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  1. #1
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    Upgrade season...xx1 and Avy, how about you?

    So I am a sucker for upgrade and had to make a few changes to my bikes.

    First, I got really excited when I saw people running xx1 cranks with ten speed cassettes and then saw they were reasonably priced. I got a set with bb for around 250 bucks and dropped the mrp g2 guide off my Endo and I've got about 140 miles on them without dropping a chain no matter how hard I try! And the kicker is that i don't even have a clutch derailleur. I am running a regular XO short cage and took two links out and works amazing. Also dropped a half of pound bringing the Endo down to 24 1/2 pounds!

    Next, I was having trouble with my marz 55 rc3 evo ti fork on my Chilcotin. I have the 66 version on the delirium and it is perfect but for some reason the 55 damper is different. I spoke to Marzocchi after the first ride and they told me to take the dust wipers out. I lived with it last year because it was better than the Fox it replaced but after hurting my wrist over the winter this fork was driving me nuts. Well, I dropped what I thought at the time an ridiculous $450 for an Avy damper. Installed it sat. mornig and headed out for some rough terrain for the next three days and all I can say it what everyone that has an avy cart already knows, its worth every penny. I didn't think the Chilly could get any more confidence inspiring but wow when the front stays as glued to the trail as the rear, it had me reaching speeds i didn't think were attainable! so big thanks to TSC, tiSS'er and the rest of you for talking them up so much. Sorry, I had previously thought you guys were a bit nuts but now I Know! Cheers Pete

  2. #2
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    Nice Pete, glad you're stoked on the Avy'd 55.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  3. #3
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    Chilcotin winter upgrades
    • ccbd coil
    • tempted by an avy'd 55
    • awaiting the 11 speed trickle down from xx1 to x0 and x9
    • hoping for lighter-weight dropper posts
    • awaiting 2014 shimano brakes (xt xtr trail)
    • going back to braided hoses (goodridge) on all rear brakes
    • new set of lightweight pedals.


    The stable (to operate either side of the Chilcotin)
    • considering a podium frame (dh)
    • considering sc solo, mojo hd 140 and the new Endo (trail bike)

  4. #4
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    Nice xx1 looks awesome. So simple. Would be great for the chilcotin. I got a bos fork which is very good. Does anyone know how that compares to an avy'd 55?

  5. #5
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    i upgraded the fleet lol....
    for my brother colin. chilcotin. lyric rc2dh fork, ccdb hope hoops on mavic rims. conti rubberqueen tyres, chromag bar stem seat seat clamp. , xt mech and shifters, superstar seat post,hope pickn mix headset, and he put his raceface turbine crank and formula mega brakes on it.
    for me.... podium and endo.
    podium, old bits bos ndee fork, chromag bar and stem. saint m820 brakes,(got them sept last year so quite new) new bits, ccdb, raceface six c crank. saint mech xt cass, hope hoops on mavic rims, chromag seat and clamp. conti baron tyres. superstar seatpost, hope headset, chromag grips,
    endo, fox float ctd, bos deville fork, hope headset, chromag bar,stem,seat, seatclamp, grips, next sl crank. xt rear mech, cass shifter and brakes. hope hoops mavic rims, conti rubberqueen tyres.
    a new evoc bag to carry the bike in, and 2 flights to whistler. woooohooo, bring it on, whistler here we come.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    I got a bos fork which is very good. Does anyone know how that compares to an avy'd 55?
    this is the million dollar question. nobody here has both.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    this is the million dollar question. nobody here has both.

    if col doesnt get on with the lyrik,,, it wil get the avvy treatment, then we will have the holygrail and beable to provide the answer that you all seek.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirian View Post
    i upgraded the fleet lol....
    for my brother colin. chilcotin. lyric rc2dh fork, ccdb hope hoops on mavic rims. conti rubberqueen tyres, chromag bar stem seat seat clamp. , xt mech and shifters, superstar seat post,hope pickn mix headset, and he put his raceface turbine crank and formula mega brakes on it.
    for me.... podium and endo.
    podium, old bits bos ndee fork, chromag bar and stem. saint m820 brakes,(got them sept last year so quite new) new bits, ccdb, raceface six c crank. saint mech xt cass, hope hoops on mavic rims, chromag seat and clamp. conti baron tyres. superstar seatpost, hope headset, chromag grips,
    endo, fox float ctd, bos deville fork, hope headset, chromag bar,stem,seat, seatclamp, grips, next sl crank. xt rear mech, cass shifter and brakes. hope hoops mavic rims, conti rubberqueen tyres.
    a new evoc bag to carry the bike in, and 2 flights to whistler. woooohooo, bring it on, whistler here we come.
    have an amazing holiday delirian...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    have an amazing holiday delirian...
    i am intending to mate. cant wait to test and shred the new knollies... hope we dont encounter weight weenie jobsworth at checkin tomoz lol.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    Well, I dropped what I thought at the time an ridiculous $450 for an Avy damper. Installed it sat. mornig and headed out for some rough terrain for the next three days and all I can say it what everyone that has an avy cart already knows, its worth every penny. I didn't think the Chilly could get any more confidence inspiring but wow when the front stays as glued to the trail as the rear, it had me reaching speeds i didn't think were attainable! so big thanks to TSC, tiSS'er and the rest of you for talking them up so much. Sorry, I had previously thought you guys were a bit nuts but now I Know! Cheers Pete
    Congrats!!! Glad you are liking it. I have been spending much of my free time on a motorcycle (Honda CRF450R) that has 12+ inches of suspension travel and I can't make it nearly as plush as my Avy'd 6 inches of travel. It's sick how well Craig's stuff works!
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Congrats!!! Glad you are liking it. I have been spending much of my free time on a motorcycle (Honda CRF450R) that has 12+ inches of suspension travel and I can't make it nearly as plush as my Avy'd 6 inches of travel. It's sick how well Craig's stuff works!

