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  1. #1
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    MagicShine 1400 Deconstructed


















    XPE pod outer diameter

    MS900 vs MS1400

    MS900 vs MS1400

    MS900 vs MS1400

    Pod ends threaded and removable.

    Optics/reflector P7 retainer ring interal and external threaded. Reflector rim threaded and screws
    into retainer ring.

    XPE optic

    XPE optic

    XPE optic retainer ring inner diameter

    MS900 vs MS1400



    XPE Pod, ring, slug, xpe

    XPE Pod, ring, slug, xpe

    Remote Switch Aluminum Body. Cap housing Aluminum threaded. Seperate driver component

    3x XPG Carclo 10417 860mA

    MS900 P7 High

    MS1400 Dual XPE only High

    MS1400 P7 only High

    MS1400 P7 and dual XPE High
    Last edited by odtexas; 03-19-2010 at 09:50 PM.

  2. #2
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    Thanks, Texas, I wuz wondering about that mouse eared light. I enjoyed the disassemble. How was soldering, swarf, your over all impression.

  3. #3
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    No swarf. Solder was first rate. Thing is extremely well sealed. Thermal paste was a little thin on the xpe slug. Must desolder to remove and add more paste. PITA. Probably not necessary, but I already had the thing apart.
    It is much more complicated than the MS900.
    Body seems to be single unit cast aluminum. Pods connect via 18 mm by 2.5 mm truss. Not going to break them off very easily.
    Last edited by odtexas; 03-19-2010 at 10:09 PM.

  4. #4
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    Thanks odtexas for doing all those pics, it does look like good value and not as big as I thought it would be. Is the inductor bonded to the pcb or just soldered with no suport like in the 900?

  5. #5
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    Thanks very much for this! Any measurements of drive current?
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  6. #6
    GeoMan
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    Great thread and effort! Very impressed.

    Appreciate it,

    Geo
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  7. #7
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    Yeti - Inductor is about twice as big and is still unsupported. A blob of silicone might be nice for support. It does feel alot more solid than the MS900 inductor.

    Znomit - Forgot to grab currents when I had it all apart. I am hoping to switch out the XPE optics so will be taking it apart again real soon. Will get current readings at that time if someone doesn't beat me to it.

    No worries Geoman. This light is very well thought out. Quality control is top notch. Looks like a real PITA to assemble and wire. Heads and shoulders over the MS900.

    Mount is different material/plastic, and design of mount looks stronger.

    Only shortcomings was small amount of thermal paste on XPE stars.
    Allen set screws on bottom of pods, control pod rotation, both stripped out.
    The cast aluminum is just not strong enough for that few number of thread. Not a big deal if you aren't planning on taking the thing apart alot. But I could see that maybe someone might recieve one with the pods being a little loose in their collars and the customer would be unable to tighten. I just pushed some JB Weld into the set screw hole, let it set a little, and then put the set screws in through the JB Weld. Holding just fine.
    Water can get in through the small opening between the main body and the XPE pods where the wires leave main body and run to XPE stars. Only way to truly seal it would be to silicone the small rubber elbows which the wires are run in.
    If it wasn't for those little wire pass throught this light would be water tight to a couple of meters. All optics and pods have o-ring seals.
    Last thing would bet the star retaining rings are plastic. MS900 used alumimum rings that threaded in to hold the stars down. Was mildly surprised to see plastic ones in the light. Not a problem for your average user of course, but the aluminum ones would aid in thermal transfer from the front surface of the star to the light body.
    I still think this light has more than enough surface/transfer area to keep it cool.

    Fit and Finish is excellent. I was impressed. Like the sealed battery unit as well.
    And it is the same battery as the MS900. Just a new and improved housing.

  8. #8
    GeoMan
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    Quote Originally Posted by odtexas
    No worries Geoman. This light is very well thought out. Quality control is top notch. Looks like a real PITA to assemble and wire. Heads and shoulders over the MS900.

    Fit and Finish is excellent. I was impressed. Like the sealed battery unit as well.
    And it is the same battery as the MS900. Just a new and improved housing.
    We had to establish a new production line to handle the added complexities of the Magicshine 1400 assembly. QC is being watched very carefully.

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  9. #9
    Rolling
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    What is the capacity of that battery pack?

  10. #10
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    Battery is a 7.4 v lithium ion 2p2s. Capacity probably around 4400 mAh if using cheap 18650s.
    Best guess on optics are the Carclo 10197, Luxeon 1 20mm.
    Can someone confirm height of those Carclo optics. Can't find a data sheet on it. I have never used them in my builds and don't have any on hand to measure either.

  11. #11
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    Spill and penetration look great on that last photo- not bad at all.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by mojojojoaf
    Spill and penetration look great on that last photo- not bad at all.
    With just the P7 on it doesn't seem to have the punch of the 900. Is it a different reflector?

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  13. #13
    www.hahntronix.com
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    odtexas,

    Very nice initial dissection of the light.

    A few things I'm curious about, and some requests.

    Are there separate drivers for the XPEs? The could be hiding in the little black ring the XPE thermal clad board was attached to.

