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  1. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    I got my DBAir back from Dirt Labs with the new air can and a full service, took the bike out for a ride and it felt ... exactly the same. Moreover, I am still not able to use the full travel. I had Dirt Labs configure the DB Air to the recommended setting for the Chilcotin (figured that was a good starting point) and am running 140psi for the air spring. I am 185 (in my birthday suit) and this yields about a 30% sag. It feels wonderful on the trail, but its only using 2/3 of the stroke on the shock.

    For the test ride, I went into AF Canyon (Wasatch, UT) and rode it 19 miles with 4600' of elevation change. There was plenty of really fast DH to test out the shock. Most of it is very fast with small roots, rocks and drops (small ones about 1-2 feet). There was some larger rocks on part of the trail which I used all of my front travel on. Granted I tend to hit these harder with the front end but I thought I would use more travel with the reworked air can.

    How big of a hit do you need to go off of to get to use all of the travel? Do I just need to take it somewhere bigger (Moab ) to test this or is there something still wrong with my shock?

    Also, I was running 140psi before the rework and was king of expecting to have to change it afterwards. I think it is right as the sag check out, it climbs wonderfully (no wallow), and claws it way over any tech it sees effortlessly. At this point I'm not sure what else to do...
    Same experience during my test ride, peeled a tire off the rim, still not full travel. What else to do? Get the DB coil.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  2. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock dude View Post
    Hey Elias, I was getting ready to send mine back to get the new can but after reading your report I'm second guessing if it's worth having the bike down.
    Hey. Just because it has not yet fixed my problem, some people are reporting that it did fix the problem. In any respect, Dirt Labs in Colorado will do a 1 day turn on the shock for you. I would send it in to them and have the air can changed out. If you call Cane Creek they are going to tell you that you need to do that first anyways. Plus, I believe you have enough hours on that guy to warrant a service anyways...

    Here is how Dirt Labs configured my shock:

    Low Speed Compression: 14 clicks from - (out of 25)
    High Speed Compression: 1 full turn from - (out of 4)
    Low Speed Rebound: 12 clicks from - (out of 25)
    High Speed Rebound: 2 full turns from - (out of 4)

    I am going to try turning down the HSC to 3/4 and then 1/2 and see if it helps.

  3. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    I got my DBAir back from Dirt Labs with the new air can and a full service, took the bike out for a ride and it felt ... exactly the same. Moreover, I am still not able to use the full travel. I had Dirt Labs configure the DB Air to the recommended setting for the Chilcotin (figured that was a good starting point) and am running 140psi for the air spring. I am 185 (in my birthday suit) and this yields about a 30% sag. It feels wonderful on the trail, but its only using 2/3 of the stroke on the shock.

    For the test ride, I went into AF Canyon (Wasatch, UT) and rode it 19 miles with 4600' of elevation change. There was plenty of really fast DH to test out the shock. Most of it is very fast with small roots, rocks and drops (small ones about 1-2 feet). There was some larger rocks on part of the trail which I used all of my front travel on. Granted I tend to hit these harder with the front end but I thought I would use more travel with the reworked air can.

    How big of a hit do you need to go off of to get to use all of the travel? Do I just need to take it somewhere bigger (Moab ) to test this or is there something still wrong with my shock?

    Also, I was running 140psi before the rework and was king of expecting to have to change it afterwards. I think it is right as the sag check out, it climbs wonderfully (no wallow), and claws it way over any tech it sees effortlessly. At this point I'm not sure what else to do...

    Sorry to hear this, but I had a horrible experience with Dirt Lab. I don't think they know what they are doing. Before heading to Whistler, I am out of town with work so an ideal opportunity to get my Marz 66 serviced. There was nothing wrong with it, but since I was out of town - let's gets some new oil and seals before the big trip. I return and the fork feels like crap and is noisy. They removed the plastic spring cover - why? I have no clue. Fork was not moving smoothly through its travel - it was horrible. I sent it back paid for overnight shipping. It came back feeling like crap again. Now I was stuck with it for my trip. When I returned, I sent to Marzocchi who fixed the fork caused by Dirt Labs. I do not trust them at all!

