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  1. #501
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    Quote Originally Posted by gticlay View Post
    Color me suprised. I thought mtbr was his job. Really.
    Add me to that list. People shouldn't be surprised though that not all lights get reviewed. Add to that you have to remember that MTBR makes money from ads from many bike light manufacturers and vendors. Supplying reviews of bike lights that don't place ads on their web site isn't going to be a high priority or make brownie points with the people paying for ads.

    For what it's worth, if someone wasn't paying me to review all those lamps I sure as heck wouldn't be in any kind of hurry.

  2. #502
    No. Just No.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RBrady View Post
    Pretty sure he works a day job and well as having a family gticlay. Don't let it get you down. Push away from the keyboard and ride your bike. It's good for you.
    I'm with you on the "don't let it get you down" part. We all like our bike lights, but the world won't stop turning on account of a few unfinished reviews. However, unless I'm misreading your posts I do think you may be missing out on the mtbr.com / Francois' day job connection that others are referring to.

    Cat-Man-Do ; it doesn't seem like the paid adverts have anything to do with it. For example, Gemini has ads running, and there's no Xera review yet.

    In the grand scheme of business operations that make up mtbr, it's more likely that some other items took the priority slot for now.

  3. #503
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    I actually don't understand the don't let it get you down comment. All I was saying is that I thought it was his day job, not that I'd depressed. I have my lights for the year - Xera's and perhaps an Olympia and/or the new X2, plus the Quazzle triple I built and the 7-up I'm finally finishing up...
    "It looks flexy"

  4. #504
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    photo 3 looks awesome

  5. #505
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    I know Francis received the demo lights at different times. In fairness of the test, he may have wanted to wait to have all the lights together before shooting. To compare a beam shot, you need to have all lights on deck available or you'll have to do the shoot all over again. And I think there were over 50 lights this year.

  6. #506
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini Lights View Post
    I know Francis received the demo lights at different times. In fairness of the test, he may have wanted to wait to have all the lights together before shooting. To compare a beam shot, you need to have all lights on deck available or you'll have to do the shoot all over again. And I think there were over 50 lights this year.
    I've been riding the Gemini Xera and other new lights. I should have results ready this week.

    francis

  7. #507
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    I've been riding the Gemini Xera and other new lights. I should have results ready this week.

    francis
    Looking forward to it.

  8. #508
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    The Jet F-1 is up. Very nice flashlight!!!!

    JetLites F-1 – 2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout | Mountain Bike Review

  9. #509
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    The Jet F-1 is up. Very nice flashlight!!!!

    JetLites F-1 – 2012 Mtbr Lights Shootout | Mountain Bike Review
    Nice light indeed. The "package" only comes with helmet mount. You have to pay more for bar mount The helmet mount looks solid.

    The Jet F-1 appears to be a "traditional" flashlight approach with a dedicated mount attached to it. There are many "flashlight" manufactures that are in this price range with same or more output, same battery choices, similar or better runtime, etc. The downside of these flashlight manufactures I am referring to is they don't have the dedicated mount but there are mounting systems that are out there that will start to blur the lines between dedicated bike systems and flashlight systems with 3rd party mounting options.

    Good choice with them using the Panasonic 3100mah batteries.

    JetLight's charger looks IDENTICAL to the Ultrafire WF-139.... hmmm

  10. #510
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    550 lumen from the Jet F-1 is a bit low, however. There should have been a 1 hr run time 'boost' option for 900 lumen, especially since you can swap out cells.

    Edit to add: If the Diablo mk3 can output 900 lumen and not over head this one should be able to as well. Dunno if they still are but they had the Mk3 for $220 a few days ago. The main problem with the Diablo, of course, is that the cell isn't swapable like on the F-1 and you have to buy their expensive piggyback. DOH! I should make my own product
    "It looks flexy"

  11. #511
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    If you check the lux measurments gticlay, the 550 lumen Jet is out performing the 975 lumen Diablo 71lux vs. 59lux. Beam pattern however may go to the Diablo.

