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  1. #51
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    HD trailstar are a good PNW winter tire if you can afford $160 every 3 months? Light, sticky and burly sidewalls are awesome for low pressure slow greasy tech stuff... but they don't last especially the rear. They also tend to wash out when things get fast and aggressive (due to transition knobs). For me, most of the smaller transition knobs quickly sheared right off, and then the outer knobs eroded to 'useless' about 10 rides later.

    I just mounted up a set of Butcher SX, and so far REALLY like them. Strangely they are also much lighter than the advertised 950 grams, mine are 827 (might need some digging into). SX's are also slightly bigger than the Butcher 'Control' version which are very narrow for a 2.3" And if you ride gnar don't even think about 'controls' they are paper thin.

    SX are probably what most will call a Minion DHF copy... but I say wrong!! DHF roll like pigs in mud. If you pedal to the top SX are very respectable rollers, and won't have you cussing all the way up, lol. When you drop in...ride much bigger than any Minion Boss! You will be amazed!

    So, If you're looking for a sturdy, light AM tire, that likes to go fast... I would say check them out.

    IMO
    Last edited by djball; 02-06-2013 at 11:22 PM.

  2. #52
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    Hans Dampf or Trail King?

    I don't have any HD experience but I really like the rubber/tread on the TK for the rear. The only complaint is the sidewall could be a little bit beefier IMO. The black chili compound wears well and I get gobs of traction.
    ¡Geaux Tigers! - ¡Visca el Barça!


  3. #53
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    I've got a handful of rides on the HD rear and I like it every bit as much as the TK, and it has more grip than the FA. Coupled with a Butcher SX front, I've not even thought about the tires in a couple weeks. Tubeless rear at about 31, but might try dropping pressure a bit as I haven't had any unnerving feedback on square edges or cornering.

  4. #54
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    Currently running the black chili 2.2 Trail King rear, Hans Dampf 2.35 pacestar front and thought I'd chime in. The snakeskin sidewalls on the HD are fantastic for such a light tire and while I'm running it on the front I wouldn't mind picking one up to try on the rear. I've also been impressed with the tread life having ran it for almost 10 months with little wear thus far. You guys seeing knobs falling off must be putting in a lot more miles than I on harder terrain! I ride the shore and am definitely now a schwalbe fan. Would like to pick up a set of dirty dans for the winter months in future as the HD is too closely spaced to be really effective in the wetter months.

    Not nearly as impressed with the Trail King 2.2. I do not know how anyone can rave about the traction of this tire. The knobs are miniscule and the sidewalls protrude excessively. While I do agree that the black chili compound is great, traction has been quite poor on hardpack, loam, and mud. It is superlight however so I can't really expect a stiff sidewall, but I can't make it 2 rides without flatting and have to be extra careful to not slam anything. Previously my favourite rear tires have been Michelin comp24 2.2 and Maxxis Minion DHR 2.35 supertacky. Perhaps I'll try a muddy mary, der kaiser, baron or High Roller II. In the meantime an old Hutchinson Barracuda 2.5 is doing a far better job while being 2 pounds heavier.

  5. #55
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    I've got the 2.4" TK's UST version on some P35 rims. Love the size and traction. The wide tire on the wide rims steer incredibly precisely. I've got a year in on these tires set up tubeless - with zero damage/flats.

    I lent those wheels to my GF and she built up some for herself.

    I've got my next set of TKs already sitting on my desk. I can't see riding anything else at the moment.

    I ride BC coastal terrain. Rocky/rooty and frequently damp.

    BTW - the 2.4" TK's are huge they max out my frame clearance.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post

    BTW - the 2.4" TK's are huge they max out my frame clearance.
    They'll rub on a bigger drop to flat...but I'm running 819's and they definitely aren't wide.

  7. #57
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    Aren't those 2.4 TK's over 1100 grams each? I thought about running them , but that's almost an extra 2 lbs rotational weight.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by djball View Post
    Aren't those 2.4 TK's over 1100 grams each? I thought about running them , but that's almost an extra 2 lbs rotational weight.
    They are heavy, but were I live the they work great and the large volume rolls more easily over roots/rocks than the "normal" sized 2.35" tires. I'm faster on the TK's both up and down than on previous lighter tires.

    That may not be true for everyone depending on your local conditions, but I'm sold on them....
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  9. #59
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    Hey guys. Right now (and recently) I have been running a Trailstar HD up front and an TK 2.4 (not UST) in the rear. Both tubeless. The traction is amazing. I used to run Trailstar HD front and rear, but the rear tire gets destroyed very quickly. I tried a pacestar HD for the rear, and I thought the traction was terrible!! OK traction for northern utah riding but for southern utah (rock) riding, the rear would not stick to anything.

