The description of these lights have always been works of fantasy that merely hint at the truth . I quite like the lights, but you would do well not accept any of the words and numbers in the description as being true. .....
    The only thing one should believe about these Chinese lights is, the housing will be some kind of aluminum and it will have some kind of LED(s) in it.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by find_bruce View Post
    One of the things I like about using 2 LEDs is that they produce more light per watt than a single LED driven at twice the current. Ignoring questions of driver efficiency,

    • 1 XM-L U2 at 2.8A = a maximum of 1067 lumens
    • 2 x XM-L U2 at 1.4A = a maximum of 623 x 2 = 1246 lumens

    Like I said I quite like the lights, just don't believe the words & numbers quoted for them.
    Yeah, that's the question I really had. I know the current to lumen curve isn't linear, so I thought there would be an advantage to using two leds instead of one. It's good to have the actual numbers, though. Thanks.

    So how does this extrapolate out to three or four leds? Those are becoming more prevalent in the chinese market.

    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    I don't feel that I am explaining myself well enough. This unit DID NOT produce the maximum brightness for the entire 4:15. For all I know, and I am hypothesizing here, it ran with max brightness for 2-3 hours and then switched to some emergency power-saving mode for the rest of the test. I am not equipped to perform the test well at work since the setup I used directs the light into a fan instead of a wall. That is to say I can't see the beam well enough. I will re-test this with pictures at home to show what I mean when I say the the light output appears to change.

    Additionally, Kir measured the current of this unit on high at 2.36A, and not the 2.8A listed on the site.
    Ok, I get is now. It doesn't last 4 hours on high. I wonder if Kir measure the current going through the leds or coming out of the battery.

    Well I'm struggling with find_bruce's numbers, but from what I gather this light is probably emitting 1100 lumens or more and lasts less than 2 hours on high. If Kir measured the led current, than it's emitting way more than 1100 lumens (ignoring driver efficiency).

    I think this light is probably a good buy, if the beam is as floody as I imagine.

  39. #39
    Kir
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    I'm the only one here with basic electronics equipment and some chinese bike lights?

    All these numbers in the description of all chinese lights are very exaggerated. For example Fenix BT20 supplies 3A to LED on turbo mode and specifies 750 lumen output - that sounds correct. But these chinese "1200-1800" lumens from single xml are obvious lies. Same with "6400" mAh batteries, you will never get more that ~4000, maybe 4400 from a chinese battery.
    I will measure the current on leds/battery in a few days/weeks...don't really have any spare time with work and bike riding and some other stuff like flying R/C helicopters

    For now I will explain the change in brightness. Yes, this light (and probably most other 2 XML lights) will have lower brightness in end of the battery life. The reason is simple - it uses step-down/buck driver with 2 leds connected in series. When battery (input) voltage drops lower than the voltage of 2 leds in series (Vf, depends on current/temperature/bin, usually about 3.1-3.2V per led, 6.2-6.4v for 2 leds) driver will slowly stop working and the current on leds will slowly drop to zero.
    Frequently Asked Questions its expained in more details here (2nd question)
    Buck converter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and here.

    So basically when battery voltage drops to ~6.8v and lower - leds brightness will begin to drop too. Then there will be a linear drop in brightness until battery is fully discharged.
    And thats actually a good thing - you will get slow brightness decrease, longer battery life in the end of the discharge cycle, noticable indication of discharged battery, etc.
    Imo this slow brightness drop is much better than sudden cutoff in 1 XML lights which have full regulation in entire discharge cycle.


    Here is a quick video to show how it works (sorry for the quality, used my old cellphone). Numbers on the left are current draw from PSU, numbers on the right are output voltage, D-50 light in middle mode. This is a very simple DC psu, so numbers aren't very accurate - but good enough for demonstration.
    As you can see light output is fully regulated until about 7v, at which point light draws 1.4A from psu. Then as I decrease the voltage - current/brightness drops too, driver slowly stops working and then completely turns off at 5v (another good thing, light will turn off even if protection pcb in battery will fail to activate).
    If I increase/decrease voltage between 5 and 7v - brightness will change too.

    So thats what steelhmr noticed in his discharge test, sorry for the kinda long explanation

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    Run Test No. 2

    Setup

    1. KD Light facing away from fan.
    2. 82 degrees F.
    3. 'High' setting used throughout entirety of test.

    Results

    1. I started this test too late.
    2. 2:09 of runtime until UI lights changed color.
    3. 2:45 abandoned test as I needed to sleep.
    4. Some change in light output noticed between 2:30 and 2:45 (might not have come across as well in the pics).