  12. #512
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    Quote Originally Posted by indebt View Post
    If you check the lux measurments gticlay, the 550 lumen Jet is out performing the 975 lumen Diablo 71lux vs. 59lux. Beam pattern however may go to the Diablo.

    Holey Moley, you are right. I should have looked at that. Huge difference.
    "It looks flexy"

  13. #513
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    With just one spare battery, one would get 3+ solid hours of run time on full blast. Looks like a front runner on helmet torches if you like a reflector style beam pattern.

  14. #514
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    Quote Originally Posted by indebt View Post
    With just one spare battery, one would get 3+ solid hours of run time on full blast. Looks like a front runner on helmet torches if you like a reflector style beam pattern.
    I actually don't like that beam at all. The new xera has the best "flashlight head" style beam pattern - larger than a reflector pattern, very little artifact issues, but not too floody either. It mixes extremely well with my DIY 1100 lumen quazzle light.
    "It looks flexy"

  15. #515
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    Same here. I have both reflector and optic style lamps and for me i prefer optics. For those who prefer reflector, this Jet is one kick A$$ torch.

  16. #516
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    Francois, one question I have is what is the light output over the length of the discharge. Providing the proper voltage to the LED from a single cell requires the driver to boost the voltage rather than just control the current. This type of circuit is often rather inefficient and as a result many lights just supply battery voltage once it drops below a certain level. The result is that the light output slowly drops as the battery drains.
    Jim Harger
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  17. #517
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    Has everyone given up on this light shootout? It started over 3 months ago and still not finished!! I would like to see the DS-1300 reviewed close up, or perhaps the X2 (1200 lumens).

    I think the task at hand was too large to take on. It's a shame really, because that was one of the key components to why I highly regarded mtbr.com. GET THE REVIEWS UP!!! mtbR <--- R stands for REVIEW. The only two things I come here for is the mtb product reviews, light shootout and forums (okay maybe three). All else is just fluff!! The news articles are just regurgitated crap from other mtb websites. We need our meat and potatoes.

    Also good work on the website update. It was much needed.

  18. #518
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    I think it is dead, but francois did put up a few new lights a few weeks back. I too have been waiting for the DS-1300 review, along with the DS-500 taillight.

    Personally, I wonder how the manufacturers of the lights he didn't review reacted. I mean everyone sent him their wares in hopes to get their stuff promoted online. After all MTBR is a pretty active community and their review carries a lot of weight. For many manufacturers, this was to be their first showing in the shootout, so I wonder when next year comes around what is going to happen. Will everyone be eager to send in samples to MTBR to review? Even if this review is completed, many manufacturers have had a 3 month head start on the others so is it really fair.

    I know francois got bogged down with his life, perhaps he could have passed the ball over to someone else to finish up, I am sure there would have been plenty of people in his area that could have completed it for him and MTBR.

    - Roger

  19. #519
    35+ yrs and still not pro
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    I didn't see any review or even ramblings about the Trail Tech. Anyone know anything about these? Single LED 35mm at Trail Tech Home

  20. #520
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    Axa 50 Plus

    I just bought an Axa 50 Nano from work, I have to say it's an amazing light whether it be road biking at night or downhill, Dynamo powered at heart, 50 lux, usb charging(when not using the light). I can charge my iphone while I bike to work, it's amazing.

  21. #521
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    ****ing bright

  22. #522
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    Betcha light number 3 will keep you warm during cold winter rides!

  23. #523
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    Is a CREE light basically the same as Magic Shine?

  24. #524
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    don't want it too bright haha

  25. #525
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    Quote Originally Posted by bunnymun View Post
    Is a CREE light basically the same as Magic Shine?
    CREE is the brand name of the LED used in Magicshine's and the counterfeit Magicshine lights you are probably referring to. CREE does not build bike lights, they only sell the LED.
    Jim Harger
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  26. #526
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    What lights were #3?

  27. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by VAIronman View Post
    What lights were #3?
    NiteRider Pro 3000...

  28. #528
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    Good lights

  29. #529
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    Now that night season is upon us will some more testing commence?......Francois you out there?
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  30. #530
    sbd
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    All I can say is I'm glad I didn't wait for the reviews!