    Doesn't Craig do motorcycles? Thought he did. If so....just sayin'......
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by delirian View Post
    if col doesnt get on with the lyrik,,, it wil get the avvy treatment, then we will have the holygrail and beable to provide the answer that you all seek.
    that would be very interesting indeed. it must close to call.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Doesn't Craig do motorcycles? Thought he did. If so....just sayin'......
    I think Craig still consults a bit with racers and their tuners on motorcycle suspensions but I'm pretty sure that hands-on motorcycle suspension tuning was in a previous life. Besides, I'm not excited to drop another $1,000+ into Craig's pocket. I like the dude and love his products but I've already spent enough on his products to allow him to buy a small island (...just a wee bit of hyperbole ).

    I'll give myself another week of twisting dials before turning to Craig. If he doesn't still do motorcycle suspensions, I know he knows the right people.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  14. #14
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    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

  15. #15
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    From my memory of the few who are fully Avy'd front and rear:

    myself: front Marz 55 RC3ti coil, rear Van RC coil
    Tisser: Lyrik Solo Air, Chubbie coil in the rear (I think)
    G-air: Lyrik Solo Air, DHX coil
    Cheezwhip: Marz 55 RC3 ti coil, rear DHX coil
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Craig will tell you that a coil fork is better than an air fork. As far as which fork becomes the best fork by being Avy'd you should call the man himself.

    My guess is that the Marz RC3 TI forks will be hard to beat because of the TI spring and how Marz handles small bumps. You put that with Craig's mid-stroke support, anti-dive, etc. and you have an amazing fork.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    From my memory of the few who are fully Avy'd front and rear:

    myself: front Marz 55 RC3ti coil, rear Van RC coil
    Tisser: Lyrik Solo Air, Chubbie coil in the rear (I think)
    G-air: Lyrik Solo Air, DHX coil
    Cheezwhip: Marz 55 RC3 ti coil, rear DHX coil
    Me: Marz 66 cheapo, Avy Woody
    J. Vaughn: Lyrik 160 air, Avy Woody
    Rob: Fox van 160, Avy Woody

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    Air and YES.
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

  19. #19
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    tempted to get a pair of Marz RC3 TI from ebay usa, get the seller to post them to craig, have the operation done, then get craig to send them over the pond. might be a way to avoid customs/charges.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    tempted to get a pair of Marz RC3 TI from ebay usa, get the seller to post them to craig, have the operation done, then get craig to send them over the pond. might be a way to avoid customs/charges.
    lol...
    depends on what the marked price on the package is,,, if they mark it down as warranty replacement, or with a value less than 15 quid you wont get charged, anything over 15 quid then youll be slaped with vat and import duties.
    if there's no price on the customs invoice, i could be mistaken here, but i read somwhere, that they can open the package to see whats inside then look up what the uk price is and charge you accordingly based on that price. as i said though dont quote me on that last part as i could be wrong, am not 100% certain on that.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Of all you guys running the Avy damper, who is on air and who is on coil? I hear the coil/Avy 170 Lyrik is so good it isn't even fair.
    coil and its so unfair that after 3 rides I'm looking for an old dhx or van rc to send him. Anyone got one laying around?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    coil and its so unfair that after 3 rides I'm looking for an old dhx or van rc to send him. Anyone got one laying around?
    Just buy a Woodie...trust me.
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  23. #23
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    Is a Woodie better performer than a CCDB Coil? My mind boggles at a small outfit like AVA potentially producing a better product than the mighty Cane Creeks shock. Are the Woodies better, period, or is it because Craig tunes it for the specific rider/style of riding.

