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  1. #201
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    So what's sitting right against the eyelet DU bushing, the rubber washer, or a super thin alum spacer?
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  2. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    So what's sitting right against the eyelet DU bushing, the rubber washer, or a super thin alum spacer?
    Rubber washer, just like the original hardware. So far, it is staying in place and everything is tight.
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  3. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodyak View Post
    HSR - 3 clicks slower from recommended
    Thanks for the info. Two quick questions:

    1) By "3 clicks" do you mean 1/2 a turn?

    2) Am I right to assume that you added to the HSR setting? (0 turns of HSR is "Lively Pop" and 4 turns is "G-out Control" according to the CC website.)
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Thanks for the info. Two quick questions:

    1) By "3 clicks" do you mean 1/2 a turn?

    2) Am I right to assume that you added to the HSR setting? (0 turns of HSR is "Lively Pop" and 4 turns is "G-out Control" according to the CC website.)
    1) Yes
    2) Yes, I turned it clockwise i.e. added more dampening i.e. made it slower

  5. #205
    TSC
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    Got it! Thanks!!!

    Guess who's been avoiding work today?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Chilcotin: The inevitable DB-air setup thread-woodyak-settings-small.jpg  

    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  6. #206
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    I just noticed on the Cane Creek website, that the setting have changed from they were last time I checked, and where this thread started off. Before LSC was at 10, and LSR was at 13. What changed?


  7. #207
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    So I see the base tune charts at Cane Creek the 2013 Chilli has a recommendation of 17 clicks of LSR compared to the 2012 model 12 clicks.
    What gives ? Have I missed a newly designed Chilli coming out?

  8. #208
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    It might not be the frame but a revised shock.

    Just a thought.

  9. #209
    TSC
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodyak View Post
    No problem. I actually enjoy suspension tuning. That's why the CCDB is THEE shock for me.

    I don't actually know the numbers as I go by feel. If I were to guess I'd say:

    Sag - 37%
    LSC - 4 clicks less from recommended
    HSC - 1/2 to 1/4 turn from fully off
    LSR - 1 click slower from recommended
    HSR - 3 clicks slower from recommended
    Update: I've mostly been boon-docking at low speeds (through downed trees on deer trails) so I haven't had many runs on high-speed bumps, but the few I've had, have been great with your settings. The back of my bike just disappears. The only way I know it's rough is because I can't get my fork dialed in as well.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  10. #210
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    For those that care there is a new high-volume inner air sleeve available for the CCDB Air that will aid in tuning and getting full use of travel on progressive suspension platforms. This should allow riders to run less sag and give more tuning options... here's some more information from NSMB:

    CaneCreek Double Barrel Air Owners! - North Shore Mountain Biking Forums

  11. #211
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    very interested to hear some real-world experiences with that update.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

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  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by gretch View Post
    For those that care there is a new high-volume inner air sleeve available for the CCDB Air that will aid in tuning and getting full use of travel on progressive suspension platforms. This should allow riders to run less sag and give more tuning options... here's some more information from NSMB:

    CaneCreek Double Barrel Air Owners! - North Shore Mountain Biking Forums
    does the Chili need this? Seems like it will be better suited for the Mojo HDs and the likes? Any thoughts? If someone tries it on Chili, let us know. I wouldn't mind using less sag and getting as much shock travel on my chili.

  13. #213
    fat & decripit old guy
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    I take my shock in on the 10th to get the new air can
    Right now with 30% sag I have a 5" travel Chilcotin.
    Hope that this will make a big improvement in the usable travel.
    I now will have to go through the whole tuning process again; I assume.

  14. #214
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    Any word on cost ? Just spent a few days in Moab and Grand Junction and needed 40% sag to get full travel on TWE.

  15. #215
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    would be interested in hearing real-world experiences as well. I wonder if it could potentially make the shock "wallow"? I like the way the shock feels now and wouldn't mind getting more travel but not at the expense of how great the mid-stroke support is.

  16. #216
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    I´ll suppose this new inner sleeve is solution for those riders not managed to use full stroke with any usable airpressure / sag. Those channels allowing airflow between sleeves, has been rather small in original version and if not prefectly aligned, too tight - causing shock uncapable to use full air volume. Based on pics taken from new version, channels are clearly larger.

    I´m curious too to read further experiences, not going to test that myself - there`s no such problem with my shock.

  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    Got it! Thanks!!!

    Guess who's been avoiding work today?
    That's awesome thanks for that. I'm gonna give that a try. I got mine on the stock settings as seen in the picture. Feels good but i think it can be a bit better.

    Question:
    - whilst pedalling slowly seated or climbing, as i hit a square edge it doesn't roll over smoothly but rather gets slightly hooked up on it making me use alittle more pedalling force to overcome this. How do i adjust it so that i can roll over this more smoothly?

    My friends got the ccdb coil and when i ride his one it just rolls over these square edges really easily.

  18. #218
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    hey i just want to be sure. What do you guys in mm measure the shock stroke to be for the chilli?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Chilcotin: The inevitable DB-air setup thread-screen-shot-2012-10-03-9.16.25-pm.jpg  


  19. #219
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    New air can cost = $00.00

    shock stroke x .3 = 30% sag
    .25 = 25% sag

    For me 57 x .3 = 17mm on the shock (like you can measure the .1 on the bike) for those who will be anal.

  20. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    That's awesome thanks for that. I'm gonna give that a try. I got mine on the stock settings as seen in the picture. Feels good but i think it can be a bit better.

    Question:
    - whilst pedalling slowly seated or climbing, as i hit a square edge it doesn't roll over smoothly but rather gets slightly hooked up on it making me use alittle more pedalling force to overcome this. How do i adjust it so that i can roll over this more smoothly?

    My friends got the ccdb coil and when i ride his one it just rolls over these square edges really easily.
    I had the same problem and solved it by adding LSC.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

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  21. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    That's awesome thanks for that. I'm gonna give that a try. I got mine on the stock settings as seen in the picture. Feels good but i think it can be a bit better.

    Question:
    - whilst pedalling slowly seated or climbing, as i hit a square edge it doesn't roll over smoothly but rather gets slightly hooked up on it making me use alittle more pedalling force to overcome this. How do i adjust it so that i can roll over this more smoothly?

    My friends got the ccdb coil and when i ride his one it just rolls over these square edges really easily.
    Try slowing down your HSR. I've found that sharp hits like that are generally a high-speed event. Slowing down the HSR should help absorb those hits better.

