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  1. #1
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    07 Coiler Deluxe Frame...

    hey all,
    i allowed a xxl coiler deluxe slip through my fingers @ $1700 used...currently i am in the market for a 20" (xxl) deluxe frame...any suggestions...???

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    i bought a frame from wheelworld with dhx 4.0 for 699
    sweet bike just a little heavy

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    what size...xxl...xl...l...med...sm...?
    Bikes + Wedding = Less Bikes

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    There still on sale there if you'd like here is the link, http://wheelworld.com/itemdetails.cfm?id=4959.

    Its a great platform. Only thing is its heavy so try getting light weight specs on the bike to make it easier on the climb

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    i am thinking about getting the same frame. the price is seemingly unbeatable. i ride a trek liquid 20 and am looking for a new rig to ride. i love having the 5.25", which the coiler has .75" more, of suspension that that has so i am thinking about the coiler deelux frame. can i make this thing come in around 33- 34 lbs without breaking the bank? i need something that can handle all aspects of a technical trail so im looking for a good all mountain bike.

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    Try going to all the hotdeal sites on mtbr (wheelwolrd, beyond bikes, pricepoint)and build it up musing there clearance stuff. Like check out this wheel set, shimano saint hubs and mavic rims for 200...http://www.pricepoint.com/detail/147...-Disc-Rims.htm... then this saint rear dereailler for 25...http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...rlr+135Mm.aspx... the shimao saint brakes 59$ ... http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...isc+Brake.aspx

    Search and the deals get smokin. I you need any help to find the best dealsI'd be more than glad to help...kind of a hobby since i'm looking to upgrade my set up

  7. #7
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    Here is a Coiler Deluxe 07 I just built up (it is still waiting on a few parts, crankset, seatpost and such, and a stiffer titanium spring, as soon as Obtanium has a new lot), but it climbs great as is, for a 36lb bike (Wotan's travel adjustment and platform adjust helps a lot with that)


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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    Here is a Coiler Deluxe 07 I just built up (it is still waiting on a few parts, crankset, seatpost and such, and a stiffer titanium spring, as soon as Obtanium has a new lot), but it climbs great as is, for a 36lb bike (Wotan's travel adjustment and platform adjust helps a lot with that)

    this looks like a great bike. how are things like brake jack and such? i have a traditional 4 bar on the liquid right now and that thing locks up tight when its bumpy and you hit the brakes. also, do you think it would make a good trail/ am bike?

    oh yeah, what is wotans travel adj? and im assuming that the platform adjust is propedal?

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    oh yeah, what is wotans travel adj? and im assuming that the platform adjust is propedal?
    Wotan adjusts from 160 ->120, via a remote on the bars. The Platform is called Albert Select and it's more similiar to Motion Control, it's a compression adjust that can adjusted from plush to lockout.

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    Mind giving us some illustration... kinda lost on how that works...SICK set up though

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by RED5
    Wotan adjusts from 160 ->120, via a remote on the bars. The Platform is called Albert Select and it's more similiar to Motion Control, it's a compression adjust that can adjusted from plush to lockout.
    What he said - and platform can be turned off and on with a knob - or with an optional remote.

    So far I like Wotan in short travel setting over Lyric 2Step, 55 ATA and TALAS. Excellent fork for this application.

    I am switching to a 2x9 (22/36 front) setup with a E13 DRS chainguide/bashguard to do the justice to its rough trail capabilities. Will need to lighten it up elsewhere. It climbs really well for such a burly bike - DHX platform also helps. Very balanced feel with Wotan.

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    Still wtf is wotan besides the travel adjust. A link or brand would be helpful
    Last edited by headstrong356; 10-15-2008 at 06:51 AM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Still wtf is wotan besides the travel adjust. A link would be helpful
    Wotan is a brand of 160mm travel "fork" made by the Magura company in Germany. That is the olive green thing in front of the bike on the picture I have posted. It has two tubes between which you attach the front wheel (the round thing covered in nobby rubber). It allows the wheel to rotate and at the same time to bounce up and down - up to 160mm (about 6 inches, or a small penis length), but not sideways, so you can steer the bike.

    This "fork" has a feature called "flight control" or "travel adjust" that allows it to be temporarly compressed by an extra 40mm (almost 2 inches).

    Last edited by Broccoli; 10-15-2008 at 12:34 AM.

