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  1. #1
    Spanish biker
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    Beamshots comparison of latest novelty in lights!!!!

    Hi, here the last novelty in light with beamshots

    Blackburn sistem X8





    busch & mueller ixon IQ





    Cateye triple shot Pro





    Hope Epic





    Lupine Betty 6





    Sigma Powerled Black Edition





    Topeak Monshine HID enduro





    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Last edited by msxtr; 11-06-2007 at 12:13 PM.
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

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  2. #2
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    Cool, nice pics That Hope Epic seem to have a nice beam, nice flood. And itīs compact too. But the Betty, oh my... What a monster. Thatīs a ridiculous (in the good sense) ammount of light everywhere. Looks like a car headlight, and the two of them!

  3. #3
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    The Hope and Lupine are very bright. I'm surprised that the Hope has such a wide pattern. I didn't think they had much experience designing lights but that is impressive.

    Good job with this, msxtr. I think you were trying to say "latest novelty in lights..." instead of "last novelty in lights..." but your English is quite good.

  4. #4
    Do It Yourself
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    WOW!!! That is impressive. Nice background. I'll assume that you mounted them all similarly (all bar mounted from the same place), pointed them in the same spot and had the same camera settings?

    That Hope looks outstanding with lots of peripheral light. I find it hard to believe that they were able to get that out a two LED system enough to clearly beat out the HID.
    Long Live Long Rides

  5. #5
    lidless ascender
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    I actually like the offering from Hope more than the Lupine one.Hope has a nicelly even beam while Lupine has too much brightness in the center for my liking.

    Marko
    I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness.

    Pictography

  6. #6
    Spanish biker
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    Hi, Flyer Thanks for the correction

    Explanation, the beamshots don't are mines are of a german magazine

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

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  7. #7
    Bodhisattva
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    1. I'm impressed with the Hope
    2. Betty is uber-bright
    3. Betty's beam looks narrower than I was expecting

    Well done

  8. #8
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    I was thinking about this. While the Hope looks great, it probably has a "raw" lumen rating of around 350 or 400. The similar Lumen rating of the Betty with seven LEDs is around 1400 (I realize this is also a "raw" number) and this is evidenced by the incredible throw of the beam. The pictures will not tell us the while story but if the photographer was taking notes, that would really help.

    For example, the close-up peripheral light of the Hope looks slightly wider than the Betty. Was this what the testers thought as well? Did the Betty really have a hotspot in the middle or was it more of a camera lens picking up more reflection than the human eye would? I have seen other pics where the Betty beam shows no reflection at all.

    Are there any notes or explanantions that go with these beams? That would really help.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by problematiks
    I actually like the offering from Hope more than the Lupine one.Hope has a nicelly even beam while Lupine has too much brightness in the center for my liking.

    Marko
    That hot spot becomes a huge blessing once youīre flying down a trail, Marko Especially when itīs complemented by the awesome spill the Betty seem to provide. You can point up the focus to increase the throw and still have plenty next to the bike to get a good feel for the surroundings. Some say you just canīt outrun Bettyīs beam. Super-technical trails might still demand a second helmet light but this must be one balanced light IMHO!

  10. #10
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    That's what I was thinking- that either you had a ton of cash and an obsession with lights or it was a magazine.

    Are there any explanations (in the magazine) of these lights and beam patterns that you can translate in short form?

  11. #11
    Spanish biker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    That's what I was thinking- that either you had a ton of cash and an obsession with lights or it was a magazine.

    Are there any explanations (in the magazine) of these lights and beam patterns that you can translate in short form?
    The magazine are Mountainbike magazin

    Here

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

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  12. #12
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    I see no text or description there either. I'll ask crisillo to see if he can find anything. He lives in Germany and may be able to find some information on this test.

    Quote Originally Posted by msxtr
    The magazine are Mountainbike magazin

    Here

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr

  13. #13
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    Unfortunately these again seem to be those kind of beamshots where you cannot really compare the beams directly - the camera is tilted in different angles for all the lights, for example, and the 1 powerled Sigma seems to be brighter than the Betty... all these are good for is to have a general idea of the beam type - flood or spot.
    Hope is only about 300 lumens, because they still use the old 5w leds (this is a case when I have to praise smaller vendors like Dinotte and Lupine who almost instantly update their lights when new technology gets available...).