  4. #254
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    damn, not what I was hoping for. I will still send mine in for service, the bushing is already worn and I have some seepage from the shrader valve.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  5. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    damn, not what I was hoping for. I will still send mine in for service, the bushing is already worn and I have some seepage from the shrader valve.
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike!

    Dude, sorry to hear about your lousy experience with Dirt Labs. While the DBAir is still not using all of its travel it is working very smoothly in all other aspects. They even swapped out the bushings for me as well. There are other labs as well...

  6. #256
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    I am so surprised that things are not working out after the new air can was installed for others.
    As I mentioned, in my first ride and several rides after that, my shock was not the same.
    Used all the travel on a 5' to flat, but use about 7/8ths travel on regular rides.
    No spiking, smooth as silk in all the motion in the travel range. On one drop on Cypress I thought that I was going to eat sh*t due to the crappy, rocky landing but the bike took the landing with out so much as a hick up.
    I would have thought the same for all of the shocks to have this mod?????

    I'm stoked with mine wish you were too.

    P.S. I did not use there settings, there's sucked.
    Last edited by material guy; 10-26-2012 at 11:06 AM.

  7. #257
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    ^^^ I'm glad to hear that you like yours because I went ahead and sent mine to GarageWorks today.
    I hope I have the same results.

  8. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike! ..
    Don´t know are there others too, but I´m using needle bearings already in the other (top) end of my DB Air - drilled eye up to 15mm`s, so using standard DU-bushings is also possible now. Bearing is RWS/ Enduro kit. Another eye is still original-sized.

  9. #259
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    Ok guys, sorry for the delay in testing but I finally got back on the bike. Leaving the shock setup as I had previously (straight from Dirt Labs, new air can, 140psi, etc.) I backed off the HSC by 1/2 turn (now total is 1/2 turn) and the result was pretty amazing. I was able to use almost all of the travel and it still felt really good. The trail I was on only had 3 foot-ish drops so I am pretty sure that when I take it to bigger terrain it will use the little bit of travel still remaining. I went ahead and continued to tune by backing off the LSC by 3 clicks and I am very happy with the results. Climbs great, no noticeable bob, really smooth ride (LSC wise) and its handling the big-hits great. Again, sorry for the review I posted before I perhaps had tested it enough. At least for now, I am calling it working!!!

  10. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike!

    Dude, sorry to hear about your lousy experience with Dirt Labs. While the DBAir is still not using all of its travel it is working very smoothly in all other aspects. They even swapped out the bushings for me as well. There are other labs as well...
    I had my bike shop send my shock into BTI (local CC service center.) I just talked to them and they said the shock was blown. Something about oil leaking into the wrong chambers and seeping out of the shraeder valve. Cane Creek is going to replace the shock under warranty and the new(er) shocks already have the sleeve installed. Looking forward to seeing what this shock feels like when it’s working
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  11. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    I had my bike shop send my shock into BTI (local CC service center.) I just talked to them and they said the shock was blown. Something about oil leaking into the wrong chambers and seeping out of the shraeder valve. Cane Creek is going to replace the shock under warranty and the new(er) shocks already have the sleeve installed. Looking forward to seeing what this shock feels like when it’s working
    So I fitted the shock to my bike Friday and went about the adjustment process. I started with the settings defined in the DB air Lounge. Bouncing around the neighborhood I was very surprised. The shock felt super plush and I was getting more travel than the previous shock ever got. Although I can't say that I noticed the sleeve upgrade exclusively, I cant say for sure that my previous shock was blown. Hopefully I will be able to get some solid ride time on the shock in the coming week and get it tuned.

    I went for a ride yesterday and the shock felt awesome. The trail conditions kept me too busy to really think about the shock. But I did not notice anything annoying so something must be right

    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

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  12. #262
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    Just got my new cc dbair and despite reading this, I backed out the screw too far and now don't have any audible clicks. Got it back in with a screwdriver but was really surprised this happened. I am always gentle with my gear but I think th problem stems from CC having the settings referenced from all the way open..... This makes no sense to me. Unless other people are having different experiences with their shock I never encountered a limit when opening my lsc screw for example. It just kept spinning on and on... Are others feeling a positive end to backing out the low speed screws? I'm assuming yes
    Last edited by Dpca10; 12-12-2012 at 07:36 PM.

