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  1. #1
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    Someone please buy the 2016 Honzo Ti...

    ...then come on here and write endlessly about how awesome it is and how it's light years ahead of the steel Honzo. Post a stream of photos of the bike in sexy poses and video of the Ti Honzo gobbling up rocks and dirt. Then proclaim how it's the greatest thing since sliced provolone and continue gushing until I can no longer take it and bite the bullet myself and pick up a Honzo Ti so I can stop drooling and getting in trouble at work because I'm spending more time oogling the frame online than earning a paycheck.

  2. #2
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    Awesome!

    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    ...then come on here and write endlessly about how awesome it is and how it's light years ahead of the steel Honzo. Post a stream of photos of the bike in sexy poses and video of the Ti Honzo gobbling up rocks and dirt. Then proclaim how it's the greatest thing since sliced provolone and continue gushing until I can no longer take it and bite the bullet myself and pick up a Honzo Ti so I can stop drooling and getting in trouble at work because I'm spending more time oogling the frame online than earning a paycheck.
    Glad to see I'm not alone...

  3. #3
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    I think there'll be quite a few of us in this gang.
    Trailwrecker at large

  4. #4
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    Looks like you'll have to wait until September or October. That's what my lbs (in Canada) was told by Kona today. Though it seems they are expecting a couple of shipments, so it comes down to when you ordered one. Seems to be a pretty hot ticket. Won't say if I ordered one myself or not...

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    Looks like you'll have to wait until September or October. That's what my lbs (in Canada) was told by Kona today. Though it seems they are expecting a couple of shipments, so it comes down to when you ordered one. Seems to be a pretty hot ticket. Won't say if I ordered one myself or not...
    Was this time frame specific to the ti frame or the entire 2016 lineup? My lbs spoke to Kona earlier in the week. They said Aug to early Sept for my Honzo st but that person was just manning the phones while a dealer camp was taking place.

  6. #6
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    That was just ti Honzo. I'm sure some other stuff will arrive earlier. Kona stuff usually shows up pretty early.

  7. #7
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    Does anyone know if this can use the 148 drop outs or is it dedicated 142?

  8. #8
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    Local Kona shop here in Santa Cruz said they will ship in the Fall. But he said numbers will be limited and they expect the frames to sell out quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    Looks like you'll have to wait until September or October. That's what my lbs (in Canada) was told by Kona today. Though it seems they are expecting a couple of shipments, so it comes down to when you ordered one. Seems to be a pretty hot ticket. Won't say if I ordered one myself or not...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    Local Kona shop here in Santa Cruz said they will ship in the Fall. But he said numbers will be limited and they expect the frames to sell out quickly.
    Well I keep trying to forget about my preorder even though it is just a steel version. Come fall 2015! I guess I can be happy riding my 2013.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    Well I keep trying to forget about my preorder even though it is just a steel version. Come fall 2015! I guess I can be happy riding my 2013.
    Never say, "Just a steel version' when speaking of the Honzo! Love my steel blue meanie. But I'm weak, and susceptible to shiny new things.

  11. #11
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    Ti version is 142: no Boost needed.

    Yeah, ian, I expect most of the Honzo crowd is gone daft over that thing. If it were only closer to $1400... like a Carver 420. (I never thought I'd say that about a hardtail... $1400...)

  12. #12
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    The price is crazy, especially in Canada, where I am. I'll admit - I ordered one - and am completely stoked, but if I hadn't received the amazing bro deal from my shop I wouldn't have splurged.

    I'm thinking B+ won't be a problem?? I've seen some steel Honzos with it, and it seems the ti has more clearance (at least from internet scuttlebutt). I have 29 wheels, but have some other hubs lying around, and am trying to decide whether to sell them (to help pay for the damn frame!), or lace them up to some 27.5 rims for giggles.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Collins View Post
    Ti version is 142: no Boost needed.

    Yeah, ian, I expect most of the Honzo crowd is gone daft over that thing. If it were only closer to $1400... like a Carver 420. (I never thought I'd say that about a hardtail... $1400...)
    I looked at the 420, but it's more XC oriented. I emailed Carver and asked about a custom frame, but once you start adding things like sliding dropouts, tapered head tube, and the normal stuff on top of the basic frame, you're looking at Honzo Ti prices. But yeah, pricing is out of control across the board. In just a few years we've gone from $5k top of the line carbon bikes to $11k. You'd think carbon was some unobtanium material. Freakin ridiculous.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    for giggles.
    I ride for giggles. An added benefit with moving to a 2016 frame is I can try 27.5+ with added CS yoke clearance. And then decide what wheel size FS to get. I want to keep my forks and wheels interchangeable for lots of reasons.

  15. #15
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    I wonder if this and the new Honzo can take a 29x3.0 in tire.