    If you are pedalling REALY slowly and you run into that I'd say your running too little sag or too much LSC

  22. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    That's awesome thanks for that. I'm gonna give that a try. I got mine on the stock settings as seen in the picture. Feels good but i think it can be a bit better.

    Question:
    - whilst pedalling slowly seated or climbing, as i hit a square edge it doesn't roll over smoothly but rather gets slightly hooked up on it making me use alittle more pedalling force to overcome this. How do i adjust it so that i can roll over this more smoothly?

    My friends got the ccdb coil and when i ride his one it just rolls over these square edges really easily.
    I think you're going to have a hard time getting any air shock to behave as well as a coil-over shock. (If you notice, the highest praise for an air shock is that it behaves like a coil shock.) In essence, coil-over shocks have an additional tuning feature (the coil). Air shocks are a trade-off--you give up the extra "tunability" for weight savings.

    IMO, even square edges at low speed are going to be managed more by the LSC circuit on the DBair. As noted by CC in their graph, there is a tradeoff between pedaling efficiency and supple response. I rode the Wasatch Crest Trail the other day and while ascending "Puke Hill" I noticed much more bob in the back shock so you might not want to back off the LSC all the way to 11. And, I've wondered (i.e. haven't played with it yet) if adjusting HSC all the way to .25 is too far. (In a post somewhere, someone had the HSC all the way to 0 and Noel had said that wasn't good.)

    Keep in mind, the post of mine you referenced is a set up that is much more for down hill, which I ride most of the time. It works quite well on the downs, but you sacrifice on the ups.

    Hope this helps!

    Chime in anyone if I'm overstating/oversimplifying or you disagree.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  23. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by material guy View Post
    New air can cost = $00.00
    Where do we sign up?
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  24. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    hey i just want to be sure. What do you guys in mm measure the shock stroke to be for the chilli?
    1) I measured the overall length of the shaft when unweighted. Call it Unweighted_Shaft_Length.
    2) I figured the amount the shaft will shrink when my sag is correct by multiplying 57 (the shaft stroke length) by the desired sag. Call it Desired_Sag_Length.
    3) I then subtract Desired_Sag_Length (#2) from Unweighted_Shaft_Length (#1) and got the amount of shaft that will be exposed when setting the sag. Call it Visible_Shaft_With_Sag.
    4) I then made a little plastic piece that is that is Visible_Shaft_With_Sag (#3) long and just use it to check of set my sag.

    This method works well if I want to verify my settings before a ride or if I wan to set my bike up for someone else to ride.

    Visible_Shaft_With_Sag = Unweighted_Shaft_Length - Desired_Sag_Length
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  25. #225
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    in other words 30% = 17mm, 33% = 19mm and 37% = 21mm measured lengths including seals.

  26. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    I think you're going to have a hard time getting any air shock to behave as well as a coil-over shock. (If you notice, the highest praise for an air shock is that it behaves like a coil shock.) In essence, coil-over shocks have an additional tuning feature (the coil). Air shocks are a trade-off--you give up the extra "tunability" for weight savings.

    IMO, even square edges at low speed are going to be managed more by the LSC circuit on the DBair. As noted by CC in their graph, there is a tradeoff between pedaling efficiency and supple response. I rode the Wasatch Crest Trail the other day and while ascending "Puke Hill" I noticed much more bob in the back shock so you might not want to back off the LSC all the way to 11. And, I've wondered (i.e. haven't played with it yet) if adjusting HSC all the way to .25 is too far. (In a post somewhere, someone had the HSC all the way to 0 and Noel had said that wasn't good.)

    Keep in mind, the post of mine you referenced is a set up that is much more for down hill, which I ride most of the time. It works quite well on the downs, but you sacrifice on the ups.

    Hope this helps!

    Chime in anyone if I'm overstating/oversimplifying or you disagree.
    TSC...I had a feeling you were going to come back with a "sacrifice on the uphills" after tuning your shock to Woodyaks settings. I'm in the same boat, however, as I like to make the suspension extremely plush and live for the downhills. I definitely climb well on this set up, but I have to work harder at it to have the exceptional ride down. Part of me thinks I would have been better off with a coil..."F" the weight.

  27. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by knollybikes.com View Post

    So, the first question is (before even considering tuning this shock): "Is this the right product for me?"

    This question is a difficult one and it's also why the CCDB-Air is not the only shock that we sell with the Chilcotin frame.

    This is why we offer 3 shock options for the Chilcotin: the RP23 (HV can), the CCDB-Air and the CCDB-Coil. The fact is that for a large percentage of our customers, the RP23 will be the best shock choice: it's lightweight, reliable, works really well in almost situations, can be ridden surprisingly aggressively and is very easy to setup.
    Although my ego tells me I can tune and use a CCDB Air to its full potential I suspect I'm probably a RP23 guy who wouldn't notice a real difference.

    Good points!...
    Safe riding,

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  28. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    Part of me thinks I would have been better off with a coil..."F" the weight.
    I used to be "air all the way" but I've started re-evaluating the tradeoffs, in the same way I did when I bought my KS Lev--sure it's heavier but it is worth it to me. Since, like you, I love the DH I'm willing to have a bit more pain on the ups to have a bigger smile during the DH. Besides, I rarely "earn" all the elevation I burn (read: I shuttle a lot ).

    Probably, the clincher was when I saw muttonchops and tisser, who are heavy into the ups, go coil for the added ride benefits. Friday, I got a Van RC off of ebay and will have Craig at Avalanche do his magic. I think it is the only way to get the best of all worlds, excluding weight of course.

    I will hold onto my DBair for until next year as a backup; but, from what rsceciel007 has told me, I won't want to switch back.
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  29. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by TSC View Post
    1) I measured the overall length of the shaft when unweighted. Call it Unweighted_Shaft_Length.
    2) I figured the amount the shaft will shrink when my sag is correct by multiplying 57 (the shaft stroke length) by the desired sag. Call it Desired_Sag_Length.
    3) I then subtract Desired_Sag_Length (#2) from Unweighted_Shaft_Length (#1) and got the amount of shaft that will be exposed when setting the sag. Call it Visible_Shaft_With_Sag.
    4) I then made a little plastic piece that is that is Visible_Shaft_With_Sag (#3) long and just use it to check of set my sag.