  13. #263
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    Found this in another thread, could solve some problems:

    Huber Bushings - High Precision Shock Bushings
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  14. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dpca10 View Post
    Just got my new cc dbair and despite reading this, I backed out the screw too far and now don't have any audible clicks. Got it back in with a screwdriver but was really surprised this happened. I am always gentle with my gear but I think th problem stems from CC having the settings referenced from all the way open..... This makes no sense to me. Unless other people are having different experiences with their shock I never encountered a limit when opening my lsc screw for example. It just kept spinning on and on... Are others feeling a positive end to backing out the low speed screws? I'm assuming yes
    I have 5 CCDB's between my wife and I on various bikes. On all of them, the low speed screws have a hard stop at full open. However I do have a riding buddy who's CCDB air does the same thing as yours on one of his low speed adjusters. He contacted Cane Creek on it and they said it shouldn't have any impact, and if he wanted to send it in he could. He decided not to and the shock has been fine, other than needing to know it has this behavior when turning the low speed screw full open.

  15. #265
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    Yeah I called CC and they said this can happen but unless oil and air are leaking out it shouldn't be a problem. I used the screwdriver trick to reset it. In any event the shock rides amazing. For a while I thought it felt stiff and wasn't plush until I realized that I wasn't feeling the chatter at all. Feel it really improved my traction on the turns

  16. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    Found this in another thread, could solve some problems:

    Huber Bushings - High Precision Shock Bushings
    The translation on the page is BRUTAL

    "The shock bushings are used to fix the shock absorber in the frame. Over the plain the pivoting movements of the damper can be added during compression and out. This should be durable and shock eye camp at the same time easily."

    If it helps eliminate the silly plastic spacer that I keep destroying I may be willing to try

  17. #267
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    yeah, its a tough read, but damn they look seksy.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  18. #268
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    The translation on the page is BRUTAL
    Yes, thats true.
    It´s an automatic translator.
    This is going to be improved.

    If you have questions I will try to answer more understandable.

    Stephan

  19. #269
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    Hey guys, jumping in on this thread for the first time in a few months, and only read the last 2 pages, so pardon me if what I'm about to say was covered in the middle pages...

    I'm seeing that many people complain about still feeling/thinking they are not getting full travel. Does everyone realize that the amount of exposed shaft on the shock is greater than the stroke of the shock? The stroke on the DB-air for Chilcotin is 2.25", but the exposed shaft is more like 2.5". This means that you will never get the travel indicator to bump all the way up to the shock body. At least, not with a properly working shock.

    Also, the new air can is an elective procedure, and certainly not mandatory specific for the Chilcotin and/or 4x4 suspension design. There is no deficiency with the standard air can on our suspension design, which is probably why most people feel no difference after the 'upgrade'.

    Finally, the eyelet/axle/reducer deficiency. Cane Creek is all over this, working hard on a permanent resolution. I have full confidence they will come up with something durable and elegant.

    Here are my current DB-air settings. As you can see, as I've gained confidence on the Chilcotin and DB-air, riding gets faster, damping goes up...

    PSI: 153 (RTR weight 215#)
    HSC: 1.5
    LSC: 18
    HSR: 2.5
    LSR: 12

    I keep my shock settings in my phone as a contact, so I can log changes on the trail, and not forget them. Cheers.
    Global Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

  20. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post


    Here are my current DB-air settings. As you can see, as I've gained confidence on the Chilcotin and DB-air, riding gets faster, damping goes up...

    PSI: 153 (RTR weight 215#)
    HSC: 1.5
    LSC: 18
    HSR: 2.5
    LSR: 12

    I keep my shock settings in my phone as a contact, so I can log changes on the trail, and not forget them. Cheers.



    Are those numbers from fully open or closed? IIRC The first time we got baseline setting some were from open and some were from close.

