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  1. #76
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    Francois, are you getting the Exposure Equinox? That would be interesting to see its beam and how it stacks up with thermal protection etc. That is a ton of output at 2000 lumens off a single cell. It will probably be a must to purchase a support cell to go along with the equinox.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Cygolite... It's very frustrating dealing with them since they don't want to send lights. They just do not want independent reviews of their lights.

    We might purchase them for the review but they don't like that either. Just strange.
    Yes, quite strange and IMHO highly suspicious. They obviously don't want to disclose real parameters...

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by cue003 View Post
    Francois, are you getting the Exposure Equinox? That would be interesting to see its beam and how it stacks up with thermal protection etc. That is a ton of output at 2000 lumens off a single cell. It will probably be a must to purchase a support cell to go along with the equinox.
    Yes, I'll follow up on this. The only gotcha is they do poorly on the claimed vs. actual lumen tests. They just always claim so high.

    fc
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  4. #79
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    Video on the 700 lumen lights.



    comments?
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  5. #80
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    Thanx for the video review Francois. Before you said it in your video, I was thinking the Serfas True 750, and MS new light as my top two picks. Same reasons as you already mentioned. The pure output of the Serfas True 750 with it's interchangeable battery, plus the fact it looks like it would dissipate the heat well with it's size.

    And the MS as their disclosing true and honest lumen claims which is a 180 from just a couple of years ago. The display feature is a front runner as well. If I missed it my apology's,,, but i'm guessing the battery is none interchangeable?? If interchangeable, those readouts would only be accurate with a designated aMh of what MS put in stock say 3100aMh, or 3400aMh?

    Of coarse my opinion may change as real world use would show what your review cant and that is how the beam quality is on the trails despite the tunnel beam shots. Based on those i'd give the L&M 700 best beam for my taste.

  6. #81
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    Thanks for that video Francois. Good to see how the lights stack up against each other in that self contained 600-800 category. Lots of lights to chose from in the video and I know you mentioned best display and best price etc but......

    If YOU can have only 2 of the lights in your video...which two would you have? And they can be two of the same. Where would your hard earned dollars go? And would your decision/selection change if it was for mtbr vs road? I mean taking everything into play from:

    A) stability in mounting system for use on rough terrain
    B) light output/beam pattern
    C) heat sinking/cooling
    D) runtime at various output levels
    E) price

  7. #82
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    It would be cool if we could see the beam shots for the gloworm XS with three flood lenses as well as the OEM setup(whatever combo it is) I think most of us will be mounting it to the bars anyways and would like it as a flood beam.

  8. #83
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    1200 lumen flashlight show 'n tell
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  9. #84
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    Good videos. Thank you very much to include Magicshine Eagle 600.
    Last edited by pabcor; 11-12-2013 at 02:59 PM.
    Looking for power lights?, see here

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by cue003 View Post
    Thanks for that video Francois. Good to see how the lights stack up against each other in that self contained 600-800 category. Lots of lights to chose from in the video and I know you mentioned best display and best price etc but......

    If YOU can have only 2 of the lights in your video...which two would you have? And they can be two of the same. Where would your hard earned dollars go? And would your decision/selection change if it was for mtbr vs road? I mean taking everything into play from:

    A) stability in mounting system for use on rough terrain
    B) light output/beam pattern
    C) heat sinking/cooling
    D) runtime at various output levels
    E) price
    I think my favorite is the Serfas 750. It measured brighter at 773. Good mounts, good cooling, charger included and spare optic included for $160.

    The other cool light is the Bontrager Ion 700. It's small and polished and very handy as a flashlight. And it's only $100.

    fc
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  11. #86
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    Francois, will you be posting updated lumen measurements of all of the lights using the new fan cooling system?

  12. #87
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    Nice set ups of all-in-one lights, the heavier weight of which brings up the issue of light mount solidity or the lack there of.

    I can see myself picking up a Lupine TL MiniMax which looks like an ideal throw-in-the-pack stop-and-go commuter light.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by stu06 View Post
    Francois, will you be posting updated lumen measurements of all of the lights using the new fan cooling system?
    No, just the Betty. I tested a few other lights and they are unaffected since it's only a 3 minute run. That fan system is really good for a full battery drain.

