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  1. #1
    swag ho Administrator
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    mtbr Shine-Off lights shootout is here.

    Do you night ride with this light?



    or this light?



    Lights shoot-out. Y'all are the first to see it. Check out the hi-res photos.
    http://www.mtbr.com/spotlight/lightshootout/


    francis aka francois

  2. #2
    Sweat is just fat crying.
    Reputation: Finch Platte's Avatar
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    Hey, frankis...

    Wudja have for lunch?

    fp

    Looks like PJ's got a good shed goin' on over them tools...
    Last edited by Finch Platte; 01-22-2004 at 10:01 PM. Reason: Wanted to insult PJ
    Mountain Biking Is Not A Crime stickers, free! (You pay postage. PM me for details.)

  3. #3
    Gone riding
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    Get over to Homemade Lighting Systems now!!

    Very good, you guys have obviously put a lot of effort into these tests!! Thanks guys!! It's intersting to compare the different beam widths, shapes and distances, not just the lightoutput. Obviously different beams have their place in different styles of terrain, I guess it just depends on your riding style and surroundings. It would be great if we could measure the light 'colour' for the non HID stuff, although I guess it's pretty obvious by just looking at the images. Well done!

    Cheers, Dave.

  4. #4
    Still chuggin' along
    Reputation: kpicha's Avatar
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    Wow guys! Great job! There's a ton of great info there and its put together well. I'm curious as to how old some of the lighting systems are or at least what year models were tested. Thanks for all of your hard work!

    Cheers,
    Kristina

  5. #5
    beer thief
    Reputation: radair's Avatar
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    Nice work, francois & crew! Best comparison I've seen yet.

    I guess I can remain content with my Jet.

  6. #6
    Do It Yourself
    Reputation: Homebrew's Avatar
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    Nice job MTBR!!!

    Nice comparison. A couple comments though. It might have been nice to compare some of the cheaper NR systems (Evolution, Head Trip, etc). It would have shown how lousey and expensive they really are compared with other brands.

    Also, the Jet Phantom only comes in 12W and 20W, not 15W like is listed in your chart. From the picture, I'm pretty sure it's a 20W. It might have been nice to see both the 12W and the 20W versions of this light as well.

  7. #7
    Skinny legged XC geek
    Reputation: pedalAZ's Avatar
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    L&M ARC

    best light for weight weenies!

    However, the heavy Turbocat S47 seems to throw a beam as wide as the HID's but with a nice warm tone and more ground feature contrast.

  8. #8
    Loose Nut Behind d' Wheel
    Reputation: Lucky's Avatar
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    Typo?

    Lights shoot-out. Y'all are the first to see it. Check out the hi-res photos.
    http://www.mtbr.com/spotlight/lightshootout/


    francis aka francois[/QUOTE]


    On the Lume Vado, the system weight is less than the battery weight alone - is that right?

    Good data - nice resource to have on the site.

    Kathy :^)
    Look where you want to go. This is as true in life as it is in mtbiking.

  9. #9
    On MTBR hiatus :(
    Reputation: Speedub.Nate's Avatar
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    I guess the good news...

    ...for those of us suffering the "inadequacy" of older lighting systems (Me? Still running a 28w Nightrider Classic dual beam plus a 10w NR Evolution on the helmet) is resting on the assurance that when we're riding with an HID equipped crew, we can safely shut our old, steam powered lights off and bask in the blue HID glow that spilth over!

    Nice work, great pics!

  10. #10
    swag ho Administrator
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    Yes thanks, the weights for the lume lights were all wrong. It's correct now at:
    battery weight to 544, system weight to 762 grams
    This is the same for both HID and xenon models.

    I had the most fun with the lume 'narrow' HID. It was just wayy too bright. The most awesome spotlight ever. I would point it at trees or ravines hundreds of yards away and I can see what's going on!


    francois

  11. #11
    swag ho Administrator
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    Quote Originally Posted by pedalAZ
    best light for weight weenies!

    However, the heavy Turbocat S47 seems to throw a beam as wide as the HID's but with a nice warm tone and more ground feature contrast.

    Yep, the turbocat beam pattern is tops. Battery doesn't last that long at full blast. But for bombing down unfamiliar trails, that will be sweet. Put one of those L&M or Lume HIDs on the helmet and I might actually fall in love with night riding.

    francois

  12. #12
    cut like the fog.
    Reputation: bones's Avatar
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    Great comparison guys! I love my JET, 3 seasons and counting


    b.
    [SIZE=3][SIZE=2]
    [/SIZE]
    [/SIZE]
    [SIZE=3][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/SIZE]

  13. #13
    Appalachian Singletrack'n
    Reputation: Endomaniac's Avatar
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    Great write up thanks allot. I wish I could have seen this a few months ago though.
    I'm moderatly happy with my Night Rider HID.
    If the nice folks at TurboCat would make a sweet CNC'd HID they would have my money.