    Any help appreciated as it would cost me a small fortune to buy it and have it shipped to the UK ... i cant test ride it beforehand either ... but if its really worth it ... just cant find any info comparing the two (and the CCDB Coil is easy to get here / easy to get serviced...although i did take note that the AVA stuff has a long, long lifetime due to build quality).

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    Is a Woodie better performer than a CCDB Coil? My mind boggles at a small outfit like AVA potentially producing a better product than the mighty Cane Creeks shock. Are the Woodies better, period, or is it because Craig tunes it for the specific rider/style of riding.

    Any help appreciated as it would cost me a small fortune to buy it and have it shipped to the UK ... i cant test ride it beforehand either ... but if its really worth it ... just cant find any info comparing the two (and the CCDB Coil is easy to get here / easy to get serviced...although i did take note that the AVA stuff has a long, long lifetime due to build quality).
    Yes, the Woodie is better. I had a CCDB coil on my Chili before the Woodie, so I can directly compare. I'm not sure why your mind is so boggled by the fact that a small company which produces a very specific shock for your very specific bike, your very specific riding style, and very specific terrain can produce a better shock than a larger company that produces one very generic shock for any bike.

    FACT: The Woodie can move 4X the oil of a CCDB. Why does this matter? Well, the Chili is a rising rate suspension, and as the bike moves through its travel it needs to move more oil for those square edge and hard hits. When my Avy tuned fork outperformed the CCDB coil on our local trails, I knew something was wrong. A quick call to Craig, and he spouted off more tech mumbo jumbo than any mortal should know. He wasn't trying to just impress me with his vast knowledge, he knew everything there was to know about the Chilcotin suspension rates, curves, velocities, and all the corresponding oil flows that go with it. So after all this talk, the one thing I do remember Craig saying is that the harsh feeling I was getting from the CCDB was not due to the shock bottoming out, but rather due the CCDBs inability to move enough oil on certain hits on my trail...the CCDB was hydrolocking.

    Lets face it, Craig is not a BS marketing person. He's not trying to sell you with some cool gold ano shock body, cool laser etched decals that scream I HAVE A CCDB *****ES! No, his stuff is rather low key, bland, and boring to look at. But it's not what's on the outside that matters. Craig's stuff will blow any manufacturers production stuff out of the water, in both performance and quality.

    That being said, the CCDB is probably the best non-custom aftermarket shock.

    You might want to read this

    A WOODIE for my Chili
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

  25. #25
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    Just get the Avy shock. I live in Connecticut, have been to his shop and have seen the promised land. Attached is a pix of my DT, Chubbie and Avy'd Totem. I don't post much, but it's a Sat night, been married 25 years and I'm bored. I also have a Purgatory and a Podium that Craig has worked his magic on.

    Upgrade season...xx1 and Avy, how about you?-dt-6_15_13.jpg

  26. #26
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    My advice in general: If you have the money, get the Woodie. If $600 breaks the bank or forces you to forgo getting your fork Avy'd then go with the VanRC.

    The VanRC is the best shock to convert for a rising-rate linkage bike (i.e. a Knolly); and, according to Craig, is a good "alternative" for the price conscious (i.e the modified VanRC is better than anything but a Woodie). I got a slightly used VanRC from Ebay for my Chili; and a slightly used one from PB for my Glory. I had both of them shipped directly to Craig so I never saw them pre-Avalanche. Other than some small nicks on the springs both looked new when Craig finished with them.

    I paid less than $200 for each of them. rscecil bought a VanRC new with a promo code. Either way it was less than the Woodie. In the end I saved $200 per shock which I spent on getting my forks Avy'd.

    Side note: If you put a TI spring on the 57X200mm VanRC it only weighs ~80 grams (~2.8 oz) more than the CC DBair.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  27. #27
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    Oh god, this is approaching _dw slurper level.....

    Dusty Bottoms, I have a %95 Lyrik coil for you so you can Avy'd your Chili too
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  28. #28
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    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  29. #29
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    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    Unless there's another 'database error' making holes in this thread, you're confused, or perhaps drunk.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Watch out Tiss'er. With that kind of response he's likely to PM you, tell you he's putting you on his ignore list, and then call you a thread troll. Or that's what he did to me.
    youre avatar and sig...i mean, cmon, whats wrong with you?

    just joking, thats why im going to put a smily face after this ...

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    Yes, the Woodie is better. I had a CCDB coil on my Chili before the Woodie, so I can directly compare. I'm not sure why your mind is so boggled by the fact that a small company which produces a very specific shock for your very specific bike, your very specific riding style, and very specific terrain can produce a better shock than a larger company that produces one very generic shock for any bike.