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    Upset

    I know what a bloody fork is ... I'm a F_cking mechanic ... just a bit unfamilliar with the name wotan( fox + talas... Marzocchi+ ata... rockshox+u turn). Now i know it is made by magura( the german company). Thats all i was asking about.Here in Canada we don't now to much about the smaller companies from the other side of the world. Mind you that its sound like a sweet fork... if I researched it properly, i understand it has lock out with both high/low speed dampening . How much does it cost
    Last edited by headstrong356; 10-15-2008 at 01:21 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    I know what a bloody fork is ... I'm a F_cking mechanic ... just a bit unfamilliar with the name wotan( fox + talas... Marzocchi+ ata... rockshox+u turn). Now i know it is made by magura( the german company). Thats all i was asking about.Here in Canada we don't now to much about the smaller companies from the other side of the world. Mind you that sound like a sweet fork... if I researched it properly, i understand it has lock out with both high/low speed dampening . How much does it cost
    using a site called google.. i entered "magura wotan" and sure enough.. the very first hit was...

    http://www.magura.com/english/frameset/frameset.htm

    amazingly enough.. google shopping also had numerous hits.. with more than 20 results.. http://www.google.com/products?hl=en...num=1&ct=title

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    No good

    No SH+T sherlock... I don't think theres a person on the planet who doesn't know how to use google. I was just looking for a price in canadian dollars since most of it was in pounds and american. But then again screw it since I see a lack of maturity coming along when people decide to smart ass pricks rather than helpfull.

    PS... FLMIke, if you didn't notice the first metion of wotan being related to magura was the post before yours ...so mayby the result of my question (the post) got me to use google without computers for dummies and cause me to write: it has lock out with both high/low speed dampening

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    its exactly like the IT system i have on my manitou minute 3. even down to the handlebar mounted control. its extremely useful. my main concern about the coiler is the weight of it. an all mountain bike thats close to 40 lbs is a little much. i know i could spec lighter components but to what end? that would break the wallet.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    No SH+T sherlock... I don't think theres a person on the planet who doesn't know how to use google. I was just looking for a price in canadian dollars since most of it was in pounds and american. But then again screw it since I see a lack of maturity coming along when people decide to smart ass pricks rather than helpfull.

    PS... FLMIke, if you didn't notice the first metion of wotan being related to magura was the post before yours ...so mayby the result of my question (the post) got me to use google without computers for dummies and cause me to write: it has lock out with both high/low speed dampening
    Here is a little review from the Canadian boys...http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Magura-...view-2008.html , just to give you a little bit more info, enjoy.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Mind you that sound like a sweet fork... if I researched it properly, i understand it has lock out with both high/low speed dampening . How much does it cost
    Sorry, I could not resist - I thought you had been banned from Google.

    Yes, it is a very nice fork, it is actually a bit cheaper then TALAS 36 or Lyric and I did prefer it to both after I had a chance to compare (not for too long). But reviews had been equally good. I bought on Ebay for about half retail with a cut steerer but no sign of any usage. I got a rare color. They are offered for about $800. There are no big changes in 2009. 2008 is improved compared with 2007 - they improved damping.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    its exactly like the IT system i have on my manitou minute 3. even down to the handlebar mounted control. its extremely useful. my main concern about the coiler is the weight of it. an all mountain bike thats close to 40 lbs is a little much. i know i could spec lighter components but to what end? that would break the wallet.
    I have it very moderately spec'ed, and it is about 36/37 pounds at the moment - and that is with a low end wheelset - (but 2.1 tires). Total cost of the bike was well under $2K with everything bought off Ebay.

    (XT brakes/rotors (203/160) and shifters and derailleurs, LX cranks (to be replaced with 22/36 SLX with E13 DLS guide), Thompson stem and seat post (get 30.0 while they are there..), Rondine saddle, Wotan fork, Deore/Singletrack wheels, Schwalbe tires)

    I think I will upgrade a few parts here and there, and eventually get a nicer set of wheels and have it under 35.

    I have done a fair bit of climbing on it - and it does not seem to be a problem at all.

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    Thanks... it okay, i like jokes to. That half the fun of forums. Just FLMike guy pissed me off since isn't exactly a KONA regular and seem to be looking for trouble... But all in all "LOL".
    By the way does it have lockout with high/low speed compression/rebound?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Thanks... it okay, i like jokes to. That half the fun of forums. Just FLMike guy pissed me off since isn't exactly a KONA regular and seem to be looking for trouble... But all in all "LOL".
    By the way does it have lockout with high/low speed compression/rebound?
    They call this "Albert select" and it has a tunable level of platform that can be turned on and off with a switch or an optional second remote (I prefer switch). It also has a rebound adjuster on the bottom of a leg.

    Here is a graph explaining the Albert Select adjustment range - so you can have selectable compression curve - either open, or within the adjustment range. I found that I set it to about 30% and engage it together with adjusting travel down for climbing - or when I need to tune brake dive down on descend.


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    can you run an air shock, like a dhx air or marz roco? there is a killer deal on coiler frames at wheelworld right now and im trying to see if i can lighten her up a bit for am riding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    can you run an air shock, like a dhx air or marz roco? there is a killer deal on coiler frames at wheelworld right now and im trying to see if i can lighten her up a bit for am riding.
    Of course, not a problem. As a matter of fact that is exactly what I did with my 07 Coiler, Roco Air TST R.