    I did notice that a bunch of people run the Trailstar front and Pacestar rear. Am I the only one that thinks the Pacestar rear is lacking in traction?

    I do like the Trailking 2.4 in the rear, but I am thinking about putting a lighter tire (i.e. the HD) back on.

    So all things aside, what will I be faster climbing on is the question? HD Trailstar rear or TK 2.4 non-UST rear?

  10. #60
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    I've had the HD Vertstars and theyre the grippiest tyres out there i think but are FRO as they wear out REALLY fast. Trailstars are the best for price performance tradeoff.

    i dont run these anymore i run 2.4 Ardents (high volume) but the ground here is soft with tight twisty natural trails so you spend your time in the middle or on the edge of the tyre, alot of people dont like the ardent as theres little inbetween the extremes but ive always found them to shed dirt faster because of this.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    Hey guys. Right now (and recently) I have been running a Trailstar HD up front and an TK 2.4 (not UST) in the rear. Both tubeless. The traction is amazing. I used to run Trailstar HD front and rear, but the rear tire gets destroyed very quickly. I tried a pacestar HD for the rear, and I thought the traction was terrible!! OK traction for northern utah riding but for southern utah (rock) riding, the rear would not stick to anything.

    I did notice that a bunch of people run the Trailstar front and Pacestar rear. Am I the only one that thinks the Pacestar rear is lacking in traction?

    I do like the Trailking 2.4 in the rear, but I am thinking about putting a lighter tire (i.e. the HD) back on.

    So all things aside, what will I be faster climbing on is the question? HD Trailstar rear or TK 2.4 non-UST rear?
    2.2 TK? Good traction, lighter...

    I dig the 2.4 TK UST for a rear tire, but I'll take the weight penalty for traction and durability.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by B Gillespie View Post
    2.2 TK? Good traction, lighter...

    I dig the 2.4 TK UST for a rear tire, but I'll take the weight penalty for traction and durability.
    Yep, the Trail King 2.2 UST is a good rear tire. Still offers pretty good size too.

  13. #63
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    +1 2.35 HD TS front (650b), 2.4 TK rear. I find it works really well. Why change?

  14. #64
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    Anyone in this thread try the Schwalbe Big Betty 2.4 TSC on the front setup tubeless? I just mounted a non UST version BB 2.4 TSC with a Hans Dampf 2.35 EVO TLR TSC on the rear. My bike is all rubber right now. I'm thinking this is going to be my setup for a trip to Sedona I'm taking in a week. I'm planning to get a few rides on it before the trip but wanted to see if anyone had thoughts/observations on the Big Betty: psi, tracking, cornering and keeping it on the rim? It's not marked as tubeless ready and I like to run low pressure so burps are a concern. I'm usually a little nervous about running tires that are new to me on bigger excursions.

    I've typically gone with a 2.5 Minion DHF EXO (love it) but got a bit scared away from it after hearing about all the tubeless failures.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by loamranger View Post
    +1 2.35 HD TS front (650b), 2.4 TK rear. I find it works really well. Why change?
    I decided not to change for now. The new Enve rims will be outfitted with HD Trailstar Front and TK 2.4 (non-UST) rear.

  16. #66
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    I should have listened! Bought a set of HDs this week. Trailstar front, Pacestar rear. The front worked pretty well on our ride today, up National, down Viejo, DC back. I ran about 20psi front. 26psi rear. Front braking and cornering was very good, and the light weight made the spin back on DC rather fun.
    However, the Pacestar in the rear BLOWS. Traction on granite was marginal at best. The Specy Ground Control is an upgrade here. The PSC rear tire caused me to be very cautious when applying power on granite. It would also slide out on off camber granite. I also found braking traction to be below average. As such, the rear tire is tore up. It looks like I have 2 months of riding on it. I think I will run the PSC as a front tire on the Endo and see how it works there.