    FACT: The Woodie can move 4X the oil of a CCDB. Why does this matter? Well, the Chili is a rising rate suspension, and as the bike moves through its travel it needs to move more oil for those square edge and hard hits. When my Avy tuned fork outperformed the CCDB coil on our local trails, I knew something was wrong. A quick call to Craig, and he spouted off more tech mumbo jumbo than any mortal should know. He wasn't trying to just impress me with his vast knowledge, he knew everything there was to know about the Chilcotin suspension rates, curves, velocities, and all the corresponding oil flows that go with it. So after all this talk, the one thing I do remember Craig saying is that the harsh feeling I was getting from the CCDB was not due to the shock bottoming out, but rather due the CCDBs inability to move enough oil on certain hits on my trail...the CCDB was hydrolocking.

    Lets face it, Craig is not a BS marketing person. He's not trying to sell you with some cool gold ano shock body, cool laser etched decals that scream I HAVE A CCDB *****ES! No, his stuff is rather low key, bland, and boring to look at. But it's not what's on the outside that matters. Craig's stuff will blow any manufacturers production stuff out of the water, in both performance and quality.

    That being said, the CCDB is probably the best non-custom aftermarket shock.

    You might want to read this

    A WOODIE for my Chili
    Cheers for that. And thanks for the pointer to the Woodie thread (had missed all that, have only been round the knolly forum for 6 months). Im going to give Craig a ring and explain our terrain differences (our trails are quite different to yours), see what his take on it is.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobmol View Post
    Just get the Avy shock. I live in Connecticut, have been to his shop and have seen the promised land. Attached is a pix of my DT, Chubbie and Avy'd Totem. I don't post much, but it's a Sat night, been married 25 years and I'm bored. I also have a Purgatory and a Podium that Craig has worked his magic on.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DT 6_15_13.jpg 
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    Love that bike. Thanks for the input.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    the clock doesn't have opinions either. i can go fast on stock suspension as well but i go faster on my avy fork.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    the clock doesn't have opinions either. i can go fast on stock suspension as well but i go faster on my avy fork.


    grins and wins, its all that matters. if it does it for you, money well spent.

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    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Furthermore, I have ridden with plenty of people who go extremely quick on stock suspension, widely derided as inferior to Avy'd Chili'd on these forums.

    Dyno charts don't have opinions, make some, post them.
    I definitely understand the idea of being dubious and wanting data (which I would love to provide if I had the equipment and the setup) but there's a point, even with data, at which you've got to look at your sources, their love of riding, their hours of saddle time, their other biking-related knowledge, and weigh it on that. I'm admittedly a lightweight, so I wouldn't hold what I say at the level of the others. Me aside, you have the testimonies of lots of riders with lots of experience, expertise, that you know log more miles in a month than most people do in a year (definitely me & probably even you); all of whom talk about their Avy'd suspensions in same manner they talk about their Knolly bikes. Yet you still act incredulous.

    Data cuts both ways. Without data, or even personal experience, showing that those who affirm that there truly is an "Avalanche Advantage" then I would expect a poster not to post things which imply that those with first-hand experience are idiots. Unless, that is, you do think that we are all idiots; which then causes me to wonder why a brainiac like you bothers with all us "tards".
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Me aside, you have the testimonies of lots of riders with lots of experience, expertise, that you know log more miles in a month than most people do in a year (definitely me & probably even you); all of whom talk about their Avy'd suspensions in same manner they talk about their Knolly bikes. Yet you still act incredulous.
    I think you're catching on to why that is, finally
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.
    Those 11 speed chains can be a nightmare, but KMC is making some pretty tough kit and is well worth a try. When im tired, i crunch gears on climbs, but cant break my KMC chain. If that had been my old sram chain it would have about 30 powerlinkls in it by now.

    When people start breaking KMC chains then its definetly time to take a relook.

    Wonder when Shimanos going to come back with something here (im quite excited about this, im sure they will do it later this year), ive always found their chains much tougher than sram (albiet not quite as strong as KMC). If its anything like the past they will come out with something that plays to SRAMs weakness, hence more reliable chains and an even lighter configuration

  40. #40
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    TSC Mrwhlr ..you two crack me up cheers!

  41. #41
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    I'm upgrading a few things. Muahahahahahahaha.
    Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    I'm upgrading a few things. Muahahahahahahaha.
    At this rate, I'm going to have to setup AVYFEST as well
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Not sold on XX1 yet... Several XC racer boi's have been in the shop with broken chains, I don't trust it on bigger stuff. In lieu of 11speed I went with Zee.
    I have been running it for several months along with several of my riding buddies without issue or a chain drop (knock on wood!) If you don't trust the chain then just run a 10 spd Shimano setup with the XX1 cranks/ring. The magic is in the chainring, not the chain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    The magic is in the chainring, not the chain.
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    At this rate, I'm going to have to setup AVYFEST as well
    So he finally decided to man up?
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.
    Glad someone else has their eye on these. I plan on buying one ASAP when they show up for the Endo. I figure with this, an MRP AMG guide, and a XT clutch derailleur, that should be a pretty solid setup.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    So he finally decided to man up?
    Not sure, just speculating. It does sound like the Knolly crew has given Craig a fair amount of business though.
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    Not sure, just speculating. It does sound like the Knolly crew has given Craig a fair amount of business though.
    next paycheck, i'm ordering the woodie! you had me at 4 times the oil flow!

