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  1. #1
    I ride a Swarf
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    I have added some Seoul to my Cateye Double Shot Edit and Triple Shot

    I have written it up on candlepowerforums

    here is the link
    .

    like I say in the thread its untested long term, so do at your own risk.

    they are a load brighter though.

    Stu
    Last edited by Stuart B; 05-01-2007 at 01:27 PM.
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  2. #2
    I ride a Swarf
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    Its dark enough to do some phots for comparisonmns between the stock tripleshot and the seouled double shot. Same battery used for both lights. Lightr is shining on white ceiling 7 foot or so above bed. Camera and light on bed.

    Stock Tripleshot 1/50th F2.8


    Seoul Doubleshot 1/50th F2.8


    Stick Tripleshot 1/100th F2.8

    Seould Double Shot 1/100th F2.8

    The double has a bigger brighter spot. I need to charge both batteries, but It lookes like the double is as good at flood too now.

    The colour is more blue than the greeny tint the K2s I put in had.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  3. #3
    Gone riding
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    Very nice work Stu!

    I’ve been wondering if someone would do this mod since that thread here on MTBR a while back. It's nice to see someone take the plunge and get it done!

    You mention a “ringy” beam and although it seems to be a common trait of the CatEye optics, I have found that the SSC P4’s don’t seem to work overly well with optics in general. Some are better then others however. A nice textured reflector will help blend things nicely, and create a much smoother light. Finding reflectors with the right profile and physical dimensions for your needs would probably be a challenge though.

    Have you tried running your meter in series with the emitters to see if the controller still behaves in terms of drive current with the different emitter forward voltage? It likely wouldn’t have changed, but just out of interest.

    So is your Triple Shot next to hit the operation table?

    Dave.

  4. #4
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    Hey Stu, Any chance of seeing the shots on a trail or just outdoors.

    Anybody else change optics on a Niterider MiNewt. Also, does anyone know if Niterider offers an upgrade or plans to.

    MB

  5. #5
    mtbr member
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    New MiNewt coming from niterider, "twice as bright, half the voltage draw." But you didn't hear it from me

  6. #6
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    WOOHOO!!!!!!!!!!

    You didn't hear that from me.(LOL)

    Thanks.

    MB

  7. #7
    I ride a Swarf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Low_Rider
    Very nice work Stu!

    I’ve been wondering if someone would do this mod since that thread here on MTBR a while back. It's nice to see someone take the plunge and get it done!

    You mention a “ringy” beam and although it seems to be a common trait of the CatEye optics, I have found that the SSC P4’s don’t seem to work overly well with optics in general. Some are better then others however. A nice textured reflector will help blend things nicely, and create a much smoother light. Finding reflectors with the right profile and physical dimensions for your needs would probably be a challenge though.

    Have you tried running your meter in series with the emitters to see if the controller still behaves in terms of drive current with the different emitter forward voltage? It likely wouldn’t have changed, but just out of interest.

    So is your Triple Shot next to hit the operation table?

    Dave.
    Thanks Dave.

    I am hoping to do the Triple soon, possibly today if I pull my thumb out hehe. I will measure the optics dimensions when I pull that one apart. I have a few reflectors, non are the right size unfortunatly without more serious mods.

    I didn't measure the current, I will try an think of a way to get a meter inline to check it..The Vfs at 700mA aren't that disimilar for the lux 3 and seoul though. The seouls is a bit lower. Goping on the data sheets

    mb323323 - I will try and borrow my mates tripod and take some out door shots. I am recovering from a broken leg so it won't be a trail shot. I will have propbably modded the triple by the time I do that so the comparison photos will be different to the wall shots posted.So the photos will have less meaning ( a camera can be set make a light look amazing or bad), I will do the same ceiling ahot though to show how the triple has improved to help with that.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  8. #8
    I ride a Swarf
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    Just a word of warning

    I just started on my triple which is virgin. The black screws are some sort of alloy of cheese. So be careful not to strip the heads out.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  9. #9
    Spanish biker
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    Excellent job!!!!!!!!! are a form easy to upgrade the light with a little money.

    Enjoy it!!!!!