    This method works well if I want to verify my settings before a ride or if I wan to set my bike up for someone else to ride.

    Visible_Shaft_With_Sag = Unweighted_Shaft_Length - Desired_Sag_Length
    nice good idea i might make my own little measuring device. I've been just eyeballing it

  30. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    I had the same problem and solved it by adding LSC.
    I find that the pedalling uphill platform for chilli with ccdb air is superb. Does not bob, very efficient, very happy.

    I will add more LSC and see if i get the same result as you. That of not hooking up on square edges while climbing.

    Was wondering though what's the reasoning behind it? Thought that if i backed off the LSC it'd be more plush? I'll tinker with it and report back, thanks.

  31. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by tom34 View Post
    I find that the pedalling uphill platform for chilli with ccdb air is superb. Does not bob, very efficient, very happy.

    I will add more LSC and see if i get the same result as you. That of not hooking up on square edges while climbing.

    Was wondering though what's the reasoning behind it? Thought that if i backed off the LSC it'd be more plush? I'll tinker with it and report back, thanks.
    mine bobs uphill.
    what is your RTR weight and how much psi did u have and what is your LSC setting ?

    i am 186 lbs RTR. i have 150 psi. i followed the base tunes and have 15 clicks of LSC

  32. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lastug View Post
    mine bobs uphill.
    what is your RTR weight and how much psi did u have and what is your LSC setting ?

    i am 186 lbs RTR. i have 150 psi. i followed the base tunes and have 15 clicks of LSC
    What's your definition of bob? Are you comparing against a hard-tail or against another full-suspension setup?

    My RTR weight is 210 lbs. With 145 psi (about 33% sag) and the stock tune (i.e. 15 clicks of LSC) I found bobbing to be minimal--similar to what I've gotten with pro-pedal on a dw-link bike. I was incredibly shocked that it was such a solid platform.

    EDIT
    A couple of things worth mentioning:

    -- I do most of my climbing while seated and use a low gear and "spin". (That's the reference for the statement above.)
    -- When I do get out of the saddle I am trying to clear obstacles and like to be able to load/unload the back end, so what you are experiencing might be what I consider as favorable.
    -- Your sock psi seems rather high. Noel wrote the following:

    Personally, I'm about 215 nekkid and I was initially using around 145 - 155 psi and ended up around the latter. At about 180 lbs body weight, you will probably be in the 135 psi range.
    Last edited by TSC; 10-03-2012 at 05:17 PM.
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  33. #233
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    Originally Posted by material guy
    New air can cost = $00.00
    Where do we sign up?
    __________________
    I have ADHD and OCD which makes me obsessively fixated on the things I like, while ignoring everything else.

    Go to the link at post # 214.

  34. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by material guy View Post
    Originally Posted by material guy
    New air can cost = $00.00
    Where do we sign up?
    __________________
    I have ADHD and OCD which makes me obsessively fixated on the things I like, while ignoring everything else.

    Go to the link at post # 214.
    Cane Creek is supplying the parts for the upgrade for free. My shock was due for a service anyway so I sent it to SuspensionWerx in Vancouver. I think if you call CC they will hook you up with the parts.

  35. #235
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    Thanks!
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  36. #236
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    I just spoke with Cane Creek and they said that they can send the new air canister to any service center for no charge for parts (there might be a service charge). On the East Coast of the USA they work at least with Suspension Experts.

  37. #237
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    thanks.

  38. #238
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    High flow air can

    Went for my first ride with the new high flow air can.
    30% sag, this is not the same shock!
    As I figured the old settings were not close,
    Old: hsc 0.5, hsr 1.0, lsc 5 clicks for dwn & 7 clicks for up, lsr 8 clicks.
    New: hsc 1.0, hsr 1.5, lsc 12 clicks, lsr 10 clicks.

    How smooth the shock was blew me away! I even had to do a miner tune to my lyrik so it would come close to feeling balanced. I was worried that it would have the mid travel wallow but the shock would have none of that.

    It was a very wet ride ( my first wet of the year ) so I did not push things too much but my first impression was nothing but stellar performance from this thing.

    Now very glad that I kept this shock; I almost gave it back to Noel cause I was not happy with how it was working. I could only get 5" travel on a 6.3" travel bike. I would also get some spiking out of the back end which is now non existent.
    Almost used all of the travel to boot.

    Pic after my ride today. Could not get the lens free of water, so blurry pic.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Chilcotin: The inevitable DB-air setup thread-knolly.jpg  

    Last edited by material guy; 10-22-2012 at 06:20 PM.

  39. #239
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    Wink DB Air vs. erection

    From pinkbike's Cane Creek - Ask Us Anything live question-and-answer session.

    Answer by Holly Colson - Dir of marketing

    Q: Why is the DBAir the best shock ever, and what seat can you potentially recommend to coincide with the constant erection I get from using this awesome shock?

    A: I actually have a canned response for this, we get it so often.....we recommend the Hobson Easy Seat.
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  40. #240
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    I should be getting my CCDB Air back from Dirt Labs today outfitted with the new air can. From the review above I am excited!!! I will post back with a review after some riding this weekend.

    About that seat, that would kind of make it hard to get forward on the nose for steep climbing sections.

  41. #241
    fat & decripit old guy
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    Climb? steep?

    Oh you mean go down steep

  42. #242
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    Marerial guy , your new settings are are very much the same as mine, but my shock is in standard
    setting from factory, never had any issues, it's worked flawless from day one.
    Just curious if the problems people are having with this shock is due to lighter body weights?

  43. #243
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    What is the new air can? Can somebody explain please.

  44. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by material guy View Post
    Went for my first ride with the new high flow air can.
    30% sag, this is not the same shock!
    As I figured the old settings were not close,
    Old: hsc 0.5, hsr 1.0, lsc 5 clicks for dwn & 7 clicks for up, lsr 8 clicks.
    New: hsc 1.0, hsr 1.5, lsc 10 clicks, lsr 12 clicks.

    How smooth the shock was blew me away! I even had to do a miner tune to my lyrik so it would come close to feeling balanced. I was worried that it would have the mid travel wallow but the shock would have none of that.

    It was a very wet ride ( my first wet of the year ) so I did not push things too much but my first impression was nothing but stellar performance from this thing.

    Now very glad that I kept this shock; I almost gave it back to Noel cause I was not happy with how it was working. I could only get 5" travel on a 6.3" travel bike. I would also get some spiking out of the back end which is now non existent.
    Almost used all of the travel to boot.