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    Hopefully RaceFace works the same magic into their new $40 narrow-wide chain ring.
    I would love to see RaceFace's narrow-wide chain ring in a direct-mount option like the MRP Bling Ring. Of course I would like to buy a lungs and legs set that would allow me ride a 1X10.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

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    Quote Originally Posted by pfarrell View Post
    next paycheck, i'm ordering the woodie! you had me at 4 times the oil flow!
    Congrats, and welcome to the next level!
    Employed by Pivot Cycles - www.pivotcycles.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    I would love to see RaceFace's narrow-wide chain ring in a direct-mount option like the MRP Bling Ring.
    Me too, but there is always these:

    Upgrade season...xx1 and Avy, how about you?-dm32_on_x9_1024x1024.jpg
    Direct Mount for SRAM GXP Cranks | wolftoothcycling.com
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

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    1x(?) Waste of time if you're actually climbing steep stuff. XX1: unbelievable waste of money, get the Avy'd Chili'd before doing that!
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    Me too, but there is always these:
    Great find Rory! I think you may have turned me into a 1x10 guy.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    XX1: unbelievable waste of money, get the Avy'd Chili'd before doing that!


    EDIT: I'm not sure if the "shocked" emoticon shows how really shocked I was when I read this. It needs to be more like a jaw hitting the floor and eyes popping out of their sockets.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Great find Rory! I think you may have turned me into a 1x10 guy.
    Right now I'm trying to decide if I should go with a 32t or 34t with my 11-36 in the back for the Endo. A few rides with a 32, and I'm pretty sure I could go 34...
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Right now I'm trying to decide if I should go with a 32t or 34t with my 11-36 in the back for the Endo. A few rides with a 32, and I'm pretty sure I could go 34...
    30-32 is popular with those in bras the trail centre next door sets up all its trail/am bikes with 34 and a 11-36 cassette. 36 is for fitter folks. sadistic people like me use 38 (with a 11-36 cassette)

    when im feeling less progressive/motivated, i switch back to 2 x 10 with a 38 and 24 i think. As Mrwhlr says, if your climbing really steep things like 50deg slope then that small 2nd ring is whats needed for low speed rock crawling (i.e. when your showing others what Knollys can do).

    HTH

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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    These are nice aswell:

    New North Shore Billet Single Chainrings for SRAM Cranks, Universal Spiders for XX1

    I use a 38T Renthal on X0 carbon cranks. Going to grab a 36T NSB for single ring days with alot of really challenging climbs.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfrench View Post
    30-32 is popular with those in bras the trail centre next door sets up all its trail/am bikes with 34 and a 11-36 cassette. 36 is for fitter folks. sadistic people like me use 38 (with a 11-36 cassette)
    Glad you didn't say that the 24, 26, or 28 are for girls because that's what I'm thinking of putting on my bike!
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Glad you didn't say that the 24, 26, or 28 are for girls because that's what I'm thinking of putting on my bike!
    Seriously, it's not about what sex you are or how much hair you have on your chest. It's about the terrain and what serves you best. If someone is using the big cog in back most of time because he/she has 38t up front he/she will be better served to have a smaller font sprocket.

    Example: 26t in the front (versus 38t) will give another 24mm of clearance and straighten the chainline because he/she will be running more in the middle of the cassette (26t x 24t takes a similar amount of force to turn as 38t x 36t).

    There is a tradeoff in top-end speed which might not work if he/she is riding flatter terrain is more high-speed and pedally as the 26t cog put top speed around 12.4mph (@80rpm with the lowest cassette cog of 11t the speed for a 26t x 24t is ~12.4mph).

    If this person went with a 30t cog in the front then he/she would have a top speed around 14.3mph (using previous assumptions); have a straighter chainline (30t x 28t takes a similar amount of force to turn as 38t x 36t); and still would benefit from 16mm more clearance.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post


    EDIT: I'm not sure if the "shocked" emoticon shows how really shocked I was when I read this. It needs to be more like a jaw hitting the floor and eyes popping out of their sockets.
    That's only because the Avy'd Chili'd can be ridden everywhere. XX1 is utterly useless a lot of places I'm told aren't bike trails by incredulous hikers.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    I am wondering where XX1 is useless? I am also wondering who could put up with a 12.8 mph top speed!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    I am wondering where XX1 is useless? I am also wondering who could put up with a 12.8 mph top speed!
    That's top pedaling speed @ 80 revs per minute; not the top speed you can reach. If your mountain biking consists of climbing steep mountains and then descending them you are not pedaling on the down; only pedaling up and you won't ever reach 12.8 mph going up a steep mountain. As I said, "It's about the terrain and what serves you best."
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    As I said, "It's about the terrain and what serves you best."
    I thought cfrench said it was all about my bra? I'm confused now.