    Pics

    Note: Unit was facing a wall with a mirror during the test so I turned unit towards a different wall for pics. Sorry for mild inconsistency in pics. Just used my cell phone (Samsung S3 with 'low-light' setting). Wall was 13' from the light. I believe you can see the light output drop slightly between 2:10 an 2:30 (look toward the outside of the pattern). Same for 2:30 to 2:45. I really just wanted to see when the first change was on this test. Images are probably best viewed by opening first link and then hitting the left arrow on the pic(s).

    Initial,
    2:01,
    2:10,
    2:30,
    2:45,

    (Sorry for living in the stone age with photo bucket. I'll try to host these somewhere else as I just noticed the ads, yeesh.)
    Last edited by steelhmr; 08-09-2013 at 04:51 AM.

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    My thoughts about the test done by Steelhmr: Something very odd going on. Even with auto-power down no two-LED lamp should run for 4hrs unless the lamp was on mid-mode at the start and then powered down at some point. Even then the output of the lamp has to be called in question. Typical run times on high should be between 2.5-3 hr. and that with good batteries. Even with the lamp on mid-mode 4hrs would be excellent run time.

    Nice that this lamp has auto-power down. Most Chinese made lamps don't have this feature.

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    Well, I'm not keen on running too many more tests, but for the next one I will setup a better location where I don't have to reposition the light for pics. Additionally, I will take a reference pic with the Lumina 650 to compare it against. One comment about the pics, the hot spot comes across exaggerated in those pics. In real life the unit doesn't cast a virtual full moon against the wall.

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    Something about the 880 clones that I noticed tonight while looking at both the Kaidomain and D/X web sites.; The K/D models claim to have a 2800ma driver, the D/X ( Ultrafire D-50 ) claim to have a 1800ma driver and output 580 lumen. This could be a misstatement on D/X's part but there is really no way to know for sure.

    All things considered, if i was going to buy one I would most likely buy from Kaidomain because theirs has the more powerful driver. Then again if Kaidomain runs out of stock who's to say they don't restock with a lamp that might have another lower-powered driver. Stuff like this happens. If Steelhmr has one with a less powerful driver than all his tests are with a lamp that is outputting something around 600 lumen. I'm just mentioning this because it is a possibility.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    Something about the 880 clones that I noticed tonight while looking at both the Kaidomain and D/X web sites.; The K/D models claim to have a 2800ma driver, the D/X ( Ultrafire D-50 ) claim to have a 1800ma driver and output 580 lumen. This could be a misstatement on D/X's part but there is really no way to know for sure.

    All things considered, if i was going to buy one I would most likely buy from Kaidomain because theirs has the more powerful driver. Then again if Kaidomain runs out of stock who's to say they don't restock with a lamp that might have another lower-powered driver. Stuff like this happens. If Steelhmr has one with a less powerful driver than all his tests are with a lamp that is outputting something around 600 lumen. I'm just mentioning this because it is a possibility.
    Cat,

    Isn't it equally possible that they just supplied this light with a very strong battery pack? It essentially runs on high for slightly over 2 hours and then gradually fades out. It's hard imagine that this is a 600 lumen light since I have a Lumina 650 (rated and tested at 650 lumens) to directly compare it to. The KD unit blows away the Lumina in terms of brightness (and every other property one would want in a light). Sorry that I don't have the equipment to test the output, but Kir already tested it and gave his findings on the first page of this thread. I'm just reporting my experience from a less electronics-savy and more from a user-experience perspective. My next task will be to take shootout-style pics with the proper camera and terrain settings. That should tell a better picture (no pun intended).

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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Isn't it equally possible that they just supplied this light with a very strong battery pack?
    Possible, well anything's possible. Probable, no way. These are cheap bike lights that have cut lots of corners to get a very low price point. Great value all in all but not top level output nor top quality components.

    I have not worked on this particular light model but have repaired a couple MS lights so I have seen how cheap lights are made.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Cat,

    Isn't it equally possible that they just supplied this light with a very strong battery pack? It essentially runs on high for slightly over 2 hours and then gradually fades out. It's hard imagine that this is a 600 lumen light since I have a Lumina 650 (rated and tested at 650 lumens) to directly compare it to. The KD unit blows away the Lumina in terms of brightness (and every other property one would want in a light). Sorry that I don't have the equipment to test the output, but Kir already tested it and gave his findings on the first page of this thread. I'm just reporting my experience from a less electronics-savy and more from a user-experience perspective. My next task will be to take shootout-style pics with the proper camera and terrain settings. That should tell a better picture (no pun intended).
    Sorry, I didn't want it to sound like I didn't believe what you were saying. If you say it blows away the Lumina I believe you. At least it's nice to hear positive feedback even if the results are somewhat unusual. All things considered if I were in the market for a good Chinese made lamp I might choose one of these ( or one of the Solorstorm X2's ) Good positive feedback from both lamps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    Sorry, I didn't want it to sound like I didn't believe what you were saying. If you say it blows away the Lumina I believe you. At least it's nice to hear positive feedback even if the results are somewhat unusual. All things considered if I were in the market for a good Chinese made lamp I might choose one of these ( or one of the Solorstorm X2's ) Good positive feedback from both lamps.
    Cat,