  25. #25
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    could you post up a pick of your coiler? whats it weigh and how does it handle? im going to be pedalling a decent amount so im looking for something that can handle rough trail, both ups and downs, and not kill me with the weight.

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    I'll try to get some pics this weekend, currently she's in a bit of disarray I've changing around some parts. I would say it weighs somewhere @ 35-37lbs, but with good reason I have some pretty beefy parts. Here is a quick build list...

    19" Coiler 07
    Maggie Wotan
    Marz Roco Air TST R
    Azonic Outlaw wheels 20mm f / 12mm R
    Kenda Telonix 2.2 tires (780grams each)
    Truvativ Stylo Cranks 22/34
    E13 DRS
    Shimano 647 pedals or CB 5050xx
    x-9 shifters & rear der
    SRAM 12-34 cassette
    SRAM front der
    FSA Pig DH Pro headset
    Gravity Dropper seatpost (4-2-0 drop)
    WTB Pure V saddle
    Truvativ Holzfeller stem 55mm
    Truvativ Holzfeller bars 50mm rise x 710
    Saint brakes 8" fr&rr
    ODI Lock on Grips

    I'm waiting on the floating brake kit from my LBS.

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    I'm thinking about getting the same rear shock, or an X fusion h3...that with a 55 ata.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    can you run an air shock, like a dhx air or marz roco? there is a killer deal on coiler frames at wheelworld right now and im trying to see if i can lighten her up a bit for am riding.
    I gave it a thought, and gave my Coiler another ride, and decided that I would not bother. It rides so well on coil. I would rather spend this money on a new wheelset (looking around ride now, my stretch goal is I9 Enduro or something to this effect).

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    that with a 55 ata.
    Wotan KO1 55ATA

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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Try going to all the hotdeal sites on mtbr (wheelwolrd, beyond bikes, pricepoint)and build it up musing there clearance stuff. Like check out this wheel set, shimano saint hubs and mavic rims for 200...http://www.pricepoint.com/detail/147...-Disc-Rims.htm... then this saint rear dereailler for 25...http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...rlr+135Mm.aspx... the shimao saint brakes 59$ ... http://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...isc+Brake.aspx

    Search and the deals get smokin. I you need any help to find the best dealsI'd be more than glad to help...kind of a hobby since i'm looking to upgrade my set up
    headstrong...can you supply a cursory list for decent, light compatible components for this bike...while i thoroughly enjoy searching the vast expanse of the internet, i am looking for someone's opinion(s) on components for making this bike relatively light (low thirties) and the pricing at hand...please keep in mind that i started this thread b/c i am departing from my loved hardtail to potentially a Deluxe...with that said please be patient and understanding of my ignorance pertaining to full susp all mountain rides...
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    Thirties sound like a great challenge... give me some numbers to play with. Also do you care about the year model of the spec or do you like relatively new? And it is for the 07 coiler on wheel world yes? It might take a day but I'll do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Thirties sound like a great challenge... give me some numbers to play with. Also do you care about the year model of the spec or do you like relatively new? And it is for the 07 coiler on wheel world yes? It might take a day but I'll do it.
    wow...thank you...yes wheelworld xxl (20in)...keep in mind that i am approx 6'5" and 240lbs when considering which parts to mention...good luck, thanks, and it is not a high proirity...thanks again...
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    Whats your budget? So that way I don't give you some useless stuff and squeeze every penny.

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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Whats your budget? So that way I don't give you some useless stuff and squeeze every penny.
    my preference is not to surpass the 2k mark...considering i can just buy a full bike as opposed to a frame and your recommended build kit...is the factory kona components that are on the complete bike worth just purchasing the pre-built bike...?
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  36. #36
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    The 2007 coiler deluxe was valued at 3700 or something like that. All the 2009 coilair run above 2000. Where as the build kit + frame could have the same specs as a deluxe or primo at half the cost... low 2000 or below. So far at 800 filled in I have an xtr front derailer, xt rear, 2008 55ata fork

