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  1. #1
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    Upgrade season...xx1 and Avy, how about you?

    So I am a sucker for upgrade and had to make a few changes to my bikes.

    First, I got really excited when I saw people running xx1 cranks with ten speed cassettes and then saw they were reasonably priced. I got a set with bb for around 250 bucks and dropped the mrp g2 guide off my Endo and I've got about 140 miles on them without dropping a chain no matter how hard I try! And the kicker is that i don't even have a clutch derailleur. I am running a regular XO short cage and took two links out and works amazing. Also dropped a half of pound bringing the Endo down to 24 1/2 pounds!

    Next, I was having trouble with my marz 55 rc3 evo ti fork on my Chilcotin. I have the 66 version on the delirium and it is perfect but for some reason the 55 damper is different. I spoke to Marzocchi after the first ride and they told me to take the dust wipers out. I lived with it last year because it was better than the Fox it replaced but after hurting my wrist over the winter this fork was driving me nuts. Well, I dropped what I thought at the time an ridiculous $450 for an Avy damper. Installed it sat. mornig and headed out for some rough terrain for the next three days and all I can say it what everyone that has an avy cart already knows, its worth every penny. I didn't think the Chilly could get any more confidence inspiring but wow when the front stays as glued to the trail as the rear, it had me reaching speeds i didn't think were attainable! so big thanks to TSC, tiSS'er and the rest of you for talking them up so much. Sorry, I had previously thought you guys were a bit nuts but now I Know! Cheers Pete

  2. #2
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    Nice Pete, glad you're stoked on the Avy'd 55.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  3. #3
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    Chilcotin winter upgrades
    • ccbd coil
    • tempted by an avy'd 55
    • awaiting the 11 speed trickle down from xx1 to x0 and x9
    • hoping for lighter-weight dropper posts
    • awaiting 2014 shimano brakes (xt xtr trail)
    • going back to braided hoses (goodridge) on all rear brakes
    • new set of lightweight pedals.


    The stable (to operate either side of the Chilcotin)
    • considering a podium frame (dh)
    • considering sc solo, mojo hd 140 and the new Endo (trail bike)

  4. #4
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    Nice xx1 looks awesome. So simple. Would be great for the chilcotin. I got a bos fork which is very good. Does anyone know how that compares to an avy'd 55?

  5. #5
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    i upgraded the fleet lol....
    for my brother colin. chilcotin. lyric rc2dh fork, ccdb hope hoops on mavic rims. conti rubberqueen tyres, chromag bar stem seat seat clamp. , xt mech and shifters, superstar seat post,hope pickn mix headset, and he put his raceface turbine crank and formula mega brakes on it.
    for me.... podium and endo.
    podium, old bits bos ndee fork, chromag bar and stem. saint m820 brakes,(got them sept last year so quite new) new bits, ccdb, raceface six c crank. saint mech xt cass, hope hoops on mavic rims, chromag seat and clamp. conti baron tyres. superstar seatpost, hope headset, chromag grips,
    endo, fox float ctd, bos deville fork, hope headset, chromag bar,stem,seat, seatclamp, grips, next sl crank. xt rear mech, cass shifter and brakes. hope hoops mavic rims, conti rubberqueen tyres.
    a new evoc bag to carry the bike in, and 2 flights to whistler. woooohooo, bring it on, whistler here we come.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    I got a bos fork which is very good. Does anyone know how that compares to an avy'd 55?
    this is the million dollar question. nobody here has both.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    this is the million dollar question. nobody here has both.

    if col doesnt get on with the lyrik,,, it wil get the avvy treatment, then we will have the holygrail and beable to provide the answer that you all seek.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirian View Post
    i upgraded the fleet lol....
    for my brother colin. chilcotin. lyric rc2dh fork, ccdb hope hoops on mavic rims. conti rubberqueen tyres, chromag bar stem seat seat clamp. , xt mech and shifters, superstar seat post,hope pickn mix headset, and he put his raceface turbine crank and formula mega brakes on it.
    for me.... podium and endo.
    podium, old bits bos ndee fork, chromag bar and stem. saint m820 brakes,(got them sept last year so quite new) new bits, ccdb, raceface six c crank. saint mech xt cass, hope hoops on mavic rims, chromag seat and clamp. conti baron tyres. superstar seatpost, hope headset, chromag grips,
    endo, fox float ctd, bos deville fork, hope headset, chromag bar,stem,seat, seatclamp, grips, next sl crank. xt rear mech, cass shifter and brakes. hope hoops mavic rims, conti rubberqueen tyres.
    a new evoc bag to carry the bike in, and 2 flights to whistler. woooohooo, bring it on, whistler here we come.
    have an amazing holiday delirian...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    have an amazing holiday delirian...
    i am intending to mate. cant wait to test and shred the new knollies... hope we dont encounter weight weenie jobsworth at checkin tomoz lol.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    Well, I dropped what I thought at the time an ridiculous $450 for an Avy damper. Installed it sat. mornig and headed out for some rough terrain for the next three days and all I can say it what everyone that has an avy cart already knows, its worth every penny. I didn't think the Chilly could get any more confidence inspiring but wow when the front stays as glued to the trail as the rear, it had me reaching speeds i didn't think were attainable! so big thanks to TSC, tiSS'er and the rest of you for talking them up so much. Sorry, I had previously thought you guys were a bit nuts but now I Know! Cheers Pete
    Congrats!!! Glad you are liking it. I have been spending much of my free time on a motorcycle (Honda CRF450R) that has 12+ inches of suspension travel and I can't make it nearly as plush as my Avy'd 6 inches of travel. It's sick how well Craig's stuff works!
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Congrats!!! Glad you are liking it. I have been spending much of my free time on a motorcycle (Honda CRF450R) that has 12+ inches of suspension travel and I can't make it nearly as plush as my Avy'd 6 inches of travel. It's sick how well Craig's stuff works!