    No offense taken at all. I can only report what I have observed. I share the same tempered enthusiasm for the light. During the first test at 2:00 I was all fistpumps. At 2:30 I think let out an audible "woo-hoo". By 3:00 I switched to "hmmm" and at 3:30 I knew something wasn't adding up. On the 2nd test my goal was to see if the light output visually changed through the first two hours on the high setting and my observation is that it did not. After 2:09, it does begin to change but I can't begin to quantify it without any additional electronics equipment. I hope that when I can produce shootout pics it will be obvious to everyone that this light is putting out a very respectable beam, at least compared to the Lumina 650. And before any questions begin to surface about the integrity of THAT light, I have two of them to use for comparison

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    looks like a tactical flashlight beam pattern. aren't there bike mounts for Fenix tactical flashlights ? you would be able to use your own 18650 cells and charger, and you could take it hiking, or look for stuff under the bed, or survive a blackout.

    its crazy though how they were able to include so much in the package at the price - it's like they are selling the product for the cost of what the components cost - how do they make a profit ?

    the Chinese never cease to amaze me - from the amount of clones they put out you would have guessed it must have taken 10 planets the size of Earth to produce it all.

    and considering the real products that they are cloning are also made in China it makes you wonder how are they able to undercut the real deal by 4X in price ? the Chinese seem to defy any sort of rational analysis - or maybe i'm just not smart enough to understand them.

    i do think the established companies suffer a bit from over-engineering. since they don't compete on price their engineering efforts end up directed at problems that don't really exist. this is especially true of German companies who spend 90% of their energy solving imaginary non-existent problems. for example the Porsche 918 has 55 computers just to control the drivetrain ... apparently somebody in Germany was bored.

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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    looks like a tactical flashlight beam pattern.
    I just want to say that I wouldn't take too much away from those pics in terms of the actual beam pattern.

    1. I mainly used to pics to compare among themselves as to whether the brightness of the light was changing over the course of the 2nd test.
    2. It was indoors with white walls from 13 feet away.
    3. The pictures seemed to exaggerate the contrast between the hot spot and the rest of the beam. I don't feel that it is as drastic of a difference in person as it appears in the pics.

    Perhaps it does mimic that of a tactical beam pattern to some degree. I just wanted to state that my purpose of those indoor pics was simply to compare the brightness during different times of the test. I'll try to get outdoor pics soon, but I just had a crash today and (slightly) bent my rear rim so it just dropped down a notch on my to do list

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    Wish they sell the head only

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    Can anyone speak to whether the battery holder will fit in this pouch?

    Action-LED-Lights ? 4 Cell Battery Case

  52. #52
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    It will.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HakanC View Post
    KD sells the battery separately 17,40 USD
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S021564
    Now there is one more version of the same battery at KD, slightly cheaper too
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S022419


    /Håkan
    SWEDEN

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    Quote Originally Posted by HakanC View Post
    Now there is one more version of the same battery at KD, slightly cheaper too
    http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S022419


    /Håkan
    SWEDEN
    What about this one:http://kaidomain.com/product/details.S021637

    6 x 18650 Waterproof Battery Set for Bicycle Light
    Voltage: 8.4V
    Capacity: 8800mAh (Manufacturer rated)


    Too good to be true?

  55. #55
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    Expect about 4700-4800mAh from it. 6000mAh is you're very lucky.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kir View Post
    Expect about 4700-4800mAh from it. 6000mAh is you're very lucky.
    Thanks. I kind of figured that the 8800 figure needed a bit of translating. 4800 would not be bad at all for that price though. Or, I could go with the one Hakan posted and replace the cells?

  57. #57
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    Replacing the cells will be better, but more expensive.
    If you don't mind extra size and weight of chinese 6x18650/8x18650 batteries - buy them, they usually have good capacity just because they're using more cells.

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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Thanks. I kind of figured that the 8800 figure needed a bit of translating. 4800 would not be bad at all for that price though. Or, I could go with the one Hakan posted and replace the cells?
    I would go to 4x 3000-3400mAh panasonics from fasttech or lipo from hobbyking .

