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  1. #1
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    2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout.

    I'm working on it now. I have a ton of lights and I'm getting a bunch more!!!

    It will be broken up in a Commuter and High End category.

    What do you guys want to see?

    Here's some sneak peak photos.

    - ok light
    - very flat beam pattern light
    - bright light

    fc
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout.-img_1773.jpg  

    2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout.-img_1753.jpg  

    2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout.-img_1751.jpg  


  2. #2
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    That bright light is... AWESOME!
    "I have one speed. I have one gear: Go." -- Charlie Sheen

  3. #3
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    I think you have done good job breaking it down in the past. I like the idea of "commuter" and "high end" for sure.
    Battery life on max is always what I'm looking for.

    What light is photo 3? Pretty much makes it daylight out.

    I'll be waiting to see the shootout.

    Thanks,
    Woody

  4. #4
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    I'd like to see comparisions between the china lights (bike ray, magicshine ect ) VS Niterider, Light and Motion ect. I'm torn between spending more on those non china lights or just dealing with the battery problems. Old L&M Arc is on it's last days and I need to make a informed decision.

  5. #5
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    OMG what is light #3? I just know that's gonna be way out of my price range but holy sh*t is that impressive.

    How soon will you have some results up? I need lights (yeah plural) soooooo bad
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  6. #6
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    Maybe you can separate the wireless into their own group as well otherwise you always do a great job.

    MB

  7. #7
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    I'd like to see more lights on bikes... I'd like to see budget lights that meet commuters' needs.

    All to often I see the familiar reflective patch pedaling in the dark without any lighting whatsoever.

    ...and don't leave out the tail light catagory!

  8. #8
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    I think grouping by light output would be helpful, but it doesn't need to be specific. Something like:

    Commuter/Be Seen: < 200 lumens
    General Riding: 201-1000 lumens
    Ah, my eyes!: 1000+ lumens

    And some sort of grouping by price would be great as well since budget is a limiting factor for almost everyone. As someone else said, light setting on high is all I care about.
    "Got everything you need?"

  9. #9
    KVW
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biscuit Pants View Post
    I'd like to see comparisions between the china lights (bike ray, magicshine ect ) VS Niterider, Light and Motion ect. I'm torn between spending more on those non china lights or just dealing with the battery problems. Old L&M Arc is on it's last days and I need to make a informed decision.

    I second this.

    I bought a Cygo-Lite Centauri 1000 OSP back in spring of this year and while it's been working well since then, I feel it's power is a bit wasted with it being so much flood and not enough throw. I would REALLY like to see a beam comparison between the Bike Ray IV and a high end cygo or nightrider.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post

    It will be broken up in a Commuter and High End category.

    What do you guys want to see?
    This sounds like a good idea at first glance but one person's idea of a commuter light is another persons MTB light.

    As for what I would like to see: Francois you have a very nice back yard but it lacks the distance needed to demonstrate the throw capability of the brighter lights. Ideally I would like the lights demonstrated in a flat trail/dirt environment or fire road. It has to be wide to demonstrate the width of the beam pattern but it also needs a good 200 to 150ft of distance...hopefully with some trees or brush near by to help judge depth. Also distance markers starting at 50ft. and continuing every 25ft. till about 150-200ft. ( for the throwers )

    I'm sure the commuters will want at least one beam shot on a road with at least one or two distance references which wouldn't be a bad idea.

    Now if you can't get a longer place for testing I suppose a way to compensate would be to place a *lux meter at the longest distance and give us that reading. Even better, three lux meters spaced out so wider beams get some credit. (*now if lux meters won't work at distance forget that idea. )

    Anyway, just my thoughts. I realize much of what I said won't be done but you did ask "Want do you want to see"?
    Last edited by Cat-man-do; 09-19-2011 at 01:19 PM.

  11. #11
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    We're getting to the point where beamshots are not all that useful anymore due to the limitations of digital photography and computer displays.

    I'd like to see a measurement at distance of how wide the brightspot (down to 50% of max beam brightness) is at several distances, say 25', 50' and 100' then how wide the beam is overall to 90% of brightness for the spill. I don't know if that's possible, but one ought to be able to do that with a spot light meter or an incident light meter, I would think.

    Those two pieces - the measurement and the beamshot would tell us a lot more about the beam and brightness and usability of the light.

    J.

  12. #12
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    Quit messing with us that last picture is taken during the day!!! If that light is less than $700 I'll be buy it in a heartbeat.

  13. #13
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    You did a very god job last time...the idea of "commuter" and "high end" is great...can't wait to see the new shootout.


    Thanks, Eran.

  14. #14
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    Maybe some ride reports from the top 3 or 5 lights that grab your attention in a good way.
    ONE SHOX, ONE GEAR, LOTS of FUN! www.TrailFu.com My Rides

  15. #15
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    I'm going to guess it's the Betty 12
    I'm interested to see the revised exposure 6 pack

  16. #16
    swag ho Administrator
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    Quote Originally Posted by mb323323 View Post
    Maybe you can separate the wireless into their own group as well otherwise you always do a great job.

    MB
    Wireless... took me a while to understand that.

    Cable Free or Flashlight style lights. I got it now.

    fc

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    This sounds like a good idea at first glance but one person's idea of a commuter light is another persons MTB light.