    Pic after my ride today. Could not get the lens free of water, so blurry pic.
    I’m glad to here the new can fixes the problems with the shock.
    The spiking toward the end of the travel was starting to drive me nuts.

    Thanks for posting this I was getting ready to order a new shock from Avalanche. Now I can spend the money on my fork.

  45. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo025 View Post
    Marerial guy , your new settings are are very much the same as mine, but my shock is in standard
    setting from factory, never had any issues, it's worked flawless from day one.
    Just curious if the problems people are having with this shock is due to lighter body weights?
    Just for reference, I'm 5'8, well almost, and my slim, fragile.......Mmmmmmm...(sorry got distracted rubbing my belly after shoveling the boston cream down my throat.) princess like figure is 190 to 195 rtr.

    As I under stand, not all of the DBair's had the air flow problem between the two chambers.
    Mine just happened to be one of the few that this was an issue with.

  46. #246
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    Back reading in this forum, I understand that some users backed out the LS knobs too far & had to send the shock in for early service.
    My solution for this is to use a small cheap socket to turn the knob with my fingers. You can feel the indents easier as well as feel the end stops. Always keep it in my pocket.
    Just a simple tip.

  47. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by loamranger View Post
    What is the new air can? Can somebody explain please.
    There is a new inner air can for the DB-air that solves the lack of travel issue and spiking that some people were having.

    The high volume inner air can will allow bikes that are more progressive to get full travel / be ridden with less sag and still get full travel.

    The high volume inner air cab will allow increased tune-ability on bikes that are less progressive, where now the CCDB Air is generally being run without tuning bands.
    You can see it here.

    CaneCreek Double Barrel Air Owners! - North Shore Mountain Biking Forums

  48. #248
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    mbikerguy, thanks. I'll contact the UK service center and see what arrangements they have for doing this modification.

  49. #249
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    I got my DBAir back from Dirt Labs with the new air can and a full service, took the bike out for a ride and it felt ... exactly the same. Moreover, I am still not able to use the full travel. I had Dirt Labs configure the DB Air to the recommended setting for the Chilcotin (figured that was a good starting point) and am running 140psi for the air spring. I am 185 (in my birthday suit) and this yields about a 30% sag. It feels wonderful on the trail, but its only using 2/3 of the stroke on the shock.

    For the test ride, I went into AF Canyon (Wasatch, UT) and rode it 19 miles with 4600' of elevation change. There was plenty of really fast DH to test out the shock. Most of it is very fast with small roots, rocks and drops (small ones about 1-2 feet). There was some larger rocks on part of the trail which I used all of my front travel on. Granted I tend to hit these harder with the front end but I thought I would use more travel with the reworked air can.

    How big of a hit do you need to go off of to get to use all of the travel? Do I just need to take it somewhere bigger (Moab ) to test this or is there something still wrong with my shock?

    Also, I was running 140psi before the rework and was king of expecting to have to change it afterwards. I think it is right as the sag check out, it climbs wonderfully (no wallow), and claws it way over any tech it sees effortlessly. At this point I'm not sure what else to do...

  50. #250
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    Hey Elias, I was getting ready to send mine back to get the new can but after reading your report I'm second guessing if it's worth having the bike down.

  51. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    I got my DBAir back from Dirt Labs with the new air can and a full service, took the bike out for a ride and it felt ... exactly the same. Moreover, I am still not able to use the full travel. I had Dirt Labs configure the DB Air to the recommended setting for the Chilcotin (figured that was a good starting point) and am running 140psi for the air spring. I am 185 (in my birthday suit) and this yields about a 30% sag. It feels wonderful on the trail, but its only using 2/3 of the stroke on the shock.

    For the test ride, I went into AF Canyon (Wasatch, UT) and rode it 19 miles with 4600' of elevation change. There was plenty of really fast DH to test out the shock. Most of it is very fast with small roots, rocks and drops (small ones about 1-2 feet). There was some larger rocks on part of the trail which I used all of my front travel on. Granted I tend to hit these harder with the front end but I thought I would use more travel with the reworked air can.

    How big of a hit do you need to go off of to get to use all of the travel? Do I just need to take it somewhere bigger (Moab ) to test this or is there something still wrong with my shock?

    Also, I was running 140psi before the rework and was king of expecting to have to change it afterwards. I think it is right as the sag check out, it climbs wonderfully (no wallow), and claws it way over any tech it sees effortlessly. At this point I'm not sure what else to do...
    Same experience during my test ride, peeled a tire off the rim, still not full travel. What else to do? Get the DB coil.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  52. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock dude View Post
    Hey Elias, I was getting ready to send mine back to get the new can but after reading your report I'm second guessing if it's worth having the bike down.
    Hey. Just because it has not yet fixed my problem, some people are reporting that it did fix the problem. In any respect, Dirt Labs in Colorado will do a 1 day turn on the shock for you. I would send it in to them and have the air can changed out. If you call Cane Creek they are going to tell you that you need to do that first anyways. Plus, I believe you have enough hours on that guy to warrant a service anyways...

    Here is how Dirt Labs configured my shock:

    Low Speed Compression: 14 clicks from - (out of 25)
    High Speed Compression: 1 full turn from - (out of 4)
    Low Speed Rebound: 12 clicks from - (out of 25)
    High Speed Rebound: 2 full turns from - (out of 4)

    I am going to try turning down the HSC to 3/4 and then 1/2 and see if it helps.

  53. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    I got my DBAir back from Dirt Labs with the new air can and a full service, took the bike out for a ride and it felt ... exactly the same. Moreover, I am still not able to use the full travel. I had Dirt Labs configure the DB Air to the recommended setting for the Chilcotin (figured that was a good starting point) and am running 140psi for the air spring. I am 185 (in my birthday suit) and this yields about a 30% sag. It feels wonderful on the trail, but its only using 2/3 of the stroke on the shock.

    For the test ride, I went into AF Canyon (Wasatch, UT) and rode it 19 miles with 4600' of elevation change. There was plenty of really fast DH to test out the shock. Most of it is very fast with small roots, rocks and drops (small ones about 1-2 feet). There was some larger rocks on part of the trail which I used all of my front travel on. Granted I tend to hit these harder with the front end but I thought I would use more travel with the reworked air can.