  21. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Also, the new air can is an elective procedure, and certainly not mandatory specific for the Chilcotin and/or 4x4 suspension design. There is no deficiency with the standard air can on our suspension design, which is probably why most people feel no difference after the 'upgrade'.
    So, I take it you have not "upgraded" to the larger can? I haven't really heard anything to convince me to do it. I like my shock the way it feels, but if something is actually better, I would do it.

  22. #272
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    ..and another thing I love about my DB coil (apart from the fact that it works the same as it did 2 years ago when I got it) I can change the sag in about 3 seconds. So aggravating faffing around w/ pumps, I can't believe I did it for so long.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  23. #273
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    Hey everyone:

    Just to clarify some of the discussion here:

    There are three things to understand regarding Cane Creek air shocks and available air can / sleeve options:

    Firstly: as Dusty B mentioned, often the visible length of the shaft is longer than the travel of the shock. Also, please remember that the i2i length of Cane Creek shocks typically measures about 1.5 - 2mm (1/16") shorter than the nominal length: this is because the shock is slightly pre-compressed by the internal top out bumper. As an aside, it is also good to remember this when measuring static BB height with a Cane Creek shock as the BB height will typically read a little lower than it actually is due to the pre-compressed nature of the shock.

    Secondly: internal air sleeve discussion. Most modern air shocks have an inner and outer air chamber: the inner chamber contains the piston which works against the air spring. The otter chamber has additional air volume that is used to give the shock a more "linear" spring rate than would be possible with just the internal air volume. Some earlier DB-Airs had a situation where air could not bleed fast enough between the inner and outer chambers, which would result in the shock feeling excessively progressive: i.e. the shock was effectively working with a much smaller air volume under high speed piston movement (i.e. big hits). At Knolly, since we were one of the first OEM customers to receive large quantities of DB-Air shocks, some of the shocks that we shipped had this issue. If you can not get full travel on a DB-Air shock no matter what you do (or have to run ridiculously low pressure to get full travel) then contact Cane Creek for warranty approved internal air sleeve change. This does not affect all earlier DB-airs , so if you're shock seems to be working fine, then you do not need to change the inner air sleeve.

    Thirdly: Cane Creek is working on an even higher volume external air can. The DB-air is already arguably the most linear air shock on the market: this larger air can is in response to some frame designs having less than idea shock progression and hence needing even more linearity. Given the idealized shock progression rate of Knolly frame due to the four by 4 linkage design, our frames do not need this larger air can to function properly.

    I hope that clears up any questions regarding CCDB-Air shocks and setup and / or performance.

    Cheers!
    Noel Buckley
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    www.knollybikes.com

    Instead of PMs, please contact me here.

  24. #274
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    hi there
    now that i got my chili ridden a few times i first felt, wow, great climbing on it. due to bad weather i skipped my local dh and rode it yesterday for the first time. i had the impression that using of travel was good, but it felt quite hard on the rocky section with many stones in it. i almost felt like hopping up and down and that made me feel uncomfortable. i was missing the plushness.
    for the record: i ride it with 30/35% of sag, and used the base-setting on the cc site. furthermore i use the steep setting of the bike.
    i'm thinking of lowering the lsr for more plushness. what do you think?

  25. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfredo View Post
    hi there
    now that i got my chili ridden a few times i first felt, wow, great climbing on it. due to bad weather i skipped my local dh and rode it yesterday for the first time. i had the impression that using of travel was good, but it felt quite hard on the rocky section with many stones in it. i almost felt like hopping up and down and that made me feel uncomfortable. i was missing the plushness.
    for the record: i ride it with 30/35% of sag, and used the base-setting on the cc site. furthermore i use the steep setting of the bike.
    i'm thinking of lowering the lsr for more plushness. what do you think?
    A couple things to try:
    - Check tire pressure. Nothing worse than over pressured new tires. It'll make anything harsh.
    - CCDB's like their sag closer to 35/40%. Try dropping the pressure a hair.
    - Was it harsh when rock crawling or cruising through the rocks. If it was cruising try backing out your High Speed Compression all the way and then add 1/4 click back in. Then go find a 2 to 3' drop to flat and see if the bike bottoms harshly. If it does add in another 1/4 until it's not harsh anymore.
    - You can also back out the Low Speed Compression a couple/few clicks but don't go crazy or your peddling will suffer.