  16. #16
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    I too am intrigued by the Ti Honzo. After riding for a week and a half in Sun Valley and Park City, I determined the only two things that could make my Honzo better are a 11 speed drive train (on order) and frame that's three pounds lighter!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by hjulier View Post
    I too am intrigued by the Ti Honzo. After riding for a week and a half in Sun Valley and Park City, I determined the only two things that could make my Honzo better are a 11 speed drive train (on order) and frame that's three pounds lighter!
    3 pounds lighter? Know something I don't? I've emailed the folks at Kona to get a frame weight, but haven't gotten a response. If I recall correctly, my large steel Honzo weighs 6.8 pounds. So three pounds is feasible. But I'm having a hard time thinking the Ti Honzo will come in under 4 pounds.

    One thing is for sure. I won't drop $2,200 on a frame without first knowing the weight.

  18. #18
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    6.8 for an large? I wonder if my small was a pig. It weighed 6.7875 lbs with the axle and clamp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    6.8 for an large? I wonder if my small was a pig. It weighed 6.7875 lbs with the axle and clamp.
    Maybe you shouldnt have bought the lead seat clamp.

  20. #20
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    Subscribing... Please give me a reason to blow all my money

  21. #21
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    My guess is 2.5lbs lighter = 4.5 lbs.
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  22. #22
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    Looks like we will have to wait until October to find out - that's what I was told by Kona. Going to be a long month and a half...

  23. #23
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    I came across a post of mine from when I built up my Honzo a few years ago. I stand corrected, my frame weighs in at 7 pounds. 6.98 to be exact.

    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    6.8 for an large? I wonder if my small was a pig. It weighed 6.7875 lbs with the axle and clamp.

  24. #24
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    I'm looking forward to some real world reviews of this frame. The one negative i have heard is that the top tube/down tube gusset at the head tube may be a little overkill - meaning the frame is stiffer thereby offsetting the 'lively-ness' of titanium.

    Otherwise I'm stoked on this frame, its taking a lot of restraint not to purchase this sucka today. i love my 2015 honzo, can only imagine how rad a lighter ti would be!

  25. #25
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    I have one on order, and I know it's kinda crazy to buy a frame or bike with no reviews, I did want to get it in time for some fall riding. I also suspect there might be more demand than supply - who knows. My main concern was flex, especially on a bike that is supposed to be ridden hard. So I hope you're right . If I can lose a couple of pounds, and still have a stiff but lively frame, I'll be happy.

  26. #26
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    F#ck it! Life is too short. Put my deposit down on a Honzo Ti today. My local Kona shop said they will be produced in very limited numbers and are almost already sold out. Or they're just puttin' the screws to me so I'd pull the trigger.

    Either way, I'm stoked. It's supposed to arrive at the end of September. According to the factory a large weighs in at 4 lbs. My large steel frame is a whopping 7 lbs. It's more than I thought I'd ever drop on a hardtail frame, but this will be the last hardtail I ever need.

  27. #27
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    Good choice . It's expensive, but as long as you ride it you'll get your money's worth. Hope they do arrive in late September, that would be great. I found some other pictures online, don't know if you've seen them. The seat stays sure look thinned out - I know they're flattened out a bit (I suppose to add a bit of compliance), but it's very noticeable in these pics.

    Infos VTT : Le Kona Honzo s?assagit / En bonus la vidéo du «press camp»

  28. #28
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    That article claims that the Honzo has a 35mm seat post, and that they worked with KS to get it specially made in that diameter. I'm guessing whoever wrote the article had some translation issues...

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    Good choice . It's expensive, but as long as you ride it you'll get your money's worth. Hope they do arrive in late September, that would be great. I found some other pictures online, don't know if you've seen them. The seat stays sure look thinned out - I know they're flattened out a bit (I suppose to add a bit of compliance), but it's very noticeable in these pics.

    Infos VTT : Le Kona Honzo s?assagit / En bonus la vidéo du «press camp»
    Sweet. Looks springy!

  30. #30
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    Bleh, Steel is real i.a.n.!

    Someone please buy the 2016 Honzo Ti...-2016-built-1.0.jpg

    This thing is money! It doesn't feel as dead as my 2013 but still has all the stiffness. Is $1674 worth 2 lbs 14 oz in a med steel vs a large ti? The ti does look sick except the seat tube brace and 44mm head tube to me.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    Bleh, Steel is real i.a.n.!
    Agreed! Which is why my other bike is a rigid steel single speed. Doesn't get any more real than that!

    But I want the Ti Honzo so I can match the titanium in my spine. I'm all about coordinatin'!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Zrgc2aocnM

  32. #32
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    Haha, funny video. I really just wanted to derail the ti thread with my 2016 steel frame. Pics of it need to be everywhere.