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    The 2007 coiler deluxe was valued at 3700 or something like that. All the 2009 coilair run above 2000. Where as the build kit + frame could have the same specs as a deluxe or primo at half the cost... low 2000 or below. So far at 800 filled in I have an xtr front derailer, xt rear, 2008 55ata fork
    i too have been looking for deals...i am wondering if i can "step" into a coiler deluxe from wheelworld complete cheaper than if i were to build one with a pre-made built kit or a build kit from your list or one from mine...a deal is a deal and i like the aspect of picking and choosing my own components but if i can get a decent all mountain for 1999.99 than i will go that route and modify later...my request from you is to help me determine whether or not i should utilize a build kit or a complete from wheelworld...thanks headstrong for you cooperation...
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  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    i too have been looking for deals...i am wondering if i can "step" into a coiler deluxe from wheelworld complete cheaper than if i were to build one with a pre-made built kit or a build kit from your list or one from mine...a deal is a deal and i like the aspect of picking and choosing my own components but if i can get a decent all mountain for 1999.99 than i will go that route and modify later...my request from you is to help me determine whether or not i should utilize a build kit or a complete from wheelworld...thanks headstrong for you cooperation...
    Frame from wheelworld: $850 shipped
    Singletrack wheels from wheelworld - $150 for 20mm front
    Online prices shipped (looked at one seller from Thailand for example):
    XT brakes - $250
    rotors - depends if you need 203mm front - say $60.
    SLX double crank and double specific front derailler $205
    XT shadow GS rear - $75
    XT shifters -$90
    XT cassette - $75
    Stem, handlebar, seatpost, seat, housing - ~$250, unless you want all Thompson and Easton carbon fiber and Fizik. Tires - $50..

    ~$2000 so far for a very good kit.

    Now the expensive part will be the fork. Wotan will run $800, Fox in the same range..

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    Done...2345$ for one kick ass kit includding the frame... load up the specs later.

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    Well for 2000 already made you get bottom line specs but for 2350 you get:
    From wheelworld...
    Single track/deore wheel set
    Frame coiler deluxe
    Evolve am stem
    Evolve handle bars
    WTB velociraptor tires

    From jenson usa
    Juicy 7 disk brakes
    Xt shifters, derailers(shadow style!!) chain, cassette and
    Evolve xc x-type crank
    FSA pig headset,
    55 ata fork
    2 tubes

    The only thing you pick out are the pedal, saddle and grips. After all i did want to pick you comfort zone specs. No one should.

    I'll give you the links later today

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    From jenson usa
    Juicy 7 disk brakes
    Xt shifters, derailers(shadow style!!) chain, cassette and
    Evolve xc x-type crank
    FSA pig headset,
    55 ata fork
    2 tubes
    I do highly recommend some larger asian sellers on Ebay over Jenson (never had a problem with Jenson, but money are money).. (one, another, yet another...)

    For me, CA tax at Jenson is another problems - large enough to cover shipping from Asia...

    In your list - I will really advise getting the AM SLX crank (22, 36, bash) together with a two ring specific SLX front derailler. Excellent crank for the task. Tree fort has both with free shipping.

    55 ATA seems to be a hit or miss - if you get 2008 Marzocchi it is indeed makes sense to buy domestically, as it may end up in the service... At $609 at Jenson, I think it makes sense to pay say $824 for Van 36 with a headset included at Pricepoint, (or $669 for slightly heavier 2008), or even better yet (and if you like adjustible travel) $790 for 2008 (same as 2009) Magura Wotan shipped from the Tree Fort Bikes.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    In your list - I will really advise getting the AM SLX crank (22, 36, bash) together with a two ring specific SLX front derailler. Excellent crank for the task. Tree fort has both with free shipping.
    can save another $40 on the SLX crank by ordering from Chain Reaction Cycles..

    Although shipping isnt free until you hit the $275.. it wont be hard to get to that point if youre building a bike from scratch...

    With the great prices there, i opted for a nicer crank for the same amount of money i would have spent domestically..

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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Done...2345$ for one kick ass kit includding the frame... load up the specs later.
    nice...thanks headstrong...curmy and flmike...i did not mean to make this a competition yet some competition helps yield some of the finest results...it seems as i research the recommended build kits i do have some very fine options...

    i am going to beg for a dollar after y'all gave me a quarter...is it possible to guess weight on ride pre-build...???
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    Ya but chain reaction cycles is in the uk and your in Florida... never mind your right about the free shipping.... a well back to the drawing board. But I highly recomend this kit I created at jenson usa http://www.jensonusa.com/store/build...i1JiAd0PO16p9T but if you would like the slx crank it can do that to for 135 $ extra. But i'll try to save more money by using chain reaction

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    nice...thanks headstrong...curmy and flmike...i did not mean to make this a competition yet some competition helps yield some of the finest results...it seems as i research the recommended build kits i do have some very fine options...
    I dont see it as competition.. just pointing out a place to save a few bucks in the build

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    Or still trying to see if ata schools wotan LOL, jokes. Ya For a second I forgot who i was doing this for. But remembering who, I stick with my build kit and will calculate the weight As for the links that could take a while. But all the stuff from wheelworld was on there deal page

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    but if you would like the slx crank it can do that to for 135 $ extra. But i'll try to save more money by using chain reaction
    If you get two ring SLX, you should go for the medium cage (GS) rear shadow XT. It has enough chain wrap capacity with front 36 to 22 (may be not crosschained to 11) and tidies up things so that a chainguide may be not needed at all.

