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  1. #1
    true washington local
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    Which to buy: Dawg or Coiler

    I already posted in the "Which bike to buy" forum but am cross-posting here to see if you guys have some more input for me.

    I am looking to buy a new bike in the next week or two. I live in Washington and have been biking most of my life, but it's been a while since I've biked a lot. When I did bike I enjoyed the technical XC riding with obscacles, hills, and climbs, and maybe small jumps but I'm not crazy so I stay away from the huge stuff. Also, I loved riding/hiking to the top of a steep ski-resort (Crystal Mountain) and bombing down. I'm not really into riding the chair lift or going off huge jumps. But I do ride pretty fast and hard compared to the average person, willing to take risks for some fun.

    So, I'm looking at the Dawg and the Coiler. I'm 5'10" and about 215 lbs (damn office job ). I hope to lose like 20-30 lbs when I get back into riding . I'm leaning toward the coiler since you can change the coil out for a stiffer spring. I don't want to put much, if any, money into upgrades. I see all these people changing forks and rear shocks, and I'm thinking I want it to have the forks and shocks I like to begin with. From what I hear the Coiler is OK at climbing. I'm not really sure how they compare though. I hear some people say they like the coiler for climbing better than the Dawg due to suspension. I know the Coiler has a slightly more laid back riding position so wheelie's might be more of an issue on the coiler, but does the suspension make up for it? Also, I think the thrill I'd get of riding downhill on the coiler would outweigh the better climbing of the Dawg (if it does climb better), because my favorite part of the ride is going down, not up.

    Also, I see that it's hard to find a 17" Coiler around this time of year. All the shops are saying Kona is out of them. I might have found one shop with one, but won't know for sure till later today. If there is no 17" Coiler around, I'm looking at the Coiler Dee-Lux. It's a lot of $$$, definately more than I planned to spend, but I can afford it and the best part is that my wife is OK with that. I'd love to have the nicer components of the coiler dee-lux, but am still wondering if that is really the best bike for me or not.

    Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Contagious Xian
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    My thoughts exactly

    "From what I hear the Coiler is OK at climbing. I'm not really sure how they compare though. I hear some people say they like the coiler for climbing better than the Dawg due to suspension. I know the Coiler has a slightly more laid back riding position so wheelie's might be more of an issue on the coiler, but does the suspension make up for it? Also, I think the thrill I'd get of riding downhill on the coiler would outweigh the better climbing of the Dawg (if it does climb better), because my favorite part of the ride is going down, not up."

    This is why I bought an '04 Coiler - I'm a lousy climber so this bike has helped me get into decent shape and the bombing is where the bike shines. You earn your descending on this bike but won't die getting up there in the process. I've changed a few minor things about the bike (shorter dh stem and wider riser bars, new tires, 8" rotor up front, bash guard).

    Test drive both until you've made up your mind. If you're like me, the Coiler will inspire a lot more confidence and you'll be happy with the bike.

    Have fun.
    Last edited by Bombin4X; 06-23-2005 at 11:51 AM. Reason: goof

  3. #3
    true washington local
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    I test rode a 17" Coiler and an 18" Coiler Dee-Lux today. Oh man were they sweet rides. Turns out the 17" is too small for me, the 18" felt way more comfortable.

    However, the more I think about this type of riding I do, I really don't ever plan on taking any huge hits or dropping 10 footers or anything like that, and there's a lot of XC trails around here, so I am thinking the Dawg would be a better fit for me. The Dawg Dee-Lux has the Fox Float RP3 which has propedal and from what I've heard some people say it climbs better than their hard tails. While climbing is not my favorite, it's still something I'll have to do and the Coiler still seems a little more on the downhill side of things than what I do, while the Dawg still rocks at downhill, or so I hear.

    So, I'm going to try and find a 18" Dawg Dee-Lux to test ride and hopefully buy a bike this weekend. I'm itching to do some riding. I'm going to Lake Sawyer this weekend which has some killer technical XC riding, but no downhill at all.

  4. #4
    Nouveau Retrogrouch SuperModerator
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    I bought a Coiler DL vs a Dawg mostly because I prefer the feel of the coil spring rather than the air shock. Remember than an air shock can be adjusted more easily for your body weight. Just use a pump. No spring swapping.

    Both the Dawg and the Coiler climb well. The Coilers are designed to go 'bigger" on the downhills.
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  5. #5
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    Basically, the Coiler will descend better than the Dawg, and the Dawg will climb better than the Coiler.

  6. #6
    true washington local
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    What do you think about shops that offer life-time tune-ups? The ones that don't will knock $200 off the price of a Coiler Dee-Lux. Do you think it's worth it?

  7. #7
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    It's the same old story...