    I rode all season last winter with two Xeras on the bars. One optic, one reflector...ridiculous. Turned one off when I didn't need it, but then got lazy and found I could easily run both on high for my after work rides which are only 1-1.5 hours. Inexpensive, flawless performance, well made, light. Im sold.

  31. #531
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbd View Post
    All I can say is I'm glad I didn't wait for the reviews!

    I rode all season last winter with two Xeras on the bars. One optic, one reflector...ridiculous. Turned one off when I didn't need it, but then got lazy and found I could easily run both on high for my after work rides which are only 1-1.5 hours. Inexpensive, flawless performance, well made, light. Im sold.
    Yup, The Xera's are super impressive. I bought at pre intro price and glad I did ending up with that free 2n'd lighthead they offered. Wish he had done the final review on it but we know it's outstanding without that. I got a MS 856 on the bars and the combo is amazing. Plenty of lights got sent in that never received their final write-ups which was to bad. Overwhelming task to test everything I know.
    2013 Banshee Spitfire V2 650b

  32. #532
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    What I'd like to see

    I need lots of light. Prefer helmet mounted. I'd like to see what is out there without the limiting factor of price.

    I'll pay for daylight in the dark, so-to-speak

  33. #533
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phread View Post
    I need lots of light. Prefer helmet mounted. I'd like to see what is out there without the limiting factor of price.

    I'll pay for daylight in the dark, so-to-speak
    You can always mount up a giant light up there, but I'm guessing weight is also a factor. I've found that my preferred method of lighting is a super bright bar light lots of flood, and a lighter spot light on the helmet. Here's why I like that: the helmet light goes where you're looking, which "should" be down trail so you want it to throw a ways. The further it throws, the sooner you can see where you're going. This is especially helpful at high speeds, but not so much on tight, twisty, or wooded sections.

    FWIW, I run a modest 1600 lumen flood on the bars, and a 900 on the helmet. If money were no option and I was buying today, here's what I would go with:

    Bars: NiteRider Pro 3600


    Helmet: Baja Designs Strykr SL - 925 lumen (and use spot reflector)
    "Got everything you need?"

  34. #534
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    How 'bout that. I am considering the 3600, but for the helmet, I thought that the Xera LED might be a winner. 850 Lumens and only 52 gm light and 122 gm battery (helmet mounted).

  35. #535
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phread View Post
    How 'bout that. I am considering the 3600, but for the helmet, I thought that the Xera LED might be a winner. 850 Lumens and only 52 gm light and 122 gm battery (helmet mounted).
    Xera is a great light and I have a couple friends that run them. More of a wide beam pattern. Good choice for the helmet as you can put everything up there. Almost got one myself so I wouldnt have to deal with the wire into the pack.

    sent via tapatalk
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  36. #536
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phread View Post
    I need lots of light. Prefer helmet mounted. I'd like to see what is out there without the limiting factor of price.

    I'll pay for daylight in the dark, so-to-speak
    A piko on the helm (a 55 gram light producing about 900 measured lumens) combined with a broad wilma (2400 real lumens) or betty R (3600 lumens) on the bars does about that.

    Question is , why?

  37. #537
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    Could someone explain to me how my set up has me confused or something could be wrong. I'm new to running a good set up *IMO* and last night my helmet light seemed to be brighter or cut through the beam of my bar light. More information on this here: New Niterider Pro 1800 Race LED - Anyone?

  38. #538
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hutch3637 View Post
    Could someone explain to me how my set up has me confused or something could be wrong. I'm new to running a good set up *IMO* and last night my helmet light seemed to be brighter or cut through the beam of my bar light. More information on this here: New Niterider Pro 1800 Race LED - Anyone?
    Your 600 has more of a spot pattern, so the light is concentrated into a smaller spot. Don't sweat it, this is how it should be! But you should try pointing your head light further down trail, so you can see more of what's coming up.
    "Got everything you need?"

