Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    My bike is my happy place
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    164

    Your thoughts on negative mag review

    I'm getting my bike choices down to a short list and the Iron Horse is one. Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike. So now I'm back to being in gravity well of the Hollowpoint Sport - I probably won't get out until I buy one. But to give me that last piece off mind...

    Have any of you compared the ride to a Jamis XLT 1.0, a Giant NRS, a Fuel 90? I know the Fuel is a completely different bike, but they're all different. I just don't know how much you rally notice/appreciate the difference when you're riding along. So help me out.
    Last edited by Muddy D; 04-09-2004 at 08:30 PM. Reason: Came across info from Weagle
    Life is a bowl of fruit, and I am trying to not bite into the mold.

  2. #2
    Industry Loudmouth
    Reputation: ska todd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    965
    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy D
    I'm getting my bike choices down to a short list and the Iron Horse is one. Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike. So now I'm back to being in gravity well of the Hollowpoint Sport - I probably won't get out until I buy one. But to give me that last piece off mind...
    Their review wasn't of a broken bike. It was of a bike with a blown rear shock. It's actually a testament to the performance of the Hollowpoint that they could perform a bike review w/o even noticing their damper was blown! A lot of designs become almost unrideable if you attempt to ride them with a blown shock.

    If you hop over to ridemonkey.com and search for threads on the Hollowpoint from about 1 year ago you will find a ton of info relating to this review. The negative review didn't really seem to hurt sales at all or affect riders' opinion of the bike. Like yourself, riders do a lot of research when purchasing a suspension bike.

    If you set-up the suspension correctly you will get a great ride. By the MBA test rider's own admission he did not properly set-up the rear shock. MBA was advised of proper set-up instructions by phone and email prior to the test. The Hollowpoint will perform best with approx 1/3 sag. If you try to ride the bike with zero sag you will not get as sweet of a ride.

    -ska todd

  3. #3
    \|/Home of the Braves\|/
    Reputation: RedRocker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1,930
    Search for or page f*naetic (sp????). His former ride was an NRS and he's now on a Hollowpoint and digging it.

    I would put minimal faith in a review done under those conditions. As a matter of fact it probably shouldn't have been published if the ride was done on a blown shock!
    Big hoopy.
    Turner Sultan / On One Inbred

  4. #4
    Loose Nut Behind d' Wheel
    Reputation: Lucky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,497
    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy D
    I'm getting my bike choices down to a short list and the Iron Horse is one. Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike. So now I'm back to being in gravity well of the Hollowpoint Sport - I probably won't get out until I buy one. But to give me that last piece off mind...

    Have any of you compared the ride to a Jamis XLT 1.0, a Giant NRS, a Fuel 90? I know the Fuel is a completely different bike, but they're all different. I just don't know how much you rally notice/appreciate the difference when you're riding along. So help me out.
    I've got a Hollowpoint Team, a Titus RacerX and a Ventana El Fuego. The Hollowpoint has 1.5" to 2.2" more travel than either of the other two, but climbs just as well. It sucks up more nasties, especially compared to the El Fuego. I'd buy it again an a heartbeat. I set up the rear shock according to an e-mail for someone at Iron Horse, and it's nice and plush.

    Kathy
    Look where you want to go. This is as true in life as it is in mtbiking.

  5. #5
    www.derbyrims.com
    Reputation: derby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    6,788
    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy D
    I'm getting my bike choices down to a short list and the Iron Horse is one. Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike. So now I'm back to being in gravity well of the Hollowpoint Sport - I probably won't get out until I buy one. But to give me that last piece off mind...

    Have any of you compared the ride to a Jamis XLT 1.0, a Giant NRS, a Fuel 90? I know the Fuel is a completely different bike, but they're all different. I just don't know how much you rally notice/appreciate the difference when you're riding along. So help me out.
    The Hollowpoint has a specific shock sag requirement. MBA didn't have it set up correctly, and probably had a deadline to meet. I hope they correct their error and give Iron Horse free advertising for a year in compensation for the amateur level review. I think the I think MBA reviews are usually pretty good in general, but they often spout a lot of vague buzz words for technical descriptions of suspension action.

    The Hollowpoint is the best pedaling full suspension bike I've ever ridden of the dozens of XC trail bike fullies I've tested and demoed. I rode it with a non-platform Float-R shock set up for me with the designed shock sag. It didn't bob at all visibly in any gear seated or standing and absorbed small bumps like butter and swallowed larger bumps without any sense of unstable wallow. It was very easy to ride in all conditions. There is a tire size limitation compared to some others with the same or less travel.