    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    I am wondering where XX1 is useless? I am also wondering who could put up with a 12.8 mph top speed!
    Everywhere your legs stop moving w/ that 36/42, which would be, for me around 20% of the climbs I do here, most other people I see, 50% of the climbs. Not using flat pedals, or air suspension, would probably help. If you don't mind going a lot slower, there's the equally useless 28t front ring option, for the really aggressive/stubborn purchase justification crowd.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  66. #66
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    I love xx1 - we have hills here but no real mtns. Very rocky terrain. I'm relatively fit with about 2600 road and mtn bike miles this year so far and I use a 32 front ring. We are rarely on fire roads and if we are it's half a mile a ride. Our single track is steep ups and downs and very rocky so it's slow rolling. No need really for a granny around these parts. When we go down its limited pedaling just off the saddle navigating rock and roots. No need for a large front ring. My road bike is 39/53 front. If I lived in the Rockies I'd have a compact road crank and a granny on my mtn bike. But of course mrwhir and cfrench despite having never ridden with me or likely ridden our trails probably know what's best for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    I love xx1 - we have hills here but no real mtns. Very rocky terrain. I'm relatively fit with about 2600 road and mtn bike miles this year so far and I use a 32 front ring. We are rarely on fire roads and if we are it's half a mile a ride. Our single track is steep ups and downs and very rocky so it's slow rolling. No need really for a granny around these parts. When we go down its limited pedaling just off the saddle navigating rock and roots. No need for a large front ring. My road bike is 39/53 front. If I lived in the Rockies I'd have a compact road crank and a granny on my mtn bike. But of course mrwhir and cfrench despite having never ridden with me or likely ridden our trails probably know what's best for me.
    If you decide to take a trip to Phoenix, Tucson, or Sedona, yes I do!
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wilks View Post
    I love xx1 - we have hills here but no real mtns. Very rocky terrain. I'm relatively fit with about 2600 road and mtn bike miles this year so far and I use a 32 front ring. We are rarely on fire roads and if we are it's half a mile a ride. Our single track is steep ups and downs and very rocky so it's slow rolling. No need really for a granny around these parts. When we go down its limited pedaling just off the saddle navigating rock and roots. No need for a large front ring. My road bike is 39/53 front. If I lived in the Rockies I'd have a compact road crank and a granny on my mtn bike. But of course mrwhir and cfrench despite having never ridden with me or likely ridden our trails probably know what's best for me.
    best thing for you when you are in that shape is a sports bra, maybe speak to rscecil007 and find out which product he uses for support.

    that like the last comment was: tongue in cheek.

    so joking aside, each to their own, while 32 - 38 is a very common range when using an 11-36 cassette (which alot of people do use as thats the standard config for the popular 10 speed XT cassette). ive only ever heard of one guy using a 40/42, and he climbs the steep too, but he's a triathlon guy who competes at fairly serious level.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    If you decide to take a trip to Phoenix, Tucson, or Sedona, yes I do!
    I don't believe you. Woodyak killed Goat Camp on his 34t 1x10, and Muttonchops was right there with him on his 32t 1x10.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    I don't believe you. Woodyak killed Goat Camp on his 34t 1x10, and Muttonchops was right there with him on his 32t 1x10.
    Not steep. You'll believe me, then hate me, about 10 minutes into my PMP hour of power, and never see me again after about 11. Sounds like they'd come around too after about 15.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Not steep. You'll believe me, then hate me, about 10 minutes into my PMP hour of power, and never see me again after about 11. Sounds like they'd come around too after about 15.
    Don't think I'd be interested in riding trails that you couldn't do with 1x10. In New England we call those hiking trails.

  72. #72
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    I have ridden Sedona and Phoenix with my XX1 and a 38 up front without issue as well as San Juan, Noble, etc in Socal. We regularly do rides with 3K of climbing and have done as much as 5K without issue. I am sure that you have some circus trick trail to try and prove everyone wrong and it is fine if it is what you are into, but I have not run across a single trail I could not pedal up yet and that includes slopes up to 25% which is about the limit of traction going up as well.