    What gauge wire runs into the main light body. The original magicshine used something like 22 gauge which is kind of thin, in my opinion. Can you tell if the wire is PVC or Silicone coated? Based on where the mode switch connects to the cable, I'd guess there are at least 3 and maybe 4 separate wires in the cable that runs into the main body of the light. My hunch is they are using thin wire again. Easy to break, and fatigues easily after a lot of flexing.

    It looks like there is only one inductor on the main electronics board. Can you tell if that board is only for driving the P7 or does it drive the XPEs as well?

    Does the battery come apart easily? I'm curious what the protection circuit board looks like and if the Ii-Ion cells look like they are good quality.

    Request #1: If your camera has a macro function, could you take a close up of both sides of the main electronics board. I'm curious to see if they used the same 6 pin driver chip with an external mosfet transistor, like they used in the original magicshine.

    Request #2: If you haven't siliconed down your inductor yet, could you bend it a bit one way and then the other when taking pictures of that side of the board? It would make more detail visible.

    Request #3: If there are separate drives for the XPEs a picture of one of those would be nice.

    Oh, don't use something like silicone window caulking to mount your inductor. As it cures it gives off a vinegar-like smell that comes from acetic acid. The acid can eat away your circuit board. Use a neutral-cure silicone if you can fine one. Something that claims it is good for coating electronics is best.

    Or if you intend to use some artica alumina expoxt adhesive to make better thermal connections inside the light, that would also probably work fine for holding the inductor in place.

    Thanks much,

    Mark
    Last edited by mhahn@hvc.rr.com; 03-20-2010 at 05:06 PM.
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  14. #14
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    Znomit -
    Reflectors are different.

    Left is MS1400 right is MS900
    MS1400 15.3 mm at star base external diameter to 33.21 mm at flange base
    MS900 17.94 mm at star base external diameter to 35.85 mm at flange base
    Both 19.75 mm high
    mA gets interesting though
    MS900 high 2.36 amps P7
    MS1400 high 1.95 amps P7 .12 amps low
    MS1400 XPE high .62 amps .02 low
    MS1400 XPE and P7 high, all on, XPE .52 amps, P7 1.71 amps
    Interesting isn't it??

  15. #15
    Rolling
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    ....................

  16. #16
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    mhahn -

    Are there separate drivers for the XPEs? The could be hiding in the little black ring the XPE thermal clad board was attached to.

    Can't tell if there are two drivers in there or not. The P7 star and driver are stacked together and can only be removed if all wires to both XPE pods are removed. There is room in there for components on the back side of the board and all wires go into the space between the back of the P7 star and driver.

    What gauge wire runs into the main light body.

    20 or 22 gauge silicone.
    Wire running to XPE pods probably 28 or 30 gauge. Very thin and easy to break. Another reason to not recommend taking it apart unless you are careful and good at soldering.

    Based on where the mode switch connects to the cable, I'd guess there are at least 3 and maybe 4 separate wires in the cable that runs into the main body of the light. My hunch is they are using thin wire again. Easy to break, and fatigues easily after a lot of flexing.

    Can't tell how many wires come out of the main cable since it exits into that small space I didn't get into.

    It looks like there is only one inductor on the main electronics board. Can you tell if that board is only for driving the P7 or does it drive the XPEs as well?
    Back side of board is a mystery.

    Does the battery come apart easily? I'm curious what the protection circuit board looks like and if the Ii-Ion cells look like they are good quality.

    Yes. The housing is actually aluminum. Threaded end cap. Guessing same exact battery as MS900



    Request #1: If your camera has a macro function, could you take a close up of both sides of the main electronics board. I'm curious to see if they used the same 6 pin driver chip with an external mosfet transistor, like they used in the original magicshine.

    Top of driver only. 2 black rectangle components have MCC SK548 on them.

    Request #2: If you haven't siliconed down your inductor yet, could you bend it a bit one way and then the other when taking pictures of that side of the board? It would make more detail visible.

    What I can get of the board






    Request #3: If there are separate drives for the XPEs a picture of one of those would be nice.

    Couldn't get that one.

    Hope some of that helps.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by odtexas
    MS1400 XPE and P7 high, all on, XPE .52 amps, P7 1.71 amps
    Interesting isn't it??
    So each XPE is putting out 160lm and the P7 500lm ...

    So ~800lm vs 670 for the 900. Bigger porkies.
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  18. #18
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    There is quite a lot going on in that switch, does this thing have lots of strobe modes?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails MagicShine 1400 Deconstructed-magicshine1400096-small-.jpg  


  19. #19
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    No strobe modes. 4 little colored leds.
    First push XPE pods on
    Second push P7 on XPE off
    Third push all on.
    Holding button down in any mode causes gradual dimming.
    Neat feature if you are into that sort of thing.

  20. #20
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    Nice pull down Odtexas , thanks , man you must have been fast getting hold of one .

    battery pack looks a huge improvement .

    It is not to my liking the mickey mouse ears but I guess it will sell in its thousands like its brother .

    cant they make a light that does what it says on the tin lumen wise .