  14. #14
    Rolling
    Reputation: lidarman's Avatar
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    You guys are having too much fun

    I wish I could have been there for that.

    BTW what does "metering mode: evaluative" mean if the camera is in manual with fixed aperature and shutter delay??

  15. #15
    Single Speed Junkie
    Reputation: crux's Avatar
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    So where is the Lupine Edison in the mix?

  16. #16
    That Waters Guy
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    Idea! These were all brand new lights?

    I should post two .jpegs of a new NiteRider HID and one that's a year old.

    The year old one (which really hasn't been used all that much) is much more yellow and noticeably (but not hugely objectionably) less bright.

    Rolland

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation: brianc's Avatar
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    Yo Lidar.....Evaluative

    Quote Originally Posted by lidarman
    I wish I could have been there for that.

    BTW what does "metering mode: evaluative" mean if the camera is in manual with fixed aperature and shutter delay??

    good question.

    my guess is that the default output from the cheap little camera is not smart enough to figure out that the metering is not actually being used. It's stuck listing the same mode that PJ last used. my guess to give him a balpark setting for what Ap and Shut to use.

    He needs to get a better camera. and give this stupid one to me. =)

    b

  18. #18
    Trail rider and racer
    Reputation: Trevor!'s Avatar
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    Fantastic work!

    What great work indeed. I really need to sell my Light system and move into the 21st century with something a little brighter..


    Its summer here so I'll have to say some $$$ and get a new HID system ready for winter and night rides.

    Trevor!

  19. #19
    swag ho Administrator
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    Quote Originally Posted by crux
    So where is the Lupine Edison in the mix?
    Good suggestion... Lupine Edison 10 .... $700 HID light from germany. Why didn't I know about that?

    I will contact them this week and get a lightset from them. We are expecting a couple more lightsets from Topeak and others so if Lupine can send lights, we can do another photoshoot to include them.

    francois

  20. #20
    swag ho Administrator
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Sagebrush Slug
    I should post two .jpegs of a new NiteRider HID and one that's a year old.

    The year old one (which really hasn't been used all that much) is much more yellow and noticeably (but not hugely objectionably) less bright.

    Rolland
    That's the first time I've heard of that. Interesting. Yes, share photos if you can. I'll ask manufacturers if this is expected of HIDs.

    francois

  21. #21
    swag ho Administrator
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    one really good suggestion...

    For the helmet and bar light combo beam patterns, we didn't quite do it right. We aimed both lights on the same spot on the ground.

    Helmet lights are generally more focused and long range. We should have aimed the helmet lights higher to allow the lights to shine farther and show more of the trail.

    Maybe on the reshoot...

    francois

  22. #22
    Fartographer
    Reputation: Photo-John's Avatar
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    No problem.

    I'll sell it to you, my friend, for only $4000. It'll be going up in value soon, I'm sure. So you'd better jump on my offer.
    Back of the camera, back of the pack.

  23. #23
    Fartographer
    Reputation: Photo-John's Avatar
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    Evaluative Metering

    Quote Originally Posted by lidarman
    I wish I could have been there for that.

    BTW what does "metering mode: evaluative" mean if the camera is in manual with fixed aperature and shutter delay??
    Lidarman-
    Most Canon SLRs have three main metering modes, spot, center-weighted, and evaluative. Spot meters off a small area in the very center of the focal plane, center-weighted meters off of a combination the center spot and a larger area about half the area of the whole imaging area. Evaluative uses the camera's built-in database and the metering sensor to evaluate the lighting and give the best meter reading based on what's in the database.

    Since I'm shooting in full manual mode, I still choose the shutter speed and aperture. And once I chose them, they remained the same for all of the photos. I only use the meter to decide on the exposure. And that exposure was set using a light that we thought represented an average brightness. After I set the aperture and shutter speed, everything stayed the same.

    Also, "shutter delay" isn't accurate. You don't set shutter delay. With the EOS-1D, there really isn't any "shutter delay". It's shutter speed that you control. That's the amount of time the shutter is open and the sensor (or film) is collecting light. For these photos it was open 1.6 seconds.

    Hope that answers your question.
    Back of the camera, back of the pack.

  24. #24
    Fartographer
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    Yup

    I think I've had my Jet lights since the about May of 2000. I just want some lighter batteries.
    Back of the camera, back of the pack.

  25. #25
    There's no app for this.
    Reputation: JimC.'s Avatar
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    moi aussi

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John
    I think I've had my Jet lights since the about May of 2000. I just want some lighter batteries.
    Had mine that long, just picked up a new 20W flood for $15 CAD from a bargoon bin and had a new battery made up locally, but yep, heavy sumbiches.

    Jim at Jet tells me he's a coupla months away from intro'ing the new Jet el blasto HID light.

    Jim

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