    Cheers - Saludos!!!!!!!!

    msxtr
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

    Easy DIY led light1
    Easy DIY led light2

    The Beast!!!

  10. #10
    I ride a Swarf
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    Quote Originally Posted by msxtr
    Excellent job!!!!!!!!! are a form easy to upgrade the light with a little money.

    Enjoy it!!!!!

    Cheers - Saludos!!!!!!!!

    msxtr
    Cheers chap. Its abit fiddly, but a very good improvement in light for not much money.

    I just finished the triple. It was abit more of a fiddle this one. I striped the black scres heads. They seemd to be made of cheese and threadlocked in. In the double the silver ones also hold the LEDs against the rear, So I drilled out the black ones and kept the screw shaft to keep everything alined. This did mean I couldn't get the bigger plastic piece out. I gor the LEDs out and left the big bit in. I decided to use multstrand insulated wire instead of the bendy wire so everythin was more manouverable (to make the bodge easier . Couple of hours later I have a nitroed triple.

    I have leant something too. The flood is not proviided by the optics...all the optics are the same. The flood on the outside LEDs on the triple is provided by the frosting on the front glass.

    Which is a little unfortunate as it measn you can't swap between the triple and double.

    Before I would say the double was brighter than the stock triple...now the seouled triple is noticable brighter than the seouled double.

    The triple is no more ringy than before I would say. I will take similar beam shots as before tonight.

    Edit I didn't take phots....but its the same kinda thing as the double.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  11. #11
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    Here is a beamshot of the triple


    This is at 1/100th of a second exposure and F2.8

    significantly brighter than stock

    I did some static runs today. the lights gets as warm as it did before (by feel) when not in moving air. I observed some temperature related dimming. the unit was probably 50 Celcius (guess). I have heard that seouls are quite temperature sensitive. I would guess it was still a fair bit brighter than stock.

    I will do a soak but with the unit being blown on by a fan simulating riding and update you.

    I just found trhe oversize bar clamp that comes with the triple....my crutchs are about the same diamerter as an over size bar.....so I fitted it hehe. Might take a piccy of it tomorrow

    Stu
    Last edited by Stuart B; 05-01-2007 at 02:41 PM.
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  12. #12
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    Nice. I like the whiter color as well.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by James@GearReview
    Nice. I like the whiter color as well.
    Yeah I like the colour too. Especially against the k2s I had in the double before, these were quite green.

    I haven't had chance to compare to my trailtech hid yet. Its on my bike hund up from the ceiling. Next time a mate comes around I might ask them to pull it down for me. Hopefully they are more similar in output and colour. I still use the the HID with the double as I need to be able to swap lights at races for run time. The HID should have a harder time drowning the double out now.

    Edit mode on - I forgot to say....I soak tested the triple using the fan, it ran perfectly fine for 2 hours. It started gettiing a bit dim due to the battery at this stage. I will try again tonight with a freh battery to check. The original figure says it shoudl run for 3.3 hours. The LED voltage should be thee same. Even so, there isn't much head room above the battery voltage with three leds and its hgoing into unregulated mode. I am nort sure I ever used the triple for 2 hours straight before with out recharging, I used to use the HID more which I have 2 batteries for. I will ask my mate to do a similar test with his stock triples to see if its a new feature hehe. I know its the battery as I quickly swapped the doubles battery on and all was bright again.

    I am tempted to try it with my LiIons and buck puck. I can try em at 1 amp then. whoich in theory should be 25% brighter. If I can find a source for the double shot extnebsions to chop up I'll try it. This will have greater voltage headroom also.

    Edit mode off

    Check out the new light testing rig hehe



    I haven't tried it yet....but I might if I go to my mates house up the road later in the week ....offroad at least. If I use it on the pavement I will annoy cars as a tilt the crutch back when I move it forward. I need to see whre I am going arounf the back of his flat (unlit steps and narrow path), I usually have a small torch in my mouth dribbling...it ain't pretty.

    Stu
    Last edited by Stuart B; 05-02-2007 at 02:03 AM.
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  14. #14
    Still learning
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    Are these new modded LEDs regulated LEDs (like are used in the Cateye Doubleshot pro/Tripleshot pro and Princeton Tec Switchbacks), or just standard LEDs which will drop off over time?