    Doesn't Craig do motorcycles? Thought he did. If so....just sayin'......
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirian View Post
    if col doesnt get on with the lyrik,,, it wil get the avvy treatment, then we will have the holygrail and beable to provide the answer that you all seek.
    that would be very interesting indeed. it must close to call.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Doesn't Craig do motorcycles? Thought he did. If so....just sayin'......
    I think Craig still consults a bit with racers and their tuners on motorcycle suspensions but I'm pretty sure that hands-on motorcycle suspension tuning was in a previous life. Besides, I'm not excited to drop another $1,000+ into Craig's pocket. I like the dude and love his products but I've already spent enough on his products to allow him to buy a small island (...just a wee bit of hyperbole ).

    I'll give myself another week of twisting dials before turning to Craig. If he doesn't still do motorcycle suspensions, I know he knows the right people.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  14. #14
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    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Global Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

  15. #15
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    From my memory of the few who are fully Avy'd front and rear:

    myself: front Marz 55 RC3ti coil, rear Van RC coil
    Tisser: Lyrik Solo Air, Chubbie coil in the rear (I think)
    G-air: Lyrik Solo Air, DHX coil
    Cheezwhip: Marz 55 RC3 ti coil, rear DHX coil
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Craig will tell you that a coil fork is better than an air fork. As far as which fork becomes the best fork by being Avy'd you should call the man himself.

    My guess is that the Marz RC3 TI forks will be hard to beat because of the TI spring and how Marz handles small bumps. You put that with Craig's mid-stroke support, anti-dive, etc. and you have an amazing fork.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    From my memory of the few who are fully Avy'd front and rear:

    myself: front Marz 55 RC3ti coil, rear Van RC coil
    Tisser: Lyrik Solo Air, Chubbie coil in the rear (I think)
    G-air: Lyrik Solo Air, DHX coil
    Cheezwhip: Marz 55 RC3 ti coil, rear DHX coil
    Me: Marz 66 cheapo, Avy Woody
    J. Vaughn: Lyrik 160 air, Avy Woody
    Rob: Fox van 160, Avy Woody

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Air and YES.
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

  19. #19
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    tempted to get a pair of Marz RC3 TI from ebay usa, get the seller to post them to craig, have the operation done, then get craig to send them over the pond. might be a way to avoid customs/charges.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    tempted to get a pair of Marz RC3 TI from ebay usa, get the seller to post them to craig, have the operation done, then get craig to send them over the pond. might be a way to avoid customs/charges.
    lol...
    depends on what the marked price on the package is,,, if they mark it down as warranty replacement, or with a value less than 15 quid you wont get charged, anything over 15 quid then youll be slaped with vat and import duties.
    if there's no price on the customs invoice, i could be mistaken here, but i read somwhere, that they can open the package to see whats inside then look up what the uk price is and charge you accordingly based on that price. as i said though dont quote me on that last part as i could be wrong, am not 100% certain on that.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    coil and its so unfair that after 3 rides I'm looking for an old dhx or van rc to send him. Anyone got one laying around?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    coil and its so unfair that after 3 rides I'm looking for an old dhx or van rc to send him. Anyone got one laying around?
    Just buy a Woodie...trust me.
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  23. #23
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    Is a Woodie better performer than a CCDB Coil? My mind boggles at a small outfit like AVA potentially producing a better product than the mighty Cane Creeks shock. Are the Woodies better, period, or is it because Craig tunes it for the specific rider/style of riding.

    Any help appreciated as it would cost me a small fortune to buy it and have it shipped to the UK ... i cant test ride it beforehand either ... but if its really worth it ... just cant find any info comparing the two (and the CCDB Coil is easy to get here / easy to get serviced...although i did take note that the AVA stuff has a long, long lifetime due to build quality).