  33. #33
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    The 2016 steel frame looks super sick - I'm looking forward to seeing a fully built up ti frame!

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    Bleh, Steel is real i.a.n.!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    This thing is money! It doesn't feel as dead as my 2013 but still has all the stiffness. Is $1674 worth 2 lbs 14 oz in a med steel vs a large ti? The ti does look sick except the seat tube brace and 44mm head tube to me.
    Is that a 140mm fork??

  35. #35
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    Yup, 140 Rev RCT3. I know, I know I need to get a 34mm stanchioned fork asap.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by beer_coffee_water View Post
    Yup, 140 Rev RCT3. I know, I know I need to get a 34mm stanchioned fork asap.
    or a 35mm Pike :P

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA View Post
    or a 35mm Pike :P
    I really want to give a Stage a go over the Pike.

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    i think this bike would be sweet!! I have never ridden a Honzo but like the sound of the slacker geometry. I feel so sketchy when way over the front wheel on some other hardtails i have ridden. I wonder if 27.5+ will run on this bike...

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    Quote Originally Posted by nfrizz View Post
    i think this bike would be sweet!! I have never ridden a Honzo but like the sound of the slacker geometry. I feel so sketchy when way over the front wheel on some other hardtails i have ridden. I wonder if 27.5+ will run on this bike...
    I have seen a couple people post on these forums running the wtb scraper rims with trailblazer 2.8 tires and swear by them

  40. #40
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    Beer Coffee water-
    Have you weighed your frame? Frame only? Or w/ sliders/axle?

    This damned thing just might....
    Might get my $$.
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Chicken Bones View Post
    Beer Coffee water-
    Have you weighed your frame? Frame only? Or w/ sliders/axle?

    This damned thing just might....
    Might get my $$.
    His/hers is the steel not the Ti...

  42. #42
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    Thanks SB.
    Guess I could have looked more closely.

    Is there a confirmed weight for the ti frame out there? Somethign more substantial than the guesstimate of Ti vs Steel?
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    Ive only seen speculation thus far, I'm guessing 3+ pounds lighter. I'm waiting anxiously for i.a.n to report back when he gets his!!!

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    F#ck it! Life is too short. Put my deposit down on a Honzo Ti today. My local Kona shop said they will be produced in very limited numbers and are almost already sold out. Or they're just puttin' the screws to me so I'd pull the trigger.

    Either way, I'm stoked. It's supposed to arrive at the end of September. According to the factory a large weighs in at 4 lbs. My large steel frame is a whopping 7 lbs. It's more than I thought I'd ever drop on a hardtail frame, but this will be the last hardtail I ever need.
    Never mind, according to i.a.n's post here, the large weighs 4 pounds

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Chicken Bones View Post
    Thanks SB.
    Guess I could have looked more closely.

    Is there a confirmed weight for the ti frame out there? Somethign more substantial than the guesstimate of Ti vs Steel?
    I asked me local dealer to ask the factory, and they said a large was 4 lbs. We'll see. I should have new Ti frame in the next 1-2 weeks. I'm guessing it's not exactly 4 lbs, but should be close.

  46. #46
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    Yeah, I would expect 4.2 or 4.3 -ish.

    I made the decision to go with some lighter parts, should save about 2lbs instead of 3lbs, but also $500 instead of $2000...
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  47. #47
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    Thanks Ian.
    Please keep us/me posted. If you are getting the frame w/o parts- I'd love to know an actual weight.

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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by micah356 View Post
    Yeah, I would expect 4.2 or 4.3 -ish.

    I made the decision to go with some lighter parts, should save about 2lbs instead of 3lbs, but also $500 instead of $2000...
    Or just say F it and drop the 2 pounds AND the 3 pounds! I mean, Im not doing that anytime soon, but if you have the cash! It can still be done that way for less than most carbon full suspension bikes

  49. #49
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    Yep SB.
    That's what I'm leaning towards. The best of both worlds.

    I've been running a pair of Moots for 8 seasons now. (SS and Geared)
    8 perfect seasons of frames that have never flinched.
    Sprint, long endurance, buckets of bike packs, lots of smiles on bikes.

    And all in all, they still look great.
    They've been bead blasted and re-stickered so they should still look reasonably good.
    If it wasn't for the cursed 1 1/8th headtube I wouldn't be looking for anything except more time off work.

    So steel/vs Ti to me means a weight savings yes but it means more.
    It also means bike packing and other random abuse scenarios that can carve up a painted frame pretty quick. I doubt I'd wear holes in a painted frame but my vanity might be enough to still want the Ti.
    To want a frame that looks good after years of abuse.
    I've seen plenty of great parts on frames that can't last as long as their headset.
    Why have a 10 year warranty on a King headset when your SC frame is warrantied for what? 3 years?
    (edit- Are you kidding me? Santa Cruz now has a LIFETIME WARRANTY? Well done.)
    But you get the point.
    Go w/ Ti if you want this frame for a long while.
    Or if you just want it.