  15. #15
    I ride a Swarf
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    Quote Originally Posted by akashra
    Are these new modded LEDs regulated LEDs (like are used in the Cateye Doubleshot pro/Tripleshot pro and Princeton Tec Switchbacks), or just standard LEDs which will drop off over time?
    LEDs are driven by the original/standard controller circuit mounted on the battery which regulates to 700mA. I wan't aware the Pro LEDS were regulating themselves. I haven't got the pro, but I imagined its very similar in setiup. Unregulated LEDs, Current regulating circuit and battery. I haven't seen a self regulating high power LED (not saying they don't exist) except fror drop in bulb replacements for mag lights and so on.

    I haven't properly investigated the dimming at the end of run of the triple yet. But like I said, I believe its due to the battery voltage dropping low enough for it to bo longer posible to drive 700mA. So the current drops off.
    Some lights do quote their run time down to half brightness even if they are constant brightness for a good chunck of time (in regulated mode). I will get my mate to run his stock triple to see if its just my modded ones, if it is I need to check its not dues to a slightly high resistance somewhere or just that the Vf of LED is actually higher than stated..

    I will do sa similar burn time test on the double soon. I have used this a fair bit, so know that it didn't dim much at the end of its charge before flashing (low bat warning).

    Update, I have just ordered a couple of extension leads. I will use these to check the drive voltage and currents with the stock controller. I will also make a setup with a buck puck on my Lithium Ions at upto 1 Amp (will post beam shots at 1 Amp).

    Stu
    Last edited by Stuart B; 05-03-2007 at 01:30 AM.
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  16. #16
    I ride a Swarf
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    I Think...I say think....it need investigating...but

    I have some IMS reflectors, one of them might fit...i think its the 20mm one.

    If it fits it will be luck....the diamter is spot on. when placed on top of the LED with the reflectors legs chopped off and with all the plastic cateye pieces inside still is prodrudes out the front of the light....by what look like the thickness off the clamping plastic piece....hopefully the protrusion is slightly more, i mean fracion of a mm. Tomorrow I will try removing the top plastic piece that clamped the LED in and see if the reflector can be used to clamp the LED in with the gasket acting as an nice firm but compressible compression holding the LED against the back.

    With the cateye plastic pieces inside still the LED doesn't sit far enough into the reflector.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  17. #17
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    looks like the seoul and ims 20 are a perfect fit in the cateye. I did a "blink" test. I only have one IMS 20 so I put the stock in the other (Not perferct as the plastic pieces were removed) but the IMS is so smooth, hardly ringy at all, I would say they are less lossy too. Possibly becaue more the refelector is over the LED and catching more light. The stock set up is shaded around the circumference slightly by the top plastic part (I need to call them other than pieces hehe)

    With the IMS legs clipped off it was a perfect fit with it slightly poking out the front of the light allowing the rubber gasket to compress against it.

    I have ordered a bunch. Hopefully next week I will have more beam shots.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  18. #18
    It's carbon dontcha know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Y-Wrench
    New MiNewt coming from niterider, "twice as bright, half the voltage draw." But you didn't hear it from me
    Is this it:
    http://www.niterider.com/prod_minewt.shtml

    Or is there a new revision coming?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by 6thElement
    Is this it:
    http://www.niterider.com/prod_minewt.shtml

    Or is there a new revision coming?

    Nope. That's the old Minewt. Luxeons. The new one should have crees or seouls.

    I'm waiting.

    MB

  20. #20
    I ride a Swarf
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    I didn't realise 20mm reflectors were pretty much standard in size.

    I have gone a bit reflector crazy to find out what works best. I have ordered some IMS 20, MCR20 (Seoul and non Seoul versions) and the Khatod wide and narrow beams.

    Hoping to oreder a couple of nFlex controllers too so I can try them at 1 amp on my Lithium bats I have already. I didn't realise the nFlex has a low voltage warning...which is awesome on litiums.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  21. #21
    I ride a Swarf
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    Update

    I have my Khatod reflectors. My IMS and McR ones have been sitting in customs....should be here tomorrow. I had to pay 8.50 tax and 13 quid to parcel force for the privilege of them handling it.

