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Thread: coiler or dawg?

  1. #1
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    coiler or dawg?

    hey whats up. trying to determine if i want the coiler or the dawg/ dawg matic...
    i like to do all kinds of riding... xc/ soem free ride/trail rideing etc.. what would be a good do it all bike ?

  2. #2
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    From the short description of your riding style, you sound like a prime candidate for the Dawg series. Although, I chose my Coiler-Dee because I'm on the heavy side and notoriously hard on components. I was willing to go with the heavier bike for added reliability. I have never regretted this choice, and this bike has advanced my riding skills substantially. I am now considering experimenting with some downhill racing, which is not something that I would have attempted with the Dawg.

  3. #3
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    Dawg/Dawg-matic

    Also remember (if you're talking about 2005 model bikes) that the Dawgmatic is only a 4" travel bike were the rest of the Dawg line is 5" of rear travel.

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    yea why is the dawg matic only 4"
    i dont even like the color of the dawg and it costs a ton more...

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    If you see you ride more XC than Freeride, go with the Dawg. If you see you riding doing more freeriding, or possibly more in the future go with the coiler. After all the bigger the bike the more confidence you will probobly get. I have an 04 Coiler and it's perfect for the do it all rig, I however do more freeride than XC so take it fo what its worth.
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    what exactly is the difference in FReeriding and XC?

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    Freeriding covers a mix of a lot of different riding styles. If you plan on consistently doing drops of 4 feet or more i would get the coiler if you only do 4 foot drops every now and then get the Dawg. I use my Coiler for everything. I do alot of agressive XC, freeriding and some downhill, and haven't met its match. If you forsee yourself getting into more "extreeme" riding the coiler will be more durable.

    The bigest difference between the Coiler and the Dawg is "beef". The Dawg is going to be 4-5lbs lighter than the Coiler, but isn't going to hold up to alot of repeated abuse. The coiler weighs around 36-37lbs and will hold up on the harder hits, but is a little harder to climb with do to the extra weight.

    Right now, baised off your last response I think the Dawg would be the better choice for you. However if you can foresee a little light freeriding in your future the coiler will be better for you in the long run.

    feel free to PM me if you need any help.
    Good luck.
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    im gonna have to go to a bike shop and compare the two.
    i can see myself doing more freeriding in the future, im probably moving out west next year.... i like to do a variety of things too so its hard to say

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    The Dawg will limit you ability to ride a lot of different styles, but the Coiler will hold up and be able to perform well with anything thrown at it.

    ****** Just remember this when buying The Dawg will climb better, but won't be able to do larger drops. The coiler will be able to climb at a slower pace, and still be able to take multiple large drops. ******

    I do everthing with my Coiler, climb downhill and Freeride and haven't exceeded any of the bikes limitations.
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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    do either of these bikes come with lockout features front or rear? i think the main concern is with the coiler in climbing... but some of my friends i ride with around here have the Giant AC and the kona stinky and they go everywhere i go with my xc bike no problem..
    how much of a difference is that 4 pounds even gonna make?

    what does the stinky weigh? that would give me a good idea as to how heavy the coiler would be

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    Or U could....

    try to get one of the 1st generation Coilers , they are 5" rear and will hold up to anything, and will climb a little better than the later 6" Coilers becuz of the shorter chainstays.
    I think I saw some of them at closeout prices at www.wheelworld.com.
    Cheers

  12. #12
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    I went with the coiler for two reasons. Coil shock/fork (HATE air forks and shocks) and the fact that I like to enter novice level downhills once or twice a year....oh...and the fact that I'm 220lbs in gear...wait...that's three reasons....OK...I went with the coiler for three reasons. Oh...and the fact that the coiler is a well balanced, great all around bike...wait...that's four reasons...OK...I went with the coiler for four reasons. Oh....the yellow on the Primo kicks ass...wait...that's five reasons....OK...OK...OK....I went with the coiler for five reasons. Oh...and it's spec'ed out like a hot fudge sundae with whipped cream, chocolate sauce, nuts, sprinkles, AND A CHERRY!!! Wait...that's six reasons....damn it......
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  13. #13
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    coiler

    Just man up and get the coiler, it's more fun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    do either of these bikes come with lockout features front or rear? i think the main concern is with the coiler in climbing...
    The Coiler does not need lock out for the shock. The Pro Pedal works very well. I have been very pleased with the climbing ability of my '05 Coiler DL, in and out of the saddle. The fork does bob but it is not a big deal. I still ride it like I ride my singlespeed.