    The Betty had a couple other problems at lab #1. It was already warm at the start of the test and it had some light leakage since the port hole was too big. A few % of error on that light translates to hundreds of lumens since the numbers are so big.

    I do have a bunch of new data though and I'll need the graphs redone soon.

    fc
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  14. #89
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    On a good note, my backyard light studio may make a comeback. I tested some lights on it and it's still tells a good story.

    Here's the Cateye Volt 1200

    fc
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2014 Mtbr Lights Shootout-pb120104.jpg  

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  15. #90
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    Do you have the numbers on all three of the GloWorm products yet?? Or better yet ,,,the reviews??

  16. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    I do have a bunch of new data though and I'll need the graphs redone soon.
    Post or send me the data and i'll update the graphs.

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by indebt View Post
    Do you have the numbers on all three of the GloWorm products yet?? Or better yet ,,,the reviews??
    Not to sound pushy but this^

  18. #93
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    I can't wait for the new Gloworm XS review, but my best light to date is Serfas true 1500.

    The only problem is the weight of the head!!! I think the new Gloworm XS will be the light to get if it ever comes out.

  19. #94
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    Francois,

    I realize your shootout is mainly targeted at the big named brands, sold in local bike shops.

    In the Lights and Night Riding forum there are three very highly discussed inexpensive ($55 or less) Chinese import lights, available from online retailers. We all know their claimed output bares little resemblance to their actual output. and their batteries don't stack up to the claimed capacity. Another downside is the variability in quality that seems to depend on which seller the light is purchased from. Certainly their fit and finish and quality control don't stack up to the big boys.

    If you'll pardon the expression, where they would really shine is in the Lumens per Dollar chart. It would be fascinating to see the results from controlled standardized tests, and their tunnel beam shots compared to the others in the field.

    The three I'm referring to are the SolarStorm X2 (XM-L or XM-L2 version), the YINDING YD-2XU2, and the KD 2 x Cree XM-L2 U2. At $20 to $30 (light head only) and $30 to $55 for full kits with battery, they are game changers for entry level bike lights.

    It would be great to see your take on each, after giving them the once over. I'm sure there are member who would gladly loan them to you testing. Is there any chance of getting you to take a look at them?

  20. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_C View Post
    Francois,

    I realize your shootout is mainly targeted at the big named brands, sold in local bike shops.

    In the Lights and Night Riding forum there are three very highly discussed inexpensive ($55 or less) Chinese import lights, available from online retailers. We all know their claimed output bares little resemblance to their actual output. and their batteries don't stack up to the claimed capacity. Another downside is the variability in quality that seems to depend on which seller the light is purchased from. Certainly their fit and finish and quality control don't stack up to the big boys.

    If you'll pardon the expression, where they would really shine is in the Lumens per Dollar chart. It would be fascinating to see the results from controlled standardized tests, and their tunnel beam shots compared to the others in the field.

    The three I'm referring to are the SolarStorm X2 (XM-L or XM-L2 version), the YINDING YD-2XU2, and the KD 2 x Cree XM-L2 U2. At $20 to $30 (light head only) and $30 to $55 for full kits with battery, they are game changers for entry level bike lights.

    It would be great to see your take on each, after giving them the once over. I'm sure there are member who would gladly loan them to you testing. Is there any chance of getting you to take a look at them?
    I have gone the way of 2 YINDING YD-2XU2s.

    Ordered from fasttech but now I want to add in the rear MJ-818 Bike Tail light - (Tail Light with Y-Cable)

    I am trying to find a case that will allow me to just put 4 x 18650 batts in it (have batts and charger at home) and use this to run my lights.

    Any ideas?

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  22. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_C View Post
    Francois,

    I realize your shootout is mainly targeted at the big named brands, sold in local bike shops.

    In the Lights and Night Riding forum there are three very highly discussed inexpensive ($55 or less) Chinese import lights, available from online retailers. We all know their claimed output bares little resemblance to their actual output. and their batteries don't stack up to the claimed capacity. Another downside is the variability in quality that seems to depend on which seller the light is purchased from. Certainly their fit and finish and quality control don't stack up to the big boys.