    So far I am impressed withthe kahtod ones....nice beams and fit like a glove.

    For the triple so far my favourite beam (on a wall at least...need out door tests still) is to use 1 wide in the middle (through the clear part of the lens) and run to spots on the outside (under the frosted bits). This gives a nice flood, but with a big soft hot spot. the hot spot is atleast as big as my HID and actually blends better into the spill than the HID. The Spill is brighter than the HID, but the diameter of the spill is smaller than the HID. I think this is shading due to the housing. The HID spill diam is much biigger than needed though.

    In the double I think narow angle reflectors works well. Hot spot is tighter than triple, but there is still a brighter flood than the HID....again the spill diameter is smaller that the HID....but this isn't critical for helmet use.

    should I have measured the voltage and current output from the stock contreoller on the triple. Output sithe factory 700mA and the voltaeg is 10V across 3 leds. Less than I thought it would be after reading the data sheet. I was expecting 10.7V or so.....thats a bit extra burn time from what I thought . I am getting my mates stock triple to do the stock voltage measuremenst and to do run time tests. last time I did a burn test on the stock setup it got noticably dim after 2 hours. my tests/comparisons with the stock lightget the answer to that.

    I did a 2.5 hour run using the neflex and 1 of li ions at 1 amp with a fan blowing on the houising. The Lowvoltage cut in just before the batterys protection did....so happy there. Might knock the nflex voltage threshold up a bit to allow some time on the emergency light level. If the bat circuit cuts out on its own you have no light. the voltage warning flash on the nflex is much more friendly than the cateye one which is a quick 50% strobe.....not so good when it happens hacking down a techy section at a race like it did last year hehe.

    I did notice a bit of blue shift after a while at 1amp. the housing was warm to the touch. I still have 2 layers of thermal tape I used to gain clearance when using the stock optics/plastic clamp. now the reflector is the clamp....i will put a single fresh layer in to reduce thermal resistance.


    I am still playing with nflex current levels for the lower settinsg. At 0.45A with no airflow the light hardly gets warm to the touch when in still air. an it is still loads brighte than stock. at that level it should last nearly all of a mid summer night.

    LowRider - I have added this to your database thread

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  22. #22
    I ride a Swarf
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    quick update

    the mcr20 reflectors don't fit. they would need a nats cock turned off on a lathe.

    Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

  23. #23
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    Walk me through this

    Stuart. Ead the post and am interested in upgrading my DS and TS. Can you give me somse step by step instructions and tell me what to buy?

    Thanks Mate

  24. #24
    trail rat
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    justaguy - look at the link in his first post and you will have what you seek.
    CCCMB web - Facebook
    SLO trail maps - conditions

    "The physician heals, Nature makes well" - real fortune cookie

  25. #25
    I ride a Swarf
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    Hi

    Yeah the link in my first post pretty much covers it.

    As for parts,

    If keeping the stock battery and controller you will need

    thermal tape (I got mone on ebay)
    Some White Seouls P4 Leds (I usually get mine from www,leds.de, I thinmk mine are U bin ones...bins are brightness catagorys (the are color tint catgories too))
    You can use the standard optics as posted in that link.
    A soldering iron, hex key ( can't remember what size) and a smallish cross head screw driver.
    and a couple of hours (take yer time to get it right).

    pul it to bits as described, swap the LEDs as described and carefully put it all back together.

    This set up is significantly brighter than stock.

    I have since changed the optics in mine to get a better beam. I have put 20mm diameter khatod reflectors in. The beam is very much improved. to fit these, don't refit the samller plastic piece that clamps the led to the back of the light, put refelctors in over the LED bubble, its should pretrude slightly out the the open light so that when the light front is put back on it provides the clamping force.

    If the LED isn't thermally bonded and clamped to the rear it will over heat and go blue and get damaged or even die. Like said in the link, the rear of the LED isn't electriclly neutral, so I used thermal tape as it is an electrical insulator. Thermal compound risks shortng out when the led is clamped.

    If you have any spoecific queries feel free to ask. You won't damage the light by popping the front off, and carefully removinf the optics to have a look before doing any surgery to familiarise your self.

    ]Stu
    What exactly is a rigid hard tail?

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