    The longer (one tenth of one inch) chainstay length of the '05 vs '04 makes no difference.
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    According to Kona, the Coiler is 34.8lbs, and the Stinky is 37.8. Those seem pretty low. The Coiler is definitely a better climber and all around bike than the Stinky.

  16. #16
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    Go Coiler. You'll definately outgrow the Dawg, where as the Coiler has room to grow.
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  17. #17
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    Coiler or Dawg for me?

    Hi all, I've got an '04 Dawg, absolutely love it. I was thinking of getting an upgraded bike, actually considered a Titus, they're made about 6 miles from me in AZ, but would love to stay Kona. Opinions, please! I am going to go Primo level this time, but Dawg vs. Coiler? I'm 43, 5'7", 170, probably never push a Coiler to it's potential, but not sure if maybe that's the way? I love trail riding with some rough, but don't do really wild decsents. Stay withe Dawg, or go Coiler? AZ does have some pretty rough stuff, if I do get to the point of riding it. Thanks for the opinions!

    Come fry in AZ with me!

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    Alright well i just test rode a dawg and a coiler... huge differences! This makes it even more difficult. THe coiler has so much more flex its rediculous... its really a lot more bike..
    Also the blue they use for the coiler looks a lot better in real life than in the magazine
    I really like the coiler and the onlything that worries me is not being able to use it for xc. The dawg really is a beefy bike as well, especially since im used to riding my xc hardtail bike now. There really isnt much difference in weight, atleast by picking both of them up. But the coiler rode a lot different with much more flex while the dog was a beefy bike but didnt seem to flex out as much in the rear like the coiler did..... man what to do

  19. #19
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    What kind of differences? I have the Dawg, am going to go Primo, Dawg or Coiler. When you say differences, what do you think of the Coiler for trails? If you ever come to AZ, there is some great riding here, let me know you're coming!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    But the coiler rode a lot different with much more flex while the dog was a beefy bike but didnt seem to flex out as much in the rear like the coiler did(
    Whut??? The Coiler should feel more solid as far as "flex" than the Dawg!! The only thing I can think is that you are mistaking "sag" for "flex". Did the shop put the proper spring preload on both bikes for your weight? The Coiler's rear triangle is much more stout and won't "flex" (talking side to side lateral motion when under turning or technical riding load) near as much as the Dawg.

    No way the Coiler flexed more than the Dawg...not possible...nope...no way....nuh uh....pfft...
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by fireboy
    Whut??? The Coiler should feel more solid as far as "flex" than the Dawg!! The only thing I can think is that you are mistaking "sag" for "flex". Did the shop put the proper spring preload on both bikes for your weight? The Coiler's rear triangle is much more stout and won't "flex" (talking side to side lateral motion when under turning or technical riding load) near as much as the Dawg.

    No way the Coiler flexed more than the Dawg...not possible...nope...no way....nuh uh....pfft...
    ...or plushness. The Coiler's suspension travel is much more noticeable than the Dawg's. Coil springs have a much different feel than air springs.

    Setup can make HUGE differences, too.
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  22. #22
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    Whut??? The Coiler should feel more solid as far as "flex" than the Dawg!!
    Totaly agree. The chainstays and linkage on the Coiler are total beef compaired to that of the dawg. You must be refering to sag and possibly a little bob. The Coiler still seems like it will be the best bike for your needs. Don't worry about XC capabillities, the coiler can handle everything you throw at it!

    As far as weight goes, My 04 Coiler with all my upgrades is close to stock weight and it is right around 36-37 pounds. You could easilly shave 1 - 1/12 pounds by going with Stans tubless system. The Stinky I think will weigh in around 42 pounds stock and the Dawg around 32 pounds.