    How big of a hit do you need to go off of to get to use all of the travel? Do I just need to take it somewhere bigger (Moab ) to test this or is there something still wrong with my shock?

    Also, I was running 140psi before the rework and was king of expecting to have to change it afterwards. I think it is right as the sag check out, it climbs wonderfully (no wallow), and claws it way over any tech it sees effortlessly. At this point I'm not sure what else to do...

    Sorry to hear this, but I had a horrible experience with Dirt Lab. I don't think they know what they are doing. Before heading to Whistler, I am out of town with work so an ideal opportunity to get my Marz 66 serviced. There was nothing wrong with it, but since I was out of town - let's gets some new oil and seals before the big trip. I return and the fork feels like crap and is noisy. They removed the plastic spring cover - why? I have no clue. Fork was not moving smoothly through its travel - it was horrible. I sent it back paid for overnight shipping. It came back feeling like crap again. Now I was stuck with it for my trip. When I returned, I sent to Marzocchi who fixed the fork caused by Dirt Labs. I do not trust them at all!

  54. #254
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    damn, not what I was hoping for. I will still send mine in for service, the bushing is already worn and I have some seepage from the shrader valve.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  55. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    damn, not what I was hoping for. I will still send mine in for service, the bushing is already worn and I have some seepage from the shrader valve.
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike!

    Dude, sorry to hear about your lousy experience with Dirt Labs. While the DBAir is still not using all of its travel it is working very smoothly in all other aspects. They even swapped out the bushings for me as well. There are other labs as well...

  56. #256
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    I am so surprised that things are not working out after the new air can was installed for others.
    As I mentioned, in my first ride and several rides after that, my shock was not the same.
    Used all the travel on a 5' to flat, but use about 7/8ths travel on regular rides.
    No spiking, smooth as silk in all the motion in the travel range. On one drop on Cypress I thought that I was going to eat sh*t due to the crappy, rocky landing but the bike took the landing with out so much as a hick up.
    I would have thought the same for all of the shocks to have this mod?????

    I'm stoked with mine wish you were too.

    P.S. I did not use there settings, there's sucked.
    Last edited by material guy; 10-26-2012 at 11:06 AM.

  57. #257
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    ^^^ I'm glad to hear that you like yours because I went ahead and sent mine to GarageWorks today.
    I hope I have the same results.

  58. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike! ..
    Don´t know are there others too, but I´m using needle bearings already in the other (top) end of my DB Air - drilled eye up to 15mm`s, so using standard DU-bushings is also possible now. Bearing is RWS/ Enduro kit. Another eye is still original-sized.

  59. #259
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    Ok guys, sorry for the delay in testing but I finally got back on the bike. Leaving the shock setup as I had previously (straight from Dirt Labs, new air can, 140psi, etc.) I backed off the HSC by 1/2 turn (now total is 1/2 turn) and the result was pretty amazing. I was able to use almost all of the travel and it still felt really good. The trail I was on only had 3 foot-ish drops so I am pretty sure that when I take it to bigger terrain it will use the little bit of travel still remaining. I went ahead and continued to tune by backing off the LSC by 3 clicks and I am very happy with the results. Climbs great, no noticeable bob, really smooth ride (LSC wise) and its handling the big-hits great. Again, sorry for the review I posted before I perhaps had tested it enough. At least for now, I am calling it working!!!

  60. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adaptive View Post
    It sounds like you should send it in... I am on my 3rd pair of bushings. I cant wait until the needle bearings are ready for this bike!

    Dude, sorry to hear about your lousy experience with Dirt Labs. While the DBAir is still not using all of its travel it is working very smoothly in all other aspects. They even swapped out the bushings for me as well. There are other labs as well...
    I had my bike shop send my shock into BTI (local CC service center.) I just talked to them and they said the shock was blown. Something about oil leaking into the wrong chambers and seeping out of the shraeder valve. Cane Creek is going to replace the shock under warranty and the new(er) shocks already have the sleeve installed. Looking forward to seeing what this shock feels like when it’s working
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  61. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    I had my bike shop send my shock into BTI (local CC service center.) I just talked to them and they said the shock was blown. Something about oil leaking into the wrong chambers and seeping out of the shraeder valve. Cane Creek is going to replace the shock under warranty and the new(er) shocks already have the sleeve installed. Looking forward to seeing what this shock feels like when it’s working
    So I fitted the shock to my bike Friday and went about the adjustment process. I started with the settings defined in the DB air Lounge. Bouncing around the neighborhood I was very surprised. The shock felt super plush and I was getting more travel than the previous shock ever got. Although I can't say that I noticed the sleeve upgrade exclusively, I cant say for sure that my previous shock was blown. Hopefully I will be able to get some solid ride time on the shock in the coming week and get it tuned.

    I went for a ride yesterday and the shock felt awesome. The trail conditions kept me too busy to really think about the shock. But I did not notice anything annoying so something must be right

    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  62. #262
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    Just got my new cc dbair and despite reading this, I backed out the screw too far and now don't have any audible clicks. Got it back in with a screwdriver but was really surprised this happened. I am always gentle with my gear but I think th problem stems from CC having the settings referenced from all the way open..... This makes no sense to me. Unless other people are having different experiences with their shock I never encountered a limit when opening my lsc screw for example. It just kept spinning on and on... Are others feeling a positive end to backing out the low speed screws? I'm assuming yes
    Last edited by Dpca10; 12-12-2012 at 08:36 PM.

  63. #263
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    Found this in another thread, could solve some problems:

    Huber Bushings - High Precision Shock Bushings
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  64. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dpca10 View Post
    Just got my new cc dbair and despite reading this, I backed out the screw too far and now don't have any audible clicks. Got it back in with a screwdriver but was really surprised this happened. I am always gentle with my gear but I think th problem stems from CC having the settings referenced from all the way open..... This makes no sense to me. Unless other people are having different experiences with their shock I never encountered a limit when opening my lsc screw for example. It just kept spinning on and on... Are others feeling a positive end to backing out the low speed screws? I'm assuming yes
    I have 5 CCDB's between my wife and I on various bikes. On all of them, the low speed screws have a hard stop at full open. However I do have a riding buddy who's CCDB air does the same thing as yours on one of his low speed adjusters. He contacted Cane Creek on it and they said it shouldn't have any impact, and if he wanted to send it in he could. He decided not to and the shock has been fine, other than needing to know it has this behavior when turning the low speed screw full open.