    I have switched the rear cassette to 11-34, from 32, switched granny ring to 24t titanium (24/34 is just 2% higher then 22/32 and seems enough for me), so that I have larger range in each front gear. Now I am happy with the setup.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Or still trying to see if ata schools wotan LOL, jokes.
    55 ATA is lighter but that is about it. I prefer Magura flight control over ATA by a wide margin, and Albert Select seems to be a nice platform, and it is incredibly stiff. But if not for the travel adjust, I would have got 2009 Van 36 coil. Can't live without an easy travel adjust for AM duties.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLMike
    can save another $40 on the SLX crank by ordering from Chain Reaction Cycles..
    Another excellent source for parts, thank you for reminding.

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    where can i get sizes, dimensions, and diameters for the coiler deluxe 20"...?
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    Here

    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    where can i get sizes, dimensions, and diameters for the coiler deluxe 20"...?
    2007:


    Seatpost 30.0 (kind of an odd size nowdays, but I have found a Thompson). Stock post is 350mm. Top swing, top pull derailler 34.8 (771 fot XT fits, FD-M667 is the one you really want with 22-36 AM SLX cranks). 1-1/8 headtube. 135mm rear spacing, 68mm bb. Stock stem, I htink was 90mm, but it seems 70mm is better suited for the geometry - quicken it up a bit.

    It is best suited for a 160mm fork.

  52. #52
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    The 55 ata also has infinite travel adjust... meaning you can pick any travel length between 165 and 120... plus it has lock out for the climb... compression, rebound adjust...bottom out resistance and a propedal like platform. It is the bomb at 609. And by the way curmy were you tweeking with my thing at jenson... if so thanks I forgot about the chain tension and its relation to the cage length

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    Also the SLX is more of a freeride crank, hence the mix between saint and lx but not hone

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    Man this thread is hot!!!! were on three pages!!!!!

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    hey all,
    i think that i have figured most everything out...except i need to know what the rear spacing is (135 or 150mm)...the downtube diameter (for seatpost, clamp and front derailleur)...IS mount or 74mm for brakes...last but not least THE FORK...!!!
    1. Magura
    2. Fox
    3. Marzocchi
    which one...please keep in mind that this bike will be on AM/XC trails...you may consider it light AM or extremely XC...with a dash of happy jack (wyoming) quarterly...!!!
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  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    The 55 ata also has infinite travel adjust... meaning you can pick any travel length between 165 and 120... plus it has lock out for the climb... compression, rebound adjust...bottom out resistance and a propedal like platform. It is the bomb at 609. And by the way curmy were you tweeking with my thing at jenson... if so thanks I forgot about the chain tension and its relation to the cage length
    i am accustom to a revelation 426 u-turn air on my ht...i love it all...complete lock out to total plushness on the fly...and adjustment from 100mm to 130mm..and it is the bomb for what i paid for it and the ride i put it on...!!! i am leaning toward the marz just b/c of price...
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  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    hey all,
    i think that i have figured most everything out...except i need to know what the rear spacing is (135 or 150mm)...the downtube diameter (for seatpost, clamp and front derailleur)...IS mount or 74mm for brakes...last but not least THE FORK...!!!
    1. Magura
    2. Fox
    3. Marzocchi
    which one...please keep in mind that this bike will be on AM/XC trails...you may consider it light AM or extremely XC...with a dash of happy jack (wyoming) quarterly...!!!
    Info provide in a post above yours.

    Rear mount is IS. Front one will depend on fork. Rear is 135. Shimano front deraillers now fit everything (it is 34.8). Post is 30.0.

    The order you have listed is a good one IMO. Only put RS Lyric before Marzocchi.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Also the SLX is more of a freeride crank, hence the mix between saint and lx but not hone
    There is nothing particularly freeride about SLX. Three ring will not be out of place on any XC machine (880g). Even the reenforced AM version (steel pedal insert and strong axel) is 999g with a bashring.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    Info provide in a post above yours.

    Rear mount is IS. Front one will depend on fork. Rear is 135. Shimano front deraillers now fit everything (it is 34.8). Post is 30.0.

    The order you have listed is a good one IMO. Only put RS Lyric before Marzocchi.
    it is quite odd that i did not notice the info you provided prior to my previous post...so you have less of an issue with rock shox than marz...? as stated all i have left to set in stone is my fork...and maybe my crankset...i am not to sure about slx b/c i have heard nothing about them...please clue me in on the slx line up...!?!?
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  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    it is quite odd that i did not notice the info you provided prior to my previous post...so you have less of an issue with rock shox than marz...? as stated all i have left to set in stone is my fork...and maybe my crankset...i am not to sure about slx b/c i have heard nothing about them...please clue me in on the slx line up...!?!?
    I am absolutely stoked about my Magura Wotan. I think it is a perfect match for the frame, though 2009 Fox 36mm lineup is no slouch. As for Marzocchi - I am just following the apparent consensus that they have dropped the ball, on their foot, while hanging themselves, in 2008 as far as quality control goes as they have outsourced stuff to Suntour.

