New Endo w/CCDBA - What are your settings?
I couldn't deal with the CTD anymore so I put on a CCDBA-CS on my Endo with the "base tune". Feels much better overall but I'm having difficulty getting full travel. I need to dig in and see if I have spacers installed or not. I tried letting the HSC all the way out and that didn't help. I added more sag and that helped a little but still not using the last 1/2" of travel and it feels like it needs more air. What have y'all come across?
Rider Weight 155 lbs.
PSI - 115 feels right but I can't get last 3/4" of travel. 100 feels too soft and can't get last 1/2" travel.
LSC - Stock +2 (firmer)
LSR - Stock +2 (slower)
HSC - Stock -.5 (softer)
HSR - Stock +.5 (slower)
You check cane creeks lounge site?
I recall Dusty mentioning the exposed surface/length of the shock is longer than the amount of travel available. Maybe he can confirm this.
I have been running the standard DBair on my Endorphin at 152 psi and 200+gear rider weight. Cane Creek recommends 17mm of sag.
Portland Off Road Navagators
I just put a CCDBA CS on as well. The shock feels really good, but like you, I am having a hard time getting full travel. I measured 2.25" up from the o-ring and also bottomed the shock with 0 PSI. Its hard to get the shock to sink into the last 1/2" of stroke.
I took the bike up to Downieville and was able to run a bit more sag and get very close to full travel. For my home trails I am running about 17mm of sag (recommended).
Rider Weight - 175
PSI - 120
LSC - 6 clicks
LSR - 10 clicks
HSC - 0.3-0.5 turns
HSR - 1.5 - 2.0 turns (still working on this one)
The information on HSR seems very vague.
I have not opened the air sleeve to see if there are spacers. I did contact CC and they said it might be worth trying the HV air sleeve.
The CS switch is nice and gives the shock a very noticeable difference when actuated. It feels great on ledgy technical climbs.
I guess the CCDB is a love/hate. With all the adjustments you have to spend some time getting it dialed. Even when it feels great I am left wondering if a little tweaking could make it feel even better. The shock does feel really good. Compared to the CTD I have been able to carry a lot more speed and have more control. I still have my AVY'd DHX from my Chili, so I might give that a go as well.
I'll keep you posted.
On the original DBair I didn't read the manual and didn't charge the negative air chamber. That limited my travel. After I did that I got more travel, but not all (this was prior to the higher flow upgrade).
"sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun
Yeah, I tried the lounge but there wasn't anything there on the Endo.
I just set it to 100 PSI, which is about 35% sag and I still can't get the last 1/4" travel.
I've been e-mailing back and forth with CC. Will see what happens...
Forgive me if this sounds dumb but have you tried letting the pressure from the shock & running through full travel then measure the results?
Originally Posted by woodyak
This is key aspect that I overlooked!
Originally Posted by TSC
I got one on the way for the Endo....keep the info coming. This is interesting stuff. If this is the case, it will be super interesting, because despite the fact I have a L volume spacer and a plastic shim in the RP23 - i still feel as though i am going thru my travel.
Hopefully be contributing to the thread next weekend.
I thought that the cs version was identical to the non cs when the climb switch is off.
this means we can just use the last versions settings...theres a thread here somewhere that has a lot of detail on how to dial it in.
Originally Posted by cfrench
Yes and no: or more appropriately:
- Yes, the new CS shock functions identically to the Non-CS shocks when the CS switch is off.
- No, you will not want to use Non-CS tune settings for CS shocks.
The reason for the latter is because you won't need as much low speed damping (primarily LSC) in the CS shock. Basically, you're essentially going to "bracket" (if you understand the term how it's used in photography) the Non-CS shock settings when you have a CS shock.
With the Non-CS shock, you would find the best compromise between DH-iness and Pedal Friendliness. With the CS, you don't need to worry about tuning for pedal friendliness: you just tune the shock for DH-iness and then engage CS when pedal friendliness is required.
Obviously, individual customers will need to tweak this differently depending up their abilities, terrain, preferences, etc... but for most customers this should be the general tuning philosophy.
thanks for that! of course..doing it the way you suggest makes it much more enduro race friendly...