    If I jumped ship over to a pair of these, I'd go ti, and I'd go w/ more carbon rims from Light Bicycle and perhaps some Next cranks too.
    I'd save some $$ here and there (those rims are way cheaper than Enve, BHS hubs work great and are indeed light) but I'd build them to get me out, and back, and whatever else comes along in between.

    Being able to stuff a nice fat tire in the frame sounds top notch.
    All I see that's an issue is the single bottle cage but that's prob just old skool haunting me.
    And who knows- w/ such short chain stays I might just learn to manual a bike a ways before the lights go out.

    Now... do I justify these bikes by selling the Mootseses? Or do I re-purpose the Moots? Do I make one into a great touring bike? Generator hub, rigid front, comfy drop bars? And make the SS into some oddball who knows what kind of weirdo rigid rig of some sort?
    That question will likely occupy me until the Honza is sold out.

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  50. #50
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    JCB, sorry about the confusion on me having the steel frame and posting itin a ti thread. I just dumped pics where I could because I got my Honzo so early. Also wanted to show i.a.n. the raw finish of the st. The st in med weighed 6 lbs 14 Oz with axle and clamp, 4 Oz less w/o them. The 2016 steel is far more compliant yet still as stiff as a 2013 I have. It has all the same components sans headset from my 2013 but rides better.

  51. #51
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    Sweet Baby Jesus.
    Nearly 7 lbs for a rigid frame.
    And yet, those that ride a Honza of any material are nuts about it.
    Clearly I'm seeing only part of this iceberg.

    Night shift can be quiet at times. So now my brain is overworked as I consider swapping parts, ordering frames, lacing wheels, selling bikes...
    Damn this frame. (Yelled as I shake my fist at the sky)
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  52. #52
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    Night shift, I feel you. It does make the mind run.

    I haven't been on a ti bike. I do hear they are magical. The ride of the new steel gets me going on opportunity cost though. The ti is over 4x the cost and saves roughly 40% of the weight. For how much different of a ride? That is my unknown and I am not sure that's worth it to me.

    I also like the tapered head tube on the steel on a frame that is meant to be ridden aggressively. Having the lower portion of a headset inside the tube seems to and durability, strength and a slight degree of steering precision in my mind.

  53. #53
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    If you're in the market for an all mountain steel hardtail, you should know you're generally getting into a heavy bike - don't bother being a weight weenie. The Ti frame is definitely a different story! I'm really curious to hear a comparison regarding ride quality between the 2 - is Ti generally more compliant? Does it maintain the stiffness like steel? I would love to try one of these out

  54. #54
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    I went with the Ti mostly for the weight savings (plus I'll admit I like the looks) - my thinking being that the bike was already going to built up pretty heavy duty with burly tires etc. So any weight saved would be great. A "bro deal" through my shop helped. Chicken bones - I also plan on using it for some bike packing, esp. a trip next year. I think it will be great for that - the front triangle is pretty small, but I'm hoping it'll fit some sort of bag.

    Last I heard was mid october frames in Canada will be ready to ship. I can live with that - as long as it's not any longer - want to get some rides in before the snow.

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    I think this is a great frame to drop the $$$ on for Ti, the geometry is proven and I really wouldn't want it any different (I love my 2015). Buy this bike and you basically wont need another hardtail ever again

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    I also noticed that the picture on the Kona website no longer has the ISCG tabs. I hope they ship with the tabs - I still would like to run a chainguide

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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    I also noticed that the picture on the Kona website no longer has the ISCG tabs. I hope they ship with the tabs - I still would like to run a chainguide
    That is a bummer... Just looked through the pics of people receiving their 2016 frames on the Honzo build thread - no more ISCG tabs :-/

  58. #58
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    Looks to me like they photochopped the iscg tabs...

    Someone please buy the 2016 Honzo Ti...-honzotix.jpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by micah356 View Post
    Looks to me like they photochopped the iscg tabs...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Strange... check out page 98 of the Honzo build thread, there is a picture of the drive-side of a frame someone was building - no tabs.

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    Yeah. So they probably had the first small batch built with tabs, and removed them for before the full production run.
    Living the dream at TDA Global Cycling – epic bike tours from 500 to 15,000 km.

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  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB666 View Post
    I think this is a great frame to drop the $$$ on for Ti, the geometry is proven and I really wouldn't want it any different (I love my 2015). Buy this bike and you basically wont need another hardtail ever again
    Pretty much my thinking. My Ti Honzo arrives in two weeks. Swapping over wheels and the drive train form my steel Honzo, but all the new parts arrived today. I figure this frame will outlast me.