  14. #14
    Spanish biker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    I see no text or description there either. I'll ask crisillo to see if he can find anything. He lives in Germany and may be able to find some information on this test.
    Hi, sometimes I can buy this magazin here in Spain, if I get buy, I inform to you

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

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  15. #15
    Spanish biker
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    Quote Originally Posted by radirpok
    Unfortunately these again seem to be those kind of beamshots where you cannot really compare the beams directly - the camera is tilted in different angles for all the lights, for example, and the 1 powerled Sigma seems to be brighter than the Betty... all these are good for is to have a general idea of the beam type - flood or spot.
    Hope is only about 300 lumens, because they still use the old 5w leds (this is a case when I have to praise smaller vendors like Dinotte and Lupine who almost instantly update their lights when new technology gets available...).
    Yes, I don't understand, why doing the beamshot a professional have this mistakes...

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Warning!!! my english is very very bad, sorry.

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  16. #16
    Do It Yourself
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    Quote Originally Posted by msxtr
    Yes, I don't understand, why doing the beamshot a professional have this mistakes...

    Greetings - Saludos

    msxtr
    Because it's a bike magazine not a peer-reviewed scientific journal. Although I do have to give zeGermans credit for a focus on empirical analysis even if not always perfectly applied science.
    Long Live Long Rides

  17. #17
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    I'm not so sure about the Betty. It has a very powerful beam that punches pretty far, but there doesn't appear to be much light within 4 or 5 meters of the bike. I think maybe the reason for the hot spot is that the testers were trying to illuminate the turf close to the bike with a beam that wants to go far ahead of the bike. At the selected angle, the Betty illuminates the area around 20 meters beautifully - which I think might be the critical distance for a roadie. At 20mph, 20meters gives you about 2 seconds to recognize and respond to a hazard. If aimed higher, the Betty looks like even 40 meters visibility would be good - even better for a roadie. But then you might loose everything within 10 meters. It is nice to have light close to the bike when cars are approaching and you have to look down to avoid being blinded.

    I think for less money than the Betty, you could get 2 good lights to fill both needs. That would give you an added advantage of having a backup.

    Just my own personal ramblings.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by radirpok
    Unfortunately these again seem to be those kind of beamshots where you cannot really compare the beams directly - the camera is tilted in different angles for all the lights, for example, and the 1 powerled Sigma seems to be brighter than the Betty... all these are good for is to have a general idea of the beam type - flood or spot.
    Hope is only about 300 lumens, because they still use the old 5w leds (this is a case when I have to praise smaller vendors like Dinotte and Lupine who almost instantly update their lights when new technology gets available...).
    Hmm, when I look at the beamshots, I see the core of the beam is focused at 10m for all of them. As for the Sigma being brighter, I think it's safe to say that the Sigma beam pattern sucks and all of it's power is concentrated to a small circle, which may be brighter than the Betty, but also useless.

    I'm less excited about total lumen ratings. First they aren't rated by an independent third party. Second, where is the measurement made? What would be very helpful is to have a graph showing lumens at certain distances and angles (left to right, up and down) from the light. This is a tall order and for now I'll settle for these beamshots which are very helpful. Thanks for the post!!

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by problematiks
    I actually like the offering from Hope more than the Lupine one.Hope has a nicelly even beam while Lupine has too much brightness in the center for my liking.

    Marko
    Me too, plus Betty is very expensive. But I could not find the Hope "Epic" anywhere, only the "Vision" model here:
    http://www.hopetechusa.com/voir_visled.html

    Looks the same, so maybe Epic is the name for the longer burn time (2 battery) version?

  20. #20
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    Some of us have the Betty coming in. We also have experience with the ARC, which has the best beam pattern I have ever seen so we will report back. I did notice that is I moved my monitor viewing angle, I could see more to the sides so I still have high hopes for the Betty. If you go to the Lupine website, you can compare the different Lupine light beams as well but I'll put up a review soon after I get mine.

  21. #21
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    Some Betty feedback..

    I am a Betty user since a few weeks and do recognise the lighting pattern shown in the picture
    but...
    only when I point my light way too low (to the ground).