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    Is a Woodie better performer than a CCDB Coil? My mind boggles at a small outfit like AVA potentially producing a better product than the mighty Cane Creeks shock. Are the Woodies better, period, or is it because Craig tunes it for the specific rider/style of riding.

    Any help appreciated as it would cost me a small fortune to buy it and have it shipped to the UK ... i cant test ride it beforehand either ... but if its really worth it ... just cant find any info comparing the two (and the CCDB Coil is easy to get here / easy to get serviced...although i did take note that the AVA stuff has a long, long lifetime due to build quality).
    Yes, the Woodie is better. I had a CCDB coil on my Chili before the Woodie, so I can directly compare. I'm not sure why your mind is so boggled by the fact that a small company which produces a very specific shock for your very specific bike, your very specific riding style, and very specific terrain can produce a better shock than a larger company that produces one very generic shock for any bike.

    FACT: The Woodie can move 4X the oil of a CCDB. Why does this matter? Well, the Chili is a rising rate suspension, and as the bike moves through its travel it needs to move more oil for those square edge and hard hits. When my Avy tuned fork outperformed the CCDB coil on our local trails, I knew something was wrong. A quick call to Craig, and he spouted off more tech mumbo jumbo than any mortal should know. He wasn't trying to just impress me with his vast knowledge, he knew everything there was to know about the Chilcotin suspension rates, curves, velocities, and all the corresponding oil flows that go with it. So after all this talk, the one thing I do remember Craig saying is that the harsh feeling I was getting from the CCDB was not due to the shock bottoming out, but rather due the CCDBs inability to move enough oil on certain hits on my trail...the CCDB was hydrolocking.

    Lets face it, Craig is not a BS marketing person. He's not trying to sell you with some cool gold ano shock body, cool laser etched decals that scream I HAVE A CCDB *****ES! No, his stuff is rather low key, bland, and boring to look at. But it's not what's on the outside that matters. Craig's stuff will blow any manufacturers production stuff out of the water, in both performance and quality.

    That being said, the CCDB is probably the best non-custom aftermarket shock.

    You might want to read this

    A WOODIE for my Chili
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

  25. #25
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    Just get the Avy shock. I live in Connecticut, have been to his shop and have seen the promised land. Attached is a pix of my DT, Chubbie and Avy'd Totem. I don't post much, but it's a Sat night, been married 25 years and I'm bored. I also have a Purgatory and a Podium that Craig has worked his magic on.

    Upgrade season...xx1 and Avy, how about you?-dt-6_15_13.jpg

  26. #26
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    My advice in general: If you have the money, get the Woodie. If $600 breaks the bank or forces you to forgo getting your fork Avy'd then go with the VanRC.

    The VanRC is the best shock to convert for a rising-rate linkage bike (i.e. a Knolly); and, according to Craig, is a good "alternative" for the price conscious (i.e the modified VanRC is better than anything but a Woodie). I got a slightly used VanRC from Ebay for my Chili; and a slightly used one from PB for my Glory. I had both of them shipped directly to Craig so I never saw them pre-Avalanche. Other than some small nicks on the springs both looked new when Craig finished with them.

    I paid less than $200 for each of them. rscecil bought a VanRC new with a promo code. Either way it was less than the Woodie. In the end I saved $200 per shock which I spent on getting my forks Avy'd.

    Side note: If you put a TI spring on the 57X200mm VanRC it only weighs ~80 grams (~2.8 oz) more than the CC DBair.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  27. #27
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    Oh god, this is approaching _dw slurper level.....

    Dusty Bottoms, I have a %95 Lyrik coil for you so you can Avy'd your Chili too
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  28. #28
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    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  29. #29
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    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    Unless there's another 'database error' making holes in this thread, you're confused, or perhaps drunk.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    youre avatar and sig...i mean, cmon, whats wrong with you?

    just joking, thats why im going to put a smily face after this ...

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    Yes, the Woodie is better. I had a CCDB coil on my Chili before the Woodie, so I can directly compare. I'm not sure why your mind is so boggled by the fact that a small company which produces a very specific shock for your very specific bike, your very specific riding style, and very specific terrain can produce a better shock than a larger company that produces one very generic shock for any bike.

    FACT: The Woodie can move 4X the oil of a CCDB. Why does this matter? Well, the Chili is a rising rate suspension, and as the bike moves through its travel it needs to move more oil for those square edge and hard hits. When my Avy tuned fork outperformed the CCDB coil on our local trails, I knew something was wrong. A quick call to Craig, and he spouted off more tech mumbo jumbo than any mortal should know. He wasn't trying to just impress me with his vast knowledge, he knew everything there was to know about the Chilcotin suspension rates, curves, velocities, and all the corresponding oil flows that go with it. So after all this talk, the one thing I do remember Craig saying is that the harsh feeling I was getting from the CCDB was not due to the shock bottoming out, but rather due the CCDBs inability to move enough oil on certain hits on my trail...the CCDB was hydrolocking.