  39. #539
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing View Post
    Your 600 has more of a spot pattern, so the light is concentrated into a smaller spot. Don't sweat it, this is how it should be! But you should try pointing your head light further down trail, so you can see more of what's coming up.
    All right, thank you, I thought I was going nuts last night and I'm new to the spot/flood set up.

    How is your thoughts on that set up even if you don't run it given the 600 for spot the 1800 for flood?

  40. #540
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hutch3637 View Post
    All right, thank you, I thought I was going nuts last night and I'm new to the spot/flood set up.

    How is your thoughts on that set up even if you don't run it given the 600 for spot the 1800 for flood?
    That's a great setup, and more than enough light. I've got a similar setup with a MJ-872 1600 lumen on the bars and a MS900 on the helmet which puts out around 600 actual lumens. I point the helmet light about 50 feet down trail, and the bar light about 20 feet. This makes it so that I have a fully illuminated area in front of my bike I don't even need to move my head to see (like riding in the day time). And the helmet light points far down trail for fast riding and to let me know what is coming up. I've run lights in all different combinations and this works the best for me. YMMV.
    "Got everything you need?"

  41. #541
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing View Post
    That's a great setup, and more than enough light. I've got a similar setup with a MJ-872 1600 lumen on the bars and a MS900 on the helmet which puts out around 600 actual lumens. I point the helmet light about 50 feet down trail, and the bar light about 20 feet. This makes it so that I have a fully illuminated area in front of my bike I don't even need to move my head to see (like riding in the day time). And the helmet light points far down trail for fast riding and to let me know what is coming up. I've run lights in all different combinations and this works the best for me. YMMV.
    Again thank you for the help and nice set up as well for you. I'll try projecting them tonight like you said above as last night I had them set up pointing around the same feet of projection. The trails around here are tight wooded twisty single track so until I find a open trail I won't see the true potential of these lights.


    ........

    Side note: Has anyone done a test on the Niterider 1800? Last years 1500 came in at 1100 actual lumens.

  42. #542
    fc
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    The new testing is coming. I already have a ton of new lights and I will use the integrating spheres at Lezyne and Light and Motion factories.

    Sorry I ran out of steam last year. Just too many copies of the same light

    This year, I will hit it hard for a solid two months.

    fc

  43. #543
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    the new testing is coming. I already have a ton of new lights and i will use the integrating spheres at lezyne and light and motion factories.

    Sorry i ran out of steam last year. Just too many copies of the same light

    this year, i will hit it hard for a solid two months.

    Fc
    welcome back!
    "It looks flexy"

  44. #544
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    Quote Originally Posted by francois View Post
    The new testing is coming. I already have a ton of new lights and I will use the integrating spheres at Lezyne and Light and Motion factories.

    Sorry I ran out of steam last year. Just too many copies of the same light

    This year, I will hit it hard for a solid two months.

    fc
    Looking forward to your reviews Francois. Cheers!!!

  45. #545
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    Wow, it's been a year?

    Go Giants!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Happy you are available to do this.

    MB

  46. #546
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    Nice work on this thread

  47. #547
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    I have all kinds of lights but lately I've been riding with just an easy2led 3x XPG setup on my helmet. It's plenty of light and I've got an even brighter light engine coming that should take it over the top.
    "It looks flexy"

  48. #548
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    OK, ...but what lights?

    ...I dusted off my old school Niterider Firestorm and found that either the bulb, ballast or electronics is fried.
    Niterider says that I would be better off going with new technology, for serious/technical nocturnal trail riding.


    And, there are other choices out there.

    I was looking at the Niterider Pro 1800 LED but concerned about the burn time and actual brightness.
    The Light and Motion Seca 1700 Enduro looks promising, but it's a pricier unit and I am not sure about the mounting (helmet and/or bar).

    Whattaya recomend?
    Brightest, longest burn time, solid mounting ...I want it all.
    ...gabba-gabba-hey!

  49. #549
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    Quote Originally Posted by doof View Post
    ...I dusted off my old school Niterider Firestorm and found that either the bulb, ballast or electronics is fried.
    Niterider says that I would be better off going with new technology, for serious/technical nocturnal trail riding.