    If you'll pardon the expression, where they would really shine is in the Lumens per Dollar chart. It would be fascinating to see the results from controlled standardized tests, and their tunnel beam shots compared to the others in the field.

    The three I'm referring to are the SolarStorm X2 (XM-L or XM-L2 version), the YINDING YD-2XU2, and the KD 2 x Cree XM-L2 U2. At $20 to $30 (light head only) and $30 to $55 for full kits with battery, they are game changers for entry level bike lights.

    It would be great to see your take on each, after giving them the once over. I'm sure there are member who would gladly loan them to you testing. Is there any chance of getting you to take a look at them?
    You already answered your own question. Doing any kind of controlled testing would not accomplish much since the light output varies so much from light to light with those units. The results wouldn't be representative or reproducible. The purpose of these reviews is to be able to purchase a light that at least meets the performance that it showed in the formal testing. Given the claims and acutal performance of some of the budget lights & batteries, I doubt those manufactures even want a formal test performed.

    Additionally, that Yingding light is far from one of the most popular budget lights. Barely anyone even owns one. There are way more people who own budget 3x units or the like.

  23. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Doing any kind of controlled testing would not accomplish much since the light output varies so much from light to light with those units. The results wouldn't be representative or reproducible. The purpose of these reviews is to be able to purchase a light that at least meets the performance that it showed in the formal testing. Given the claims and acutal performance of some of the budget lights & batteries, I doubt those manufactures even want a formal test performed.

    Additionally, that Yingding light is far from one of the most popular budget lights. Barely anyone even owns one. There are way more people who own budget 3x units or the like.
    I've followed the discussions fairly closely, and I don't think I've seen people noting brightness differences between branded units (other than XM-L vs XM-L2). There are several unbranded SS look-a-likes with different drivers and seller upgraded units. But the stock branded units from a good supplier (like FastTech) seem to be consistent between samples. I suppose Kir could really answer that, as he has SS units from several different suppliers.

    With lights at this price point, I really don't care about the difference between the claimed output and the actual output. We know that depending on the seller, the amount of exaggeration can range from somewhat inflated to ridiculous. I'd be interested in seeing the output and beam shots as compared to the bigger name brands/higher priced units.

    Who cares about the manufacturer's involvement. Francois has already stated that Cygo-Lite (one of the bigger players) has been unwilling to supply test samples, but he may purchase some to include in the shootout.

    Admittedly the Yinding is new to the scene (I think it showed up around July). But it is extremely highly discussed, and picking up speed in the number of people acquiring it.

    Yes more people have the 3x units. But how many of them have the SAME 3x light? Every Ebay seller seems to have a different body style, and different drivers. There is no trusted source supplier on those, so repeat-ability might be impossible. Though something like the Sky Ray S6 3T6 with that solid walled, mid body, LED mounting plate would be an above average representative for the 3x. So heck - yes - throw one of them into the mix too. It would be great to see their ratings and beam shots compared to the name brands.

    My main point is that many of us have opted for the cheap Chinese lights. It would be nice to see how they really stack up to the field. A ball park of their actual output would suffice. If nothing else, the beam shot comparison would prove interesting.

    Francois has tested the Best in Class lights. His impression of the bottom end would be interesting. He was surprised by the $100 Bontrager. He might be amazed by the offerings in the <$55 class.

  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelhmr View Post
    Additionally, that Yingding light is far from one of the most popular budget lights. Barely anyone even owns one. There are way more people who own budget 3x units or the like.

    This is a subjective statement...do you have anything to back up "Barely anyone even owns one. There are way more people who own budget 3x units or the like."? Sounds like we need a good poll to see.
    Geologist by trade...bicycle mechanic (former) by the grace of God!

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  25. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian_C View Post
    My main point is that many of us have opted for the cheap Chinese lights. It would be nice to see how they really stack up to the field. A ball park of their actual output would suffice. If nothing else, the beam shot comparison would prove interesting.

    Francois has tested the Best in Class lights. His impression of the bottom end would be interesting. He was surprised by the $100 Bontrager. He might be amazed by the offerings in the <$55 class.
    Agree 100%.
    Geologist by trade...bicycle mechanic (former) by the grace of God!

    2012 Specialized Stumpy EVO 29 HT

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