    Shimano nailed it with the new SLX double, and it finally has a proper matching two-ring 36t specific front derailler to match. It handles the 22 - 36 and cage is shorter an matches 36t ring. (I swapped granny for 24t titanium with 11-34 rear XT cassette, seems to be a good range). SLX double is 100% stronger then XT crank, according to the usually conservative and accurate Shimano. (link). I think it is the crank to have on this frame.

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    ok, so ive decided that i already have a good am ride with my liquid 20 and im going to build up a coiler and do more downhill/ fr oriented stuff. wheelworld has a coiler and a coiler deluxe frame on closeout. whats the difference? i plan on changing the rear shock straight away so if the only difference is the rear shock, ill buy the base coiler.

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    Marzocchi 55 is a better bang for your buck hence you get all the the adjustability of that of a fox tales 36 for a price of a base line rockshock. They have a great warranty system for any defects. Three years i believe. I stand corrected about the slx crank it is an all mountain crank but is heavier than than a triple ring race face atlas when set up as a duel chainring with bash guard. The atlas crank runs at the same price as the slx. Even the ride xc crank from race face is lighter than the slx for 1/4 of the price. So your crank should be race face for price and weight.


    As for jmhilss the only difference is the shock so go for the deluxe.

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    if i plan on throwing a roco tst air shock on there should i just get the base frame? it would be a waste to spend 300 bucks more on the same frame with an upgraded shock when i want to run a different shock straight away.

    how do you run a dual chain guide on these? do they have tabs from the factory?

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    if i plan on throwing a roco tst air shock on there should i just get the base frame? it would be a waste to spend 300 bucks more on the same frame with an upgraded shock when i want to run a different shock straight away.

    how do you run a dual chain guide on these? do they have tabs from the factory?
    I agree with your re: the frames, just get the basic Coiler, no sense spending more. BTW, your going to love the Roco, it's a great shock for the Coiler lineup, I love mine.

    The frame does not have tabs, you'll have to find a BB mount guide or use an adapter. I've run several different guides (MRP LRP, Heim, DRS and Blackspire Dewlie), my favorite would be the 1) DRS or 2)Dewlie.

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    Well in that case go for the bottom coiler and upgrade for sure... thats exactly what i'm doing.

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    i have been trying to find a picture of the rear suspension triangle and cant find any. does this have the asymetrical type where one chain stay is slightly lower than the other side?

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    The chain stay is one piece but the right side is some what higher the the left.

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmhills
    ok, so ive decided that i already have a good am ride with my liquid 20 and im going to build up a coiler and do more downhill/ fr oriented stuff. wheelworld has a coiler and a coiler deluxe frame on closeout. whats the difference? i plan on changing the rear shock straight away so if the only difference is the rear shock, ill buy the base coiler.
    Why do not you like DHX 4.0?

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    . I stand corrected about the slx crank it is an all mountain crank but is heavier than than a triple ring race face atlas when set up as a duel chainring with bash guard. The atlas crank runs at the same price as the slx. Even the ride xc crank from race face is lighter than the slx for 1/4 of the price. So your crank should be race face for price and weight.
    Unless you suggest ISIS, Race face ride XC is around $100+ which is not 1/4 of $150 for SLX by any stretch of imagination.
    Its weight is 955g, and it will be heavier then 999g SLX with any decent bashring installed, and heavier still if you swap 32t to a larger ring.

    Atlas double is $150 more online in 24-36-bash, about the same weight, and I prefer Shimano's bash ring. Triple is the same price, but you would need bash, and 22-32 is not as useful as 22-36.

    Nothing shifts quiet as nice as Shimano crank with matching front derailler.

    So for price and weight and performance it is still SLX in my opinion. (and if you want triple, it is still a 880g SLX triple)

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    hey headstrong and curmy...i have officially decided on the slx and the marz 55 ata...so consider that you two are even on my battlefield...as for stem and handlebars any recommendations (this is all that remains in my build)...?
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  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    hey headstrong and curmy...i have officially decided on the slx and the marz 55 ata...so consider that you two are even on my battlefield...as for stem and handlebars any recommendations (this is all that remains in my build)...?
    For stems and seatposts I do not trust anything but Thomson. My Coiler got 70mm X-4. $60 well spent (currently only see one on Ebay for $69 shipped). I also found a 30.0x350 Thomson seatpost in the same place..
    Got Enduro Specialized OS handlebar. It is an aluminum handlebar.. I will think if I get more bling later...

    On SLX - just in case I forgot to tell - for SLX double (if you got double), I am very happy with the SLX double specific derailler... Big improvement over the regular one for this application..