    And, there are other choices out there.

    I was looking at the Niterider Pro 1800 LED but concerned about the burn time and actual brightness.
    The Light and Motion Seca 1700 Enduro looks promising, but it's a pricier unit and I am not sure about the mounting (helmet and/or bar).

    Whattaya recomend?
    Brightest, longest burn time, solid mounting ...I want it all.
    You asked for it!!!!!! Check out Gretna Bikes, if you can handle the sticker shock, either a Lupine Betty R,,,,,,it will knock your socks off literally, but is the best performing light in the market 3600 measured lumens. Or to ease the pocket book a little,,, the Wilma with 2400 measured lumens and super long burn times with the 11.2Ah Smartcore battery. I'm ordering two Betty R's myself any day now as i will be able to control both my lamp heads with a single wireless remote. Can't wait!!!

  50. #550
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    Agreed. Lupine Betty is the end all be all of lights.

    J.

  51. #551
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    Quote Originally Posted by indebt View Post
    You asked for it!!!!!! Check out Gretna Bikes, if you can handle the sticker shock, either a Lupine Betty R,,,,,,it will knock your socks off literally, but is the best performing light in the market 3600 measured lumens. Or to ease the pocket book a little,,, the Wilma with 2400 measured lumens and super long burn times with the 11.2Ah Smartcore battery. I'm ordering two Betty R's myself any day now as i will be able to control both my lamp heads with a single wireless remote. Can't wait!!!
    No wonder you're indebt!
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  52. #552
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    Need to add the Cygolite TridenX 1100 to the shootout. I just got mine yesterday and have already ridden it in the dark. I'm super impressed by its light output and run times (I have the Xtra version).

    Not too bad a price either (I got mine for $270) though they list at $350.

  53. #553
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    The lupine betty with the 17,5 Ah battery will be the brightest and longest lasting solution, but before buying it, have a look at it in real live!

    It is insanely brigth, your old firestorm produced about 350/400 lumen , the betty 3600 lumen!

    So before spending money, ask yourself: do I need more light on my bike than on a car?


    A single light is also less efficient than a combination helmet/ bars!

  54. #554
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nothing's impossible View Post
    The lupine betty with the 17,5 Ah battery will be the brightest and longest lasting solution, but before buying it, have a look at it in real live!

    It is insanely brigth, your old firestorm produced about 350/400 lumen , the betty 3600 lumen!

    So before spending money, ask yourself: do I need more light on my bike than on a car?


    A single light is also less efficient than a combination helmet/ bars!
    No-no.
    The Betty is a little puppy compared to Full-Beam's latest toy, the X12.
    Full Beam - High Performance Bike Lights

    As I heard NASA ordered a couple for their new prototype rockets...

  55. #555
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    That X-12 is a monster in output. Would only be a bar light though unless your a football player with a 23" neck. That's just crazy!!

  56. #556
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    Quote Originally Posted by radirpok View Post
    No-no.
    The Betty is a little puppy compared to Full-Beam's latest toy, the X12.
    Full Beam - High Performance Bike Lights

    As I heard NASA ordered a couple for their new prototype rockets...
    That is one damn bright light. One up-man points earned.

    I figure the battery for these must weigh about 4 lbs. Down side is I'd have to spend more than I paid for my FS bike to get one.

    Oh, Oh! I almost forgot the kicker question: Does it run on a MagicShine battery?

  57. #557
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    4500 lumen, that is a crazy lot of light, but i guess you will need to look twice to notice the difference between 3600 and 4500 lumen, it's not a puppy vs a dog, it's just a bit more insane!


    Just to put things in perspective, older 55 watt halogen bulbs strugle to reach 1000 lumen output, and older reflector optics with a diffuser lens have an efficiency under 27%,so a lot of cars on the road have a total OTF output under 600 lumen, HID bulbs produce 2800-3200 lumen, and modern projector optics have an efficiency a bit over 50%, ..






    Ok, they don't spill half of the light into the air, but carligths and windscreens seldom are clean, ....