    We should have a special section on here for comercial light strip downs and testing maybe that would scare the big boys in to telling the truth .

    bit of extra space could you slot in a small driver and push the xpes harder

  21. #21
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    odtexas,

    Thank you very much for the pictures. You've saved me from wasting $90 and ordering a litehead one from the SingleTrack store. I wanted to see if the new light had a better designed driver than the magicshine.

    Your first picture of the P7 driver has convinced me that they are using nearly the same circuit that drove the magicshine light. The driver chip is most likely a sm5241, I can make out "524*" on the 6 pin chip visible in the bottom center of your first photo. Can you confirm that the part is labeled 5241?

    The transistor labeled Q1, on the PCB to the right of the SM5241, is most likely a mosfet in a SOT23-3 package. The magicshine used an 8 pin SOIC. I've used SOT23-3 mosfets in LED drivers I've designed, so that might be OK. But it is typically easier to find a low Ron (on resistance) mosfet in a SOIC package. A low Ron mosfet will not get as hot as one that has a higher Ron. Low Ron mosfets are typically more expensive than high Ron ones. Have you tried holding your finger on Q1 while the light is running? Be careful, it may be hot enough to burn you. If it feels painfully hot, it probably won't last a long time. It will run hotter the lower your battery voltage is.

    And to the left of the SM5241are two resistors labeled R100 and R500. They sure look like 0805 sized resistors, and can't be rated for more than 1/8 a watt (could be as low as 1/10 a watt). Gee, that's the same size and same value resistors used in the magicshine. So this light has the same problem. These resistors, used to sense current, have the same amount of current flowing thru the two of them wired in parallel as the P7 has running thru it. Power is calculated by the formula Current squared times Resistance. Assuming they run the P7 at something close to 2.5 amps, the resistor labeled R100 has to dissipate something like 1/2 a watt, and it's only rated for 1/8 of a watt. It will burn out soon enuff. If you are handy with a soldering iron, you can replace these with two 1206 or 1210 sized resistors, maybe around 0.16 ohms.

    It would be interesting to see what's on the other side of the PCB to see if they do any kind of thermal regulation of the LED's brightness. It'd be nice to dim the LED when the temperature gets too high. But given that folks on this forum have dissed the magicshine driver's electrical design and the manufacturer has made the same mistakes they made before, I very much doubt they do any thermal regulation.

    My guess is they are still cutting corners where most folks won't see it. They have some new cosmetic features, like the aluminum can to hold the Li-Ion cells. The nice thing about that is if they still use low quality cells and one catches fire, the aluminum can may help contain the fire. My impression is it's the same innards as the magicshine, with a slightly improved user interface, and a different beam pattern because of the 2 XPEs.

    These new lights come with the same 90 day warranty the magicshine did. Hey if it was a quality light the manufacturer would offer a longer warranty.

    Mark
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  22. #22
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    Troutie.
    The lumen thing is aggravating. Just part of the game. This light is bright and beam pattern looks good. Great light for getting into biking on the cheap.
    Would never consider putting this on my helmet just due to its size.
    But then again it only seems big because of the little lights that many of us build here.

  23. #23
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    One chip does have 5241B on it.
    Q1 does get hot. So many burns from soldering though has desensitized me so I may not be a good judge of "painfully" hot. Unless the flesh sizzles I tend not to notice anymore.
    Major improvements over the MS900, both in quality and beam pattern.
    The battery container is also really nice.
    Just put this in the same category as a low end mountain bike. Gets the job done and gives you an idea if you enjoy the experience enough to get something a lot nicer.
    Last edited by odtexas; 03-21-2010 at 11:19 AM.

  24. #24
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    Yep, I get a kick out of "painfully hot". My finger tips are so seared by years of holding parts while soldering, I have seen the puffs of smoke before the I feel the pain. lol Good write up Texas, thanks again. You SAVED me from having to go buy a 1400 to disassemble. James

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mhahn@hvc.rr.com
    odtexas,

    The transistor labeled Q1, on the PCB to the right of the SM5241, is most likely a mosfet in a SOT23-3 package. The magicshine used an 8 pin SOIC. I've used SOT23-3 mosfets in LED drivers I've designed, so that might be OK. But it is typically easier to find a low Ron (on resistance) mosfet in a SOIC package.

    Mark
    Later Magicshine 900's switched from the 8 pin SOIC mosfet to a smaller SOT23-3 mosfet as well. It doesn't have as low of a RDSon as the SOIC part and it does run hotter and makes the driver less efficient.

    I'm amazed they won't fix the under spec'ed resistors. It's not like this is really subjective. Any first year EE major could figure this out and the datasheet for the resistor gives very clear guidelines for what is in and out of spec. They aren't even close. What's crazy is the pattern on the PCB board is clearly setup for larger resistors and we're talking about parts that cost less than a penny in quantity. The one good thing about the low drive current on high is the resistors won't be as far out of spec. But they sure are giving up a lot of brightness out of the LEDs.

    Of course they haven't seen a lot of warranty issues with a 90 day warranty and this is the kind of problem that could become a serious issue when the lights are a year to two old. They may get away with them running over spec for a while, but why take a chance for something that is so cheap and easy to correct.

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