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    Well curmy we have a tie...I got the ata... you got the slx. But about your point on the pricing on jeson usa, the build kit price for the crank had the evolve the chepest, Atlas second and slx at the big spender. Maybe they have a better rep for race face than shimano compare to your source. But anyhow Adubb25, lets hear the full beast spec... and jmhills lets hear your plans. You'll both have to post your bikes when there all built up on post your KONA's
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

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  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    You'll both have to post your bikes when there all built up on post your KONA's
    I have the preliminary build posted on this thread - I am finalizing it. I usually leave it alone for years once I like it, and replace parts that break only. My two previsou bikes had been largely unchanged (and will remain so) for about five years. I got two new ones this year (thus a lot of reading and posting as I was reasearching and building them up)..

    P.S. On the fork choice: what I dislike about ATA (and about U-turn) - is that you have to turn, and turn, and turn it to adjust. With Wotan's flight control (and with 2-step, or Talas), you just press a lever, push it down, and keep climbing, and pop it back on top.

    For ~100mm fork I used to like ETA the best - one switch, both knocks it down, locks it up, leaves about an inch of plush to reduce chatter. On Wotan I have to adjust both travel and turn platform on/off - but then you have an excellent 120mm fork in the reduced travel mode, not a rigid one.
    Last edited by Broccoli; 10-22-2008 at 03:32 PM.

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    Actually I'm the opposite,what I dislike about wotan and talas is the step down idea, where ata and u turn let you dial in any travel setting you like rather than just 100, 130, 160, ect. I can pick 140, 125, 150 even something stupid like 135.9. Also who cares about a little elbow greese to get your travel.
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

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  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Actually I'm the opposite,what I dislike about wotan and talas is the step down idea, where ata and u turn let you dial in any travel setting you like rather than just 100, 130, 160, ect. I can pick 140, 125, 150 even something stupid like 135.9. Also who cares about a little elbow greese to get your travel.
    I do care about elbow grease when I am riding some nice singletrack. With U-turn/ATA I have to stop/slow down before a climb, and on the top.

    They are a much better solution if you want to dial-in your bike geometry as you have described, and mostly leave it there, or if you set it up for a particular terrain. My usage is to flip travel between pretty much every climb and descend. I do not have any use for any settings in between.

    This is obviously dependent on individual preferences and places you ride.

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    maybe i put the cart in front of the horse on my readiness pertaining to my build...i still need to decide on a somethings...and by the way i ended up purchasing a xxl kona coiler dee lux 05 frame from a local south dakotan...never thought it would happed...savin the dollar bills y'all...!
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    hey curmy...iget the slx crank and the double front derailleur...is there anything specific pertaining to the shifters......
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  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    hey curmy...iget the slx crank and the double front derailleur...is there anything specific pertaining to the shifters......
    No, it uses the regular shifter. I got XT.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    No, it uses the regular shifter. I got XT.
    curmy can you do me a favor...clue me in on which shifters/derailleurs...? model # on shifters and rear derailleur...just want to make sure prior to ordering...
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  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    curmy can you do me a favor...clue me in on which shifters/derailleurs...? model # on shifters and rear derailleur...just want to make sure prior to ordering...
    My build parts:
    Rear derailler: XT RD-M772-GS, (772 is shadow) (you may want SGS (long cage) if you want triple. It also has just enough capacity for 24/36 to 11-34. It will be fine with default 22-36 to 11-32. with 34 rear you may drop chain if you cross chain granny into 11 or 13 cog.)
    Front derailler: FD-M667 SLX
    Crankset: FC-M665 SLX
    Shifters: XT, SL-M770 (indicators removed)
    Brakes: XT BR-M775 calipers, BL-M775 levers.

    P.S. Now I wish I have ordered wheelset from chain reaction cycles. If you build one there, they can add an XT cassette and necessary rotors etc for some nice price (and dollar going up right now helps)

    It is not in there custom build area yet, but I do want new Saint (810 series with normal centerlock spline, so that XTR rotors fit) laced to DT Swiss 5.1d..

    New Saint is nice looking. I would have got the Saint brake levers and maybe shifters..

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    Than one of the pains with shimano, the damn numbers!! And man does the 05 frame looks sweet
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

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  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Than one of the pains with shimano, the damn numbers!! And man does the 05 frame looks sweet
    why thank you headstrong...give me until this weekend and i will have a parts list that i have chose...primarily based on price, preference and compatibility...i am stoked...! this was going to be a winter build but i am fearing that i am going to have this shyster completed within a month or two...!
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  83. #83
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    Well just remember to post some pics!!
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

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  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    why thank you headstrong...give me until this weekend and i will have a parts list that i have chose...primarily based on price, preference and compatibility...i am stoked...! this was going to be a winter build but i am fearing that i am going to have this shyster completed within a month or two...!
    PS - Whatever I have said was for the 07 frame, but AFAIK it is not that different. I think they have introduced DOPE replaceable dropouts in 07 and I think they have changed the mount point of the shock to play with leverage (it has two positions, so it will work with air shock in the rear one - less progressive I think, I did not check) - but I did not have a chance to examine 05 frames...