    As for what I would like to see: Francois you have a very nice back yard but it lacks the distance needed to demonstrate the throw capability of the brighter lights. Ideally I would like the lights demonstrated in a flat trail/dirt environment or fire road. It has to be wide to demonstrate the width of the beam pattern but it also needs a good 200 to 150ft of distance...hopefully with some trees or brush near by to help judge depth. Also distance markers starting at 50ft. and continuing every 25ft. till about 150-200ft. ( for the throwers )

    I'm sure the commuters will want at least one beam shot on a road with at least one or two distance references which wouldn't be a bad idea.

    Now if you can't get a longer place for testing I suppose a way to compensate would be to place a *lux meter at the longest distance and give us that reading. Even better, three lux meters spaced out so wider beams get some credit. (*now if lux meters won't work at distance forget that idea. )

    Anyway, just my thoughts. I realize much of what I said won't be done but you did ask "Want do you want to see"?
    Great point. My backyard hits the its limitations at around 1200 lumens. I started using a new location last year. I'll use it again if I can't find a better one.

    Exposure Six Pack Bike Light Review | Mountain Bike Review

    fc

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    Great point. My backyard hits the its limitations at around 1200 lumens. I started using a new location last year. I'll use it again if I can't find a better one.

    Exposure Six Pack Bike Light Review | Mountain Bike Review

    fc
    If you were to do light meter readings from a distance I would also recommend multiple readings too. I did a test in July on 4 similar xml light heads to measure light fall off from the center. Meter reading at 20m distance, readings from the center, at 1m either side of center and at 2m either side. The 4 similar lights all had different beam patterns and different size hot spots which reflected on my lux meter results.



    Also including beam patterns on a white board to also help compare similar lights beam patterns



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  19. #19
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    Can't wait to see this years offerings. As far as technical readings at distance and whatever else. That's a bit technongeek. A measurement isn't going to mean squat on the trail. A 500 HP car isn't squat if it doesn't get it to the ground but on paper its impressive.

    I think beam shots like last year possibly from behind the light source a bit back or different landscape to really showcase lights beam and throw would be more use full.

    Just a thought.
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  20. #20
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    The last picture should be in the holy **** category

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat-man-do View Post
    ....Now if you can't get a longer place for testing I suppose a way to compensate would be to place a *lux meter at the longest distance and give us that reading. Even better, three lux meters spaced out so wider beams get some credit. (*now if lux meters won't work at distance forget that idea. )
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    ....I'd like to see a measurement at distance of how wide the brightspot (down to 50% of max beam brightness) is at several distances, say 25', 50' and 100' then how wide the beam is overall to 90% of brightness for the spill. I don't know if that's possible, but one ought to be able to do that with a spot light meter or an incident light meter, I would think.....Those two pieces - the measurement and the beamshot would tell us a lot more about the beam and brightness and usability of the light. J.
    Quote Originally Posted by dereknz View Post
    If you were to do light meter readings from a distance I would also recommend multiple readings too. I did a test in July on 4 similar xml light heads to measure light fall off from the center. Meter reading at 20m distance, readings from the center, at 1m either side of center and at 2m either side. The 4 similar lights all had different beam patterns and different size hot spots which reflected on my lux meter results.
    It seems I struck a chord that others can resonate with. The problem I see with using lux meters is deciding just where to place them. Some people favor lights with wide close in beam patterns. That would require using the meter(s) used more close in and spread farther apart. Others like myself want distance readings to help judge which throw the farthest.. Yes, it would be nice to have but it would be tedious to set up and record to say the least.

    Francois, if you decide to include direct throw lux readings and don't mind playing with the distances a bit it would be quite awesome. ( Particularly with the brighter lights )
    Last edited by Cat-man-do; 09-20-2011 at 03:28 AM.

  22. #22
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    Comparing throw [for fast road riding] would be sweet.
    If you could rig up something on a pitch black country road/trail with distance markers.
    A bit like the Lupine beam shots.

  23. #23
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    I've been wait for this, keep up the good work.

  24. #24
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    ditto the ^. Beam shots on some kind of non-reflective surface (ie. not grass) with more distance - fire roads are excellent for this. Also, if you want to better reflect what the eyes see, drop the exposure time on the higher powered lights. I don't know if you're still using 6s, but I find that setting washes out the brighter beam patterns and doesn't accurately represent what my eyes see. If you want continuity between lights of different power, do all of them at one exposure then the mega lights at lower exposure times.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattthemuppet View Post
    ditto the ^. Beam shots on some kind of non-reflective surface (ie. not grass) with more distance - fire roads are excellent for this. Also, if you want to better reflect what the eyes see, drop the exposure time on the higher powered lights. I don't know if you're still using 6s, but I find that setting washes out the brighter beam patterns and doesn't accurately represent what my eyes see. If you want continuity between lights of different power, do all of them at one exposure then the mega lights at lower exposure times.
    Great insight!

    I've maintained my camera settings over the years.
    Camera Canon G9
    Setting full manual
    ISO 100
    Exposure 4 seconds
    Aperture F4.0
    Focus Manual
    White Balance Daylight

    It works well as it similutes what I see with my eyes. But with these lights over 2000 lumens, there is a washout effect on the grass.

    Dropping the exposure times to 2 seconds, etc. may prove really useful for comparing these ultra powerful lights.

    fc

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