    Hope that helps!

  26. #276
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    thanks woodyak.
    well, i also thought of the tires (indeed they're new) but didn't realise it could have such an impact. i'll have to measure it and see if it's too much.
    it was harsh when i rode the rocky section on the dh. as i said it felt a bit like bumping around and not like the shock giving a smooth feeling.
    i'll give it a try.

  27. #277
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    I must not be normal than everyone else on this topic. For me its 30% sag (anymore and I'm dragging my pedals on the rocks and can't stop bottoming out.) about two turns more of HSC from stock, two clicks less LSC, one click less LSR, and half a turn or more less HSR. So far this feels close to my push tuned fox rc4 I used to ride. I'm still tinkering but we'll see where it ends up. oh, and I only weigh about 150 lbs ride weight.

  28. #278
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    yesterday first i took out pressure out of the tires, but didn't measure it, just by feeling. furthermore i backed out lsc by 2 clicks. then i tried to do a jump into the flat and it felt very good. all in all it was better but not what i expected. still too progressive in my eyes. i'm still trying to find the balance between good climbing (that i already have) and a smooth on dh.
    maybe i'll go for little more sag. maybe i back out lsr as well by 1or 2 clicks.

  29. #279
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    Alfredo, I wasn't initially satisfied either. Once its "right" it's just amazing. Just make minor adjustments as you go. 5 psi is a big difference and one or two clicks of LSC are quite noticeable as well. After you find this sweet spot this shock will flatten the trail and climb anything.

  30. #280
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    now i had the time to measure tire pressure and i´m wondering a bit. i´m running maxxis hi roller and minion and the indication on the tire says 2.4-4.0 bar. actually i´m running with 2.0 as i felt they could be over pressured, but obviously they weren´t.
    not that i feel them now being to soft, but anyways, i will have to dial it out the shock.

  31. #281
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    Chilcotin: The inevitable DB-air setup thread

    depending on your tire, weight, terrain and ride style you could actually try even less than 2.0 bar. maybe try around 1.8 bar next and see how it works for you ... mind you, you could have a flat but that's part of the experiment ;-)

  32. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfredo View Post
    now i had the time to measure tire pressure and i´m wondering a bit. i´m running maxxis hi roller and minion and the indication on the tire says 2.4-4.0 bar. actually i´m running with 2.0 as i felt they could be over pressured, but obviously they weren´t.
    not that i feel them now being to soft, but anyways, i will have to dial it out the shock.
    I was referring to pressure in the shock where 5 psi is significant...Especially when you are close to that sweet spot.

  33. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    I must not be normal than everyone else on this topic. For me its 30% sag (anymore and I'm dragging my pedals on the rocks and can't stop bottoming out.) about two turns more of HSC from stock, two clicks less LSC, one click less LSR, and half a turn or more less HSR. So far this feels close to my push tuned fox rc4 I used to ride. I'm still tinkering but we'll see where it ends up. oh, and I only weigh about 150 lbs ride weight.
    so you've gone frome stock settings? means everything half in/out? right? that means you run hsc fully closed or open?

  34. #284
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    HSC more closed than the 1/4 it came shipped as. Basically I slowed the shock way down in both HSR and LSR and took away some of the LSC to make it a little more plush. It does have a little pedal bob but I don't mind. Its more about the downhill for me.

  35. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    HSC more closed than the 1/4 it came shipped as. Basically I slowed the shock way down in both HSR and LSR and took away some of the LSC to make it a little more plush. It does have a little pedal bob but I don't mind. Its more about the downhill for me.
    If you guys really want to dial this thing in go to Cane Creeks website and use the "Chilcotin Base Tune" and go from there (not the stock settings). I also like it plush and dialed out the LSC a couple clicks and went with more sag (33-35%).