    The angle I have adopted is way higher as it gives me a view even further down the road and still more than enough light directly in front of me. When pointed like this, you get a very even beam from your front wheel upto many tens of meters (to avoid receiving a 'fanboy' label, I will not say how many I estimate, but it's a lot...), without the hotspot shown in the picture and pointing so far outrunning it would be near impossible.

    I do suppose however that in order to be able to compare all these lights, certain parameters were kept constant and I can undertsand this choice. In this test one of the constants obviously was to point the focus of all lights to a mark 10m away. For the Betty however, this certainly is very far from it's optimal angle and this could well be the case for other lights in the test as well...

    Having said all this, I certainly will not say the Betty is perfect. In fact, I could still use a wider beam pattern and have found out that I need another, helmet-mounted, light for those sharp singletrack corners. As a single helmet mounted light the Betty beam is wide enough for singletrack I am sure but mounted on the handlebars it is not.
    I am therefore very curious to a comparison between the Betty and the ARC, as I have never seen an ARC but have read many praises regarding it's excellent wide beam.
    So let's hear those results!!

  22. #22
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    I'd definitely mount the Betty on the helmet if I only had one light. Just wait a couple of weeks. A few ARC owners like us will have the Betty and the Wilma and be able to compare and contrast. I agree than LEDs in general need better peripheral light; not just the Lupines. Given what I have heard, I'm willing to bet we will see some incredible beam patterns at next year's Interbike.

    I still have high hopes for the Betty as one helmet-mounted light or as a second light on the bar with something else on the helmet (Wilma in my case). HIDs still have two years to rule and then they can RIP. Till then, it's premature and overly optimistic to call them relics- at least for the best ones out there.

  23. #23
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    the battle of the giants

    Betty as a single helmet-mounted light will indeed be wide and bright enough.
    It is an option I will certainly test one of the coming nights, although I attach a lot of importance on being able to see the terrain details and therefore on a handlebar mounted light. It is for this reason I have already ordered a smaller helmet light to complement my Betty and I am sure that using both together will give me all the light I 'need' and than some..
    Even though my 'needs' will be satisfied, I am still curious regarding the Betty/Arc comparison as I wonder how much wider the ARC really is...

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by icycle
    Me too, plus Betty is very expensive. But I could not find the Hope "Epic" anywhere, only the "Vision" model here:
    http://www.hopetechusa.com/voir_visled.html

    Looks the same, so maybe Epic is the name for the longer burn time (2 battery) version?
    Yes it is:
    http://www.wiggle.co.uk/ProductDetai...0Front%20Light
    As a matter of fact:
    MBR Review

    "Doubling the cells in the Epic battery doubles the size of the pack over the conventional set-up, but it's still small enough to stem mount on anything over 80mm long. From the two 5watt LEDs the beam is wide, bright and extends far enough into the middle distance for most riding, but not quite far enough for tanking down fast trails at over 20mph, where roots and rocks come into vision later than is ideal."

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by icycle
    Hmm, when I look at the beamshots, I see the core of the beam is focused at 10m for all of them. As for the Sigma being brighter, I think it's safe to say that the Sigma beam pattern sucks and all of it's power is concentrated to a small circle, which may be brighter than the Betty, but also useless.
    You are right about the pointing of the beams, which makes the overall comparison much better, but I still don't get why they couldn't do all the shots with the same tilt (and we still don't know anything about the other settings of the camera). The problem is exactly that for the first glance the Sigma _might_ seem to be a better (or at least brighter) light than the Betty, and only after a careful examination can you say which is brighter in reality. If they photographed all the lights with exactly the same settings then this would have been obvious from the very beginning.

    Quote Originally Posted by icycle
    I'm less excited about total lumen ratings. First they aren't rated by an independent third party. Second, where is the measurement made? What would be very helpful is to have a graph showing lumens at certain distances and angles (left to right, up and down) from the light. This is a tall order and for now I'll settle for these beamshots which are very helpful. Thanks for the post!!
    Nice idea. However until that happens we have to make do with these pictures and the lumens ratings which give at least a vague idea about the lights' performance. If you have a light rated at 200 lumens and another one at 500, there is one thing for sure: the 500 lumens _will_ be significantly brighter than the other (or cover a significantly larger area). So in this sense the lumens ratings are useful.

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