    As for the fella in AZ. I think the Dawg would suit you a little better than the Coiler. Seems as if you are an agressive XCer and the Dawg will work great for it and the occasional 3-4 foot drop. If you do drops/jumps more frequintl go for the Coiler, but the Dawg seems righ up your alley.
    Last edited by drum714; 05-31-2005 at 08:25 PM.
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    Yea sorry about the misunderstanding.. i guess i meant sag.. but i refer to it as flex... i just meant when riding aorund in a parking lot the coiler was "bouncier" like even when u sat down it it and sagged down where the dawg didnt do it so much but still seemed like a lot of bike.. so i donno what to go with thus far.. i still like my fair amount of xc style and using my bike to stay in shape for a big day of riding.. both sweet bikes though!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy
    ...or plushness.
    THAT'S the word I was looking for!!!
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    Yea sorry about the misunderstanding.. i guess i meant sag.. but i refer to it as flex... i just meant when riding aorund in a parking lot the coiler was "bouncier" like even when u sat down it it and sagged down where the dawg didnt do it so much but still seemed like a lot of bike.. so i donno what to go with thus far.. i still like my fair amount of xc style and using my bike to stay in shape for a big day of riding.. both sweet bikes though!
    Number one, if the coiler was too bouncy...the propedal wasn't adjusted properly for your weight. Number two, when you sit on any FS bike, the bike should sink (sag) into just short of 1/3 of it's travel...whether it's the Dawg or the Coiler. Dawg should have squatted about 1.6666666 inches while the Coiler would squat 2.0 (not a real big difference, eh??). Number three, the Coiler is actually quite a nimble bike if you keep in mind it's intended use. I find I can climb anything I would climb on my Hardtail or my Rigid. I go a little slower, might be a gear down from the other two bikes, but she doesn't walk all over the hill or "nose up" as you climb, even with the 66RC on the front. So, number 4, as far as staying in shape, ride the Coiler XC and you'll go just as far as the Dawg...and hauling the extra 5 lbs of bike will definitely make a man of you!!!

    which ever you get....you'll love it....Kona's kick ass....and that's coming from someone who's owned nothing but "boutique" bikes, for years, until purchasing his Coiler last month.
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

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    whats this propedal all about? Yea i dont think it was adjusted properly as it was an 18" frame and im only 5'7 so id want to ride a 17" i think. Do either have a front shock that you can easily adjust like the manitou minute shock? those are awesome.
    Fireboy, sounds like you used to ride xc bikes until the coiler, how do you like the difference? Can you still get going real nice on flat and uphills like with a xc hardtail?

    on the other hand , as far as weight goes, i didnt notice much of any difference between picking up the two, they both were heavy.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    whats this propedal all about? Yea i dont think it was adjusted properly as it was an 18" frame and im only 5'7 so id want to ride a 17" i think. Do either have a front shock that you can easily adjust like the manitou minute shock? those are awesome.
    Fireboy, sounds like you used to ride xc bikes until the coiler, how do you like the difference? Can you still get going real nice on flat and uphills like with a xc hardtail?

    on the other hand , as far as weight goes, i didnt notice much of any difference between picking up the two, they both were heavy.
    Pro Pedal is a valving in the rear shock that keeps you bike from bobbing because of pedaling input. The shock remains active to bumps. The level of "anti-bob" can be adjusted. My '05 Coiler DL has almost no rear suspension movement on smooth climbs or flats in the saddle and moderate movement out of the saddle. It remains very compliant over bumps, rocks and logs.

    On trails and road climbs I ride the Coiler DL pretty much the same way I ride my rigid singlespeed - with some gear shifting, of course.
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  28. #28
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    Do either have a front shock that you can easily adjust like the manitou minute shock? those are awesome.
    I have a Rock Shox Pike Race on my 04 coiler and couldn't be any happier. Quick effective on the fly adjustments including lock out and travel adjustment. I agree with Shiggy, my bike very rarley noses up, but when I climb I drop my fork to 100mm of travel, and my front wheel stays glued to the ground. Plus if you get the 05 coiler, which has a 6 inch fork,you'll drop the front of your bike a little because the Pike is a 5.5 inch fork.

    My Coiler/Pike setup has seen regular 4-6 foot drops and the occasional 8 foot drop while still doing the longer 10-15 mile rides. This thing was a dream in moab, keeping up with the XCers, and still being able to have more fun on the downhills and the "extraciricular trail activities"

    I'm still convinced that the Coiler is the right bike for you. If I'm not mistaken you are coming from a hardtail, as was I when I got my Coiler. The extra sqwishiness of the bike is weird at first, which would explain why the "firmer" ride of the Dawg felt better to you, but you will learn to feel more comfortable as you ride it more. Don't discount the ride of the Coiler when properly setup, it can peddal like a dream and take 6 foot drops like a curb all in the same ride!
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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    we just did about a 15 mile ride tonight after work and i rode a stinky for a little ways on xc. That thing was so hard to ride on flat and uphills.. i wouldnt want anything like that.. Its an 04 stinky.. how much different is the coiler?
    I like to do a fair amount of xc and the coiler seems like it could do that well with its rating of 3 for xc in the kona catalog and by adjusting the shock right, but i would only get the regular coiler.. not deelux or anything, will that make a diff in shock?
    The dog even felt like a big bike to me because yes i do ride a hardtail xc right now..
    what the difference in the coil shock and the air shock?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    we just did about a 15 mile ride tonight after work and i rode a stinky for a little ways on xc. That thing was so hard to ride on flat and uphills.. i wouldnt want anything like that.. Its an 04 stinky.. how much different is the coiler?
    I like to do a fair amount of xc and the coiler seems like it could do that well with its rating of 3 for xc in the kona catalog and by adjusting the shock right, but i would only get the regular coiler.. not deelux or anything, will that make a diff in shock?
    The dog even felt like a big bike to me because yes i do ride a hardtail xc right now..
    what the difference in the coil shock and the air shock?
    The Stinkys have shorter top tubes and more cramped cockpits. More DH style. The Coilers are longer and more XC style.