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    I have found that most of the batteries from Kaidomain are hit or miss ( see my posts in the battery thread).
    Buying a good, solid battery from Xeccon or Action is what I would suggest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MK96 View Post
    I would go to 4x 3000-3400mAh panasonics from fasttech or lipo from hobbyking .
    When replacing batteries you really do have to consider your need for more run time. No sense in buying the most expensive batteries if you typically only ride 2-2.5 hrs. in the dark. You can still buy good ( Sanyo or Samsung ) 2600 to 2800mAh cells at bargain prices and you will be surprised at how well they will work. Currently I use a 4-cell battery that was built with either Sanyo 2600's or Baks. ( 3 yr old Bikeray battery ) This makes the battery 5200mAh. I've been very pleased using these batteries and have never had a problem with run times. Now if you are running a lamp with three or more emitters than you will need a bigger battery ( if you want 3 or more hours of run time.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    When replacing batteries you really do have to consider your need for more run time.
    I considered the longest run time implicitly but you are right. If you don't need that much run time go for 2600-2800 or even good 2200-2400. I am going to power 2 SS X2 and Skyray S6 (perhaps) from one battery (8000 mAh lipo) - the bigger the better for me :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    When replacing batteries you really do have to consider your need for more run time. No sense in buying the most expensive batteries if you typically only ride 2-2.5 hrs. in the dark. You can still buy good ( Sanyo or Samsung ) 2600 to 2800mAh cells at bargain prices and you will be surprised at how well they will work. Currently I use a 4-cell battery that was built with either Sanyo 2600's or Baks. ( 3 yr old Bikeray battery ) This makes the battery 5200mAh. I've been very pleased using these batteries and have never had a problem with run times. Now if you are running a lamp with three or more emitters than you will need a bigger battery ( if you want 3 or more hours of run time.)
    Yeah, I am going to wait until my new light arrives before making any decisions. I am very pleased with the light output and run time of my KD 2 XML-U2. The new light is 3x and I am anticipating the possibility that I may (only) be paying for a lighthead and charger with a sup-par battery. My current need is only for a 2hr or less run time, but next year I will be doing races that include multiple night laps so I may need more power (or batteries) in either case.

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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    Ordered a clone and the Action LED lens for the 880 with high hopes that it will fit and give me a bright flood for my bars. I don't suppose anyone's already attempted this combo?

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    Ordered a clone and the Action LED lens for the 880 with high hopes that it will fit and give me a bright flood for my bars. I don't suppose anyone's already attempted this combo?
    I saw your post in the other thread. Did you order the XML-T6 version (http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S021414) or the XML-U2 version (http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S021518)?

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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    I saw your post in the other thread. Did you order the XML-T6 version (http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S021414) or the XML-U2 version (http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S021518)?
    The black U2 version. That's the newer version, right? http://kaidomain.com/Product/Details.S021521

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    The black U2 version. That's the newer version, right? http://kaidomain.com/Product/Details.S021521
    Yeah, that's the newer/better one. On the other thread you had linked to the T6 version. I have the black U2 version as well and I'm curious to read what you have to say about it when the time comes.

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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    Yeah - I linked that before I ordered. I'll definitely post back in this thread with my thoughts on the light and the lenses.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    Yeah - I linked that before I ordered. I'll definitely post back in this thread with my thoughts on the light and the lenses.
    Nice. I think as more and more questionable SSX2's hit the market, people will start getting over their $50+ fear and start giving this unit a harder look. The extra $10-$15 appears to go a long way.

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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Nice. I think as more and more questionable SSX2's hit the market, people will start getting over their $50+ fear and start giving this unit a harder look. The extra $10-$15 appears to go a long way.
    Well, I have one of those on the way too. I bought that one looking for a light, low profile helmet light. A friend ordered the version on amazon and is pretty happy with it so hopefully Ill get a good one. Fingers crossed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    Well, I have one of those on the way too. I bought that one looking for a light, low profile helmet light. A friend ordered the version on amazon and is pretty happy with it so hopefully Ill get a good one. Fingers crossed.
    Then you can be the one to do a direct comparison between the two. I have nothing against the SSX2, but as the price continues to go down, I am reading about more and more shortcomings (unit and/or battery).

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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    I have nothing against the SSX2, but as the price continues to go down, I am reading about more and more shortcomings (unit and/or battery).
    I bought 2 SS X2 heads since I could not find these MJ880 clone heads alone. I pretty much don't like that li-ion cells lottery from CN :-(

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    Quote Originally Posted by MK96 View Post
    I bought 2 SS X2 heads since I could not find these MJ880 clone heads alone. I pretty much don't like that li-ion cells lottery from CN :-(
    Pretty much doesn't matter who you buy these from, the battery quality will always be questionable. This is also true of the lamp heads as well because time and time again we see a lack of standard quality controls with the mass produced Chinese lamps. You accept all this before you decide to roll the dice. A better battery you can always buy and use with any number of lamps but if the lamp is crap or doesn't meet your expectations than you rolled a snake eyes. Just remember, everyone has different expectations. What makes someone else happy might not please you at all.