  62. #62
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    Won't need a hardtail ever again....
    That's a good one.

    I"ve heard that enough times to think that I'd only not need a HT if it meant I was soon to die.
    There's just too much change out there.
    Damn you 1 1/8th headtube that ruined the old Bontrager.
    Damn you tapered headtubed that made perfect Moots hard to get forks for.
    Damn you press fit BB of whatever standard du jour
    Or post mount brakes.
    And don't get me started on the damned hub dimensions. Or axle sizes, or the effing rim widths flooding the world right now.
    Or wheels size. (that's actually a really rough one. How many amazing carbon spaceshps are hanging unused in various garages because of their unsafe unsightly kids wheels?)
    I would really like to see the industry just take it easy man.
    https://coub.com/view/3iojw

    But still- I get your point. A Ti frame of most shapes sure can run the distance.
    And Ti, as a material, can bring plenty to the table besides just weight.

    Much of my riding contains many long arduous days.
    There are better options for such rides true- but, my rides all include fast fun downhills.
    Tire clearance, long-ish forks....

    I'm interested but will see.

    My vote is out for now, but my interested continues to grow.
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  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Chicken Bones View Post
    Won't need a hardtail ever again....
    That's a good one.

    I"ve heard that enough times to think that I'd only not need a HT if it meant I was soon to die.
    There's just too much change out there.
    Damn you 1 1/8th headtube that ruined the old Bontrager.
    Damn you tapered headtubed that made perfect Moots hard to get forks for.
    Damn you press fit BB of whatever standard du jour
    Or post mount brakes.
    And don't get me started on the damned hub dimensions. Or axle sizes, or the effing rim widths flooding the world right now.
    Or wheels size. (that's actually a really rough one. How many amazing carbon spaceshps are hanging unused in various garages because of their unsafe unsightly kids wheels?)
    I would really like to see the industry just take it easy man.
    https://coub.com/view/3iojw

    But still- I get your point. A Ti frame of most shapes sure can run the distance.
    And Ti, as a material, can bring plenty to the table besides just weight.

    Much of my riding contains many long arduous days.
    There are better options for such rides true- but, my rides all include fast fun downhills.
    Tire clearance, long-ish forks....

    I'm interested but will see.

    My vote is out for now, but my interested continues to grow.
    Touche on the bike industry point... And of course, there will always be an itch to try/get something new.

    I guess my ultimate stance is, if there are people out there (and there are many) who are comfortable paying this amount for a carbon hardtail - or a full suspension for that matter, then why not a Ti Honzo? If you love the geometry, and you have the coin, I say go for it! I won't be getting one anytime soon, but if I had the extra cash I'd be stoked on one of these!

  64. #64
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    And that the truth SB!
    The money that people will dump on a carbon frame with questionable longevity is surprising.

    So if you can swing the Ti- go for it!
    Unless the $$ savings means more trips to ride elsewhere- then go steel.
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  65. #65
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    FWIW, Kona responded to me last week in regards to frame weights of Ti vs Steel. They said a med steel weighs 7.4lbs and med Ti at 4.9lbs on their scale.

    Ti looks great, but I have only $2k into my 15' Honzo with all the hard hitting parts I would want on it (with exception of carbon) and I ride that thing hard up or down on just about anything without any worries. Yes, frame is heavy but geometry is spot in with 120 fork (Pike) for do-all trail riding IMO. Last week I put in 5,200ft vertical in 30 miles on long'ish XC/trail ride, then hit some flow/jump/FR trails the next day. I still ride my 6" FS here and there, but the steel Honzo has become my go-to aggro XC/trail bike as of late where I know I will be pedalling a ton, even though it weighs 3 lbs more than my 6" FS (Bronson CC). So weight isn't everything if the bike is built and geometry is done right.
    Ride On!

  66. #66
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    I didn't say it will be my last bike, but my last hardtail for sure. I don't fall victim to upgrade-itis. And I'm purging jsut about everything in my life these days, so I sold another bike and I'm selling off parts to finance this build.

    Speaking of which, I'll have a large blue steel Honzo and Fox 120mm fork for sale shortly. :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Chicken Bones View Post
    Won't need a hardtail ever again....
    That's a good one.

    I"ve heard that enough times to think that I'd only not need a HT if it meant I was soon to die.
    There's just too much change out there.
    Damn you 1 1/8th headtube that ruined the old Bontrager.
    Damn you tapered headtubed that made perfect Moots hard to get forks for.
    Damn you press fit BB of whatever standard du jour
    Or post mount brakes.
    And don't get me started on the damned hub dimensions. Or axle sizes, or the effing rim widths flooding the world right now.
    Or wheels size. (that's actually a really rough one. How many amazing carbon spaceshps are hanging unused in various garages because of their unsafe unsightly kids wheels?)
    I would really like to see the industry just take it easy man.
    https://coub.com/view/3iojw

    But still- I get your point. A Ti frame of most shapes sure can run the distance.
    And Ti, as a material, can bring plenty to the table besides just weight.