  36. #286
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    Mine came stock with the recommended chilcotin base tune. I think the base tune is very close, I just had problems bottoming out a lot so I had to up the HSC.

  37. #287
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    After this weekends ride here's where I stand
    20mm sag
    150lbs rider weight
    2.5 turns HSC
    13 clicks LSC
    1 turn HSR
    15 clicks LSR

    I'm hoping to get out on a chunky buck prone DH trail with speeds in the 30's this week and tune a little further. I think LSR and LSC are pretty dialed but I'm still messing with the HSR and HSC. It seems to have the HSC feel good on DH I need about 2 maybe 2.5 turns but for drops and any freeride stuff I need about 3 turns. I might just have to adjust based on the terrain. I'm not sure how so many people are have trouble getting full travel. With the base tune I can get full travel off a 2' drop to flat. I'm fairly confident I can get this shock feeling as good or better than my push tuned RC4. So far I'm really enjoying it.

  38. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    Mine came stock with the recommended chilcotin base tune. I think the base tune is very close, I just had problems bottoming out a lot so I had to up the HSC.
    It sounds like you have the same symptoms my brother is having with bottoming out. My brother and I are the same weight, but he is bottoming his out with the same settings that I have. I believe it's because he has the newer DB AIR can with more port holes. My shock feels absolutely incredible and I'm reluctant to change to the new can because of having to possibly put the volume reducers in to prevent bottoming. That seems to negate the advantages of a large volume shock. I believe in this case the best thing to do is exactly what you are doing by adding more HSC. I only have a 1/4 turn of HSC where my brother needs a lot more due to the newer can. He was getting full travel on small hits as well. I've been extremely happy using the base tune and working slightly from there. My brother hasn't had many rides to date but is likely going to be using different settings even though we are identical weight. Riding style also plays a role.

  39. #289
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    Interesting facts about the different aged shocks and the air volume. I didn't know anything had changed.

  40. #290
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    i'm starting to get it dialed now. still not 100% but way better than in the beginning. but what i found out is that the hs knobs both have more than 25 clicks. i counted 28-30.... anyone experiencing the same?
    anyway, i now have the following
    hsc 0.25
    lsc 14
    hsr 1.5
    lsr 15
    sag 21mm
    rider weight 180lbs

  41. #291
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    So out of curiosity (and lack of time to get out and tune the shock)....

    From the standard settings what changes would you guys recommend trying to get my bike a more lively feeling. I like to pop of every little bump and such and feel the base settings are lacking a bit in this department. I don't mind losing a bit of small bump for a more poppy ride.

  42. #292
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    From stock I'd add a bunch of LSC in. Maybe 4 or 5 clicks. You could also speed up the rebound by a click or so to give it a more lively feeling. If that fails you may need a little more air pressure. I'd crank down the LSC 1st though before you start getting crazy with it.

  43. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    It sounds like you have the same symptoms my brother is having with bottoming out. My brother and I are the same weight, but he is bottoming his out with the same settings that I have. I believe it's because he has the newer DB AIR can with more port holes. My shock feels absolutely incredible and I'm reluctant to change to the new can because of having to possibly put the volume reducers in to prevent bottoming. That seems to negate the advantages of a large volume shock. I believe in this case the best thing to do is exactly what you are doing by adding more HSC. I only have a 1/4 turn of HSC where my brother needs a lot more due to the newer can. He was getting full travel on small hits as well. I've been extremely happy using the base tune and working slightly from there. My brother hasn't had many rides to date but is likely going to be using different settings even though we are identical weight. Riding style also plays a role.

    Hey Guys!

    I know I sound like a broken record here, but there are TWO different topics here:
    1) Air flow between inner and outer air chambers: old shocks may have had issues with this; new shocks shouldn't.
    2) Large volume external chamber: this is a sidegrade, not upgrade and useful for certain frame designs. It is not required for Knolly products (though shoudln't be detrimental either).

    If there is an issue with #1, you'll notice because you're not getting full travel on the shock: you will be missing about the last 8 - 10 mm of travel. You should have the shock serviced by an authorized Cane Creek service centre.