    If you really wanted the 880 clone you should of bought one and not worried that you couldn't just buy the lamp head alone. While you might have saved $10 doing it that way it wouldn't be like you didn't get anything for the extra $10 of buying one with battery. Even if you don't like the cheap battery it will probably still work and still be there if you need a back-up. You just can't ( or shouldn't ) rely upon it as your primary voltage source. Regardless, once you know it's limitations it can still be of use.

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    K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    So, Cat, what's the most cost effective way to get a good, reliable battery? Make one? Buy from Action LED?

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    So, Cat, what's the most cost effective way to get a good, reliable battery? Make one? Buy from Action LED?
    Not sure I can answer that. Probably best to shop around. I'm sure the list I started over on the Battery Thread back in January is out of date. Both Action LED and Xeccon offer some good deals on batteries but I'm sure there must be other places. Been a while since I've done a price survey on bike batteries.

    Personally, if I were looking for a good four cell battery I want at least 5200mAh capacity but would prefer something higher like 5600, 5800, 6200 or 6800mAh
    Hard to find a decent price on a 4-cell battery made with higher capacity Sanyo, Samsung or Panasonic cells.

    If you don't mind fiddling around with loose cells you could try one of those 4-cell holders and buy some decent quality cells to go into it. Not what I would do but it certainly can work if you don't mind the inconvenience of messing with a cell holder.

    If you can find a good 4-cell 5600 or 5800mAh battery ( Samsung or Sanyo ) in the $50 USD range that would be a good place to start. If you want more capacity ( > 6000mAh ) the best deals are with 6-cells ( although 6-cell batteries are heavier than 4-cells, thus the lower cost ). Xeccon lighting has some good deals on those.

    If I had the money I'd buy one of the 4-cell ( Panasonic cells ) Gloworm batteries ( Action LED ) but those are not cheap. On the other hand Xeccon has a very good price on a Samsung 6-cell (7800mAh ) . Hard to beat the price on those. I don't know why there is such a price jump with 4-cells once you go over 4400mAh.

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    looking at fins on Chinese lights makes you wonder if Chinese people understand what fins are for ?

    i wonder if Chinese have ever seen an air conditioner or a car radiator and asked themselves why the fins are a fraction of a millimeter on them but are maybe 1/4 inch on the lights they're making ?

    the objective of fins is to add surface area, unless you're a Chinese light maker then apparently the objective is to add dead weight.

    if these guys built an air conditioner with fins like that it would take up the whole room and weigh 10,000 pounds.

    sorry, lol, but i just find it funny.

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    D/X Versions Of the 880 clone; More than one type

    Tonight while looking over the D/X stuff I noticed that D/X has a couple versions of the 880 clone. If you want the one with the best features ( U2 emitters, high output, 4-modes ( including press to hold strobe ),..) This "Nitefire" version is the one you want if you are buying from D/X. D/X has at least three other versions with different brand names. While less expensive most of those are only listing 580 lumen. I don't think you want one of those.

    I also noticed that D/X is trying to be a little more honest about the output and battery listing...( sometimes ). The Nitefire version is listing the output around 1200 Lumen which is probably accurate. They also list the battery at 3000mAh, also probably accurate. This is a nice trend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    looking at fins on Chinese lights makes you wonder if Chinese people understand what fins are for ?

    i wonder if Chinese have ever seen an air conditioner or a car radiator and asked themselves why the fins are a fraction of a millimeter on them but are maybe 1/4 inch on the lights they're making ?

    the objective of fins is to add surface area, unless you're a Chinese light maker then apparently the objective is to add dead weight.

    if these guys built an air conditioner with fins like that it would take up the whole room and weigh 10,000 pounds.

    sorry, lol, but i just find it funny.
    I am sure that the Chinese understand heat transfer and the need for it on a light. They also understand the economics of making a lamp housing for really low cost. That low cost requirement is what drives the profile of the lamp. Fewer, thicker fins are far easier/cheaper to produce whether by extrusion or machining.

    A side effect of the thicker fin design that likely did not occur to the designer is that a thicker fin is less likely to cut a user in the event of contact in a crash.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vancbiker View Post
    I am sure that the Chinese understand heat transfer and the need for it on a light. They also understand the economics of making a lamp housing for really low cost. That low cost requirement is what drives the profile of the lamp. Fewer, thicker fins are far easier/cheaper to produce whether by extrusion or machining.