    I did replace the PSC with a Trail King 2.4 UST Black Chili. Based on the info here, this looks to be the ticket. Although the TK is heavier, it feels like it rolls rather well. Kiwanis tomorrow, That should tell me all I need to know.
    "Three balls at once...who knew?" - Cotton McKnight

  17. #67
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    Yeah, the Pacestar is terrible on rocks . As stated earlier, I'm running the TK 2.4 on the rear now and it works great. For what is is worth though, a Trailstar HD on the rear also works fantastically well and for the sure works great on rock surfaces as well. The TK lasts longer. As far as which rear tire is better performance, I'm not sure yet.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    I should have listened! Bought a set of HDs this week. Trailstar front, Pacestar rear. The front worked pretty well on our ride today, up National, down Viejo, DC back. I ran about 20psi front. 26psi rear. Front braking and cornering was very good, and the light weight made the spin back on DC rather fun.
    However, the Pacestar in the rear BLOWS. Traction on granite was marginal at best. The Specy Ground Control is an upgrade here. The PSC rear tire caused me to be very cautious when applying power on granite. It would also slide out on off camber granite. I also found braking traction to be below average. As such, the rear tire is tore up. It looks like I have 2 months of riding on it. I think I will run the PSC as a front tire on the Endo and see how it works there.

    I did replace the PSC with a Trail King 2.4 UST Black Chili. Based on the info here, this looks to be the ticket. Although the TK is heavier, it feels like it rolls rather well. Kiwanis tomorrow, That should tell me all I need to know.
    Nice feedback. I just pulled the HD TSC off the rear. I've decided the HD tires will simply not work for me front or rear. IMO they don't reward aggressive riding. I'm back to what I know and like in the Minion DHF EXO 2.5 front / Trail King 2.2 UST rear for my chunkier rides, and Butcher Control / DHR for XC/trail.

  19. #69
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    I'm waiting for the TR version of the Maxxis tires to be available and I will likely go that direction as well. I was able to get the HDs for $56 each, so cheaper than the Specy tires I normally get and figured it was worth the try. If I don't like the tires, they will wear out quickly enough. Hoping the TK works out. Seems like a really good compound, and people say it wears exceptionally well. Plus, it is a good ol' paddle tire. A 2.2 UST would be my preferred choice for weight purposes, but the LBS only had the 2.4.

    My biggest complaint with the Specy butcher SX it is wears so fast. The side knobs get under cut very quickly. Seems like the Maxxis tires wear more evenly.
    "Three balls at once...who knew?" - Cotton McKnight

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiSS'er View Post
    I'm waiting for the TR version of the Maxxis tires to be available and I will likely go that direction as well. I was able to get the HDs for $56 each, so cheaper than the Specy tires I normally get and figured it was worth the try. If I don't like the tires, they will wear out quickly enough. Hoping the TK works out. Seems like a really good compound, and people say it wears exceptionally well. Plus, it is a good ol' paddle tire. A 2.2 UST would be my preferred choice for weight purposes, but the LBS only had the 2.4.

    My biggest complaint with the Specy butcher SX it is wears so fast. The side knobs get under cut very quickly. Seems like the Maxxis tires wear more evenly.
    That's a good deal you got on the HD's. I have a stockpile of tires that didn't pass go. I spent a lot of money to end up right back at what I already knew works for me. I really like the Butcher Control it keeps amazing me with how well it tracks and rails the corners. I would definitely consider an SX if I could find one. I'm going to test the 2.4 Big Betty tomorrow but if it falters the DHF will be on for my Sedona trip. The BB 2.4 is HUGE, square profile, but no defined channel that I prefer like on the Butcher and DHF.

    Hans Dampf or Trail King?-bigbettysm.jpg

  21. #71
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    Surprised that no one has chimed in about these.

    Continental Baron Black Chili 2.3in Tyre Review - BikeRadar

    Best all around tyres that I have used.

    Almost a year old & still going strong!

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by material guy View Post
    Surprised that no one has chimed in about these.

    Continental Baron Black Chili 2.3in Tyre Review - BikeRadar

    Best all around tyres that I have used..

    Almost a year old & still going strong!
    I have a set of Barons which are very good, but not as smooth rolling as the bigger 2.4 TK's.

  23. #73
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    I had the 2.4 TK's and found that they did not handle the aggressive cornering as well as the Barons do.

  24. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by material guy View Post
    Surprised that no one has chimed in about these.

    Continental Baron Black Chili 2.3in Tyre Review - BikeRadar

    Best all around tyres that I have used.

    Almost a year old & still going strong!
    Nice. I had picked one up at one point to use, but opted for the TK instead. They're on my list, but right now, the Butcher SX f and HD rear...I've no complaints. Don't even think about tires.

  25. #75
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    I'm looking for a new front tire to try out, just something to compare to my Muddy Mary. Maybe I should give the Butcher SX a shot based on some of your guys comments. Does it play well tubeless with a Flow rim?
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

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