    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!
    2) Tune HSC as required to allow you to use all the travel, but not have frequent bottom out issues.

    Cheers!
    Noel Buckley
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    www.knollybikes.com

    Instead of PMs, please contact me here.

  44. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by knollybikes.com View Post
    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!

    Cheers!
    Something to add: before adjusting sag, put 50 to 75 psi in the shock and slowly cycle the shock through all it's movement. This is necessary to charge the negative air chamber and often is overlooked. (See "To Measure/Set Sag" on page 15--PDF page 16. http://canecreek.com/resources/produ...ers_manual.pdf)
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  45. #295
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    Just wondering...if a DB Coil weighed the same or less than a DB Air, would anyone still pick the air over the coil based on performance characteristics alone?

    I may need to decide between the two shortly, and since I don't care about weight, I'm wondering which simply works better overall.

  46. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by knollybikes.com View Post
    Hey Guys!

    I know I sound like a broken record here, but there are TWO different topics here:
    1) Air flow between inner and outer air chambers: old shocks may have had issues with this; new shocks shouldn't.
    2) Large volume external chamber: this is a sidegrade, not upgrade and useful for certain frame designs. It is not required for Knolly products (though shoudln't be detrimental either).

    If there is an issue with #1, you'll notice because you're not getting full travel on the shock: you will be missing about the last 8 - 10 mm of travel. You should have the shock serviced by an authorized Cane Creek service centre.

    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!
    2) Tune HSC as required to allow you to use all the travel, but not have frequent bottom out issues.

    Cheers!
    Hi Noel,

    Loving your bikes! Just a few things that I'm confused/wondering about...I've got the Podium with DB Coil and Chilcotin with DB Air. My brother also has the DB Air on his Chilcotin. I feel like my Chilcotin with the older air can couldn't be set up any better. It climbs incredible and handles massive drops while being perfectly plush and composed. My brother (same weight) who has the newer air can is bottoming. I know how to dial these things in by charging the negative air chamber and starting with sag (air pressure), and at this point have a really good understanding of making the appropriate adjustments. What I'm curious about is whether the newer can may not be just a "side grade" but a "down grade" for some riders. This is my thought (hopefully I'm wrong). With the same settings that I have my brother is bottoming his out. Dialing in HSC still yields bottom out in which case (I believe) you would need to add volume reducers, but doesn't that defeat the advantages of having a "LARGE volume" shock?

    Thanks!

    Mike
    Last edited by mayha; 05-08-2013 at 07:16 AM.

  47. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    Hi Noel,

    Loving your bikes! Just a few things that I'm confused/wondering about...I've got the Podium with DB Coil and Chilcotin with DB Air. My brother also has the DB Air on his Chilcotin. I feel like my Chilcotin with the older air can couldn't be set up any better. It climbs incredible and handles massive drops with plushness and composure. My brother (same weight) who has the newer air can is bottoming. I know how to dial these things in by charging the negative air chamber and starting with sag (air pressure), and at this point have a really good understanding of making the appropriate adjustments. What I'm curious about is whether the newer can may not be just a "side grade" but a "down grade" for some riders. This is my thought (hopefully I'm wrong). With the same settings as me my brother is bottoming his out. Dialing in HSC still yields bottom out in which case (I believe), you would need to add volume reducers, but doesn't that defeat the advantages of having a "LARGE volume" shock?

    Thanks!

    Mike
    Sorry for butting in, but the upgrade is high flow not volume. High volume is also available as a pay extra. What has your brother got?

  48. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by loamranger View Post
    Sorry for butting in, but the upgrade is high flow not volume. High volume is also available as a pay extra. What has your brother got?
    I realize that it's high flow and not higher volume...What I was referring to was using the "volume reducers" to eliminate bottom out.

  49. #299
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    To me coil works much much better. I've had the air for about 8 months. And just recently the coil. Coil is much plusher and provides better traction in my experience.

  50. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    I realize that it's high flow and not higher volume...What I was referring to was using the "volume reducers" to eliminate bottom out.
    Sorry, mis-read your post.

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