    Much of my riding contains many long arduous days.
    There are better options for such rides true- but, my rides all include fast fun downhills.
    Tire clearance, long-ish forks....

    I'm interested but will see.

    My vote is out for now, but my interested continues to grow.

  67. #67
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    No way the weight of the medium steel frame is right. And that makes me nervous because I was told a large Ti frame weighs 4 pounds. Makes me think the Kona rep may have inflated the steel numbers to make the Ti numbers seem more impressive. Either way I'll be a little pinched if the large Ti frame I have on order is 4.9 pounds.

    My 2012 large steel frame weighs 6.98 pounds, weighed on a scale I know to be accurate.

    Quote Originally Posted by jgusta View Post
    FWIW, Kona responded to me last week in regards to frame weights of Ti vs Steel. They said a med steel weighs 7.4lbs and med Ti at 4.9lbs on their scale.

    Ti looks great, but I have only $2k into my 15' Honzo with all the hard hitting parts I would want on it (with exception of carbon) and I ride that thing hard up or down on just about anything without any worries. Yes, frame is heavy but geometry is spot in with 120 fork (Pike) for do-all trail riding IMO. Last week I put in 5,200ft vertical in 30 miles on long'ish XC/trail ride, then hit some flow/jump/FR trails the next day. I still ride my 6" FS here and there, but the steel Honzo has become my go-to aggro XC/trail bike as of late where I know I will be pedalling a ton, even though it weighs 3 lbs more than my 6" FS (Bronson CC). So weight isn't everything if the bike is built and geometry is done right.

  68. #68
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    I posted on the last page that my med 2016 st weighed 6 lbs 14 Oz with the post and clamp. 4 Oz less without. 7.4 seems like it would be hard to achieve.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    No way the weight of the medium steel frame is right. And that makes me nervous because I was told a large Ti frame weighs 4 pounds. Makes me think the Kona rep may have inflated the steel numbers to make the Ti numbers seem more impressive. Either way I'll be a little pinched if the large Ti frame I have on order is 4.9 pounds.

    My 2012 large steel frame weighs 6.98 pounds, weighed on a scale I know to be accurate.
    Sorry to may have killed your stoke if I did, sure the Ti Honzo will be amazing regardless of final weights.

    Here's the message the Kona rep sent me if you are curious.

    "Hi, we had the 2016 frame on the scale at 7.4 lbs. I don’t have a 2015 left to check but I bet if you picked up both frames blindfolded you wouldn’t feel a difference. Now the Ti one, that’s 4.9 lbs so you’d feel that. Happy Trails!"

    "That’s the Medium on the scale, about the only size we scale. Ti is more supple than steel. It makes steel feel like it’s aluminum. It’s a total magic carpet ride. Unfortunately at many times the price of steel"
    Ride On!

  70. #70
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    I know....
    I asks too much-
    But, only one bottle cage right?

    5lbs for a hard tail in Ti.
    Surely I'd put worthy tires on it- something chewy.
    And a stout fork.
    And one bottle cage.
    Harrumph. Getting heavier.

    Might not be the solution to the puzzle I'm looking to solve.
    But- the industry will keep making ways to take my $$.
    I'll be happy to ride what I have another season while I look for a new option.
    Perhaps in that time- they will calm the hell down with axle standards.
    But I've beat that dead horse enough.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgusta View Post
    Sorry to may have killed your stoke if I did, sure the Ti Honzo will be amazing regardless of final weights.

    Here's the message the Kona rep sent me if you are curious.

    "Hi, we had the 2016 frame on the scale at 7.4 lbs. I don’t have a 2015 left to check but I bet if you picked up both frames blindfolded you wouldn’t feel a difference. Now the Ti one, that’s 4.9 lbs so you’d feel that. Happy Trails!"

    "That’s the Medium on the scale, about the only size we scale. Ti is more supple than steel. It makes steel feel like it’s aluminum. It’s a total magic carpet ride. Unfortunately at many times the price of steel"
    No worries, you didn't harsh my stoke at all. It annoys me a little when bike reps don't give a straight answer. When my frame arrives I'll be stoked 4 pounds or not. But note to any of you bike reps out there. When a customer asks a question, either give it to them straight, or just say, "I don't know." I knew the Ti frame was not 4 pounds, so I won't be surprised when it's a bit porkier.

    But in the end these are first world problems. The new parts I ordered have arrived and now I'm just waiting anxiously to build up the new bike.