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    Than one of the pains with shimano, the damn numbers!!
    I love numbers. That's what pays for my bikes.

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    NO WORRIES I WILL TRACK THIS THREAD DOWN AND REVITALIZE WHEN MY RIDE IS DOWN...does the 05 really differ from the 07 that much...?
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  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    .does the 05 really differ from the 07 that much...?
    DId you get Primo or Deluxe frame? Info I found says 05 Primo has an extra inch of travel. 07 are both the same (6")

    If you do not plan to convert to 12mm rear or to install a floating brake, DOPE does not matter. I plan to get a wheelset with 10mm rear, once Chain Reaction does custom builds with 810 Saint (that can now use XTR rotors)

    They changed shock from 7.875 x 2.0 to 7.875 x 2.25, so 2007 has a tad lower leverage ratio, which would make it ever slightly more plush.

    Otherwise what I see is largely the same.
    Last edited by Broccoli; 10-24-2008 at 10:15 PM.

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    dee lux...with fox dhx 5.0, irp seatpost, d hanger, and a front derailleur that i will not use...$300...so you do not think that i can not use DOPE...
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  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    DId you get Primo or Deluxe frame? Info I found says 05 Primo has an extra inch of travel. 07 are both the same (6")

    If you do not plan to convert to 12mm rear or to install a floating brake, DOPE does not matter. I plan to get a wheelset with 10mm rear, once Chain Reaction does custom builds with 810 Saint (that can now use XTR rotors)

    They changed shock from 7.875 x 2.0 to 7.875 x 2.25, so 2007 has a tad lower leverage ratio, which would make it ever slightly more plush.

    Otherwise what I see is largely the same.
    hey curmy,
    stack height on headset...what should be...?
    adam
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  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by adubb25
    hey curmy,
    stack height on headset...what should be...?
    adam
    They are all about the same (~30 total, ~13 lower), except for the Crank Brothers, that I got, that drops it 5mm. With Wotans length I think it brings it to the sweet spot for the frame, but I will be damned if I can really feel where this spot is - pure conjecture on my part.

    I have heard mixed opinions about the long term durability of Opium, it does not look as well sealed as Chris King that I usually use, by here in California that is less of a problem and I intend to clean in often. It is very easy to clean.

    I am of the opinion that they all work - and I do not use star-nuts (only expanders, that are usually used for carbon steerers. I usually buy Chris King for the bling factor, and got Cranks Brothers for the curiosity factor.

    Crank Brothers was right in place getting my hardtail to 20lb.

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    got the list prepped...

    05 coiler dee lux frame - 300
    07 fox talas 36 - 500
    transition wheelset - 290
    race face stem/handlebars - 65
    hayes hfx 9 brakes - 130
    xt shifters - 100
    slx crank - 150
    wtb seat - 50
    slx frnt der - 50
    xt rear der - 80
    xt cassette - 65
    xt chain - 25
    oury lock-on grips - 20
    wtb weirwolf tires - 60

    just under $1900...deadline for this build is march...wish me luck...!!!
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  92. #92
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    NICE!!!! was the fork a 36 talas? Anyhow good luck!!
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

    If you miss the tranny... don't look down.

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by headstrong356
    NICE!!!! was the fork a 36 talas? Anyhow good luck!!
    you not like the talas 36...? are you still pushing the marz 55...? i am willing to listen considering what you have done throughout this process of mine...!!!
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    No just wondering it you got the 20mm thru axel 36 or the quick release 32. Good deal btw. Hope you enjoy it and good luck with the build.
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

    If you miss the tranny... don't look down.

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    i am getting 20mm thru...07 fox talas 36RC2...and thanks for the luck...still trying to find decent clipless shoes for me feet...size 15...if i cant i will continue my platform use...
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  96. #96
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    Where did you find that smokin deal?
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

    If you miss the tranny... don't look down.

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    a friend of a friend was parting out his ride and well i am getting...sometime down the road i may push it and enjoy it as a "new" fork...stancions, paint, decals are all good and his old bike was used during his tame period...
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  98. #98
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    Nice... just out of curiosity when you say tame period, is this guy crazy on his forks?
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

    If you miss the tranny... don't look down.

  99. #99
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    tame...meaning college campus and the occassional horse trail in our state parks...used yet not abused...
    Bikes + Wedding = Less Bikes

  100. #100
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    ... and if we just ...

    What... he does like to show off the chick magnet in campus ?? Common ... the urban freeride must be crazy!
    If it ain't broken... why the hell you fixin it!

    KONA rules!!

    If you miss the tranny... don't look down.

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