    How do you want to pay for your tune ups. You can pay me a lot now and I will use your money to MY advantage, or I'll give you a break and only hit you a little at a time when you need the service. That's how I look at it. I never buy service plans for anything. The reason this is a "safe bet" for most products is that people either never use the service or they sell the item thereby nullifying the contract. If you're mechanically inclined or have a good friend who is, or are willing to buy a book/CD and wrench yourself you will be better off doing most adjustments yourself. Case in point, your out on the trail or on vacation in the mountains. Where is your lifetime tune up shop now when your rear derailleur goes out of whack? This service IMO is best for folks that can't figure out which end of the screwdriver to hold on to and never leave the housing development they live in. All that being said I would still hege toward the shop that offers the best technical know-how and has the best overall customer service. If that happens to be the shop that offers lifetime tune ups you may want to stick with them anyway. Bear in mind though, tune ups are generally turn a cable adjuster, lube the chain and your good to go.
    Try to pick out anything by itself and you find it connected to the entire universe.

  8. #8
    true washington local
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    Heh, yeah I think that's a good way to look at it. I'd rather get the $200 discount on the bike and then either tune it myself or pay $15-$20 a couple times to have it tuned. I don't see myself going there much unless something breaks and is covered on warranty, and their service plan is not going to cover that anyway, the warranty is. I really wanted to buy from the Bonney Lake Bike shop since I live in Bonney Lake and it's close, but the customer service I received was not the best. It was OK most of the time, but this one guy I think belonged in a harley shop and as a repair guy, not in sales. They would not budge on price, saying that they signed a contract with Kona and that they could get in trouble for selling it under MSRP. I tried to reason with him, but he wouldn't budge. I walked out and said I'm going to buy it from the shop that will discount the price. I don't care if they get in trouble or not, it's saving me $200 and frankly I don't think Kona cares if a shop sells it under MSRP, Kona is still getting wholesale price from the shop so they're not losing out. Maybe I'm wrong, but it would really surprise me if this is true.

  9. #9
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    Dunno about you...but I avoided the dawg because of the air front and rear suspension. If you're 215 lbs. (as am I) air is just too harsh at the pressures needed for proper sag, IMHO. Also, blowing the seals on a coil fork/shock will still get you back home in comfort. Do it on a air and have a nice walk home. The plushness of a coil/oil makes up for the extra weight...also...just MHO. I love my coiler primo!
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  10. #10
    true washington local
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    So I've thought about the bike a lot, and given the type of riding I do, I think the Dawg would be a better bike for me. Most of the trails around are XC trails, and when I do go up the big mountains, I'm not all padded up with a full face helmet and chest pad etc. I mostly stay on the trail. I like to haul, but I think the Dawg would be fine at that. Maybe the coiler would be a little better with the 66 degree head angle, but I think it's worth sacrificing that for something better at XC trails, and $300 lower in price as well. Now to place an order

  11. #11
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    Can't you just add air pressure to adjust for proper sag? I think I'll go ride one and see what I think. I'm really not concerned about blowing a seal cause I'm not into big hits.
    Last edited by mryerse; 06-24-2005 at 12:51 PM.

  12. #12
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    Good Points that I forgot to mention...

    Quote Originally Posted by fireboy
    Dunno about you...but I avoided the dawg because of the air front and rear suspension. If you're 215 lbs. (as am I) air is just too harsh at the pressures needed for proper sag, IMHO. Also, blowing the seals on a coil fork/shock will still get you back home in comfort. Do it on a air and have a nice walk home. The plushness of a coil/oil makes up for the extra weight...also...just MHO. I love my coiler primo!
    Good points - with gear I'm about 220ish and I prefer the coils versus the air shocks I've had. One thing I'd recommend to mryerse to consider is that the Coiler is not a FR or DH bike - they make the Stinky and the Stab for that kind of riding (and some folks still are ok climbing on the Stinky from what I've read). Pound for pound, the beef that comes with the Coiler at my weight and for the price I got mine made it an easy decision. I'm not sure I'd huck 10 ft on my Coiler even if it could withstand it but the solid ride under me descending singletrack and Moab is perfect (Coiler 19").

  13. #13
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    Wink It's up to you, not us...

    These are all good and valid points of view. I think there are plenty of burly guys riding Dawgs with no problems. Read the reviews on this site. Many say they are doing 4-6 foot drops with no issue. Personally that would scare the cr#p out of me! Maybe I'm a woos. Used to race MX though so I can't be too chicken. Point is you have to come to grips with the type of riding YOU will be doing and buy the bike that fits that style.
    Try to pick out anything by itself and you find it connected to the entire universe.

  14. #14
    true washington local
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    Totally. I definately do a lot of XC, but I like riding mountains a lot more. There's no shops with a Dawg Dee-Lux in my size, but they could order one if I wanted. However, the coiler seems like a really nice bike that I'd be happy with, and there's on at a shop nearby, so I think I'll just go pick it up tonight. This has been tough thinking over the last few days, but I think I'll be happy with it in the end.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by mryerse
    Totally. I definately do a lot of XC, but I like riding mountains a lot more. There's no shops with a Dawg Dee-Lux in my size, but they could order one if I wanted. However, the coiler seems like a really nice bike that I'd be happy with, and there's on at a shop nearby, so I think I'll just go pick it up tonight. This has been tough thinking over the last few days, but I think I'll be happy with it in the end.
    Can't really go wrong with a Kona

  16. #16
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    I think you'll be very happy with the Coiler,just make a few adjustments and it''ll xc fine.When I had a Stinky Primo a couple of years ago I rode it with several different setups,It was a Six inch travel like the Coiler and it XCed better then the Specialized FSR Enduro I had prior to it.If you get the standard coiler it wouldn't be hard to make a spacer out of PVC to install in the forks to drop the travel back to 5 inch.My stinky descinded pretty damn well with a 5 inch DJ3 on the front.

