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  1. #26
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    The seca may very well be a good light but illumination immediately in front of you provides no major value since your vision should be focused down road when moving. Most people when moving don't have the reaction time skills necessary to adjust for something they immediately see in front of the tire. They would have to see that object down stream first to adjust for it.

    Dark spots exist in all vehicles. The dark spot is the distance from the steering wheel to the where the headlights first illuminate.

    I think you both make good points. Androgen you want to illuminate the horizon so you don't run into branches (which is the main focus of a headlamp) but you don't mention that head lamps should possibly have a reverse cutoff so that up it shines upward away for. The horizon to focus on branches or trees and then your bar lights should have cut offs to focus downward.

    Some can say that in essence the lupine and all the other lights out there allow for that by letting the end user tilt their bar light down to provide the right amount of near field to far distance and then a headlight that the user can angle slightly upward to illuminate branches.

    Maybe the seca/niterider is trying to do the job of both lights at once and in doing so creates the blinding effect that you mention.

    This 2 jobs in one can be seen as perfect for riding in the woods and such which is truly the primary focus of the design for those lights.

  2. #27
    6ix
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    "in that picture the light appears to be aimed at the 1st cone,"

    "somebody should give Francois the idea to do two beam shots per light - one aimed lower and one aimed higher."

    "since i already have all the near-field lighting i need i don't see how not aiming the light down makes me an "idiot" ..."
    I know you are reading this like all supposedly ignored.

    The Seca is aimed down fixed to a handlebar because night trail riding is about seeing obstacles and what's ahead on the ground. Helmet lights picks up overhead hazards or prepares yourself for what's to come. You are spending all that money lighting up nothingness in the city. Its not efficient and annoying to everyone you ride past.

    Francois should only take shots aimed higher or horizontally if he's doing a shootout for Gyrocopter lights.

  3. #28
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    Good point, cue003. In other words, you may choose to aim it closer to horizontal for off road and farther from horizontal to down 15 degrees on road. One is obviously not worried with blinding anyone on the trail but definitely interested in seeing where the switchback suddenly turns or where that branch at head height is. On road, you're not worried about branches but you are worried about potholes and other pavement defects.

    J.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Interesting comment that a Lupine light is "crippled by a useless beam." Right. That's going to be news to Lupine and just about everyone that has one.
    not really. i have read here on MTBR in the ( i belive ) "some Lupine news" thread of a Betty user thinking about dumping the Betty over the narrow beam with no spill ...

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    If I want to get a light that I can use to directly and brightly light my front tire and handlebars, which would be like shining a light on your steering wheel and hood
    it is rather amazing how you can be blind to the absurdity of what you are saying. the fact that cars have a hood that blocks nearfield view is precisely why car beams don't need to illuminate the nearfield, and why you can sometimes drive over a bottle getting out of parking ( if you park on NYC streets that is ) if you don't look under the car first. bikes don't have a hood and need lights that can provide nearfield light to assist with hopping over obstacles such as curbs and potholes - something you don't do in a car - in a car you just drive over the potholes, but on a road bike with 19mm tire this may not be advisable.

    Seca spill is carefully calibrated so that it sufficient but not excessive and doesn't interfere with your ability to see far into the distance. I was actually quite impressed by how expertly this aspect of the design was nailed.

    the Dosun isn't as expertly done - it's nearfield is over-blown causing the eyes to adapt to it and thereby reducing your ability to see far into the distance. however when combined a helmet mounted Seca which is conservative with its near-field spill ( when helmet mounted ) they balance out as you can see:


  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    It's being aimed for you. So you properly position it on your bars just like I do. You can just as easily improperly aim a Seca as a Wilma. I'm not sure why you don't understand this.

    I can also see my front wheel and the area immediately in front of my wheel, but it's indirect lighting because the lumens and beam are downrange illuminating things I need to see that I can actually do something about. Try swerving around an object you didn't see until it was 3' in front of your bike while at speed - you can't. Too much light close in destroys your night vision.

    The actual end result of the Wilma is not substantially different than this picture except it's brighter downrange because the Wilma is a significantly brighter light at 2400 lumens than your Secas (which is also a good light). Lupine is slightly less bright in the 0-8' range because that's in the sidespill and purposely not as bright. I would submit that the choice of lighting in the near field is a matter of personal preference and matters less in practice.