  72. #72
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    That's a little beefy for a Ti frame, but the Honzo calls for an overbuilt frame, given the type of riding it is designed for.

    i.a.n. - any update on your frame arrival? The waiting is killing me!

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    That's a little beefy for a Ti frame, but the Honzo calls for an overbuilt frame, given the type of riding it is designed for.

    i.a.n. - any update on your frame arrival? The waiting is killing me!
    Killing you!? I'm dying here! Last Wednesday I was told two weeks. So 9 more days! The new Fox 34 fork I picked up is sitting here...taunting me!

  74. #74
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    Same here...even just forked out for a new XT 1x11 drivetrain. Everything ready...except the frame. I'm in Canada and was told ready to ship in middle of October.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    Same here...even just forked out for a new XT 1x11 drivetrain. Everything ready...except the frame. I'm in Canada and was told ready to ship in middle of October.
    Nice! I'll try not to rub it in too much when mine finally arrives. :-)

  76. #76
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    I need help!!
    I want a bike to rip around a cross country track near my house. Track has rock gardens, jumps and big berms. Plenty of climbing/pedalling necessary Relatively smooth though.
    Honzo Aluminium OR honzo steel!?
    No money for Ti

  77. #77
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    Never tried the AL, but the steel (2013 in my case) is one of the funnest bikes I've ever ridden. If I had an easy way to unload my current frame I'd go back to a Honzo st/ti or maybe a Canfield EPO without hesitation.

  78. #78
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    Just read that American Classic is releasing a fattie wheelset soon that's almost cross country weight.

    40mm inner width 27.5 and 29 wheelsets in the 1700g range for around $800. Considering the 27.5 to run 3.0s on the Honzo Ti for chunky stuff in the Sierras.

    American Classic Packs Heat with New 40mm Smokin? Gun Wheel Set | Singletracks Mountain Bike News

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    Just read that American Classic is releasing a fattie wheelset soon that's almost cross country weight.

    40mm inner width 27.5 and 29 wheelsets in the 1700g range for around $800. Considering the 27.5 to run 3.0s on the Honzo Ti for chunky stuff in the Sierras.

    American Classic Packs Heat with New 40mm Smokin? Gun Wheel Set | Singletracks Mountain Bike News
    Maybe overkill for non-boost hubs though?

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB666 View Post
    Maybe overkill for non-boost hubs though?

    Overkill? How so? I can ride my current 29er wheelset in any conditions, but for shuttle rides in places like Downieville the thought of running super low PSI on 3.0 tires sounds very enticing.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by i.a.n. View Post
    Overkill? How so? I can ride my current 29er wheelset in any conditions, but for shuttle rides in places like Downieville the thought of running super low PSI on 3.0 tires sounds very enticing.
    Oh I wasn't saying it WAS overkill, was totally just asking opinions, I don't know much about the world of wider rims yet.. I wasn't referring to the 3" tires as overkill, more so the 40mm internal width rims coupled with a 142 and 100 spaced hub set. But I suppose if the 3" tires aren't overkill then there isn't any reason why the 40mm rim would be - I was just curious

  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB666 View Post
    Oh I wasn't saying it WAS overkill, was totally just asking opinions, I don't know much about the world of wider rims yet.. I wasn't referring to the 3" tires as overkill, more so the 40mm internal width rims coupled with a 142 and 100 spaced hub set. But I suppose if the 3" tires aren't overkill then there isn't any reason why the 40mm rim would be - I was just curious
    Gotcha. Well, as someone who has drank (drunk? drunken? dranken?) the wide rim cool aid, I can honestly say the 29mm rims I'm currently on have made a big difference in how the tire behaves and I can run much lower PSI without the tire rolling around on the rim. And it kinda seems like a second, uber-wide 27.5 wheelset with fat tires almost gives me two bikes in one.

    Cheaper than buying two bikes. :-)

  83. #83
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    I'd probably go with WTB scraper rims or go Chinese carbon instead. I've had some good luck with AC wheels, but in my experience they aren't the best for gnarly trails. The beads are super thin; if it's rocky get ready for dents. As I say, I had a good experience, but lots of folks out there with lots of problems. My 2 cents.

  84. #84
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    I've been running some Light Bike carbon rims on two bikes. I suppose these are Chinese carbon, though at $170 each I can't say they are cheap.
    Not sure I'm going any faster but- I really like them.
    If you liked moving to a thru axle and felt the difference, you'd like carbon rims. At least in my experience.