Originally Posted by knollybikes.com
Just to update everyone. Yes, I can get full travel with no air in the shock. I've been going back and forth with CC and today I rode the shock with 0 LSC and 0 HSC w/100 psi (35%+ sag) and while it rode better it still felt harsh on all aspects and still could not bottom it out. So half way through my ride I threw on my old DBAir from my Chilly, that I just had serviced, and it rode great. I was only able to tune the LSC and LSR because I don't have that tool, but w/105 psi and about 15 LSC and stock LSR it felt fantastic. Way better than the CTD and way way better than the DBAir-CS. So I'm thinking there is something wrong with mine. I'm going to push CC to help me get it fixed while I keep riding the older DBAir.
Threw the DBA CS on Friday and rode Sat / Sun. I am not up to speed yet after a couple weeks off the bike - but i didnt 'second guess' or change my suspension settings for a second on either ride.
I set the shock settings pretty much per the CC recomendation with 1/2 a turn less HSC (per G-AIR) and the same psi as him also. I used all my travel without a doubt y'day and added that extra 1/2 turn of HSC (to get back to 1 turn) and today I felt about perfect using all but 5mm of my travel on an XC ride.
I found that I left the shock in "CS" mode even on the seated XC sections which were pretty rooty and technical and it felt awesome. I would best describe it as, "not noticing or caring what the shock was doing".
I have ridden this same trail numerous times with the CTD and RP23 and have stopped to futz with the air pressure / rebound - today - i was pulling the piss and deliberately staying seated or wheely'ing into rooted sections to guage the shock. It was rad.
When i flicked the lever (i remembered every time)...and headed down, i felt 100% balanced and felt as though the bike felt grounded when i wanted it to be - but light and weightless when required - I am home this week and with good weather on the horizon I am super excited to ride a couple different trails. This is going to the blow the socks off the Endo.
Bad Ass Black!
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/davemutton/10392787174/" title="Bad As Black by davemutton, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3787/10392787174_a0c5f273be_z.jpg" width="640" height="480" alt="Bad As Black"></a>
Last edited by Muttonchops; 10-20-2013 at 06:43 PM.
Again - great looking Endorphin! I love the all black!
Originally Posted by Muttonchops
How's the Pike matching the DB Air?
Also are you running 30% sag or 35% sag?
Glad it's working out for you. That black is sick. Don't think I've ever seen that much black on a bike before.
Originally Posted by Muttonchops
CC recommended I go with the XVGA air can so that's on the way. I'm thinking maybe because I'm lighter that I need the can. We'll see.
Quick update - i am running pretty much the same as G-AIR. Finding i need much less LSC than recommended and this makes a huge difference in plushness when descending.
So I picked up the XVGA can last week and put it through a thorough thrashing. CC recommended I go with one spacer. I tried that and found no difference with the same psi, so I dumped the spacer. I set it up with the same settings as MC and I gotta say I'm pretty stoked on this shock now. I can now get full travel on the bigger hits. I also found it to be a hair plusher while still keeping midstroke support.
Did you purchase the can direct from CC?
Any more ride reports?
Thanks for keeping us posted.
Originally Posted by woodyak
Yup, straight from CC. I think it was $40. You have to get the spacers separately. I already had one from my older DBAir.
Originally Posted by G-AIR
I'm still stoked on the bigger can. The change is not nearly as big as I thought it would be. I was afraid that it'd blow through it's travel and wallow on me but that has not been the case at all. I've been riding the bike harder than every lately and the shock has not let me down.
I do find the CS to be kinda funky. It's definitely more active than the CTD when locked out. You could get away riding with it on most of the day w/o even knowing it. With the CTD I only used it as a lockout when climbing pavement and fireroads and would never consider using it during actual riding. But with the CS I find myself preferring to have it on when hitting the buffed out roller trails. You can get more pump out of it with the CS on and gives you more snap when peddling. You definitely want it off when you hit the chunk though.
Gotta say the DBAir/Pike combo has to be the best combo for the Endo. It really stretches how far you can take this bike. With the CTD/Rev combo I had the same problem that I've always had with XC oriented bikes. While they peddled superfast and climbed great the minute I tried to hit any jumps, drops, ttfs, or take things at speed the shocks would get overwhelmed and the bike would feel sketchy. And good luck if you hit something off balanced, no forgiveness at all. While a lot of it seems to be related to XC geo and flimsy flexy frames, the poor dampers amplified the problem. That's all gone now. I feel totally comfortable hitting smaller jumps and drops at speed and I feel like I have way more confidence than I ever did on any light bike I've owned. Man I love this bike!
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