    Once you have tried 1x for two or three weeks then come back and tell us is doesn't work. I was a non believer for a long time as well...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    I have ridden Sedona and Phoenix with my XX1 and a 38 up front without issue as well as San Juan, Noble, etc in Socal. We regularly do rides with 3K of climbing and have done as much as 5K without issue. I am sure that you have some circus trick trail to try and prove everyone wrong and it is fine if it is what you are into, but I have not run across a single trail I could not pedal up yet and that includes slopes up to 25% which is about the limit of traction going up as well.

    Once you have tried 1x for two or three weeks then come back and tell us is doesn't work. I was a non believer for a long time as well...
    I have several hiking trails that will have you needing that little ring. Elevation gained is pretty meaningless. The problem is lack of recovery time combined with no stopping or dabbing. On some session everything and take pictures jack off ride I'm sure XX1 is just great. Not into that.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Not steep. You'll believe me, then hate me, about 10 minutes into my PMP hour of power, and never see me again after about 11. Sounds like they'd come around too after about 15.
    lol, mrwhlr e-rider of the century. please show up at the next knollfest and put your money where your keyboard is

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    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    lol, mrwhlr e-rider of the century. please show up at the next knollfest and put your money where your keyboard is
    It may coincidentally happen. Of course there's an easy way to make it certain on any old afternoon. Anyone who keeps up just becomes another potential riding partner. Since that very small population didn't move to Phoenix with me from Austin, I need to re-cultivate.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  76. #76
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    I think it comes down to level of fitness. Some guys can go single and some can't, for various reasons. I know personally, riding the V-Tach for years in granny gear set me up perfectly for riding the Chilcotin with a single (32 front, 12/36 back). It's just a little bit harder to get up the same hills with the Chili, but I get up twice as fast as I did on the Tach.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Me aside, you have the testimonies of lots of riders with lots of experience, expertise, that you know log more miles in a month than most people do in a year (definitely me & probably even you); all of whom talk about their Avy'd suspensions in same manner they talk about their Knolly bikes. Yet you still act incredulous.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    I think you're catching on to why that is, finally
    If you go to Knollyfest you can evaluate if you should listen to the posters on this board.

    FYI: Qbert inspired a name change and the only way I could do it was sign up for a new account. I think eRider describes me pretty well!

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    Quote Originally Posted by eRider View Post
    If you go to Knollyfest you can evaluate if you should listen to the posters on this board.

    FYI: Qbert inspired a name change and the only way I could do it was sign up for a new account. I think eRider describes me pretty well!
    what was your old id

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    Quote Originally Posted by qbert2000 View Post
    what was your old id
    TSC

    When I lived in UT I used to be into rock climbing and would go at least 3 times per week. I had a lot of friends that MIGHT go every few weeks who portrayed themselves as climbers. I called them "social climbers" and thought of them as posers. I’m the equivalent in the Knolly mtbr community. When I do have time to play, which has been rare lately, I have to split it between tons of activities; so in comparison to almost everyone else who posts in the Knolly forum I am a huge poser.

    That said, I’m learning so much on mtbr that I wouldn’t give it up and I feel like I do contribute. I understand more about bikes than a lot of the those that ride a lot more than me (sort of like a coach of a pro team that never played the sport at the highest levels).

    Now I have a username that describes me well and inspires me to get off my ars and ride!!!

    Thanks Q!

    EDIT: removed a the word "not" which totally changed the meaning of what I was say.
    Last edited by eRider; 06-20-2013 at 09:46 PM.

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    I had to read that a couple times. It reads like you're calling yourself a poser, but then you say you're not a huge poser (maybe just a little poser), and then you call everyone here a huge poser? I'm confused.

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    I think he is calling himself a "social rider"
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

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    I think it meant to say not a huge "poster" in place of poser

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    Quote Originally Posted by eRider View Post
    TSC
    Should have gone with "THC". Had me fooled though, thought it was Mr. Turner finally coming to his senses!
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    I have several hiking trails that will have you needing that little ring. Elevation gained is pretty meaningless. The problem is lack of recovery time combined with no stopping or dabbing. On some session everything and take pictures jack off ride I'm sure XX1 is just great. Not into that.
    Do I have to be a Furry, dress in a circus bear costume and ride a unicycle while I jack off too?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Not steep. You'll believe me, then hate me, about 10 minutes into my PMP hour of power, and never see me again after about 11. Sounds like they'd come around too after about 15.
    I'm sure I must know you. If your reality is anything like your "persona" I imagine you mostly ride alone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blatant View Post
    I'm sure I must know you. If your reality is anything like your "persona" I imagine you mostly ride alone.
    Doubtful, since the only non-family I know in this state are in Tucson and I've only been here a few months. I don't have to like someone to enjoy riding with them. A lot of people I like would be terrible riding partners.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    Do I have to be a Furry, dress in a circus bear costume and ride a unicycle while I jack off too?
    You have to keep up. If you can do it jacking off, I'll give you + rep.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big B View Post
    I had to read that a couple times. It reads like you're calling yourself a poser, but then you say you're not a huge poser (maybe just a little poser), and then you call everyone here a huge poser? I'm confused.
    Doh! Sorry; the word "not" was NOT supposed to be there. I did mean to write that "in comparison to almost everyone else who posts in the Knolly forum I am a huge poser"; however, in reflection that is probably not accurate because I'm do NOT pretend to be a hard-core or talented rider. I think Calhoun said it best. I am a "social rider".

  89. #89
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    Up San Juan on a 38t is impressive. That pizza dish 42t cog must be a pleasure to have!

    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    I have ridden Sedona and Phoenix with my XX1 and a 38 up front without issue as well as San Juan, Noble, etc in Socal. We regularly do rides with 3K of climbing and have done as much as 5K without issue. I am sure that you have some circus trick trail to try and prove everyone wrong and it is fine if it is what you are into, but I have not run across a single trail I could not pedal up yet and that includes slopes up to 25% which is about the limit of traction going up as well.

    Once you have tried 1x for two or three weeks then come back and tell us is doesn't work. I was a non believer for a long time as well...
    Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

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    I still cant quite wrap my head around a 42t cog. Pizza dish isn't far off from a good description!
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    I still cant quite wrap my head around a 42t cog. Pizza dish isn't far off from a good description!
    Lemme help you out: Take $400, put it in a box for six months, open the box, burn the money. Repeat.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Up San Juan on a 38t is impressive. That pizza dish 42t cog must be a pleasure to have!
    Definitely helps. My main riding buddy is on a 38t up front with an 11-34 on the rear! He is also crazy enough that when he forgot his shoes he just kept his running shoes on for SJT and then rode down Chiquito, ON EGGBEATERS! Guy is an animal.

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Lemme help you out: Take $400, put it in a box for six months, open the box, burn the money. Repeat.
    If you are going through a rear cog every six months you have bigger maintenance issues. My last XTR cogset lasted seven chains and 2K+ miles. I have no doubt that the XX1 will last just as long if not longer. The amount of misinformation you are spouting/bitterness towards XX1 is mind numbing. I am sure you are fast on a bike, but take it down from 11 to 8 on the anger scale.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    that includes slopes up to 25% which is about the limit of traction going up as well.
    To clarify, I believe that Salespunk means 25 degrees and not 25% which is ~14 degrees (still very steep). There is a cobblestone road in Pittsburg PA that is 37% and is ridden often. (There is a race up it.) And, there is a paved road in Hawaii that has sections of 25 degrees (~45%) and has been climbed on a bike.

  95. #95
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    I thought Mrwhlr accidently quoted the price of a full XX1 drivetrain. Just the cassette is $400?!?! It's made out of the same crap the old cassettes are made out of! 2 extra cogs cost that much?

    I'll stick with my 9 speed system and $47 HG-61.

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big B View Post
    I thought Mrwhlr accidently quoted the price of a full XX1 drivetrain. Just the cassette is $400?!?! It's made out of the same crap the old cassettes are made out of! 2 extra cogs cost that much?

    I'll stick with my $47 HG-61, 9 speed system.

    Pretty sure it is cnc'd out of one big block of aluminum...but someone correct me if I am wrong.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Pretty sure it is cnc'd out of one big block of aluminum...but someone correct me if I am wrong.
    Looks like you are right. And here I thought they were just trying to rip us off.

    The story of the SRAM XX1 drivetrain | Dirt


  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Pretty sure it is cnc'd out of one big block of aluminum...but someone correct me if I am wrong.
    That's how they describe it here (but with steel):
    SRAM XX1 Drivetrain - Tested - Pinkbike
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salespunk View Post
    If you are going through a rear cog every six months you have bigger maintenance issues. My last XTR cogset lasted seven chains and 2K+ miles. I have no doubt that the XX1 will last just as long if not longer. The amount of misinformation you are spouting/bitterness towards XX1 is mind numbing. I am sure you are fast on a bike, but take it down from 11 to 8 on the anger scale.

    That's how long it takes before they fold from massive torque. To put it another way, he could just buy six economical cassettes and throw five in the trash each replacement period. I do 2,000 miles in six months, easily. Don't mistake objectivity for anger.

    XTR.....yeah, 2nd place to XX1 in the do not buy contest. At least it works everywhere.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big B View Post
    I thought Mrwhlr accidently quoted the price of a full XX1 drivetrain. Just the cassette is $400?!?! It's made out of the same crap the old cassettes are made out of! 2 extra cogs cost that much?

    I'll stick with my 9 speed system and $47 HG-61.
    No, that's ~$1300. Something like $350 each time you fvck a rear der.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

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