  17. #17
    true washington local
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    I picked up the '05 Coiler Dee-Lux, size 18. Took it out for a couple hour+ rides yesterday. Wow. Just Wow.

  18. #18
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    Nice!!

    Doesn't life suck when you have to agonize over whether to buy a Dawg or a Coiler??!! Glad to here you like it. Though it's a bit like choosing between 2 favorite ice cream flavors because you don't have the money to get both! Remember we'll be watching for that full ride report. You're too smitten right now to be journalistically objective!
    Try to pick out anything by itself and you find it connected to the entire universe.

  19. #19
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    Just wait...

    Quote Originally Posted by mryerse
    I picked up the '05 Coiler Dee-Lux, size 18. Took it out for a couple hour+ rides yesterday. Wow. Just Wow.
    ...until you take that bad boy out on your first epic ride and you can't wipe the smile off your face for 3 days

    Enjoy!

  20. #20
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    welcome

    ...to the cult of the coiler (my Cove has sat, unused, since the purchase of my Coiler Primo)!!! You'll be very happy with your purchase (you'd have been happy with the dawg, too). Kona's just plain kick ass, no matter what model you buy. I personally think they are one of the best "bang for the buck" bike brands out there. Hard to find another mass producing bike company that does the following:

    1. listens to their target consumers
    2. has employees that ride ALOT and know what works
    3. stays ahead of the curve on what's popular, not just "follow the crowd"
    4. stands behind their product without jerking you on warranties, etc.
    5. proves on a daily basis that you can build an innovative, quality product without charging sky high prices (the '05 line proves that!!!)
    6. backs the people who create areas to use their product (our local club received $500 from Kona to help build a new MTX course)

    They do alot of other cool **** too....it's just way too early for me to remember what they are....

    terry
    Boogers and Birthdays....the more you have...the harder it is to breath

  21. #21
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    I've been riding my new Dee-Lux for a couple weeks now. Most of my riding was XC with a little downhill. This bike is sooo sweet. I am very happy I bought it. The cost was high for my budget, but well worth it. I can tell it's going to last a long time.
    I am still on the 650 lb spring. I thought I would want to up it to over 700, maybe 800, but it actually seems to do pretty nice. I'll ride it a while longer before I do anything to the spring though.
    When riding this bike, it just begs to be ridden fast. It is so smooth and the suspension sucks up large drops and bumps really nicely. I took a 4 foot drop and it was like butter. I remember dropping things like that on my hardtail and you had to be ready for it, but on this Coiler it allows you to go much faster and offers a lot of give.
    Climbing is not as easy as it was on a hardtail, as expected. I am finding that I climb better when I don't pump real hard, but rather pedal a nice even rotation keeping the power the same all the way around. I really don't mind doing this though as I think it just makes me a better rider and forces me to get a better workout.
    I did change the pedals out to the Shimano 646 and am glad I did that for the type of riding I do.
    I got my first nick in the paint last night on the fork. I was kinda bummed since it's a new bike but it's going to get a lot more wear than that so no biggy.
    I really can't wait to take it up some bigger mountains like Crystal Mountain and Whistler.
    Finally got the dampening set how I like it. At first I thought I couldn't tell a difference in the settings, but I was riding the wrong terrain to test it. Once on the right terrain you can really feel the difference in each setting.
    Haven't messed with pro-pedal much though. I can't tell a difference with different settings, but like with the dampening maybe I'm just testing it wrong.
    When I am climbing hills I am wishing I was on a Kikapu or maybe a Dawg, but when I am bombing down a hill jumping all the bumps, there is no regret at all. That is what I really like to do so it fits me well.
    I'll need to spend some more time riding and tinkering to get it all set how I like it.

  22. #22
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    I was in the same position and decided on the Coiler. Put a deposit down today, should be in by the end of the week. It just seemed a little beefier and I am a relatively big guy that's not worried about weight until about 10lb increments. The Coiler seems ready to tackle just about anything.

  23. #23
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    congrats on the coiler

    just got my coiler dee 2 weeks ago and since i was in the middle of moving i got my first ride on monday. great bike, feels so stable on the trails. the place where i ride has some winding slow climbs with a fireroad at the top that comes to the bottom. i rewarded myself with the fireroad downhill after the climb. the coiler definitely takes some effort to climb but it will do it. downhill was amazing. im already looking for a nearby ski resort thats open for DHers.

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