    It is in another league in ride quality above the NRS, and Fuel which are both very low to no bob, the Hollowpoint is much smoother and plush also with no pedal bob. I haven't ridden the Jamis to compare.

    It's a great bike at an amazing price.

    - ray

  6. #6
    On MTBR hiatus :(
    Reputation: Speedub.Nate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    9,145

    Ex NRS owner...

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy D
    Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike.

    Have any of you compared the ride to a Jamis XLT 1.0, a Giant NRS, a Fuel 90?
    Everyone's pretty well covered the MBA review. I didn't know about the blown shock damper that Todd mentioned, but the reviewer comes right out and says he rode the bike with the shock overinflated, which dismisses practically every ride-related comment he made.

    It's amazing how often this botched MBA review comes up, even after the overwhelmingly positive reviews in the other mags and on from owners on sites such as MTBR.

    I bought in to the NRS hype in 2001 -- I wanted to "be efficient" after riding a Fisher Joshua 'Y' bike for the previous 5 years.

    The NRS delivered on its promise, but it was a drastic change from the relatively plush Joshua I was used to. Gone was small bump compliance, the front end was a bit light for my tastes, and I got used to the pedaling "hanging up" on climbs over terrain rough enough to cycle the suspension.

    I didn't hate the NRS, but I quickly realized that I allowed the pendulum to swing too far into to the efficiency spectrum. After a brief summer on the NRS, I bought a 29-inch hardtail and immediately realized the two bikes had way too much overlap, sending me on a search for an all mountain NRS replacement which eventually led me to the Hollowpoint.

    My criteria for the NRS replacment were (1) smooth and efficient pedaling (2) terrain compliant and (3) cost. As I mentioned, the NRS's efficiency wasn't all bad, but I wanted the new bike to be able to track up a hill, across flat ground, and give me a supple ride on the way down as well. I wanted to avoid a design relying on the new SPV-type shocks, in keeping with the K.I.S.S. principle.

    I narrowed my short list down to the Hollowpoint by reading back to the 2002.5 Hollowpoint reviews (the model on which the dw-link first appeared) and some of the subsequent suspension discussions on the old boards as well as on hcor.net.

    I figured coming off the NRS I'd be in for a rude transition to the nearly 5" of HP suspension. I had a trouble accepting the relatively large amount of sag the bike requires to pedal correctly (~30% of travel feels at first like sinking into an easy chair), but once I got the fork dialed in to lower the front end appropriately and got through the first ride, I was no longer thought about it.

    The fact was, the NRS to HP transition was pretty much seamless. I've gone so far as to state that I prefer climbing on the Hollowpoint simply because the pedaling doesn't get hung up on suspension hits. Granted, there is a minimal amount of suspension movement evident in the shock during seated climbing, but I swear you don't feel it one bit in the pedaling action. The hit has to be d-e-e-p before pedaling cadence is interrupted. In the end, I believe "quailty of climb" comes down in large part to rider perception: If the climb feels smooth and stable, it is. The fact that the suspension is working underneath rider the whole time is icing on the cake.

    The flat terrain and downhill performance is a given with this bike. The suspension has that "bottomless" feel, and none of the harsh top-out I experienced with the NRS. Unlike the NRS, you'll be floating in the middle of your shock stroke causing the suspension to be responsive to the smallest terrain variations, without regard to fore or aft weight bias.

    I can't think of any other NRS:Hollowpoint comparisions, but if you have any specific questions, ask.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    27
    Like Nate, I too am coming from an NRS and a hard tail before that. When I bought the NRS, I was looking for a full suspension bike that would pedal like a hard tail. The NRS does that but its ride is just too firm for me. I purchased a hollowpoint last year and it has been great. I still own the NRS but ride my hollowpoint 95% of the time.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    520

    Hollowpoint is Awesome

    I test road most of the bikes you mentioned. I didn't get to test ride the Hollwopoint. But, I got an 03 Expert at super discount at Supergo. Read all of the forums and completely dismissed the MBAction review. Faenetic (sp?) was exteremly helpful. Have had the bike for 4 months and I can tell you it is smoother than most of the bikes you mentioned. Got the shocks dialed in after 2 rides and BAM! Singletrack heaven. Apart from the bad ass suspension, Iron Horse bikes are typically better speced for components thatn most of it's competitors. I mean, my bike is all XT w/ Fox Float 100 front and fox rear shock and I got this at $1,300 (yearend close out). I will not have to upgrade anything.