    J.
    while you can't swerve around something that's already in your near-field you can still prepare your body for the shock. simply transferring the weight from your saddle to the pedals would only require you to move half an inch but make a difference in the amount of shock transmitted to your spine when you hit that pothole which was already too late to swerve around.

    for this reason i still want to have near-field lighting, but it must be not so bright as to compromise my night vision overall.

    and even if you see the obstacle just a fraction of a second before impact and there is nothing you can do at all in the time BEFORE impact seeing what has happened can help your brain keep balance AFTER the impact because it will have more information sooner about what has happened when time counts.

    finally not having a dark gap in front of you will simply improve your confidence and help you enjoy the ride more.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by 6ix View Post
    I know you are reading this like all supposedly ignored.

    The Seca is aimed down fixed to a handlebar because night trail riding is about seeing obstacles and what's ahead on the ground. Helmet lights picks up overhead hazards or prepares yourself for what's to come. You are spending all that money lighting up nothingness in the city. Its not efficient and annoying to everyone you ride past.

    Francois should only take shots aimed higher or horizontally if he's doing a shootout for Gyrocopter lights.
    when somebody is on ignore list their posts are hidden by default and replaced with a button that allows you to view the post if you want. this way i get the choice to look at the post if i feel like it or not look at it if i don't. rest assured - you are all still on ignore list, but i sometimes take a peek.

  7. #32
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    It's apparent to me that you do know much about Lupine lights.

    It's not dark in the near field, it's just indirectly lit with spill - it is done very well. And, 8' in front of you it is right in the beam. There is no issue with not being prepared for a hit - none at all.

    The current Betty is a 26 degree light, that is not a "narrow" light. The older as in ancient history Bettys - like 4 or 5 years old - had much narrower beams in about the 15-18 degree range if I recall. They were also about 1800 lumens too. In their favor too, many of them can be upgraded to a wider beam of about 22 degrees, which few, if any, other lights are able to do. So, you pretty much have it way wrong again. Apparently here again, you did not have accurate information either and did not take the time to be correct.

    You're operating on bad information and with only about 2/3rds of the information in the first place. You ought to go and figure it out first so you know what you are talking about. I get that you like your lights, and they are good lights, but that doesn't mean that everything else isn't.


    J.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    It's apparent to me that you do know much about Lupine lights.

    It's not dark in the near field, it's just indirectly lit with spill - it is done very well. And, 8' in front of you it is right in the beam. There is no issue with not being prepared for a hit - none at all.

    The current Betty is a 26 degree light, that is not a "narrow" light. The older as in ancient history Bettys - like 4 or 5 years old - had much narrower beams in about the 15-18 degree range if I recall. They were also about 1800 lumens too. In their favor too, many of them can be upgraded to a wider beam of about 22 degrees, which few, if any, other lights are able to do. So, you pretty much have it way wrong again. Apparently here again, you did not have accurate information either and did not take the time to be correct.

    You're operating on bad information and with only about 2/3rds of the information in the first place. You ought to go and figure it out first so you know what you are talking about.


    J.
    i'm tired. i'm going to go relax ...

  9. #34
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    This thread is so full of f'n noise.

    Here's yer bottom line: look high and low and you will not find an accident caused by a cyclist's light, ever. I've tried, never found anything, not even an accident where the cyclist's light was a contributing factor.

    Let us not regulate those things which do not pose any risk whatsoever.

    Buy a bunch of lumens, aim them at the road, and ride your bike. And don't take your lead from the Germans - they live to regulate everything.

    And to the poster who thinks 99 of 100 people can't think because they buy an SUV rather than a station wagon (which is what they really need according to you) - you're a sad, arrogant individual.

    Though of course I'm sure YOU need that 3rd bike, that 2nd TV, that game console, that boat, that new Iphone, that 6th pair of shoes, etc etc etc.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by canuckjgc View Post
    Let us not regulate those things which do not pose any risk whatsoever.

    Buy a bunch of lumens, aim them at the road, and ride your bike. And don't take your lead from the Germans - they live to regulate everything.
    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by canuckjgc View Post
    And to the poster who thinks 99 of 100 people can't think because they buy an SUV rather than a station wagon (which is what they really need according to you) - you're a sad, arrogant individual.
    +10

  11. #36
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    delllllete
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    99 out of 100 people have no ability for analytical thinking at all -
    Quote Originally Posted by -Archie- View Post
    And the rest 1 typically believe he is a rare genius...
    thank you
    I did not think you noticed.
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

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