  58. #558
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    Both mentioned above ale little puppies compared to Czech project Zora Scorpion that delivers astonish 6150 lumens (output, ANSI) in 6 XM-L/U2 version with special copper PCB or 4850 lumens with standard (alu?) PCB. The English version of the pages is not finished yet (partly only), but all important information is understandable from the tables and graphs (e.g. comparisons with Lupine Betty14).

  59. #559
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Both mentioned above ale little puppies compared to Czech project Zora Scorpion that delivers astonish 6150 lumens (output, ANSI) in 6 XM-L/U2 version with special copper PCB or 4850 lumens with standard (alu?) PCB. The English version of the pages is not finished yet (partly only), but all important information is understandable from the tables and graphs (e.g. comparisons with Lupine Betty14).
    AWESOME!....Looking forward to the English website and the beam shots.

  60. #560
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    I would wait for next years 10 000 lumen version, that must be the bare minimum for mountainbiking!
    And in case off a calamity you don't need a cellphone anymore, you can just point your light into the sky in SOS mode and the people from the international spacestation will alert the earth ;-)

  61. #561
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    Surely 10,000 lumens is minimum for mountain biking, so I always wonder, how can I ride with 700 OTF lumens on the handlebar plus 500 OTF lumens on the helmet...

  62. #562
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Both mentioned above ale little puppies compared to Czech project Zora Scorpion that delivers astonish 6150 lumens (output, ANSI) in 6 XM-L/U2 version with special copper PCB or 4850 lumens with standard (alu?) PCB. The English version of the pages is not finished yet (partly only), but all important information is understandable from the tables and graphs (e.g. comparisons with Lupine Betty14).
    Hey Peter that light looks great.
    At that price I might just consider buying two of those!
    And Francois, if you are listening, you just absolutely gotta get your hands on one of these for your next shootout

  63. #563
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    OTF? What does that mean?

  64. #564
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    Quote Originally Posted by kerryn View Post
    OTF? What does that mean?
    Out The Front. OTF lumens refers to the net or "real" lumen output after all losses from optics, thermal buildup etc are taken into account.
    This is opposed to the theoretical max emitter output that the vast majority of light manufacturers quote.

  65. #565
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    In general I don't need 10 000 lumen, 560 and 360 lumen do the trick!

    Here I rode with the piko at the bars at 900 lumen (the camera tends to need a lot of light) and 560 lumen on the helmet.Most people ride a lot less light!


  66. #566
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    One think I've noticed is that when it's wet I need more lumen to see the same as when it's dry. When it's raining, I need way more lumen than when it's just wet. When it's a little foggy, it doesn't matter how much you have, it's just hard to see I've found that mounting the light up higher on my helmet helps in the rain/fog, especially with a visor on my helmet.
    "It looks flexy"

  67. #567
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    I like riding bikes in the dark




    from Jay Buthman on Vimeo.





    ***

  68. #568
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    Scar, that is a cool video!

    But for me, I wouldn't take it as fast on a first run, no matter how much lumen!
    And after a few runs, knowing what 's coming, I wouldn't need more light than I normallly run!


    about meteo,

    in the fog I need to ride slow, 300 lumen down on the fork is ideal.
    In the mud i ride a bit slower to, I most like the handlebar pointed down as a closby flood (not to brigth to avoid hotspots) and the helmet as a main lightsource providing a big brigth flood. i didn't profit yet from more light than 1500 combined lumen.

    In dry condttions I use both lights pointed far away, in general more power on the handlebar, the full 1800 lumen is nice, but it's not making me ride faster than 1000 combined lumen.

  69. #569
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    Since I got my TridenX 1100 on the bars with my MityCross 480 on my helmet that I simply can't peddle fast enough any more to warrant more powerful lights.

    I may swap out my 480 on the helmet for the MityCross 800 but I see no urgency in that need.

  70. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titus Maximus View Post
    No wonder you're indebt!
    Lol,, actually i'm doing OK Titus Maximus, but you are right,,,, i do spend to much money on bike lights.

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