    Lets face it, Craig is not a BS marketing person. He's not trying to sell you with some cool gold ano shock body, cool laser etched decals that scream I HAVE A CCDB *****ES! No, his stuff is rather low key, bland, and boring to look at. But it's not what's on the outside that matters. Craig's stuff will blow any manufacturers production stuff out of the water, in both performance and quality.

    That being said, the CCDB is probably the best non-custom aftermarket shock.

    You might want to read this

    A WOODIE for my Chili
    Cheers for that. And thanks for the pointer to the Woodie thread (had missed all that, have only been round the knolly forum for 6 months). Im going to give Craig a ring and explain our terrain differences (our trails are quite different to yours), see what his take on it is.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobmol View Post
    Just get the Avy shock. I live in Connecticut, have been to his shop and have seen the promised land. Attached is a pix of my DT, Chubbie and Avy'd Totem. I don't post much, but it's a Sat night, been married 25 years and I'm bored. I also have a Purgatory and a Podium that Craig has worked his magic on.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DT 6_15_13.jpg 
Views:	207 
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ID:	808477
    Love that bike. Thanks for the input.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    the clock doesn't have opinions either. i can go fast on stock suspension as well but i go faster on my avy fork.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    the clock doesn't have opinions either. i can go fast on stock suspension as well but i go faster on my avy fork.


    grins and wins, its all that matters. if it does it for you, money well spent.

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    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    I definitely understand the idea of being dubious and wanting data (which I would love to provide if I had the equipment and the setup) but there's a point, even with data, at which you've got to look at your sources, their love of riding, their hours of saddle time, their other biking-related knowledge, and weigh it on that. I'm admittedly a lightweight, so I wouldn't hold what I say at the level of the others. Me aside, you have the testimonies of lots of riders with lots of experience, expertise, that you know log more miles in a month than most people do in a year (definitely me & probably even you); all of whom talk about their Avy'd suspensions in same manner they talk about their Knolly bikes. Yet you still act incredulous.

    Data cuts both ways. Without data, or even personal experience, showing that those who affirm that there truly is an "Avalanche Advantage" then I would expect a poster not to post things which imply that those with first-hand experience are idiots. Unless, that is, you do think that we are all idiots; which then causes me to wonder why a brainiac like you bothers with all us "tards".
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Me aside, you have the testimonies of lots of riders with lots of experience, expertise, that you know log more miles in a month than most people do in a year (definitely me & probably even you); all of whom talk about their Avy'd suspensions in same manner they talk about their Knolly bikes. Yet you still act incredulous.
    I think you're catching on to why that is, finally
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.
    Those 11 speed chains can be a nightmare, but KMC is making some pretty tough kit and is well worth a try. When im tired, i crunch gears on climbs, but cant break my KMC chain. If that had been my old sram chain it would have about 30 powerlinkls in it by now.

    When people start breaking KMC chains then its definetly time to take a relook.

    Wonder when Shimanos going to come back with something here (im quite excited about this, im sure they will do it later this year), ive always found their chains much tougher than sram (albiet not quite as strong as KMC). If its anything like the past they will come out with something that plays to SRAMs weakness, hence more reliable chains and an even lighter configuration

  40. #40
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    TSC Mrwhlr ..you two crack me up cheers!

  41. #41
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    I'm upgrading a few things. Muahahahahahahaha.
    Global Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    I'm upgrading a few things. Muahahahahahahaha.
    At this rate, I'm going to have to setup AVYFEST as well
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.
    I have been running it for several months along with several of my riding buddies without issue or a chain drop (knock on wood!) If you don't trust the chain then just run a 10 spd Shimano setup with the XX1 cranks/ring. The magic is in the chainring, not the chain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    The magic is in the chainring, not the chain.
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    At this rate, I'm going to have to setup AVYFEST as well
    So he finally decided to man up?
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.
    Glad someone else has their eye on these. I plan on buying one ASAP when they show up for the Endo. I figure with this, an MRP AMG guide, and a XT clutch derailleur, that should be a pretty solid setup.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    So he finally decided to man up?
    Not sure, just speculating. It does sound like the Knolly crew has given Craig a fair amount of business though.
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    Not sure, just speculating. It does sound like the Knolly crew has given Craig a fair amount of business though.
    next paycheck, i'm ordering the woodie! you had me at 4 times the oil flow!

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.
    I would love to see RaceFace's narrow-wide chain ring in a direct-mount option like the MRP Bling Ring. Of course I would like to buy a lungs and legs set that would allow me ride a 1X10.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    next paycheck, i'm ordering the woodie! you had me at 4 times the oil flow!
    Congrats, and welcome to the next level!
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

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