    A side effect of the thicker fin design that likely did not occur to the designer is that a thicker fin is less likely to cut a user in the event of contact in a crash.
    the thing is most lights on the market that have fins on them either have no real need for fins or don't derive any serious benefit from the ineffective fins that they do have. this is true for both chinese and "good" lights like lupine.

    for example i have had Lupine Piko - and i'm pretty sure if it didn't have fins there would be no difference in performance whatsoever.

    in other words, with the exception of very good, high-output lights, the fins on most lights are primarily for decoration. this is the same situation as spoilers on cars - they are for decoration on most cars, with the exception of cars capable of hitting 180 mph or so.

    now just because a spoiler isn't needed, doesn't mean you can't add one, as long as it is conservative and doesn't interfere with performance, like so:



    same with fins:



    and then you have trash like this:



    which serves no useful purpose except adding weight, aerodynamic drag, raising your center of gravity and making it hard to open the trunk.

    and this is pretty much what fins look like on 3 out of 4 chinese lights, conservatively speaking.

    now of course you can still drive a car even with that *thing* plastered on top of it, and you can still use a light with those fins ...

    but i find it difficult to use the word "engineering" to describe this mess. the word that comes to mind is "ret4rdation" ...

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    Fins add area for heat dissipation. Their location and dimensions do affect their efficiency, but in most all cases will improve heat management. Can fins improve aesthetics? Sure, but the side effect will also be to improve cooling.

    1 sq inch area per watt of LED will keep a light cool with moderate airflow (>6-7 mph) in 60 degree F temps. 2 sq inches per watt drops the airflow reqirement to a walking pace. My current helmet light is 18 watts on it's high setting with 14 sq inches area. It still works but only because on everything except fast trail sections I run on medium

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vancbiker View Post
    Fins add area for heat dissipation. Their location and dimensions do affect their efficiency, but in most all cases will improve heat management. Can fins improve aesthetics? Sure, but the side effect will also be to improve cooling.

    1 sq inch area per watt of LED will keep a light cool with moderate airflow (>6-7 mph) in 60 degree F temps. 2 sq inches per watt drops the airflow reqirement to a walking pace. My current helmet light is 18 watts on it's high setting with 14 sq inches area. It still works but only because on everything except fast trail sections I run on medium
    chinese fins do not significantly increase area. most of the area on chinese lights comes from the enormous size of these lights compared to something like Lupine of same output.

    L&M Seca is the only light where fins are 100% functional. The fins are about 80% functional on NiteRider Pro 3600 / 1800. About 60 functional on Betty / Wilma and mostly for decoration on other lights including Piko where they are 100% for decoration.

    most metal-bodied lights do not need fins at all. it is only high-output plastic-bodied lights like Seca where the fins are 100% functional. a metal chinese light that is heavy as a tire iron and puts out 500 lumens doesn't need fins - they're just there because Chinese like to make products resemble the real thing - that's why they have "adidos" sneakers and "abble" iPhone chargers. they have been doing the same thing for decades.

    if you think those fins serve a function you might as well believe that "abble" and "adidos" are words in chinese.

  81. #81
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    Re: K/D 2 x XML, MJ880 Clone

    Love ppl saying cause its made in China and such it can't work. Has nothing to do with where its made its how it made. So many of the lights I see out have Chinese copies, many of which are the exact same thing from the same factory but with crappy parts like chargers and batteries.

    Best to have knowledge of all this before trying to bash products. So much of anything is made in China just the cheaper stuff has no stickers where as the way overpriced stuff has a brand name sticker on it.

    Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2

  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigris99 View Post
    Love ppl saying cause its made in China and such it can't work. Has nothing to do with where its made its how it made. So many of the lights I see out have Chinese copies, many of which are the exact same thing from the same factory but with crappy parts like chargers and batteries.

    Best to have knowledge of all this before trying to bash products. So much of anything is made in China just the cheaper stuff has no stickers where as the way overpriced stuff has a brand name sticker on it.

    Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2
    yes you figured it all out. everybody who buys brand name products is an id1ot and you are a genius and outsmarted us all. congratulations !

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    chinese fins do not significantly increase area. most of the area on chinese lights comes from the enormous size of these lights compared to something like Lupine.
    So the country of origin has some effect on how fins add area or not???? So just to make sure basic math has not been overlooked, let's look at the following example. A flat surface of a length and width of one inch is one square inch of area. Now put fins on that one by one surface that are an eighth inch tall and wide with a groove between fins also an eighth inch wide. That will give you four fins. The surface area is now two square inches. 100% more area is a substantial gain and in some instances important. Whether a light needs fins or not is merely a function of what it's power to heat dissipation area ratio is, not country of manufacture.