  65. #265
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    Yeah I called CC and they said this can happen but unless oil and air are leaking out it shouldn't be a problem. I used the screwdriver trick to reset it. In any event the shock rides amazing. For a while I thought it felt stiff and wasn't plush until I realized that I wasn't feeling the chatter at all. Feel it really improved my traction on the turns

  66. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calhoun View Post
    Found this in another thread, could solve some problems:

    Huber Bushings - High Precision Shock Bushings
    The translation on the page is BRUTAL

    "The shock bushings are used to fix the shock absorber in the frame. Over the plain the pivoting movements of the damper can be added during compression and out. This should be durable and shock eye camp at the same time easily."

    If it helps eliminate the silly plastic spacer that I keep destroying I may be willing to try

  67. #267
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    yeah, its a tough read, but damn they look seksy.
    "Mi amor Nuevo Miércoles!"

    -cabra cadabra

  68. #268
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    The translation on the page is BRUTAL
    Yes, thats true.
    It´s an automatic translator.
    This is going to be improved.

    If you have questions I will try to answer more understandable.

    Stephan

  69. #269
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    Hey guys, jumping in on this thread for the first time in a few months, and only read the last 2 pages, so pardon me if what I'm about to say was covered in the middle pages...

    I'm seeing that many people complain about still feeling/thinking they are not getting full travel. Does everyone realize that the amount of exposed shaft on the shock is greater than the stroke of the shock? The stroke on the DB-air for Chilcotin is 2.25", but the exposed shaft is more like 2.5". This means that you will never get the travel indicator to bump all the way up to the shock body. At least, not with a properly working shock.

    Also, the new air can is an elective procedure, and certainly not mandatory specific for the Chilcotin and/or 4x4 suspension design. There is no deficiency with the standard air can on our suspension design, which is probably why most people feel no difference after the 'upgrade'.

    Finally, the eyelet/axle/reducer deficiency. Cane Creek is all over this, working hard on a permanent resolution. I have full confidence they will come up with something durable and elegant.

    Here are my current DB-air settings. As you can see, as I've gained confidence on the Chilcotin and DB-air, riding gets faster, damping goes up...

    PSI: 153 (RTR weight 215#)
    HSC: 1.5
    LSC: 18
    HSR: 2.5
    LSR: 12

    I keep my shock settings in my phone as a contact, so I can log changes on the trail, and not forget them. Cheers.
    Director of Sales: Knolly Bikes

  70. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post


    Here are my current DB-air settings. As you can see, as I've gained confidence on the Chilcotin and DB-air, riding gets faster, damping goes up...

    PSI: 153 (RTR weight 215#)
    HSC: 1.5
    LSC: 18
    HSR: 2.5
    LSR: 12

    I keep my shock settings in my phone as a contact, so I can log changes on the trail, and not forget them. Cheers.



    Are those numbers from fully open or closed? IIRC The first time we got baseline setting some were from open and some were from close.

  71. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Bottoms View Post
    Also, the new air can is an elective procedure, and certainly not mandatory specific for the Chilcotin and/or 4x4 suspension design. There is no deficiency with the standard air can on our suspension design, which is probably why most people feel no difference after the 'upgrade'.
    So, I take it you have not "upgraded" to the larger can? I haven't really heard anything to convince me to do it. I like my shock the way it feels, but if something is actually better, I would do it.

  72. #272
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    ..and another thing I love about my DB coil (apart from the fact that it works the same as it did 2 years ago when I got it) I can change the sag in about 3 seconds. So aggravating faffing around w/ pumps, I can't believe I did it for so long.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  73. #273
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    Hey everyone:

    Just to clarify some of the discussion here:

    There are three things to understand regarding Cane Creek air shocks and available air can / sleeve options:

    Firstly: as Dusty B mentioned, often the visible length of the shaft is longer than the travel of the shock. Also, please remember that the i2i length of Cane Creek shocks typically measures about 1.5 - 2mm (1/16") shorter than the nominal length: this is because the shock is slightly pre-compressed by the internal top out bumper. As an aside, it is also good to remember this when measuring static BB height with a Cane Creek shock as the BB height will typically read a little lower than it actually is due to the pre-compressed nature of the shock.

    Secondly: internal air sleeve discussion. Most modern air shocks have an inner and outer air chamber: the inner chamber contains the piston which works against the air spring. The otter chamber has additional air volume that is used to give the shock a more "linear" spring rate than would be possible with just the internal air volume. Some earlier DB-Airs had a situation where air could not bleed fast enough between the inner and outer chambers, which would result in the shock feeling excessively progressive: i.e. the shock was effectively working with a much smaller air volume under high speed piston movement (i.e. big hits). At Knolly, since we were one of the first OEM customers to receive large quantities of DB-Air shocks, some of the shocks that we shipped had this issue. If you can not get full travel on a DB-Air shock no matter what you do (or have to run ridiculously low pressure to get full travel) then contact Cane Creek for warranty approved internal air sleeve change. This does not affect all earlier DB-airs , so if you're shock seems to be working fine, then you do not need to change the inner air sleeve.

    Thirdly: Cane Creek is working on an even higher volume external air can. The DB-air is already arguably the most linear air shock on the market: this larger air can is in response to some frame designs having less than idea shock progression and hence needing even more linearity. Given the idealized shock progression rate of Knolly frame due to the four by 4 linkage design, our frames do not need this larger air can to function properly.

    I hope that clears up any questions regarding CCDB-Air shocks and setup and / or performance.

    Cheers!
    Noel Buckley
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    www.knollybikes.com

    Instead of PMs, please contact me here.

  74. #274
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    hi there
    now that i got my chili ridden a few times i first felt, wow, great climbing on it. due to bad weather i skipped my local dh and rode it yesterday for the first time. i had the impression that using of travel was good, but it felt quite hard on the rocky section with many stones in it. i almost felt like hopping up and down and that made me feel uncomfortable. i was missing the plushness.
    for the record: i ride it with 30/35% of sag, and used the base-setting on the cc site. furthermore i use the steep setting of the bike.
    i'm thinking of lowering the lsr for more plushness. what do you think?

