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Thread: Amber

  1. #1
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    Amber

    this is the reason:



    why i don't think using Amber lights for visibility is such a hot idea.

    unless your idea of visibility is to blend in.

    the opposite of amber is blue, but it's reserved for emergency vehicles.

    ps: you can right click, open image in new tab for full resolution.

  2. #2
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    You take some mighty long rides.

    J.
    Last edited by JohnJ80; 10-30-2013 at 08:40 PM.

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    ...not that I'm speaking for others but I'm still trying to figure out what a view of the earth from outer space has to do with amber lights.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    I'm still trying to figure out what a view of the earth from outer space has to do with amber lights.
    the view from space shows that the average color of street light at night is amber, which means that on average amber lights will stand out the LEAST at night.

    blue will stand out the most, but is illegal.

    amber may be a good color during the day though. but to have a separate light just for day use would be expensive.

    i passed some school buses at about ~ 3 pm today by some school, and i noticed they had amber lights flashing. i asked myself if i thought the color was working and my conclusion was yes. however it was an overcast day, and skylight has blueish hue, so naturally yellow will stand out against blue. whether these lights are still effective on a sunny day remains to be seen.
    Last edited by androgen; 10-31-2013 at 09:55 AM.

  5. #5
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    On most of my night rides that i stand on top of the mountain and look out over the city lights, i see almost no red or yellow lights. Green lights are visible for a considerable distance. I notice green laser pointers are more visible in the daylight and travel further at night as well. Green is the way to go. The reason white works at night is because it adds equal parts of red, green, and blue into the equation. This means the entire spectrum is included. Removing one or more only reduces output.

    This is all just my un-scientific guess. lol.

    BTW, you didn't need a 6000x4000 image to try and make a point. That is HUGE!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    the view from space shows that the average color of street light at night is amber, which means that on average amber lights will stand out the LEAST at night.
    I shouldn't have to say this BUT...Looking at a photo of earth at night from anywhere from 250 miles away to tens of thousands of miles away ( depending on distance of orbit in space )...there is no way to make any rational determination on the average color of street lamps JUST BY LOOKING AT A PHOTO. if you want to know the average color of street lamps you just get out and drive around. I don't think I've ever seen an amber street lamp. The only place I generally see amber lights are on signal lights and work vehicles.

    Now as to what spectrum of light is more dominant AFTER filtering through hundreds of miles of our polluted atmosphere I have no comment nor do I care. This discussion has no real purpose on the forum.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    I shouldn't have to say this BUT...Looking at a photo of earth at night from anywhere from 250 miles to tens of thousands of miles away ( depending on distance of orbit in space )...there is no way to make any rational determination on the average color of street lamps JUST BY LOOKING AT A PHOTO. if you want to know the average color of street lamps you just get out and drive around. I don't think I've ever seen an amber street lamp. The only place I generally see amber lights are on signal lights and work vehicles.

    Now as to what spectrum of light is more dominant AFTER filtering through hundreds of miles of our polluted atmosphere I have no comment nor do I care.
    if you watch this video:

    you can see lightnings are still the blueish white after filtering through the atmosphere, but street lights are amber.



    aside from that, thank you for posting in my thread just to inform me that you don't care about my thread. maybe you should join a forum about knitting sweaters just to tell everybody there that discussion of knitting is irrational, pointless, and that you don't care about it. wow them with your intelligence.

    PS: i already knew the color of street lighting was amber from driving around the street, and from knowing the spectrum of both halogen and high pressure sodium lamps. but the picture from space makes for a convenient and simple summary and visualization. apparently not simple enough for some of us

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    I don't think we can say that all street lights are amber. What is going to matter is the street that you are riding on. Either way, if the amber flasher is bright enough, it's not going to be a problem.

    Androgen - in your particular case, you have enough lights and lumens to be seen from space on your own.

    J.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    I don't think we can say that all street lights are amber. What is going to matter is the street that you are riding on. Either way, if the amber flasher is bright enough, it's not going to be a problem.

    Androgen - in your particular case, you have enough lights and lumens to be seen from space on your own.

    J.
    Now John I know I shouldn't say this but I thought "Andro-world" actually WAS in space. If my memory serves me correctly it is somewhere in the same constellation as "Never-never Land".

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    Amber

    Cat - you're going to joining me on the Andro ignore list pretty quick.

    J.

  11. #11
    6ix
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    Coming to your defense Andie! This thread would have been very useful to these guys had it been posted a little sooner. Pity one of them may not have home internet access to read this invaluable thread.
    Warning: It is a criminal offense to feed trolls after midnight

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post

    PS: i already knew the color of street lighting was amber from driving around the street, and from knowing the spectrum of both halogen and high pressure sodium lamps. but the picture from space makes for a convenient and simple summary and visualization. apparently not simple enough for some of us
    Strange. I work at night and drive all night for a living. I do see two different kinds of street lighting. One is a warmer white with some reddish hues to it. The other kind is more bluish and a bit more harder on the eye.

    Once again keep in mind street lamps point downward. Any light viewed from above is mostly reflected light. Then factor in the layers of atmosphere that also come in play to shift the tint. Lastly the camera used has to have special filters. They also angled the shots so we could see more of the planet. This means you are looking through even more atmosphere than you would if you looked straight down. This too will change things.

    Other facts to ponder; When the full moon first rises it appears orange/yellow on the horizon. When it rises higher in the sky it then changes to white. When the sun sets as it approaches the horizon it gets more yellow and finally turns red/orange as it dips below the horizon. Do not under estimate our ever changing atmosphere's ability to distort color from any light emitting source. Why do you think the Hubble was built?

    I could go on to ask why you think the sky is blue during the day but once again I think it safe to say I think I made my point.

    All this said, Amber is just another color to consider for cycling purposes. As far as LED's go, white is the brightest, red is next with amber not far behind. Personally I like amber for Daytime rear use as long as you can get it bright enough. Amber is the color that promotes "warning"..."Danger"..."Alert". Red promotes "Stop" or danger when blinking. Flashing or strobing white light is becoming more commonplace on the road. I see them on emergency vehicles, work vehicles , tow trucks, school buses and of course bicycles.

    Parting comment: Tonight while doing my job I saw a guy riding a bike along I-95, ( speed limit 65 mph ) the busiest Interstate in the state of Maryland. Add to this it was raining with construction areas set up in different spots. No lights, no reflectors , no helmet. Might as well of had a flag out with "Run me over NOW" written on it. Not even those k-mart reflector pedals. Not'a...zilch...nothing. I guess he didn't care or know it is illegal to ride a bike on the interstate. I swear to you if I had had a cheap rear blinkie with me I would of considered pulling over and flagging him down.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    Tonight while doing my job I saw a guy riding a bike along I-95, ( speed limit 65 mph ) the busiest Interstate in the state of Maryland. Add to this it was raining with construction areas set up in different spots. No lights, no reflectors , no helmet. Might as well of had a flag out with "Run me over NOW" written on it. Not even those k-mart reflector pedals. Not'a...zilch...nothing. I guess he didn't care or know it is illegal to ride a bike on the interstate. I swear to you if I had had a cheap rear blinkie with me I would of considered pulling over and flagging him down.
    yeah i recently came across more or less this:



    except she was completely covered in black clothing except for the face, which of course i couldn't see because she was in front of me. i don't know what color her scooter was because i didn't see it.

    so i'm driving and this girl starts to sort of materialize and separate out from the pavement like a ghost - because she might as well just been a shadow on the asphalt - same color anyway.

    and of course there were like 2 or 3 cars in front of me so i barely had any view out front anyway. basically i saw her when she was like 20 feet from the car and i have perfect vision.

    some day she will come across some nearsighted drunk and that will be the end of her. he won't even know what he'd just hit, and he certainly will not stop to wait for the cops to find out he was drunk, he's just going to floor the gas and leave her body to get run over by the next car.

    oh well, that's evolution at work. if somebody is looking for information i will gladly help them if i can. but if somebody is a moron i'm not going to try to interfere with nature's work.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by androgen View Post
    ....that's evolution at work. if somebody is looking for information i will gladly help them if i can. but if somebody is a moron i'm not going to try to interfere with nature's work.
    Yeah, I understand. Impossible to educate everyone. Still, sometimes people do things a certain way only because they haven't been told of a better way ( or haven't figured it out yet themselves ). This is particularly true of young people. Then there is the economic factor to consider. Some people just don't have the money to do things differently.

    Helping others can be very rewarding but not everyone wants to be helped. I always try to keep that in mind. Old saying, " You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink".

    I've always wanted to gather a kit together of cheap "see me" lights that I could hand out to people who I feel are in need. Might be a good idea to include some cheap reflectors or reflector vests as well. Great to be able to just tell someone what they need but when you actually put something in their hands ( and see the smile on their face...) "THAT" is a very rewarding feeling. It won't bring about world peace but it will still leave you with a warm feeling inside and really make your day.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink
    you could buy somebody a helmet, but you can't make them wear it ...

    i have people on this forum telling me i look like a clown because i have blinking lights on me. fortunately, i happen to be the kind of person who doesn't care what anybody thinks, but most people care. if somebody tells them that a helmet or a blinky looks funny they will rather die a terrible death than be caught wearing / using it. that's their choice.

  16. #16
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    Not that I go along with amber lights for day use, and I know I probably missed it, but what do amber street lights have to do with amber daytime lights?

  17. #17
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    Hmmm. Looks like Androgen got banned?


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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by scar View Post
    Hmmm. Looks like Androgen got banned?


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    About a week ago. Long overdue IMO!

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    Quote Originally Posted by jetboy23 View Post
    The reason white works at night is because it adds equal parts of red, green, and blue into the equation. This means the entire spectrum is included. Removing one or more only reduces output.
    Yes and no. If you are putting light from a white light source through a coloured filter to get the colour you want then you are reducing the output. If you are talking about LEDs where the light they output is already in the colour you want then there's no reduction.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by pigmode View Post
    Not that I go along with amber lights for day use, and I know I probably missed it, but what do amber street lights have to do with amber daytime lights?
    Not that I know anything but the "A" man has been silent for a while. Could be "Androworld" has revoked his rights to communicate with the world of "Lights and Night riding" ( * OR vise versa )

    Back to your main question; IMO, nothing.
    Amber makes a very visible daytime light as long as it is bright enough and has a good beam pattern. Still nothing beats a white *strobe ( *slow-flash or series pulse pause.. ) for daytime "see me" visibility. White LED's just have more lumen output. Still, would be nice if Santa would bring me a DiNotte 400A this year.

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    You do realize that 50 miles of different chemicals and molecules in the atmosphere is going to change the color of the lights. Do you think that the morning red sun is a different star then the bright white sun of noon?

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