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  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by chunkylover53 View Post
    I'd probably go with WTB scraper rims or go Chinese carbon instead. I've had some good luck with AC wheels, but in my experience they aren't the best for gnarly trails. The beads are super thin; if it's rocky get ready for dents. As I say, I had a good experience, but lots of folks out there with lots of problems. My 2 cents.
    I'm sure the Scraper rim works great, but I've had some issues with WTB wheels that leave me a bit skeptical. I also don't want to spend the extra dough to build up a complete wheelset since the Scraper is available only as a rim. Plus, the 27.5 Scraper rim alone is 650g. The entire American Classic front wheel is 810g.

    I'm also a lightweight at 160 lbs, so I'm not too concerned about braking most wheelsets. I'll wait to see how this wheel does in some real world tests, but they look pretty good on paper.

  86. #86
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    Any updates from anybody on arrival? I was told end of September, then mid October, now, maybe beginning of November? I guess it's all pretty normal for new frame.

  87. #87
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    Two weeks ago I was told...two weeks. Which to me means at least a month. I'm trying not to look at the calendar and be patient. Not one of my strengths.

  88. #88
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    My LBS was told today that Kona is expecting shipments at the end of October and November. The first batch of orders should be arriving in local stores at the beginning on November.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  89. #89
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    My Euro dealer said they weren't even getting any TIs, this sucks.

  90. #90
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    What the crap?
    Who's turning these out? Surely Asia can make me quick or is is dubbed out to Lynsky? I've read of too many Ti hikes lately.

  91. #91
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    It sucks because I was hoping to ride it before winter, but I was told when I ordered the frame at the beginning of August that it would be here around the middle of October or the beginning of November.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  92. #92
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    It sucks for a handful of reasons, including that Ti frames are reinventing the wheel.
    Also becuase it's 2016 model. When did the industry teach us to expect next year now?
    Back in the day, or somewhere around then, if the 2016 model actually came out in 2016- we'd have been fine w/ it. (I'm looking at you Fox. I think they just released their new soon to fail new coating on the 2017 models at InterBike <--- thats a joke)

    It also sucks because somebody knows when they will be truly available. And if that person told the world that the Ti Honza wouldn't be available until winter- we'd have been bummed but mostly OK w/ it.
    But this BS that the frame is "just around the next turn" was a lame song the first time I heard it.

    On the other hand- NOBODY is riding our local trails seeing how much of Colorado is forgotten this time of year.
    The leaves are mostly still great. The smells of fall are amazing.
    So there's that. Go ride.

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  93. #93
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    In Norway the pricing for the TI Honzo is $350 more than the EPO, add that to no one here being able to get a TI and I guess I'm either stuck with the EPO (not a bad thing really) or I'll have to sit on the fence and wait.

  94. #94
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    What about ordering from somewhere like bikeman.com and having them ship it to you? Does that get too expensive?

  95. #95
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    That'd be alot more expensive, somewhere around $750 more than the EPO, because I'd have to pay taxes on the imported TI.

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB666 View Post
    Buy this bike and you basically wont need another hardtail ever again
    We find any means to justify bright and shiny objects. Those of us that have been doing for more than a dozen years know that this is just a one-man mind game. One that you cannot win...

    But hell yeah, I'm getting one too
    Every rose has it's thorn.

    enjoy the ear worm

  97. #97
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    Just looked at the 2016 Honzo AL at my lbs because I'm considering a frame purchase. Tire clearance *might* be an issue in the rear: Stock Ardent 2.25 on a WTB 25mm rim leaves not a lot of clearance at the CS/BB junction - perhaps 5mm on each side. With super short stays and alloy construction, I can't help be wonder if an honest 2.4" tire would rub. I'm not in a hurry to build one up with less tire volume.
    If anyone bought one and is running bigger meat in the back, please post up.
    Every rose has it's thorn.

    enjoy the ear worm

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Entrenador View Post
    Just looked at the 2016 Honzo AL at my lbs because I'm considering a frame purchase. Tire clearance *might* be an issue in the rear: Stock Ardent 2.25 on a WTB 25mm rim leaves not a lot of clearance at the CS/BB junction - perhaps 5mm on each side. With super short stays and alloy construction, I can't help be wonder if an honest 2.4" tire would rub. I'm not in a hurry to build one up with less tire volume.
    If anyone bought one and is running bigger meat in the back, please post up.
    The construction on the aluminum is different. The steel and Ti versions are more of a yoke design - if you look at the bb/chainstay area on the Kona website, you'll see the difference. I don't think tire clearance will be an issue

  99. #99
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    I was told today my frame will ship sometime this week and arrive next week. We'll see. But I'm getting jumpy!

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    Those looking for more clearance in the rear: You can always check out Walt -- he's one of the best. Dig it: This frame could run 27.5/+ or 29/+ just fine, with stays as short as you'd want. After all my hem & hawing over the Ti Honzo and the EPO, this is the direction I'm leaning:

    On plus bikes, jealousy, and the shortest chainstays you?ll probably ever see |

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