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vancbiker View Post
    So the country of origin has some effect on how fins add area or not???? So just to make sure basic math has not been overlooked, let's look at the following example. A flat surface of a length and width of one inch is one square inch of area. Now put fins on that one by one surface that are an eighth inch tall and wide with a groove between fins also an eighth inch wide. That will give you four fins. The surface area is now two square inches. 100% more area is a substantial gain and in some instances important. Whether a light needs fins or not is merely a function of what it's power to heat dissipation area ratio is, not country of manufacture.
    how hot does this light get anyway ? if it gets so hot you can barely touch it while riding at 10+ mph then it needs those fins. if not - it doesn't.

    i don't think i buy the idea that properly shaped fins would be that difficult to manufacture however. the more logical explanation is that the people who put the fins there simply didn't care about what they were doing, and frankly, if i was working for 10 cents an hour i wouldn't care either.

    my father once bought a chinese clamp in a 99 cents store that said 4" on it, but the actual size of the clamp was 3" ... i want to see what kind of formulas you can come up with to explain to me that 3 inches equals 4 inches. LOL.

    this is what chinese stuff is like. they have no incentive to make good honest products NONE because they don't have any brand name to protect. they don't care if the light works or not. tomorrow they will sell the same light under a different name and people will again buy it because it will be 10 times cheaper than a real light from a real company.

    i don't care if a company is chinese or german. i care about the brand name. DOES IT HAVE ONE ? Huawei is a chinese company that has a brand name. are their phones good ? no. but at least they TRY to make a good phone because they have a brand name that people recognize and they want to protect that brand name.

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    There is a new 2x XM-L2-U2 from Kaidomain. Light head only. Looks very nice: http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S022462

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by tigris99 View Post
    Love ppl saying cause its made in China and such it can't work. Has nothing to do with where its made its how it made. So many of the lights I see out have Chinese copies, many of which are the exact same thing from the same factory but with crappy parts like chargers and batteries.

    Best to have knowledge of all this before trying to bash products. So much of anything is made in China just the cheaper stuff has no stickers where as the way overpriced stuff has a brand name sticker on it.
    Yes, yes, when can talk till the cows come home about how cheap the Chinese products are. Just remember, just like anywhere else in the world the people who design the products are not the one's that make it. What makes a high quality product has to do with design, quality parts and skilled people to put all the stuff together and then very good quality control parameters to make sure every product makes the grade. ( *Truthfully, be glad the Chinese DON'T follow strict quality control because if they did the cost would be 3x as much )...

    Most of the Chinese lamps I see being sold look very simplistic. I don't doubt that many corners are cut putting these together but if you look back at where all this started with the release of the MagicShine lamps, design and function have changed in those few years since and improvements are seen in some of the stuff now being sold. ( That's why we talk about and review these things to find out which are crap and which are okay ) Quality control is likely still crap but if the product is designed better you will more likely get a better product ( most of the time ).

    Just keep in mind; these lamps are designed for quick inexpensive sale and are not designed to meet the standards used in a Space shuttle program. Some will be good and some will suck but few will be great. You're buying something that cost about what you would spend for a tank of gas. That tank of gas might last you a couple weeks if you're lucky. If your generic Chinese lamp last you a season you should consider this as getting your monies worth. The rule is; The more you invest in your purchase the more you can ( or should ) expect to get out of it.

    In the mean time, if the fins only partly function and the two emitters only put out 1000 lumen ( vs. the claimed 1800 lumen ) and the battery only last you a year....Smile, 1000 lumen is a hell of a good output to ride with. If it cost you $40 or less and still works after a year you made out like a bandit.

    Choosing the right Chinese lamp for bike use is like choosing the cheapest pi**-water beer to get a drunk on with. Some are a little better than others but all will get you drunk. As we all know, " Drinking something that taste better is always preferable. This equates to having a lamp that works better but is still inexpensive.
    Last edited by Cat-man-do; 09-02-2013 at 03:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    how hot does this light get anyway ? if it gets so hot you can barely touch it while riding at 10+ mph then it needs those fins. if not - it doesn't.

    i don't think i buy the idea that properly shaped fins would be that difficult to manufacture however. the more logical explanation is that the people who put the fins there simply didn't care about what they were doing, and frankly, if i was working for 10 cents an hour i wouldn't care either.

    my father once bought a chinese clamp in a 99 cents store that said 4" on it, but the actual size of the clamp was 3" ... i want to see what kind of formulas you can come up with to explain to me that 3 inches equals 4 inches. LOL.

    this is what chinese stuff is like. they have no incentive to make good honest products NONE because they don't have any brand name to protect. they don't care if the light works or not. tomorrow they will sell the same light under a different name and people will again buy it because it will be 10 times cheaper than a real light from a real company.

    i don't care if a company is chinese or german. i care about the brand name. DOES IT HAVE ONE ? Huawei is a chinese company that has a brand name. are their phones good ? no. but at least they TRY to make a good phone because they have a brand name that people recognize and they want to protect that brand name.
    XMLs produce a lot of heat and performance drops significantly without some form of cooling. How hot a bike light is to touch is irrelevant as it depends on the internal thermal pathway and how much aluminium mass the heat has to pass through.
    Considering bike lights are relatively small and are now coming with multi-emitters, any form of thermal cooling will have an impact on performance and heatfins make a difference, especially with air flow. For best effect they need to be placed as close to the emitter as possible with a good direct thermal pathway, providing the light has been well designed heatfins make a difference.