  75. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfredo View Post
    hi there
    now that i got my chili ridden a few times i first felt, wow, great climbing on it. due to bad weather i skipped my local dh and rode it yesterday for the first time. i had the impression that using of travel was good, but it felt quite hard on the rocky section with many stones in it. i almost felt like hopping up and down and that made me feel uncomfortable. i was missing the plushness.
    for the record: i ride it with 30/35% of sag, and used the base-setting on the cc site. furthermore i use the steep setting of the bike.
    i'm thinking of lowering the lsr for more plushness. what do you think?
    A couple things to try:
    - Check tire pressure. Nothing worse than over pressured new tires. It'll make anything harsh.
    - CCDB's like their sag closer to 35/40%. Try dropping the pressure a hair.
    - Was it harsh when rock crawling or cruising through the rocks. If it was cruising try backing out your High Speed Compression all the way and then add 1/4 click back in. Then go find a 2 to 3' drop to flat and see if the bike bottoms harshly. If it does add in another 1/4 until it's not harsh anymore.
    - You can also back out the Low Speed Compression a couple/few clicks but don't go crazy or your peddling will suffer.

    Hope that helps!

  76. #276
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    thanks woodyak.
    well, i also thought of the tires (indeed they're new) but didn't realise it could have such an impact. i'll have to measure it and see if it's too much.
    it was harsh when i rode the rocky section on the dh. as i said it felt a bit like bumping around and not like the shock giving a smooth feeling.
    i'll give it a try.

  77. #277
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    I must not be normal than everyone else on this topic. For me its 30% sag (anymore and I'm dragging my pedals on the rocks and can't stop bottoming out.) about two turns more of HSC from stock, two clicks less LSC, one click less LSR, and half a turn or more less HSR. So far this feels close to my push tuned fox rc4 I used to ride. I'm still tinkering but we'll see where it ends up. oh, and I only weigh about 150 lbs ride weight.

  78. #278
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    yesterday first i took out pressure out of the tires, but didn't measure it, just by feeling. furthermore i backed out lsc by 2 clicks. then i tried to do a jump into the flat and it felt very good. all in all it was better but not what i expected. still too progressive in my eyes. i'm still trying to find the balance between good climbing (that i already have) and a smooth on dh.
    maybe i'll go for little more sag. maybe i back out lsr as well by 1or 2 clicks.

  79. #279
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    Alfredo, I wasn't initially satisfied either. Once its "right" it's just amazing. Just make minor adjustments as you go. 5 psi is a big difference and one or two clicks of LSC are quite noticeable as well. After you find this sweet spot this shock will flatten the trail and climb anything.

  80. #280
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    now i had the time to measure tire pressure and i´m wondering a bit. i´m running maxxis hi roller and minion and the indication on the tire says 2.4-4.0 bar. actually i´m running with 2.0 as i felt they could be over pressured, but obviously they weren´t.
    not that i feel them now being to soft, but anyways, i will have to dial it out the shock.

  81. #281
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    Chilcotin: The inevitable DB-air setup thread

    depending on your tire, weight, terrain and ride style you could actually try even less than 2.0 bar. maybe try around 1.8 bar next and see how it works for you ... mind you, you could have a flat but that's part of the experiment ;-)

  82. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by alfredo View Post
    now i had the time to measure tire pressure and i´m wondering a bit. i´m running maxxis hi roller and minion and the indication on the tire says 2.4-4.0 bar. actually i´m running with 2.0 as i felt they could be over pressured, but obviously they weren´t.
    not that i feel them now being to soft, but anyways, i will have to dial it out the shock.
    I was referring to pressure in the shock where 5 psi is significant...Especially when you are close to that sweet spot.

  83. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    I must not be normal than everyone else on this topic. For me its 30% sag (anymore and I'm dragging my pedals on the rocks and can't stop bottoming out.) about two turns more of HSC from stock, two clicks less LSC, one click less LSR, and half a turn or more less HSR. So far this feels close to my push tuned fox rc4 I used to ride. I'm still tinkering but we'll see where it ends up. oh, and I only weigh about 150 lbs ride weight.
    so you've gone frome stock settings? means everything half in/out? right? that means you run hsc fully closed or open?

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    HSC more closed than the 1/4 it came shipped as. Basically I slowed the shock way down in both HSR and LSR and took away some of the LSC to make it a little more plush. It does have a little pedal bob but I don't mind. Its more about the downhill for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    HSC more closed than the 1/4 it came shipped as. Basically I slowed the shock way down in both HSR and LSR and took away some of the LSC to make it a little more plush. It does have a little pedal bob but I don't mind. Its more about the downhill for me.
    If you guys really want to dial this thing in go to Cane Creeks website and use the "Chilcotin Base Tune" and go from there (not the stock settings). I also like it plush and dialed out the LSC a couple clicks and went with more sag (33-35%).

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    Mine came stock with the recommended chilcotin base tune. I think the base tune is very close, I just had problems bottoming out a lot so I had to up the HSC.

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    After this weekends ride here's where I stand
    20mm sag
    150lbs rider weight
    2.5 turns HSC
    13 clicks LSC
    1 turn HSR
    15 clicks LSR

    I'm hoping to get out on a chunky buck prone DH trail with speeds in the 30's this week and tune a little further. I think LSR and LSC are pretty dialed but I'm still messing with the HSR and HSC. It seems to have the HSC feel good on DH I need about 2 maybe 2.5 turns but for drops and any freeride stuff I need about 3 turns. I might just have to adjust based on the terrain. I'm not sure how so many people are have trouble getting full travel. With the base tune I can get full travel off a 2' drop to flat. I'm fairly confident I can get this shock feeling as good or better than my push tuned RC4. So far I'm really enjoying it.

  88. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch6013 View Post
    Mine came stock with the recommended chilcotin base tune. I think the base tune is very close, I just had problems bottoming out a lot so I had to up the HSC.
    It sounds like you have the same symptoms my brother is having with bottoming out. My brother and I are the same weight, but he is bottoming his out with the same settings that I have. I believe it's because he has the newer DB AIR can with more port holes. My shock feels absolutely incredible and I'm reluctant to change to the new can because of having to possibly put the volume reducers in to prevent bottoming. That seems to negate the advantages of a large volume shock. I believe in this case the best thing to do is exactly what you are doing by adding more HSC. I only have a 1/4 turn of HSC where my brother needs a lot more due to the newer can. He was getting full travel on small hits as well. I've been extremely happy using the base tune and working slightly from there. My brother hasn't had many rides to date but is likely going to be using different settings even though we are identical weight. Riding style also plays a role.

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    Interesting facts about the different aged shocks and the air volume. I didn't know anything had changed.

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    i'm starting to get it dialed now. still not 100% but way better than in the beginning. but what i found out is that the hs knobs both have more than 25 clicks. i counted 28-30.... anyone experiencing the same?
    anyway, i now have the following
    hsc 0.25
    lsc 14
    hsr 1.5
    lsr 15
    sag 21mm
    rider weight 180lbs

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    So out of curiosity (and lack of time to get out and tune the shock)....

    From the standard settings what changes would you guys recommend trying to get my bike a more lively feeling. I like to pop of every little bump and such and feel the base settings are lacking a bit in this department. I don't mind losing a bit of small bump for a more poppy ride.

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    From stock I'd add a bunch of LSC in. Maybe 4 or 5 clicks. You could also speed up the rebound by a click or so to give it a more lively feeling. If that fails you may need a little more air pressure. I'd crank down the LSC 1st though before you start getting crazy with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    It sounds like you have the same symptoms my brother is having with bottoming out. My brother and I are the same weight, but he is bottoming his out with the same settings that I have. I believe it's because he has the newer DB AIR can with more port holes. My shock feels absolutely incredible and I'm reluctant to change to the new can because of having to possibly put the volume reducers in to prevent bottoming. That seems to negate the advantages of a large volume shock. I believe in this case the best thing to do is exactly what you are doing by adding more HSC. I only have a 1/4 turn of HSC where my brother needs a lot more due to the newer can. He was getting full travel on small hits as well. I've been extremely happy using the base tune and working slightly from there. My brother hasn't had many rides to date but is likely going to be using different settings even though we are identical weight. Riding style also plays a role.

    Hey Guys!

    I know I sound like a broken record here, but there are TWO different topics here:
    1) Air flow between inner and outer air chambers: old shocks may have had issues with this; new shocks shouldn't.
    2) Large volume external chamber: this is a sidegrade, not upgrade and useful for certain frame designs. It is not required for Knolly products (though shoudln't be detrimental either).

    If there is an issue with #1, you'll notice because you're not getting full travel on the shock: you will be missing about the last 8 - 10 mm of travel. You should have the shock serviced by an authorized Cane Creek service centre.

    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!
    2) Tune HSC as required to allow you to use all the travel, but not have frequent bottom out issues.

    Cheers!
    Noel Buckley
    ------------------
    www.knollybikes.com

    Instead of PMs, please contact me here.

  94. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by knollybikes.com View Post
    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!

    Cheers!
    Something to add: before adjusting sag, put 50 to 75 psi in the shock and slowly cycle the shock through all it's movement. This is necessary to charge the negative air chamber and often is overlooked. (See "To Measure/Set Sag" on page 15--PDF page 16. http://canecreek.com/resources/produ...ers_manual.pdf)
    "sounds like you need to find a better mechanic..." -- Calhoun

  95. #295
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    Just wondering...if a DB Coil weighed the same or less than a DB Air, would anyone still pick the air over the coil based on performance characteristics alone?

    I may need to decide between the two shortly, and since I don't care about weight, I'm wondering which simply works better overall.

  96. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by knollybikes.com View Post
    Hey Guys!

    I know I sound like a broken record here, but there are TWO different topics here:
    1) Air flow between inner and outer air chambers: old shocks may have had issues with this; new shocks shouldn't.
    2) Large volume external chamber: this is a sidegrade, not upgrade and useful for certain frame designs. It is not required for Knolly products (though shoudln't be detrimental either).

    If there is an issue with #1, you'll notice because you're not getting full travel on the shock: you will be missing about the last 8 - 10 mm of travel. You should have the shock serviced by an authorized Cane Creek service centre.

    As far as bottom out resistance, go back to the fundamentals:
    1) Ensure that your air pressure is correct - this is ALWAYS the starting point of shock tuning!
    2) Tune HSC as required to allow you to use all the travel, but not have frequent bottom out issues.

    Cheers!
    Hi Noel,

    Loving your bikes! Just a few things that I'm confused/wondering about...I've got the Podium with DB Coil and Chilcotin with DB Air. My brother also has the DB Air on his Chilcotin. I feel like my Chilcotin with the older air can couldn't be set up any better. It climbs incredible and handles massive drops while being perfectly plush and composed. My brother (same weight) who has the newer air can is bottoming. I know how to dial these things in by charging the negative air chamber and starting with sag (air pressure), and at this point have a really good understanding of making the appropriate adjustments. What I'm curious about is whether the newer can may not be just a "side grade" but a "down grade" for some riders. This is my thought (hopefully I'm wrong). With the same settings that I have my brother is bottoming his out. Dialing in HSC still yields bottom out in which case (I believe) you would need to add volume reducers, but doesn't that defeat the advantages of having a "LARGE volume" shock?

    Thanks!

    Mike
    Last edited by mayha; 05-08-2013 at 07:16 AM.

  97. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    Hi Noel,

    Loving your bikes! Just a few things that I'm confused/wondering about...I've got the Podium with DB Coil and Chilcotin with DB Air. My brother also has the DB Air on his Chilcotin. I feel like my Chilcotin with the older air can couldn't be set up any better. It climbs incredible and handles massive drops with plushness and composure. My brother (same weight) who has the newer air can is bottoming. I know how to dial these things in by charging the negative air chamber and starting with sag (air pressure), and at this point have a really good understanding of making the appropriate adjustments. What I'm curious about is whether the newer can may not be just a "side grade" but a "down grade" for some riders. This is my thought (hopefully I'm wrong). With the same settings as me my brother is bottoming his out. Dialing in HSC still yields bottom out in which case (I believe), you would need to add volume reducers, but doesn't that defeat the advantages of having a "LARGE volume" shock?

    Thanks!

    Mike
    Sorry for butting in, but the upgrade is high flow not volume. High volume is also available as a pay extra. What has your brother got?

  98. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by loamranger View Post
    Sorry for butting in, but the upgrade is high flow not volume. High volume is also available as a pay extra. What has your brother got?
    I realize that it's high flow and not higher volume...What I was referring to was using the "volume reducers" to eliminate bottom out.

  99. #299
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    To me coil works much much better. I've had the air for about 8 months. And just recently the coil. Coil is much plusher and provides better traction in my experience.

  100. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by mayha View Post
    I realize that it's high flow and not higher volume...What I was referring to was using the "volume reducers" to eliminate bottom out.
    Sorry, mis-read your post.

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