    I could not stand the Stinky I rode last year. I felt like I either had the bars in my belly or my feet and hands were WAY in front of me and I was doing a pullup.

    The Coiler felt totally natural.

    I bought a Coiler DL.

    I did not buy a Dawg because I preferred the plushness of the coil shock vs the air shock.

    I also am coming from a XC/trail hardtail background. I do still ride my hardtail (singlespeed). I also ride the Coiler as a trail bike.
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  31. #31
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    we just did about a 15 mile ride tonight after work and i rode a stinky for a little ways on xc. That thing was so hard to ride on flat and uphills.. i wouldnt want anything like that.. Its an 04 stinky.. how much different is the coiler?
    The coiler is going to weigh 5-6 pound less than the stinky, and like Shiggy said the Coiler also has a longer top tube so your weight will be more forward for those longer climbs. The Stinky is setup more for going down where as the coiler is setup for going up and/or down. Outside of that the stinky and Coiler are going to ride very simmilar, very little peddal bob on the ups and a very plush ride on the downs.
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohhpe
    do either of these bikes come with lockout features front or rear? i think the main concern is with the coiler in climbing
    lockout is for people that don't know how to pedal.

    imho, (well, not really that humble) if you're not racing, there's no reason to buy a dawg. the shocks on the coiler actually work, which i don't think is really the case with the dawg, but then i hate air shocks.

    my coiler is a big one, 20" and weighs around 32-33 lbs. really pretty reasonable for a non-race bike.
    mark weaver
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    First off...I moved from an Ellsworth Joker to the Coiler...and the linkage of the coiler vs. the single pivot Joker...no competition...the Coiler wins...hands down.

    As far as comparing the Coiler to my Stiffee hard tail or my Fisher Pro Caliber rigid...forget it...that's like comparing apples to howitzers. You have to remember THE INTENDED USE of a Coiler. If you're wanting ANY FS bike to climb or rip on the flats like a hardtail....BUY A HARDTAIL!!!

    I'm sorry...but it just seems that you are wanting the bling bling of an FS bike, but you want the efficiency of a hardtail...NOT GONNA HAPPEN.

    stay safe...good luck

    terry
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by velosapiens
    lockout is for people that don't know how to pedal.

    imho, (well, not really that humble) if you're not racing, there's no reason to buy a dawg. the shocks on the coiler actually work, which i don't think is really the case with the dawg, but then i hate air shocks.

    my coiler is a big one, 20" and weighs around 32-33 lbs. really pretty reasonable for a non-race bike.
    Yeah. I have lockout on the fork on my SS. Rarely use it and most the time when I do it feels HARDER to pedal the bike.

    32-33? Dang! That is LIGHT, Mark. My 19" C DL (shiggified) is 43. I only really notice the weight when putting the bike on top of the car or walking it up a hill.

    Coil springs.......mmmmmm!
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy
    Coil springs.......mmmmmm!
    Amen brutha....
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  36. #36
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    Seriously.... 32-33 lbs thats realy light espeicily for a large frame. My 04 small Coiler is around 36-37lbs with some medium weight 2.5 tires. Going tubless in a couple of days so hopfuly I'll lose a pound or two!
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by drum714
    Seriously.... 32-33 lbs thats realy light espeicily for a large frame.
    hmm. well, it's possible i'm lying. my memory ain't what it used to be. if i remember, i'll weight it tonight. hopefully it weighs more. then i can bust on the 20-somethings with light hardtails even more when i climb easily away from them. heh heh.
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    Going tubless in a couple of days so hopfuly I'll lose a pound or two!
    Finally got it all set up, and lost about a pound. My bike weights in at just under 35lbs. I scored some Stans mix from my LBS and my rim strips from maxxis for $5 a peice plus $5 shipping, but they threw in a free T-shirt and a bunch of stickers. Not a bad deal if you ask me.
    It's not a good ride if you don't scare yourself at least once.


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