    If you haven't already you might want to read up on a forum such as budgetlightforum, plenty of testing done on that site.

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by whokilledJR View Post
    XMLs produce a lot of heat and performance drops significantly without some form of cooling. How hot a bike light is to touch is irrelevant as it depends on the internal thermal pathway and how much aluminium mass the heat has to pass through.
    Considering bike lights are relatively small and are now coming with multi-emitters, any form of thermal cooling will have an impact on performance and heatfins make a difference, especially with air flow. For best effect they need to be placed as close to the emitter as possible with a good direct thermal pathway, providing the light has been well designed heatfins make a difference.

    If you haven't already you might want to read up on a forum such as budgetlightforum, plenty of testing done on that site.
    as i said heatsink fins are like spoilers on a car. sometimes they're functional:



    sometimes they are aesthetic:



    and sometimes they are pointless and ridiculous:



    you don't need to tell me what heatsink fins or spoilers are for. i have a degree in electrical engineering. i am telling you to know the difference between the 3 types. this way next time somebody tries to sell you a 20 year old rusty diesel pickup truck with five spoilers on the roof you won't think that it's a formula 1 ...

  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    There is a new 2x XM-L2-U2 from Kaidomain. Light head only. Looks very nice: http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S022462
    Thats a completely different light, don't mix it up with MJ880 clones.
    Original is called JEXREE Owl:
    HIGH POWER LED PORTABLE-LIGHT SERIES
    It has nice SMD-leds glowrings around the main led's reflectors which serve as parking/daytime lights and also look very cool
    It also uses XM-L2 leds, has very high brightness maximum mode and good thermal transfer to outer case.

    There is also a JEXREE Bat with 3 xml leds:
    10PCS/LOT JEXREE High Power CREE 3x L2 LED 4000Lumen High Power Headlight Bike Bicycle Light +battery and charger-in Headlamps from Lights & Lighting on Aliexpress.com

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kir View Post
    Thats a completely different light, don't mix it up with MJ880 clones.
    Original is called JEXREE Owl:
    HIGH POWER LED PORTABLE-LIGHT SERIES
    It has nice SMD-leds glowrings around the main led's reflectors which serve as parking/daytime lights and also look very cool
    It also uses XM-L2 leds, has very high brightness maximum mode and good thermal transfer to outer case.
    parking / daytime lights ? say what ?

    are they for real ?

    these people ...

    Light & Motion put side marker lights on some of their low-end headlights as well as on their tail lights, but what could possibly be the point of having a marker light facing FORWARD when there is already a light there ?

    these people ...

    i'm sure when they design their products they're sure rich Americans will buy them for their 6 year olds to play with. i don't think the Chinese have any idea that fully grown adults play with these toys themselves !

    ugh ... no words LOL

  91. #91
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    Because 1) they don't blind people in front of you 2) they can be seen from sides 3) they can be set up to blinking mode + main lights on low, that increases your visibility.
    Don't complain about these led rings, imo thats a great idea.

  92. #92
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    It is getting little out of topic, the topic was the MJ880 clone, not the other lights, heatsink fins and sportscars :-)

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK96 View Post
    It is getting little out of topic, the topic was the MJ880 clone, not the other lights, heatsink fins and sportscars :-)
    OK OK

    i'll try to stop

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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post

    you don't need to tell me what heatsink fins or spoilers are for. i have a degree in electrical engineering. i am telling you to know the difference between the 3 types. this way next time somebody tries to sell you a 20 year old rusty diesel pickup truck with five spoilers on the roof you won't think that it's a formula 1 ...
    Fair enough, although the part of your text I was replying to left a different impression.

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vancbiker View Post
    So the country of origin has some effect on how fins add area or not????
    This has been established previous on MTBR.
    Thin Finnish fins win.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scvkurt03 View Post
    Ordered a clone and the Action LED lens for the 880 with high hopes that it will fit and give me a bright flood for my bars. I don't suppose anyone's already attempted this combo?
    Hi there! I bought the same lamp. Now I would like to know: Did it work with the reflector? If yes, what was the result?

    I really hope so very much!

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by tish! View Post
    Hi there! I bought the same lamp. Now I would like to know: Did it work with the reflector? If yes, what was the result?

    I really hope so very much!
    I've yet to receive the light. I'll post here when I get it...

  98. #98
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    These flood type lenses might work with other ( two reflector ) lamps as well. I think you'll like the output just as it is but if you feel you need more flood likely you will only need to replace one lens. If you use two it will likely kill the throw particularly when in the lower output levels.

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    Good news, I got the light today! Bad news, the lenses look way too small. Worse news...well:K/D  2 x XML, MJ880 Clone-broken-cord.jpg

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    Is that the way it came, or did it just snap off? I thought this was a quality light.

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