    But, in the end, you should test ride as many bikes as you can.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    28

    Plush

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy D
    I'm getting my bike choices down to a short list and the Iron Horse is one. Reading the Mountain Bike Action review made me think against it, until I found out that their review was of a broken bike. So now I'm back to being in gravity well of the Hollowpoint Sport - I probably won't get out until I buy one. But to give me that last piece off mind...

    Have any of you compared the ride to a Jamis XLT 1.0, a Giant NRS, a Fuel 90? I know the Fuel is a completely different bike, but they're all different. I just don't know how much you rally notice/appreciate the difference when you're riding along. So help me out.
    Hollowpoint is very plush compared to NRS and Fuel. It doesn't pedal well when standing up. As long as you are seated the bob isn't noticeble.

    Check your rear triangle frequently. Check for hairline cracks on the weld-on reinforcement ....where the Y tube meet the seat stays. Mine had a crack and supergo was able to take care of it after a month of waiting.

  10. #10
    On MTBR hiatus :(
    Reputation: Speedub.Nate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    9,145
    Quote Originally Posted by jamisfoes
    It doesn't pedal well when standing up. As long as you are seated the bob isn't noticeble.
    Wow, my experience has been 180 the opposite. I can stand up and hammer on the Hollowpoint and looking down at the shock, it's rock solid. In fact, I think mine *moves less* during standing climbs than the small amount of movement I see while seated.

    That could partly be a function of my Cane Creek shock, but I doubt it. It might have something to do with my gearing. In any case, I've got zero complaints with this aspect of the Hollowpoint / dw-link performance.

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    28
    Quote Originally Posted by SpeeDub Nate
    Wow, my experience has been 180 the opposite. I can stand up and hammer on the Hollowpoint and looking down at the shock, it's rock solid. In fact, I think mine *moves less* during standing climbs than the small amount of movement I see while seated.

    That could partly be a function of my Cane Creek shock, but I doubt it. It might have something to do with my gearing. In any case, I've got zero complaints with this aspect of the Hollowpoint / dw-link performance.
    When I pedal standing up, the bike feels very flexy. There is some bob but I think the flexy sensation is mainly due to the suspension design. Hold your rear tire and push it left and right, you can see the linkage flexes. I got rid of the Hollowpoint after the rear triangle broke.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    573
    Same here, the bike sure has some bob (although hard to notice unless you're staring at the shock, and then... another JRA incident) when seated because of the rider's weight generating a downward force on the saddle, having the same effect as hitting a bump. Again, even THAT is limited assuming that saddle height/horizontal position are OK.

    But standing up, there's NO bob. I've raced the bike and there's no way in hell I would have done better with a hardtail, here in the NE. Too many rock gardens, roots, rocks and trails ain't flat either, far from it. I'm amazed how I can make it up some climbs where EVERYBODY is walking, and I'm in poor shape these days (who said 'chubby' ?).

    Maurice

  13. #13
    On MTBR hiatus :(
    Reputation: Speedub.Nate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    9,145
    Quote Originally Posted by jamisfoes
    When I pedal standing up, the bike feels very flexy. There is some bob but I think the flexy sensation is mainly due to the suspension design. Hold your rear tire and push it left and right, you can see the linkage flexes. I got rid of the Hollowpoint after the rear triangle broke.
    It's good that Iron Horse has beefed up the '04 rear triangles and linkage plates/shock mount. I agree that there is a slight flex to the rear end on my '03, but I really only feel it on side load transitions, such as climbing out the side of a rut -- and even then it's pretty minor, especially considering my 200+ pound weight. But that's seems to be the compromise for most light weight linkage suspensions versus a burly single pivot design.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    5
    I've got a trek fuel 98, my brother has a giant NRS 2, which i've ridden a lot. I love my bike, and i like my brothers too, but i rode a Hollowpoint RL team at a demo night and had it all set up for me, and it was soooooooo much smoother! it was much more plush than my trek, although it didn't have quite the same pedalling efficiency. I didn't actually notice it until i looked down though.
    as for rear-end flex, i felt absolutly none. this may because im a 5'10, 137lb racer type.

Similar Threads

  1. '04 Stumpjumper FSR thoughts (long)
    By chrisjohn78 in forum Specialized
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 04-15-2004, 03:26 PM
  2. Cannondale 1FG review in new Bike mag.
    By Hollywood in forum Singlespeed
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 04-06-2004, 11:42 AM
  3. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-20-2004, 08:42 PM
  4. Fake review posts.
    By biblebasher in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 02-24-2004, 05:23 PM
  5. Cake vs. Blur - Any thoughts?
    By aspang in forum Trek
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 02-18-2004, 05:47 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •